2nd time in 3 weeks we saw a team with multipe all-pro players mssing and we lost.. How can the Cowboys have 8 OL that are better than our best OL? How come backup RBs look so good against us and at times better than our 2nd overall pick.. especially when we have invested so heavily in our DL..
Can someone please explain how are we any better than we were 3 years ago? He really needs to go.. Dallas probably has a better OL talent on their practice squad team than we have on starters.. after all these investments..
It is like anything else today. If you say someone is bad and someone disagrees with you, they get labelled a "defender" or a "supporter". Again - I'm such a "fan" of DG that it should be very easy to find posts where I'm talking about him being great, right? You do realize that there is a ton of area between someone being comp0lete shit and a marvelous GM, right?
You might not, because you are really fucking dumb, but let's take teh average person.
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very simple ask of shitbirds like giantstock or lax counsel, please produce a post where I've said Gettleman is a very good GM or has made great moves for us.
Should be easy if I'm a huge supporter of his, right?
What I've done is taken people to task who say he's unqualified to be a GM, has always sucked as a GM, or the analytics schmucks who claim that he shuns analytics.
So he's the challenge - produce posts where I talk about Gettleman being a very good or great GM here in NY. Really shouldn't be too hard, right?
Please. Your play has essentially been this mantra - Gettleman did good work in Carolina, has some good offspring (Brandon Beane), did good work under Accorsi, and we should trust that will eventually convey to Jints Central.
Good luck spinning out of that...
Again - tell me how that translates to me saying he's doing a great job here. Hell, some of you guys mantra has been that he was terrible in Carolina and should never have been hired here. Should that ridiculousness be called out?
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In comment 15005568 lax counsel said:
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In comment 15005563 FatMan in Charlotte said:
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very simple ask of shitbirds like giantstock or lax counsel, please produce a post where I've said Gettleman is a very good GM or has made great moves for us.
Should be easy if I'm a huge supporter of his, right?
What I've done is taken people to task who say he's unqualified to be a GM, has always sucked as a GM, or the analytics schmucks who claim that he shuns analytics.
So he's the challenge - produce posts where I talk about Gettleman being a very good or great GM here in NY. Really shouldn't be too hard, right?
<<Sigh>> the beat goes on...
And it will until you back up ridiculous claims. I haven't been on the board for 4 weeks?? Very simple request - but one you can't back up
Prove that you didn't...
LOL - I already did above you fucking imbecile.
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In comment 15005551 Les in TO said:
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His winning percentage with the Giants is worse than Matt Millen. Let that sink in
Inform us all what would you have done to make a better winning percentage?
If this is all you have in your holster to defend Gettleman's regime, it might be time to sit a few threads out.
LMAO, I always love it when the putz's claim "We suck" but always lack any real solution...Thanks for proving my point....PUTZ!
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In comment 15005573 FatMan in Charlotte said:
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In comment 15005568 lax counsel said:
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In comment 15005563 FatMan in Charlotte said:
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very simple ask of shitbirds like giantstock or lax counsel, please produce a post where I've said Gettleman is a very good GM or has made great moves for us.
Should be easy if I'm a huge supporter of his, right?
What I've done is taken people to task who say he's unqualified to be a GM, has always sucked as a GM, or the analytics schmucks who claim that he shuns analytics.
So he's the challenge - produce posts where I talk about Gettleman being a very good or great GM here in NY. Really shouldn't be too hard, right?
<<Sigh>> the beat goes on...
And it will until you back up ridiculous claims. I haven't been on the board for 4 weeks?? Very simple request - but one you can't back up
Prove that you didn't...
LOL - I already did above you fucking imbecile.
Living rent free in your head...
You want answers?? No way! He sucks and if you don't want him ridden out of town - you're a "supporter"!!
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In comment 15005463 giantstock said:
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In comment 15005346 montanagiant said:
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A bunch of you have made claims about FMiC's posting and he asked for evidence of that.
If you're going to do that then step the fuck up and prove it! Otherwise, be a man and admit you're wrong. That is only the right thing to do.
Why should anyone do that??
You asked me to provide evidence of when I said that during Dg's 1st year I would have drafted gotten FA's Hubbard and Fulton then gone after SY's guy of Braden Smith. I finally found the posts I made and replied and then you say nothing.
