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NFT: Mets/Nats - Degrom

PhiPsi125 : 9/26/2020 3:41 pm
Big Jake on the mound for today’s game. Always a must watch.

Unfortunately, I think he falls just short of the third CY this season. In a short season, one start can kill your numbers. And that September 16th start where he left early due to an injury, knocked him out. However, he’s still the best pitcher in baseball.
Degrom vs Scherzer  
spike : 9/26/2020 4:10 pm : link
Two future HOF members
mets gonna win out  
KDubbs : 9/26/2020 4:41 pm : link
giants lose 2, phils lose 2, and brewers lose 2 and we get a play in vs giants? ya gotta believe
are they doing play-ins?  
MetsAreBack : 9/26/2020 5:06 pm : link
I'm so confused why the Reds clinched last night. They are 30-28...

Cards can still finish ahead of them for 2nd in the central

Giants are 29-29. Phillies are 28-30.

What if there is a 3-way tie at 30-30 for the two wild card slots? Please don't tell me they are basing it on NL record or something when teams are playing completely different opponents within their divisions..
Is consistently  
JayBinQueens : 9/26/2020 5:12 pm : link
making the same bad strike call ok, if it's consistent? /s
I couldn’t care less about Diaz and his 1.80 ERA.  
PhiPsi125 : 9/26/2020 5:33 pm : link
He sucks. Not a closer. Can’t hack it in high leverage situations. Go get your stats in middle relief or garbage time.
RE: I couldn’t care less about Diaz and his 1.80 ERA.  
ryanmkeane : 9/26/2020 5:37 pm : link
In comment 14984717 PhiPsi125 said:
Quote:
He sucks. Not a closer. Can’t hack it in high leverage situations. Go get your stats in middle relief or garbage time.

He came in with runners on the corners and 1 out. You expect him to just automatically get out of that with no runs? Cmon.
RE: RE: I couldn’t care less about Diaz and his 1.80 ERA.  
PhiPsi125 : 9/26/2020 5:51 pm : link
In comment 14984721 ryanmkeane said:
Quote:
In comment 14984717 PhiPsi125 said:


Quote:


He sucks. Not a closer. Can’t hack it in high leverage situations. Go get your stats in middle relief or garbage time.


He came in with runners on the corners and 1 out. You expect him to just automatically get out of that with no runs? Cmon.


Uh, yeah...that’s kinda the point. Is it difficult? Fuck yeah. But he’s a strikeout pitcher that throws 100 mph. Strike out, ground ball, pop fly...all at least gives an opportunity to to TRY and get the out. But this guy gives up a hit the second he enters the game. Lol cmon.
Castro  
pjcas18 : 9/26/2020 6:01 pm : link
and Diaz are like clones on the mound (though Castro is physically much bigger).

they both have electric stuff, but are so frustrating with their control and command.

If the Mets can get a pitching coach to harness that stuff the bullpen isn't an issue.

So far it hasn't happened.

dont think I've ever  
Rory : 9/26/2020 6:07 pm : link
seen you start a game thread before.

Didnt See the Game  
Samiam : 9/26/2020 6:35 pm : link
What is the criticism of Diaz today? Looks like he gave up a ground ball & got a strikeout. Is the play by play wrong?
RE: Didnt See the Game  
pjcas18 : 9/26/2020 6:43 pm : link
In comment 14984750 Samiam said:
Quote:
What is the criticism of Diaz today? Looks like he gave up a ground ball & got a strikeout. Is the play by play wrong?


Diaz was fine today, would have been nice to see him escape without giving up the run on the forceout, but he did his job.
RE: dont think I've ever  
PhiPsi125 : 9/26/2020 6:59 pm : link
In comment 14984733 Rory said:
Quote:
seen you start a game thread before.


