for display only
Big Blue Interactive The Corner Forum  
Back to the Corner

Archived Thread

Gates - biggest surprise?

kennyd : 11/25/2020 9:00 pm
Just re watched the eagles game and focused on OL. He has to be the biggest surprise this year, right? C was a HUGE concern going into this season and he has more than held his own. I don't know how many people saw this coming but I sure didn't.
Pages: 1 2 | Show All |  Next>>
I was excited when Gates was moved to center  
Jay on the Island : 11/25/2020 9:05 pm : link
I thought that he would be solid there but it would take time. I wasn’t expecting him to be this good so quickly. He has made noticeable improvements each game. I can’t wait to see how he does next year with a full offseason of preparation.

Gettleman made a great move by signing Gates to that extension before the season.
Yeah, have to agree.  
section125 : 11/25/2020 9:15 pm : link
Former tackle. Nasty player. Tough ass SOB. He was the feet. Love when he pulls. Still looks a little undersized, but love him.
Gates  
Giants : 11/25/2020 9:15 pm : link
has been better than I expected. Truth is DG moves are paying off
He's arguably the offensive MVP...  
bw in dc : 11/25/2020 9:48 pm : link
I can't believe how well he's played, especially lately.

The once human turnstile is now a competitive, reliable interior OL.
RE: Yeah, have to agree.  
Jay on the Island : 11/25/2020 9:56 pm : link
In comment 15056939 section125 said:
Quote:
Former tackle. Nasty player. Tough ass SOB. He was the feet. Love when he pulls. Still looks a little undersized, but love him.

He is taller than most centers but he can add about 10lbs this offseason which I expect him will now that he knows he isn’t playing outside. The best part is that Gates can play all 5 OL positions. If the Giants wanted they could move him over to guard in the future but I doubt that happens because of how well he is playing at center but it just adds to his value.

When it came to finding a solid starting offensive lineman among UDFA’s or late round picks the Giants were long overdue. Now it appears that they have two with Gates and Lemieux.
The Giants knew they had something with Gates.  
Giant John : 11/25/2020 10:23 pm : link
Now he is developing nicely. Could also play other positions on the line.
Plays with a streak of mean and versatile.
RE: The Giants knew they had something with Gates.  
Jay on the Island : 11/25/2020 10:30 pm : link
In comment 15056956 Giant John said:
Quote:
Now he is developing nicely. Could also play other positions on the line.
Plays with a streak of mean and versatile.

The Giants did a great job of hiding their intentions leading up to the draft. Most expected the Giants to draft a center early because all they had was Pulley. When they didn’t there was speculation that Lemieux might be moved to center but that was quickly proven false in camp as he had little to no practice time at center.
Jay...  
bw in dc : 11/25/2020 10:38 pm : link
Do you think Olave will come out early for your Buckeyes?
RE: Jay...  
Jay on the Island : 11/25/2020 11:27 pm : link
In comment 15056963 bw in dc said:
Quote:
Do you think Olave will come out early for your Buckeyes?

You’re confusing me with another Jay
Aaron Donald treats ALL offensive centers like. ..  
Manny in CA : 11/26/2020 1:40 am : link

Meat grinders treat chuck roast. When Gates stood up to him, I was a lot more than surprised - delighted is the word.
He did play well last season at both guard and tackle. Center was a  
Ira : 11/26/2020 4:48 am : link
new position for him, so it made sense that it would take him time to learn the position - especially after the covid shortened pre-season.
I thought he would be servicable  
Mark from Jersey : 11/26/2020 6:48 am : link
he has been more than that.

The tackles look good, Lemieux looks good...what I am more excited about it not spending premium picks on the OL this year with needs at EDGE, CB, WR, TE. Wouldnt mind picking up another OL if there is value in the later rounds but I would really like to get some help at the skill positions on both D & O early this coming draft.
RE: RE: Yeah, have to agree.  
Fred-in-Florida : 11/26/2020 7:01 am : link
In comment 15056947 Jay on the Island said:
Quote:
In comment 15056939 section125 said:


Quote:


Former tackle. Nasty player. Tough ass SOB. He was the feet. Love when he pulls. Still looks a little undersized, but love him.


