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NFT: Good Morning Mets fans

DanMetroMan : 1/20/2021 9:40 am
-Springer a Blue Jay

-Quintana to LAA for 1 year 8. Bummed we didn’t land him at that price. Potential steal.

-Heyman says they had/have interest in Kike Hernandez but he is looking for a starting job. Maybe a platoon in CF with PT in other spots entices him?

-the new head of R& D is close with Justin Turner. Zero indication the Mets are interested but notable.

-have not shown interest in JBJ to this point

-Hand and Colome have both switched agents (Hand’s new agent does not have any Mets clients for anyone looking for that connection)
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What are we looking at realistically at this point?  
Chris684 : 1/20/2021 9:44 am : link
Hand and a defensive type CFer?
The Athletic  
DanMetroMan : 1/20/2021 9:46 am : link
Has a piece up with sources saying there were those who did in fact think Porter was a creep or “bad news”
Every team has a budget clearly..  
Sean : 1/20/2021 9:46 am : link
I’m guessing the pending extensions of Lindor & Conforto prevented the Mets from going all in on Springer.
Im hoping they pivot towards Cain  
debo_GIANTS : 1/20/2021 9:46 am : link
If the Brewers are looking to offload some salary, he could be a good fit
I know Sandy has talked about  
KDavies : 1/20/2021 9:53 am : link
being too lefthanded, but Bradley is the best FA CF out there. Wonder how much a Kike/Bradley platoon would cost.

Trade route, Cain looks to be the best option. Don't know what they would give up. Maybe Betances to counteract some of the salary. Wouldn't want to give up much more than that for a salary dump.
RE: I know Sandy has talked about  
DanMetroMan : 1/20/2021 9:57 am : link
In comment 15128746 KDavies said:
Quote:
being too lefthanded, but Bradley is the best FA CF out there. Wonder how much a Kike/Bradley platoon would cost.

Trade route, Cain looks to be the best option. Don't know what they would give up. Maybe Betances to counteract some of the salary. Wouldn't want to give up much more than that for a salary dump.


Gotta figure those 2 cost mid-teens combined. Seems far too pricey for the production to me. At that point go cheap in CF and add Wong. Lindor/Wong would be the best defensive MI in the sport
RE: The Athletic  
Sammo85 : 1/20/2021 9:59 am : link
In comment 15128736 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
Has a piece up with sources saying there were those who did in fact think Porter was a creep or “bad news”


And I'm sure none of them spoke up or did anything specific or courageous beforehand until the coast was clear to grab the shovels and throw some dirt on Porter and the Mets.
Sandy  
DanMetroMan : 1/20/2021 10:00 am : link
Is very friendly with Stearns, gotta figure they are least touch base on Cain
What about a Marcus Semien  
Sammo85 : 1/20/2021 10:00 am : link
I know more of a SS, but seems a type that could play some 3B and 2B as part of a super-utility rotation with McNeil and maybe Davis if he's kept on.
I still think something around Cain/JDD makes sense  
Eric on Li : 1/20/2021 10:04 am : link
with some salary being offset either by MIL kicking in prospects or taking back Betances or Familia.

JDD's bat plays and he could play for them in a variety of spots - OF, 3b, 1b, or DH. 1B would seem most likely since it looks like their current depth chart is topped by Daniel Vogelbach.

If anything I would think MIL would need to sweeten the pot with a prospect since they'd be saving $ and getting a cost controlled young bat.
RE: What about a Marcus Semien  
DanMetroMan : 1/20/2021 10:05 am : link
In comment 15128760 Sammo85 said:
Quote:
I know more of a SS, but seems a type that could play some 3B and 2B as part of a super-utility rotation with McNeil and maybe Davis if he's kept on.


He’s certainly worth calling but he’s going to be a starter and doesn’t help their CF needs. Wong is probably a better fit if they pivot off of CF
Not  
DanMetroMan : 1/20/2021 10:09 am : link
particularly interested in committing multiple years for a CF platoon at 20ish million. Seems foolish for JBJ/Hernandez.
How about this for an upgraded defense  
Eric on Li : 1/20/2021 10:10 am : link
JDD + Betances for for Cain (believe this only adds about $5m net for LT payroll)
Sign Wong (let's say $10m to make it easy)
Sign Hand

Think that would all be within the remaining budget and give them multiple time gold glovers at SS, 2B, and CF. McNeil I suppose would become a full time 3B.
Eric  
DanMetroMan : 1/20/2021 10:12 am : link
sign me up.
Nice move for them  
DanMetroMan : 1/20/2021 10:12 am : link
Jon Heyman
@JonHeyman
·
1m
Kirby Yates deal done and official with Jays. $5.5M guarantee. $4.5M incentives to get to $10M if he pitches in 70 gam
actually it looks like spotrac changed Betances luxury tax salary  
Eric on Li : 1/20/2021 10:13 am : link
they used to have it 4m higher than his actual cash salary so the above scenario would either require Familia instead or it would be 4m more expensive.
I'd be ok  
pjcas18 : 1/20/2021 10:13 am : link
going into 2021 with Nimmo, Conforto, and Dom in the OF.