What's the point with posters like you?? You wear your New York Giants skirt and no matter what it's "Yay Team!"
No one owes you nothing - especially a cheerleader of a fan. If you think so many are lying then go ahead and pout.
Because in any Message Board if you make a claim about someone else you should at least be able to back it up.
Why is that a questionable request?
I went back on my time to find the post you asked me to prove - I replied and I sent it on the thread you asked. What did I get for it? Nothing. Which is fine but I did it as a courtesy and I got no reply.
Why is it unreasonable to believe that posters may feel that when they make a post they should feel trusted? You can choose to believe that poster or not.
You can call me a liar if you wish. I can care less. Me and you have a bad relationship. I'm sure there are some others on here too you have bad relationships with as I do. No offense - but why should I waste my valuable time to satisfy you? What does it get me to go back and look? Last time I did-- you said nothing and we just went right back on other threads ripping into one another.
For example on here there have ben several people here that have accused FMiC of being a DG defender. Every accuser is lying? They can't be trusted? If they believe their word is good -- why do they need to go back? This board is fun board to talk. You gotta go back and find links on everything that was said previously rather than just make your own decision if that poster is honest or not?
Please tell me what thread that was and I will 100% give you the courtesy of responding because at that point it's deserved and I apologize if I missed it.
You want answers?? No way! He sucks and if you don't want him ridden out of town - you're a "supporter"!!
"I hate this team because....Well....I really don't know what we should have done but hell I hate this team...Yeah!"
Again - tell me how that translates to me saying he's doing a great job here. Hell, some of you guys mantra has been that he was terrible in Carolina and should never have been hired here. Should that ridiculousness be called out?
Your suggestions are the "great job" is coming based on his resume and that he walked into an oil spill.
And once that is cleaned up, better days will arrive.
If we aren’t 4-7 or so by that mark, the fire DG talks will continue to get louder
Gettleman saw a masterful performance by Eli in the last week of the season and just went on as if that could be assumed to continue. A few years prior that would be acceptable. But, the balance of that season was not great. One of the biggest reasons was Eli, an immobile QB, was playing behind a horrid OL. So, if you proceed with Eli, you have to do something about the OL. He didn't.
Then, he assumes just drafting Barkley solves the problem. Again, without doing anything to the worst OL, what did you expect. Barry Sanders is great as an individual comparison, but how many titles did he win? Playoff games? There's a reason he is the career "leader" in runs for a loss. I, for one, love Barkley, but I don't want to see week after week of 16 carries for 30 yards and then a 70 yard run and then tout the 100 game. That kind of game looks great when you look back on it 30 years later. But, it more often than not isn't winning the game. And I don't put that on him. I put it on a lack of an offensive plan and OL. All that said, I am 1000% happier with Barkley, injury and all, than I would be with Darnold as the QB.
Now, here we are after 3 off seasons. The OL is still mostly the same results. But, we have a 1st round pick in Thomas starting and we have 2 promising draft picks in the wings. I think a lot of Gettleman's fate could ride on Lemieux and Peart (and Thomas).
Many people wanted to pretend like we had every reason to think DG was a strong hire and a lot more than competent while others of us from the beginning questioned if he was even a competent hire.
NoGainDayne : 10/1/2018 3:20 pm : link
and even more pissed off now. While other teams are moving their analytics and technology programs forward we hired a guy stuck in the past who barely changed the staff.
We haven't done anything to show we can compete in a fast modernizing NFL.
I started to root against the Giants winning last year because I wanted them to clean house. I might be there again already. This team isn't going to the playoffs and I fear the only way ownership might actually accept the reality that they need a new leader is one or two years more of horrible play.
Honestly I might be willing to stomach that if we can actually get a lick of innovation in the building.
We have all the same characters on that thread even today day after day trying to twist facts to overrate the competence of the people in that building. When the truth is, it should be scary to them how clear it was to some of us.
I'm sharing this again because it's sad, many here were in this place years ago, where I've been conflicted. Losses seem better than wins on some level because it might get us closer to real change. I don't want to be here, I don't think any of the "realists" do where I found myself before this season saying to people, honestly it might be better if they are 2-14 than 5-11.
