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NFT: NBA Free Agency Discussion Thread

Chris L. : 11/20/2020 8:00 am
I believe negotiations can start at 6:00pm today...I think I have that right. Let the madness begin!!!!!
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RE: I wouldnt be shocked  
SFGFNCGiantsFan : 11/21/2020 4:37 pm : link
In comment 15053178 nygiants16 said:
Quote:
if Knicks were still in talks with Rockets for Westbrook, seems odd Knicks havnt signed anyone besides Burks, even someone to a bloated 1 year deal


Westbrook as a Knick...I'd vomit.
RE: RE: RE: Knicks still have to spend at least 20 million  
Jon in NYC : 11/21/2020 4:38 pm : link
In comment 15053190 nygiants16 said:
Quote:
In comment 15053186 Strahan91 said:


Quote:


In comment 15053185 nygiants16 said:


Quote:


..


The cap floor doesn't kick in til the end of the season so they don't need to do anything before the season starts technically.



no but still seems weird they are leaving their space wide open and not doing anything


I hear you, but there's still plenty of time. I'm hoping they are more creative than just bringing in KCP for 1 year 15 mil. They should call the Hornets and offer to take on Batum for a 1st, for example.
Knicks  
TyreeHelmet : 11/21/2020 4:39 pm : link
Didn’t even offer FVV or meet with him. To me that’s inexcusable. Make him take less or Raptors pay more.

And if they planned on sitting out free agency- where have them been on these salary cap dump trades? The Knicks are by far the worst team at properly utilizing cap space. It’s hard to fathom.

But keep preaching cap flexibility...working out great.
Knicks-  
XBRONX : 11/21/2020 4:42 pm : link
faces change but same ole Knicks.
I keep thinking back to what Rasheed Wallace said  
ghost718 : 11/21/2020 4:45 pm : link
That the Knicks were taking on Leon Rose's baggage in hiring him.It was good point that I don't think many took in.

Who knows how long the enemy list is. I've never even met him and I already don't like him.
Rondo to  
SFGFNCGiantsFan : 11/21/2020 4:47 pm : link
The Hawks.
RE: Knicks  
Giantfan21 : 11/21/2020 4:49 pm : link
In comment 15053194 TyreeHelmet said:
Quote:
Didn’t even offer FVV or meet with him. To me that’s inexcusable. Make him take less or Raptors pay more.

And if they planned on sitting out free agency- where have them been on these salary cap dump trades? The Knicks are by far the worst team at properly utilizing cap space. It’s hard to fathom.

But keep preaching cap flexibility...working out great.


That is why i am in favor of taking salary dumps even if they drag for 2 or 3 years because nobody is coming here in FA anyway. You take the picks with the terrible contract and use the cap space to acquire assets at least instead of signing these pointless 1 year deal with mediocre vets year after year that gets you nowhere.

A deal like Wall for 2 or 3 unprotected 1st round picks i would do that in a heartbeat. Yeah it kills the cap going forward but its the assets that matter .
Who is offering wall for a handful of unprotected picks?  
Ten Ton Hammer : 11/21/2020 5:05 pm : link
.
knicks are so damned if they do damned if they dont....  
Italianju : 11/21/2020 5:15 pm : link
i mean what were people expecting? If they signed Hayward to that deal everyone would be going crazy about the overpay! Same with FVV since we would have had to pay him prolly 25 mill per to get him to leave TOR (at least). Would i have liked Augstine, sure, but its def not the end of the world we didnt pay him 7 per.

Knick fans love to say "just do a real rebuild, stop overpaying solid but not great players to huge money!". Then they dont sign Hayward and FVV and its "Same ole knicks".
The idea that the Wiz are going to attach a bunch of assets...  
Italianju : 11/21/2020 5:17 pm : link
to Wall is fiction. For just a second think why would WAS to do that? Capspace? Who was the last big FA to sign in WAS? They want to keep Beal, so they are going to make their team worse along with trading away multiple picks just to save money? A russ for wall deal at least made some sense (although barely) but they arent trading him Randle and DSJ. They have no reason to.
Just an example if something like that became an option  
Giantfan21 : 11/21/2020 5:19 pm : link
i would want the knicks to jump all over that and not worry how it affects the capspace over the next 3 years since nobody is coming here anyway.

