Defending toppins play tonight vs Haliburton. Haliburton looks like the smartest player in the court on both ends of the floor. Obi played well tonight, did I fall asleep? . He had a few dunks, what else am I missing? I don’t see anything exciting about his game. Again the Knicks had they opportunity to choose a guard that can shoot, pass and defend well and for some reason they were concerned about his slender frame?
Haliburton was the best all round player on the floor tonight. What an embarrassment by the organization passing on him. We all had the pick, it was an easy pick. If the Knicks had me as a gm they would have Haliburton and donovan mitchell o the roster right now. I will admit After Sexton went knox was my preferred choice over bridges and I am wrong on that one, but in a league dominated by shooting I don’t get how you pass on Haliburton.
One other note I was all over trading down for Booker on the KP draft. Now KP ended up being the goods but I was pounding the table about finding a way to get Booker. My track record speaks for itself.
As for the frank comments. I still think frank can end up being a shooter and have reasons for it, he is an excellent free throw shooter and has really good form on his shot. You can’t serious look at toppins form and think he has the chance to be a great shooter. There also is a big difference between the college 3 and the nba 3. At the end of the day his upside to me is a 12 pt 7 rebound players. Haliburton has the chance to be an all star. He isn’t a top 10 nba type player but def can make some all star teams. Tell me what you all see in Toppin that excites you? Being serious what have you seen so far that you think you like his future more than Haliburton.
is rough. Lot's of yo-yo'ing from day to day. If we need to rebuild this right, it takes patience and young guys developing, before we can get there. People crapping on this team and its effort, is ridiculous. Not sure what was expected, but the fact these games are watchable with this roster, is a blessing. Let's not pretend we are the Lakers or anything close.
Team has tired legs. Barrett was a step slower than yesterday. If he could finish with his right hand (harder than it sounds), he would be deadly.
Randle playing really well. It'll be interesting to see the offers we get for him, it would have to be worth it for how miraculously he's playing. Legit 1/2 option right now playing two ways. Who would've thought!?
Kings backcourt is legit. Haliburton and Fox can get out on the break! I wanted Tyrese as I thought he was exactly what we needed, but getting Quickley makes it more palletable. His 3-9 was blip on the development radar.
Obi didn't play enough to get into the flow of the game. Tough to play agains the good two way player in Barnes.
Burks and Payton, hopefully we can get something for them at the deadline. Payton played great d for three quarters which took its toll on the offensive side of the game. Burks needs to get in shape. 3-14, looked sleepy tonight.
Kings are a front court player from being pretty good. Nothing to be ashamed of in this game.. west coast, back to back not matter where you are.
Yea, I disagree. I thought he was fine. Still very timid in the lane, but hes gotten better so...
Randle is infuriating. He is such a good producer, he makes his free throws, but he KILLS flow. I would rather trade him in a package for Beal than Toppin or RJ. As good as hes been, he absolutely murders the flow of moving thee ball around. How is that going to work with a guy like Beal? Would rather speed and hops in Toppin.
Yea, I disagree. I thought he was fine. Still very timid in the lane, but hes gotten better so...
Randle is infuriating. He is such a good producer, he makes his free throws, but he KILLS flow. I would rather trade him in a package for Beal than Toppin or RJ. As good as hes been, he absolutely murders the flow of moving thee ball around. How is that going to work with a guy like Beal? Would rather speed and hops in Toppin.
How is it Randles fault? he was carrying the team, He is constantly trying to find the ooen man, the offense runs through him..
It’s been great to watch but missing on draft picks when the picks are easy picks it’s just unacceptable. It sets the franchise back for years. No tram will ever get every pick right but the Knicks have had opportunities and in many cases these were obvious picks not only from a player talent perspective but also from a what the team really needs perspective. Rose I’m assuming had the final say on the pick and over ruled someone. People fall in love with dunking and highlight real plays, I think a great gm can look past that stuff. I don’t even want to disregard topping too much, I’m sure he will be in the league for a long time I just don’t see anything that he does really well. Besides the open dunks he does not finish well in traffic, his foot work is terrible, which I know will improve over time, very stiff in his movements, never a good sign defensively for a big man and not very strong, which I know will improve. All these things 3-4 years from now when he should be entering his prime what do you think he looks like. If he is a starter he is a 12-7 guy. I don’t see any thing that makes me think he can be a star and he was supposed to be the most nba ready guy in the draft. I just don’t see it.
