This is the offseason where Barkley would expect to get paid. Zeke, McCaffrey and Kamara all signed their second contracts after their third season. The Giants can kick the can down the road by picking up his fifth year option, with the argument that they need to see how he recovers, but then you risk a real nasty situation next year if he plays well in 2021.
I think a lot of this depends on who is making the decision. Gettleman is not going to walk away from a guy he drafted second overall. Judge might. A new GM might. Hard to say unless we see a change made, I think that’s unlikely unless they go 2-4 or worse the rest of the way. Even 2-4 might be enough.
I would personally look to move him, curious about the rest of the board. So far we know he’s very talented but really only one spectacular year. 2019 was a disappointment, 2020 a total washout.
It’s a difficult decision but also one of the most important decisions this franchise will face in the near future.
Then decide what to do after that happens. Anything before then is rolling the dice - whether it's extending him or trading him.
By the time that expires, you'd think as a RB he'd be about ready to start the decline.
No need to do anything.
This.
No need to do anything.
Yeah, you let him play the next two years. If he doesn't stay healthy or doesn't look the same, you don't pay him. It's not rocket science. Paying guys like him, Kamara, and CMC, is not the same as paying the rest of the RBs elite money. What they bring to the table offensively is much different.
Let's see him stay healthy and storm through the league. We can tag him after that if we want.
Barkley is not stupid, he knows that he isn't getting a contract extension this offseason because of his knee injury.
I am convinced that Barkley and the Giants will have an agreement where they will offer him a fair extension next season once he proves that he is recovered from the knee injury. It will either happen midseason or after the year unless of course he isn't the same player that he was.
This 👆
This sums it up well.
Think about. It continues to play out where RBs just aren'r productive in the long run.
The OP mentions Zeke, McCaff and Kamara.
Zeke was the bell cow for Dallas. Now he can't outrun LBs, let alone having the gear to get by DBs. Last year, he longest run was 33 yards. This year it's 24 yards. If I'm Dallas, Pollard becomes much more of the feature RB.
McCaff is now experiencing the injury bug. Carolina got cute last year and were hell bent on getting him all of this statistical milestones. Now what? He can't get on the field. And Davis looks pretty decent as his replacement.
Kamara is a very good player, but the Saints smartly limit his touches. He's more of a hybrid guy. And they have smartly distributed almost the same number of carries to Latavius Murray.
Basically, only the Saints are getting a decent ROI on the RB investment.
Paying RBs big money is the height of idiocy. And when you you really analyze it, the big contract is usually based on services rendered and the high production rarely continues...
If he can come back healthy, it will be exciting to see what this staff can do as far as utilizing his strengths. Regardless of the fact that he's 230, utilizing him similar to Kamara with Gallman serving filling the Latavius Murray would be a better use of Barkley's skills, imo. Also haven't seen much of Barkley with above replacement-level run blocking, it would be extremely foolish to trade him now, imo.
Then trade him.
Just curious but are you sure Barks is a leader? This team doesn’t seem to have missed him much. Obviously his big play production, when it occurs, is exciting but is the team really any worse without him? Idk.
And as to “leadership”, I’m not sure the Giants have really missed him at all in that regard. Frankly not sure how important being a good person or leadership really is in the NFL. Look at Mixon, that dude is a total scumbag. Same thing for Hill in KC. I think maybe we like to believe that character counts but I’m not sure it does.
Also, it’s always a little hard to really know about the players character. I used to love rooting for Meggett and LT and those guys are total scumbags. Champions? Yes. Giants? Yes. Scumbags? Absolutely.
None of this is to say Barks isn’t a great guy. As far as any of us know he seems like a terrific young man. But, I don’t think that character is going to figure in to the decision to pick up his 5th year. And it certainly shouldn’t be part of any longer term deal. Just my two pennies.
Running style, carries, hits.
I do think zeke can a 2 more real productive yrs, he is only 25
Oline is poor for cowboys this yr too
New change of scenery maybe?
I would hope saquon shows enough that we can give him an extension that’s reasonable
Also with his Uber freaky talent, I expect him to perform well enough into his late 20’s
Use him like kamara, get him in space a little more. Keep carries 20 or less most games
Playoffs. Run the crap out of him
Give Barkley one more season to prove himself. No 5th year option. That would be hoping to get a cheap extra year out of him before you have to pay him. The options after 2021 will be the same as after 2022 with the 5th year option. If you give him a 5th year option, the odds are pretty good that he will underperform or get hurt in one of those seasons and you will be back in the same situation you are today.
That is a lot of mileage.
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play next year and hope he plays well. Then you try to trade him or cut your losses. Under no circumstance do you invest significant cap $'s to a RB (the same way you don't draft a RB at #2 overall). We already made one mistake, let's not exacerbate it.
This sums it up well.
Think about. It continues to play out where RBs just aren'r productive in the long run.
