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Lamar Jackson — can someone explain to me why so many ....

Jim from Katonah : 1/11/2021 11:10 am
... on BBI either marginalize him or don’t see him as a great player?

After an absurd Heisman-winning college career, he’s 30-7 as a Ravens starter. In his last 2 years, he’s accounted for 74 TDs vs 20 turnovers (in 30 games). He’s also been a top 10 rusher each of the past 2 years (averaging an historic 6.5 ypc) — thus, providing the Ravens an added ball control/clock killing advantage. And, after last year, he was voted the overall no. 1 player in the NFL by his peers.

So what’s the argument? That he lost his first 2 playoff games (at age 22 and 23) and his game won’t translate to playoff football? From where I sit, he’s among the handful of most impactful on winning players in the NFL.
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...  
christian : 1/11/2021 5:34 pm : link
Go Terps — I nearly forgot my seasonal obligatory apology for being an asshole towards you when discussing Jackson. Sorry about that one, you were right, sir.
RE: ...  
Go Terps : 1/11/2021 5:37 pm : link
In comment 15119149 christian said:
Quote:
Go Terps — I nearly forgot my seasonal obligatory apology for being an asshole towards you when discussing Jackson. Sorry about that one, you were right, sir.


Not necessary at all. I don't remember you saying anything unreasonable.
RE: RE: He probably  
section125 : 1/11/2021 5:45 pm : link
In comment 15119132 Go Terps said:
Quote:
In comment 15119121 giantBCP said:


Quote:


has the worst arm talent of any QB to ever play the game. It's only right to question his passing ability. - ( New Window )



You've indicated being very confident in Daniel Jones, so here's a quick comp:

Jackson: 64% completions, 7.5 YPA
Jones: 62% completions, 6.6 YPA

So Jackson completes more passes, and gets more out of each pass. Oh, and Jones has thrown 4 more interceptions in 40 fewer attempts.

Jones is a better thrower, but Jackson's a better passer...and that's what matters.


He has a very awkward throwing style, but it is very effective. Every week he seems to just chuck about 2 or 3 passes up, and loe and behold, it is into a tight window for a completion and he does it scrambling. Then he makes beautiful throws. Cannot be luck.
I have to agree with you.
RE: He probably  
Saquads26 : 1/11/2021 5:46 pm : link
In comment 15119121 giantBCP said:
Quote:
has the worst arm talent of any QB to ever play the game. It's only right to question his passing ability. - ( New Window )


HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA I can't stop laughing. You'd think this was a joke, literally.
49 MPH throwing velocity  
giantBCP : 1/11/2021 5:50 pm : link
Literally lower than just about everyone of note bar BBI's favorite Deshaun Watson.


Arm talent - ( New Window )
RE: RE: He probably  
ThisIsMyBBIname : 1/11/2021 5:53 pm : link
In comment 15119132 Go Terps said:
Quote:
In comment 15119121 giantBCP said:


Quote:


has the worst arm talent of any QB to ever play the game. It's only right to question his passing ability. - ( New Window )



You've indicated being very confident in Daniel Jones, so here's a quick comp:

Jackson: 64% completions, 7.5 YPA
Jones: 62% completions, 6.6 YPA

So Jackson completes more passes, and gets more out of each pass. Oh, and Jones has thrown 4 more interceptions in 40 fewer attempts.

Jones is a better thrower, but Jackson's a better passer...and that's what matters.


Also weird to see all this talk about how no one would want Jackson cause eventually injuries will build up and take their toll when our guy has already missed a handful of games.
It's effective...can it last for an entire season and SB Run?  
Rafflee : 1/11/2021 5:54 pm : link
The really effective Mobile QB's have great vision and they avoid big hits. That's important whether you're a runner or an In Pocket Mover. Eli knew how to get to the next play undamaged, generally....... less turnovers and less Crunches that way.

It's effective...can it last for an entire season and SB Run?  
Rafflee : 1/11/2021 5:54 pm : link
The really effective QB's have great vision and they avoid big hits. That's important whether you're a runner or an In Pocket Mover. Eli knew how to get to the next play undamaged, generally....... less turnovers and less Crunches that way.

RE: It's effective...can it last for an entire season and SB Run?  
UConn4523 : 1/11/2021 5:58 pm : link
In comment 15119172 Rafflee said:
Quote:
The really effective Mobile QB's have great vision and they avoid big hits. That's important whether you're a runner or an In Pocket Mover. Eli knew how to get to the next play undamaged, generally....... less turnovers and less Crunches that way.


