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Mahomes Concussion?

mittenedman : 1/18/2021 8:58 am
I just watched the replay a few times and I cant for the life of me see how he got a concussion on this play. It doesnt even look like his head got hit at all.

Am I missing it? Sorry I cant post a video.
he was already bothered  
gidiefor : Mod : 1/18/2021 9:01 am : link
he may have gotten his head wrapped prior to that - but this spill just exacerbated it
Explanation that made most sense to me  
shyster : 1/18/2021 9:02 am : link
is that the brain can be concussed by acceleration that bounces it back and forth within the skull even if the skull does not sustain outside impact.

In this case, Mahomes head was pulled forward forcibly by the tackler.
It also..  
FatMan in Charlotte : 1/18/2021 9:03 am : link
looks like his head hit the turf pretty hard. His head was pushed straight down to the ground
I think he was choked...  
Johnny5 : 1/18/2021 9:04 am : link
... not concussed. That's my theory. His head did not hit anything that I could see. But the arm wrapped around his neck seemed to bother him going down.
RE: I think he was choked...  
FatMan in Charlotte : 1/18/2021 9:08 am : link
In comment 15126699 Johnny5 said:
Quote:
... not concussed. That's my theory. His head did not hit anything that I could see. But the arm wrapped around his neck seemed to bother him going down.


Except he was checked for a concussion and placed into the protocol
RE: Explanation that made most sense to me  
bigbluescot : 1/18/2021 9:08 am : link
In comment 15126695 shyster said:
Quote:
is that the brain can be concussed by acceleration that bounces it back and forth within the skull even if the skull does not sustain outside impact.

In this case, Mahomes head was pulled forward forcibly by the tackler.


Most concussions are due to that, the neck is a pretty decent shock absorber but the brain has movement in the skull.
Glazer in post game  
beatrixkiddo : 1/18/2021 9:14 am : link
Said he believes it was more of a choke out than a concussion, and thinks he will pass protocol easily.
Doesn't...  
JohnG in Albany : 1/18/2021 9:20 am : link
it take considerably longer than that to reduce the oxygen level to the brain via "choke out"?
RE: Glazer in post game  
bubba0825 : 1/18/2021 9:21 am : link
In comment 15126716 beatrixkiddo said:
Quote:
Said he believes it was more of a choke out than a concussion, and thinks he will pass protocol easily.


I don’t know about that, a solid minute after he could barely walk, the chiefs are 100% going to float stories that he’s fine until kickoff. Let the bills prep for both
Wouldn't be..  
FatMan in Charlotte : 1/18/2021 9:22 am : link
surprised if the Chiefs are minimizing it to make it seem minor.

But since Mahomes was placed into the concussion protocol, ultimately he'll have to be cleared by the independent test to play.
I also though choking could have been it  
UConn4523 : 1/18/2021 9:24 am : link
or even a combination of the two. I'm not sure how much stock I put into him going into the concussion protocol - its a precaution and something all players have to do if a concussion is suspected. We will know soon enough, its not something they can hide.
He got slammed by the arm of the tackler  
jsuds : 1/18/2021 9:28 am : link
Basically it looked to me that Mahomes was Jack Tatum'ed. That would concuss anyone.
I thought his head hit the turf pretty hard  
PatersonPlank : 1/18/2021 9:34 am : link
no?
He was concussed  
giantBCP : 1/18/2021 9:38 am : link
His head hit the turf pretty hard. If you look at the slow motion replay, you can clearly see his head hitting the turf, and if you look at the replay in real time, you can get an idea of how forceful it was.
Not buying the choke out  
SLIM_ : 1/18/2021 9:42 am : link
I've never seen someone get choked out for a dynamic event. What I mean by that is choking someone out takes a prolonged (I"m talking seconds not immediate like Mahomes) restriction of blood to the brain. This did not happen.

regardless  
Ron Johnson : 1/18/2021 9:43 am : link
of how it happened, he couldn't get to his feet. That is a KO. If they let him play one week later they risk his life.
Re: Turf hit?  
shyster : 1/18/2021 9:45 am : link
In comment 15126746 giantBCP said:
Quote:
His head hit the turf pretty hard. If you look at the slow motion replay, you can clearly see his head hitting the turf, and if you look at the replay in real time, you can get an idea of how forceful it was.


