Watching playoff football depresses the heck out of me. I’m so sick of the Giants sucking. I don’t care what the Giants did in past decades. The Giants are now in the company of the dredges of the league in playoff win droughts.
For all the principals to keep their jobs the Giants really need a winning season. I’m so sick of the excuses of what Mara did to Gettleman, what Gettleman did to Manning, what Manning did to Mara’s cat, what Mara’s cat did to Jones.
It’s time to cut the crap and systematically cut out the excuses. The Giants don’t have insane ownership, play in a crap city, play in an ancient stadium, or have a losing legacy. The Giants have zero built-in excuses to suck.
If Jones can’t pair gaining yards, throwing touchdowns, and a low turnover rate — replace him.
If Barkley can’t pair a healthy season, with fewer negative runs, and good productivity, don’t extend him.
Don’t sit on your hands and expect Lemieux, Gates, and Peart to defy the odds and anchor the line, go get a top shelf veteran too.
Don’t expect more miracles at the skill positions, go get a unequivocal no. 1 WR.
Pick where you want to rush the passer — either go get a 3 down outside linebacker who can edge rusher, or sign Williams and Tomlinson.
Wrap up the corner position, and pair Bradberry with a league average counter part.
Just when I think a point of absurdity can't be reached, it is taken by storm by a marauding band with red-hot pitchfork tines.
He's fucking doing it again!! Who coaches this schmuck?
Jesus Christ - why don't we get a Lombardi comment to go with that?? Walsh coached predominantly in an era with no salary cap. An era where there was an upper tier of teams from both a talent and coaching standpoint.
Since 2000, there has been turnover of more than 50% of the playoff teams year over year consistently. Those "8 teams" rotate in and out. It's why the NFC South went through an 8 year stretch without a repeat division winner. It's why the NFC East is in a stretch like that now.
Can we get some wisdom from George Halas while you're fucking at it??
Why the fuck does that matter if I can just take a still shot and make comments from that?
Jones and Barkley have a ton to prove moving forward, otherwise it will be time to seek replacements. If Jones winds up not the QB of the future, it potentially sets things back again.
Incredible.
There was too much talk about adding playmakers to the offense after the season was over from front office regarding what they need to do differently. So this was clearly a coordinated message that they have specifically discussed already and shows necessary support for their commitment with Daniel Jones.
I genuinely like discussing football with you. In the minority of time you stick to football you're a pleasant exchange. Your little explosions with little to no value have swung from the minority to the majority of your posts over the years. I miss the 1999 version of you, you peppered more football into your rants then.
Incredible.
It's not the hitch, it's the long motion with lots of moving parts. Spend 15 minutes looking at clips from both years.
This is a guy who's led the league in fumbles per drop back both of his years in the NFL. This isn't mysterious.
Unfortunately, the situation is a bit desperate to score more via the passing game to everyone. And right/wrong/indifferent this front office has shown tendencies in recent past of making mistakes when desperate.
We shall see if happens again.
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Why the fuck does that matter if I can just take a still shot and make comments from that?
I genuinely like discussing football with you. In the minority of time you stick to football you're a pleasant exchange. Your little explosions with little to no value have swung from the minority to the majority of your posts over the years. I miss the 1999 version of you, you peppered more football into your rants then.
C'mon. What is there seriously to discuss when a snapshot of Jones is shown and you have a group of people saying "Yep. There's a problem!!".
We aren't discussing football. We are having a confirmation bias circle jerk taken from a still shot, framed under the guise of there being some "Aha" moment not seen with other QB's.
There are plenty of threads where I'm talking about football. I'm trying to figure out where the football discussion is on this one.
If I'm drawing up a fantasy offseason -- I trim the fat of veterans (Solder, Tate, Zeitler, and the minor characters) and got after:
1) Thuney as the prize of the offseason
2) A Sam Ebukam type, value edge rush linebacker to replace Frackrell
3) A Rashard Higgins type, WR who's arrow is pointing way up
3)
Unfortunately, the situation is a bit desperate to score more via the passing game to everyone. And right/wrong/indifferent this front office has shown tendencies in recent past of making mistakes when desperate.
We shall see if happens again.
Holy shit, I keep forgetting about Golden Tate, and I keep forgetting he's still on the team. Thank you for ruining my morning.
