The Giants are in a tricky spot right now with regards to the looming, 10/29 trade deadline. It’s widely thought that Gettleman is a lame duck GM here, whether he’s let go or retires, I think most feel he will not be here next season.
I’m of the belief that Abrams has been groomed to be the next GM. He has been involved in the interview process with the 2018 and 2020 head coach search. He also has had an increased media responsibility the last year or so. I feel part of the reason Gettleman was retained was in hopes of a better season where they could transition to Abrams. The optics didn’t allow that after 2019.
For as much as Mara likely wants to give Abrams the GM title, he can’t. The results simply aren’t good enough. The more I think about it, the more I think Gettleman was hired with the condition that Abrams was GM in waiting. It aligns with the history of the franchise since George Young to think the Giants wanted to eventually hand over GM duties to Abrams.
This leads to the trade deadline. Should Gettleman have the authority to sell off assets or potentially trade off draft picks for players? He sold off Apple & Snacks in 2018 and made the polarizing Williams trade last year.
The three likely options here leading up to the deadline:
1. Gettleman has full authority to make any moves as he sees fit.
2. Gettleman is restricted in what he can do and we see a quiet trade deadline.
3. Unlikely, but Gettleman is let go in the coming ten or so days and Abrams handles any trades prior to the deadline.
The reason I mention this, it is important for the Giants to try to add more draft picks. With only 6 picks in 2021, that is simply not enough. Any player who can fetch something decent, should be moved. Yet, who do we have to handle those tough decisions?
Leonard Williams and Dalvin Tomlinson to long term contracts.
One of them absolutely needs to go by the deadline.
We should be able to get a least a 4th Rounder. Maybe a very low 3rd.
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Leonard Williams and Dalvin Tomlinson to long term contracts.
One of them absolutely needs to go by the deadline.
We should be able to get a least a 4th Rounder. Maybe a very low 3rd.
What can we trade them vs what we might get in a comp pick.
Good point. But maybe a bird in hand (a known draft pick) is better than two in the bush (what the NFL assigns us.)
I can see the Giants retaining one of Williams/Tomlinson, one of Golden/Frackrell, Freeman, and Gano.
My guess is the Giants lose Ryan, Williams, Golden, Fleming. It then becomes a question of whether the Giants sign UFAs from other teams that negate the loss.
Short story, although I don't think the Giants will be big winners in the comp game, I do think they will get something.
You can believe whatever you like based on your listening skills. But all you provided on this thread was an unsupported opinion.
If you had taken the time to read what i wrote you woild know I stated that since day 1 of his hiring and his 1 presser JUDGE has stated that he is instrumenting a plan that would change the Giants into a Regular Winning contending for championships yearly. This season is NOT about wins and losses but about Progress and and improvement, dont ask me about wins and losses because it is not going to be qan overnight fix Win will come as this team and organization improves so wins and losses are irrelevant.
He says this in almost every presser he has. His plan is for the LONG TERM not NOW and it is going to take time to fully implement. I dont know how else to put this that you dont understand
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You did not give ANY solid reasons for anything you said. "don't just listen, but HEAR Joe Judge" is not a solid reason why Judge is now defacto running the entire Giants organization.
You can believe whatever you like based on your listening skills. But all you provided on this thread was an unsupported opinion.
If you had taken the time to read what i wrote you woild know I stated that since day 1 of his hiring and his 1 presser JUDGE has stated that he is instrumenting a plan that would change the Giants into a Regular Winning contending for championships yearly. This season is NOT about wins and losses but about Progress and and improvement, dont ask me about wins and losses because it is not going to be qan overnight fix Win will come as this team and organization improves so wins and losses are irrelevant.
He says this in almost every presser he has. His plan is for the LONG TERM not NOW and it is going to take time to fully implement. I dont know how else to put this that you dont understand
I’d say that too if I weren’t winning games. What coach would say anything different? I LISTEN to Judge and I HEAR the same excuses that have been getting peddled for the last three years. Patience, guys. Rome wasn’t built in a day. We almost won that game. Progress. Maybe next season we’ll tie them.
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In comment 15006930 M.S. said:
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Leonard Williams and Dalvin Tomlinson to long term contracts.
