And how Andrew Thomas was a bust, Mekhi Becton the next Walter Jones after week 4. You just have to laugh.
To be fair Becton looks like the next Walter Jones. He looks like the real deal. IMO that is a huge selling point to the next coach of the Jets and Trevor. Come on over Harbaugh/Lawrence, we got a premier blue goose LT to protect you for the next 10 years. Ive always said, get a GM/Coach/QB/LT and build from there and you are well on your way to become a playoff team.
Levels a defender and just keeps moving, doesn't even break stride, looking for someone else to hit. The whole reel is just beautiful.
Yes, the 3 running plays were his most impressive. Pancaked a couple DL in 1v1 blocks, leveled a DB on the run and would've flattened the safety too if the play wasn't stopped by the pursuit.
Good recognition (and finishing) in support of his fellow OL on the passing plays.
Levels a defender and just keeps moving, doesn't even break stride, looking for someone else to hit. The whole reel is just beautiful.
Yes, the 3 running plays were his most impressive. Pancaked a couple DL in 1v1 blocks, leveled a DB on the run and would've flattened the safety too if the play wasn't stopped by the pursuit.
Good recognition (and finishing) in support of his fellow OL on the passing plays.
That QB sweep with McCoy was a questionable play call, but what a great job blocking by Gates
Seeing him seek out a safety at the end of the play and getting in his face brought a smile. I played FS in college, and on rare occasions a guard or tackle would find his way to the secondary and take a shot at me.
I'd typically respond by yelling WTF, did you get lost? Go find a linebacker to block!
RE: RE: RE: I remember how he much shit he got for not being an NFL center
And how Andrew Thomas was a bust, Mekhi Becton the next Walter Jones after week 4. You just have to laugh.
To be fair Becton looks like the next Walter Jones. He looks like the real deal. IMO that is a huge selling point to the next coach of the Jets and Trevor. Come on over Harbaugh/Lawrence, we got a premier blue goose LT to protect you for the next 10 years. Ive always said, get a GM/Coach/QB/LT and build from there and you are well on your way to become a playoff team.
Walter Jones started 180 games out of 180 games. Becton has been hurt at least a third of his games in year one and logic seems to indicate that won't get better over time. God forbid Becton has a serious injury and gains another 50 pounds sitting around.
Always hustling, looking for blocks, not interested in locking hands and instead prefers taking guys out, never backs down from a verbal altercation...
RE: RE: RE: I remember how he much shit he got for not being an NFL center
To be fair Becton looks like the next Walter Jones. He looks like the real deal. IMO that is a huge selling point to the next coach of the Jets and Trevor. Come on over Harbaugh/Lawrence, we got a premier blue goose LT to protect you for the next 10 years. Ive always said, get a GM/Coach/QB/LT and build from there and you are well on your way to become a playoff team.
Becton has been very good when he’s been on the field but the problem is that he’s had trouble staying healthy. Few people know this but Becton had lower back issues coming out of college which obviously is a concern for someone carrying over 370lbs. Now Becton has a shoulder injury which is a huge concern for OT’s.
My friend in college was the starting LT for the football team but he had to quit playing because he suffered a shoulder injury. I remember him telling me that the worst body part an OL can injure is his shoulder. Tony Boselli had to retire in his prime before the age of 30 because of a shoulder injury.
Now I am not saying that Becton’s shoulder injury is career threatening but between his massive size, back, and shoulder injuries so far I wouldn’t be surprised if he has to retire early.
Can't say I caught every play, but for those burying Hernandez
and elevating Lemieux, there's two really good block by WH in space, one of which is a pancake, and there's a really bad pass pro rep by Lemieux where the DT just "swims" right past him as Lemieux cleanly whiffs.
RE: RE: RE: RE: I remember how he much shit he got for not being an NFL center
And how Andrew Thomas was a bust, Mekhi Becton the next Walter Jones after week 4. You just have to laugh.
