Very harsh Jones criticism from around the league:

missed opportunities, horrible decisions under duress. You can't really object to any of it.

Inaccurate to be honest.

It's time for Jones to make plays, not get congratulated for not fumbling when he gets sacked ffs.

With Darnold as well. I can only hope Judge has the power and conviction to make a change this offseason. The worst case scenario now isn’t that Jones is bad, it’s that he’s just good enough to convince them to stick it out another year.

The level of QB play is as high as it has ever been, and young players are coming up and thriving every season. The Giants should not burn more time waiting on a player who doesn’t have it.

It was good while it lasted.

I think his decision making will improve. Plus, Some of these evaluators do not know what the field looked like from ground level. If there was a 6 foot 5 lineman in the way of his line of sight and he can't see Slayton open deep he can't make the Throw. When I was a HS assistant we had ground level cameras in the endzone and a lot of times what looked like an easy read from the cameras above, was not when you looked at the play from ground level. I do not know if that is the case but it is something to consider. Maybe he needs to learn to climb the pocket better to get a better view????

Everyone has bad days every now and then. Even Eli in years the Giants won it all. Jones couldn't hit ANY deep balls that day but he has hit several extremely nice ones so we know he has the ability do it. I still think he looks like the most athletic person on the field most of the time.

If he cleans up the TOs, I think he will be alright. THe analysis I posted the other day was encouraging from the WAS game. Hopefully it continues.

in that offense. I think Judge is a better coach than Shurmur but not sure if Jones is more confident or comfortable in this offense. I can't believe what we saw last year was a fluke. There was just too many great games by him throwing 3, 4, and 5 TD's a game. I'm certainly no expert but just judging by what I saw. Where did that go?

"scrambled" on two of his INT's. Looked like he made ill advised throws as the pocket was collapsing and he was in the grasp or about to be hit.

I'd like to know what the evaluation would say of Tom Brady's game against us and the subsequently vs. the Saints.

until he starts beating non-Washington teams, people will question his skills and decision-making. I'd be the same for any other QB.

8 touchdown passes in 9 games is simply not good enough in the modern NFL.

In comment 15043276 Blue21 said:

Quote:

in that offense. I think Judge is a better coach than Shurmur but not sure if Jones is more confident or comfortable in this offense. I can't believe what we saw last year was a fluke. There was just too many great games by him throwing 3, 4, and 5 TD's a game. I'm certainly no expert but just judging by what I saw. Where did that go?

One hit wonder. Teams now have film on him and can read him like a book. He hasn't proven he can make any adjustments to counter how defenses are game planning for him now.

with the football and his TB game was terrible.

With that said, I still feel as though we are watching the growing pains of a quarterback who is no longer being spoon-fed and instead is thrown right into the fire with a new offense and all of the responsibility a veteran NFL quarterback must undertake in managing a game. Last year, Jones had a lot of simpler, half-field reads, less responsibility at the LOS and fewer adjustments/calls to make. It's obvious that he's in a much different situation this year, and from time to time you see his mental processing stall as he continues to grasp what he's being asked to do.

It's sink or swim, and that is deliberate. If Jones fails, we will have an opportunity for a do-over in the draft. I still have faith in him, but there's no doubt that it's show-me time.

Jones is 5-16 in his career, 1-16 against everyone except an awful Washington team. He has thrown 8 touchdowns all season in an era where scoring is at an all time high and the good to great QB’s throw touchdown passes at will.

He’s a nice kid, I believe he works hard, but he doesn’t have it.

will transcend beyond being a mediocre starting QB.

However, I think it would be a devastating mistake to give up too early on him. The Giants most likely are not going to be in a position to draft Lawrence and I'm not convinced any of the other QBs are that good prospects that they are worth giving up on Jones.

I think the end of next year will be the key decision point. The Front office needs to get him some more reliable weapons. At that point the OL will have stabilized, Saquan should be back and he will at least have a WR corps that will allow you to eliminate the variable that he has no weapons.

