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I'm disappointed in Judge today

Keyser : 10/23/2020 2:20 am
This is a bad team and bad teams find a way to lose. I don't blame Judge for Engram dropping the ball at the end or letting the ball bounce off his hands for the first interception. I don't blame Judge for Dion Lewis fumbling. I don't blame Judge for Scott making a great catch for the game winning TD over good coverage.

However, he has to take some responsibility for the undisciplined play at the end of the game. The corner getting beat on the 56 yard pass play to set up the first score at the end. If he lost on a jump ball, fine, but he can't get beat like that. The penalties, many of which were undisciplined, which helped the Eagles move the ball down the field. The unsportsman like conduct before the 2 point conversion fail. Also not having Ballentine prepared to catch a fake punt when he wasn't covered earlier in the game.

I like Judge and I think he will be a good coach, but he had a hand in this loss as well. Disciplined football is the coaches responsibility.
I think the good thing about Judge  
santacruzom : 10/23/2020 2:25 am : link
Is that he will learn and evolve from this, and eventually the team as a whole will too.
Judge coached his ass off  
Go Terps : 10/23/2020 2:30 am : link
This game could have been 24-7 at halftime. He was at a degree talent disadvantage tonight, and frankly coached Pederson off the fucking field.
Yeah, I think Pederson  
bceagle05 : 10/23/2020 2:33 am : link
walked off the field tonight realizing this won’t be the same ol’ Giants going forward. Brutal loss though.
this is surprisingly the least penalized giants team  
Platos : 10/23/2020 2:33 am : link
i've seen in years.

6 in 5 minutes was freakin sad considering we had 3 for 15 yards leading up to that point.

i don't think judge is the issue there.
RE: Judge coached his ass off  
.McL. : 10/23/2020 2:34 am : link
In comment 15021098 Go Terps said:
Quote:
This game could have been 24-7 at halftime. He was at a degree talent disadvantage tonight, and frankly coached Pederson off the fucking field.

agreed, I thought this was heading towards a blowout.
The defense for most of the second half was lights out. That was a hell of a halftime adjustment.
I think the real problem at the end was that the defense had been on the field too much. Tired players make mistakes.
RE: Judge coached his ass off  
Essex : 10/23/2020 2:38 am : link
In comment 15021098 Go Terps said:
Quote:
This game could have been 24-7 at halftime. He was at a degree talent disadvantage tonight, and frankly coached Pederson off the fucking field.


I don’t know if that’s true at all. It wasn’t to Judge’s credit Wentz threw up that INT or missed the fg. It was Judge’s team that fumbled it up. It was the Eagles who came out and knew exactly what they wanted to do against us. I I thought our team looked better after halftime and Judge gets that credit, but let’s be honest here there was a ton of mistakes by our team, especially on defense coming out in a soft zone and then not having a hip over the top on Hightower’s catch, a guy Wentz like to throw deep to (also on special teams actually not faking it with the gunner not covered, a 15 yard penalty, poor execution on tackling on the short kick, fair catches called when we should have run it back). This is not to say Judge is a bad coach or anything, but tonight was not his finest hour and he probably would admit that himself if you asked him in private
RE: I think the good thing about Judge  
short lease : 10/23/2020 3:52 am : link
In comment 15021097 santacruzom said:
Quote:
Is that he will learn and evolve from this, and eventually the team as a whole will too.


+1

This is a young head coach in charge of a young team. They will grow together and be successful if ownership gives them the time. I love everything I have seen so far ... because I know (from what I have seen) it will get better.

The record does not indicate it but, these guys want it.
RE: RE: Judge coached his ass off  
Go Terps : 10/23/2020 4:51 am : link
In comment 15021103 Essex said:
Quote:
In comment 15021098 Go Terps said:


Quote:


This game could have been 24-7 at halftime. He was at a degree talent disadvantage tonight, and frankly coached Pederson off the fucking field.



