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NFT: James Harden traded to Nets

ryanmkeane : 1/13/2021 4:12 pm
no word on the details yet, but it's official per Woj and Shams
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RE: RE: RE: RE: How In The World Is This A Plus For The Nets?  
Eric on Li : 1/13/2021 6:20 pm : link
In comment 15121625 Strahan91 said:
Quote:
In comment 15121609 Eric on Li said:


Quote:



my 2 favorite things from this trade (from a nets fan):

1. makes it likelier that KD stays beyond current deal
2. makes Kyrie somewhat dispensable

I can't imagine Kyrie is going to turn a 180 so quickly to not returning, however I think at this point they have to know they just can't rely on him at all.


I get the Kyrie viewpoint but I don't think you should be worried about KD staying beyond his current deal. He'll be heading into a season at 35 years old in the first year of a new deal.


Lebron turned 36 a couple weeks ago (and won a trophy last year at 35). With the draft picks and swaps out there they need to hope KD can similarly play at a high level into his mid to late 30's.

His current deal runs through 2023, the draft picks run for several years after that. Harden is a year younger too, so between the 2 of them that should keep those picks in the 20's.

As a Net fan i'm not thrilled with this but the best positive I can see is that it hopefully extends the window to compete for championships with KD even if it's just ensuring he's here for a couple more years than his current deal.
Lebron is always the exception, not the rule.  
Strahan91 : 1/13/2021 6:25 pm : link
He's like Tom Brady, just a complete freak of nature. Lebron has hardly ever been injured for a guy his age who's been in the league as long as he has. Is it possible KD is similar? Of course but he hasn't been as durable as Lebron over his career and the odds are against it. 35 is right around the age (off the top of my head) Wade, Duncan, and Dirk began to decline.
.  
Del Shofner : 1/13/2021 6:30 pm : link
In comment 15121533 larryflower37 said:
Quote:
I really don't understand the desperation by the Nets to do this deal, they were a really deep team that was probably the best team in the east.
I personally don't like the deal for the Nets.


I'm with you there. Mortgaged the future too.
Andre Drummond  
jacob12 : 1/13/2021 6:34 pm : link
Andre Drummond is having a superb season. Andre is leading the NBA in rebounds and averaging 18 points a game.
RE: .  
81_Great_Dane : 1/13/2021 6:37 pm : link
In comment 15121531 Anando said:
Quote:


Quote:



Sources: Full current trade:

Rockets: Victor Oladipo, Dante Exum, Rodions Kurucs, 3 BKN first-rounders (22, 24, 26), 1 MIL first (22, unprotected), 4 BKN 1st round swaps (21, 23, 25, 27)

Nets: James Harden

Pacers: Caris LeVert, 2nd-rounder

Cavs: Jarrett Allen, Taurean Prince
4:25 PM · Jan 13, 2021·TweetDeck
Those swaps are at Houston's option, correct? Not the Nets' option? Highly unlikely Houston has a better record than the Nets this season, so the swap for 21 would be worthless, right?
RE: Lebron is always the exception, not the rule.  
Eric on Li : 1/13/2021 6:48 pm : link
In comment 15121632 Strahan91 said:
Quote:
He's like Tom Brady, just a complete freak of nature. Lebron has hardly ever been injured for a guy his age who's been in the league as long as he has. Is it possible KD is similar? Of course but he hasn't been as durable as Lebron over his career and the odds are against it. 35 is right around the age (off the top of my head) Wade, Duncan, and Dirk began to decline.


I believe Duncan was still getting MVP votes and making all star games in his age 35/36/37 seasons. Dirk was still putting up big numbers through age 37. KD is a near 7 footer with uncommon skill so I think those are probably the most apt comparisons as opposed to someone like Wade.

But of course there's no real way to predict how a player will age.
Duncan and Dirk  
TommyWiseau : 1/13/2021 7:02 pm : link
Did not tear their achilles. This was a trade to bring in a ring ASAP. Is the trade worth it? If they get a title, it 100% was worth it. If they don't, it was a major fail. That's the only way you can grade this trade IMO.
Two years ago...  
bw in dc : 1/13/2021 7:10 pm : link
the Nets were so enjoyable to watch and root for under Atkinson.