Yea, I disagree. I thought he was fine. Still very timid in the lane, but hes gotten better so...
Randle is infuriating. He is such a good producer, he makes his free throws, but he KILLS flow. I would rather trade him in a package for Beal than Toppin or RJ. As good as hes been, he absolutely murders the flow of moving thee ball around. How is that going to work with a guy like Beal? Would rather speed and hops in Toppin.
How is it Randles fault? he was carrying the team, He is constantly trying to find the ooen man, the offense runs through him..
I replied to this, but for some reason the post didnt post.
Im not typing the whole thing again, but simple answer is I prefer Topins athleticism and defensive potential to JR and his great off production but poor decision making. If we can somehow trade Randle and 1 or 2 picks for Max deal Beal, I would prefer that over Toppin. Toppin is so explosive and I think can be taught D. JR does not want to play help side or above the rim D. We dont need a point 4. We need a guy who will run the floor and go up against rim gangsters.
Its Zach Randolph vs Amare Stoudemire in their primes. But with a great shooting guard added to the mix. Who do you think fits better?
Defending toppins play tonight vs Haliburton. Haliburton looks like the smartest player in the court on both ends of the floor. Obi played well tonight, did I fall asleep? . He had a few dunks, what else am I missing? I don’t see anything exciting about his game. Again the Knicks had they opportunity to choose a guard that can shoot, pass and defend well and for some reason they were concerned about his slender frame?
Haliburton was the best all round player on the floor tonight. What an embarrassment by the organization passing on him. We all had the pick, it was an easy pick. If the Knicks had me as a gm they would have Haliburton and donovan mitchell o the roster right now. I will admit After Sexton went knox was my preferred choice over bridges and I am wrong on that one, but in a league dominated by shooting I don’t get how you pass on Haliburton.
One other note I was all over trading down for Booker on the KP draft. Now KP ended up being the goods but I was pounding the table about finding a way to get Booker. My track record speaks for itself.
As for the frank comments. I still think frank can end up being a shooter and have reasons for it, he is an excellent free throw shooter and has really good form on his shot. You can’t serious look at toppins form and think he has the chance to be a great shooter. There also is a big difference between the college 3 and the nba 3. At the end of the day his upside to me is a 12 pt 7 rebound players. Haliburton has the chance to be an all star. He isn’t a top 10 nba type player but def can make some all star teams. Tell me what you all see in Toppin that excites you? Being serious what have you seen so far that you think you like his future more than Haliburton.
The thing about your pounding your chest incessantly about Mitchell that nobody has called you out on for some reason is that you also loved DSJ in that draft. They were 1a and 1b on your wishlist for the Knicks. They were often mentioned together in your posts during that draft period. You were absolutely in love with DSJ and his athleticism. You never seem to mention that. I wonder why?
is rough. Lot's of yo-yo'ing from day to day. If we need to rebuild this right, it takes patience and young guys developing, before we can get there. People crapping on this team and its effort, is ridiculous. Not sure what was expected, but the fact these games are watchable with this roster, is a blessing. Let's not pretend we are the Lakers or anything close.
Team has tired legs. Barrett was a step slower than yesterday. If he could finish with his right hand (harder than it sounds), he would be deadly.
Randle playing really well. It'll be interesting to see the offers we get for him, it would have to be worth it for how miraculously he's playing. Legit 1/2 option right now playing two ways. Who would've thought!?
Kings backcourt is legit. Haliburton and Fox can get out on the break! I wanted Tyrese as I thought he was exactly what we needed, but getting Quickley makes it more palletable. His 3-9 was blip on the development radar.
Obi didn't play enough to get into the flow of the game. Tough to play agains the good two way player in Barnes.
Burks and Payton, hopefully we can get something for them at the deadline. Payton played great d for three quarters which took its toll on the offensive side of the game. Burks needs to get in shape. 3-14, looked sleepy tonight.
Kings are a front court player from being pretty good. Nothing to be ashamed of in this game.. west coast, back to back not matter where you are.
Good post. Overall this team is playing well and exceeding expectations, but we all know the roster is still stocked with several guys who won’t be here long term. This year is about rebuilding a culture and playing competitive under a good new coach, instead of tanking for a high pick for the 10th year in a row or whatever.
2nd night of a back to back after a west coast flight, they faded down the stretch. It happens
Obi has been back 3 games after 3 weeks off, and you guys are ready to take him out back and shoot him. Good grief
Do we see any big changes then? Elf on the shelf, or better yet off the team?