One of them absolutely needs to go by the deadline.
We should be able to get a least a 4th Rounder. Maybe a very low 3rd.
What can we trade them vs what we might get in a comp pick.
Good point. But maybe a bird in hand (a known draft pick) is better than two in the bush (what the NFL assigns us.)
Rather take a 4th now then get screwed out of comp pick later. no guarentees
I can see the Giants retaining one of Williams/Tomlinson, one of Golden/Frackrell, Freeman, and Gano.
My guess is the Giants lose Ryan, Williams, Golden, Fleming. It then becomes a question of whether the Giants sign UFAs from other teams that negate the loss.
Short story, although I don't think the Giants will be big winners in the comp game, I do think they will get something.
Then, since this team is going nowhere, trade them for whatever you can get. 6th round pick? Sold. Get something for them, anything.
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In comment 15006875 Mike from Ohio said:
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You did not give ANY solid reasons for anything you said. "don't just listen, but HEAR Joe Judge" is not a solid reason why Judge is now defacto running the entire Giants organization.
You can believe whatever you like based on your listening skills. But all you provided on this thread was an unsupported opinion.
If you had taken the time to read what i wrote you woild know I stated that since day 1 of his hiring and his 1 presser JUDGE has stated that he is instrumenting a plan that would change the Giants into a Regular Winning contending for championships yearly. This season is NOT about wins and losses but about Progress and and improvement, dont ask me about wins and losses because it is not going to be qan overnight fix Win will come as this team and organization improves so wins and losses are irrelevant.
He says this in almost every presser he has. His plan is for the LONG TERM not NOW and it is going to take time to fully implement. I dont know how else to put this that you dont understand
I’d say that too if I weren’t winning games. What coach would say anything different? I LISTEN to Judge and I HEAR the same excuses that have been getting peddled for the last three years. Patience, guys. Rome wasn’t built in a day. We almost won that game. Progress. Maybe next season we’ll tie them.
I need to see DJ not turn the ball over. He has to show he can protect the football. If he can't, he is bust folks and everything that entails for a franchise when it is a 1st round QB bust.
That is how low my bar is. DJ and AT have to give me hope they are not going to be busts.
I have been watching football with a religious passion since 1975.
I am scared.
I need to see DJ not turn the ball over. He has to show he can protect the football. If he can't, he is bust folks and everything that entails for a franchise when it is a 1st round QB bust.
That is how low my bar is. DJ and AT have to give me hope they are not going to be busts.
I have been watching football with a religious passion since 1975.
I am scared.
WOW this post is very good and I agree with it. Just a question though. have you or have you not seen an improvement each week since the Games Started? I have seen a lot of improvements myself. As far as the O-line goes, I dont care which team it is it takes time for any O-line to gel and play as a unit. Thest guys have 5 games together and I have seen an improvement from day 1. Just the fact that this team was able to run the ball on Sunday was a huge improvement. The pass protection has also improved immensely, we have a rookie LT that has had no Preseason games and is actually playing the position that he was supposed to be groomed to play. Not thrown in there on day 1 as the LT. He was supposed to start at RT and then moved when ready to LT. I am actually shocked That Thomas's performance isnt worse. He has been up against 5 of the best pass rushers in the league. Has he excelled NO, he he looked bad YES, but You can see as the games progressed he git better. This is a good thing, because he is literally learnin by tHE TRIAL BY FORE METHOD, and his learning has been put on thr fast lane.
Hopefully he doesnt lose confidence, which happens to a lot of players thrown to the wolves right off the bat. Im happy with his progress thus far. By next season he will look like a different player if he doesnt get discouraged and lose confidence
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I care about seeing if the OL gets better. I am willing to wait until the end of the year. The first games could not have been worse. They are also the least meaningful. Game 1 into the second quarter of the season was not good.
I need to see DJ not turn the ball over. He has to show he can protect the football. If he can't, he is bust folks and everything that entails for a franchise when it is a 1st round QB bust.
That is how low my bar is. DJ and AT have to give me hope they are not going to be busts.
I have been watching football with a religious passion since 1975.
I am scared.