To be fair Becton looks like the next Walter Jones. He looks like the real deal. IMO that is a huge selling point to the next coach of the Jets and Trevor. Come on over Harbaugh/Lawrence, we got a premier blue goose LT to protect you for the next 10 years. Ive always said, get a GM/Coach/QB/LT and build from there and you are well on your way to become a playoff team.
Walter Jones started 180 games out of 180 games. Becton has been hurt at least a third of his games in year one and logic seems to indicate that won't get better over time. God forbid Becton has a serious injury and gains another 50 pounds sitting around.
Thank you. Becton also has to work on technique and his iffy balance may be hard to overcome.
RE: Can't say I caught every play, but for those burying Hernandez
and elevating Lemieux, there's two really good block by WH in space, one of which is a pancake, and there's a really bad pass pro rep by Lemieux where the DT just "swims" right past him as Lemieux cleanly whiffs.
No I think Sy has pointed that out before. People saying Lemieux is much better are not correct. They do have different skill sets and Hernandez is more stout. Lemieux seems to be a better pulling/athletic guard, and it does seem to fit what we are doing a little bit better.
When the Giants said Gates would compete for center is pretty funny now.
It shows you how clueless fans are.
Thats one way to see it. There are definitely some interesting opinions expressed here. And patience would be something many of us here could benefit from.
But I also think its important to recall the FO track record in recent years. They'd proven completely and utterly incapable of putting a solid OL together for going on a decade. Poor FA signings, draft picks ranging from disappointing to disastrous, and an offense consistently hamstrung by downright embarrassing play. So while I didnt lose my mind when that plan was announced I dont begrudge anyone who laughed. This team, this desert of offensive line play, is taking a 3rd yr undrafted FA with very limited experience period-and none on the interior-and making him the new center? Cant blame people for scoffing. It sounds insane.
Is the main reason we have so much hope for this offensive line, Thomas is now starting to put it together also, but who could have imagined that the center position was going to be our best on the offensive line, this was the position we were all most concerned with after free agency and the draft, now 11 games into the season we all feel like we have our starter.
When the Giants said Gates would compete for center is pretty funny now.
It shows you how clueless fans are.
Thats one way to see it. There are definitely some interesting opinions expressed here. And patience would be something many of us here could benefit from.
But I also think its important to recall the FO track record in recent years. They'd proven completely and utterly incapable of putting a solid OL together for going on a decade. Poor FA signings, draft picks ranging from disappointing to disastrous, and an offense consistently hamstrung by downright embarrassing play. So while I didnt lose my mind when that plan was announced I dont begrudge anyone who laughed. This team, this desert of offensive line play, is taking a 3rd yr undrafted FA with very limited experience period-and none on the interior-and making him the new center? Cant blame people for scoffing. It sounds insane.
Gettleman hasn't been in our front office for the better part of ten years. That is a criticism that was not warranted for Gettleman, that was on the FO with Reese at the helm.
Especially after week 1
He is the main reason we are busting 4 yards a shot up the middle
Gallman running hard help too
But it looks like we have a LT center now , 24 yrs old. Signed thru 2022
Works for me
When the Giants said Gates would compete for center is pretty funny now.
It shows you how clueless fans are.
Thats one way to see it. There are definitely some interesting opinions expressed here. And patience would be something many of us here could benefit from.
But I also think its important to recall the FO track record in recent years. They'd proven completely and utterly incapable of putting a solid OL together for going on a decade. Poor FA signings, draft picks ranging from disappointing to disastrous, and an offense consistently hamstrung by downright embarrassing play. So while I didnt lose my mind when that plan was announced I dont begrudge anyone who laughed. This team, this desert of offensive line play, is taking a 3rd yr undrafted FA with very limited experience period-and none on the interior-and making him the new center? Cant blame people for scoffing. It sounds insane.
Gettleman hasn't been in our front office for the better part of ten years. That is a criticism that was not warranted for Gettleman, that was on the FO with Reese at the helm.
No, but his tenure started with more of the same. We're only now seeing an improvement despite fixing the line being one of his stated priorities. His "once and for all" comment even acknowledges his failure in that regard.