Needs to happen. Quickley with the first unit makes everyone better. Not sure what Elfrid Payton has done to earn so much rope. It’s like Willie playing Miguel Cairo everyday in 2005
Do we see any big changes then? Elf on the shelf, or better yet off the team?
Needs to happen. Quickley with the first unit makes everyone better. Not sure what Elfrid Payton has done to earn so much rope. It’s like Willie playing Miguel Cairo everyday in 2005
Or Tom starting Markus Kuhn in 2015 for most of the season
Everyone healthy i am starting Rivers, Burks, Rj, Randle, Mitch..
Rivers i not a true point guard but hr can playmake, he can shoot the 3 and he can get into the paint, you cant jist leave him on offense..
I would do a 3 guard rotation quickley rivers and burks..Quick can play off the ball or on the ball, all 3 can shoot..
Bullock would be my back up 3 behind Rj..
Toppin back up randle and Noel back.up Mitch..
Knox and Payton out of the rotation for now..
I think that 9 gives this team the best chance to win, you cant go and double Randle freely with no care with those guys in the back court and you always have at least 2 shooters on the court
Seems like a good guy but was a terrible head coach.
David Fizdale on the Knicks, via ‘The Jump:’
“They are exactly Tom Thibodeau. They are competing their tails off. You know I love those kids. So for them to know what it feels like to win in this league is great for them. And (Thibs) is doing a helluva job.”
Seems like a good guy but was a terrible head coach.
David Fizdale on the Knicks, via ‘The Jump:’
“They are exactly Tom Thibodeau. They are competing their tails off. You know I love those kids. So for them to know what it feels like to win in this league is great for them. And (Thibs) is doing a helluva job.”
I domt think Fiz is a bad guy, he is just an assistant in every sense of the word, as HC you got to be a hard ass and your going to piss players off..Assistants are the players friends and Fiz couldnt change his mentality, i think what happened in Memphis eith Gasol scarred him..
He was so afraid to make a player mad that he was constantly changing the lineups, giving 12 guys a night minutes, it just didnt work..
Seems like a good guy but was a terrible head coach.
David Fizdale on the Knicks, via ‘The Jump:’
“They are exactly Tom Thibodeau. They are competing their tails off. You know I love those kids. So for them to know what it feels like to win in this league is great for them. And (Thibs) is doing a helluva job.”
I domt think Fiz is a bad guy, he is just an assistant in every sense of the word, as HC you got to be a hard ass and your going to piss players off..Assistants are the players friends and Fiz couldnt change his mentality, i think what happened in Memphis eith Gasol scarred him..
He was so afraid to make a player mad that he was constantly changing the lineups, giving 12 guys a night minutes, it just didnt work..
There has to be some balance. You also can’t give 6 guys 30+ minutes on back to back nights and have them fresh down the stretch.
Seems like a good guy but was a terrible head coach.
David Fizdale on the Knicks, via ‘The Jump:’
“They are exactly Tom Thibodeau. They are competing their tails off. You know I love those kids. So for them to know what it feels like to win in this league is great for them. And (Thibs) is doing a helluva job.”
I domt think Fiz is a bad guy, he is just an assistant in every sense of the word, as HC you got to be a hard ass and your going to piss players off..Assistants are the players friends and Fiz couldnt change his mentality, i think what happened in Memphis eith Gasol scarred him..
He was so afraid to make a player mad that he was constantly changing the lineups, giving 12 guys a night minutes, it just didnt work..
There has to be some balance. You also can’t give 6 guys 30+ minutes on back to back nights and have them fresh down the stretch.
No but most starters play 30+ minutes in the NBA, most teams go 9 or 10 deep eith their 10th guy only playing 10 to 15 minutes..
Randle and Rj playing 37 minutes a night is not out of the ordinary and yes there will be nights they are tired
I don’t recall this alleged love for Dennis Smith but I also don’t remeber so I will take your word on that. At the end of the day, I can say with great confidence that mitchell was by far and away my number 1 I may have liked smith jr over Frankie, which at this point I like frankie better so if that’s the case then I was slightly wrong on smith jr over frankie.
I will say for this draft I didn’t love anyone and I def. argued against trading up for ball, said I would just stay at 8 and take Haliburton. Ball looks good Haliburton looks good also so I don’t think I am wrong on that one. The frustrating thing was again Haliburton was such an easy pick there from a talent perspective and from a need perspective. I’m not going to act like some genius I think majority of people on this board thought Haliburton should have been the pick there and also the ‘experts’ did as well.