This is another one I think differently on now. Finding a 10+ year starter is so damn rare and I think too many teams fail trying to go that route. Nothing wrong with 3-5 elite years from a QB, IMO. Whatever happens from there is what it is. If you manage the cap accordingly you become more fungible and less focused on finding the next Eli, Brady, Ben, etc.
RE: 49 MPH throwing velocity  
bw in dc : 1/11/2021 6:07 pm : link
In comment 15119165 giantBCP said:
Quote:
Literally lower than just about everyone of note bar BBI's favorite Deshaun Watson.
Arm talent - ( New Window )


FWIW, I watch way too much of each Combine... ;)

And I remember LJax throwing that day. But he wasn't really ripping through it when he threw. He was pretty lackadaisical that day. So I wouldn't much stock into that number.

I think Lamar's arm is just fine  
Go Terps : 1/11/2021 6:26 pm : link
I side note people tend to forget  
GManinDC : 1/11/2021 7:01 pm : link
There was a "thing" was his mother and people freaked out thinking he was gonna be another Eli Apple..

I remember a few people who are advocating for him now having reservations about drafting him because of that reason..
RE: I side note people tend to forget  
Go Terps : 1/11/2021 7:05 pm : link
In comment 15119226 GManinDC said:
Quote:
There was a "thing" was his mother and people freaked out thinking he was gonna be another Eli Apple..

I remember a few people who are advocating for him now having reservations about drafting him because of that reason..


I'm one of them. That's a legit cause for concern, but something that can be resolved in an interview, which we obviously aren't privvy to.

If he acted in the combine interview like he does in his post game, I'd have had no issues with him. Guy is a competitor and a gamer.
RE: Good defenses can shut anyone down in the playoffs though  
NINEster : 1/11/2021 8:40 pm : link
In comment 15118657 Greg from LI said:
Quote:
The Giants with Montana in '86 and '90, the Niners with Marino in '84, the Patriots repeatedly with Peyton Manning, the Giants with Brady in '07 and '11.

Yes, LJ still has things to prove, but I don't think it's necessarily because of the type of QB he is.


Times have changed.

It's super hard to just win championships for having the best defense. It was very common 15+ years ago, but now not as much.

Now everything is done to make sure the better QB is given a better chance of winning the game. Sickening.

Where was this love in the '80s and '90s? LOL.

RE: Fun debate  
NINEster : 1/11/2021 8:44 pm : link
In comment 15119089 Jim from Katonah said:
Quote:
Jackson really is an unusual player. Sometimes throws like Uncle Rico, but going back to college, just absurd production both in the air and on the ground. This weeks game will give us additional info as an underdog v. a solid Bills D — and will continue to frame just who he is.

One follow up: on the issue of injury risk, is there any actual correlation between running QBs and injuries? Off the top of my head, can’t really think of one. Tons of pocket QBs get blown up too (maybe because they can’t see it coming/brace themselves) — see Joe Burrow as a recent example. And plenty of running QBs have long relatively healthy careers — see Steve Young, Cunningham, Steve McNair etc.


Steve Young was turned into a pass first QB rather quickly once Montana left town.

Not so sure I agree about Young's health. He was sorta robbed a few years because of concussions.
RE: I think Lamar's arm is just fine  
allstarjim : 1/11/2021 10:13 pm : link
In comment 15119203 Go Terps said:
Quote:


Wow a ball that travelled 50 whole yards in the air between the hashes! /sarcasm

He doesn't make all the throws. It isn't a franchise-QB caliber NFL arm.

It's apparent when you see him try to throw the deep out to the opposite hash. You won't see many examples because he can't make that throw. Every time I watch him I see him miss a throw that is easy for most NFL QBs. And he's successful because defenses have to respect his speed and agility. But a team that can contain him as a runner is always going to have a great chance to beat him, and that's why I don't believe he'll win a Super Bowl.