Disagree.

It looks like the turf hit is going to happen, but putting the replay at slowest speed and freeze framing, there is always space between turf and helmet.

His head is being pulled awkwardly forward by the tackler, which prevents it from going all the way down to the turf.

The pull forward could have accelerated the brain into the skull when it "caught up."
utube - ( New Window )
I don’t really want to argue  
giantBCP : 1/18/2021 9:51 am : link
about how he was concussed, but I think that it’s obvious that he was concussed, and pretty severely. The notion that he was “choked out” is pretty ridiculous.
RE: I don’t really want to argue  
Johnny5 : 1/18/2021 10:02 am : link
In comment 15126765 giantBCP said:
Quote:
about how he was concussed, but I think that it’s obvious that he was concussed, and pretty severely. The notion that he was “choked out” is pretty ridiculous.

lol... who says, you?

He may or may not have a concussion from whiplash, who knows it's all speculation. As for the choking, you know that you can pass yourself out in a couple of seconds just by holding your fingers on your carotid arteries... right?
RE: RE: I don’t really want to argue  
Mad Mike : 1/18/2021 10:06 am : link
In comment 15126773 Johnny5 said:
Quote:
He may or may not have a concussion from whiplash, who knows it's all speculation. As for the choking, you know that you can pass yourself out in a couple of seconds just by holding your fingers on your carotid arteries... right?

But he clearly didn't have pressure applied to his neck for a few seconds.
It’s not speculation  
giantBCP : 1/18/2021 10:08 am : link
He was put into the concussion protocol because doctors diagnosed him with a concussion.
When I saw it, I thought it  
RobCrossRiver56 : 1/18/2021 10:20 am : link
was the defenders arm that hit Mahomes pretty hard in the neck area then he fell to the turf.
It's pretty clearly a concussion  
rasbutant : 1/18/2021 10:32 am : link
I'm not a doctor, but this doctor on youtube explains it.....makes sense to me.
Link - ( New Window )
RE: It's pretty clearly a concussion  
rasbutant : 1/18/2021 10:35 am : link
In comment 15126796 rasbutant said:
Quote:
I'm not a doctor, but this doctor on youtube explains it.....makes sense to me. Link - ( New Window )


Also, from the comment section of the video he address the chocking theory....

"For those saying he was choked out, first of all loss of consciousness from low blood flow would not cause fencing response. And second, the compression isn't long enough to cause LOC imo. Think of UFC fights. It takes a good 5+ seconds of a choke for a guy to go out. This was a second or two, maybe. Third, the angle of contact from the defenders arm is more straight down onto shoulder pads, not into the neck directly."
Mahomes' face guard lands on the ball  
Lurts : 1/18/2021 10:45 am : link
snapping his head back against his neck.
RE: Glazer in post game  
ColHowPepper : 1/18/2021 11:15 am : link
In comment 15126716 beatrixkiddo said:
Quote:
Said he believes it was more of a choke out than a concussion, and thinks he will pass protocol easily.
How does that explain his staggering as he tried to regain his feet?
RE: RE: Glazer in post game  
Zeke's Alibi : 1/18/2021 11:19 am : link
In comment 15126851 ColHowPepper said:
Quote:
In comment 15126716 beatrixkiddo said:


Quote:


Said he believes it was more of a choke out than a concussion, and thinks he will pass protocol easily.

How does that explain his staggering as he tried to regain his feet?



Things are still a little woozy when you get choked out. There’s no way that happened though. That takes time to do it’s bullshit the Chiefs are trying to get out there so the perception isn’t bad when he’s cleared because he looked on another planet.
RE: RE: RE: Glazer in post game  
bubba0825 : 1/18/2021 11:22 am : link
In comment 15126857 Zeke's Alibi said:
Quote:
In comment 15126851 ColHowPepper said:


Quote:


In comment 15126716 beatrixkiddo said:


Quote:


Said he believes it was more of a choke out than a concussion, and thinks he will pass protocol easily.

How does that explain his staggering as he tried to regain his feet?




