Giants Trade
Odell Beckham Jr.
Browns Trade
Jabrill Peppers
#17 Pick (Dexter Lawrence)
#95 Pick (Oshane Ximines)
I heard Cowherd reference the trade today on his show, so I figured it’d be a good time to revisit the trade. At the time, the universal opinion was the Giants lost the trade. However, it is no longer clear cut.
I feel bad for Beckham; it hasn’t worked out for him in Cleveland. I hated to see him get hurt again this year. The trade has not worked out as intended for Cleveland, there is no way around that.
As for the return, Peppers has shown more this year under this coaching staff. He’s had some nice returns in special teams. I’m hopeful he can play well alongside McKinney down the line.
Lawrence has arguably been Gettleman’s best pick, he is a keg on what hopefully becomes a strong defensive line. We’ll see if Oshane Ximines ever amounts to anything.
Lastly, a big portion of this trade will come down to Jones. I wonder if this trade was made with the idea that Jones was the pick at #6. Getting the extra first rounder may have made the decision to draft Jones easier for Gettleman and company.
One thing is certain, the trade paved the way for a much different direction for this franchise.
Odell Beckham 2019-2020: 58.8 yds/gm, 4.2 rec/gm, 7 TDs
It's a 6 yard and half a reception difference between them per game - their numbers couldn't be much more identical than that.
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In comment 15049138 Thegratefulhead said:
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In comment 15049116 djm said:
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but nothing gets me going like the fan favorite, the one and only, the DISTRACTION.
BEckham was a distraction here, yet we won more games from 14-2016 then we did 2018-2020. Go figure.
I keep askiong this, but does a QB get distracted by something Beckahm said one day prior on his instagram account when it's 3rd and 10 and the pocket collapses? IS that when Beckham's distractions really cause havoc?
Fans are distracted. And media members. Players play the game and couldn't give a fuck what Beckham said in some stupid PC one week prior.
You don't think players walking off the field before the half is over in a contested game to get an IV because he doesn't like the way water feels in his tummy can affect team morale? How about that injury that kept him off the field for his last 4 games as a Giant? So glad he is gone.
What about the injury that kept him out??. He was injured, what was he supposed to do?
The bruised quad that cost him 4 games. A bruised quad. It's the NFL. They all have bruised something, every day.
So what are you implying??. he faked the injury??
Now, after the fact when new information has come to light!
A scout was fired due to the miss out on Baker, and ultimately DG has to accept the responsibility for the failed pick, no argument there.
But I do a lot of reading and nowadays even more podcast listening about the Giants and I don't recall any of the negatives about Baker's work habits, or let's be blunt, his flat out stupidity, until after he was in the building. Au contraire, what I heard about Baker was that he was the best most ridiculously serious shut down man cover corner in college for two full years as a starter, in the SEC battling college's best WRs regularly.
One UGA media guy glowingly called Baker best CB in the entire history of UGA football!
After he came to training camp as a Giant, reports of him sleeping during team meetings, and sleeping in the players' lounge area, rather than studying his playbook like most all the other rookies would, came to light.
If you have a documented source of published info re the behavioral red flags around Baker prior to the draft (not the combine speed issue), I'd love to see them.
Enjoy the debate, thanks.
You know the scout that got fired is the same scout DG promoted?. He basically promoted the guy and then fired him the next year..
On top of that, he had a season with 112 receptions AND DIDN'T BREAK 1,000 YARDS!
Landry is a decent WR, but, he's likely not a top 20 guy in the NFL. Probably just a tier above Slayton.
Odell Beckham 2019-2020: 58.8 yds/gm, 4.2 rec/gm, 7 TDs
It's a 6 yard and half a reception difference between them per game - their numbers couldn't be much more identical than that.
Reread what I said (bolded).
In comment 15049236 Eric on Li said:
OBJ prior to joining Cleveland was an elite WR. His NYG career average of 93 yards per game would be 2nd best all time behind Julio Jones and the 2 of them would be the only players above 90 yards per game. Ahead of Calvin Johnson, Deandre Hopkins, Antonio Brown, and Michael Thomas (as well as all time greats like Harrison, TO, Moss, etc - though obviously it's a slightly different era).
Jarvis Landry is a good player but on another planet compared to what Beckham was prior to the last 2 years - which is why their cost of acquisition was so different in the first place.
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But I do a lot of reading and nowadays even more podcast listening about the Giants and I don't recall any of the negatives about Baker's work habits, or let's be blunt, his flat out stupidity, until after he was in the building. Au contraire, what I heard about Baker was that he was the best most ridiculously serious shut down man cover corner in college for two full years as a starter, in the SEC battling college's best WRs regularly.
I believe Sy pointed out some red flags. But I need to dig it up.
They were definitely there because I remember being pissed about taking Baker over Murphy when all we talked about is culture and turn around anc draft some guy with work ethic issues
I think people are very understating how bad Mayfield is. Which is not an excuse but he is terrible. And what BBI and the media said about him before does not mean jack shit right now.