I have started game threads in the past but it’s rare. However, a DeGrom start should ALWAYS have a game thread so I wanted to start one 😁
Could have sworn that Diaz gave up a bit, hence my ire.  
PhiPsi125 : 9/26/2020 7:09 pm : link
Maybe I confused him with Castro. Yeah, probably a bit over the top with my reaction. Oh well. Let’s see how they shape up next season.
disappointing miniseason but this was the likely outcome post Stroman  
Eric on Li : 9/26/2020 7:10 pm : link
for the 2nd year in a row his goose egg contribution ends up being a glaring a "what could have been" given they only just barely missed making it. And obviously Thor/Wheeler add some salt to the wound. But we all know this is a team that had flaws beyond needing 1 extra good SP. They are actually 5th in SP fwar and 8th in fwar for the hitters. So as ever it was the defense (26th) and bp (27th) that let the team down, though the BP was weakened needing to move Lugo to the rotation after Stroman opted out. Perhaps that was hard to anticipate but the defensive weakness was not.

The defense has been a disaster for the entire decade, and specifically regressed badly since the last playoff appearance.

Team defense by DRS this year - 5th worst
last year - 3rd worst
2018 - 4th worst
2017 - worst
2016 - 15th (only year they were actually + with a +3)
2015 - 17th (-11)

That's an area where I hope the new regime comes in and acts quickly to embrace a more athletic team that plays solid defense. That will require both self reflection on their previous strategies and also resource investments. But it should not only help smooth out offensive slumps but also be a tremendous help for the whole pitching staff to not give the opposition extra outs.
It’s amazing that Degrom won two Cy youngs  
spike : 9/26/2020 7:25 pm : link
With the inept defense behind him
RE: It’s amazing that Degrom won two Cy youngs  
PhiPsi125 : 9/26/2020 7:34 pm : link
In comment 14984776 spike said:
Quote:
With the inept defense behind him


He’s gonna have a tougher time getting to the HOF because of his later start to his career and that he’s been saddled with the Mets but a couple more years of this and it shouldn’t even be a question.
Not just the inept  
pjcas18 : 9/26/2020 7:37 pm : link
D that hurts, but the lack of run support.

You might think this is irrelevant because wins are a silly stat to use to gauge a pitchers value or performance, but you know at some point his low win total is going to be mentioned and/or considered by BBWAA HOF voters.

I'd love to see the stat about career run support and see how many HOF pitchers have a worse or similar run support and how many W's they have.
I'm glad they didn't make the playoffs  
CMicks3110 : 9/26/2020 8:36 pm : link
this year may have sucked, but the blame is largely on our atrocious starting pitching behind deGrom. Amazing we went from having the #1 rotation in baseball 2nd half of last year, to one of the worst.

This off-season has the chance to be amazing, our payroll is way down with Cespedes, Lowrie, Ramos, David Wright, and probably Matz off the books.

With Cohen's money, and the fact that FA market will be depressed because of COVID, we have the opportunity really strike big.

I would expect 2 major moves, and a handful of mid-level moves.

I'm thinking Realmuto, Bauer and Hendriks, and a trade for Arenado. I seriously don't think this is a dream either.

Rockies are going to want to dump that contract, and we should be able to get deals on the FA market given Cohen probably will want to spend to take advantage of our window.

Imagine this lineup -- DH-Alonso C-Realmuto 1B-Smith 2B-Cano SS-Gimenez 3B-Arenado LF-McNeil CF-Nimmo RF-Conforto

Plus with deGrom, Syndergaard, Stroman, Peterson, we can have a REALLY good team next year. Move Lugo back to pen, and the pitching staff can be lights out too.