Now this...
RE: Two years ago...  
SFGFNCGiantsFan : 1/13/2021 7:12 pm : link
In comment 15121662 bw in dc said:
Quote:
the Nets were so enjoyable to watch and root for under Atkinson.

Now this...


Well, it'll be a circus for sure.
RE: Duncan and Dirk  
Eric on Li : 1/13/2021 7:16 pm : link
In comment 15121655 TommyWiseau said:
Quote:
Did not tear their achilles. This was a trade to bring in a ring ASAP. Is the trade worth it? If they get a title, it 100% was worth it. If they don't, it was a major fail. That's the only way you can grade this trade IMO.


Agreed - that's why I think 1 of the benefits of this trade was potentially extending the window of contention.

If Kyrie takes his sage burning talents to the peace corps or something, what are the odds of KD picking up his option for 2022-23?
I agree...  
SFGFNCGiantsFan : 1/13/2021 7:18 pm : link
This trade is a success if Nets win it all, a failure if they don't. Pretty black & white.
Pretty exciting  
PhilSimms15 : 1/13/2021 7:22 pm : link
As a Knicks fan I really admire how the Nets have pushed their chips into the middle of the table. It’s really hard to win a title in any major sport and if you have a chance you go for it.

The Nets paid a huge price, but it’s worth it.

Contrast it to the Knicks whose big acquisition this year is Alec Burks.

Another big attribute of this deal is that young people in the New York area 10 to 20 years old will have a choice to pick teams to follow and which would you choose? Seems pretty clear to me. As a 25 year season ticket holder, I’m stuck with the Knicks but if I was 12, I’d go Durant and Harden not Randle and RJ.

The Nets must realize they have a real chance to take the city.
I know this is just how it is ....  
Jim from Katonah : 1/13/2021 7:24 pm : link
... in the NBA these days, but as star aggregating continues to pick up steam, gotta wonder how it impacts the fan base of so many teams on the outside looking. It was always fun to watch a team grow organically, get to know the players — exactly what the Nets were doing with Atkinson. Yes, yes, the point is to win it all, I get it — but with all the entertainment options available to folks today, wonder if this is a sustainable biz model for the NBA. Jesus, I sound so old lol. Get off my lawn, Beard!
RE: Pretty exciting  
Jim from Katonah : 1/13/2021 7:26 pm : link
In comment 15121675 PhilSimms15 said:
Quote:
As a Knicks fan I really admire how the Nets have pushed their chips into the middle of the table. It’s really hard to win a title in any major sport and if you have a chance you go for it.

The Nets paid a huge price, but it’s worth it.

Contrast it to the Knicks whose big acquisition this year is Alec Burks.

Another big attribute of this deal is that young people in the New York area 10 to 20 years old will have a choice to pick teams to follow and which would you choose? Seems pretty clear to me. As a 25 year season ticket holder, I’m stuck with the Knicks but if I was 12, I’d go Durant and Harden not Randle and RJ.

The Nets must realize they have a real chance to take the city.


I like your take on this better than mine. I hereby retract my grumpy opinion, and adopt yours!
The Nets will NEVER take over NYC.  
SFGFNCGiantsFan : 1/13/2021 7:27 pm : link
Nope. Nada. Ain't happening. The Nets will forever be little brother to the Knicks. It's like the Clips in LA; even during Lob City, I'd go home & the Clips were a distant second to the Lakers, who were at a nadir in my lifetime.
I notice this among many coworkers of mine in their 20s...  
SFGFNCGiantsFan : 1/13/2021 7:29 pm : link
They don't necessarily follow/like a team, but follow/like certain players. Now, perhaps that's because where I am the local NBA team (the Hornets) haven't exactly been something to write home about, but I wonder if that's a trend nationwide.
RE: I notice this among many coworkers of mine in their 20s...  
Jim from Katonah : 1/13/2021 7:36 pm : link
In comment 15121683 SFGFNCGiantsFan said:
Quote:
They don't necessarily follow/like a team, but follow/like certain players. Now, perhaps that's because where I am the local NBA team (the Hornets) haven't exactly been something to write home about, but I wonder if that's a trend nationwide.


