Kim Jones @KimJonesSports
On #Zoom, we saw optimistic Joe Judge. Complimentary of #NYG, including o-line. Of C Nick Gates: “Handled himself very well.” My sense: Judge might be mostly/somewhat pleased after loss to #PIT. He was also tough thru preseason. Not gonna kick his guys now when they’re down.
Mike Garafolo @MikeGarafolo
The #Giants have a lot of work to do and it’s going to take time. But that team competed last night far more than they have in many games the last two seasons. They’ll steal a couple of games against better teams this year. Truly believe that.
We put a 19 play drive on one of the better D's in the NFL.
If people aren't seeing signs of improvement, especially on the coaching side - they aren't looking very hard. Just cutting out the miscommunications on D alone was a bright spot
That might be good enough to take the division...🙂
Jones was the same immensely impressive QB as last year. The Darnold/Haskins crew needs to be hanging on by a thread at this point.
Andrew Thomas played the best LT we've seen since Diehl in his first game ever with no preseason.
Lawrence, Williams, Carter, Martinez, Bradberry were all making plays on D and there were no major break downs.
They were not ready to beat a SB contender week 1 but fortunately the rest of the schedule isn't filled with SB contenders, starting with this Sunday.
I mean really. Have some sense guys.
@MikeGarafolo
I hear ya. Never understood the Shurmur hire from the jump. Those were just two lost years.
I agree. The Shurmur hire wasted 2 years here.
I watched a lot of the Bears/Lions game on Sunday, and I think this team beats Chicago by 10.
A few lessons the Giants should remember, mostly close to home:
One good season doesn't prove much. (McAdoo)
One bad season doesn't prove much. (Parcells)
If the goal is to win a championship, regular season records can be overrated, as long as you make the playoffs. (Coughlin)
A team that wins an occasional championship but is lousy more often than not makes for restless fans. (Also Coughlin)
From the experience of Bill Belichik in Cleveland: Don't mistake "good coach" for "fun" or "quotable" or "popular with fans." if a guy is turning your team around, leave him in there. Once the team's good, the fans will come along. Also see: Bill Walsh's first couple of seasons in San Francisco. The team was 2-14 then 6-10. Next season, 13-3.
I mean really. Have some sense guys.
I chuckled last year when we were told that Lynch had it right and that the Niners knew how to rebuild quickly. And in the same post they'd bash Gettleman saying he's had long enough to turn it around.
What is "more often than not"?? Coughlin had 4 straight seasons in Jacksonville where they were .500 or above.
He had 7 straight seasons in NY like that. He was the coach here 12 years.
What’s the alternative? Can’t change the schedule, we can’t change the past. I think he’s taking the right approach, no point in beating them down after a hard fought loss, especially publicly. I’m sure he will drill down on things privately as the week progresses.
The defenses do get easier by the simple fact that the Steelers are the premier defense in the league right now. They weren't a fluke like the Jags a few years back and all the numbers back it up. If Big Ben's arm holds up they are right there with the Chiefs and Ravens as faves in the AFC.
I believe one of the best things to come out of last night's game is that our team fought hard and played competitive football. I count at least 7 games from last season where the Giants were simply not a competitive team. A lot went wrong last night, but no one can say the Giants did not compete against a very good Steelers team.
One thing I'm hoping the Giants take away from last night: the way the Steelers handled themselves when the Giants were winning, and things were not going the Steelers way. They just re-grouped; took a deep breath; and then ratcheted up their game a few more notches.
That's a talent issue, but it is also a mind-set issue. I believe the Giants still have a few key talent holes, but I also believe Head Coach Joe Judge will create the sort of mind set that will allow the Giants to persevere under adversity.
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there is a very good chance we are 0-5 playing a game against Washington. Will the team still have high spirits if we continue to lose and not be able to run the football (that is pretty demoralizing) and its not like the defenses and frontlines get easier over the next 6-7 weeks.
What’s the alternative? Can’t change the schedule, we can’t change the past. I think he’s taking the right approach, no point in beating them down after a hard fought loss, especially publicly. I’m sure he will drill down on things privately as the week progresses.
I think that is fair but to also say you were proud of the offensive line and they did well seems a bit much don't you think? The O-line looked like a JV high school team vs a Div 1 college football team. There shouldn't be that level of disparity at the proffessional level. Our guys were getting tossed around like rag dolls out there. The fact Barkley can go a game with under 10 yards rushing with 15 carriers is pretty horrendous.
Yeah... no moral victories?? I was declaring a moral victory before the first quarter ended!
It really appears as though the overall coaching has taken a dramatic leap forward. If the front office takes a similar one, this team could be exciting to watch for some time.
The oline knows they got their lunch handed to them, but they fought hard and were still in position to take a lead in the 4th before the turnover. You get on them in practice and the film room, and then you move on.
JJ has a young team. If he’s as smart as they say, he knows this is not an overnight success especially given the tough early schedule. We need to avoid guys getting down on themselves. It’s the right approach, IMO.
My expections is to continue to see the team build. Add more pieces. Get some experience. Take steps toward being competitive for an entire game.
