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Andrew Thomas...when is it time to worry?

SFGFNCGiantsFan : 10/25/2020 8:47 pm
I didn't see the Jets game, but saw the posts that Becton looked really good. Wirfs & Wills have also graded well.

There's no other way to put it about Thomas...he's been awful. And yes, it's only 7 games in a weird season, but those other guys are in the same boat for the most part.

He's been in Sy's dud's multiple times. If he's a blown pick...well, another Gettleman disaster.
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Everytime he is on the  
jvm52106 : 10/25/2020 8:48 pm : link
field!
Can’t blame Gettleman  
Saquads26 : 10/25/2020 8:48 pm : link
He wasn’t a reach and everyone here loved the pick.
I woukd move him to the right side  
nygiants16 : 10/25/2020 8:48 pm : link
Peart at the left, and let him adjust..

I would start to worry if there is no imlrovement by the end of the year
I will worry  
Giantimistic : 10/25/2020 8:49 pm : link
When the coaching staff shows signs of worry.
Next summer  
section125 : 10/25/2020 8:52 pm : link
after the 1st pre-season game and he is still getting no one blocked.
RE: I woukd move him to the right side  
jnoble : 10/25/2020 8:52 pm : link
In comment 15024469 nygiants16 said:
Quote:
Peart at the left, and let him adjust..

I would start to worry if there is no imlrovement by the end of the year


Yes. I think the original plan before Solder left was for him to play on the right side anyway
The coaching staff is blind  
Giant John : 10/25/2020 8:52 pm : link
If they are not worried.
I think one can be  
GoDeep13 : 10/25/2020 8:58 pm : link
Concerned now. There are rookie struggles and then there is getting beat like a red headed step-child. The fact of the matter is Thomas is giving up pressure each way til Sunday. Power, speed, inside, outside. He’s a Burger King spokesman right now. Have it your way.
After the 48th thread on AT  
DCOrange : 10/25/2020 8:59 pm : link
So after the next one.
Groundbreaking stuff.  
robbieballs2003 : 10/25/2020 8:59 pm : link
Why has nobody else brought this up?
This is a Problem  
Samiam : 10/25/2020 9:03 pm : link
I’ve read in numerous places that he was the first OT drafted because he was the most pro ready of the tackles. From what I’ve seen and read, he seems like the least pro ready. Becton today looked far more polished against the Bills than Thomas has looked at any time and Becton, who was regarded as the least pro ready, dominated at times. Thomas has shown nothing to date to warrant being taken first OT much less the 4th pick in the draft.
Why would moving him to the right side make a difference......  
Simms11 : 10/25/2020 9:04 pm : link
It’s fundamentals he’s not getting. It would be the same on the right side. He keeps reverting back to things he’s gotten away with in college. Didn’t scouts see any of that? He’s not planting his right foot apparently and rushers are blowing through his inside shoulder as a result and not giving Jones anywhere to step up. I think they should make him practice with weights on his ankles. If he hasn’t corrected these flaws next year I think you could start worrying.
panic should already have set it  
GiantsFan84 : 10/25/2020 9:07 pm : link
this guy absolutely sucks. worse than flowers. thomas was not billed as and was never considered a project. the giants blew the 4th pick in the draft, as becton and wirfs are significantly better
If he's been doing poorly,  
Angel Eyes : 10/25/2020 9:08 pm : link
Why has he still been starting at left tackle aside from the Washington game?
RE: Groundbreaking stuff.  
EricJ : 10/25/2020 9:09 pm : link
In comment 15024482 robbieballs2003 said:
Quote:
Why has nobody else brought this up?


was thinking the same thing. So glad we have people who bring insightful discussions to the table.
He's sucked since the first days of camp  
arniefez : 10/25/2020 9:09 pm : link
and he's gotten worse. So anytime works.
RE: Next summer  
chopperhatch : 10/25/2020 9:09 pm : link
In comment 15024473 section125 said:
Quote:
after the 1st pre-season game and he is still getting no one blocked.


This. He has struggled, but he has also struggled after zero offseason and playing some tough defensive fronts. Pitt, Chicago, 49ers, Dallas (Lawreence, Smith and Crawford are no slouches), Rams and Wash have pretty top notch DEs and rush backers.

Compare that to everybody's hero in Becton (widely regarded as the 3rd or 4th best OT going into the draft) who has played the 49ers, Colts and not much else in terms of DL talent.

The answer is probably cliser to early next season. You really cant evaluate him at this point
RE: Can’t blame Gettleman  
GMen72 : 10/25/2020 9:12 pm : link
In comment 15024468 Saquads26 said:
Quote:
He wasn’t a reach and everyone here loved the pick.