Anyway, This is shaping up to be another Scott Perry offseason almost identical to last year. I have no idea why he wasnt fired along with Mills when Leon Rose came aboard.

Perry has never had a winning season anywhere hes been and has no idea how to construct a roster. He brings in Vets who take playing time away from the kids who need it instead of bringing in Vets who can help compliment them and help their game . He keeps capspace open for FA who never come instead of using it to take salary dumps to acquire assets.

When you have a terrible team you should prioritize and focus on development and that means giving young guys who are playing well in the Gleague a shot or young FA who need a change of scenery. Instead he signs older mediocre FA who only care about getting theirs while the young guys are either buried on the bench or frozen out on the court.

Truthfully it all goes back to Dolan anyway. Sam Presti was willing to listen and OKC was willing to let him walk but he rushed to sign Leon Rose and keep all his stooges at MSG who have been giving him the same shitty advice for 20 years instead . This team will never win a damn thing with Dolan . He will always hire the wrong people and even when he hires someone competent like Walsh, he has his cronies there to undermine him anyway
Elfrid back!  
Jon in NYC : 11/21/2020 5:21 pm : link
Everything is fine.
Melo back to Portland  
Anakim : 11/21/2020 5:21 pm : link
.
RE: Elfrid back!  
nygiants16 : 11/21/2020 5:22 pm : link
In comment 15053224 Jon in NYC said:
Quote:
Everything is fine.


if he could fricken shoot he would be damn good
I’m pleasantly surprised thus far.  
bceagle05 : 11/21/2020 5:23 pm : link
The second COVID wave will likely turn this 72 game schedule into a 50-60 game schedule. Perfect opportunity to throw the young guys out there and wait for next year’s stronger draft and free agency. I know it’s the same old song, but if they strike out next offseason they’ll get more aggressive in trades or something and field a competitive team. If we were expecting a full season with fans in the arena, they’d probably be doing that right now.

Also, keep in mind Toppin is NBA ready at 22 years old, at least offensively - unlike Frank, Knox and, to a lesser extent, RJ when they were rookies. He’ll play 30+ minutes and average 18 ppg.

And as I type this I see Melo’s in Portland and Scrub Payton is back on the cheap - even better.
So 24M left  
Anakim : 11/21/2020 5:24 pm : link
Will the Knicks look into Fox? I mean Perry did draft him in Sacramento.
RE: So 24M left  
Jon in NYC : 11/21/2020 5:25 pm : link
In comment 15053230 Anakim said:
Quote:
Will the Knicks look into Fox? I mean Perry did draft him in Sacramento.


He just signed a max extension
Elf was prolly the best option left...  
Italianju : 11/21/2020 5:25 pm : link
Teague most likely wanted to go to a contender (since nobody was paying him much i assume).

Well hopefully Frank made some strides and gets first crack at starting. Or maybe Quickly is an early surprise. So this is as of now? Yeesh.

Frank/Elf/Quickly/DSJ
Burks/bullock
RJ/Knox/ignas
Randle/Toppin
Mitch/Davis
only RFA i think they would even consider...  
Italianju : 11/21/2020 5:28 pm : link
is Bogdan, but im not sure how big the offer has to be for SAC not to match. Wonder if we could just work out a trade with SAC, i mean they obviously arent super interested in him returning. Wonder if they would like to save some money next season by dumping Joseph's 12 mill?
RE: RE: So 24M left  
Anakim : 11/21/2020 5:29 pm : link
In comment 15053231 Jon in NYC said:
Quote:
In comment 15053230 Anakim said:


Quote:


Will the Knicks look into Fox? I mean Perry did draft him in Sacramento.



He just signed a max extension



Oh, I missed that. I know he was in rumors a few days ago.
RE: Elf was prolly the best option left...  
Jon in NYC : 11/21/2020 5:30 pm : link
In comment 15053232 Italianju said:
Quote:
Teague most likely wanted to go to a contender (since nobody was paying him much i assume).

Well hopefully Frank made some strides and gets first crack at starting. Or maybe Quickly is an early surprise. So this is as of now? Yeesh.