We aren't discussing football. We are having a confirmation bias circle jerk taken from a still shot, framed under the guise of there being some "Aha" moment not seen with other QB's.
There are plenty of threads where I'm talking about football. I'm trying to figure out where the football discussion is on this one.
Jones's throwing motion is something Terps and I have discussed at length over the last few months. I suspect that's why he posted it in this thread.
Jones has led the league in fumbles per drop back now twice. I think it's quite fair to question whether his wind up is a contributor.
If you take a look at the link I posed above, he seems get the ball knocked out of his hands a lot mid-motion.
Unfortunately, the situation is a bit desperate to score more via the passing game to everyone. And right/wrong/indifferent this front office has shown tendencies in recent past of making mistakes when desperate.
We shall see if happens again.
Show me the players to target, there are very few, is the point.
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C'mon. What is there seriously to discuss when a snapshot of Jones is shown and you have a group of people saying "Yep. There's a problem!!".
We aren't discussing football. We are having a confirmation bias circle jerk taken from a still shot, framed under the guise of there being some "Aha" moment not seen with other QB's.
There are plenty of threads where I'm talking about football. I'm trying to figure out where the football discussion is on this one.
Jones's throwing motion is something Terps and I have discussed at length over the last few months. I suspect that's why he posted it in this thread.
Jones has led the league in fumbles per drop back now twice. I think it's quite fair to question whether his wind up is a contributor.
If you take a look at the link I posed above, he seems get the ball knocked out of his hands a lot mid-motion.
And these type of fumbles seemed to disappear once we got some competent LT play. Is he still going to fumble a couple times a year because of this? Probably, but there are 100 things that are more important than this. It's not even Darnold or Jameis level bad.
The big issue with QBs fumbling is keeping the ball low before the throwing motion. Some guys, once the bullets fly the drop back to bad habits. DJ did a good job of cleaning that up this year. I'm more worried about him dropping the ball when he takes off to run. This needs to be cleaned up, but is extremely hard to beat out of guys. One thing at a time though and I feel like this is going to be the next coaching point as far as ball security.
This slightly extended throwing motion is not a big a deal as you are making it out to be and certainly something that doesn't need to be retooled at this point of time. Not even sure its worth it to fuck around with his mechanics. It's not even Darnold or Jameis level bad. It can be a tip on those intermediate or deep routes, but like I said, it's all about anticipation there anyway. Anticipation rules the day and why we need some guys that actually get open outside of Shep. Nothing to anticipate if nothing there. How many interceptions did he throw when going to Shep? My guess would be zero and there's a reason for that.
While I think a lot of fans point to 2020 as an example of a more reasonable shopping period for the Giants, desperation to get better sooner, and determine if Jones is the right piece at QB could tip the scales back to bad habits.
Like I suggested, we shall see.
LOL. I think the fact that Rivers can have a throwing motion like he's shot-putting a bowling ball, and still put up those numbers, is first ballot worthy... ;)
He's sort of the Jim Furyk of QBs. Somehow it worked...
In the last 7 seasons, 6 ended in DOUBLE DIGIT LOSSES.
41-71 over the last 7 years.
That sucks.
Some us are sick of excuses.
The constant defense of the NYG considering the magnitude of the suck is absurd.
To my eye, he's still holding the ball low and away from his body when he gets into his motion, he's tapping, and he's got an elongated delivery. All of those things logically contribute to the ball coming out when he's hit. I group all of those thing together as the problem.
One part of the solution is getting him hit less. For all the optimism about the line progressing, the rate Jones was hit didn't really decrease over the 2nd half of the season (being injured contributes).
Seems like a compounding problem, Jones gets hit a lot, and when he gets hit he gives up the ball. Both those things could stand improvement.
DJ does not have anywhere near that type of stroke in his arsenal. Just too slow off the mark...
That divisional weakness should be more motivation to improve at quarterback if anything.
They should be scouting the QBs in FA and the draft hard.
By my standards?? You pulled a fucking still photo out and are breaking it down like you are a QB coach!!
And you think you've made an astute point!
Daniel Jones's throwing mechanics suck. Combine that with no pocket presence and it's no surprise he finally so much, and he's so often late in the red zone and on throws outside the numbers.
You want to say that's bullshit because I'm not Bill Walsh, fine. But you don't need to be a pilot to know a plane shouldn't be flown into a mountain.