Watching the Giants management struggle through appearing to be even remotely competitive in their approach is kind of like watching someone go into a fight that they are overmatched in with far too much confidence. You say something to yourself like man, I hope they get knocked out or stay down because otherwise they might get themselves killed. This franchise is for some reason pursuing the path of watching us die before our eyes instead of taking it's lumps calling up some people in its extended network to fight alongside instead of charging into a fight that increasingly few people think they have any shot at winning.
2018 Thread on Ownership and DG - ( New Window )
You want answers?? No way! He sucks and if you don't want him ridden out of town - you're a "supporter"!!
He’s 9-27. But he re-tooled behind Eli twice which he know you loved soooo
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look. If you don't grab a pitchfork, you are a supporter!!
You want answers?? No way! He sucks and if you don't want him ridden out of town - you're a "supporter"!!
"I hate this team because....Well....I really don't know what we should have done but hell I hate this team...Yeah!"
What is the point of some fan telling you a perfect set of moves in hindsight? That’s what you’re looking for?
Bottom line we are in year 3 and are now 0-5, that’s reality. Don’t really need to spin that at all.
Abrams. But maybe Judge will be a good change for the organization and get some control. The team is terrible but at least they fight. More than can be said under McAdoo or Shurmur.
I've said repeatedly that Gettleman has made some poor moves. But that he also inherited a team that was in a terrible state.
Are you really saying that the record of a team is the indicator of if a GM is doing well or not?? Funny, because Yankee fans want their GM run out of town.
I said that this year was a critical one in if the team is heading in the right direction. If we miss the playoffs and are at the bottom of the league again - he needs to go, not because of the record but because after three years, we still aren't in a competitive position.
“He needs to go but not because of the record but because after three years, we still aren’t in a competitive position”
What?? Those are the same thing.
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In comment 15005279 FatMan in Charlotte said:
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where I've defended Gettleman
OMG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
It's got to be the leading post for Post of the Year.
I had to read it at least 20X to make sure I wasn't misreading what he wrote.
Oh my, Fatman, you can’t be serious.
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that??
I've said repeatedly that Gettleman has made some poor moves. But that he also inherited a team that was in a terrible state.
Are you really saying that the record of a team is the indicator of if a GM is doing well or not?? Funny, because Yankee fans want their GM run out of town.
I said that this year was a critical one in if the team is heading in the right direction. If we miss the playoffs and are at the bottom of the league again - he needs to go, not because of the record but because after three years, we still aren't in a competitive position.
“He needs to go but not because of the record but because after three years, we still aren’t in a competitive position”
What?? Those are the same thing.
However, we are looking more like a 3-13 team, at the very best. With the latter, the record wouldn't be great. With the former it's both the record and a lack of any type of improvement...except for those who are happy that all our players showed up with the right uniform and shoelaces tied.
FatMan in Charlotte : 9:18 pm : link : reply
where I've defended Gettleman
Easy
2018
1-Barkley, great rookie season, disappointing and injury-riddled second season, blown out knee and who knows if he'll still have that burst when he comes back?
2-Hernandez, been regressing like hell, looks like at best a mediocre starter.
3-Carter, mostly invisible his first two years, was better this year but still far from an impact player, done for this season. Also Hill, who got incredible mileage out of one decent game but has otherwise done little. Was so impressive that Mr Magoo trader for the honor of overpaying Leonard Williams to take most of his snaps.
4-Lauletta 😂
5-RJ McIntosh, still around but still getting left off of the active roster on gameday
Oh, and the 3rd round supplemental draft pick wasted of Sam Beal, who will have played all of 6 games in three years.
2019
1-Jones, was up and down last year, taking big steps backwards this year, gives the ball away as if he were the Santa Claus of the Meadowlands. Lawrence is a steady performer, though limited mostly to a wide body run-plugging role that you can fill without using a first. Baker is gone.
3-Ximines has had zero impact, looks slow as molasses, and is now hurt.
4-Love has seen time at CB and S, doesn't look like an answer at either position.
5-Connelly looked good for a couple of games, got hurt, and is now gone. Slayton was last year's happy surprise but sure doesn't look like a quality starting WR this year.
6-Ballentine....hoo boy does he suck.
7-dont even remember their names, doesn't matter
Obvious it's too early to say much about 2020, but Thomas has gotten off to a rough start.
When people say he's never been a good GM, I show them the record from Carolina.