The Solder contract in particular stands out as egregious. I dont really fault him for guys like Jamon Brown and Remmers, its not like he can control who is available. But no one forced him to make an average player like Solder the highest paid offensive lineman in the league. Unless of course he was following a directive to load up for one last run with Eli...which tbh is totally plausable...
Look man, I dunno lol. Sometimes in my dogged pursuit of nuance I lose my point. Which is just that by the time they got around to announcing Gates was in the mix as the starting C they had lost all goodwill and benefit of the doubt.
When the Giants said Gates would compete for center is pretty funny now.
It shows you how clueless fans are.
Thats one way to see it. There are definitely some interesting opinions expressed here. And patience would be something many of us here could benefit from.
But I also think its important to recall the FO track record in recent years. They'd proven completely and utterly incapable of putting a solid OL together for going on a decade. Poor FA signings, draft picks ranging from disappointing to disastrous, and an offense consistently hamstrung by downright embarrassing play. So while I didnt lose my mind when that plan was announced I dont begrudge anyone who laughed. This team, this desert of offensive line play, is taking a 3rd yr undrafted FA with very limited experience period-and none on the interior-and making him the new center? Cant blame people for scoffing. It sounds insane.
Gettleman hasn't been in our front office for the better part of ten years. That is a criticism that was not warranted for Gettleman, that was on the FO with Reese at the helm.
No, but his tenure started with more of the same. We're only now seeing an improvement despite fixing the line being one of his stated priorities. His "once and for all" comment even acknowledges his failure in that regard.
The Solder contract in particular stands out as egregious. I dont really fault him for guys like Jamon Brown and Remmers, its not like he can control who is available. But no one forced him to make an average player like Solder the highest paid offensive lineman in the league. Unless of course he was following a directive to load up for one last run with Eli...which tbh is totally plausable...
Look man, I dunno lol. Sometimes in my dogged pursuit of nuance I lose my point. Which is just that by the time they got around to announcing Gates was in the mix as the starting C they had lost all goodwill and benefit of the doubt.
If Solder played average that wouldn't be nearly as bad of a signing it was and a lot of people would understand overpaying for the best LT available.
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: Yes, the Whining on this board
When the Giants said Gates would compete for center is pretty funny now.
It shows you how clueless fans are.
Thats one way to see it. There are definitely some interesting opinions expressed here. And patience would be something many of us here could benefit from.
But I also think its important to recall the FO track record in recent years. They'd proven completely and utterly incapable of putting a solid OL together for going on a decade. Poor FA signings, draft picks ranging from disappointing to disastrous, and an offense consistently hamstrung by downright embarrassing play. So while I didnt lose my mind when that plan was announced I dont begrudge anyone who laughed. This team, this desert of offensive line play, is taking a 3rd yr undrafted FA with very limited experience period-and none on the interior-and making him the new center? Cant blame people for scoffing. It sounds insane.
Gettleman hasn't been in our front office for the better part of ten years. That is a criticism that was not warranted for Gettleman, that was on the FO with Reese at the helm.
No, but his tenure started with more of the same. We're only now seeing an improvement despite fixing the line being one of his stated priorities. His "once and for all" comment even acknowledges his failure in that regard.
The Solder contract in particular stands out as egregious. I dont really fault him for guys like Jamon Brown and Remmers, its not like he can control who is available. But no one forced him to make an average player like Solder the highest paid offensive lineman in the league. Unless of course he was following a directive to load up for one last run with Eli...which tbh is totally plausable...
Look man, I dunno lol. Sometimes in my dogged pursuit of nuance I lose my point. Which is just that by the time they got around to announcing Gates was in the mix as the starting C they had lost all goodwill and benefit of the doubt.
If Solder played average that wouldn't be nearly as bad of a signing it was and a lot of people would understand overpaying for the best LT available.
If he played average it would still be an awful signing. You dont pay average talent top dollar. Its bad business. We're not talking about a top 10 player at his position resetting the market. Thats to be expected. But Solder was always a notch or two above average. They made him the highest paid lineman in the league, and he's been one of if not the worst LTs in the league since he arrived.