I hated the pick. Not Thomas in particular but DG should have been able to trade down a few picks for anything and get any of the top 4 OTs. It wasn't anything close to a value pick and Thomas was regarded as the highest floor/lowest ceiling OT in the draft. Looks like the floor is dropping already? I still don't think DG has the intellect to negotiate a solid trade. When has he made a trade where the Giants have benefited more than the other franchise? I think that's why he's so scared to trade down.
I loved the pick, and I'm worried  
rasbutant : 10/25/2020 9:18 pm : link
However, every player is different, some guys struggle at first. I was also worried about Corey Webster but he turn out alright. All hope is not lost.

But yes, at this point in the season I was hoping to see better play from him.
RE: Can’t blame Gettleman  
GiantsFan84 : 10/25/2020 9:20 pm : link
In comment 15024468 Saquads26 said:
Quote:
He wasn’t a reach and everyone here loved the pick.


There were a lot of differences of opinion by draft gurus on this.

There is very ample room to criticize DG for this
I'd start to worry  
RAIN : 10/25/2020 9:20 pm : link
next year, when he turns 22 years old, and has had time to address his issues. He needs to get stronger and be in balance in his sets.

My biggest worry with him (why I had him behind Wills, Becton, and Wirfs in that order), is his lack of balance. The reason the Flowers experiment didn't work.

I didn't know if that could be fixed. I really hope for our sake it can, but its up to the young man and a lot of work. He has all the tools, but he has to change the way he's doing things.
Draft day was the time to worry  
pjcas18 : 10/25/2020 9:27 pm : link
when the Giants had their choice of tackles and seems like they took the worst of those realistic for their draft spot.

Highest floor? NFL ready? Best technique? Those terms thrown around post-draft about Thomas don't indicate a player who needs a year to get acclimated to the NFL game. Thomas looks like the project tackle.
RE: Draft day was the time to worry  
GiantsFan84 : 10/25/2020 9:30 pm : link
In comment 15024509 pjcas18 said:
Quote:
when the Giants had their choice of tackles and seems like they took the worst of those realistic for their draft spot.

Highest floor? NFL ready? Best technique? Those terms thrown around post-draft about Thomas don't indicate a player who needs a year to get acclimated to the NFL game. Thomas looks like the project tackle.


yes he was supposed to be the most pro ready according to DG. becton and wirfs were the freak athletes and they are already better technically by a wide margin. someone really dropped the ball on this
RE: RE: Can’t blame Gettleman  
Anakim : 10/25/2020 9:31 pm : link
In comment 15024504 GiantsFan84 said:
Quote:
In comment 15024468 Saquads26 said:


Quote:


He wasn’t a reach and everyone here loved the pick.



There were a lot of differences of opinion by draft gurus on this.

There is very ample room to criticize DG for this



I think he's being facetious
Andrew Thomas...when is it time to worry?  
M.S. : 10/25/2020 9:32 pm : link

Right fucking now!

He looks like the sort of draft bust that will set this hell-hole franchise back another three years.

Very concerned  
Thegratefulhead : 10/25/2020 9:32 pm : link
Way too early to give up but scared. We needed to hit in that pick. If he can be an All Pro anywhere on the OL we can survive. He just can't be a bust.
I think it's fair to worry now  
Ten Ton Hammer : 10/25/2020 9:32 pm : link
Rookies are usually up and down. He has strictly been down since week 3.
RE: RE: RE: Can’t blame Gettleman  
GiantsFan84 : 10/25/2020 9:34 pm : link
In comment 15024516 Anakim said:
Quote:
In comment 15024504 GiantsFan84 said:


Quote:


In comment 15024468 Saquads26 said:


Quote:


He wasn’t a reach and everyone here loved the pick.



There were a lot of differences of opinion by draft gurus on this.

There is very ample room to criticize DG for this




I think he's being facetious


I don't know if he was. PFF loved thomas coming out
there were very few who wanted either wirfs or Becton  
Chip : 10/25/2020 9:38 pm : link
over Thomas. He has played very few games and had limited practice time prior to the season. A young team with new coaches was never going to succeed the way this season was set up. Everyone is frustrated and hopefully the Maras don't panic and clean house again with the Coaches. Lets give Judge another year and just file this season away.
Maybe we should cut him  
JoeyBigBlue : 10/25/2020 9:38 pm : link
7 games into his career and take the sunk cost. ..... People need to relax. What Becton and the others are doing is irrelevant. If he hasn’t shown any proven in year 2, then we should worry.
RE: RE: Next summer  
barens : 10/25/2020 9:42 pm : link
In comment 15024493 chopperhatch said:
Quote:
In comment 15024473 section125 said:


Quote:


after the 1st pre-season game and he is still getting no one blocked.



