Leo will want 20 mill, i would definitely pick him over Dalvin Tomlinson. Tomlinson is easy replaceable with a 2nd pick, leo was clearly picked 1st round for a reason
We traded for him without an extension in place so we're just boosting the price tag of an impending FA. Could have locked him up for cheap and now we have to either overpay to keep him or let him walk. Great move!
We traded for him without an extension in place so we're just boosting the price tag of an impending FA. Could have locked him up for cheap and now we have to either overpay to keep him or let him walk. Great move!
He wanted to be paid top edge rusher money, its why they had to franchise tag him which is top dollar for your position and he still took them to court to be paid for more. Giants really had no choice but to play him another year dince he wasnt interest in team friendly nose tackle money
He have stated in multiple interviews that he loves this team, clearly a leader and playmaker. Even with McKinney they gatta find a way to have both olus peppers on the field
RE: But that’s was a bad roughing the QB move on the TD drive.
No reason for it at all ... must have been the Gregg Williams coaching coming out of him.
After watching the replay, I thought that was a pretty ticky tacky call. The fact that it stopped the clock I thought hurt even more than the 15 yards tacked on.
A player having his best season in his contract year is a red flag...
I'd generally agree, but this situation is a bit different. DG reportedly traded for him because they believed he was being completely misused for the Jets. Gets traded here and he played well, but the sacks were missing because the back end coverage sucked and our edge rushers were pathetic in their discipline. At least our edge guys still keep contain, even though they barely get push or penetration.
yes he keeps driving the price of the franchise tag up
Leo will want 20 mill, i would definitely pick him over Dalvin Tomlinson. Tomlinson is easy replaceable with a 2nd pick, leo was clearly picked 1st round for a reason
The thing is, if the cap wasn't taking a major hit, he'd get 20 million. After seeing all the numbers, I think he hits 18 million. The problem is he may have leverage, there are teams with a ton of money and he would undoubtedly be one of the better jewels in FA.
He does sound he like loves to be here, so maybe he takes 18.
Although, based on his negotiations to date, it seems like he wants to be shown that paper. The difference was he was looking for 18 last year apparently correct?
Love those saying hes only playing well because its a contract year
Well, it was a contract year for him last year too
So yeah
And the giants have the option of making next year...yet another contract year!
Have we not noticed its the same posters that think they are the oracles of football knowledge, who are wrong just as often as they're right but are rarely called on it.
Same posters claim they own it when they are wrong, but never do.
RE: RE: Love those saying hes only playing well because its a contract year
I believe his position is that since both years were contract years it's a horseshit excuse as to why he has more sacks this year.
If it was that easy to just turn it on in a contract year, why didn't he do so last year?
LW is getting a second bite at the apple after switching teams mid-year. He didn't get the big contract he wanted, got tagged, and now is taking advantage of opportunity #2.
RE: RE: RE: RE: Love those saying hes only playing well because its a contract year
I believe his position is that since both years were contract years it's a horseshit excuse as to why he has more sacks this year.
If it was that easy to just turn it on in a contract year, why didn't he do so last year?
LW is getting a second bite at the apple after switching teams mid-year. He didn't get the big contract he wanted, got tagged, and now is taking advantage of opportunity #2.
Dude you have NO point. As usual. The guy played very well for us last year too. Our coverage schemes are better this year and as such, his hurries are turning into sacks.
You need to stop. Jints Central is fielding a team that is playing above their talent level and making all of your horseshit theories look dumb as ever.
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: Love those saying hes only playing well because its a contract year
I believe his position is that since both years were contract years it's a horseshit excuse as to why he has more sacks this year.
If it was that easy to just turn it on in a contract year, why didn't he do so last year?
LW is getting a second bite at the apple after switching teams mid-year. He didn't get the big contract he wanted, got tagged, and now is taking advantage of opportunity #2.
Dude you have NO point. As usual. The guy played very well for us last year too. Our coverage schemes are better this year and as such, his hurries are turning into sacks.