While obviously not ideal, I think you can win with that, and fix it in 2022.

I'm as impatient as every Mets fan, but I hate to think of forcing bad fits or overpays to try and fix every single problem in one off-season.

Use the Springer money on Bauer high ACV low years deal (if Sandy can sell that) and roll with it.
RE: How about this for an upgraded defense  
KDavies : 1/20/2021 10:14 am : link
In comment 15128775 Eric on Li said:
Quote:
JDD + Betances for for Cain (believe this only adds about $5m net for LT payroll)
Sign Wong (let's say $10m to make it easy)
Sign Hand

Think that would all be within the remaining budget and give them multiple time gold glovers at SS, 2B, and CF. McNeil I suppose would become a full time 3B.


That would be best case scenario at this point. Adding great defense, not losing any prospects.
Not  
DanMetroMan : 1/20/2021 10:15 am : link
aimed at anyone on here but I'm really surprised how many people on twitter are willing to spend almost 20 million for the next 2 seasons for a JBJ/Hernandez platoon. Pass from me.
I'd  
DanMetroMan : 1/20/2021 10:17 am : link
be all over JDD/Cain (Brewers taking back one of the expensive RP's), then signing Wong and Hand.
my best friend  
KDubbs : 1/20/2021 10:17 am : link
went to dartmouth and is good friends with Matt Klentak. Mets apparently asked permission to talk to him but Klentak turned down the mets. I told my friend to tell him "Good, we dont need any philly scum."

cool story bro i know
Brewers need help at 3B/1B  
debo_GIANTS : 1/20/2021 10:21 am : link
And need to add both some pitching... I think JDD/Familia would be a good fit for them.
RE: Not  
Eric on Li : 1/20/2021 10:25 am : link
In comment 15128784 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
aimed at anyone on here but I'm really surprised how many people on twitter are willing to spend almost 20 million for the next 2 seasons for a JBJ/Hernandez platoon. Pass from me.


I'd be ok but not enthused with that duo. It may be the best they can do and it would be a step in the right direction but that's got to be plan B or C.

I'd be ok with Hernandez (or Turner) being a plan A over Wong if they don't want to play McNeil at 3b. But they did say they are considering him at 3rd so I'm not sure that's the case. Hernandez' versatility over Wong is a plus though even if you are losing some D at 2b. He's also presumably cheaper.
Sign  
ZGiants98 : 1/20/2021 10:27 am : link
Hand and the pitching is virtually complete aside for some ST invites.

With the lineup, both the IF and OF have options. You can add an infielder but Guillorme/Davis are both likely as interesting as whoever you bring in.

A CF could work, but they likely are part of a rotation as none left will provide enough offense to justify sitting Dom or Nimmo if there isn’t a DH.

Losing Springer sucks but now that he’s off the table there isn’t a whole lot left to do.
RE: RE: Not  
DanMetroMan : 1/20/2021 10:27 am : link
In comment 15128804 Eric on Li said:
Quote:
In comment 15128784 DanMetroMan said:


Quote:


aimed at anyone on here but I'm really surprised how many people on twitter are willing to spend almost 20 million for the next 2 seasons for a JBJ/Hernandez platoon. Pass from me.



I'd be ok but not enthused with that duo. It may be the best they can do and it would be a step in the right direction but that's got to be plan B or C.

I'd be ok with Hernandez (or Turner) being a plan A over Wong if they don't want to play McNeil at 3b. But they did say they are considering him at 3rd so I'm not sure that's the case. Hernandez' versatility over Wong is a plus though even if you are losing some D at 2b. He's also presumably cheaper.


I think it's very silly to commit that kind of money for a very mediocre offensive combination. It seems like it's spending just to spend. Hernandez isn't a good offensive player. I'd sign one or the other. Not have 20ish million on the books for multiple seasons.
Is JBJ  
pjcas18 : 1/20/2021 10:28 am : link
even a significant defensive upgrade at this point over Nimmo?

