if true, could mean trouble brewing in Miami...
"Miami Herald columnist Armando Salguero spoke to three Dolphins players who spoke anonymously about Tagovailoa and the organization’s decision to name him the starter for 2021, and they expressed doubt about Tagovailoa’s overall talent and his ability to develop into what the team needs him to be: a top-tier quarterback."
I haven't heard or seen anything that the Giants players are not on board with Jones...
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No. The Dolphins beat the Rams like that though.
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and ask for opinions, you are bound to find some differences of opinion. I am sure there are other people in that locker room who believe Tua is a fine young man with lots of promise.
Pot. Meet kettle
It's strange that you find a counter-balance with teams not named the Giants, but when it comes to us, you have no such view.
I doubt if there was a thread about Giant players being unhappy with Jones that you'd have any comment about the flip side. Heck, it would probably just turn into a rant about ownership fucking things up again!
They left the team, Wilson went on to be great.
No. The Dolphins beat the Rams like that though.
You gonna give him props for almost beating the Chiefs with no running game, throwing for over 300 yards and 2 TDs with Lynn Bowden as his top WR?
Give the kid time.
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Daniel Jones have won if he went 12-22, 93 yards, a lost fumble and one TD drive? 145 total yards on offense. Longest drive was 33 yards.
No. The Dolphins beat the Rams like that though.
are you really gonna hold not being able to light up the Rams defense against Tua? That defense has been lights out this year. He didn’t even have Devante Parker who is his only legitimate weapon! And Giants beat the Seahawks with Colt McCoy giving a similar performance. You aren’t gonna win every game in the NFL the same.
You gonna give him props for almost beating the Chiefs with no running game, throwing for over 300 yards and 2 TDs with Lynn Bowden as his top WR?
Give the kid time.
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In comment 15121704 Go Terps said:
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In comment 15121620 section125 said:
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In comment 15121453 Greg from LI said:
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He didn't. He was worse. Terps is right, I never got it with him. Better than Hurts, yes.
Whatever. Hope he has a good career.
Tua was better than Jones by a bit. Jones was horrendous.
No he wasn't. Had Fitz stayed at QB, the Dolphins make the playoffs. Flores screwed up. Tua was awful anytime I was watched a Dolphins game.
The numbers say otherwise.
I agree Tua stunk, but Jones was even worse. Go look at the pro football reference page. It's all there.
In his first year under Shurmur Jones was impressive before regressing under Garrett. When has Tua impressed anybody ?
That’s an extreme oversimplification. Of course wins matter but “drama” happens and prevents wins, we see it all the time. I don’t know why people think distractions don’t exist. You are talking about 50+ guys all with different personalities and making wildly different amounts of money. Jealousy, egos, etc are all issues on every team and how it’s handled often leads to cohesion or dysfunction.
The giants example doesn’t make sense. We overachieved and the games we lost weren’t due to turmoil amongst the players - they just didn’t have the horses. When we won we felt unity because our HC exudes how important that is with every fiber of his being.
In sum, Tua came in with a lot of hype and didn’t really do much. Wasn’t awful but wasn’t good either. I never understood the “tank for tua” crap we read on BBI, never liked his size/injury history and I suspect that will impact his pro career. He’s a good kid though so I hope he does well, but I wouldn’t feel confident if I was a Dolphins fan.
I would imagine that the mental aspect of quarterbacking comes later in the evolutionary process for young signal callers so I wouldn't be so quick to draw conclusions after nine starting assignments.
With that said, Tua's production wasn't as dreadful as some would lead you to believe. If I told you that a 22 year old quarterback went 6-3 with an 11:5 ratio and 1800 yards to go along with a 64% completion percentage and a few scores on the ground in his first nine starts, I think most of us would consider it a tentatively positive sign for things to come.
If I added further context that the player was about a year removed from major surgery, operated under an OC that explicitly implemented a sheltered playbook, and had a supporting cast of three rookie starting lineman and perhaps the worst collection of skill players in the NFL...you'd probably be even more impressed with that production. Tua certainly did not light the NFL on fire and he was very reliant on check downs but prior to the Buffalo game to end the season you saw a QB that protected the ball (11:2 at that point) and played within the confines of a conservative system.
Was Justin Herbert better? Of course (although Tua did outplay him and beat him in their matchup this season), I don't think many would argue that Herbert would go higher in a redraft. However, Herberts extraordinary rookie success isn't a death knell for other QBs that didn't ascend as rapidly.
Was Justin Herbert better? Of course (although Tua did outplay him and beat him in their matchup this season), I don't think many would argue that Herbert would go higher in a redraft.
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In comment 15121732 section125 said:
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In comment 15121704 Go Terps said:
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In comment 15121620 section125 said:
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In comment 15121453 Greg from LI said:
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He didn't. He was worse. Terps is right, I never got it with him. Better than Hurts, yes.
Whatever. Hope he has a good career.
Tua was better than Jones by a bit. Jones was horrendous.
No he wasn't. Had Fitz stayed at QB, the Dolphins make the playoffs. Flores screwed up. Tua was awful anytime I was watched a Dolphins game.
The numbers say otherwise.
I agree Tua stunk, but Jones was even worse. Go look at the pro football reference page. It's all there.
In his first year under Shurmur Jones was impressive before regressing under Garrett. When has Tua impressed anybody ?
I guess that depends on your definition of impressive. I don't agree.
I think Tua had a far superior year to Jones - I watched all of Jones' starts other than the first half of AZ and about 4 of Tua's.
Greg Cosell was recently evaluating Tua's year and said the Dolphins really dummied down the offense to keep it simple. Give him one quick read and hopefully get the short, easy completion. Which explains his very underwhelming 6.3 YPA.
Thinks his arm talent is still very questionable.
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The knock on Tua is that he didn't flash elite skills. That's a fair point. I don't understand how anyone could say he was objectively bad. His numbers overall were okay. Not great or anything, but okay for a rookie starter in an offense fairly light on talent.
Greg Cosell was recently evaluating Tua's year and said the Dolphins really dummied down the offense to keep it simple. Give him one quick read and hopefully get the short, easy completion. Which explains his very underwhelming 6.3 YPA.
Thinks his arm talent is still very questionable.
I thought of Chad Pennington watching Tua. Was his arm better pre-injury?
Recall, coming out of Bama one of Tua's strengths was supposed to be an accurate deep ball and that part of his game was nowhere to be found this year. Now part of this is because there's a difference in being "college open" and "NFL open" and Tua certainly needs to adjust to this after having benefited from talent mismatches every Saturday at Bama. The putrid supporting cast in Miami further compounded this issue and a big talking point this season was Fitz telling Tua to force the ball to players even if they don't appear open (hence why Fitz is more of a boom/bust QB). As mentioned, he doesn't have the Allen or Herbert arm and he's been coached to avoid turnovers so I have to believe it manifested itself in a complete lack of risk taking down the field. I also suspect play design intentionally limited his opportunities to make plays. Interestingly enough, his most impressive flashes come after the called play broke down and he was improvising.
Now the cynic could also say that the strict training wheels are an indictment of his talent or perhaps what the staff his limitations to be but the word from the staff and front-office has been consistent in their support so far. I guess time will tell.
The draft is a crapshoot at any position; guys overperform and underperform their draft position all the time. It's not an exact science. Everybody misses on picks; everybody gets lucky occasionally in the late rounds or UDFA. The better GMs are more consistent but they still miss.
QB is even more of a crapshoot. Guys who look like world-beaters in college don't amount to anything in the NFL. Sometimes you get Ryan Leaf, sometimes you get Josh Allen, sometimes you get RGIII (who looked like a star until he didn't).