You need to stop. Jints Central is fielding a team that is playing above their talent level and making all of your horseshit theories look dumb as ever.
Agreed, one of the best things is availability...he has been healthy and always playing his best. Even in the jets he was always all over the ball, very high effort player. I firmly believe he will only get better playing with more years under graham. In interviews he has said none of the players believed in the system and did their own thing, now tou see the defense is all firm believers of Judge even all quoting his 1 game at a time philosophy
None of the players believed the system for the jets
But the guy is a stud. Hybrid DE/DT who reminds me of a DT version of Justin Tuck. I think he’s the top FA priority, if you add a stud edge rusher I think Williams is able to take it to another level.
There’s never been a question in my mind that Williams is a good player. The question was and is can the Giants and Williams come to terms, and pencil him in as a cornerstone of the defense for a championship run.
The two sides clearly couldn’t come to a number last year. Hopefully they can this offseason.
For me, the worst outcome for the Giants would be tagging him again, with no future control. If the Giants pay a guy 36M+ fully guaranteed, it’s insanity to get only 2 years of team control.
You acquire the good player for a draft pick. However it doesn’t end with the draft pick. You have to resign that player and if you can’t, it’s a 17m price tag to rent him for a year. That’s 17m you can’t spend on a free agent (ie Conklin). So you float that acquisition another year on a loan.. Worst case...he stinks and you let him walk. So you burnt a top 70 pick on nothing. Best case...he plays well and you have to sign him to a monster contract. It looks like we’re heading down that road...at the expense of another player that was already on the roster in Dalvin Tomlinson who should probably be allowed to walk if we’re signing Williams. So you slightly upgraded for versatility at a higher market cap number and a 1 yr cap killing bridge. You “win” but at best paid about what he’s worth to get there.
He wanted to be paid top edge rusher money, its why they had to franchise tag him which is top dollar for your position and he still took them to court to be paid for more. Giants really had no choice but to play him another year dince he wasnt interest in team friendly nose tackle money
Then you don't trade for him and sign him at market value of the time, which wasn't very high coming off a couple lackluster seasons with the Jets. Good on the Giants for recognizing potential that wasn't showing up in the stat column, but why trade a draft pick to eliminate your contract leverage?
get him signed up already since he played well last year and is the vision for how this GM is building the team? Had from Oct 2019 to July 2020 to get it done for Pete’s sake...what was the problem?
So now the Giants have to overpay even more because he is accumulating some sacks?
Moronic
Strange trade at the time and still tough to justify
But the guy is a stud. Hybrid DE/DT who reminds me of a DT version of Justin Tuck. I think he’s the top FA priority, if you add a stud edge rusher I think Williams is able to take it to another level.
I was hard on the trade, but am very happy to see him
playing this well this year. If he was playing this well last season, I wouldn't have been as hard on the trade. Hell, if LW was playing this well on the Jets they might not have traded him in the first place. Either way, I'm happy to see him become a force and really hope we can retain for a decent, not crazy, contract.
Ok this what ask yourself, would trade a 3rd round pick to make the playoffs? Of course!! When we make the playoffs this year, it will be because our best defensive player helped us get there. Yes it was a strange trade at the time, but Leo probably would not ever be a Giant, or we would have to over pay him last off season. We probably will have to sign him for a deal around 80m over 5 years, but like the draft picks to get him, it will be money well spent. Just because we resign him, doesn't mean we can't pay Tomlinson too.
Will help negotiations go more smoothly. I also think a lot of credit should be given to his position coach who said he’d chase Leo down himself if he didn’t get to the qb and get the sacks. To his credit, he is.
All signs point to everyone wanting this marriage to work.
There’s never been a question in my mind that Williams is a good player. The question was and is can the Giants and Williams come to terms, and pencil him in as a cornerstone of the defense for a championship run.
The two sides clearly couldn’t come to a number last year. Hopefully they can this offseason.