In one of the darkest eras in the franchises history its arguably the most egregious mistake. Theres simply no defending it.
When the Giants said Gates would compete for center is pretty funny now.
It shows you how clueless fans are.
Thats one way to see it. There are definitely some interesting opinions expressed here. And patience would be something many of us here could benefit from.
But I also think its important to recall the FO track record in recent years. They'd proven completely and utterly incapable of putting a solid OL together for going on a decade. Poor FA signings, draft picks ranging from disappointing to disastrous, and an offense consistently hamstrung by downright embarrassing play. So while I didnt lose my mind when that plan was announced I dont begrudge anyone who laughed. This team, this desert of offensive line play, is taking a 3rd yr undrafted FA with very limited experience period-and none on the interior-and making him the new center? Cant blame people for scoffing. It sounds insane.
Gettleman hasn't been in our front office for the better part of ten years. That is a criticism that was not warranted for Gettleman, that was on the FO with Reese at the helm.
No, but his tenure started with more of the same. We're only now seeing an improvement despite fixing the line being one of his stated priorities. His "once and for all" comment even acknowledges his failure in that regard.
The Solder contract in particular stands out as egregious. I dont really fault him for guys like Jamon Brown and Remmers, its not like he can control who is available. But no one forced him to make an average player like Solder the highest paid offensive lineman in the league. Unless of course he was following a directive to load up for one last run with Eli...which tbh is totally plausable...
Look man, I dunno lol. Sometimes in my dogged pursuit of nuance I lose my point. Which is just that by the time they got around to announcing Gates was in the mix as the starting C they had lost all goodwill and benefit of the doubt.
Alright. I think it's good to remember that mistakes are expected (to a degree), patience for players to grow, perspective for the whole picture (example, how much of Judge's and his staff's good coaching are helping players to grow? How much of Shurmur and his staff's coaching negated player growth)
When the Giants said Gates would compete for center is pretty funny now.
It shows you how clueless fans are.
Thats one way to see it. There are definitely some interesting opinions expressed here. And patience would be something many of us here could benefit from.
But I also think its important to recall the FO track record in recent years. They'd proven completely and utterly incapable of putting a solid OL together for going on a decade. Poor FA signings, draft picks ranging from disappointing to disastrous, and an offense consistently hamstrung by downright embarrassing play. So while I didnt lose my mind when that plan was announced I dont begrudge anyone who laughed. This team, this desert of offensive line play, is taking a 3rd yr undrafted FA with very limited experience period-and none on the interior-and making him the new center? Cant blame people for scoffing. It sounds insane.
Except, in the process of deriding "the Giants' FO OL plan" based on the past 10 years' failures is patently ridiculous. Dave Gettleman has been overseeing the OL rebuild only for 3 years, and he attempted a poorly executed "patch job" with Solder and Omameh and Halapio first while also working on a rebuild that began with drafting Hernandez and signing priority UDFA Gates, a very solid (but too short armed) LT from Nebraska.
People on this site were burying Gettleman, just last year, for his entire 2018 class of rookie acquisitions, incuding Saquon, Hernandez, Carter, Hill and overlooking Gates as nothing at all since he was IRed through 2018 and looked to be no more than a versatile replacement level fill in during 2019.
Patience.... Tell that to the folks who regularly call Gettleman inept at best.
When a largely unheralded UDFA is part of a rebuild plan, and is envisioned by someone in the FO as having serious upside, judgements shouldn't be coming down as quickly and assuredly as they do here - with regularity! Just as judgements shouldn't have been coming down on the selection of Thomas after his rough start vs a bevy of the NFL's best pass rushers and edge players on Pittsburgh, the Eagles, the Rams.
Did you notice the Rams lined Aaron Donald head up on Thomas to start with in that game?
Who knows but in Murphy from URI we might have another Gates in the making. He's supposedly very athletic for a big and had plenty of pancakes at URI too. But suppisedly is way short on strength by NFL standards.
Murphy I think is the key to replacing Zeitler eventually.