Frank/Elf/Quickly/DSJ
Burks/bullock
RJ/Knox/ignas
Randle/Toppin
Mitch/Davis


It's actually a pretty decent frontcourt. But easily the worst backcourt in the NBA. Probably the worst starting PG AND SG, which is actually impressive.
So we spent  
Carl in CT : 11/21/2020 5:32 pm : link
$16 on Elf, Burks, and Davis? How about $16 on a good player once in awhile. Only thing I like is we should have $60m next year at least.
So Payton and Randle are going to play their  
Giantfan21 : 11/21/2020 5:34 pm : link
2 man game where theu freeze out the rest of the offense because they are extremely selfish basketball players ? This is horrible for RJ and OBI development
RE: So we spent  
Jon in NYC : 11/21/2020 5:34 pm : link
In comment 15053238 Carl in CT said:
Quote:
$16 on Elf, Burks, and Davis? How about $16 on a good player once in awhile. Only thing I like is we should have $60m next year at least.


If those are your 7-9 guys that's a fine bench. The problem is two of those guys are starters.
They're  
Jon in NYC : 11/21/2020 5:38 pm : link
still 15 mil under the floor, so I'm expecting a 1 year 15 mil deal for KCP to announced any minute now.
disappointed so far with how Rose and crew have played this FA.  
Strahan91 : 11/21/2020 5:41 pm : link
Payton just doesn't help the young guys at all, can't shoot and doesn't have a great feel for the game. I would've hoped they'd make a bigger push for another vet or jump into the trade market. If this was the plan, they should've made the deal LA did for Schroder.

I was also hoping (still am hoping I suppose) that they can find a way to offload Randle somehow. He's blocking Toppin and he drags everyone else down when he's on the court.

Where's the creativity? Essentially no one else has the cap space for a Bogdan offer. Why not see you can steal a good player like Bogdan with nothing to lose if SAC matches.

It does seem like we're trending towards going to go star hunting again next summer so that should go well.
Wasn't expecting a FVV level splash  
widmerseyebrow : 11/21/2020 5:43 pm : link
But was hoping for some kind of heady move for a decent stop gap starter that'd benefit the young guys. What is it with New York and point guards?
the issue with signing a RFA to a contract...  
Italianju : 11/21/2020 5:46 pm : link
is that your money gets held up until the team decides to match or not. Its why you dont see it very often. Now i mean what else are spending the money on, but still im guessing thats why they arent just giving him an offer.

Im just not ready to trash this FO right now. Do i want them to move Randle, of course. Do i want them to attach assets to move Randle, no. And im guessing the line of teams that want Randle is pretty short. Did i want a Hayward or FVV, yes but at 25-30 per for them its a hard pill to swallow. Especially if it wasnt going to be combined with another fairly large move.

Lastly, why do we need KCP? What is the difference between KCP, Bullock, and Burks? There has to be a team out there who would attach some young player at the end of their bench if we take a 15 mill expiring from them. At least the young player could be some lucky find, lol.
Yeah  
Jon in NYC : 11/21/2020 5:49 pm : link
I'm not really sure what people expected. Really the only other alternatives would have been to overpay for one or some combo of FVV/Hayward/Malik Beasley, which I feel like would have had a short term boost but probably hurts the team long term.
Mudiay is still available  
Anakim : 11/21/2020 5:50 pm : link
Haha



But seriously, what about Shaq Harrison?
If Randle is gone  
nygiants16 : 11/21/2020 5:52 pm : link
I dont mind Payton, he can run the offense and find open giys, his bigfest issue is it is hard to put him off the ball..

Surprised how many seemingly promising young guys are UFA  
Anakim : 11/21/2020 5:57 pm : link
Harry Giles
Frank Jackson
Thon Maker
Ante Zizic
Furkan Korkmaz
Skal
Cheick Diallo
I’m ok if they stay with the plan  
Carl in CT : 11/21/2020 5:57 pm : link
Now you can’t trade for westbrook unless you get assets.
I still would sign  
Carl in CT : 11/21/2020 5:59 pm : link
Giles. Could have huge upside. Give him minutes and see.
RE: I still would sign  
Anakim : 11/21/2020 6:01 pm : link
In comment 15053262 Carl in CT said:
Quote:
Giles. Could have huge upside. Give him minutes and see.


Honestly, if we can't be competitive this year, I don't see why not. Take a chance on some of those guys. No need to dumpster dive like we did last year and just hand out a bunch of one-year deals to middling veterans. Take a chance on a few young guys. Giles, Skal, Thon Maker...
How much  
UGADawgs7 : 11/21/2020 6:12 pm : link
Was Payton deal prior to re-negotiating?
RE: How much  
nygiants16 : 11/21/2020 6:14 pm : link
In comment 15053271 UGADawgs7 said:
Quote:
Was Payton deal prior to re-negotiating?


