An interesting discussion of Daniel Jones' improvement

happened with Eli & Rueben Randle

In comment 15053471 mittenedman said:

Quote:

happened with Eli & Rueben Randle

I always felt like the same thing happened with Eli & Shockey as well. It always seemed like they were not on the same page and Eli tried to force the ball to him. In that infamous 07 Vikings game where Eli threw 4 Ints, 3 of those Ints were passes to Shockey, and all 3 of those were returned for TDs. I'd even go as far to say, I'm not sure we win in 07 if Shockey wasn't hurt

In comment 15053478 Scyber said:

Quote:

In comment 15053471 mittenedman said: Quote: happened with Eli & Rueben Randle I always felt like the same thing happened with Eli & Shockey as well. It always seemed like they were not on the same page and Eli tried to force the ball to him. In that infamous 07 Vikings game where Eli threw 4 Ints, 3 of those Ints were passes to Shockey, and all 3 of those were returned for TDs. I'd even go as far to say, I'm not sure we win in 07 if Shockey wasn't hurt

To be clear, I am not blaming all of those Ints on Shockey, but they clearly were not on the same page and Eli often tried to force it. Which I sometimes think DJ is trying to do with Engram.

It should be note, instead of not.

I see many things that I like...but he still shows stuff that is a concern.

I would vote holding off drafting another top QB.....for now

In comment 15053478 Scyber said:

Quote:

In comment 15053471 mittenedman said: Quote: happened with Eli & Rueben Randle I always felt like the same thing happened with Eli & Shockey as well. It always seemed like they were not on the same page and Eli tried to force the ball to him. In that infamous 07 Vikings game where Eli threw 4 Ints, 3 of those Ints were passes to Shockey, and all 3 of those were returned for TDs. I'd even go as far to say, I'm not sure we win in 07 if Shockey wasn't hurt

So interesting that you say this. Mentioned this story here a few years ago.

A while back, a good friend of mine was at a poker game with some friends. A now retired offensive lineman from the Shockey Eli era was there as well.

When asked how/why Eli improved as a QB, this player said once Shockey left, it all changed for the better for Eli.

He said Shockey would berate Eli in the huddle. One time even said "nice pass asshole" when the ball was not on target. HE said despite Shockey's talent, he disrupted the entire offense.

should have his fingers broken.

O-Line should be much improved, Saquon will be back, and I expect the Giants to add a few WR’s to the mix so he has weapons. No excuse at that point.

As mentioned in the story, Winston is 6 years into his career while Jones is in year 2. Winston had amazing talent surrounded him in Tampa while it is obvious Jones has not.

What wasn't mentioned in the article, was that Jones turnovers in the recent games (Dallas forward) were on 1st and 2nd downs. You can train someone to chuck it and live for another day. Very correctable.

Not interception related but something that I really want Jones to work on... throwing on the run. He has good top end speed but doesn't show the agility to make cuts as well as some of the other qb's in the league. While I don't expect that to change, I have seen big improvements in 1 offseason for quarterbacks like Peyton Manning and Matt Stafford for instance. This would open up the playbook tremendously.

In comment 15053522 Jerry K said:

Quote:

should have his fingers broken.

Agree. That was a painful read.

is attitude. Shockey would call out Eli or make arm motions, but thats not Engram. What’s common is the fact that the team is forcing the ball to them. Engram is supposedly a weapon, but I haven’t seen that side of him in this offense. Jones seems to want to get him the ball, but some of the passes were off the mark or through his hands which allowe defenders to make plays on the ball. I recall also a pitch to Engram, on a jet sweep, that ended up on the ground and ruled a fumble. They just can’t seem to connect well and it’s caused a good portion of Jones’s turnovers this year. Slayton on the other hand seems to be a solid connection with Jones.

Despite the overwriting. The comments about the Broncos and our own Erik Flowers at the end are worth scrolling down for. Thanks for linking.

Garett Bolles is having a very good season and will hit the FA market if the Broncos don't work out an extension or tag him. Hopefully the Broncos keep him because he would fill a big hole in Washington.