Plus with the bad record this year, we will get another high draft pick, and the farm system is creeping into the above average category with Baty, Alvarez, Mauricio, Allan, Crow-Armstrong, probably all arriving in the '22-'23 season, we have a bright future.
Again  
Shecky : 9/26/2020 8:47 pm : link
I don’t see Cohen spending like that this off-season.
CMicks  
pjcas18 : 9/26/2020 8:49 pm : link
I know you know all this, but when you remove Syndergaard, Wheeler and Stroman from the rotation and replace them with fringy players like Wacha and Porcello it's not a mystery how the rotation nosedived

In fairness to BVW in this case, by the time Syndergaard was injured free agency was over and Stroman obviously opted out.

but with those two and no Wheeler, the Mets are in the playoffs, and maybe just behind the Dodgers as NL favorites.
shecky  
CMicks3110 : 9/26/2020 8:54 pm : link
why wouldn't he spend? He's not the Wilpons. Cohen is BObby Axelrod, he's extermely competitive. He's spending 2.4 billion on the team, and probably buying SNY for a billion. Spending an additional 100million on payroll, when fans will be back in the stands and any losses might be nominal, if anything at all, given the pent up demand. Why not spend. A 100 million is a drop in the bucket for this guy.
My guess  
pjcas18 : 9/26/2020 9:05 pm : link
is Cohen leaves it up to Sandy and the GM on what makes sense for payroll.

Shecky has insider knowledge, I don't pretend to but I'd imagine someone like Cohen even with all his loot wouldn't want a GM to come in and spend for the sake of spending.

I do think Bauer makes sense, but his market will be active.
“Spend for the sake of spending”  
PhiPsi125 : 9/26/2020 9:36 pm : link
Not meant to single you out, pj, because it’s said often by many. But I hate that phrase. Does anybody actually do that? These teams aren’t spending hundreds of millions just because they have it.

People like Cohen don’t amass their wealth by being careless with their finances. And being a lifelong Mets fan doesn’t mean that Cohen knows a lick on how to run a team. I agree that he’ll have a conversation with Sandy about payroll and then let him operate within those boundaries.

And to be fair, we have no idea how Sandy (and new GM) will operate under Cohen. Nor do we know what Cohen will do from a payroll perspective. Just because $100 million is a drop in the bucket to. Oven doesn’t mean that it’s insignificant to him.

Lots to be excited about but also lots that we don’t know yet.
yeesh Wacha and Porcello were brutal  
Eric on Li : 9/26/2020 9:44 pm : link
combined they made 18 starts.

2-10 with a 6+ era.

only thing worse than them was Matz 6 starts.

0-5, 10+ era.

That's a pretty shit-tastic 60% of the rotation.

Whether they keep Rojas or not, I would not be at all disappointed to bring in a highly regarded veteran pitching coach. I know Hefner was well thought of and bows to the analytics alter, but other than JDG our streak of almost every other pitcher regressing continues.
Cohen spent like 142 million dollars  
CMicks3110 : 9/26/2020 9:45 pm : link
on some piece of art, he's known to be profligate items. I think he spends big, and Sandy has never worked with a budget he's about to have.

He's going to spend, especially with the window they are in with deGrom, and the fact that they have so much money coming off the books.

They will spend. Mets haven't signed a major free agent (not counting re-signigns) since probably Johan, and right after that? Madoff. No more debt now. Cohen wants to win. I expect to spend, and I expect to take advantage of a market where teams are looking to shed salary (See Arenado)
and it's not like they haven't spent recently  
CMicks3110 : 9/26/2020 9:48 pm : link
its just been on garbage.

This year, money was spent on: Porcello, Familia, Lowrie, Ramos, Wacha, Cespedes, Wright, Betances, Marsinick, and what did we get from those players? Pretty much nothing. If you take away the pro-ration, that's like 70 million on virtually nothing, re-allocate that money to sure-thing players like realmuto and arenado and bauer and we have ourselves a team.
RE: Cohen spent like 142 million dollars  
pjcas18 : 9/26/2020 9:49 pm : link
In comment 14984881 CMicks3110 said:
Quote:
on some piece of art, he's known to be profligate items. I think he spends big, and Sandy has never worked with a budget he's about to have.

He's going to spend, especially with the window they are in with deGrom, and the fact that they have so much money coming off the books.