For me, the worst outcome for the Giants would be tagging him again, with no future control. If the Giants pay a guy 36M+ fully guaranteed, it’s insanity to get only 2 years of team control.
This is a silly take I cannot understand. Who cares whether money is guaranteed or not if it's a 1 year deal and the player isn't getting cut under any circumstance. It's completely irrelevant.
The choice is have LW at a fair AAV or don't. It's binary. And a simple, obvious decision just as it was this year (if they can't agree on an extension).
There’s never been a question in my mind that Williams is a good player. The question was and is can the Giants and Williams come to terms, and pencil him in as a cornerstone of the defense for a championship run.
The two sides clearly couldn’t come to a number last year. Hopefully they can this offseason.
For me, the worst outcome for the Giants would be tagging him again, with no future control. If the Giants pay a guy 36M+ fully guaranteed, it’s insanity to get only 2 years of team control.
This is a silly take I cannot understand. Who cares whether money is guaranteed or not if it's a 1 year deal and the player isn't getting cut under any circumstance. It's completely irrelevant.
The choice is have LW at a fair AAV or don't. It's binary. And a simple, obvious decision just as it was this year (if they can't agree on an extension).
This is definitely not a binary situation. There are plenty of variable involved in judging this deal. "Fair AAV" is the ability to sign him at his peak market value...which is where we are right now.
So yeh, it's binary. In that vain, it's always been binary. That was always the prize after acquiring him for a high draft pick - the ability to sign him at whatever his current market value was or let him walk. A year ago, he was playing well but not in the stat column...so it was "overpay a potential guy" or lease to buy at the low cost of 17 million for one year. Well the great news is he played well, the bad news is we're not forced to buy at his peak value. That's the fault in the trade.
A player having his best season in his contract year is a red flag...
He wanted to be paid top edge rusher money, its why they had to franchise tag him which is top dollar for your position and he still took them to court to be paid for more. Giants really had no choice but to play him another year dince he wasnt interest in team friendly nose tackle money
After watching the replay, I thought that was a pretty ticky tacky call. The fact that it stopped the clock I thought hurt even more than the 15 yards tacked on.
A player having his best season in his contract year is a red flag...
I'd generally agree, but this situation is a bit different. DG reportedly traded for him because they believed he was being completely misused for the Jets. Gets traded here and he played well, but the sacks were missing because the back end coverage sucked and our edge rushers were pathetic in their discipline. At least our edge guys still keep contain, even though they barely get push or penetration.
The thing is, if the cap wasn't taking a major hit, he'd get 20 million. After seeing all the numbers, I think he hits 18 million. The problem is he may have leverage, there are teams with a ton of money and he would undoubtedly be one of the better jewels in FA.
So yeah
So yeah
And the giants have the option of making next year...yet another contract year!
Thank you for saying this. That is a long list for this team in the past decade.
So yeah
Let me make sure I understand your position.
Are you suggesting LW playing just as well last year as this year?
Quote:
Well, it was a contract year for him last year too
So yeah
And the giants have the option of making next year...yet another contract year!
Have we not noticed its the same posters that think they are the oracles of football knowledge, who are wrong just as often as they're right but are rarely called on it.
Same posters claim they own it when they are wrong, but never do.
Quote:
Well, it was a contract year for him last year too
So yeah
Let me make sure I understand your position.
Are you suggesting LW playing just as well last year as this year?
I believe his position is that since both years were contract years it's a horseshit excuse as to why he has more sacks this year.
If it was that easy to just turn it on in a contract year, why didn't he do so last year?
He is a 25 year old excellent 3 down DL who makes his teammates better. You don’t let that guy go because you want a comp pick
I believe his position is that since both years were contract years it's a horseshit excuse as to why he has more sacks this year.
If it was that easy to just turn it on in a contract year, why didn't he do so last year?
LW is getting a second bite at the apple after switching teams mid-year. He didn't get the big contract he wanted, got tagged, and now is taking advantage of opportunity #2.