The OP mentions Zeke, McCaff and Kamara.
Zeke was the bell cow for Dallas. Now he can't outrun LBs, let alone having the gear to get by DBs. Last year, he longest run was 33 yards. This year it's 24 yards. If I'm Dallas, Pollard becomes much more of the feature RB.
McCaff is now experiencing the injury bug. Carolina got cute last year and were hell bent on getting him all of this statistical milestones. Now what? He can't get on the field. And Davis looks pretty decent as his replacement.
Kamara is a very good player, but the Saints smartly limit his touches. He's more of a hybrid guy. And they have smartly distributed almost the same number of carries to Latavius Murray.
Basically, only the Saints are getting a decent ROI on the RB investment.
Paying RBs big money is the height of idiocy. And when you you really analyze it, the big contract is usually based on services rendered and the high production rarely continues...
Zeke isn’t CMC, Kamara, or Barkley. He just barely had breakaway speed when he entered league and his offseason work habits are all over the map. What CMC, Kamara, and Barkley give you is completely different than the more traditional Zeke. Offensively they give you a lot more value because of what they open up. Zekes value is he can be out there all the time. Better to use those guys up for what you can.
Give Barkley one more season to prove himself. No 5th year option. That would be hoping to get a cheap extra year out of him before you have to pay him. The options after 2021 will be the same as after 2022 with the 5th year option. If you give him a 5th year option, the odds are pretty good that he will underperform or get hurt in one of those seasons and you will be back in the same situation you are today.
Football is a team sport. Put those guys in Giants offense and their stats suffer. The big question is how he comes back from this injury and how healthy he stays next two years. If he checks those boxes no reason not to give him a 3 year contract.
Even if he's lost a step, he'll still be the best back in the conference.
Dude is freak athlete, is there really anyone to compare him too? Peterson maybe? I really don't think anyone knows how long he will be effect in this league for.
Let it play out. If he really want a new contract, sign him at any time if the deal is team friendly (meaning they can get out of it a anytime without big dead money hit), the early they do it, the more team friendly it gets. But really what is best for both parties is to just let it play out and take it from there.
Do not trade him at his lowest point....ridiculous suggestion
If you want to use Zeke as a measuring stick for Barkley, note that Zeke is already starting to wear down in year 5 and he doesn't have Barkley's injury history.
Talking about Barkley as part of the long term plan is really premature; putting him in the HOF goes beyond premature and into crazy.
But I just don't think it will.
Just curious but are you sure Barks is a leader? This team doesn’t seem to have missed him much. Obviously his big play production, when it occurs, is exciting but is the team really any worse without him? Idk.
And as to “leadership”, I’m not sure the Giants have really missed him at all in that regard. Frankly not sure how important being a good person or leadership really is in the NFL. Look at Mixon, that dude is a total scumbag. Same thing for Hill in KC. I think maybe we like to believe that character counts but I’m not sure it does.
Also, it’s always a little hard to really know about the players character. I used to love rooting for Meggett and LT and those guys are total scumbags. Champions? Yes. Giants? Yes. Scumbags? Absolutely.
None of this is to say Barks isn’t a great guy. As far as any of us know he seems like a terrific young man. But, I don’t think that character is going to figure in to the decision to pick up his 5th year. And it certainly shouldn’t be part of any longer term deal. Just my two pennies.
Yes he is absolutely a leader as evidenced by him being a team captain for a second year in a row. Even though he is not playing this season he is still around and supporting the team.
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unless his knee injury was more severe than reported and he isn't the same player anymore. Barkley is a team leader and a great kid.
If he can come back healthy, it will be exciting to see what this staff can do as far as utilizing his strengths. Regardless of the fact that he's 230, utilizing him similar to Kamara with Gallman serving filling the Latavius Murray would be a better use of Barkley's skills, imo. Also haven't seen much of Barkley with above replacement-level run blocking, it would be extremely foolish to trade him now, imo.
The last three weeks I've seen the offensive line open big holes where the RB gets 10-12 yards and I am disappointed that Barkley isn't playing because several of those runs would have been long touchdowns. I am very excited to see what he does next season running behind this offensive line.
If you want to use Zeke as a measuring stick for Barkley, note that Zeke is already starting to wear down in year 5 and he doesn't have Barkley's injury history.
Talking about Barkley as part of the long term plan is really premature; putting him in the HOF goes beyond premature and into crazy.
I think #1 speaks more to how Barkley has been used thus far in his career vs. Zeke's pass-catching ability.
I totally agree on points 2 and 3. However, it's also premature to count the kid out. This team severely lacks top end talent and isn't particularly pressed for cap space so let's stop trying to push a 23 year old top 5 draft pick, and 2018 rookie of the year out the door.