If all those things fall into place, I think you can better assess his preformance.

undersell how bad that Bucs game was. Sure it's just one game. But to not even look at your first read on plays? That goes beyond an off throwing day, and speaks to a guy who is completely lost.

If he hits one, Giants win. And, he missed 3-4 of them.

You don't want him to NEVER take chances, but he has to learn WHEN to take them, and when not to. What you saw in that Tampa game is what we've seen in other games, too. A lack of situational awareness. Those are the INTs you cannot have. That stuff comes with more experience.

He still hasn't wised-up enough to realize that when he's flushed from the pocket and being chased, he shouldn't throw the ball downfield once the defender has hands on him. I get WHY he's doing it, but he needs to learn that's a really low-percentage throw, and that he should either throw it away (which he seldom does), or just take the sack.

That said, if he every gets more protection, he won't be in these situations as often.

So the criticism is fair. And until he corrects it, and the fumbling, he's going to hear criticism.

starting qb is the way he was described coming out of college. Obviously overdrafted with the sixth pick. Doesn't mean he is terrible or that he won't make the occasional great play. He's just not the guy you are building your offense around.

of Tom Brady's poor outing vs Saints?

This is a revisiting of Sando's rankings conducted over the summer. The rankings are the same as they were then, he's just added a few quotes from sources around the league for each QB.

Explains why guys like Murray, Josh Allen, Tannehill are so low considering current-year performance; and guys like Rivers, Stafford, Wentz probably higher than they would be otherwise.
Link to the July list - ( New Window )

Brady is the goat; Jones has a career record of 5-16.

No doubt he had a shit game against the Bucs. Would love to know who this evaluator is. Right now DJ is our ride or die homie. Lets see how the rest of the season plays out.

In comment 15043296 JonC said:

Quote:

If he hits one, Giants win. And, he missed 3-4 of them.

Truth be told, he wasn't that great on Sunday either. 212 yards, 6.2 y/a and a td is pretty pedestrian stuff. About the only good thing to be said is that he didn't turn the ball over.

It may be that he saw their superb pass rush on tape and in-game and didn't think he'd get off the deep routes that were clearly there!

I've been saying lets judge this team and Jones POST-BYE, the final stretch, as they can make adjustments and coach up and heal up giving them a shot to finish strong.

Now I say the Philadelphia game will tell us who we are!! We beat Philly we go into the bye week in the race!! Can Jones step up against a good team in the division under the pressure? If he shows really well and we win (no loss) then we learn a lot about who we have and our future.

In comment 15043309 Bernie said:

Quote:

No doubt he had a shit game against the Bucs. Would love to know who this evaluator is. Right now DJ is our ride or die homie. Lets see how the rest of the season plays out.

Is it a "whatever" like who cares or is DJ our "ride homie"?

If there is no doubt he had a shit game vs Buc than why does it matter who the evaluator is?

If he was on a division rival, or the Jets. We would probably be delighted.

In comment 15043315 Oscar said:

Quote:

If he was on a division rival, or the Jets. We would probably be delighted.

This board has consistently underrated division QBs like Dak. Fan bias cuts both ways with respect to intra-divisional stuff.

And put him in Tier3 at rating of 3.38. The top of tier3 was Kyler Murray, 14th overall at 2.68. Some well known names just above DJ - Derek Carr at 20 (2.98), Baker Mayfield at 21 (3.0), Josh Allen at 22 (3.04), Teddy Brigewater at 23 (3.14) and Darnold at 24 (3.18).

The most ‘positive’ comment from evaluator was:

“It’s hard for me to put my trust in him because you see really good flashes, but then there are just times when there are so many boneheaded mistakes,” an evaluator said. “Him, Sam Darnold, Mitch Trubisky are all the same to me. Talented enough, can scramble enough, but not consistent enough. Are there coaches who can develop these guys?”