Quote:
I believe his position is that since both years were contract years it's a horseshit excuse as to why he has more sacks this year.
If it was that easy to just turn it on in a contract year, why didn't he do so last year?
LW is getting a second bite at the apple after switching teams mid-year. He didn't get the big contract he wanted, got tagged, and now is taking advantage of opportunity #2.
Dude you have NO point. As usual. The guy played very well for us last year too. Our coverage schemes are better this year and as such, his hurries are turning into sacks.
You need to stop. Jints Central is fielding a team that is playing above their talent level and making all of your horseshit theories look dumb as ever.
Quote:
In comment 15059978 Eric on Li said:
Quote:
I believe his position is that since both years were contract years it's a horseshit excuse as to why he has more sacks this year.
If it was that easy to just turn it on in a contract year, why didn't he do so last year?
LW is getting a second bite at the apple after switching teams mid-year. He didn't get the big contract he wanted, got tagged, and now is taking advantage of opportunity #2.
Dude you have NO point. As usual. The guy played very well for us last year too. Our coverage schemes are better this year and as such, his hurries are turning into sacks.
You need to stop. Jints Central is fielding a team that is playing above their talent level and making all of your horseshit theories look dumb as ever.
Agreed, one of the best things is availability...he has been healthy and always playing his best. Even in the jets he was always all over the ball, very high effort player. I firmly believe he will only get better playing with more years under graham. In interviews he has said none of the players believed in the system and did their own thing, now tou see the defense is all firm believers of Judge even all quoting his 1 game at a time philosophy
The two sides clearly couldn’t come to a number last year. Hopefully they can this offseason.
For me, the worst outcome for the Giants would be tagging him again, with no future control. If the Giants pay a guy 36M+ fully guaranteed, it’s insanity to get only 2 years of team control.
OR..
We should not pay him... then one year later complain that we always let our talent go.
Then you don't trade for him and sign him at market value of the time, which wasn't very high coming off a couple lackluster seasons with the Jets. Good on the Giants for recognizing potential that wasn't showing up in the stat column, but why trade a draft pick to eliminate your contract leverage?
So now the Giants have to overpay even more because he is accumulating some sacks?
Moronic
He is a 25 year old excellent 3 down DL who makes his teammates better. You don’t let that guy go because you want a comp pick
Exactly. Amazing what a few sacks will do to make you appreciated more. People value the things that are only the most obvious.
All signs point to everyone wanting this marriage to work.
The two sides clearly couldn’t come to a number last year. Hopefully they can this offseason.
For me, the worst outcome for the Giants would be tagging him again, with no future control. If the Giants pay a guy 36M+ fully guaranteed, it’s insanity to get only 2 years of team control.
This is a silly take I cannot understand. Who cares whether money is guaranteed or not if it's a 1 year deal and the player isn't getting cut under any circumstance. It's completely irrelevant.
The choice is have LW at a fair AAV or don't. It's binary. And a simple, obvious decision just as it was this year (if they can't agree on an extension).
Quote:
There’s never been a question in my mind that Williams is a good player. The question was and is can the Giants and Williams come to terms, and pencil him in as a cornerstone of the defense for a championship run.
The two sides clearly couldn’t come to a number last year. Hopefully they can this offseason.
For me, the worst outcome for the Giants would be tagging him again, with no future control. If the Giants pay a guy 36M+ fully guaranteed, it’s insanity to get only 2 years of team control.
This is a silly take I cannot understand. Who cares whether money is guaranteed or not if it's a 1 year deal and the player isn't getting cut under any circumstance. It's completely irrelevant.
The choice is have LW at a fair AAV or don't. It's binary. And a simple, obvious decision just as it was this year (if they can't agree on an extension).
This is definitely not a binary situation. There are plenty of variable involved in judging this deal. "Fair AAV" is the ability to sign him at his peak market value...which is where we are right now.
If however that conversation goes nowhere the decision to tag or not is binary. And obvious.