Agreed. Same goes with fantasy and the NFL. My kids are way more into their fantasy teams than the Giants. My son is like, Jones sucks, my QB is Mahomes lol.
Thinking more about this trade..  
Sean : 1/13/2021 7:42 pm : link
I think the Nets had to make it. Once Durant was signed, their intent was clear - build a super team and win a title. You have no choice to go all in while the iron is hot. This will be their best chance to win a title with Durant & Harden in their primes (who knows with Kyrie).
Jim I think your point is something the NBA needs to grapple with  
Eric on Li : 1/13/2021 7:44 pm : link
and to a degree has - the current environment is a direct result of the max salary system. If the amount of money you make is the same with employer, how would anyone make a decision? The important factors would obviously be relationships (teammates), location, perks (winning), etc. Lebron sort of blazed the trail but it was a pretty logical conclusion which is why others followed.

The way they have adapted thus far is the super max extension and early max qualifications for teams who draft superstars. There have been some successful extensions so perhaps that's enough for the next generation of super stars to behave differently than Lebron/KD/Kawhi whose main perk was 1 extra guaranteed year that they knew they'd likely get paid big for any way.
RE: Thinking more about this trade..  
Eric on Li : 1/13/2021 7:48 pm : link
In comment 15121695 Sean said:
Quote:
I think the Nets had to make it. Once Durant was signed, their intent was clear - build a super team and win a title. You have no choice to go all in while the iron is hot. This will be their best chance to win a title with Durant & Harden in their primes (who knows with Kyrie).


I begrudgingly feel the same way, though I do think there was another possible path (which was admittedly riskier in some ways).
Allen  
hitdog42 : 1/13/2021 7:53 pm : link
is younger then Obi Toppin. What a steal that is for a Bucks pick that wont be high.
RE: RE: Thinking more about this trade..  
SFGFNCGiantsFan : 1/13/2021 7:56 pm : link
In comment 15121701 Eric on Li said:
Quote:
In comment 15121695 Sean said:


Quote:


I think the Nets had to make it. Once Durant was signed, their intent was clear - build a super team and win a title. You have no choice to go all in while the iron is hot. This will be their best chance to win a title with Durant & Harden in their primes (who knows with Kyrie).



I begrudgingly feel the same way, though I do think there was another possible path (which was admittedly riskier in some ways).


Beal? I think the Nets gave up a ton, but if results in a title, it'll be worth it.
RE: Allen  
Eric on Li : 1/13/2021 7:57 pm : link
In comment 15121707 hitdog42 said:
Quote:
is younger then Obi Toppin. What a steal that is for a Bucks pick that wont be high.


Value was diminished since it's his walk year. But agree, it's sort of deflating to see him leave for so little. He took the next step this year and is going to get paid big in the next few months.
RE: RE: RE: Thinking more about this trade..  
Eric on Li : 1/13/2021 7:59 pm : link
In comment 15121709 SFGFNCGiantsFan said:
Quote:
In comment 15121701 Eric on Li said:


Quote:


In comment 15121695 Sean said:


Quote:


I think the Nets had to make it. Once Durant was signed, their intent was clear - build a super team and win a title. You have no choice to go all in while the iron is hot. This will be their best chance to win a title with Durant & Harden in their primes (who knows with Kyrie).



I begrudgingly feel the same way, though I do think there was another possible path (which was admittedly riskier in some ways).



Beal? I think the Nets gave up a ton, but if results in a title, it'll be worth it.


Maybe Beal, maybe some other smaller scale moves. But basically trying to compete with the team mostly as it was while building something consistent owning all their own picks, etc.
I gotta say the irony of people  
Osi Osi Osi OyOyOy : 1/13/2021 8:25 pm : link
Calling Harden a loser while also shitting on the “team up to win” mindset of the NBA is hilarious. Harden ended his run in Houston like a b1tch but I will always be a fan of his for how he carried the franchise on his back and consistently got results no matter the cast. He won 1 MVP, and could easily have won 2 or 3 more. Since he was with the Rockets, no one played more minutes or scored more points. He has been an iron man and a legendary offensive force.

