First of all, when we knew there was finally going to be a season, a lot of the threads said something to the effect of:
“We have a tough schedule. With the limited practice time and the new coaching staff, we will likely struggle in the beginning of the season. As long as we play good football by the end of the year, the results won’t matter to me as I am not expecting much as far as a good record.”
They play the Steelers fairly well. Could have won if some plays went in our favor. They then throw up a first half stinker vs. the Bears. Didn’t help that Barkley got hurt. But they fight back and make it a close game down to the final play. Come up short and I come on here and some of you are saying we’re going 0-16.
Well, don’t you remember what you said just last month? Yes, it sucks SB got hurt. But some of your perceptions are just off. The team will improve as they have a chance to work together. I find it very doubtful we won’t play better football and get some wins going forward.
After all, most of you probably had SF down as a sure loss and half their stars got hurt today. This is the NFL as we know it.
these two games have been deja vu of how Giants lose games
that is the discouraging part
Perfect comment!
It's like deja vu.
Terrible offensive line play.
A quarterback who makes soul crushing turnovers the team cannot overcome.
Defense unable to get off the field on 3rd down.
Lack of talent across the board.
That's the frustration. It's not the record. (but that doesn't help)
If it was just mistakes or bad play, that's fixable. The Giants do not have as much talent as other teams. Where did the team improve in the offseason? On the OL? In the secondary? Where are the young players they've drafted you are excited about seeing play? Slayton, maybe.
And the jury is out on the most important piece. Jones continues to be what he is. Competence is his ceiling, and if he makes a couple mistakes, down goes the ship. Unless he gets better he was not worth the number 6 pick.
And while the Steelers are going to be good this year, the Bears were a third place team last year. They were begging the Giants to win that game but came within a missed, makeable field goal from winning by 10.
Now, the line is that the 49ers are injured enough for the Giants to win. That's where our hope lies. Pathetic.
Absolutely balling out? They were adequate. No, they didn't allow any points, but the Bears did miss a field goal. On that drive they allowed runs of 11, 10, 9, and 23 yards. They didn't force any three and outs and let the Bears run a lot of clock.
My hope is that Andrew Thomas will be a plus player at LT.
My hope is that a new, competent coaching staff can develop players like Hernandez, Engram, Dexter Lawrence, Lorenzo Carter, and other players.
I have chosen to not look for hope in wins necessarily, but in progress towards stability.
It might not be fair to Joe Judge, but fans have been dealing with this trash football since 2013. The idea that fans should find a way to bury it is odd to me.
Anyway, whatever is said on this forum doesn't change anything anyway. What you're reading is boiling over frustration, obviously. You want people to be reasonable solely because that frustration grinds on your nerves, but everyone is in the same boat.
I don’t think anyone is overly critical about Judge. This team has zero playmakers. It’s impressive really that there is no one on either side of the ball that scares anyone. They simply lack the talent to compete in the NFL. And that’s an indictment of Gettleman, Mara, Abrams, etc. Judge seems to know what he’s doing and i think 95% of this board and Giants fans in general would be fine with him picking the next GM/player personnel.
Which will never happen bc Maras gonna Mara.
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It doesn’t help their team has been the worst team in football for the past three seasons, but I don’t understand why they are connecting those seasons to this, “same old, same old”, does not apply here, totally new regime.
Mostly new. DG is still the GM, and int that changes the Giants will not be anything more than mediocre
I’d settle for mediocre. Right now we are a laughingstock.
Well, that's on the man making these picks, Mr. Gettleman.
DL is very good. For three guys, they create plenty of pressure.
Our linebackers are - as a group - finally passable.
Now, we're stuck with a 6th round pick and a 7th round retread as our #2 and #3 corners. Maybe this is why Graham is scared to blitz.
JJ can't worry about what has happened here the previous eight years. He has to do this his own way and I am willing to see what he has to offer.
Dave Gettleman can't worry about what has happend from 2012-thru 2017, but he's been the GM for three years now and if the team finishes this season without the arrow pointing up and the franchise feeling it's on the right track, he needs to step down.
I'd also say that if JJ looks to be the part of a coach that's going to be here a long time, they should give strong consideration to who he wants to work with.