Levels a defender and just keeps moving, doesn't even break stride, looking for someone else to hit.
That was nice to see. In defense of LeShaun Sims, he actually did a decent job on that play, standing his ground against Zeitler while the LBs and safety rallied to the ball. By the time Gates blew Sims up, the Bengals had strung the play out and McCoy had nowhere to go.
The plays against Hunt, Atkins and Covington look darned good. Obviously, you don’t judge offensive linemen off a highlight reel, but Gates seems pretty consistent too. When was the last year our offensive line didn’t get dominated by the Eagles twice? Must have been while Fletcher Cox was in high school.
And how Andrew Thomas was a bust, Mekhi Becton the next Walter Jones after week 4. You just have to laugh.
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after 1 friggin week.
And how Andrew Thomas was a bust, Mekhi Becton the next Walter Jones after week 4. You just have to laugh.
To be fair Becton looks like the next Walter Jones. He looks like the real deal. IMO that is a huge selling point to the next coach of the Jets and Trevor. Come on over Harbaugh/Lawrence, we got a premier blue goose LT to protect you for the next 10 years. Ive always said, get a GM/Coach/QB/LT and build from there and you are well on your way to become a playoff team.
It shows you how clueless fans are.
Yes, the 3 running plays were his most impressive. Pancaked a couple DL in 1v1 blocks, leveled a DB on the run and would've flattened the safety too if the play wasn't stopped by the pursuit.
Good recognition (and finishing) in support of his fellow OL on the passing plays.
So awesome.
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Levels a defender and just keeps moving, doesn't even break stride, looking for someone else to hit. The whole reel is just beautiful.
Yes, the 3 running plays were his most impressive. Pancaked a couple DL in 1v1 blocks, leveled a DB on the run and would've flattened the safety too if the play wasn't stopped by the pursuit.
Good recognition (and finishing) in support of his fellow OL on the passing plays.
That QB sweep with McCoy was a questionable play call, but what a great job blocking by Gates
Seeing him seek out a safety at the end of the play and getting in his face brought a smile. I played FS in college, and on rare occasions a guard or tackle would find his way to the secondary and take a shot at me.
I'd typically respond by yelling WTF, did you get lost? Go find a linebacker to block!
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In comment 15063024 BestFeature said:
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after 1 friggin week.
And how Andrew Thomas was a bust, Mekhi Becton the next Walter Jones after week 4. You just have to laugh.
To be fair Becton looks like the next Walter Jones. He looks like the real deal. IMO that is a huge selling point to the next coach of the Jets and Trevor. Come on over Harbaugh/Lawrence, we got a premier blue goose LT to protect you for the next 10 years. Ive always said, get a GM/Coach/QB/LT and build from there and you are well on your way to become a playoff team.
Walter Jones started 180 games out of 180 games. Becton has been hurt at least a third of his games in year one and logic seems to indicate that won't get better over time. God forbid Becton has a serious injury and gains another 50 pounds sitting around.
Becton has been very good when he’s been on the field but the problem is that he’s had trouble staying healthy. Few people know this but Becton had lower back issues coming out of college which obviously is a concern for someone carrying over 370lbs. Now Becton has a shoulder injury which is a huge concern for OT’s.
My friend in college was the starting LT for the football team but he had to quit playing because he suffered a shoulder injury. I remember him telling me that the worst body part an OL can injure is his shoulder. Tony Boselli had to retire in his prime before the age of 30 because of a shoulder injury.
Now I am not saying that Becton’s shoulder injury is career threatening but between his massive size, back, and shoulder injuries so far I wouldn’t be surprised if he has to retire early.
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In comment 15063032 Victor in CT said:
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In comment 15063024 BestFeature said:
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after 1 friggin week.
And how Andrew Thomas was a bust, Mekhi Becton the next Walter Jones after week 4. You just have to laugh.
To be fair Becton looks like the next Walter Jones. He looks like the real deal. IMO that is a huge selling point to the next coach of the Jets and Trevor. Come on over Harbaugh/Lawrence, we got a premier blue goose LT to protect you for the next 10 years. Ive always said, get a GM/Coach/QB/LT and build from there and you are well on your way to become a playoff team.