He is taller than most centers but he can add about 10lbs this offseason which I expect him will now that he knows he isn’t playing outside. The best part is that Gates can play all 5 OL positions. If the Giants wanted they could move him over to guard in the future but I doubt that happens because of how well he is playing at center but it just adds to his value.

When it came to finding a solid starting offensive lineman among UDFA’s or late round picks the Giants were long overdue. Now it appears that they have two with Gates and Lemieux.


I agree it's about time we we're able to hit on a free agent OL.

On a different note. I saw the other night where Remmers was the starting Tackle for the Chiefs.
More important  
Aaroninma : 11/26/2020 7:27 am : link
He is improving. Whoever is working with him is getting results. Hes mean, nasty and also seems to be a leader.
RE: More important  
Mark from Jersey : 11/26/2020 7:56 am : link
In comment 15056999 Aaroninma said:
Quote:
He is improving. Whoever is working with him is getting results. Hes mean, nasty and also seems to be a leader.
The whole OL is improving, Gates moreso than the others, but is great to see. Most of us came into the season with minimal expectations...its just great to see the team trying hard and improving each week!
RE: More important  
Spider56 : 11/26/2020 8:06 am : link
In comment 15056999 Aaroninma said:
Quote:
He is improving. Whoever is working with him is getting results. Hes mean, nasty and also seems to be a leader.


Let’s hope the guy who worked with him to get to this level is still on the payroll.
Reminds me of Diehl  
Lines of Scrimmage : 11/26/2020 8:28 am : link
Put him somewhere and he will figure it out and at least give you serviceable performance. Hopefully he continues to grow in the position and stays healthy. Tough, smart the someone who can be part of a very good OL. Really nice find by that coach from Nebraska on Shurmurs staff.
I figured at some point this summer they were going to deal  
LBH15 : 11/26/2020 8:34 am : link
for a real Center and move Gates to right tackle or backup Guard. He really has been a nice surprise and hopefully it continues.

I sure got that one wrong.
I hate doing this because a lot of times it doesn't work out that way.  
mittenedman : 11/26/2020 8:38 am : link
Thomas (22)
Hernandez (26)
Gates (26)
Lemieux (24)
Peart (24)

Those are the ages next year. All of these guys are going to be established players with a full season working together under their belts. If all goes well, this could be one of the best OLines in the NFL next year.
I usually take a few months yearly sabbatical  
Big Blue '56 : 11/26/2020 8:40 am : link
from BBI given the insufferability of the place at times. It was hastened this year by definitive comments made here even though we had new coaches, players, no pre-season ( all teams went through that, but many had their staffs in place) to speak of and no games to prepare for the season. Effectively, our regular season began after the first 4 games..

After 1 or 2 games, the brutality towards Gates, knowing full well this was an alien position for him, was just egregious..it was also that way for other players and even coaches. At that point, I realized I had to get the fuck out of here, wait for the season to TAKE HOLD and then see what we had..

I had no idea how Gates would do, but I did know, that in time we’d get a sense, perhaps a strong one, whether or not he was or had a chance to be the goods.

I’m thrilled with the guy..

Be safe for Thanksgiving..
BTW RE: Hernandez  
mittenedman : 11/26/2020 8:41 am : link
He took a lot of heat, me included. The OL instantly improved when Lemieux stepped in at LG. Problem is - it sounds like that was also when Judge took a more hands-on approach.

Looking forward to seeing what the starting OL is, coming out of the bye!
DG  
joeinpa : 11/26/2020 8:51 am : link
Has had a good year
RE: I usually take a few months yearly sabbatical  
Jay on the Island : 11/26/2020 9:22 am : link
In comment 15057018 Big Blue '56 said:
Quote:
from BBI given the insufferability of the place at times. It was hastened this year by definitive comments made here even though we had new coaches, players, no pre-season ( all teams went through that, but many had their staffs in place) to speak of and no games to prepare for the season. Effectively, our regular season began after the first 4 games..