He’s not the best player in the game. But he’s been the 4th best player of this era behind LeBron, KD, and Curry. Maybe 5th if you consider Kawhi, but Kawhi could never carry a franchise the way Harden did so it’s tough.

It sucks that the Warriors owned the Harden Rockets, but that was a legendary team especially with KD. Maybe if CP3 doesn’t get hurt they could pull it off in 18, but it wasn’t meant to be.

Already the team has young talent and picks to work with to get back to contender status. I wish Harden the best of luck, he’s absolutely a legend and hopefully he returns to his MVP levels after the trade.
RE: I gotta say the irony of people  
Eric on Li : 1/13/2021 8:38 pm : link
In comment 15121740 Osi Osi Osi OyOyOy said:
Quote:
Calling Harden a loser while also shitting on the “team up to win” mindset of the NBA is hilarious. Harden ended his run in Houston like a b1tch but I will always be a fan of his for how he carried the franchise on his back and consistently got results no matter the cast. He won 1 MVP, and could easily have won 2 or 3 more. Since he was with the Rockets, no one played more minutes or scored more points. He has been an iron man and a legendary offensive force.

He’s not the best player in the game. But he’s been the 4th best player of this era behind LeBron, KD, and Curry. Maybe 5th if you consider Kawhi, but Kawhi could never carry a franchise the way Harden did so it’s tough.

It sucks that the Warriors owned the Harden Rockets, but that was a legendary team especially with KD. Maybe if CP3 doesn’t get hurt they could pull it off in 18, but it wasn’t meant to be.

Already the team has young talent and picks to work with to get back to contender status. I wish Harden the best of luck, he’s absolutely a legend and hopefully he returns to his MVP levels after the trade.


Harden asking for a trade is definitely a lot less lame than others. He obviously didn't choose to trade himself to Houston and like you said he gave them a great run. They are going in another direction and it's not crazy that he'd want to try to win elsewhere.

KD going to GS was the most egregious ring chase, even more than "the decision".
RE: This trade is exactly why I can't stand the NBA  
TJ : 1/13/2021 9:15 pm : link
In comment 15121603 Rick in Dallas said:
Quote:
A douchebag like Harden being paid millions by his employer and under contract acts like a malcontent to get traded. If the Nets don't win a title in the next couple of years they are screwed in the future.
Terrible trade and speaks volumes about the spoiled millionaire athletes in the NBA.


Says absolutely zero about the players.

Owners make the deals to bring big names to town. Fans fill the seats and buy the merch and supply the money that owners use to make the deals.
This Trade Never Would Have Happened...  
looie : 1/13/2021 9:30 pm : link
...if Irving hadn’t decided to be so cavalier about his basketball career. Perhaps he’ll just retire, which would be a good thing. Bw in dc said it best: this team was so much more fun to watch and grow under Atkinson.
RE: RE: This trade is exactly why I can't stand the NBA  
Producer : 1/13/2021 9:36 pm : link
In comment 15121608 Leg of Theismann said:
Quote:
In comment 15121603 Rick in Dallas said:


Quote:


A douchebag like Harden being paid millions by his employer and under contract acts like a malcontent to get traded. If the Nets don't win a title in the next couple of years they are screwed in the future.
Terrible trade and speaks volumes about the spoiled millionaire athletes in the NBA.



Meh. And the owners are spoiled billionaires and often act like it (just like NFL and MLB owners).

NBA is more of a player-driven league than just about any other major sport. More and more people are tuning in to root for players instead of teams. A big reason for this is because in basketball adding one superstar can change your team's playoff/championship chances astronomically in a way that doesn't work in football & baseball. The players have a ton of power and leverage and they know it and use it. Simple as that.