Hasn't his D been declining?
RE: Not  
KDavies : 1/20/2021 10:28 am : link
In comment 15128784 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
aimed at anyone on here but I'm really surprised how many people on twitter are willing to spend almost 20 million for the next 2 seasons for a JBJ/Hernandez platoon. Pass from me.


Yeah, I was just thinking out loud. If it's $20 million for the two, pass. Ideally JBJ would be a right. But, maybe they just say eff it and go with the lefty if they can't get a Cain deal done. Cain would be ideal though.
I  
DanMetroMan : 1/20/2021 10:29 am : link
mean Hernandez over the past 2 seasons is at... 86 wRC+. He's only played 128 career games in CF. He's versatile but that seems silly WITH JBJ. That's substantial money.
Hand would be my number one priority  
ZGiants98 : 1/20/2021 10:29 am : link
Right now. Bolster the hell out of that pen.
RE: RE: Not  
DanMetroMan : 1/20/2021 10:29 am : link
In comment 15128808 KDavies said:
Quote:
In comment 15128784 DanMetroMan said:


Quote:


aimed at anyone on here but I'm really surprised how many people on twitter are willing to spend almost 20 million for the next 2 seasons for a JBJ/Hernandez platoon. Pass from me.



Yeah, I was just thinking out loud. If it's $20 million for the two, pass. Ideally JBJ would be a right. But, maybe they just say eff it and go with the lefty if they can't get a Cain deal done. Cain would be ideal though.


Safe to assume they end up "near" 20 million. I've seen JBJ anywhere from 8-12 per and Kike 7-9 per.
RE: Is JBJ  
DanMetroMan : 1/20/2021 10:30 am : link
In comment 15128807 pjcas18 said:
Quote:
even a significant defensive upgrade at this point over Nimmo?

Hasn't his D been declining?


JBJ is still plus in CF. Tied with Bellinger for #1 in OAA in CF.
RE: Brewers need help at 3B/1B  
KDavies : 1/20/2021 10:30 am : link
In comment 15128794 debo_GIANTS said:
Quote:
And need to add both some pitching... I think JDD/Familia would be a good fit for them.


The issue with that is Familia makes about $10 million a year, where Betances is half that. If Cain is a salary dump I can see them taking back a Betances, but the Familia contract is a bad one. I don't see it. I see Betances/JDD
RE: RE: Brewers need help at 3B/1B  
DanMetroMan : 1/20/2021 10:36 am : link
In comment 15128816 KDavies said:
Quote:
In comment 15128794 debo_GIANTS said:


Quote:


And need to add both some pitching... I think JDD/Familia would be a good fit for them.



The issue with that is Familia makes about $10 million a year, where Betances is half that. If Cain is a salary dump I can see them taking back a Betances, but the Familia contract is a bad one. I don't see it. I see Betances/JDD


in fairness, the Brewers would save 17 million in 2022 (minus whatever JDD makes). But I wouldn't think twice for Betances either.
With  
DanMetroMan : 1/20/2021 10:41 am : link
Yates off the board, Hand is probably my #1 RP. 1 + a team option or 2 years, yes.
RE: RE: RE: Brewers need help at 3B/1B  
KDavies : 1/20/2021 10:47 am : link
In comment 15128821 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
In comment 15128816 KDavies said:


Quote:


In comment 15128794 debo_GIANTS said:


Quote:


And need to add both some pitching... I think JDD/Familia would be a good fit for them.



The issue with that is Familia makes about $10 million a year, where Betances is half that. If Cain is a salary dump I can see them taking back a Betances, but the Familia contract is a bad one. I don't see it. I see Betances/JDD



in fairness, the Brewers would save 17 million in 2022 (minus whatever JDD makes). But I wouldn't think twice for Betances either.


True, but the savings would be only about $5-6 million this year between Cain and Familia. Then you add in $2.3 million for JDD. I would prefer a Familia/JDD trade than a Betances/JDD, but I don't see the Brewers doing it.
RE: I'd be ok  
Beezer : 1/20/2021 10:58 am : link
In comment 15128781 pjcas18 said:
Quote:
going into 2021 with Nimmo, Conforto, and Dom in the OF.

While obviously not ideal, I think you can win with that, and fix it in 2022.

I'm as impatient as every Mets fan, but I hate to think of forcing bad fits or overpays to try and fix every single problem in one off-season.