After 1 or 2 games, the brutality towards Gates, knowing full well this was an alien position for him, was just egregious..it was also that way for other players and even coaches. At that point, I realized I had to get the fuck out of here, wait for the season to TAKE HOLD and then see what we had..

I had no idea how Gates would do, but I did know, that in time we’d get a sense, perhaps a strong one, whether or not he was or had a chance to be the goods.

That exposed who truly understands football and those who don’t. Gates and Andrew Thomas did not have any offseason practice time coming into training camp that players usually have. Gates had never played center in a game before this season and some wrote him off after he struggled week one versus a very tough, and 10-0, experienced, and talented Steelers defense. They also ignored his improved performance the next game against another tough defense in Chicago.

Gettleman deserves criticism for many of his decisions but the guy knows how to build an offensive line. Jerry Reese did not find a single starting caliber offensive lineman among day 3 picks or UDFA’s. Gettleman has already brought in two.
So he knew how to build an Offensive Line  
LBH15 : 11/26/2020 9:38 am : link
in 2018 and 2019 or did he just forget in those years?
RE: So he knew how to build an Offensive Line  
fireitup77 : 11/26/2020 11:11 am : link
In comment 15057044 LBH15 said:
Quote:
in 2018 and 2019 or did he just forget in those years?


It takes time. He did sign gates in year one. To bad he got hurt. He also drafted hernandez that year. Zietler trade was year two.
LBH15  
Giants : 11/26/2020 11:15 am : link
So he knew how to build an Offensive Line
LBH15 : 9:38 am : link : reply
in 2018 and 2019 or did he just forget in those years?

Solid 8 years Giants had a horrible OL. In three years you can count what could be 6 players who could start and a 7th player that could endup being a quality backup. It was not just the starters on the Giants OL their backups for backups were terrible. To get that much of a overhaul in three years DG did a good job. You can easy up on the hating now
RE: So he knew how to build an Offensive Line  
Jay on the Island : 11/26/2020 11:19 am : link
In comment 15057044 LBH15 said:
Quote:
in 2018 and 2019 or did he just forget in those years?

You’re right he should have had it fixed immediately when he arrived. All he needed to do was bring in a LT, LG, C, RG, and RT with little cap room. Let’s not forget that the Giants had an aging franchise QB in place with no successor on the roster plus holes at DE, CB, S, CB, WR, ILB, and OLB. As we all know it’s so easy to build an entire OL in just 1-2 years while also finding a new franchise QB.

It took the Colts about 5 years to build their OL while investing three 1st round picks and a 2nd on the OL. Dallas didn’t build their OL in a year. It took several seasons while also using multiple high picks.

The Solder signing was a terrible decision but the Giants were desperate after losing out on Norwell(another Gettleman UDFA find)in FA.
Guys - I am not suggesting he needed to go build the  
LBH15 : 11/26/2020 11:40 am : link
great wall of china immediately. But he was basically hired because his predecessor failed at this singular topic and was fired. And DG made it one of his top goals touting it from the mountain top on day 1. yet he failed miserably at it for two years resulting in a change at QB, OC and Head Coach.

Finally, in desperation, he sees the writing on the wall and invests heavily in the OL in the 2020 draft and hopefully the Giants are seeing some of that investment take hold.

So my remark is completely valid, especially when it was made just in response to a poster touting "this guy knows how to build an offensive line". Happy the Oline is moving forward but let's be real as to the actual steps taken to get there.

RE: RE: So he knew how to build an Offensive Line  
LBH15 : 11/26/2020 11:45 am : link
In comment 15057105 Jay on the Island said:
Quote:
In comment 15057044 LBH15 said:


Quote:


in 2018 and 2019 or did he just forget in those years?


You’re right he should have had it fixed immediately when he arrived. All he needed to do was bring in a LT, LG, C, RG, and RT with little cap room. Let’s not forget that the Giants had an aging franchise QB in place with no successor on the roster plus holes at DE, CB, S, CB, WR, ILB, and OLB. As we all know it’s so easy to build an entire OL in just 1-2 years while also finding a new franchise QB.



And not for nothing, I agree with situation and your shopping list above Jay.