This take is correct. Add to this the fact Basketball is a 5x5 game. One great player is huge in increasing your chances to win a title.
Veterans needed  
Longtimelurker : 1/13/2021 10:36 pm : link
Interesting to see what veterans may get buy outs at the end of the season and accept a minimum contract. A Tristan Thompson type guy and/or a 3 and D guy would help.
RE: Worst Trade in NBA History  
jhibb : 1/13/2021 11:23 pm : link
In comment 15121545 BradberryGlue said:
Quote:
And it’s not close

2 best young players and 7 Round 1s for a guy who only passes for his assist column

1 ball

No D

Pretender Status


As a Nets fan, I had mixed feelings about the trade, but I feel much better about it after reading this take.
The Nets now have to play like a man.  
manh george : 1/14/2021 2:59 am : link
With two balls.
Four #1s -  
Beer Man : 1/14/2021 7:59 am : link
Wow, that's a lot of premium draft capital for guy in his 30s
Now Its NBA Title or Bust  
LTIsTheGreatest : 1/14/2021 9:14 am : link
if the Nets don't win the Championship, this trade will go down as one of the worst in history. Nets pretty much mortgaged their entire immeditate future. Still shocked they included Jarret Allen in this deal. He was one guy I deemed untouchable
oh you poor poor nets fans  
djm : 1/14/2021 10:20 am : link
cry me a fucking river. Some of you are disgusted with this move? tell you what, let's switch fucking places and come back to me with how disgusted you are.

I had a raging debate last night about how soft and pussy like Durant and Harden are and how the Nets are now a dumpster fire in waiting. Just shut up with the stupid. Dumpster fire? Disgusted?

See you in the finals. Poor guys.

Do you guys realize what you gave up for this trifecta of talent? You now have 3 all nba talents --even if and when flat earth boy stays off the rails like he is now, you have harden there to soften the blow. You are loaded. Stop crying and watch a fucking game with real talent and get a fucking grip. Christ.

The worst part of the deal for the Nets is the pick swaps. everything else is trash. This is nothing like the Garnett/Pierce deal. NOTHING. That deal was doomed from the jump. The Nets weren't any good and Pierce/garnett were cooked.
shouldn't say everything else is trash  
djm : 1/14/2021 10:22 am : link
but you gave up good for great. That's how shit works. Want to go all in and have a shot? This is what you do.

Disgusted....go back to the 40 win days and and watch that nice little team go nowhere or live in the NBA finals for the next 3 years. My heart goes out to you all.
RE: Now Its NBA Title or Bust  
djm : 1/14/2021 10:26 am : link
In comment 15121948 LTIsTheGreatest said:
Quote:
if the Nets don't win the Championship, this trade will go down as one of the worst in history. Nets pretty much mortgaged their entire immeditate future. Still shocked they included Jarret Allen in this deal. He was one guy I deemed untouchable


Yea, with all due respect this is bullshit. If the Nets are a great team the next 3 years but don't win a title that doesn't mean it's a disaster and it's not even close to a bad trade let alone the worst in history. Can we stop with this all or nothing nonsense? The Nets didn't just trade away an NBA title in waiting. They traded away two good players and a bunch of late first rounders.

The nets already one of the worst trades ever about 5 years ago. This isn't even close.
RE: Four #1s -  
djm : 1/14/2021 10:26 am : link
In comment 15121915 Beer Man said:
Quote:
Wow, that's a lot of premium draft capital for guy in his 30s


Not premium. Filler. Every pick will be 24 or later. The swaps are bigger.
i swear some of you have the weirdest memory  
djm : 1/14/2021 10:44 am : link
you remember shit that isn't important and love to forget the shit that matters. Have we never ever seen teams with 3-4 stars succeed before? Huh? What the hell were the GS Warriors? Or even Boston? Or basically every good to great final teams over the last 50 years? Now teams that field 2-3 offensive stars can't make it work, because why? When did this happen?

for years all I heard was you need to build a super team. Now that's out. Now the Nets represent everything that is wrong with the NBA and are doomed to fail because of too many stars. That. Is. Rich.

See you in the finals. Poor guys.
i didn't want to make a trade  
hitdog42 : 1/14/2021 11:05 am : link
because i do enjoy the build up from the bottom.
but I am not going to sit here and pretend that it wont give them a better chance to win a title by doing this... it will. the picks for the next 3-4 years should be entirely irrelevant. they lose levert but gain harden. Prince was playing awful. if they had dinwiddie nobody would notice levert gone either from the depth side. (and i like levert but calling a spade a spade he is quite inefficient). Allen and the last 2 picks they lose or swap on the back end will be how they are judged if they don't get a title.
the role players they have (plus a vet or 2 they add mid year i am sure) given them more then enough depth- and they will space out harden and kyrie to have ball dominant times of the floor alone (if kyrie is playing!).
Nets  
TyreeHelmet : 1/14/2021 11:32 am : link
Stars, shooters and perimeter play is everything in the current league. And the Nets are now completely loaded in those categories. They could put out 4 truly elite shooters- they are the opposite of the Knicks.