My take is it is do or die time for DJ. He needs a strong performance over the next 7 games, otherwise I’m banging the drum for QB in round 1. Hope he balls out, but gun to my head - he is not the guy.

i know he's been largely positive in his public statements, but he doesn't seem like a guy who wears rose colored glasses when it comes to talent evaluation. he is seeing the same tape as everyone else. given the state of the team and what he's trying to accomplish, he's never going to bench jones. this season seems to be about evaluation across the board as much as anything. but i can't see this coach tying himself to a qb he doesn't believe in because he was a high draft pick selected before he arrived.

especially ones that have smarts. Let's see what happens.

In comment 15043276 Blue21 said:

Quote:

in that offense. I think Judge is a better coach than Shurmur but not sure if Jones is more confident or comfortable in this offense. I can't believe what we saw last year was a fluke. There was just too many great games by him throwing 3, 4, and 5 TD's a game. I'm certainly no expert but just judging by what I saw. Where did that go?

This is a legitimate and under-asked question.

Did they select a system QB that works specifically in Shurmur's system, or is he more than that and capable of working in other schemes? If he can't raise his level of play to supersede a system, I lose faith in him being able to lift a team.

He's been fairly dreadful this year, but my hope clings on the fact he's started to string together a few multi-TD games now. O-line is looking better. Zero turnover game last game. Let's see if these are anomalies or him turning a corner.

Jones has had a running game for a total of 2 weeks, give the man a chance to adjust. No off-season, new coach and coordinators. And for the first 6 games he was running for his life and in third and long all day. He will be fine. Maybe never a Mahomes level superstar but he will be a better than average starter once he gets in sync with his receivers, especially on those deep routes. Takes a lot of timing and practice.

In comment 15043331 gary_from_chester said:

Quote:

And put him in Tier3 at rating of 3.38. The top of tier3 was Kyler Murray, 14th overall at 2.68. Some well known names just above DJ - Derek Carr at 20 (2.98), Baker Mayfield at 21 (3.0), Josh Allen at 22 (3.04), Teddy Brigewater at 23 (3.14) and Darnold at 24 (3.18). The most ‘positive’ comment from evaluator was: “It’s hard for me to put my trust in him because you see really good flashes, but then there are just times when there are so many boneheaded mistakes,” an evaluator said. “Him, Sam Darnold, Mitch Trubisky are all the same to me. Talented enough, can scramble enough, but not consistent enough. Are there coaches who can develop these guys?” My take is it is do or die time for DJ. He needs a strong performance over the next 7 games, otherwise I’m banging the drum for QB in round 1. Hope he balls out, but gun to my head - he is not the guy.

The rankings were assigned during the summer, and haven't been adjusted based on current-season performance.

While his surrounding cast has not only been worse than him but has been, in the overall, as bad if not worse than any in the league.

makes a lot of stubborn, boneheaded decisions and throws that having nothing to do with a poor OL, few weapons, or no offseason. He has 15 INTs and 21 fumbles in the last 36 games, and almost had two more last Sunday. That needs to stop or he should be benched. At a minimum, we'll have to look for a new QB in the offseason.

The irony is that I'm not sure his not looking for Slayton during the TB game was his fault. Slayton said he missed one throw in the lights IIRC, and Jones threw to the wrong side on another attempt. But I wonder if that was the wind. Both he and Brady missed quite a few open receivers. Jones may have decided that there was too much of a chance that he'd miss on any deep throw because of the wind to even try.