Exactly why you actually don't pick a shiny new running back with the overall #2 pick as a strategy.
RE: Aaron Donald treats ALL offensive centers like. ..  
PJCdude : 11/26/2020 11:49 am : link
In comment 15056982 Manny in CA said:
Quote:

Meat grinders treat chuck roast. When Gates stood up to him, I was a lot more than surprised - delighted is the word.


I think that was a real turning point. Was so happy to see that.
Agree. Gates has been a wonderful surprise  
Rick in Dallas : 11/26/2020 11:52 am : link
Center position now set with Gates.
Second biggest surprise for me is how well Peppers is playing the last month. Give props to Coach Graham for figuring out how to maximize Peppers talents.
RE: Guys - I am not suggesting he needed to go build the  
fireitup77 : 11/26/2020 11:52 am : link
In comment 15057111 LBH15 said:
Quote:
great wall of china immediately. But he was basically hired because his predecessor failed at this singular topic and was fired. And DG made it one of his top goals touting it from the mountain top on day 1. yet he failed miserably at it for two years resulting in a change at QB, OC and Head Coach.

Finally, in desperation, he sees the writing on the wall and invests heavily in the OL in the 2020 draft and hopefully the Giants are seeing some of that investment take hold.

So my remark is completely valid, especially when it was made just in response to a poster touting "this guy knows how to build an offensive line". Happy the Oline is moving forward but let's be real as to the actual steps taken to get there.


You are seeing too imply he did nothing for three years. He signed the best OT on the market in year one. His play feel off a cliff since. He drafted his LG year one in round 2. He signed a couple of UDFA year one too. Both got hurt. One started at center year two. Got hurt in the last game and wasn't brought back. Another one played some at RT and guard in year two and is the topic of this thread.

In year two hw traded a guy that was about to be cut for a RG that is probably the best player on this line.

This year value matched draft position and he added two tackles and a guard that have looked the part.

It's obvious that you hate DG and want him gone. I think you are going to be disappointed when he is here to finish the job.
Fire - trying to build an oline and failing at it  
LBH15 : 11/26/2020 11:58 am : link
because the guys you brought in got worse, were bad anyway or got injured doesn't give you a pass. This is the singular most important part of rebuilding this team.

And I don't like DG because he makes too many bad decisions with the roster. Not that he doesn't have some good ones, just far too many bad ones.
easily  
bc4life : 11/26/2020 12:08 pm : link
without question. last year's swing tackle.
RE: Fire - trying to build an oline and failing at it  
fireitup77 : 11/26/2020 12:14 pm : link
In comment 15057126 LBH15 said:
Quote:
because the guys you brought in got worse, were bad anyway or got injured doesn't give you a pass. This is the singular most important part of rebuilding this team.

And I don't like DG because he makes too many bad decisions with the roster. Not that he doesn't have some good ones, just far too many bad ones.


Are you saying that solder wasn't a good player before coming here? If we will have to agree to disagree. You can't blame injuries on the gm. My point is in year one he brought in our starting LG and center. Year two he brought in our starting RG.

He never forgot how to build an OL. It just took him a couple years. Like it does for most teams.

Oh and in those three years years he has also built a very good DL, found some guys that could play LB, and bike 3/4 of a solid secondary. He might of found us a franchise QB too.

Now every decision he has made has not been the correct one. But overall this team is headed in the right direction and DG deserves credit for it.
Anyone think our previous staff  
UConn4523 : 11/26/2020 12:18 pm : link
get Gates to C let alone preps him to excel at it?

I don’t. And it’s why I don’t look at DGs roster moves from previous seasons as complete fails. Coaching matters, we keep seeing why.
You are expanding this when not needed. The comment  
LBH15 : 11/26/2020 12:21 pm : link
was made that you can "criticize DG for certain things but the guy knows how to build an offensive line". As if he is so good at it that it is worth denoting.