Theres risk in everything but this trade was something they had to do. They are the clear favorites in the East now for the next few years. A remarkable turnaround for this franchise. Nets fans should be thrilled and excited. I would be ecstatic to have this roster on the Knicks.
...  
SFGFNCGiantsFan : 1/14/2021 11:35 am : link
Any word about Kyrie ending his sabbatical?
Yeah, once things calm down I think  
bceagle05 : 1/14/2021 11:38 am : link
people realize this trade was a no-brainer. Imagine if the Nets came up short these next couple of years with Durant/Irving and had to live with the fact they COULD have pulled the trigger on a Harden trade, but didn't? You have to go all in - Marks has already proven he can rebuild from scratch when the time comes. They'll find a big during buyout season to throw out there during crunch time with the Big 3 and Joe Harris, and will likely coast to the Finals unless Kyrie just retires.
RE: I am not a fan of the NBA  
Darth Paul : 1/14/2021 11:41 am : link
In comment 15121503 johnnyb said:
Quote:
but this is a huge trade.

Love to see the Nets beat the Knicks to players.


Yeah, Knicks were in it till the end....
I’m ranting and raving more  
djm : 1/14/2021 11:57 am : link
In defense of harden and even Durant than I’m defending the trade. I am defending it, but what really grinds my gears is this weird hatred fans have for harden and Durant. Listening to Knicks fans last night (not here) go on and on about how soft Durant is because he’s not an alpha due to the GS move or how harden is a cancer and no defense and bla bla fucking bla. Just shut it. Harden is the best scoring guard in the game or damn close and his style of play leads to wins. Period. Don’t tell me he hasn’t won shit. He’s won plenty. And the Durant nonsense too, wahhhh he’s not tough because he wanted to play for a great team and waahhh he’s not an alpha just stop with the high school drama garbage.
djm...  
SFGFNCGiantsFan : 1/14/2021 11:58 am : link
Both are super talents, no doubt. But I still think it was incredibly weak on KD's part to join the Warriors. That's just my opinion.
RE: RE: So Kyrie didn't like playing behind LeBron  
MotownGIANTS : 1/14/2021 12:04 pm : link
In comment 15121544 UConn4523 said:
Quote:
In comment 15121541 LawrenceTaylor56 said:


Quote:


He's going to be okay now playing behind KD and now Harden?



Maybe? Gotta think age plays a factor here - Irving clearly though he could do it all on his own back then. He must realize now that isn’t the case (you’d think, haha). I also don’t think the shadow cast by Harden/Durant is as big either.


He is going to go full revolt now ...it is going to be hilarious
This will only work  
nygiants16 : 1/14/2021 12:18 pm : link
If Harden and Irving fall behind Durant, if all 3 try to play their normal games it will never work
Nets will definitely build their fan base  
PhilSimms15 : 1/14/2021 1:54 pm : link
If you are a 10 or 12 year old and you are deciding which team to root for, why would any child pick the Knicks UNESS of course, their Dad or Mom is a fan.

Dolan has taken NY Knick fans for granted for many years. I am going into my 26th year of Knick season tickets, and I have never got so much as a thank you for your patronage.

Also looks like the Knicks are a good 2-3 years from seriously competing and the recent games for their young guys (last night was better) has not been stellar except for Mitch and maybe Knox.

RE: This Trade Never Would Have Happened...  
jestersdead : 1/14/2021 2:00 pm : link
In comment 15121811 looie said:
Quote:
...if Irving hadn’t decided to be so cavalier about his basketball career. Perhaps he’ll just retire, which would be a good thing. Bw in dc said it best: this team was so much more fun to watch and grow under Atkinson.

Completely agree with most of this. I think the current Kyrie fiasco forced them to pull the trigger on this trade. Wouldn't be shocked if KD told them to do it, immediately.

Any chance the Nets can move Kyrie before the AS break?
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