And for any jackasses reading this, this is just my own evaluation of Jackson. I'm a big fan, however, of Justin Fields, who I believe has everything you want in a franchise QB from what I've seen so far.
he's a good player  
Paulie Walnuts : 1/12/2021 1:44 am : link
and is still young.. dont under rate him.. He's good
There's a difference between mobility and being a running QB  
widmerseyebrow : 1/12/2021 11:10 am : link
Mahommes and Watson could win exclusively from the pocket.
No we know why a lot don't like him  
Saquads26 : 1/16/2021 11:21 pm : link
...STILL
RE: No we know why a lot don't like him  
UConn4523 : 1/17/2021 12:02 am : link
In comment 15125027 Saquads26 said:
Quote:
...STILL


Don’t want to get in the way of the troll other than to remind you how dumb your stance on this is.
RE: RE: No we know why a lot don't like him  
Saquads26 : 1/17/2021 12:04 am : link
In comment 15125092 UConn4523 said:
Quote:
In comment 15125027 Saquads26 said:


Quote:


...STILL



Don’t want to get in the way of the troll other than to remind you how dumb your stance on this is.


That pick 6  
Thunderstruck27 : 1/17/2021 12:22 am : link
tho...
I’m doing great  
UConn4523 : 1/17/2021 12:26 am : link
and couldn’t care less about either quarterback in this game. Just a neutral party letting you know your value.
RE: That pick 6  
Saquads26 : 1/17/2021 12:30 am : link
In comment 15125105 Thunderstruck27 said:
Quote:
tho...


LOL so bad but not surprising at all, he's not a good QB.
The injury concern is less the probability of him getting hurt...  
Big Blue Blogger : 1/17/2021 1:46 am : link
... and more the way a significant leg injury might alter his game. I think Jackson is better than RG III, and he’s certainly sturdier. But if he were to suffer a Carson Palmer-type injury - which can happen to anyone - how effective would he be, even two or three years later? I hope he stays healthy, because he’s fun to watch.

The Ravens were really sloppy tonight on offense and special teams. Jackson was part of the problem, mostly because of one horrible play.
RE: The injury concern is less the probability of him getting hurt...  
CromartiesKid21 : 1/17/2021 7:29 am : link
In comment 15125122 Big Blue Blogger said:
Quote:
... and more the way a significant leg injury might alter his game. I think Jackson is better than RG III, and he’s certainly sturdier. But if he were to suffer a Carson Palmer-type injury - which can happen to anyone - how effective would he be, even two or three years later? I hope he stays healthy, because he’s fun to watch.

The Ravens were really sloppy tonight on offense and special teams. Jackson was part of the problem, mostly because of one horrible play.


Rarely do defenders square up on Jackson to lay the big wood..he has a slithery natural ability to his game
I didn't like Jackson then  
mittenedman : 1/17/2021 8:44 am : link
I don't like him now. And by "like" I mean I wouldn't make the guy my franchise QB.

Last night was a perfect example: eventually these running QBs will run into a Playoff D that makes them look ridiculous. It's happened every year to Jackson so far.

When this guy has to throw without gimmicks he looks like a backup QB on my local JV team.

I am disappointed in the Giants D against BAL though - Graham had no plan. The Bills showed you how to embarrass them. Quarters coverage, both your S's attacking the backfield relentlessly. Put their backfield under siege because they can't hurt you. Great job by the Bills, just like the Chargers a year ago.
he's an unusual combination  
bc4life : 1/17/2021 10:32 am : link
of freakish athleticism and being a pocket passer.

I wonder if it would help to move the pocket more?

Also, he needs different weapons - think he could benefit from bigger Mike Evans type receivers. Or even another H-Back type TE.

keep in mind, he's still a very young QB
There are a few unlikeable idiots on this thread  
djm : 1/17/2021 11:13 am : link
Posting stupid opinions.

I’m trying to be nice.
RE: I didn't like Jackson then  
Saquads26 : 1/17/2021 10:02 pm : link
In comment 15125164 mittenedman said:
Quote:
I don't like him now. And by "like" I mean I wouldn't make the guy my franchise QB.

Last night was a perfect example: eventually these running QBs will run into a Playoff D that makes them look ridiculous. It's happened every year to Jackson so far.

When this guy has to throw without gimmicks he looks like a backup QB on my local JV team.

I am disappointed in the Giants D against BAL though - Graham had no plan. The Bills showed you how to embarrass them. Quarters coverage, both your S's attacking the backfield relentlessly. Put their backfield under siege because they can't hurt you. Great job by the Bills, just like the Chargers a year ago.


Exactly, I think he's actually gotten worse every year in the playoffs which I didn't think was possible. He's awful.
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