In comment 15043340 JB_in_DC said:

Quote:

In comment 15043331 gary_from_chester said: Quote: And put him in Tier3 at rating of 3.38. The top of tier3 was Kyler Murray, 14th overall at 2.68. Some well known names just above DJ - Derek Carr at 20 (2.98), Baker Mayfield at 21 (3.0), Josh Allen at 22 (3.04), Teddy Brigewater at 23 (3.14) and Darnold at 24 (3.18). The most ‘positive’ comment from evaluator was: “It’s hard for me to put my trust in him because you see really good flashes, but then there are just times when there are so many boneheaded mistakes,” an evaluator said. “Him, Sam Darnold, Mitch Trubisky are all the same to me. Talented enough, can scramble enough, but not consistent enough. Are there coaches who can develop these guys?” My take is it is do or die time for DJ. He needs a strong performance over the next 7 games, otherwise I’m banging the drum for QB in round 1. Hope he balls out, but gun to my head - he is not the guy. The rankings were assigned during the summer, and haven't been adjusted based on current-season performance.

Correct.....arrow is pointing down....

In comment 15043349 gary_from_chester said:

Quote:

In comment 15043340 JB_in_DC said: Quote: In comment 15043331 gary_from_chester said: Quote: And put him in Tier3 at rating of 3.38. The top of tier3 was Kyler Murray, 14th overall at 2.68. Some well known names just above DJ - Derek Carr at 20 (2.98), Baker Mayfield at 21 (3.0), Josh Allen at 22 (3.04), Teddy Brigewater at 23 (3.14) and Darnold at 24 (3.18). The most ‘positive’ comment from evaluator was: “It’s hard for me to put my trust in him because you see really good flashes, but then there are just times when there are so many boneheaded mistakes,” an evaluator said. “Him, Sam Darnold, Mitch Trubisky are all the same to me. Talented enough, can scramble enough, but not consistent enough. Are there coaches who can develop these guys?” My take is it is do or die time for DJ. He needs a strong performance over the next 7 games, otherwise I’m banging the drum for QB in round 1. Hope he balls out, but gun to my head - he is not the guy. The rankings were assigned during the summer, and haven't been adjusted based on current-season performance. Correct.....arrow is pointing down....

Right. Obviously he's not in the same tier as Murray and Allen if they do this survey now. Half a season left - he's gotta progress.

no 2 ways about it.

22 games into his career. 7 more to go. Will be interesting to watch.

Right now, through 22 games, his numbers compare somewhat favorably to Eli's first 22 games. What does that mean? Absolutely nothing. Just a reference/perspective point.

I think this team is well coached enough that they are going to win 2-3 more games.

If you're in the 6-10 pick range, you don't have a shot at Fields and it's a no-brainer that Jones gets year 3, IMO.

The tough situation would be if Jones looks absolutely terrible for the remaining 7 games. If he does, good chance they are picking in the top 3-4. And if he looks that bad, maybe you consider Fields.

I'd say there's probably a 90%+ chance that Jones is the QB in 2021. Can't use a top 10 pick on another QB who's as or greater of a risk as Jones was (Wilson, Lance, Trask).

For what it's worth, I think they still aren't using enough designed runs for him.

In comment 15043347 AcidTest said:

Quote:

makes a lot of stubborn, boneheaded decisions and throws that having nothing to do with a poor OL, few weapons, or no offseason. He has 15 INTs and 21 fumbles in the last 36 games, and almost had two more last Sunday. That needs to stop or he should be benched. At a minimum, we'll have to look for a new QB in the offseason. The irony is that I'm not sure his not looking for Slayton during the TB game was his fault. Slayton said he missed one throw in the lights IIRC, and Jones threw to the wrong side on another attempt. But I wonder if that was the wind. Both he and Brady missed quite a few open receivers. Jones may have decided that there was too much of a chance that he'd miss on any deep throw because of the wind to even try.

He needs to stop throwing spirals. You need to be like Eli and throw ducks that cut right through the wind.

In comment 15043310 HomerJones45 said:

Quote:

In comment 15043296 JonC said: Quote: If he hits one, Giants win. And, he missed 3-4 of them. Truth be told, he wasn't that great on Sunday either. 212 yards, 6.2 y/a and a td is pretty pedestrian stuff. About the only good thing to be said is that he didn't turn the ball over.