Things are still a little woozy when you get choked out. There’s no way that happened though. That takes time to do it’s bullshit the Chiefs are trying to get out there so the perception isn’t bad when he’s cleared because he looked on another planet.


Glazer does the chiefs a solid and floats this story, in turn they feed him a real story in the future. I’ve never seen someone get choked out so quickly then have trouble walking 60 seconds later.
...  
christian : 1/18/2021 11:22 am : link
The crown of his helmet slammed into the turf at the same time his face mask got buried into the ball. That’s a ton of energy coming from both sides of the helmet.
Reid said he got hit on the back of the head.  
LBH15 : 1/18/2021 11:27 am : link
The guy who tackled Mahomes first him with his helmet near the back of the neck-area and maybe was enough of a blow to cause it.
I've read the OL and DL have several minor concussions per game...  
Milton : 1/18/2021 11:32 am : link
...without even banging helmuts, but instead from the jarring act of propelling themselves into each other and the head snapping back abruptly. It's why some (myself included) favor doing away with the three point stance.
RE: It's pretty clearly a concussion  
shyster : 1/18/2021 12:48 pm : link
In comment 15126796 rasbutant said:
Quote:
I'm not a doctor, but this doctor on youtube explains it.....makes sense to me. Link - ( New Window )


1:36-2:08

Good point by poster Lurts about the face guard and the ball.

As the doctor points out, the helmet does not contact turf.
As I pointed out on another thread  
Matt M. : 1/18/2021 1:18 pm : link
It is a misunderstanding that the head needs to be hit directly to be concussed. He does not appear to be hit on the head by the defender. His head, however, was slammed face first into the turf, which could have shifted his brain, slamming it into the skull. Additionally, a violent enough perfectly clean hit can cause the brain to slam hard enough into the skull. At the very least, its can jostle the brain enough to do minor damage. The cumulative impact of these hits can lessen the degree of violence required to cause a full concussion over time.
Also of note,  
Matt M. : 1/18/2021 1:19 pm : link
helmets do nothing to prevent what happens to the brain inside the skull, regardless of the nature of the hit. That goes for hits to the head and perfectly clean hits.
RE: As I pointed out on another thread  
ColHowPepper : 1/18/2021 1:23 pm : link
In comment 15126960 Matt M. said:
Quote:
It is a misunderstanding that the head needs to be hit directly to be concussed. He does not appear to be hit on the head by the defender. His head, however, was slammed face first into the turf, which could have shifted his brain, slamming it into the skull. Additionally, a violent enough perfectly clean hit can cause the brain to slam hard enough into the skull. At the very least, its can jostle the brain enough to do minor damage. The cumulative impact of these hits can lessen the degree of violence required to cause a full concussion over time.
Matt, I agree w/most of what you say, but I don't think there is any concept of 'full concussion': TBI is TBI, whether minor or major. And, yes, the cumulative effect of a series of TBIs produces worse outcomes. Key to healing if time, esp. time between TBIs.
RE: RE: As I pointed out on another thread  
Matt M. : 1/18/2021 1:38 pm : link
In comment 15126967 ColHowPepper said:
Quote:
In comment 15126960 Matt M. said:


Quote:


It is a misunderstanding that the head needs to be hit directly to be concussed. He does not appear to be hit on the head by the defender. His head, however, was slammed face first into the turf, which could have shifted his brain, slamming it into the skull. Additionally, a violent enough perfectly clean hit can cause the brain to slam hard enough into the skull. At the very least, its can jostle the brain enough to do minor damage. The cumulative impact of these hits can lessen the degree of violence required to cause a full concussion over time.

Matt, I agree w/most of what you say, but I don't think there is any concept of 'full concussion': TBI is TBI, whether minor or major. And, yes, the cumulative effect of a series of TBIs produces worse outcomes. Key to healing if time, esp. time between TBIs.
Good point. I would agree with that. I used that term more as a "layman" term to put it in perspective for many that really don't get concussions, but you are correct.
I'm with most of you, I  
section125 : 1/18/2021 3:34 pm : link
saw nothing that would cause a concussion. My original thought was his neck got torqued. But I did not see a head slam. There was certainly nothing wrong with the tackle except it seemed he was whipped around by the neck.

Yet he was clearly out of it.
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