I really wanted Sexton, but he went right before knicks so nothing knicks can do about that. And I favored knox over bridges, which bridges looks like the better player now, I still see upside in knox, he needs a few more years and probably won’t be on the Knicks by the time he is reliable. I would have been fine with Porter jr risk but I also understood knicks were not in a position to take that risk given the current roster situation. I missed on SGA.
I did really want Booker in the KP draft and I did not want KP, I was happy to not get okafor. At the end of the day KP is a stud, but always hurt. I can’t say the Knicks are idiots for not trading down for Booker, but again if you watched him in college it was easy to see that he would be a star one day the way the league plays now a days and no reason for him dropping as far as he did.
I remember when we picked Ntilikina the big criticism of the pick was
a lack of upside, and a George Hill comp. Now people are going to piss and moan over not taking Haliburton, who is a low upside, high floor player that is most likely a George Hill type.
The big problem with not taking Halliburton is the position he plays. I could understand taking Toppin over another big man but the Knicks haven’t had a good PG in like forever. And, Toppin played 4 years in college whereas Halliburton came out early which I think suggests there’s lots of more room for improvement. Can somebody tell me who ran the draft for the Knicks? Was Thibs in the process?
is Obi Toppin doesn't win any one-on-one matchups. No matter the advantage. It seems like he loses all momentum, and can't back down anyone. He's a power forward. He's about to be 23 soon. He shouldn't be this raw. IMO.
The big problem with not taking Halliburton is the position he plays. I could understand taking Toppin over another big man but the Knicks haven’t had a good PG in like forever. And, Toppin played 4 years in college whereas Halliburton came out early which I think suggests there’s lots of more room for improvement. Can somebody tell me who ran the draft for the Knicks? Was Thibs in the process?
Haliburton is not a point guard tho, The guy from Utah most likely ran the drsft, his name escapes me right now..
is Obi Toppin doesn't win any one-on-one matchups. No matter the advantage. It seems like he loses all momentum, and can't back down anyone. He's a power forward. He's about to be 23 soon. He shouldn't be this raw. IMO.
Again, still early.
Whether we like it or not, he IS raw. He played one season of varsity basketball in high school. He’s still learning the game
is Obi Toppin doesn't win any one-on-one matchups. No matter the advantage. It seems like he loses all momentum, and can't back down anyone. He's a power forward. He's about to be 23 soon. He shouldn't be this raw. IMO.
Again, still early.
Whether we like it or not, he IS raw. He played one season of varsity basketball in high school. He’s still learning the game
I understand that he is. But from the impression that I got leading up to selectig him was that he was the most ready to make that jump Day 1. He's young. I'm patient. I'm sure an actual competent PG who could best utilize him would do wonders for the kid.
I haven’t watched any SAC this year but I like the idea of Hield, a youngish wing with big range on a decreasing salary, especially given free agency dried up a lot. As always the question is what would they want. We can give a lot of salary relief, would they want take like Frank, DSJ, and some seconds? Knox instead of one? Don’t know that’d I’d do a first - maybe the protected DAL first but that’s about it.
If we had picked him we probably wouldn’t have Quickley. Halliburton probably would be playing 15 min a game behind Payton and Bullocks anyway. Sac is where young prospects go to languish away though, with Fox being the exception, so we will see. He picked off two passes RJ threw directly at his head, let’s not hail him as the next Mitchell just yet.
Obi needs to settle down, and just react instead of going 100mph with the ball. Our guard play doesn’t help either.
How about you comment on my thoughts on Haliburton vs Toppin, where do you stand on this? You just made to useless comments about my post, but did not provide an opinion. I’m guessing it’s because you agree but you don’t want to admit it. If not let’s hear why you are more excited for Toppin over Haliburton?
Separate I will pass on Hield, no defense, he looks like put on 40 lbs in the offseason which means he is lazy and he also has an attitude problem. He doesn’t do anything that is very exciting besides hitting 3-4 3’s a game. He is not worth the money.
As for Beal I am all in and would overpay, given that he is locked in for thisbyear and next and is entering his prime. Toppin, Knox, DSJ, Bullock and 4 first rounders for Beal. Given that we have the Dallas picks we lose net 2 first round picks for Beal plus a few guys that have potential to be good but we won’t know until down the road.