You beat me to it here. In fact, I don't think Jones has not broken 7 YPA in one game the entire season.

In essence, Jones was a good game manager on Sunday. Not sure those were the expectations with a sixth pick investment, but that's where we seem to be.

As someone suggested above, the Tampa game was the biggest indictment that Jones may not be a franchise QB after all. Garrett called an absolutely brilliant game. Used Tampa's speed and aggressive nature against them. They were completely off balance. Yet, Jones couldn't execute and we left too many points on the field.

In these upcoming games, we are playing the worst pass defense in the NFL (Seattle), 7th worst pass defense (Browns), the 8th worst pass defense (Cincy), and the 2nd worst scoring defense in the league (Dallas...Seattle is the 3rd worst).

If Jones can't light up against a few of these, he really needs to be replaced ASAP.

In comment 15043300 LBH15 said:

Quote:

of Tom Brady's poor outing vs Saints?

I guess the jury is still out on Brady...Not sure he can cut in this league...

In all seriousness, Jones has had a poor supporting cast and not much of a running game all year. But him badly badly missing open receivers and misreading defenses really doesn't have much to do with that. Add in the turnovers and those are really bad signs. I hope and I think he can turn it around- but he has a lot to prove. They are a ton of good young quarterbacks and its never been more important to have one.

That was his worst game as a pro to my eyes. When have you seen him miss that many downfield throws?

He was clearly really off that game, more so than usual.

don't expect Jones to light it up right now. I just want him to be smart with the football. He has an inexperienced OL and few weapons. Barkley is out, and Slayton can easily be doubled. He just needs to be a game manager. Stop waiting five or six seconds for receivers to clear and get open. That just leads to sacks and fumbles. Throw it away instead or run. And stop forcing throws into extremely tight windows. It's fine to punt. The defense is playing well despite having no edge rushers. Dixon is also a good punter.

Have to remember his QBR is #21 for a second year player without a line and weapons and no full training camp. (Eli got the reps his rookie year). He is not top ten yet and had a bad Tampa game. If he continues to hold the TO’s down and ends up around #15-17 he will be right where he should be. Give it time. If he had a Keenan Allen who is open every time to throw to we wouldn’t be having this discussion. Our WR’s are off the scrap pile with a line that struggled for a year and a half with no Barkley.

"They had guys running deep three times and the quarterback doesn’t even look at them.That is the first read in the play."

How does someone know what the first read is without knowing the play design and play call?

In comment 15043371 Trainmaster said:

Quote:

"They had guys running deep three times and the quarterback doesn’t even look at them.That is the first read in the play." How does someone know what the first read is without knowing the play design and play call?

These coaches know every play/formation in the league. If it is a new wrinkle, they can quickly discern the sequence of options. So they know exactly what's going on...

The coaches see DJ in places where they can get a real handle on whether or not he has the goods to succeed. When he isn't being blitzed, hit, sacked and pressured at the highest rates in the league. When he has receivers that are occasionally open or don't drop his passes. Maybe they see that given adequate support he can be really good or maybe they see someone who just doesn't have it. I'd love to know what they see but we'll just have to wait and see what they decide.

Winning 4 of the last 7, winning the division and making noise in the playoffs to having the worst QB?

Seriously though, NFL QBs are judged by production. Unless he proves them different they are right.

is that he is not an accurate passer. People are bamboozled by a few, very nice plays he makes each game but the overall performance AND NUMBERS are unmistakable. His completion pct is near the bottom of the league. He has terrible Y/A and Y/C numbers. He routinely throws to the wrong side of receivers on simple passes and he often overthrows and under-throws. This makes him ineffective. Trubisky and Mariota among others have the same exact problem - a few good plays make them look good but they are not consistently accurate. We will not win a thing with Jones unless he improves dramatically. And unless he improves now, we should be looking for his replacement starting in next year's draft.