I don’t know if that’s true at all. It wasn’t to Judge’s credit Wentz threw up that INT or missed the fg. It was Judge’s team that fumbled it up. It was the Eagles who came out and knew exactly what they wanted to do against us. I I thought our team looked better after halftime and Judge gets that credit, but let’s be honest here there was a ton of mistakes by our team, especially on defense coming out in a soft zone and then not having a hip over the top on Hightower’s catch, a guy Wentz like to throw deep to (also on special teams actually not faking it with the gunner not covered, a 15 yard penalty, poor execution on tackling on the short kick, fair catches called when we should have run it back). This is not to say Judge is a bad coach or anything, but tonight was not his finest hour and he probably would admit that himself if you asked him in private


I'm about to hit the hay so I won't go into it, but I think you're completely wrong. I think this was the best game the Giants have played since 2016. If you can't see the signs I can't explain them to you.
Time for Patrick Graham to catch some heart  
Giant4Life : 10/23/2020 5:37 am : link
His defense plays their poorest in the final minutes of the game when you need them to play their best. I would sack him and Gettleman today, move Thomas to RT or the bench, and trade EE for a 7th rounder and move on.
Heat, sorry it's early  
Giant4Life : 10/23/2020 5:38 am : link
Bad night.
RE: RE: RE: Judge coached his ass off  
Essex : 10/23/2020 6:13 am : link
In comment 15021120 Go Terps said:
Quote:
In comment 15021103 Essex said:


Quote:


In comment 15021098 Go Terps said:


Quote:


This game could have been 24-7 at halftime. He was at a degree talent disadvantage tonight, and frankly coached Pederson off the fucking field.



I don’t know if that’s true at all. It wasn’t to Judge’s credit Wentz threw up that INT or missed the fg. It was Judge’s team that fumbled it up. It was the Eagles who came out and knew exactly what they wanted to do against us. I I thought our team looked better after halftime and Judge gets that credit, but let’s be honest here there was a ton of mistakes by our team, especially on defense coming out in a soft zone and then not having a hip over the top on Hightower’s catch, a guy Wentz like to throw deep to (also on special teams actually not faking it with the gunner not covered, a 15 yard penalty, poor execution on tackling on the short kick, fair catches called when we should have run it back). This is not to say Judge is a bad coach or anything, but tonight was not his finest hour and he probably would admit that himself if you asked him in private



I'm about to hit the hay so I won't go into it, but I think you're completely wrong. I think this was the best game the Giants have played since 2016. If you can't see the signs I can't explain them to you.


I would love to see these signs. What? This year we managed to lose in more heartbreaking fashion than the last two years there? We got totally bossed around in the first half, was lucky to be in the game to be honest. We had two nice drives in the second half and then we choked an 11 point lead in the last 6:17 of the game. Forgive me for not seeing the signs, plus we made a million mistakes. I thought Jones played much better tonight so I think that was a sign, but I am not taking my hat off to the coach for collapsing again in Philly, nor do I view that as a positive sign. Please
Thomas  
OX100 : 10/23/2020 6:30 am : link
Didn't watch second half. Was Thomas as bad the rest of the game? I think that was the worst coaching mistake, leaving Thomas in after his first Whiff.
Of course he’s learning  
RetroJint : 10/23/2020 6:52 am : link
and he was schooled by a staff that has won a Super Bowl and had another season of 13 victories . I think he’s going to be an excellent coach . But as to last night , come on , the Eagles didn’t have Ertz or Sanders and 3 guys on the offensive line came from the docks and warehouses.

Engram catches the ball and Judge probably draws rave reviews . That’s how much a play means in these games . But Judge was part of the problem last night more then he was a solution . I thought the second time out happened 20 seconds too late . As it turned out , they could have used those .

Jimmy Johnson went 1-15 his first year with the Cowboys . Parcells was 3-12-1. Coughlin list 9 genes in a row his first year with the Giants . Stay with the coach . Sack the GM at 0800 this morning .
Average players play poorly..  
morrison40 : 10/23/2020 7:00 am : link
Too many of those on this team.
What I honestly don't get...  
islander1 : 10/23/2020 7:01 am : link
is why he burned his timeouts on Philly's last drive.

If you really don't trust your defense, then I mean that's pretty damning. Just let them score on the first down and goal.

Jones had no chance with 40 seconds and zero timeouts.
It would impossible for me not to go full ballistic if I was Judge  
SteelGiant : 10/23/2020 7:02 am : link
Time to punish the bad, reward the good, and find new blood. This team needs to play better by the end of the year. Time to cut players who cant cut it and pillage every team's practice squads to find ounces of hope for the future.

