Love Saquon, but this could make us better next year

Barkley may never be the same player. The Giants may not even re-sign him given what he will want versus the risk.

Devastating injury for a franchise that has been spinning its wheels for years now. Just devastating. No positive spin to this.

you've been on the doom and gloom train with Barkley, and I get it. But what exactly is the point of that? Let's see what happens. He's 23 years old, hopefully it was a clean tear. We've seen way more gruesome injuries to athletes and they've come back just fine, sometimes better than they were.

I'm not betting against Barkley, I'll tell you that much.

It's another to say this is a good thing.

with hopes of a high draft pick.

But with Saquan going down, I did find myself suddenly rooting for the Jets.

In comment 14979972 Eric from BBI said:

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Barkley may never be the same player. The Giants may not even re-sign him given what he will want versus the risk. Devastating injury for a franchise that has been spinning its wheels for years now. Just devastating. No positive spin to this.

Exactly.

but I think it maybe a bit of a stretch.

Maybe it was just coincidental that the offense started moving when Barkley went down.

Or maybe, sometimes the offense falls into a false sense of security and they just stand around waiting for Barkley to make a play. I feel like it would sometimes be the same with Beckham. Maybe more ball distribution could potentially be a good thing.

Disclaimer: I’m not saying that the team is better off without Barkley. Just different.

what a dumpster fire this franchise is

In comment 14980014 Vin_Cuccs said:

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Maybe it was just coincidental that the offense started moving when Barkley went down. Or maybe, sometimes the offense falls into a false sense of security and they just stand around waiting for Barkley to make a play. I feel like it would sometimes be the same with Beckham. Maybe more ball distribution could potentially be a good thing. Disclaimer: I’m not saying that the team is better off without Barkley. Just different.

This is my basic point I guess. The D will stop keying on only Barkley (the run) and play us straighter. It will give the OL more room and the running game may improve, so the OL will be getting needed experience. The pass defense will tighten up with increased numbers (again due to the lack of focusing only on Barkley), and force Jones and the receivers to get more separation and be more exact. Right now they are getting lots of 1-on-1 looks with Barkley.

Next season we will have learned to win without him, so when Barkley comes back he will add a huge boost.

Man up injuries are a part of the game did we not anoint Lewis as #2, & Gallman #3, now all of a sudden Lewis ain’t nothing but garbage and Gallman even less amazingly. So who did we lie to the player, the team, front office or themselves? If our running back situation was really so bad why don’t we even have one on the PS, not a fullback please.

It we can’t run the ball we just might be able to put a passing offense together but dreams about running the ball this season are useless.

I get that other players will get chances with Barkley out, but by definition those chances will be less successful than if Barkley was involved.

I guess we get to see what we have in Gallman and Lewis but am otherwise unconvinced there's a silver lining,.

In comment 14980067 Dragon said:

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It we can’t run the ball we just might be able to put a passing offense together but dreams about running the ball this season are useless.

Not sure I agree. The Giants will no longer see 8 or 9 in the box now, so running will be easier to do. I expect the passing game to take a hit though as more players stay back in the passing lanes. I'm not saying our offense will be better, I'm just saying it will be different and I wouldn't be surprised if we ran better. Remember NFL teams can take away almost anything aspect they want to by game planning. They were selling out to stop Barkley leaving the passing open (or more open). That won't happen now

The running game should get better this season. Like others have been saying, we'll be more 'balanced', and opponents won't stack up so much when Barkley was in there. And whether you like to hear this or not, he was proving to be more of a glorified Dave Meggett on the next level, basically a home run hitter and/or scatback. Not quite an every-down, feature back (using him that way was proving to be ineffective, with injuries starting to accumulate). Our running game should improve with a workhorse back in there.

Agree. It'll also increase our chance of a better draft pick and decrease our chance of winning meaningless games against the Skins or Bengals like we did last year to ruin our chance at Chase Young.

We weren't competing anyway this year, regardless how optimistic people were. Even if we had stayed healthy and players exceeded expectations - we had an absolutely brutal schedule. How many games would we have been favored in? 2? 3?

