Jason garrett —when is it too soon to jettison

for Pete's sake, look at the fucking roster.

Is it too soon to fire him? Too soon to change the approach? Serious question.

To me it looks like they are gradually adding to the playbook as he and the O improve.

fan said the same thing and I fear you are correct. It’s been 10 years since he called plays and I think he is the real reason for DJs regression. It’s sad to think he could be looking at 3 OCs and systems in 3 years.

every play. It ain’t helping with this roster.

I am so frustrated by Garret’s play calling
There are virtually no chunk plays, no passes into the end zone , and the play calls are so predictable

On first down with two TE sets the Giants Run 90% of the time
If Garrett’s offense is based upon play action it would be good to try a pass on first down

The offense needs to take more advantage of Jone’s athleticism
They have RPO plays but most of the time Jone’s hands off

I don’t believe that the Giant’s offense is made to go 14 plays they need some long passes

Garrett plays as if he does not want to lose
He is not playing to win

In comment 15013223 Eric from BBI said:

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for Pete's sake, look at the fucking roster.

Our skill talent is worst in the league right now. Pair that with an awful offensive line, but yeah Garrett is the issue.

Today was really apparent about DJ too. He's pretty much doing everything he can out there, but unless he's perfect this offense isn't goin to score too many points.

In comment 15013223 Eric from BBI said:

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for Pete's sake, look at the fucking roster.

Come on Eric. Just because they have the worst offensive roster in the league doesn’t mean we shouldn’t be able to scapegoat anyone we want. You must be new to BBI.

In comment 15013223 Eric from BBI said:

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for Pete's sake, look at the fucking roster.

The structure of the offense is completely wrong for what Jones does well. One of the biggest pluses for him coming out was work ethic and preparation. One of his biggest weaknesses was him being slow at working through his progression during the play. So far Garret's offense has given Jones very little presnap control which negates his ability to use preparation. Instead he focuses primarily on set plays with few to no audibles which places all the pressure on Jones to make through his reads to find the open man. This was a very poor coaching decision on my part and if Garret doesn't adjust away from it Jones is going to continue to fail. So it isn't unreasonable to suggest that he be replaced if this is all he is going to bring to the table receiving corp be damned.

works all the time.

Garrett is not a good fit for DJ. I think he is causing more harm than good for him. I personally wanted Matt Canada who is now an offensive coach for the Steelers.

I wanted a head coach is will be a good CEO, and two innovative coordinators. I like Patrick Graham, I think he just lacks the talent he truly but he has done well with what he has.

Garrett however is not using the tools has. We can say the players sucks but there are better ideas out on how to use what you have too it's strengths.

It's like jecyl and hyde. I think Judge was forced to hire some coaches with head coaching experience but Garrett is a fail. Defense looks innovative and takes chances. Offense plays way too safe. DJ is way more mobile than we use him. Where is the no huddle and set up some bootlegs and tell DJ if the read is not there, take off. If you did the eventually the defense would have to respect DJ legs and then he would have more time to read the field.

Does DJ need to improve, Yes big time. But I think the regression we are seeing is more on Garrett for being too safe on early downs that he puts more pressure on DJ to convert 3rd downs.

I understand Garret is trying to get DJ in more manageable 3rd downs but I think he should be aiming at having less 3rd downs. Be more aggressive on First down, speed up the game, and see how DJ does.

We are already losing games or barely winning them. We need to play to DJ strengths, if he doesn't cut it then you know we need to grab another one.

But even though DJ makes mistakes, he also makes some great throws. He also makes plays with his legs. I am trying to keep a level head when watching DJ, and some on here are only looking at every bad play under a microscope. There are a lot of good plays he has out there too. I'm not a DJ fan boy but I would prefer to push DJ this year and have an answer.

What "tools" does Garrett have? I'd love to hear this.

How do you know any of that? That just sounds like you are talking out of your ass.

Some people want to bash everything

In comment 15013261 Eric from BBI said:

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How do you know any of that? That just sounds like you are talking out of your ass.