Walter Jones started 180 games out of 180 games. Becton has been hurt at least a third of his games in year one and logic seems to indicate that won't get better over time. God forbid Becton has a serious injury and gains another 50 pounds sitting around.
Thank you. Becton also has to work on technique and his iffy balance may be hard to overcome.
No I think Sy has pointed that out before. People saying Lemieux is much better are not correct. They do have different skill sets and Hernandez is more stout. Lemieux seems to be a better pulling/athletic guard, and it does seem to fit what we are doing a little bit better.
It shows you how clueless fans are.
Thats one way to see it. There are definitely some interesting opinions expressed here. And patience would be something many of us here could benefit from.
But I also think its important to recall the FO track record in recent years. They'd proven completely and utterly incapable of putting a solid OL together for going on a decade. Poor FA signings, draft picks ranging from disappointing to disastrous, and an offense consistently hamstrung by downright embarrassing play. So while I didnt lose my mind when that plan was announced I dont begrudge anyone who laughed. This team, this desert of offensive line play, is taking a 3rd yr undrafted FA with very limited experience period-and none on the interior-and making him the new center? Cant blame people for scoffing. It sounds insane.
Quote:
When the Giants said Gates would compete for center is pretty funny now.
It shows you how clueless fans are.
Thats one way to see it. There are definitely some interesting opinions expressed here. And patience would be something many of us here could benefit from.
But I also think its important to recall the FO track record in recent years. They'd proven completely and utterly incapable of putting a solid OL together for going on a decade. Poor FA signings, draft picks ranging from disappointing to disastrous, and an offense consistently hamstrung by downright embarrassing play. So while I didnt lose my mind when that plan was announced I dont begrudge anyone who laughed. This team, this desert of offensive line play, is taking a 3rd yr undrafted FA with very limited experience period-and none on the interior-and making him the new center? Cant blame people for scoffing. It sounds insane.
Gettleman hasn't been in our front office for the better part of ten years. That is a criticism that was not warranted for Gettleman, that was on the FO with Reese at the helm.
He is the main reason we are busting 4 yards a shot up the middle
Gallman running hard help too
But it looks like we have a LT center now , 24 yrs old. Signed thru 2022
Works for me
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In comment 15063049 ZogZerg said:
Quote:
When the Giants said Gates would compete for center is pretty funny now.
It shows you how clueless fans are.
Thats one way to see it. There are definitely some interesting opinions expressed here. And patience would be something many of us here could benefit from.
But I also think its important to recall the FO track record in recent years. They'd proven completely and utterly incapable of putting a solid OL together for going on a decade. Poor FA signings, draft picks ranging from disappointing to disastrous, and an offense consistently hamstrung by downright embarrassing play. So while I didnt lose my mind when that plan was announced I dont begrudge anyone who laughed. This team, this desert of offensive line play, is taking a 3rd yr undrafted FA with very limited experience period-and none on the interior-and making him the new center? Cant blame people for scoffing. It sounds insane.
Gettleman hasn't been in our front office for the better part of ten years. That is a criticism that was not warranted for Gettleman, that was on the FO with Reese at the helm.
No, but his tenure started with more of the same. We're only now seeing an improvement despite fixing the line being one of his stated priorities. His "once and for all" comment even acknowledges his failure in that regard.
The Solder contract in particular stands out as egregious. I dont really fault him for guys like Jamon Brown and Remmers, its not like he can control who is available. But no one forced him to make an average player like Solder the highest paid offensive lineman in the league. Unless of course he was following a directive to load up for one last run with Eli...which tbh is totally plausable...
Look man, I dunno lol. Sometimes in my dogged pursuit of nuance I lose my point. Which is just that by the time they got around to announcing Gates was in the mix as the starting C they had lost all goodwill and benefit of the doubt.
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In comment 15063254 j_rud said:
Quote:
In comment 15063049 ZogZerg said:
Quote:
When the Giants said Gates would compete for center is pretty funny now.