Where to begin....
Evan Engram - INACTIVE - dont care if they trade him, I really think he can play better but he is killing us right now. Take his jersey away for week and tell him he needs to earn it back. Tell him to stretch out his alligator arms and find some toughness because this is the NFL, until I see some killer instinct in practice, you are benched. He needs to made a example - he is a high profile player to prove to other this years performance is unacceptable - THIS IS WEEK 7

Madre Harper and Ryan Lewis - I would possibly cut both of them - Stupid Penalties and Cant cover - anyone off the street can do both of those things.

Peart to LT, Thomas to RT, Lemieux in for Zietler, and tell Hernandez you have the rest of the season to get better or Thomas is moving to Guard and we are drafting another tackle next year. Yeah Thomas you heard me - you might be playing guard next year.

We suck with you, We can suck without you.

Fire Gettlemen because we need draft picks and its time to sell and I do not want him handling this process. Also go pillage the other teams practice squads until you find hope.

Try to trade any of these players Peppers/Zeitler/Engram/Decide which DT you like and trade the other - this out only position of value and we need cash something in. I would trade almost anyone who is not in the long term plans.

Go get me Maurice FFrench from KC practice squad to give me a chance at a WR who can get separation and would be better kickoff returner than I have right now. That is mine but I am sure there are also defensive backs that have a better chance to better players for us next year. This year is over, we tried and we are simply not good enough. I dont need to waste more time on has been and players that have proved they are never will bees

This all might sound knee jerk but I think 7 weeks is enough time to know. On top of the years before.




RE: Time for Patrick Graham to catch some heart  
Giantimistic : 10/23/2020 7:08 am : link
In comment 15021125 Giant4Life said:
Quote:
His defense plays their poorest in the final minutes of the game when you need them to play their best. I would sack him and Gettleman today, move Thomas to RT or the bench, and trade EE for a 7th rounder and move on.


Graham has actually done a really good job with the players he has. On the broadcast they even said he is not playing the man style that he likes because he doesn’t have his players. He is playing the best system he can with the players we have. He actually calls blitz’s that get home. If he had not adjusted to the players he have, our defense would be getting killed.
RE: Judge coached his ass off  
mfsd : 10/23/2020 7:20 am : link
In comment 15021098 Go Terps said:
Quote:
This game could have been 24-7 at halftime. He was at a degree talent disadvantage tonight, and frankly coached Pederson off the fucking field.


100% agree.

Judge can do everything right...so can Garrett, for that matter...but they can’t go out there and catch an easy ball for Engram

Yes Giants were less disciplined tonight, but overall they’ve been much better coached than recent past. Just don’t have the talent to finish a game like last night yet
Great posts ... I’m all in on JJ too.  
Spider56 : 10/23/2020 7:45 am : link
JJ was all over playing smart football and team discipline in ‘training camp’ but the bonehead plays came from 2 guys they just picked up ... Lewis and Harper.

The frustrating mistakes were from Ballantine, on the missed oppty for a fake punt, then later with the personal foul on Jackson.
Judge is a keeper  
Lines of Scrimmage : 10/23/2020 7:49 am : link
In the pregame Steve Smith mentioned talking to Giants players and how they really love their coach. Is is very honest with them (the good and bad) and they like that. They say his football knowledge is incredible.

He has not had his chance to really put his stamp on the team. With another offseason I expect a big jump. I think his biggest decision will be regarding Jones. We are in good hands.
RE: RE: Judge coached his ass off  
Essex : 10/23/2020 7:54 am : link
In comment 15021178 mfsd said:
Quote:
In comment 15021098 Go Terps said:


Quote:


This game could have been 24-7 at halftime. He was at a degree talent disadvantage tonight, and frankly coached Pederson off the fucking field.



100% agree.

Judge can do everything right...so can Garrett, for that matter...but they can’t go out there and catch an easy ball for Engram

Yes Giants were less disciplined tonight, but overall they’ve been much better coached than recent past. Just don’t have the talent to finish a game like last night yet


This thread is comical. I get the fact that people are grasping at straws to see the positive and there was some positives. Jones looked much better, Gallman and the run game was much better especially in the second half. But this was a team that came back on us basically 2 opening day starters playing—Wentz and Kelce. Johnson was out by the time of the two drive, etc.