- Against the Steelers SB and Dion Lewis rushed (the top 2 RBs in carries) rushed 16 times for 6 yards. .4 yards a carry. Melvin Gordon and Royce Freeman rushed 22 times for 90 yards or 4.1 yards a carry. The Broncos aren’t some rushing juggernaut. It was talked about as if the Steelers were just too good. We have the #4 pick at LT, a 2nd round pick at G, and the 3rd highest paid G in the league. Not to mention a RB we took #2 who was supposedly touched by the hand of god. This was a point of emphasis for DG and our line just shouldn’t be looking this pathetic. It’s nothing short of an extreme disappointment.
- the DL where we have a first round pick, a second round pick, a 3rd round pick and a franchise tagged player we traded a 3rd and 4th round pick for as well at the 10th highest paid ILB and run stuffing specialist. We still got gashed by the Steelers and their backup RB and then the Bears who have not been particularly impressive rushing the ball or on offense generally. Especially with the game on the line and us knowing the running attack was coming we still couldn’t do anything.
That is the problem and it’s been the problem, people want to point to all these individual players and defend individual moves when the bottom line is the things we have focused on fixing haven’t been even remotely fixed. AND we spent such significant resources attempting to fix those problems that we’ve under-allocated in other areas. I’m not sure we are even above average at any of the main 4 phases of the game pass / run, offense / defense. Regardless, there is plenty of reason to be disappointed in seeing things we have been trying hard to improve still look so bad even if we were expected a bad overall team.
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In comment 14979732 joeinpa said:
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It doesn’t help their team has been the worst team in football for the past three seasons, but I don’t understand why they are connecting those seasons to this, “same old, same old”, does not apply here, totally new regime.
Mostly new. DG is still the GM, and int that changes the Giants will not be anything more than mediocre
I’d settle for mediocre. Right now we are a laughingstock.
Mediocre is the ceiling with DG
There are several things that posters just overlook or assume away. For example, it is assumed the Jones is a franchise qb. We haven't seen enough of him one way or another to make that determination. He looks better in terms of pocket awareness, but he has a penchant for game changing turnovers. He may only ever be a Qb that flashes greatness in spurts and then makes game changing mistakes. That is not a franchise qb and probably someone destined as a backup in the league. No one wants to face the reality that if Jones isn't the answer, the Giants are a long, long way from competitive championship level football.
I also question the wisdom of building a modern NFL offense around a running back. We are witnessing after two plus seasons why this doesn't work. I also question building a modern NFL defense around run stuffing defensive tackles. The league favors teams that can attack a defense through the air and generate a pass rush without blitzing. It seemed like DG was building a 1980s style football team.
So while the regimes may be changed, I can understand the perception that the franchise hasn't changed and still appears lost.
- Against the Steelers SB and Dion Lewis rushed (the top 2 RBs in carries) rushed 16 times for 6 yards. .4 yards a carry. Melvin Gordon and Royce Freeman rushed 22 times for 90 yards or 4.1 yards a carry. The Broncos aren’t some rushing juggernaut. It was talked about as if the Steelers were just too good. We have the #4 pick at LT, a 2nd round pick at G, and the 3rd highest paid G in the league. Not to mention a RB we took #2 who was supposedly touched by the hand of god. This was a point of emphasis for DG and our line just shouldn’t be looking this pathetic. It’s nothing short of an extreme disappointment.
- the DL where we have a first round pick, a second round pick, a 3rd round pick and a franchise tagged player we traded a 3rd and 4th round pick for as well at the 10th highest paid ILB and run stuffing specialist. We still got gashed by the Steelers and their backup RB and then the Bears who have not been particularly impressive rushing the ball or on offense generally. Especially with the game on the line and us knowing the running attack was coming we still couldn’t do anything.
That is the problem and it’s been the problem, people want to point to all these individual players and defend individual moves when the bottom line is the things we have focused on fixing haven’t been even remotely fixed. AND we spent such significant resources attempting to fix those problems that we’ve under-allocated in other areas. I’m not sure we are even above average at any of the main 4 phases of the game pass / run, offense / defense. Regardless, there is plenty of reason to be disappointed in seeing things we have been trying hard to improve still look so bad even if we were expected a bad overall team.
We are 2 games into an entire new coaching staff and a fucked preseason in which we played ZERO games. The OL has 3 players on it, one of them NEVER having played professional games before and another entirely new to the center position(fucking hard position) and a journeyman RT.
It isn't even close to Apples to Oranges on the Broncos vs us.
Ownership said they were not expecting anything more than improvement by year's end.
Those are the people cutting the paychecks.
What don't you get?