It shows you how clueless fans are.
Thats one way to see it. There are definitely some interesting opinions expressed here. And patience would be something many of us here could benefit from.
But I also think its important to recall the FO track record in recent years. They'd proven completely and utterly incapable of putting a solid OL together for going on a decade. Poor FA signings, draft picks ranging from disappointing to disastrous, and an offense consistently hamstrung by downright embarrassing play. So while I didnt lose my mind when that plan was announced I dont begrudge anyone who laughed. This team, this desert of offensive line play, is taking a 3rd yr undrafted FA with very limited experience period-and none on the interior-and making him the new center? Cant blame people for scoffing. It sounds insane.
Gettleman hasn't been in our front office for the better part of ten years. That is a criticism that was not warranted for Gettleman, that was on the FO with Reese at the helm.
No, but his tenure started with more of the same. We're only now seeing an improvement despite fixing the line being one of his stated priorities. His "once and for all" comment even acknowledges his failure in that regard.
The Solder contract in particular stands out as egregious. I dont really fault him for guys like Jamon Brown and Remmers, its not like he can control who is available. But no one forced him to make an average player like Solder the highest paid offensive lineman in the league. Unless of course he was following a directive to load up for one last run with Eli...which tbh is totally plausable...
Look man, I dunno lol. Sometimes in my dogged pursuit of nuance I lose my point. Which is just that by the time they got around to announcing Gates was in the mix as the starting C they had lost all goodwill and benefit of the doubt.
If Solder played average that wouldn't be nearly as bad of a signing it was and a lot of people would understand overpaying for the best LT available.
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In comment 15063618 crick n NC said:
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In comment 15063254 j_rud said:
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In comment 15063049 ZogZerg said:
Quote:
When the Giants said Gates would compete for center is pretty funny now.
It shows you how clueless fans are.
Thats one way to see it. There are definitely some interesting opinions expressed here. And patience would be something many of us here could benefit from.
But I also think its important to recall the FO track record in recent years. They'd proven completely and utterly incapable of putting a solid OL together for going on a decade. Poor FA signings, draft picks ranging from disappointing to disastrous, and an offense consistently hamstrung by downright embarrassing play. So while I didnt lose my mind when that plan was announced I dont begrudge anyone who laughed. This team, this desert of offensive line play, is taking a 3rd yr undrafted FA with very limited experience period-and none on the interior-and making him the new center? Cant blame people for scoffing. It sounds insane.
Gettleman hasn't been in our front office for the better part of ten years. That is a criticism that was not warranted for Gettleman, that was on the FO with Reese at the helm.
No, but his tenure started with more of the same. We're only now seeing an improvement despite fixing the line being one of his stated priorities. His "once and for all" comment even acknowledges his failure in that regard.
The Solder contract in particular stands out as egregious. I dont really fault him for guys like Jamon Brown and Remmers, its not like he can control who is available. But no one forced him to make an average player like Solder the highest paid offensive lineman in the league. Unless of course he was following a directive to load up for one last run with Eli...which tbh is totally plausable...
Look man, I dunno lol. Sometimes in my dogged pursuit of nuance I lose my point. Which is just that by the time they got around to announcing Gates was in the mix as the starting C they had lost all goodwill and benefit of the doubt.
If Solder played average that wouldn't be nearly as bad of a signing it was and a lot of people would understand overpaying for the best LT available.
If he played average it would still be an awful signing. You dont pay average talent top dollar. Its bad business. We're not talking about a top 10 player at his position resetting the market. Thats to be expected. But Solder was always a notch or two above average. They made him the highest paid lineman in the league, and he's been one of if not the worst LTs in the league since he arrived.
In one of the darkest eras in the franchises history its arguably the most egregious mistake. Theres simply no defending it.
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In comment 15063254 j_rud said:
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In comment 15063049 ZogZerg said:
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When the Giants said Gates would compete for center is pretty funny now.
It shows you how clueless fans are.