Well maybe we are very good at hiding it? When is the last time Jones has checked out of a play? run to pass or pass to run? How many presnap adjustments is he making with the receivers? If its happening I am not seeing it. I see it a lot in other games. I remember seeing it with Eli.

Their best offensive player is Devonta Freeman, who they just picked up off the scrap heap.

I thought he called a pretty good game today

In comment 15013236 Archer said:

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I am so frustrated by Garret’s play calling There are virtually no chunk plays, no passes into the end zone , and the play calls are so predictable On first down with two TE sets the Giants Run 90% of the time If Garrett’s offense is based upon play action it would be good to try a pass on first down The offense needs to take more advantage of Jone’s athleticism They have RPO plays but most of the time Jone’s hands off I don’t believe that the Giant’s offense is made to go 14 plays they need some long passes Garrett plays as if he does not want to lose He is not playing to win

Who gets open dipshit? Answer: NOBODY. Other than Slayton who is now doubled on virtually every play.

Do you realize that the Giants had TWO dressed WRs available for much of the game?

Wtf is he supposed to do?

God posters like you suck.

In comment 15013252 LBH15 said:

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works all the time.

Is anyone on the giants looking to get engaged to a cheerleader?

In comment 15013223 Eric from BBI said:

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for Pete's sake, look at the fucking roster.

The roster sucked last season too. The only way Jones gets to 24 passing TDs this year is with a mid season trade back to Duke. The running game is embarrassing right now. The change in coaching hasn’t elevated the offensive line at all. And now Evan Engram is a non-factor.

OLine has yet to prove they can run block and you want them to be more adventurous?

the last two weeks. Last week, we finally put some points up and this week we sustained drives. Not a single 3 and out. We were on the doorstep of putting the game away when Jones laid the ball out there for a DB instead of throwing it away. If he was trying to throw it away, it was a feeble attempt. Either way, it was a bad decision/execution by Jones. If he tucks it away or throws it out of bounds, the Giants at least get a FG and go up 10. That would have basically wrapped things up.

Board and Slayton were out of the game, I'd challenge 90% of the fanbase to call out who the #2 and #3 WR's were at that point.

In comment 15013223 Eric from BBI said:

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for Pete's sake, look at the fucking roster.

Look at the roster last year, how can you write that knowing how much more we got last year from similarly talentless roster?

I do not understand the Garrett hate.

We're clearly trying to get creative on offense to overcome our talent liabilities. Even putting DJ at risk on designed runs. Andrew Thomas caught a touchdown last week. We're seeing jet sweeps, double reverses. This is the stuff you do when you don't have the talent to succeed running a more conventional offensive gameplan.

In comment 15013326 FatMan in Charlotte said:

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Board and Slayton were out of the game, I'd challenge 90% of the fanbase to call out who the #2 and #3 WR's were at that point.

Ok, I agree with that to a certain extent. But, let me ask you this? Name a person on the Eagles offensive line besides Jason Kelce who played today? Name a WR that they had, too. From my understanding of the game (albeit reported and not seen) is that they were miserable in the first half and the coaches saw stuff and schemed it in the second half. How often have we seen that from the Eagles in our own games. The last two years they were dead in the first half only to catch up I the second half. Coaches and coaching matter and despite the admitted dearth of talent, we don't really seem to improve offensively in games (except for the Bears game but we had nowhere in that one to go but up).

I'm with those who think Garrett is calling things right, at this stage. It's becoming clear what DJ is, and I think that's a game manager. It'll work against lesser teams. But it won't against the better teams out there. We'll fall behind quickly, and DJ makes more mistakes trying to air it out. That's just how it is. But if you control the game, and the clock, with early runs, and conservative play calling, you can shorten the game... and win. When DJ tries to play hero-ball, that's when mistakes happen. So I think Garrett is right to rein him in, and make him a game manager, at this stage. I fear that's all he'll ever be, unfortunately.