As to coaching
1. The old saying bad things happens happen to teams that do stupid things.
a. The fumble right before the half on a play where we had no business running.
b. I realize DeSean is not the player he used to be, but kicking to him was pretty stupid and we were rewarded for that with a 15 year penalty. Not only that we had two penalties on that play (both Ballentine and Harper).
Which leads me to number two
2. We do stupid stuff on special teams week after week, especially with Ballentine. This week, the gunner isn’t covered, and Ballentine keeps his head down. This after not executing in Dallas on the fake with the gunner. He is supposed to be a special teams coach.
3. Our game plan was awful, especially defensively with a soft zone against no offensive talent. I do give credit for switching it up at the half.
4. The fact that it wasn’t 24-7 had nothing to with “coaching is ass off”, but with luck. Wentz threw a ball up for grabs, thankfully and we took it. And Elliot missed the FG. It’s not like we did anything.
5. Also, why would you give the ball to a guy who can’t catch when the game is on the line. You want to blame Engram, go for it, but that play was designed for him and designed to go for him. In other words, you went to an unreliable player in the biggest moment in the game and got the reward you would expect when you do a dumb thing like that.

This is not to say Judge won’t develop into a good coach going forward. I really like him and respect him as a person, and think he is a great person to lead our program. The players obviously like and respect him, and that is a great thing. But the fact remains the team is still plagued by the crap that has gone on for way too long with this team. Last night was not a new beginning, but a different chapter in the same darn story. So while there were some good things in that chapter, Jones and Gallman, it was basically the same story.

I’m sorry but I can’t tip my cap to Judge and the coaching staff at 1-6, no matter how much I admire him as a person and want him to succeed. He may well grow into a great coach, but the results so far haven’t been pretty. And, yes, a lot of that is lack of talent, but a lot of that is a coach who is very green and making rookie mistakes.
Giantimistic  
bc4life : 10/23/2020 7:58 am : link
Baker, Beal, and McKinney being out probably had something to do with that. That and a pass rusher or two. They're better but not good enough.

This Eagles team almost came back and beat the Ravens last week.
Players make plays  
UConn4523 : 10/23/2020 8:00 am : link
a CB getting beat isn’t on Judge, how do you draw that conclusion.

Was Jones’ big run on Pederson? Can’t you just point to any big play and do this?
RE: Players make plays  
Essex : 10/23/2020 8:04 am : link
In comment 15021244 UConn4523 said:
Quote:
a CB getting beat isn’t on Judge, how do you draw that conclusion.

Was Jones’ big run on Pederson? Can’t you just point to any big play and do this?


Maybe not but not having over the top protection with an 11 point with less than six minutes left is a coaching error. You have to put your players in with a chance to succeed. So Lewis getting beaten by Hightower doesn’t bother me as much as not having the game in front of us.
Judge is the only thing that keeps me sane.  
SFGFNCGiantsFan : 10/23/2020 8:05 am : link
I think he is legit. Just needs the horses.
Essex  
UConn4523 : 10/23/2020 8:11 am : link
I think you are letting the record heavily influence your opinion on Judge which to be honest, is perfectly fine. I just don’t agree with it. While it sounds like moral victory talk to you this team is clearly different - they just can’t close. There’s no closer on either side of the ball and blowing games is the sad result of that.

Have you seen the RBs we are trotting out there? Shepard’s return was huge but we still don’t have a dagger on offense. Leonard Williams may have played his best game as a Giant but when the best pass rusher next to him is Golden, who can’t get to the QB consistently, then it’s easy to plan for.

Maybe you don’t want to get “fooled” or disappointed but this team is clearly different.
Wasn't Coughlin a good guy? Wasn't Macadoo? Shurmur?  
Dinger : 10/23/2020 2:10 pm : link
They were all good guys until they weren't. To quote a somewhat successful former headcoach, 'you are what your record says you are'. For the last FOUR YEARS and 4 head coaches, we've had one game each year against Philly that was close at the end but we lost in the final moments. Macadoo was the last coach to beat the eagles. I questioned the timeouts at the end but realized the defense has no control over the clock. the offense does and does not need time outs. But the 'look' wasn't good. it was almost conceding they were going to score a TD. I'm dissappointed the staff didn't have a better backup linebacker than Davonte Downs. I'm disappointed that Love is still out there missing tackles and getting blown away. But its the same as it ever was and until Judge wins a game like last night or like two weeks ago or dominates a team that basically handed us a victory ike last week, he's just like all the rest. Oh yeah, he's a better teacher and he says all the right things to the press, but win some games. Then I'll believe the crazy horseshit coming out of your mouth about coaching better.....
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