Winning games does build confidence. I'm aware of that. But you have to learn how to win, before you win.
We put a 19 play drive on one of the better D's in the NFL.
If people aren't seeing signs of improvement, especially on the coaching side - they aren't looking very hard. Just cutting out the miscommunications on D alone was a bright spot
Hear, hear!
They did take the steps I thought they needed to take and they knocked two key offensive players out -- but Pittsburgh is a well-oiled team that nearly made it into the playoffs without Ben and it was on the strength of their defense. That defense is among the best in the game and very deep.
Then Ben stayed in the game even though he got a little nicked up and banged around by our guys, and he has some weapons out there, and that team is tough and well-coached.
I did see a bunch of things I really liked out of the Giants - that we didn't see last year:
(1) both Williams and Lawrence got to the QB and brought him down, and they did it authoritatively
(2) Blake Martinez played a terrific game -- we haven't seen an inside linebacker play like him in a really long time
(3) Bradberry played a really awesome game -- and I think we played at a very high level and very physical -- which I really liked seeing.
(4) Peppers is a heck of a punt returner
(5) Barkley was running the ball primarily straight up the middle and running hard into contact
(6) Daniel Jones had a very tough group knocking him around and he didn't fumble once last night - he showed real toughness -- this kid is the real deal and he's a keeper - he stood in the pocket, took a pounding and made plays. He's improved. He has not played 16 games yet - he's going to make mistakes, but he's improved over last year, and he's got some real fire in him
(7) Slayton also is not a fluke the kid is a playa, and he picked right up where he left off last year
(8)The Giants played very hard and physical football last night with real intensity, and while there were a few lulls, they mostly played that way all night. I haven't seen them do that in the first game of the season for a very, very long time.
(9) they played very opportunistically on special teams - and that too is really good to see. Special teams manufactured a turnover - that was a very exciting moment.
(10) the head coach looked absolutely like he was in command last night, he didn't do anything embarrassing which over the past six years we've seen plenty of embarrassing coaching moments. This guy handles himself really well.
(11) Kaden Smith is one tough cookie and he made some strong plays, and the team responded to that
(12) Lewis also ran the ball up the middle with authority
(13) the Giants marched down the field on the first set of downs and put points on the board, I really liked seeing that against a defense like Pittsburgh, and then the defense held Pittsburgh and made them punt, I liked seeing that too.
(14) I thought Garrett called a pretty good game, with a good mix of plays, and that he stuck with the run throughout the game mixing it up and not afraid of calling it up the center even when Pittsburgh was eating up plays behind the line.
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These are all real positives in my mind. This team has holes, but it also has real room to grow and gel. I know the offensive line took a pounding - but I think they are going to learn from this and improve and they are not playing against a team quite like Pittsburgh with all its firepower and the sheer quantity of mismatches that it has again.
You want to lash out at Engram -- he's the same guy we've been seeing year in and year out now - there are no surprises there. He's a rich man's Travis Beckham. A little tougher and stronger, but with the same fragility and maddening inconsistency.
You want to lash out at an Offensive line with two rookie starters, and a jag at right tackle - go right ahead knock yourself out. I predict Peart will be out there before the season is over at right tackle, but right now Flemming is a better option until he isn't. I want to see this line play a few games together and make improvements before I get down on them. They got man-handled, but this was expected by all who were in the know. Want to know what's different about this offensive line, they should grow and get better, instead of playing like crap and then regressing like they did last year. If they regress we'll know they suck and so does Columbo, but if they improve then that's what they need to do and that's what I want to see, and that's something to hope for and more of a possibility right now.
The defense also needs some time to gel in a new system. They showed some real spark, but they have holes out there -- but surprise. What's the number one problem on the Giants the Back field, that surprises you? What did you expect them to be? Many of us were writing about our concerns about them at the end of training camp.
There's reason for optimism at linebacker and on the line and with Bradberry - the jury is still out on the rest of the backfield, they made a lot of mistakes last night against a seasoned offense --
Guess what else - I think these guys can take on the NFC East. The three teams I watched on Sunday didn't look as good as the Giants did. Our QB with all his warts may be the best QB in the NFC East. There are questions about every NFC East Offensive line too. Right now Washington and the Giants have the two best Defensive lines - and every team in the East appears to have holes. It's a very real possibility that we can at least split with each of them and possibly do better because of Jones.
You know what else - I'm really looking forward to the Bears Game next Sunday and what comes next!!!
That’s a fair question. One thing I’ll say with certainty from my own pov is there was a higher number of defensive players that stood out to me in last night’s game vs last year pats game. I came away thinking we have some decent starters on D after last night. By decent I mean worthy. Lawrence looked menacing. I can’t remember the last time I thought that about a nyg defender.
Need to see wins at some point but player development is absolutely paramount this season. We need to answer some questions with these 2nd and 3rd year players. Those guys showed something last night let’s keep it up and get a win.
It was a tough team to start the new season with and I think it will help them to know the can play with anyone.
I will tell you now they are going to beat the bears next week.