Now we can get a better draft pick to accelerate the rebuild.

In comment 14979972 Eric from BBI said:

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Barkley may never be the same player. The Giants may not even re-sign him given what he will want versus the risk. Devastating injury for a franchise that has been spinning its wheels for years now. Just devastating. No positive spin to this.

This. And I am typically the optimist. Seasons not over and I am impressed by Judge but we can’t assume our best player will be the same again and the contract situation could get very messy fast.

In comment 14980074 mikeinbloomfield said:

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I get that other players will get chances with Barkley out, but by definition those chances will be less successful than if Barkley was involved. I guess we get to see what we have in Gallman and Lewis but am otherwise unconvinced there's a silver lining,.

Barkley might be the best player.

But he's not the most important. That's Jones.

But - ACL injuries of today are very different than 10 years ago. Success rate is much higher, and as long as it's pretty clean with minimal other damage (MCL, meniscus, etc.) then I think we can all expect a full recovery. Just looking at RB and WR over the last few years, everyone on the list below has come back successfully.

RB
Dalvin Cook
Adrian Peterson
Darren Sproles
Danny Woodhead
Dion Lewis

WR
Allen Robinson
Julian Edelman
Keenan Allen

The days of Ki-Jana Carter are far more rare than they were in the 90's. Saquon may not ever be as explosive as he was prior to yesterday, but his skill set is still tremendous and as long as he get's the proper treatment and his body responds he could still become a dominant back.

Put it in perspective - this team is going nowhere this year and has a lot to figure out on both sides of the ball before they are ready to compete. This is awful for a rebuilding team but I don't believe it's as doom and gloom as others. Assuming he recovers this will not prevent the team from improving nor should it slow the rebuild. The key is the coaching staff and how people develop in '20. We will learn a lot about the OL and the secondary over the next 15 weeks which should determine DG's fate and the likelihood of competing in '21; none of that changes with the injury to Saquon. If he was going to tear his ACL I'd prefer it happen during a rebuilding season than what SF is dealing with on Bosa (who is on ACL #2) where it will significantly impact their chances of winning a championship.

In comment 14980019 GiantsFan84 said:

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what a dumpster fire this franchise is

Or maybe it's the site?

to design an offense utilizing a RB whose physical attributes were not a limiting factor? A phenomenal physical talent.

In comment 14979972 Eric from BBI said:

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Barkley may never be the same player. The Giants may not even re-sign him given what he will want versus the risk. Devastating injury for a franchise that has been spinning its wheels for years now. Just devastating. No positive spin to this.

Exactly. Call me crazy, but this may actually be a blessing in disguise.

In comment 14980127 Bob in Newburgh said:

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to design an offense utilizing a RB whose physical attributes were not a limiting factor? A phenomenal physical talent.

My point is for this season the offense would have been more geared to passing and taking advantage of the 8-9 man box that the defenses were determined to play. We weren't going to run the ball much, and the passing is easier. Now they will play 4-5 man boxes. The running game will be easier but the passing game will be harder.

So this means the receiving and passing game will get more experience against tougher defensive sets. It also means the OL/TE will find run blocking easier, thus building confidence and getting better reps. Since we are a young team all this will help tremendously next year with SB back. Jones/WR's should be able to dissect the reduced secondary's we will face because the D will go back to 8 in the box again. The OL will be better prepared to face the heavy box because of the added run experience this season.

We were relying a lot of Barkley. The OL was inconstant firedrill mode and the passing game was seeing less challenging sets then they should have. Not having him "may" increase the development of the staff around him, so when he comes back everyone is better.

Do you think teams could stack the box with 8 or 9 against a seasoned, more experienced passing attack? Try stacking the box against the Packers, they will kill you. Hopefully when Barkley comes back we will torch the defenses who do this so they will need to fall back. This means Barkley will get a lot more room to run and our offense will be a lethal balanced attack.

and I dont agree with the take at all. They needed him this year to be all pro.