This may be strange but maybe the thing that most disappointed me yesterday was the way the Giants front 7 wilted beneath the Bears rushing attack in the 4th quarter yesterday. I think that's what ultimately lost us the game. That front 7 was playing well through much of the game and at crunch time, got beaten.
This may be strange but maybe the thing that most disappointed me yesterday was the way the Giants front 7 wilted beneath the Bears rushing attack in the 4th quarter yesterday. I think that's what ultimately lost us the game. That front 7 was playing well through much of the game and at crunch time, got beaten.
I am actually encouraged. We were competitive in both games.
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This may be strange but maybe the thing that most disappointed me yesterday was the way the Giants front 7 wilted beneath the Bears rushing attack in the 4th quarter yesterday. I think that's what ultimately lost us the game. That front 7 was playing well through much of the game and at crunch time, got beaten.
We had the ball in our hands inside the 20 with time remaining on the clock. We are game 2 of rebuild with no preseason games. We lost our best played for the season early and the team didn't quit.
I am actually encouraged. We were competitive in both games.
I'm encouraged too, and unlike most here I think we have a lot of young talent. Its just young, it needs to mature and learn how to win.
There are several things that posters just overlook or assume away. For example, it is assumed the Jones is a franchise qb. We haven't seen enough of him one way or another to make that determination. He looks better in terms of pocket awareness, but he has a penchant for game changing turnovers. He may only ever be a Qb that flashes greatness in spurts and then makes game changing mistakes. That is not a franchise qb and probably someone destined as a backup in the league. No one wants to face the reality that if Jones isn't the answer, the Giants are a long, long way from competitive championship level football.
I also question the wisdom of building a modern NFL offense around a running back. We are witnessing after two plus seasons why this doesn't work. I also question building a modern NFL defense around run stuffing defensive tackles. The league favors teams that can attack a defense through the air and generate a pass rush without blitzing. It seemed like DG was building a 1980s style football team.
So while the regimes may be changed, I can understand the perception that the franchise hasn't changed and still appears lost.
*Applauds*
Andrew Thomas was playing his first game and was our best offensive lineman. What does that say about our team? When we have the 3rd highest paid G in the league looking like a JAG.
Problem with LW is that we have a garbage players at C and RT and many calling this out as a problem along the way. That is an extreme over-allocation to DL. Keeping that pick having no LW and putting the LW money into overall depth and having a 3rd round C in our lineup. Our team looks better IMO.
And again, it can't be said enough that despite this over-allocation to stopping the run (Blake Martinez included in that, in addition to our massive allocations to draft picks on the DL) we STILL can't stop the run.
You are missing my point. Struggling this year was going to happen. You can't put so much work into specific areas and still not be good at them. That is what's unacceptable.
And it's you that's being dumb if you can't see how that is unacceptable.
Andrew Thomas was playing his first game and was our best offensive lineman. What does that say about our team? When we have the 3rd highest paid G in the league looking like a JAG.
Problem with LW is that we have a garbage players at C and RT and many calling this out as a problem along the way. That is an extreme over-allocation to DL. Keeping that pick having no LW and putting the LW money into overall depth and having a 3rd round C in our lineup. Our team looks better IMO.
And again, it can't be said enough that despite this over-allocation to stopping the run (Blake Martinez included in that, in addition to our massive allocations to draft picks on the DL) we STILL can't stop the run.
You are missing my point. Struggling this year was going to happen. You can't put so much work into specific areas and still not be good at them. That is what's unacceptable.
And it's you that's being dumb if you can't see how that is unacceptable.
Yes, I know he's playing well, but see NoGainDayne's post slightly above this one for an explanation.
Gettleman's whiffed a lot in free agency and his strategic moves just haven't been right.
And I hate to bring this up again, and it's not to do with Gettleman, but really, in OT against Washington, just fumble the frickin' ball near our own goal line and you got the #2 draft pick and Chase Young.
If we add a franchise player to our team via trade and pair him with a 1st round pick, a 2nd round pick and a 3rd round pick that rotates in. Bring in the 10th highest paid ILB and run stopping specialist, seeing improvement in this area is important. It doesn't need to be overall but this is absolutely the area we should be seeing improvement in, even if others are lagging.
RE: Saquon, we use the #2 pick in the draft on him and 3 seasons later we are still saying he doesn't have any room to run. When this was a point of emphasis for the GM. Not saying it won't change either, just saying it's already unacceptable that this is the case.