They will spend. Mets haven't signed a major free agent (not counting re-signigns) since probably Johan, and right after that? Madoff. No more debt now. Cohen wants to win. I expect to spend, and I expect to take advantage of a market where teams are looking to shed salary (See Arenado)


Johan was a re-sign after the trade - maybe you mean Beltran.
also just saw another interesting defensive stat on twitter re: Ramos  
Eric on Li : 9/26/2020 9:49 pm : link
from Mark Simon:

Quote:
Mark Simon @MarkASimonSays
5h
To Gary Cohen's point

Wilson Ramos' successful block rate on pitches in the dirt is 87%

Average is 91-92%

J.T. Realmuto is 95%

He's among the leaders with Max Stassi, Roberto Pérez, Yan Gomes, Stephen Vogt


Ramos can rake but boy was he a terrible pickup for a staff full of pitchers who rely on high velocity sliders and splitters in the dirt. What an awful signing instead of Grandal.

I know Shecky has concurred that Omar deserves his share of blame for some of the moves they made the past couple years and that one sticks out to me as the likeliest candidate. Runner up being Stroman.
the problem this offseason is a lack of players to spend $ on  
Eric on Li : 9/26/2020 9:52 pm : link
Betts would have obviously been worth it.

Realmuto is a consideration but his age as a catcher is a little reason for pause. Depending on price he still may be a consideration.

Same for Bauer.

But there's little else on the market in the places they have holes. When Marcus Stroman is the 7th best FA, that's a very weak class.
Here are the top 25 free agents for 2020-21 - ( New Window )
Bauer will only sign for 1 season  
CMicks3110 : 9/26/2020 10:20 pm : link
he made a childhood bet to never sign a long-term deal. So I think we can sell him with both money and opportunity for 2021.
Bauer will only sign for 1 season  
CMicks3110 : 9/26/2020 10:20 pm : link
he made a childhood bet to never sign a long-term deal. So I think we can sell him with both money and opportunity for 2021.
Re spending, just a hunch  
Shecky : 9/26/2020 10:41 pm : link
Re Ramos, Brodie believed his bullshit. The salesman got sold.
..  
Named Later : 9/27/2020 10:36 am : link
The Mets gave away too many games this year. They blew that 7-2 lead vs the Yankees.....I couldn't watch baseball for a week after that shit-show.

I saw a stat somewhere that the Mets led all MLB in most games with double-digit hit totals. But they were near the bottom in runs scored. That says something about the way the lineup was constructed, lack of timely hitting.

BVW traded away good pitchers, then filled the Mets rotation with garbage. Would have been nice to see Justin Dunn start some games. Or even Kevin Smith. hey were forced to start a pitcher whose name I didn't know and can't recall....Bum of the Month.

Wait til next year.
Justin Dunn's  
CMicks3110 : 9/27/2020 11:29 am : link
peripherals are awful. 6.54 FIP
Anthony Kay  
CMicks3110 : 9/27/2020 11:31 am : link
hasn't been particularly good either.

A lot of the other talent the Mets gave up hasn't really done much at the ML level.

The biggest losses will be seen in the years ahead, specifically Kelenic and Simeon-Woods Richardson, those are the two to be most concerned about.


Blake Taylor had an ok year in the bp  
Eric on Li : 9/27/2020 11:47 am : link
though it appears to have been flukey (bad walk rate, era 2 points better than his fip, crazy low BABIP).

SWR and Kelenic are going to haunt us for a while.

I don't particularly think much of Dunn/Kay/Smith, but the volume of players BVW gave up for practically nothing at the MLB level is staggering, even lower level guys like the guy they gave up for Font. Law of averages would suggest at least 1 will come back to bite them.
RE: Justin Dunn's  
Named Later : 9/27/2020 11:58 am : link
In comment 14985177 CMicks3110 said:
Quote:
peripherals are awful. 6.54 FIP



Justin Dunn finished 4 and 1. That would make him better than 3 of the Mets starters. What was their FIP ?

Kevin Smith should have been covered under the Peterson Rule....you don't give away big Lefty pitching.

Anyway, we'll be rid of this front office in a short while.
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