Can you show where I say he's been a good or great GM here?
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Please show me..
FatMan in Charlotte : 9:18 pm : link : reply
where I've defended Gettleman
Easy
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When people say he's never been a good GM, I point them to his record in Carolina and that he's their most successful GM ever. When people say he shits on analytics, I've pointed to him putting the system in place in Carolina.
He's moved the goal posts oh so subtly.
FMiC has now revised to "...good GM with the Giants..." as what he really meant...
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In comment 15005298 FatMan in Charlotte said:
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that??
I've said repeatedly that Gettleman has made some poor moves. But that he also inherited a team that was in a terrible state.
Are you really saying that the record of a team is the indicator of if a GM is doing well or not?? Funny, because Yankee fans want their GM run out of town.
I said that this year was a critical one in if the team is heading in the right direction. If we miss the playoffs and are at the bottom of the league again - he needs to go, not because of the record but because after three years, we still aren't in a competitive position.
“He needs to go but not because of the record but because after three years, we still aren’t in a competitive position”
What?? Those are the same thing.
Not really. An example of the latter could be a 7-9 season with a strong finish. Not a winning season, but more wins than prior and a shot at the playoffs at some point in November.
However, we are looking more like a 3-13 team, at the very best. With the latter, the record wouldn't be great. With the former it's both the record and a lack of any type of improvement...except for those who are happy that all our players showed up with the right uniform and shoelaces tied.
7-9 is in a competitive position because you’re one or two games going your way from being in the playoffs. The record is directly correlated to not being in a competitive position because they’re 9-27.
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In comment 15005619 ajr2456 said:
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In comment 15005298 FatMan in Charlotte said:
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that??
I've said repeatedly that Gettleman has made some poor moves. But that he also inherited a team that was in a terrible state.
Are you really saying that the record of a team is the indicator of if a GM is doing well or not?? Funny, because Yankee fans want their GM run out of town.
I said that this year was a critical one in if the team is heading in the right direction. If we miss the playoffs and are at the bottom of the league again - he needs to go, not because of the record but because after three years, we still aren't in a competitive position.
“He needs to go but not because of the record but because after three years, we still aren’t in a competitive position”
What?? Those are the same thing.
Not really. An example of the latter could be a 7-9 season with a strong finish. Not a winning season, but more wins than prior and a shot at the playoffs at some point in November.
However, we are looking more like a 3-13 team, at the very best. With the latter, the record wouldn't be great. With the former it's both the record and a lack of any type of improvement...except for those who are happy that all our players showed up with the right uniform and shoelaces tied.
7-9 is in a competitive position because you’re one or two games going your way from being in the playoffs. The record is directly correlated to not being in a competitive position because they’re 9-27.
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Please show me..
FatMan in Charlotte : 9:18 pm : link : reply
where I've defended Gettleman
Easy
Quote:
When people say he's never been a good GM, I point them to his record in Carolina and that he's their most successful GM ever. When people say he shits on analytics, I've pointed to him putting the system in place in Carolina.
He's moved the goal posts oh so subtly.
FMiC has now revised to "...good GM with the Giants..." as what he really meant...
Isn't that the argument?? If you think he wasn't a good GM with the Panthers, you are a moron.
When people say he's never been a good GM, I show them the record from Carolina.
Can you show where I say he's been a good or great GM here?
That’s not what you asked, don’t be sneaky. You defend Gettleman’s tenure, his results, and the scenario around his dismissal at every juncture.
I always assumed that had some relevance to your thoughts about his current position. But maybe you’re just the editor for the Dave Gettleman Wikipedia section titled Carolina?
Should be easy if I'm a huge supporter of his, right?
What I've done is taken people to task who say he's unqualified to be a GM, has always sucked as a GM, or the analytics schmucks who claim that he shuns analytics.
So he's the challenge - produce posts where I talk about Gettleman being a very good or great GM here in NY. Really shouldn't be too hard, right?
This is the type of weasel that you do. This is the same example I gave that you ripped into me about Sam Darnold when I said that he was going to be "good." (( was wrong.) Then you replied that I was wrong for making such claim that he'd be elite (or generational etc)?
The point was I NEVER SAID HE WAS GOING TO BE ELITE (GENRATIONAL). When I replied to you - you denied you said elite but I replied back and copied your post -- YOU SAID IT.