In comment 15013347 Spider43 said:

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I'm with those who think Garrett is calling things right, at this stage. It's becoming clear what DJ is, and I think that's a game manager. It'll work against lesser teams. But it won't against the better teams out there. We'll fall behind quickly, and DJ makes more mistakes trying to air it out. That's just how it is. But if you control the game, and the clock, with early runs, and conservative play calling, you can shorten the game... and win. When DJ tries to play hero-ball, that's when mistakes happen. So I think Garrett is right to rein him in, and make him a game manager, at this stage. I fear that's all he'll ever be, unfortunately.

Daniel Jones isn't a game manager. If he had weapons around him, he would be airing out, just like he did last year.

In comment 15013335 BestFeature said:

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In comment 15013223 Eric from BBI said: Quote: for Pete's sake, look at the fucking roster. Look at the roster last year, how can you write that knowing how much more we got last year from similarly talentless roster?

I simply can't believe how stupid some of these comments are. Saquon Barkley?

In comment 15013347 Spider43 said:

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I'm with those who think Garrett is calling things right, at this stage. It's becoming clear what DJ is, and I think that's a game manager. It'll work against lesser teams. But it won't against the better teams out there. We'll fall behind quickly, and DJ makes more mistakes trying to air it out. That's just how it is. But if you control the game, and the clock, with early runs, and conservative play calling, you can shorten the game... and win. When DJ tries to play hero-ball, that's when mistakes happen. So I think Garrett is right to rein him in, and make him a game manager, at this stage. I fear that's all he'll ever be, unfortunately.

I’m sorry but that’s making excuses for Garrett. Jones mistakes last season were fumbles. He still would throw TDs even in his worst performances and bunches of them in his good games. Now there are no good games. Maybe he still needs more time in the offense, but Garrett isn’t helping him in any way, shape, or form.

In comment 15013292 shockeyisthebest8056 said:

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In comment 15013223 Eric from BBI said: Quote: for Pete's sake, look at the fucking roster. The roster sucked last season too. The only way Jones gets to 24 passing TDs this year is with a mid season trade back to Duke. The running game is embarrassing right now. The change in coaching hasn’t elevated the offensive line at all. And now Evan Engram is a non-factor.

Saquon Barkley.

Man, the IQ level of the average Giants fan has hit an all-time low.

In comment 15013257 Eric from BBI said:

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What "tools" does Garrett have? I'd love to hear this.

Good Coordinators design for the players they have. For instance is it possible that Evan Engram runs a seam and you bomb the ball down the field? You could playaction to the left side and you roll out DJ to the right and Slayton runs a slant to the same side of the field, if the play is there you throw, if not DJ tucks and runs it. You could run more no huddle give the defense less time to change players. I'm talking about scheme and timing regardless of talent. Your job is to scheme your players open. If you think no one could call a game better than Jason Garret with these players I disagree. The 2020 Giants are not the first crappy team I have watched play NFL football but I have seen other bad NFL teams produce better results with their bad players. DJ is our leading rusher, start using it to your advantage.

at times like this:

Jones with Barkley:
9 Games
21 TD's
8 INT's
265 yds.gm
3 games of passer rating above 120

Without Barkley:
8 Games
5 TD's
9 INT's
217 yds/gm
0 games of 120+ passer raying

Blah, blah, blah... you're spewing stuff out of your ass at this point. They are using Jones on the run. It's why he had 74 yards today and is this team's leading rusher.

We have a rebuilding OL, the worst group of wideouts in the league (down to 2 receivers at one point in this game until Slayton came back), the worst group of RBs in the league, and arguably the worst group of TEs.

But hey, the coaching is the problem! If we only had a good coach, we'd be scoring 30 points a game!

Right.

To not following the Cowboys but wasn’t Garrett the one who made Romo look like Montana for two or three years?

I honestly don’t know., so I’m asking for some input. Isn’t his “thing” that he’s a quarterback guru?