Thats one way to see it. There are definitely some interesting opinions expressed here. And patience would be something many of us here could benefit from.
But I also think its important to recall the FO track record in recent years. They'd proven completely and utterly incapable of putting a solid OL together for going on a decade. Poor FA signings, draft picks ranging from disappointing to disastrous, and an offense consistently hamstrung by downright embarrassing play. So while I didnt lose my mind when that plan was announced I dont begrudge anyone who laughed. This team, this desert of offensive line play, is taking a 3rd yr undrafted FA with very limited experience period-and none on the interior-and making him the new center? Cant blame people for scoffing. It sounds insane.
Gettleman hasn't been in our front office for the better part of ten years. That is a criticism that was not warranted for Gettleman, that was on the FO with Reese at the helm.
No, but his tenure started with more of the same. We're only now seeing an improvement despite fixing the line being one of his stated priorities. His "once and for all" comment even acknowledges his failure in that regard.
The Solder contract in particular stands out as egregious. I dont really fault him for guys like Jamon Brown and Remmers, its not like he can control who is available. But no one forced him to make an average player like Solder the highest paid offensive lineman in the league. Unless of course he was following a directive to load up for one last run with Eli...which tbh is totally plausable...
Look man, I dunno lol. Sometimes in my dogged pursuit of nuance I lose my point. Which is just that by the time they got around to announcing Gates was in the mix as the starting C they had lost all goodwill and benefit of the doubt.
Alright. I think it's good to remember that mistakes are expected (to a degree), patience for players to grow, perspective for the whole picture (example, how much of Judge's and his staff's good coaching are helping players to grow? How much of Shurmur and his staff's coaching negated player growth)
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When the Giants said Gates would compete for center is pretty funny now.
It shows you how clueless fans are.
Thats one way to see it. There are definitely some interesting opinions expressed here. And patience would be something many of us here could benefit from.
But I also think its important to recall the FO track record in recent years. They'd proven completely and utterly incapable of putting a solid OL together for going on a decade. Poor FA signings, draft picks ranging from disappointing to disastrous, and an offense consistently hamstrung by downright embarrassing play. So while I didnt lose my mind when that plan was announced I dont begrudge anyone who laughed. This team, this desert of offensive line play, is taking a 3rd yr undrafted FA with very limited experience period-and none on the interior-and making him the new center? Cant blame people for scoffing. It sounds insane.
Except, in the process of deriding "the Giants' FO OL plan" based on the past 10 years' failures is patently ridiculous. Dave Gettleman has been overseeing the OL rebuild only for 3 years, and he attempted a poorly executed "patch job" with Solder and Omameh and Halapio first while also working on a rebuild that began with drafting Hernandez and signing priority UDFA Gates, a very solid (but too short armed) LT from Nebraska.
People on this site were burying Gettleman, just last year, for his entire 2018 class of rookie acquisitions, incuding Saquon, Hernandez, Carter, Hill and overlooking Gates as nothing at all since he was IRed through 2018 and looked to be no more than a versatile replacement level fill in during 2019.
Patience.... Tell that to the folks who regularly call Gettleman inept at best.
When a largely unheralded UDFA is part of a rebuild plan, and is envisioned by someone in the FO as having serious upside, judgements shouldn't be coming down as quickly and assuredly as they do here - with regularity! Just as judgements shouldn't have been coming down on the selection of Thomas after his rough start vs a bevy of the NFL's best pass rushers and edge players on Pittsburgh, the Eagles, the Rams.
Did you notice the Rams lined Aaron Donald head up on Thomas to start with in that game?
Who knows but in Murphy from URI we might have another Gates in the making. He's supposedly very athletic for a big and had plenty of pancakes at URI too. But suppisedly is way short on strength by NFL standards.
Murphy I think is the key to replacing Zeitler eventually.
The plays against Hunt, Atkins and Covington look darned good. Obviously, you don’t judge offensive linemen off a highlight reel, but Gates seems pretty consistent too. When was the last year our offensive line didn’t get dominated by the Eagles twice? Must have been while Fletcher Cox was in high school.