Give Barkley one more season to prove himself. No 5th year option. That would be hoping to get a cheap extra year out of him before you have to pay him. The options after 2021 will be the same as after 2022 with the 5th year option. If you give him a 5th year option, the odds are pretty good that he will underperform or get hurt in one of those seasons and you will be back in the same situation you are today.
Year 3 doesn't count as a year, the OL was in flux and he got hurt after what 3 games?
Year 1 he was great
Year 2 he was just as good. He only played 13 games so he just ended up at a little over 1K yards, pretty much the same as 1.3K in 16 games.
Not sure what all of you are looking at.
Keep him, because like others said above selling low makes no sense. But after that it's on him to kick the door down and be what they drafted him to be. If he doesn't do that, trade him.
I don't think he'll be here more than a couple years. Is Judge going to get behind building the offense around one running back? Remember the system he came from in NE...NE is a fantasy football player's nightmare because every week it's a different back doing the work.
In the end I think it will boil down to three things:
1. Drafting a running back that high was a mistake
2. He had bad injury luck
3. When healthy he wasn't as good a player as was sold to the fans
Maybe ask him to cut his weight a bit, run a little lighter/leaner.
That dude had no OL, he was making yardage out of nothing.
I have a dream of watching this OL gel and start to show dominant traits. And then next year bringing in a healthy Barkley. My goodness.
Dude is freak athlete, is there really anyone to compare him too? Peterson maybe? I really don't think anyone knows how long he will be effect in this league for.
Let it play out. If he really want a new contract, sign him at any time if the deal is team friendly (meaning they can get out of it a anytime without big dead money hit), the early they do it, the more team friendly it gets. But really what is best for both parties is to just let it play out and take it from there.
The guy Barkley reminds me of most is Reggie Bush. Both drafted #2 with an insane, impossible to live up to amount of pre draft hype. To my amateur eyes a similar skill set, shifty, speed backs that make crazy cuts and highlight real plays and be very active in the pass game. Reggie Bush had a solid, ok career but nothing that ever came close to the hype (people were proclaiming he was going to be the best of all time before he played a down). Bounced around the league and is never mentioned at all any more and he hasn’t been gone that long.
That dude had no OL, he was making yardage out of nothing.
I have a dream of watching this OL gel and start to show dominant traits. And then next year bringing in a healthy Barkley. My goodness.
If you want to use Zeke as a measuring stick for Barkley, note that Zeke is already starting to wear down in year 5 and he doesn't have Barkley's injury history.
Talking about Barkley as part of the long term plan is really premature; putting him in the HOF goes beyond premature and into crazy.
If you think just looking at stats tells you this story, its unbelievable naive. CMC, Kamara, and Barkley are all guys you can run routes with. Zeke did a ton of damage in the passing game because other teams had to play man and run blitz to stop their all pro offensive line, opening up slip screens for big gains. Cmon man. I think it's way to early to be including Barkley in our long term plans, but you clearly already have your mind made up and are looking for stats to validate that opinion.
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Zeke has the same yards/catch as Barkley - 8.2 - in his 66 career games that Barkley does in his 31. So it's not like there's this great dimension that Barkley brings that Zeke doesn't. If anything, Zeke has brought things Barkley doesn't...availability and an ability to block. Barkley's a liability in the backfield on third down because everyone knows he can't block. Seeing him back there next to the QB is like an invitation to blitz. Saquon can clearly be more available and be a better blocker, but he only looks poor because at his size he should be much better. He shouldn't really be blocking in most sets anyway.
If you want to use Zeke as a measuring stick for Barkley, note that Zeke is already starting to wear down in year 5 and he doesn't have Barkley's injury history.
Talking about Barkley as part of the long term plan is really premature; putting him in the HOF goes beyond premature and into crazy.
If you think just looking at stats tells you this story, its unbelievable naive. CMC, Kamara, and Barkley are all guys you can run routes with. Zeke did a ton of damage in the passing game because other teams had to play man and run blitz to stop their all pro offensive line, opening up slip screens for big gains. Cmon man. I think it's way to early to be including Barkley in our long term plans, but you clearly already have your mind made up and are looking for stats to validate that opinion.
I'd be careful calling anyone naive; you're the one making a case based on...what is it based on?
1. stay healthy
2. learn how to block
3. learn to hit the hole hard. when a rusher broke through our OL this year Barkley would stop dead and look to juke. he needs to run through the first tackle and stop thinking of himself as the next Barry Sanders. the TFLs are drive killers (i know i'll get crap for this point, but go back and watch the first few games before Barkley got hurt).
based on actual production and availability to date there are a lot of former Giant RBs i'd be more comfortable with.
Hopefully he can make it through a full training camp and season with this new regime, just so we can have a better read on his ceiling.
Aside from who it is that makes any decision in the next two years, a factor in SB's future here will be just how proficient our OL becomes. If it remains at 2019 or (early) 2020 proficiency, SB's running style is contra-indicated.