WOW this post is very good and I agree with it. Just a question though. have you or have you not seen an improvement each week since the Games Started? I have seen a lot of improvements myself. As far as the O-line goes, I dont care which team it is it takes time for any O-line to gel and play as a unit. Thest guys have 5 games together and I have seen an improvement from day 1. Just the fact that this team was able to run the ball on Sunday was a huge improvement. The pass protection has also improved immensely, we have a rookie LT that has had no Preseason games and is actually playing the position that he was supposed to be groomed to play. Not thrown in there on day 1 as the LT. He was supposed to start at RT and then moved when ready to LT. I am actually shocked That Thomas's performance isnt worse. He has been up against 5 of the best pass rushers in the league. Has he excelled NO, he he looked bad YES, but You can see as the games progressed he git better. This is a good thing, because he is literally learnin by tHE TRIAL BY FORE METHOD, and his learning has been put on thr fast lane.
Hopefully he doesnt lose confidence, which happens to a lot of players thrown to the wolves right off the bat. Im happy with his progress thus far. By next season he will look like a different player if he doesnt get discouraged and lose confidence
I will keep hoping it changes until the end of the year. DJ is on the clock. If he can't make some magic and win a game, we will draft Lawrence. I would trade anyone on this team for picks at the deadline...Anyone.
Spare me the relentless Joe Judge optimism too. There are things to like for sure but everyone got a chance to see Andrew Thomas and the other tackles on film and as of now (again jury is out on this too) it looks like we made changes but not enough to cover up our serious flaws.
Judge could be the start of something good but even the idea that he knows how to build an organization around him is a huge leap at this point. Would I trust him more than anyone else in the building? Certainly. But that isn’t saying much
Argh. You probably aren't wrong, but I'd hate to lose Slayton. Not only just because of his potential at a position of need, but also because he's a great team guy with the perfect attitude.
Spare me the relentless Joe Judge optimism too. There are things to like for sure but everyone got a chance to see Andrew Thomas and the other tackles on film and as of now (again jury is out on this too) it looks like we made changes but not enough to cover up our serious flaws.
Judge could be the start of something good but even the idea that he knows how to build an organization around him is a huge leap at this point. Would I trust him more than anyone else in the building? Certainly. But that isn’t saying much
WIll you please post a link where it says Abrahms is in charge of trades already? I have not seen written nor do I know of anyone that has stated this. So where is this coming from? Or is this just some made up wishful thinking because no where in the Press or from anyone affiliated with the NY Giants FO has anything come out on this huge decision.
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In comment 15007800 Thegratefulhead said:
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I care about seeing if the OL gets better. I am willing to wait until the end of the year. The first games could not have been worse. They are also the least meaningful. Game 1 into the second quarter of the season was not good.
I need to see DJ not turn the ball over. He has to show he can protect the football. If he can't, he is bust folks and everything that entails for a franchise when it is a 1st round QB bust.
That is how low my bar is. DJ and AT have to give me hope they are not going to be busts.
I have been watching football with a religious passion since 1975.
I am scared.
WOW this post is very good and I agree with it. Just a question though. have you or have you not seen an improvement each week since the Games Started? I have seen a lot of improvements myself. As far as the O-line goes, I dont care which team it is it takes time for any O-line to gel and play as a unit. Thest guys have 5 games together and I have seen an improvement from day 1. Just the fact that this team was able to run the ball on Sunday was a huge improvement. The pass protection has also improved immensely, we have a rookie LT that has had no Preseason games and is actually playing the position that he was supposed to be groomed to play. Not thrown in there on day 1 as the LT. He was supposed to start at RT and then moved when ready to LT. I am actually shocked That Thomas's performance isnt worse. He has been up against 5 of the best pass rushers in the league. Has he excelled NO, he he looked bad YES, but You can see as the games progressed he git better. This is a good thing, because he is literally learnin by tHE TRIAL BY FORE METHOD, and his learning has been put on thr fast lane.
Hopefully he doesnt lose confidence, which happens to a lot of players thrown to the wolves right off the bat. Im happy with his progress thus far. By next season he will look like a different player if he doesnt get discouraged and lose confidence
Gates...I think he might be a diamond. Thomas is too slow for the speed outside. I am hoping that when the game slows down for him, he can anticipate and improve. Right now, he looks a speed rusher's wet dream. That is a problem. DJ spent hte entire offseason on body, making it stronger and drills to improve his ball security. I have not seen improvement there. I have been a DJ guy. He has some plus traits including accuracy that I put double weight on in today's NFL but if he can't feel the rush he will always turn the ball over.