In comment 15053531 Bernie said:

Quote:

O-Line should be much improved, Saquon will be back, and I expect the Giants to add a few WR’s to the mix so he has weapons. No excuse at that point.

Agreed, I expect a few tweaks along the OL but I think it's safe to say that the starters will be Thomas, Peart, Gates, Hernandez, and Lemieux. It is possible that Zeitler returns but I think that the Giants will move on due to his cap number.

I think the line will take a big step forward next year due to all the young players gaining experience, get stronger, and begin to form a cohesive unit.

In 2021. That isn’t remotely palatable. You can release him with a very tolerable dead cap hit, start Lemieux and sign Tomlinson with that money. If you look at it as an unified set of transactions - which is only somewhat artificial - it is literally a no brainer.

In comment 15053574 Jay on the Island said:

Quote:

Garett Bolles is having a very good season and will hit the FA market if the Broncos don't work out an extension or tag him. Hopefully the Broncos keep him because he would fill a big hole in Washington.

Guy has made a LOT of money for himself this season. Rare to see the light go on so late for a guy - so good for him. Penalties were always an issue with him so I wonder how much he's been helped by the lessened holding calls this year.

Quote:

But, overall, he has played objectively well in 2020.

I don't really get this comment, to be honest. He's had 2-3 plus games this year and some really bad ones. He's looked much better the past few weeks, and I'm not writing him off. But I think he's been a bad quarterback on the whole so far this year.

In comment 15053540 FJ said:

Quote:

In comment 15053522 Jerry K said: Quote: should have his fingers broken. Agree. That was a painful read.

Thank God, I thought it was just me.

I don't think Engram's a bad kid. Just too inconsistent, doesn't seem to be getting better after 4 years.

In fairness to both of them. Shockey was a much better talent and a true TE. Excellent blocker, tough. Too bad he was such a jerk.

reasonable take. I take deal with long winded writing if the info is helpful :-)

In comment 15053631 Victor in CT said:

Quote:

I don't think Engram's a bad kid. Just too inconsistent, doesn't seem to be getting better after 4 years. In fairness to both of them. Shockey was a much better talent and a true TE. Excellent blocker, tough. Too bad he was such a jerk.

Yes, Engram is incredibly frustrating. In the second eagles' game he mhade an incredible one handed catch that did not count as it was a throwaway and he had no chance to get either foot down inbounds. Watching that I could not forget the throw in his hands that would have all but clinched the first eagles' game that he could not catch.

And Shockey undeniably had talent, yet getting rid of him was the best thing they could have done for the team, especially Eli. If Shockey had played in that Super Bowl instead of sitting in the stands drinking adult beverages, Brady, Belichick, and the Patriots would have had their undefeated season, 19-0. Losing Tiki and Shockey made them a much better team by allowing Eli to be a leader.

In comment 15053478 Scyber said:

Quote:

In comment 15053471 mittenedman said: Quote: happened with Eli & Rueben Randle I always felt like the same thing happened with Eli & Shockey as well. It always seemed like they were not on the same page and Eli tried to force the ball to him. In that infamous 07 Vikings game where Eli threw 4 Ints, 3 of those Ints were passes to Shockey, and all 3 of those were returned for TDs. I'd even go as far to say, I'm not sure we win in 07 if Shockey wasn't hurt

I always felt the same regarding Shockey and the SB

Engram is a coach and QB killer. Horrendous football player.

In comment 15053540 FJ said:

Quote:

In comment 15053522 Jerry K said: Quote: should have his fingers broken. Agree. That was a painful read.

Glad to see others had difficulty reading this bilge. I thought I was having some bidementia moments.

In comment 15053540 FJ said:

Quote:

In comment 15053522 Jerry K said: Quote: should have his fingers broken. Agree. That was a painful read.

Yeah, his jokes were terrible

Thought that DJ wasn't going to be the QB for the Giants next year?

Wow ...

horrible writing ... that author should never be linked to again.