DJ does not have anywhere near that type of stroke in his arsenal. Just too slow off the mark...
This is just not true, shit he showed he could do that in his very first game in the redzone TD to Shephard.
People are focusing way too much on what is going on up top and it's not even poor. Most QBs are bringing the ball down to throw intermediate or deep passes.
What that play really highlights is our need for a fucking WR that can go up and win 1 v 1 battles like that. I'm really hoping Kyle Pitts is there and the pick.
The big deal about mechanics is they generate consistent results. It's really overblown as there are lots of ways to skin a cat. Shit I can show you a ton of throws Mahomes misses because his feet stink. It's not like DJ is consistently missing throws. In fact, he's certainly plus in this category. The problem with this team is opportunites in pass game are absolutely limited because of the talent among our pass catchers so every miss gets blown to kingdom come.
Still needs to pick the ball up once he decideds to run, and certainly an uphill battle here, but one ball security coaching point at a time.
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Go watch that first TD Rodgers threw last week near the goalline to Adams. It is uncanny how quickly he threw that ball, and with speed and mustard.
DJ does not have anywhere near that type of stroke in his arsenal. Just too slow off the mark...
This is just not true, shit he showed he could do that in his very first game in the redzone TD to Shephard.
People are focusing way too much on what is going on up top and it's not even poor. Most QBs are bringing the ball down to throw intermediate or deep passes.
What that play really highlights is our need for a fucking WR that can go up and win 1 v 1 battles like that. I'm really hoping Kyle Pitts is there and the pick.
The ball being low in DJ's windup is less concerning to me than his slower, longer windup. I wonder if Jones can make an adjustment to a shorter, more efficient stroke. It's a very tough thing to alter muscle memory like that. But in my opinion he should consider it...
I seriously doubt you think DJ has the type of throw I was referring to in the Rodgers example. That's just a different level of class.
Look, I'm big into big arm talent. That just provides such a luxury when you can't be mechanically sound. And greater margin for error. Unfortunately, that's just not who Jones is. Which may be fine, but the clock is ticking...
Wow, that is a lot. It sounds like Jones is a project.
I watched that throw Rodgers made and its not like this was a throw 30 yards down the sideline. It was a 12-15 yard back shoulder to sideline. Except it wasn't even a good throw though, Adams made a play and took it to the house. We need a guy that can do that. Go look at the throw DJ makes to Shep in that Bucs game to corner of the endzone. High Difficulty throw with touch that comes out with lighting quick release.
The questions are there on his decision making and reading the field.
The two above were comments from this season.
From Ourlads scouting prior to being drafted:
Outstanding mechanics in both upper and lower body leads to consistently pretty and accurate throws. Creates an excellent throwing base with his legs and is typically squared to the target, maximizing a less-than-elite, but still easily NFL-caliber arm.
CONS
Inconsistent. Rhythm player too easily knocked off rhythm. Prone to questionable decision making in the pocket, including forcing throws into traffic and failing to prioritize ball security
This talk about mechanics is a couple of schmucks on BBI playing the role of QB guru.
"Failing to prioritize ball security"
This is why I'm hopeful, it was obviously the biggest coaching point they went with into offseason and he's improved drastically there. He was higher and stronger with the ball going into the season and pretty much stopped forcing balls into coverage at all as the season went on.
There's a reason that they pretty much announced our intentions for this offseason because its OBVIOUS to the rest of the NFL. This team drastically needs weapons outside Saquon and we can't put all our eggs into that basket. It's hard to exhibit anticipation and reading the field well when nobody gets consistently open. We need to add something to actually understand what we have in DJ so that decision can be made because while I'm optimistic, it still needs to materialize.
Instead we have people here with pitchforks because he missed a backside check down 4th read that you pretty much should only expect out of very seasoned QBs. He keeps his eyes downfield, which at this stage is the most important thing. Problem is we don't have guys that get open down field.
Enjoy Jones's mechanics while you can. Between his limitations and the shortcomings of the people helping him, his days as the starting quarterback are numbered.
Insert any fucking excuse you want.
Results never matter on BBI.
All of that said, I have not given up on the kid.
Next year, the road needs to meet the rubber with Jones.
I am exhausted by the perennial kicking of the can down the road.
Win or GTFO.
With two years of NFL observation, you don't think his pre-throw mechanics have any bearing on how frequently the ball comes out when he's about to throw the ball?