All you been saying is a bunch of group talk not has no basis of fact.\
If you have personal experience that OBJ didn't put the work in to play in these games, even when he was show working out prior to the game and was game time decisions, please provide..
I don't deal with conspiracy theorist..
All you been saying is a bunch of group talk not has no basis of fact.\
If you have personal experience that OBJ didn't put the work in to play in these games, even when he was show working out prior to the game and was game time decisions, please provide..
I don't deal with conspiracy theorist..
Well that’s even worse. That means he just didn’t want to play. It’s a fucking muscle contusion. There isn’t any risk of further injury. Are you his cousin or something you are going to awfully long lengths to defend a guy that has worn out his welcome in two places.
How is that even a debate?
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Jarvis Landry 2019-2020: 64.8 yds/gm, 4.8 rec/gm, 6 TDs
Odell Beckham 2019-2020: 58.8 yds/gm, 4.2 rec/gm, 7 TDs
It's a 6 yard and half a reception difference between them per game - their numbers couldn't be much more identical than that.
Reread what I said (bolded).
In comment 15049236 Eric on Li said:
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Now he can't even match the productivity of Jarvis Landry in the exact same situational circumstances, which is striking because prior to the last 2 years Landry wasn't on the same planet as OBJ in terms of productivity.
OBJ prior to joining Cleveland was an elite WR. His NYG career average of 93 yards per game would be 2nd best all time behind Julio Jones and the 2 of them would be the only players above 90 yards per game. Ahead of Calvin Johnson, Deandre Hopkins, Antonio Brown, and Michael Thomas (as well as all time greats like Harrison, TO, Moss, etc - though obviously it's a slightly different era).
Jarvis Landry is a good player but on another planet compared to what Beckham was prior to the last 2 years - which is why their cost of acquisition was so different in the first place.
But that's not an accurate assessment of Jarvis Landry - when Cleveland acquired him they actually did believe he was on the same planet as Beckham. It's the reason why they gave him a contract that made him the 5th highest paid receiver in the league at the time.
And they weren't entirely wrong - Landry didn't have Beckham's stats while he was in Miami, but he was regarded as one of the better receivers in the league and was expected to continue growing in a new offense and with another QB throwing to him.
. . . that didn't happen, and that's the main point. Landry's production has actually fallen off some since arriving in Cleveland. There isn't ANY receiver that is excelling over there despite the level of talent that they have had on their offense. If you're trying to understand why Beckham's numbers have been so mediocre since leaving NY, you have to look at other variables.
OBJ prior to joining Cleveland was an elite WR.
He was in his first two seasons.. not right before he joined Cleveland.
The answer is because he was about to get a contract far richer than his actual impact. Comparing Jarvis Landry to OBJ simply because they both got paid is like comparing Olivier Vernon to Khalil Mack.
Also not sure what you are talking about in terms of Landry's performance being meaningfully different pre and post trade.
Jarvis Landry 4 years in MIA - 4k yards (63 yards per game)
Jarvis Landry 2.5 years in CLE - 2.5k (63 yards per game)
makes his career averages pretty easy to guess doesn't it? He is and always has been a solid 1k yard receiver. OBJ on the other hand was a potential HOF'er as a giant.
That's why even Landy's career best season (73 yards per game) is not that close to OBJ's averages with the Giants (93 yards per game). And if you say yards are overrated, ok, how about touchdowns?
In just his first 4.5 years with the Giants OBJ had 44 TDs.
In year 7 Landry is currently sitting on 32 TDs.
The only viable comparison between the 2 players is the diminished version of OBJ that's played for the Browns the past 2 years. Which is sort of the entire point. The Browns paid a HOF price via trade for what has been a lesser version of Jarvis Landry.
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OBJ prior to joining Cleveland was an elite WR.
He was in his first two seasons.. not right before he joined Cleveland.
He wasn't as good as his first 2 years but this is debateable. In 2016 and 2018 (his last 2 full seasons as a NYG) he averaged about 86 yards per game and was pacing towards 10 tds both years. 86 yards per game would still have him in the top 5 all time of ypg for a WR.
Completely agree he probably was no longer the guy averaging over 100 yards per game and 15+ touchdowns. That guy would have been the best WR of all time. But he was still a top 5-10 player at his position. The fall off outside the top 25 was not predictable.
I’m citing his time in Miami, this isn’t revisionist history. He has never been an elite WR, really not close to it. No YAC, limited scoring ability, lots of chain moving catches. Very good #2 WR, but that’s it.
Our own Steve smith had a better year in 2009 than any of Landry’s and Smith wasn’t a #1 either.
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because for whatever reason it's hard for people to accept that Baker Mayfield isn't very good.
I’m citing his time in Miami, this isn’t revisionist history. He has never been an elite WR, really not close to it. No YAC, limited scoring ability, lots of chain moving catches. Very good #2 WR, but that’s it.
Our own Steve smith had a better year in 2009 than any of Landry’s and Smith wasn’t a #1 either.