In comment 14980116 BillKo said:

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In comment 14980019 GiantsFan84 said: Quote: what a dumpster fire this franchise is Or maybe it's the site?

Just checked, its the franchise.

In comment 14980203 Justlurking said:

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In comment 14980116 BillKo said: Quote: In comment 14980019 GiantsFan84 said: Quote: what a dumpster fire this franchise is Or maybe it's the site? Just checked, its the franchise.

Yeah, its definitely the franchise

"this puts the Giants in the race for Trevor Lawrence." And I'm not a Doom and Gloomer.

But you just took the best talent off the team, THE GUY other teams were focused on to stop (just rewatch the Steelers' game).

And with the weird extremely limited off season the new coachingng staff was facing an incredibly slanted uphill field to start with.

Of COURSE it's not a "good" thing. But this realistically puts the Giants in a position where they may very well have a top draft pick that lands them a true blue chip player next year - whether that's Lawrence, Sewell, Parsons or anyone else.

Isn't Parsons a better edge prospect than either TJ Watt or Bud Dupree? Doesn't this team desperately need THAT GUY?

CARTER is coming around rather well year 3 under Bielema, but a real stud on the edge could very well flip the field for Graham's D. Or Sewell just lock down the OL...

worth it if it gets them Lawrence.

In comment 14979972 Eric from BBI said:

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Barkley may never be the same player. The Giants may not even re-sign him given what he will want versus the risk. Devastating injury for a franchise that has been spinning its wheels for years now. Just devastating. No positive spin to this.

They could always franchise him twice

In comment 14980226 BlueLou'sBack said:

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"this puts the Giants in the race for Trevor Lawrence." And I'm not a Doom and Gloomer. But you just took the best talent off the team, THE GUY other teams were focused on to stop (just rewatch the Steelers' game). And with the weird extremely limited off season the new coachingng staff was facing an incredibly slanted uphill field to start with. Of COURSE it's not a "good" thing. But this realistically puts the Giants in a position where they may very well have a top draft pick that lands them a true blue chip player next year - whether that's Lawrence, Sewell, Parsons or anyone else. Isn't Parsons a better edge prospect than either TJ Watt or Bud Dupree? Doesn't this team desperately need THAT GUY? CARTER is coming around rather well year 3 under Bielema, but a real stud on the edge could very well flip the field for Graham's D. Or Sewell just lock down the OL...

These are my exact thoughts, getting either 3 of these players will be a win season for me, but knowing Giants they will most likely fight hard to win meaningless games even if they go 0-14 they will fight to win last two games and be out of the top 3 picks

to make is that teams should cut their best player.

That is obviously not true. There are no silver linings to losing talent, especially for a team with not a lot of talent to begin with. If this offense could not take advantage of 8 man boxes while Barkely was still here, they sure as hell aren't going to get better at with him gone.

In comment 14980454 mikeinbloomfield said:

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to make is that teams should cut their best player. That is obviously not true. There are no silver linings to losing talent, especially for a team with not a lot of talent to begin with. If this offense could not take advantage of 8 man boxes while Barkely was still here, they sure as hell aren't going to get better at with him gone.

Actually my intended premise was that Barkley is a unique super player, but perhaps the Giants weren't in a position to properly use him yet. In an effort to win now, we were building our offense around Barkley and how the D's tried to deal with him, and this may not have been in the best interest of the young teams development. Given a season now to "live" without him, the young offense may find its own identity and improve in ways it wouldn't have out of necessity. The result will be when Barkley comes back next year, the offense will be more mature and in a better position to really leverage the unique talent his is. Next year when the Steelers put 8 in the box we will torch them for 50 pts through the air (for example). This will also help open up the running game for Barkley, and we will become a juggernaut of an offense.

In comment 14980033 PatersonPlank said:

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Next season we will have learned to win without him, so when Barkley comes back he will add a huge boost.

I'm not so sure you can declare that we'll have learned how to win without him -- that's counting on us actually winning a handful of games this year.