Carve it in stone
Slayton was just an incredible draft pick, and Shepard is reliable as hell.
Jones's passes had more zip than last year and he looked very accurate. His INT after the big drive was terrible decision making, but I think it's a lesson he's learned and won't make that mistake again.
The big negative for me is the interior OL. If the Giants coaches get it fixed to just be adequate then Saquon and Jones can take it from there.
Really need the O line to gel to compete, or the D lines of CHI, SF, and LA are going to be repeats of last night.
I think Judge is going to be a good coach, and that goes a long way in the NFL. We should be able to beat the Cowboys because Mike McCarthy is one of the worst in game coaches IMO.
I haven’t seen that in a long time and if it can be maintained it bodes well for the defense over the marathon the NFL season is.
The OL was a disaster but don't understand why so many fans give the Guards a pass. They were the worst rated OL in the game and Hernandez has not followed up on the promise of his rookie season, while Zeitler, may be showing signs of age. For all the hype about the OL when he was hired, not sure DG knows how to build a line. Maybe this year's rookies will turn that corner.
And don’t get swept by the eagles and cowboys
I mean really. Have some sense guys.
You're not allowed to invoke this take because the Giants have sucked for so long now. Never mind that this regime has been here for 3 months, or that DG basically went scorched earth midway through the 2018 season, nope, "it's been 7 years now wahhhhh"
People need to have short memories and forget 2015 already. It means nothing now.
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want to know their journey to the Super Bowl? 5-11, 2-14, 6-10, 4-12. Those were the consecutive seasons before going 13-3 and 1 quarter away from a title.
I mean really. Have some sense guys.
You're not allowed to invoke this take because the Giants have sucked for so long now. Never mind that this regime has been here for 3 months, or that DG basically went scorched earth midway through the 2018 season, nope, "it's been 7 years now wahhhhh"
People need to have short memories and forget 2015 already. It means nothing now.
Lynch wasn’t GM for the first 5-11 season and they did lose their QB in one of those years. So in reality the team was bad for a season and 3:3rd until they traded for JG
Obviously making any changes to the OL is premature. You can't judge the players after one game against a very tough opponent. The key is how will the line perform moving forward. If they play better each week then there is no need to make any changes. If they continue to struggle we could see Lemieux and Peart inserted into the starting lineup.
People act as if there weren't games like that in the previous few years. Remember the New England game last year?
The one commonality over these seasons is that the Giants, in fact, do not make the couple of plays to steal the game and lose these games.
It felt like a more "competitive" loss.
The difference was mostly a young, 2nd year QB and a vet, SB winner on the other side.
I thought Jones actually played really well, but the turnover on the 19-play drive was just one of those critical mistakes you cannot make there. It was very Eli-esque. That's where the game was lost and I think everyone knows that.
A score there of any kind - even a FG changes the complexion of it.
I also thought the defense was better than expected. They got gassed and worn down late, but I think we will defend the run well and for the most part, the coverage was decent. There weren't Steelers just running wide open all over the place in the secondary, which is something we've seen a lot of.
Obviously the biggest red flag is Barkley's rushing line. 6 yards on 16 carries is putrid. It's almost hard to do that. So, the run blocking is a MAJOR problem and needs to get a lot better really quickly.
The pass protection wasn't nearly as bad. But, again, the OL is still a WIP.
I don't know - this team feels a little more "together" and organized to me. I don't see a playoff year or anything, but I do see a much more competitive football team.
I also think we are going to win on Sunday.
I'd like to see another TE step up. On that early series, Engram dropped a pass and missed a block. There's three other guys in the TE room....can somebody give Garrett some options?
Also need one more WR option. Slayton is good, we see that. I'd like to keep Shep from repeatedly going into traffic. And is Golden Tate going to limp his way thru the entire season ?
Totally agree. They left an easy 7-11 points on the field which changes the trajectory of the game. And the Steelers played really well. I came away thoroughly impressed by Pitt.
But the most important takeway is Jones. I have no idea how cannot be excited about this guy.
JJ has a young team. If he’s as smart as they say, he knows this is not an overnight success especially given the tough early schedule. We need to avoid guys getting down on themselves. It’s the right approach, IMO.
Spot on.
We put a 19 play drive on one of the better D's in the NFL.
If people aren't seeing signs of improvement, especially on the coaching side - they aren't looking very hard. Just cutting out the miscommunications on D alone was a bright spot
I forget who said it, but the past few years, the Giants were never "a play or two away." They were always "a play or two away from being a play or two away." Last night might seem similar to years past, but I think it's honestly a game where you could say they were a play or two away. Convert for TDs after the muffed punt and the 19-play drive, and the complexion of the game changes.
It remains to be seen whether we can upgrade our talent, but I think Judge will prove he's the right guy for the job.
We put a 19 play drive on one of the better D's in the NFL.
If people aren't seeing signs of improvement, especially on the coaching side - they aren't looking very hard. Just cutting out the miscommunications on D alone was a bright spot
+1
I saw a young team that tried really hard and looked good at times. They will only get better with experience.
Was not disappointed at all in the effort. They just need some polishing. It will happen.