Use the Springer money on Bauer high ACV low years deal (if Sandy can sell that) and roll with it.


Been thinking this for a while. Let's say Nimmo turns in an average season - nothing more, nothing less. He'd give you .258, a ton of hustle and a good clubhouse guy, plus an average OPS of 838. Keep adding to the bench and the BP and I think we're fine.
.  
DanMetroMan : 1/20/2021 10:59 am : link
@JesseSanchezMLB
tells @MLBPipeline
(podcast) that "no one really knows" what Colas plans to do (wait for 2022? Sign with a team now?). Many teams have limited information. Teams are looking to work him out first. #Mets
RE: I  
Eric on Li : 1/20/2021 11:04 am : link
In comment 15128809 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
mean Hernandez over the past 2 seasons is at... 86 wRC+. He's only played 128 career games in CF. He's versatile but that seems silly WITH JBJ. That's substantial money.


Agreed. Also I wouldn't be signing Hernandez for CF. I'd hope to sign him to a 2 year deal to be the utility guy who can start in a variety of spots depending on where you need him. And if McNeil wins 3b it's possibly he could be your primary competition with Guillorme at 2b. Hernandez has been very good defensively by both OAA (+4 the last 2 years) and DRS (+21 the last 2 years combined).

So he's presumably a cheaper, more versatile, alternative to Wong that would still give them very good defense at 2b if that's where he ends up playing.

I have very little interest in JBJ unless they strike out on other options first and get him on a 1 year deal.
.  
DanMetroMan : 1/20/2021 11:21 am : link
John Flanigan
@jflan816
On @WFAN660
, @JonHeyman
said he wouldn’t be surprised if the Mets lose Brad Hand to the Blue Jays too.
just went down a bit of a kike hernandez rabbit hole and he's really  
Eric on Li : 1/20/2021 11:26 am : link
a perfect fit for what they need given the unsettled situations at 2b/3b and the need for OF depth. I think Shecky was talking about him earlier in the offseason and he was dead on. Wong's defense is almost definitely better at 2b, but with Guillorme on the roster is that something they need to pay more for?

Offensively Kike makes more hard contact than Wong and that's backed up by just about every metric - SLG%, exit velocity, hard hit rate, barrel% etc. Though Wong does K less.

Where Hernandez' value really stands out is that he can play anywhere. 2b, 3b, OF, whatever. He's used to coming off the bench. If you pay Wong it's as a starting 2b.
I  
DanMetroMan : 1/20/2021 11:27 am : link
think you're overstating his ability to play 3b. He's made 3 starts at 3b in 3 years despite the fact Turner was always dinged.
watching a lot of the red sox over the years  
ryanmkeane : 1/20/2021 11:29 am : link
I'll add my two cents on JBJ: he's an incredible fielder and also seems to be a clutch hitter, even though he's not a great hitter obviously. He's a spark type player, and he does get on base quite a bit for someone who doesn't hit for average.
Eric  
DanMetroMan : 1/20/2021 11:29 am : link
Wong is an ELITE defensive 2b, maybe the best in the sport. Kike Hernandez somehow is getting lumped in as a 3b option... he hasn't played there in years and -1 DRS career
don't want to overpay for a guy like JBJ  
ryanmkeane : 1/20/2021 11:31 am : link
but he's absolutely worth 10M a year.
/  
DanMetroMan : 1/20/2021 11:31 am : link
Complete pass on Billy Hamilton. He's no longer interesting. Minor league deal as a late-season pinch runner? Sure.
The  
DanMetroMan : 1/20/2021 11:35 am : link
Mets would likely be worse with Kike Hernandez at 3b than JDD Davis. Davis a far superior offensive player, Hernandez not particularly good at 3b
One  
DanMetroMan : 1/20/2021 11:40 am : link
thing to remember with the Brewers, they are likely considering themselves playoff contenders in 2021.
.  
DanMetroMan : 1/20/2021 11:45 am : link
Bob Nightengale
@BNightengale
·
6m
Wade Davis' deal with the #Royals will pay him $1.25 million if he's on their big-league roster with $925,000 in incentives. He also has an opt-out if he doesn't make their opening-day roster.
If  
DanMetroMan : 1/20/2021 11:47 am : link
Yelich has anything resembling a normal season the Brewers are a playoff team in 2020. Wild how horrible the NL Central is on paper.
Toronto  
DanMetroMan : 1/20/2021 11:54 am : link
intensifying their pursuit of Hand, likely only willing to give Bauer 1 year at a huge AAV.
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