Now you are trying to weasel yourself on here.
****You are asking the following: "where I've said Gettleman is a very good GM or has made great moves for us."
Like the weasel you are NOBODY is saying this. You again DELIBERTAELY/DECEIPTFULLY changed what you're being accused of.
People are saying you "DEFENDED" DG. Now you are trying to weasel that into "I never said he was very good" etc. Saying you never said he was good is not the same as defending him. You can't understand that?
And even on this thread. Hasn't there been posters on here saying the losing today is indicative of the GM?
Thus aren't you defending DG against these attacks?? Ohh wait a minute that's right. When the poster bw-in-dc gave you an explanation why-- YOU DEFENDED DG!!!! Ohh yeah and then you chose to deflect the point by going off topic and talk about running Cashman out of town. SO you are using what SOME (not all) Yank fans have suggested and using it to defend your position on DG.
This is the same bullshit you are trying to do with Lax. He told you that you were hiding on here. Are you that slow that you couldn't understand that he was implying "state of the Giants?" SO what do you do? You print out some subjects in which you were discussing the Yankees. And the posts about the Giants -- which one at the time lax accused you - did you address the state of the team? Y YOU KNEW WHAT HE WAS ASKING YET YOU DLEIBERALETY TRIED OT DEFLECT.
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Please show me..
FatMan in Charlotte : 9:18 pm : link : reply
where I've defended Gettleman
Easy
Quote:
When people say he's never been a good GM, I point them to his record in Carolina and that he's their most successful GM ever. When people say he shits on analytics, I've pointed to him putting the system in place in Carolina.
He's moved the goal posts oh so subtly.
FMiC has now revised to "...good GM with the Giants..." as what he really meant...
This is the best thread in quite some time. It’s like the twilight zone. Prove a negative! All those profanity laced tirades against any poster suggesting DG was an awful hire weren’t meant to say DG was a good GM <<for the Giants>> he was only demonstrating that he was above carrying -as he loves to say- a pitchfork. Let the bloviating continue...
2018
1-Barkley, great rookie season, disappointing and injury-riddled second season, blown out knee and who knows if he'll still have that burst when he comes back?
2-Hernandez, been regressing like hell, looks like at best a mediocre starter.
3-Carter, mostly invisible his first two years, was better this year but still far from an impact player, done for this season. Also Hill, who got incredible mileage out of one decent game but has otherwise done little. Was so impressive that Mr Magoo trader for the honor of overpaying Leonard Williams to take most of his snaps.
4-Lauletta 😂
5-RJ McIntosh, still around but still getting left off of the active roster on gameday
Oh, and the 3rd round supplemental draft pick wasted of Sam Beal, who will have played all of 6 games in three years.
2019
1-Jones, was up and down last year, taking big steps backwards this year, gives the ball away as if he were the Santa Claus of the Meadowlands. Lawrence is a steady performer, though limited mostly to a wide body run-plugging role that you can fill without using a first. Baker is gone.
3-Ximines has had zero impact, looks slow as molasses, and is now hurt.
4-Love has seen time at CB and S, doesn't look like an answer at either position.
5-Connelly looked good for a couple of games, got hurt, and is now gone. Slayton was last year's happy surprise but sure doesn't look like a quality starting WR this year.
6-Ballentine....hoo boy does he suck.
7-dont even remember their names, doesn't matter
Obvious it's too early to say much about 2020, but Thomas has gotten off to a rough start.
Quite damning to say the least. Is Ross still running the draft?
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very simple ask of shitbirds like giantstock or lax counsel, please produce a post where I've said Gettleman is a very good GM or has made great moves for us.
Should be easy if I'm a huge supporter of his, right?
What I've done is taken people to task who say he's unqualified to be a GM, has always sucked as a GM, or the analytics schmucks who claim that he shuns analytics.
So he's the challenge - produce posts where I talk about Gettleman being a very good or great GM here in NY. Really shouldn't be too hard, right?
This is the type of weasel that you do. This is the same example I gave that you ripped into me about Sam Darnold when I said that he was going to be "good." (( was wrong.) Then you replied that I was wrong for making such claim that he'd be elite (or generational etc)?