8 million
This is interesting.  
robbieballs2003 : 11/21/2020 6:17 pm : link

Tommy Beer
@TommyBeer
·
10m
Appears the Knicks may have signed Elf Payton using their room exception, which means NY still has upwards of $30 million in cap space (more than twice as much as any other team in the NBA).

Will be interesting to see if they make a run at restricted free agent Bogdan Bogdanovic
At least  
Spider43 : 11/21/2020 6:22 pm : link
We dodged a bullet with Carmela. Can't imagine Thibs would be happy with just Elf and the rest of the ragged point crew, but I'm fine with saving the bulk of our load for next offseason. On to training camp...
Any player woth some upside is worth a shot  
Italianju : 11/21/2020 6:25 pm : link
I mean they aren’t going to be expensive.
RE: This is interesting.  
UGADawgs7 : 11/21/2020 6:26 pm : link
In comment 15053274 robbieballs2003 said:
Quote:

Tommy Beer
@TommyBeer
·
10m
Appears the Knicks may have signed Elf Payton using their room exception, which means NY still has upwards of $30 million in cap space (more than twice as much as any other team in the NBA).

Am so confused how these exceptions work but that’s good.
Will be interesting to see if they make a run at restricted free agent Bogdan Bogdanovic
Could it be so much cause  
Carl in CT : 11/21/2020 6:29 pm : link
Mo signed somewhere? Did we get more room?
Looking forward to the Knicks trading for Hayward  
bubba0825 : 11/21/2020 6:32 pm : link
Taking on a bad contract for a 2nd round pick
RE: Looking forward to the Knicks trading for Hayward  
Anakim : 11/21/2020 6:35 pm : link
In comment 15053286 bubba0825 said:
Quote:
Taking on a bad contract for a 2nd round pick


Hayward signed with the Hornets
My understanding is  
Spider43 : 11/21/2020 6:41 pm : link
Teams can only use the exceptions (MLE, Room, and BAE) if they go over the cap for that given offseason. We'd have to eat into our cap first before being allowed use of these exceptions. Unless things have changed for this particular offseason.
RE: My understanding is  
robbieballs2003 : 11/21/2020 6:44 pm : link
In comment 15053297 Spider43 said:
Quote:
Teams can only use the exceptions (MLE, Room, and BAE) if they go over the cap for that given offseason. We'd have to eat into our cap first before being allowed use of these exceptions. Unless things have changed for this particular offseason.


Can't you trade for one? The NBA is so complex with their rules.
RE: RE: My understanding is  
Spider43 : 11/21/2020 6:54 pm : link
In comment 15053299 robbieballs2003 said:
Quote:
In comment 15053297 Spider43 said:


Quote:


Teams can only use the exceptions (MLE, Room, and BAE) if they go over the cap for that given offseason. We'd have to eat into our cap first before being allowed use of these exceptions. Unless things have changed for this particular offseason.



Can't you trade for one? The NBA is so complex with their rules.


Yes, the traded player exception... plus the disabled player exception (Klay), Larry Bird exception, minimum salary exception... indeed, complicated.
RE: My understanding is  
nygiants16 : 11/21/2020 7:00 pm : link
In comment 15053297 Spider43 said:
Quote:
Teams can only use the exceptions (MLE, Room, and BAE) if they go over the cap for that given offseason. We'd have to eat into our cap first before being allowed use of these exceptions. Unless things have changed for this particular offseason.


Yeah i think you need to use all your cap space first, so if it is being reported it is for the room exception, maybe the Knicks have a move where they are using all their space?
Cap  
31southst : 11/21/2020 7:16 pm : link
They probably agreed to the number that equals the exception if they go over, they use it if not just pay him the same amount out of cap space. Just a matter of semantics and sequencing.
RE: Cap  
Strahan91 : 11/21/2020 7:38 pm : link
In comment 15053313 31southst said:
Quote:
They probably agreed to the number that equals the exception if they go over, they use it if not just pay him the same amount out of cap space. Just a matter of semantics and sequencing.

This. It’s not a separate designation or anything like that. They only use the exception if they need to.
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