This. He has struggled, but he has also struggled after zero offseason and playing some tough defensive fronts. Pitt, Chicago, 49ers, Dallas (Lawreence, Smith and Crawford are no slouches), Rams and Wash have pretty top notch DEs and rush backers.

Compare that to everybody's hero in Becton (widely regarded as the 3rd or 4th best OT going into the draft) who has played the 49ers, Colts and not much else in terms of DL talent.

The answer is probably cliser to early next season. You really cant evaluate him at this point


Yeah, and when Becton went against the Niners, he only had to face Bosa, who he had no trouble with. But who's counting.
Actually, Daniel Jeremiah spoke about it  
Anakim : 10/25/2020 9:46 pm : link
The minute Thomas was drafted
"He was my fourth Offensive Tackle...I did not see elite recoverability, quickness or athleticism...there were better options on the board." - ( New Window )
It really is simple.  
robbieballs2003 : 10/25/2020 9:48 pm : link
Baldinger nails it. It is called a kick slide for a reason. You kick back with your outside leg and SLIDE your inside foot. You also have to stay square to the LoS meaning your shoulders are parallel to the LoS until at the right moment. Thomas doesn't know what that moment is. He's too slow with his kick slide, which means that he is turning his shoulders too quick. Teams study that and are attacking him inside because they know he cannot recover because of that technique. Them we get to what Baldinger was talking about that his inside foot is way to high and cannot plant it in the ground. He's all over the place. Switching him to the right side isn't going to do anything but slow down his progression.

This isn't even taking in the mental aspect of the game where he is slow to read stunts. Too much is going in around him.

If I am a coach I am making it simple on him. I am having him focus on not getting beat inside. That has to come first. He's so worried about getting beat outside that he is struggling with everything. I am saying hey nobody gets inside of you. That's your focus then adjust to the outside stuff. Then I would have TEs and WRs help slow down the initial rush of defenders and have backs help chip. Put him in a position to gain some confidence with something and then slowly build off of that.
And to add to my last post  
robbieballs2003 : 10/25/2020 9:58 pm : link
All I heard from Thomas since getting drafted was his hand placement and he needs to fix that. The problem is his footwork is horrendous. His hand placement doesn't mean shit if he's not in position to punch.
Yester-  
SomeFan : 10/25/2020 9:59 pm : link
day
The kid is 21  
Earl the goat : 10/25/2020 10:02 pm : link
Everyone needs to take a Valium and relax
RE: Can’t blame Gettleman  
Ned In Atlanta : 10/25/2020 10:05 pm : link
In comment 15024468 Saquads26 said:
Quote:
He wasn’t a reach and everyone here loved the pick.



People on a fan forum liked the guy so an NFL GM is exonerated if it proves to be a terrible decision. That checks out
RE: Can’t blame Gettleman  
santacruzom : 10/25/2020 10:08 pm : link
In comment 15024468 Saquads26 said:
Quote:
He wasn’t a reach and everyone here loved the pick.


I agree he wasn't particularly a reach, but there were quite a few here who didn't love the pick.
....  
BrettNYG10 : 10/25/2020 10:10 pm : link
Thomas isn't just struggling, he's one of the worst tackles in the league right now.

I'm concerned. The Giants have bungled line picks for years (and our Director of College Scouting has been with the franchise for 15 years). When you add in how good some other guys have looked, it's concerning.
.....  
BrettNYG10 : 10/25/2020 10:11 pm : link
Just to be clear, our director of college Scouting has only been in that position since 2018. He was a scout the other years.
Tough Defensive Fronts  
WillVAB : 10/25/2020 10:16 pm : link
Is the weakest shit up here when it comes to Thomas. Everyone in the division can rush the passer. He has to be able to hold his own vs good competition if he’s ever going to justify the pick.
He’s been pretty good lately  
Simms11 : 10/25/2020 10:27 pm : link
in run blocking. His pass blocking is the biggest concern. I think he’ll get better. He’s still very young and athletic. Maybe he should have stayed for his senior year?! So it appears he wasn’t the most NFL ready after all and that’s OK. I think he’ll still be a good LT. Can’t be concerned yet. He’s played all of 7 games in the NFL without any preseason and is playing one of the hardest positions, except CB and QB to start in this league as a rookie. He was no slouch in college and had many awards and accolades.
RE: RE: Can’t blame Gettleman  
John In CO : 10/25/2020 10:35 pm : link
In comment 15024568 santacruzom said:
Quote:
In comment 15024468 Saquads26 said:


Quote:


He wasn’t a reach and everyone here loved the pick.



I agree he wasn't particularly a reach, but there were quite a few here who didn't love the pick.