The point was I NEVER SAID HE WAS GOING TO BE ELITE (GENRATIONAL). When I replied to you - you denied you said elite but I replied back and copied your post -- YOU SAID IT.
Now you are trying to weasel yourself on here.
****You are asking the following: "where I've said Gettleman is a very good GM or has made great moves for us."
Like the weasel you are NOBODY is saying this. You again DELIBERTAELY/DECEIPTFULLY changed what you're being accused of.
People are saying you "DEFENDED" DG. Now you are trying to weasel that into "I never said he was very good" etc. Saying you never said he was good is not the same as defending him. You can't understand that?
And even on this thread. Hasn't there been posters on here saying the losing today is indicative of the GM?
Thus aren't you defending DG against these attacks?? Ohh wait a minute that's right. When the poster bw-in-dc gave you an explanation why-- YOU DEFENDED DG!!!! Ohh yeah and then you chose to deflect the point by going off topic and talk about running Cashman out of town. SO you are using what SOME (not all) Yank fans have suggested and using it to defend your position on DG.
This is the same bullshit you are trying to do with Lax. He told you that you were hiding on here. Are you that slow that you couldn't understand that he was implying "state of the Giants?" SO what do you do? You print out some subjects in which you were discussing the Yankees. And the posts about the Giants -- which one at the time lax accused you - did you address the state of the team? Y YOU KNEW WHAT HE WAS ASKING YET YOU DLEIBERALETY TRIED OT DEFLECT.
I didn’t even bother posting a reply to that. He indicted himself, by posting threads where he was commenting on....Brian Cashman
This is not a good performance. He was given a bad team before and may have made it worse because of contracts and failed draft picks. If Mara had a singular hair on his ball he would fire this man by Wednesday and ask Judge to help him pick a GM.
McKinney and Peart haven’t played for us yet.
The only saving grace here is that outside about 2 games, Beckham has looked very ordinary in Cleveland.
He's been invisible for the last three weeks before tonight. Forgive me for not being overly impressed by good stats against an incredibly bad Cowboys defense. Also had a killer drop today.
McKinney and Peart haven’t played for us yet.
You hit the nail on the head. It will largely come down to Jones. If he’s mediocre or worse, it is going to look a whole lot worse than it even does now.
Isn't that the argument?? If you think he wasn't a good GM with the Panthers, you are a moron.
Guilty. I don't think he was a good GM. I think was okay and was the beneficiary of Hurney's foundation.
The Panthers thought so highly of Gettleman they fired him after they went 11-5. I'm sure you'll respond with how he got screwed, was misunderstood, etc, etc.
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by no means am I trying to defend DG with this particular thread but if we are talking solely about draft picks, he’s been ok and will come down to whether or not Jones develops into a pro bowl quarterback. If he doesn’t, that sucks.
McKinney and Peart haven’t played for us yet.
You hit the nail on the head. It will largely come down to Jones. If he’s mediocre or worse, it is going to look a whole lot worse than it even does now.
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In comment 15005676 ryanmkeane said:
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by no means am I trying to defend DG with this particular thread but if we are talking solely about draft picks, he’s been ok and will come down to whether or not Jones develops into a pro bowl quarterback. If he doesn’t, that sucks.
McKinney and Peart haven’t played for us yet.
You hit the nail on the head. It will largely come down to Jones. If he’s mediocre or worse, it is going to look a whole lot worse than it even does now.
If he's mediocre or worse, we are very likely to have a shot at Lawrence. I think under those circumstances you have to take him. For no other reason, Lawrence is the kind of guy you will expect to elevate the rest of the team. To date, Jones hasn't shown he can be that guy. That isn't necessarily saying he will be bad. But, that isn't the guy I can build with, knowing I have a ton of holes to fill.
Agreed 100%
Where would you rank Lawrence among his peers? Is he a top 10 DT? Nah. So where?
Lawrence is a great player. But he can only be on the field for 60% of snaps at a maximum. If he were to get hurt, then BJ Hill and Austin Johnson get more snaps. They're good players. Unless they have the unique ability to quickly disrupt the passing game, it's not hard to find good interior DL play. He wasn't a bad draft pick by any stretch...but at 17 Dexter Lawrence needed to be every bit of Dexter Lawrence to justify that pick. Even then...it's just a single because of his skillset and snap coutn.