And we never take any shots. Everything is designed to get the yards you need for a first down and nothing more. No big plays or even any real tries to get them

In comment 15013368 Bleedblue10 said:

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And we never take any shots. Everything is designed to get the yards you need for a first down and nothing more. No big plays or even any real tries to get them

The Giants threw a 27-yard touchdown pass on 3rd-and-9.

is the right strategy

Are you kidding me? We have one wr - a Rb off the trash heap and an oline
That is poor at protecting and run blocking

But it is the coordinator? I can’t .... chunk plays with whom? With what time? Our offensive roster is horrendous

Are you kidding me? We have one wr - a Rb off the trash heap and an oline
That is poor at protecting and run blocking

But it is the coordinator? I can’t .... chunk plays with whom? With what time? Our offensive roster is horrendous

And 3 new pieces on an OL that is starting to come together....

Great thread...can I please subscribe to your newsletter?

In comment 15013359 Eric from BBI said:

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In comment 15013292 shockeyisthebest8056 said: Quote: In comment 15013223 Eric from BBI said: Quote: for Pete's sake, look at the fucking roster. The roster sucked last season too. The only way Jones gets to 24 passing TDs this year is with a mid season trade back to Duke. The running game is embarrassing right now. The change in coaching hasn’t elevated the offensive line at all. And now Evan Engram is a non-factor. Saquon Barkley. Man, the IQ level of the average Giants fan has hit an all-time low.

Saquon Barkley ran for SIX yards on 15 carries in the opener. Exactly where has Jason Garrett improved the offense? Name literally one thing. I’m not making it up that the QB is worse than last season. We all see it. Christian McCaffrey gets hurt and Carolina still can run the ball. And none of this has anything to do with Evan Engram’s disappearance. It’s early, but who could post be enthusiastic or even optimistic about the job Garrett has done?

opinion in this case because I don't think Garrett has been the issue and he's been conservative more-so due to having a young, inexperienced team that lacks talent with their top skill players out with injury. And Jones regression is on Jones making poor decisions as well as the lack of talent helping him out.

here:

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Saquon Barkley ran for SIX yards on 15 carries in the opener. Exactly where has Jason Garrett improved the offense? Name literally one thing. I’m not making it up that the QB is worse than last season. We all see it. Christian McCaffrey gets hurt and Carolina still can run the ball. And none of this has anything to do with Evan Engram’s disappearance. It’s early, but who could post be enthusiastic or even optimistic about the job Garrett has done?

With Pitt selling out to stop the run, Jones was able to connect with Slayton on the longest play of the season. With Barkley out, teams have sat back in a 2 Deep Zone and I have seen a ton of posts complaining ab out not getting deep plays. The very thing the Cover 2 is in place to stop.

I'm not sure what magical formula people are looking for with the offense. Look at Jones splits with Saquon and without him

On second and short, we run up the middle against Washington's strength instead of rolling DJ out to look for an option for chunk play, of it's not there why can't DJ run 2 yards to the outside for a first down.

Eric I'm talking about NOT waiting for 3rd down to take your chances.

This team is not good and there is enough blame to go around. I'm not disagreeing the roster sucks. I'm saying at Garrett is not helping DJ. I do not think his gamr plans uses DJs strengths. I don't know you sit on DJ fence. I personally feel DJ has converted 3rd downs and saving Garret's shitty play calling.
I'm saying Garret's second down calls should look more like his third down calls and give DJ two shots instead of one because Garret calls a weak as running play on second down because he wants 3rd and 7 instead of possibly being second and 10. Which I understand why he is doing, I just don't agree with the strategy of playing that safe.
If DJ can convert 3rd and 7 as much as he has, I think with a little more risk DJ could create more rewarding plays on second down.

In comment 15013392 shockeyisthebest8056 said:

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In comment 15013359 Eric from BBI said: Quote: In comment 15013292 shockeyisthebest8056 said: Quote: In comment 15013223 Eric from BBI said: Quote: for Pete's sake, look at the fucking roster. The roster sucked last season too. The only way Jones gets to 24 passing TDs this year is with a mid season trade back to Duke. The running game is embarrassing right now. The change in coaching hasn’t elevated the offensive line at all. And now Evan Engram is a non-factor. Saquon Barkley. Man, the IQ level of the average Giants fan has hit an all-time low. Saquon Barkley ran for SIX yards on 15 carries in the opener. Exactly where has Jason Garrett improved the offense? Name literally one thing. I’m not making it up that the QB is worse than last season. We all see it. Christian McCaffrey gets hurt and Carolina still can run the ball. And none of this has anything to do with Evan Engram’s disappearance. It’s early, but who could post be enthusiastic or even optimistic about the job Garrett has done?