I didnt love it, but not so much because of the player. I had a hard time differentiating between the 4 OT's, and because of that, I really was hoping for a minor trade down a few spots (assuming there was someone who wanted to move up to 4 for someone) and then take whichever OT was left standing, and also pick up an extra pick or two so we could fill a couple of holes, mainly WR because of the deep class. But when they made the pick, I figured that someone in their scouting department or DG saw something in Thomas that made him stand out among the group. Whatever that is.....obviously havent seen it yet.
RE: It really is simple.  
barens : 10/25/2020 10:52 pm : link
In comment 15024536 robbieballs2003 said:
Quote:
Baldinger nails it. It is called a kick slide for a reason. You kick back with your outside leg and SLIDE your inside foot. You also have to stay square to the LoS meaning your shoulders are parallel to the LoS until at the right moment. Thomas doesn't know what that moment is. He's too slow with his kick slide, which means that he is turning his shoulders too quick. Teams study that and are attacking him inside because they know he cannot recover because of that technique. Them we get to what Baldinger was talking about that his inside foot is way to high and cannot plant it in the ground. He's all over the place. Switching him to the right side isn't going to do anything but slow down his progression.

This isn't even taking in the mental aspect of the game where he is slow to read stunts. Too much is going in around him.

If I am a coach I am making it simple on him. I am having him focus on not getting beat inside. That has to come first. He's so worried about getting beat outside that he is struggling with everything. I am saying hey nobody gets inside of you. That's your focus then adjust to the outside stuff. Then I would have TEs and WRs help slow down the initial rush of defenders and have backs help chip. Put him in a position to gain some confidence with something and then slowly build off of that.


I actually think the one area that he's good at, is picking up stunts with Hernandez. For some reason, that seems more natural, but we are getting to a point where we ask, is he a better interior player? This really can't go on all year.
Thomas  
stretch234 : 10/25/2020 11:01 pm : link
He was the best LT prospect coming out of the best conference. It was the right choice for the LT. Unfortunately he is struggling

Don’t recall any NFL team, scout, etc thinking Wirfs was an NFL left tackle most thought he would be a G

Wills never played LT in college

Beckton was not considered as good as Thomas

It sucks right now he is struggling, but it is only 7 games
Now...  
trueblueinpw : 10/25/2020 11:21 pm : link
People say “move him to the right tackle”. We didn’t spend the overall 4 on an RT did we? And why would AT be good at RT when isn’t good at LT?

Anyway, the time to worry is now. It’s not like he can’t get better. But, why wouldn’t anyone be worried now? He’s getting beat every week in every way imaginable. Seriously, what’s not to worry about?
For me, if Peart and Thomas end up playing our Tackle  
PatersonPlank : 10/25/2020 11:37 pm : link
spots for years and make All-Pro teams, I couldn't care who plays RT or LT. I'll consider it a big success.
RE: Thomas  
Anakim : 10/25/2020 11:38 pm : link
In comment 15024613 stretch234 said:
Quote:
He was the best LT prospect coming out of the best conference. It was the right choice for the LT. Unfortunately he is struggling

Don’t recall any NFL team, scout, etc thinking Wirfs was an NFL left tackle most thought he would be a G

Wills never played LT in college

Beckton was not considered as good as Thomas

It sucks right now he is struggling, but it is only 7 games


Some people had Becton ahead of Thomas. DJ I believe had Becton as his #1 OT.
RE: For me, if Peart and Thomas end up playing our Tackle  
jeffusedtobeonwebtv : 10/26/2020 6:49 am : link
In comment 15024629 PatersonPlank said:
Quote:
spots for years and make All-Pro teams, I couldn't care who plays RT or LT. I'll consider it a big success.


Speaking of Peart, why is he not getting snaps after his performance against Washington? He rated much better than Thomas. Joe Judge has said over and over that you earn playing time, and he doesn't care where you were drafted. Yet as Thomas keeps getting beat, Peart remains on the bench.

And I suppose Gallman after looking good against Philly will not play. And even worse, Engram not only gets snaps, but is counted on in clutch times. What a joke next week it will be watching Gronkowski, possibly the best tight end ever, and comparing his play to Engram, the most overrated player in the entire league.
RE: RE: Thomas  
jeffusedtobeonwebtv : 10/26/2020 6:52 am : link
In comment 15024631 Anakim said:
Quote:
In comment 15024613 stretch234 said:


Quote:


He was the best LT prospect coming out of the best conference. It was the right choice for the LT. Unfortunately he is struggling

Don’t recall any NFL team, scout, etc thinking Wirfs was an NFL left tackle most thought he would be a G

Wills never played LT in college

Beckton was not considered as good as Thomas

It sucks right now he is struggling, but it is only 7 games



Some people had Becton ahead of Thomas. DJ I believe had Becton as his #1 OT.


Becton may very well have been seen as having the highest ceiling and the lowest floor. After Flowers that lowest floor part must have scared them away.
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