I will keep hoping it changes until the end of the year. DJ is on the clock. If he can't make some magic and win a game, we will draft Lawrence. I would trade anyone on this team for picks at the deadline...Anyone.
I agree with Gates. I was very intrigued with him being moved to center. I wasnt doubtful in his ability to play the position, my question on him was calling out the protections and being able to do that with the consistency that would be needed.
Thomas is going to be fine, you cant expect a rookie playing LT with no real NFL Experience to play at a high level. He is basically in a normal season on his 2nd game in the NFL. His preseason was not normal, he had no roookie camp, no real meetings for a learning standpoint and no pre season games. How much can you expect from him. He is still better than Flowers ever was, and on top of that he doesn't make the same mistakes week in and week out. You mentiooned him being slow, and I agree, but I dont think that is because he is slow, it is because he isnt playing instintual football and is thinking about what to do and then does it. As he gains experience he will just react and not have to think. That is NORMAL for any player in this league.
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With only 6 picks in 2021, that is simply not enough.
quantity is not quality.
Top 3 round picks are basically the only ones with value, reliable value.
That's not to say you won't ever hit one a 4th round pick or later, but the odds are not in your favor and it's not something to rely on.
so if the Giants had 12 7th round picks, why would you feel any better than the 6 they have if the new 6 are 5th, 6th, and 7th round picks.
The p of any player selected beyond even the 2nd round becoming a long-term starter is pretty remote. But that doesn't mean you should acquire fewer of them; in fact, the data supports the exact opposite: You should acquire more of them if the value of the acquisition cost is fair. No one is asking DG (or the next GM) to bat 1.000 on the mid/late draft picks, but instead, to acknowledge that he cannot possibly get them all right, and thus would be best served to give himself more bites at the apple.
Ordinarily, there is an embarrassment of riches effect that takes over - if you have a decent or better roster, you might only have 8-10 roster spots available for rookies. Anything more than that is wasteful and ends up on the waiver wire anyway (by theory). But on this team? They could draft 15 guys, have them all unseat/displace incumbents, and be no worse off than they are now, and have upside attached.
DG's trades for Williams and Yiadom in the midst of a rebuild are exactly counter to that concept. And here we are. So there's that.
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already. So a guy supposedly specializing in resource allocation decided the LW trade was a good idea. Just something else to toss into any Abrams optimism.
Spare me the relentless Joe Judge optimism too. There are things to like for sure but everyone got a chance to see Andrew Thomas and the other tackles on film and as of now (again jury is out on this too) it looks like we made changes but not enough to cover up our serious flaws.
Judge could be the start of something good but even the idea that he knows how to build an organization around him is a huge leap at this point. Would I trust him more than anyone else in the building? Certainly. But that isn’t saying much
WIll you please post a link where it says Abrahms is in charge of trades already? I have not seen written nor do I know of anyone that has stated this. So where is this coming from? Or is this just some made up wishful thinking because no where in the Press or from anyone affiliated with the NY Giants FO has anything come out on this huge decision.
Will you please post a link where there's an H in Kevin Abrams' name?
If you're gonna defend the guy, at least learn his fucking name.
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In comment 15007868 NoGainDayne said:
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already. So a guy supposedly specializing in resource allocation decided the LW trade was a good idea. Just something else to toss into any Abrams optimism.
Spare me the relentless Joe Judge optimism too. There are things to like for sure but everyone got a chance to see Andrew Thomas and the other tackles on film and as of now (again jury is out on this too) it looks like we made changes but not enough to cover up our serious flaws.
Judge could be the start of something good but even the idea that he knows how to build an organization around him is a huge leap at this point. Would I trust him more than anyone else in the building? Certainly. But that isn’t saying much
WIll you please post a link where it says Abrahms is in charge of trades already? I have not seen written nor do I know of anyone that has stated this. So where is this coming from? Or is this just some made up wishful thinking because no where in the Press or from anyone affiliated with the NY Giants FO has anything come out on this huge decision.