Its obvious you didnt watch the run blocking the first 2 games. Its okay, just stop posting shit without putting forth a frame of reference.

3/5 new starters on the OL, one of which is a rookie and another has never plaued his position before....no offseason...but dont let that stop you from rushing to judgement.

In comment 15013425 SteelGiant said:

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On second and short, we run up the middle against Washington's strength instead of rolling DJ out to look for an option for chunk play, of it's not there why can't DJ run 2 yards to the outside for a first down. Eric I'm talking about NOT waiting for 3rd down to take your chances. This team is not good and there is enough blame to go around. I'm not disagreeing the roster sucks. I'm saying at Garrett is not helping DJ. I do not think his gamr plans uses DJs strengths. I don't know you sit on DJ fence. I personally feel DJ has converted 3rd downs and saving Garret's shitty play calling. I'm saying Garret's second down calls should look more like his third down calls and give DJ two shots instead of one because Garret calls a weak as running play on second down because he wants 3rd and 7 instead of possibly being second and 10. Which I understand why he is doing, I just don't agree with the strategy of playing that safe. If DJ can convert 3rd and 7 as much as he has, I think with a little more risk DJ could create more rewarding plays on second down.

Conversely, there were short yardage plays where he tried to drive short yardage and got stuffed by a line that has 4 1st rounders on it. He called plays that got Jones outside including a 49 yard run by the QB. Fact is, the other team sees no outside threats on this team. We had a hobbled Slayton and Engram who cant get open except underneath.

Just infuriating to read posts like yours.

In comment 15013419 FatMan in Charlotte said:

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here: Quote: Saquon Barkley ran for SIX yards on 15 carries in the opener. Exactly where has Jason Garrett improved the offense? Name literally one thing. I’m not making it up that the QB is worse than last season. We all see it. Christian McCaffrey gets hurt and Carolina still can run the ball. And none of this has anything to do with Evan Engram’s disappearance. It’s early, but who could post be enthusiastic or even optimistic about the job Garrett has done? With Pitt selling out to stop the run, Jones was able to connect with Slayton on the longest play of the season. With Barkley out, teams have sat back in a 2 Deep Zone and I have seen a ton of posts complaining ab out not getting deep plays. The very thing the Cover 2 is in place to stop. I'm not sure what magical formula people are looking for with the offense. Look at Jones splits with Saquon and without him

In defense of Jones, I’ve often made the point about how it would be nice to run the ball down someone’s throat and win the game that way. If the safeties are playing back now, then where’s the running game outside of Jones? Freeman wasn’t that good today. They didn’t run the ball all that well last week against an embarrassingly bad run D. I’m not asking for The Greatest Show on Turf. Just tell me one area where the offense hasn’t gone backwards?

In comment 15013257 Eric from BBI said:

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What "tools" does Garrett have? I'd love to hear this.

Eric, your one-liner responses are priceless.

a pretty good job running the ball in the opening drive of the 3rd. 15 plays, which unfortunately ended with the INT. Couple that with a 19 play drive against Pitt, and we've had times where we are moving.

We can't really compare last year to this year though. How many times were people bitching about yards in "garbage time", but now, we are trying to compare production is close games to that?

We haven't had Barkley, Shepard, Tate and Engram on the field together for more than a quarter. Ever. And Barkley is out, Shepard is out and we have Tate and Slayton as the only WR's with any competency.

What is a OC supposed to do to overcome this? Again - I've seen a number of complaints about not throwing the ball deep. And those that point that out is a sure sign of not understanding defensive schemes.

You do understand that when Saquon Barkley is on the field, it AFFECTS EVERYTHING. The things the Giants can and can't do, the way the defense defends everyone else.

He is THE only player on the offensive side of the football that scare anyone... and he frightens the shit out of them.

When you take him away, it's like taking Michael Jordan off the Bulls.