And imv he is not very good at it. And the facts of the last several years support that.
the hate for DG  
Giants : 11/26/2020 12:29 pm : link
is over the top by some. Has he upgraded the OL, yes. Did some of trades he made look bad, yes they did. Has most of those trades turned-out to be right, yes they have. So while at the time he took a lot of heat. Time has shown he was right. Over all DG has drafted well and made some good trades. Some fans need to take another look and realize some of his moves just took a little time to show the Giants are moving in the right direction
RE: You are expanding this when not needed. The comment  
fireitup77 : 11/26/2020 12:30 pm : link
In comment 15057135 LBH15 said:
Quote:
was made that you can "criticize DG for certain things but the guy knows how to build an offensive line". As if he is so good at it that it is worth denoting.

And imv he is not very good at it. And the facts of the last several years support that.


Yes because it's easy to change an entire oline in one season. He sucks because he didn't rebuild the line in one offseason. Got ya.
RE: Anyone think our previous staff  
Spider56 : 11/26/2020 12:31 pm : link
In comment 15057134 UConn4523 said:
Quote:
get Gates to C let alone preps him to excel at it?

I don’t. And it’s why I don’t look at DGs roster moves from previous seasons as complete fails. Coaching matters, we keep seeing why.


+1 ... I originally thought that having Pat Shurmur as the HC, being a former offensive center would help him at least see talent at the position, and know how to pick a good OL coach. Man was I wrong.
Man, you all are stubborn with this one  
LBH15 : 11/26/2020 12:37 pm : link
and not seeing what an awful process it has been to just get to a functioning OL in year 3 that is still a pretty damn big work-in-progress.

It's not something that anybody should be saying our GM has been good at.
He did start builiding the OL right away  
PatersonPlank : 11/26/2020 1:56 pm : link
Young players don't magically play great on day 1, and the full OL transition isn't magically done on day 1. He did start the process right away.

Nothing happens immediately on day 1. No the narrative has changed from DG hasn't built an OL, to DG took too long (as if 2 years is too long).
I’m not being stubborn  
UConn4523 : 11/26/2020 2:22 pm : link
we are seeing what good coaching is doing. And outside of Thomas, the talent on the line is really no different. It’s reasonable to assume that if we had a quality coaching staff earlier (something that’s his fault), that some of his personnel moves would have worked better.
RE: I’m not being stubborn  
LBH15 : 11/26/2020 3:42 pm : link
In comment 15057168 UConn4523 said:
Quote:
we are seeing what good coaching is doing. And outside of Thomas, the talent on the line is really no different. It’s reasonable to assume that if we had a quality coaching staff earlier (something that’s his fault), that some of his personnel moves would have worked better.


Wasn't referring to you. You're only stubborn on other threads :-)
RE: He did start builiding the OL right away  
LBH15 : 11/26/2020 3:43 pm : link
In comment 15057161 PatersonPlank said:
Quote:
Young players don't magically play great on day 1, and the full OL transition isn't magically done on day 1. He did start the process right away.

Nothing happens immediately on day 1. No the narrative has changed from DG hasn't built an OL, to DG took too long (as if 2 years is too long).


I think some of you fell asleep for a few years.

But I applaud your patience. :-)
Haters will hate  
Giants : 11/26/2020 3:46 pm : link
Giants OL has more talent than it has had in many years. Haters will never allow themselves to see that. Just like they refuse to now see trades that DG made have worked-out in the Giants favor. This team still has needs nobody is saying it doesn't. Does DG have this team going in the right direction, yes he does
Love how  
PJCdude : 11/26/2020 4:37 pm : link
A positive thread about the improvement of nick gates who’s a very likeable young key cog in this offense turns into another trash Gettleman thread. I don’t love the guy either but hey the OL is finally getting some life and that doesn’t happen if he didn’t emphasize that in the draft.
Although it didn’t.  
LBH15 : 11/26/2020 4:42 pm : link
Some of you need to see and think thru things objectively, without viewing everything as unfounded shots at the NYG.

Or don’t...whatever.

An Some  
Giants : 11/26/2020 5:54 pm : link
need to see when their dead wrong
RE: An Some  
LBH15 : 11/26/2020 6:50 pm : link
In comment 15057232 Giants said:
Quote:
need to see when their dead wrong


Umm...wrong at what?

You just like calling people haters. Probably a blast at parties.
Pages: 1 2 | Show All |  Next>>
Back to the Corner