Will you please post a link where there's an H in Kevin Abrams' name?
If you're gonna defend the guy, at least learn his fucking name.
Ok you answered my question, with a snide remark but you answered it, Your making it up, and ABRAMS (There Happy Now) Is not in fact in charge of the Trades. Thank You for at least semi admitting you made it up WOW Unbelieveable!!!!!!!!!
This entire season is about Change and improvement not wins and losses. So I highly doubt Gettleman is a "LAME DUCK". He may retire but he is not getting fired
How can anyone honestly keep him employed after his tenure thus far?That’s a hard sell to the fan base.
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Where are you getting Gettleman is a lame duck? He isnt as far as I or anyone knows. Judge has said time and time again since day 1 of being hired that he is not looking at wins and losses. He is looking for Improvement, wins and losse mean nothing this season. He is implementing a LONG TERM SUCCESS PLAN not a quick fix. He has stated this is not going to be an Overnight fix. He is changeing everything from the way the FO is run to the way the players put the uniforms on. (Not those exact words) but everything is getting changed. That takes time and he is not on anyones timeline but his own. Mara And Tisch know this Gettleman knows this and if people would just listen to Judge and not just hear him they would know this.
This entire season is about Change and improvement not wins and losses. So I highly doubt Gettleman is a "LAME DUCK". He may retire but he is not getting fired
How can anyone honestly keep him employed after his tenure thus far?That’s a hard sell to the fan base.
His drafts are 1000 times better than REESE ever were. His hands were tied in FA because Reese overpaid every FA he signed. He has fixed alot of problems with contracts and The Cap. This year he had some money and didnt spend foolishly and we got some quality FA's. Everyone want to blame him foe Solder, but let me ask you this Did we need a LT? and Wha else in Free Agency at the time was available for the LT position? We overpaid Solder but when you are desperate for a LT you have to pay what the market says or go into the season without a LT. That was his choice. You can blame that one on Reese. Gettleman had NO CHOICE because no one else was available at the time. He has made mistakes, but name 1 GM that hasnt. Letting Collins walk was a good thing Collins couldnt cover anyone, Beckham was a Frigging LOUD MOUTHED Attention Whore that only cared about his stats, which SUCK since his injury. Jenkins mouth got him released and yae Im probably 1 of a few people that agreed with him on them. His mistakes like any other GM were because he is trying to fix this DEBACLE of a roster but his wins well outweigh his mistakes. Look if he was as bad as people make him out to be he would have been fired a while a go. He may retire but he isnt getting fired
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In comment 15007877 couchcoach100 said:
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In comment 15007868 NoGainDayne said:
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already. So a guy supposedly specializing in resource allocation decided the LW trade was a good idea. Just something else to toss into any Abrams optimism.
Spare me the relentless Joe Judge optimism too. There are things to like for sure but everyone got a chance to see Andrew Thomas and the other tackles on film and as of now (again jury is out on this too) it looks like we made changes but not enough to cover up our serious flaws.
Judge could be the start of something good but even the idea that he knows how to build an organization around him is a huge leap at this point. Would I trust him more than anyone else in the building? Certainly. But that isn’t saying much
WIll you please post a link where it says Abrahms is in charge of trades already? I have not seen written nor do I know of anyone that has stated this. So where is this coming from? Or is this just some made up wishful thinking because no where in the Press or from anyone affiliated with the NY Giants FO has anything come out on this huge decision.
Will you please post a link where there's an H in Kevin Abrams' name?
If you're gonna defend the guy, at least learn his fucking name.
Ok you answered my question, with a snide remark but you answered it, Your making it up, and ABRAMS (There Happy Now) Is not in fact in charge of the Trades. Thank You for at least semi admitting you made it up WOW Unbelieveable!!!!!!!!!
Ok, first of all, I didn't admit anything.
Second of all, I'm not the one who you were asking to admit anything.
Third of all, no one has admitted what you were asking them to admit.
Fourth of all, it's "you're"
The Giants don't have anything anyone wants, (JFC we can't beat teams fielding their second and third stringers-who do you think is lining up for our players?) and Jawn, who must approve all player moves, isn't going to let Gettleman do anything in light of the opera bouffe trending on the field.