PG - Quickley/Frank/Payton
SG - Beal/Burks/Frank
SF - Barrett/Burks
PF - Randle/ buyout player
C - Mitch/noel/Gibson
Cap space for a max in the offseason but unfortunately no max guy left to sign. 2022 could have some really good free agents but most are likely to resign where they are, Mitch will be do $15 mil a year deal soon
How could they concentrate with the 16,000 ads on the Kings court? I know teams are trying to make a buck, but that was ridiculous. It looked like a NASCAR hood out there.
that he was significantly more athletic than everyone in college but won't be near that level in the NBA. Some guys do carry their college athletic advantage over to the NBA--such as De'Aaron Fox last night--but Obi is not one of them.
That said, he does seem to have above-average athleticism, the ability to create a bit, and to shoot a bit. I think his ceiling is an above-average starter.
He's also played only like 7 games and already shown flashes of being able to do some nice things, so maybe we should all (myself included) fall back a little bit.
As for Beal I am all in and would overpay, given that he is locked in for thisbyear and next and is entering his prime. Toppin, Knox, DSJ, Bullock and 4 first rounders for Beal. Given that we have the Dallas picks we lose net 2 first round picks for Beal plus a few guys that have potential to be good but we won’t know until down the road.
So we're giving up more assets for Beal than we did Melo? Aside from not nearly having the impact of Melo, Beal isn't worth 4 first round picks plus Toppin and Knox.
Also, I can't speak for Jon.. but you've said before how you do your gloating about wanting and being right on Mitchell on purpose just to see if we take the bait? After so many times, you come across as a douche. Like you were called out earlier, you also were high on Dennis Smith Jr. The "I know what I'm talking about" and "my track record speaks for itself" is the part where you lose any shred of being taken seriously. You were right about one prospect in an overall crapshoot draft. To act like you're some authority figure on scouting talent makes you look like a joke. As Jon and I like to say.. take a lap.
As for Beal I am all in and would overpay, given that he is locked in for thisbyear and next and is entering his prime. Toppin, Knox, DSJ, Bullock and 4 first rounders for Beal. Given that we have the Dallas picks we lose net 2 first round picks for Beal plus a few guys that have potential to be good but we won’t know until down the road.
So we're giving up more assets for Beal than we did Melo? Aside from not nearly having the impact of Melo, Beal isn't worth 4 first round picks plus Toppin and Knox.
Also, I can't speak for Jon.. but you've said before how you do your gloating about wanting and being right on Mitchell on purpose just to see if we take the bait? After so many times, you come across as a douche. Like you were called out earlier, you also were high on Dennis Smith Jr. The "I know what I'm talking about" and "my track record speaks for itself" is the part where you lose any shred of being taken seriously. You were right about one prospect in an overall crapshoot draft. To act like you're some authority figure on scouting talent makes you look like a joke. As Jon and I like to say.. take a lap.
That trade for Beal would be an absolute steal for the Knicks, Beal is playing like a top 10 player in the league this year..
Beal, Rj, Randle, Mitch with room for more is not to shabby and eith the amount of picks the Knicks have they would still have 1st rounders to add players
How about you comment on my thoughts on Haliburton vs Toppin, where do you stand on this? You just made to useless comments about my post, but did not provide an opinion. I’m guessing it’s because you agree but you don’t want to admit it. If not let’s hear why you are more excited for Toppin over Haliburton?
Separate I will pass on Hield, no defense, he looks like put on 40 lbs in the offseason which means he is lazy and he also has an attitude problem. He doesn’t do anything that is very exciting besides hitting 3-4 3’s a game. He is not worth the money.
As for Beal I am all in and would overpay, given that he is locked in for thisbyear and next and is entering his prime. Toppin, Knox, DSJ, Bullock and 4 first rounders for Beal. Given that we have the Dallas picks we lose net 2 first round picks for Beal plus a few guys that have potential to be good but we won’t know until down the road.
PG - Quickley/Frank/Payton
SG - Beal/Burks/Frank
SF - Barrett/Burks
PF - Randle/ buyout player
C - Mitch/noel/Gibson
Cap space for a max in the offseason but unfortunately no max guy left to sign. 2022 could have some really good free agents but most are likely to resign where they are, Mitch will be do $15 mil a year deal soon
Washington laughs at that trade offer. I don’t think fans and people on here how much it’s going to take to trade for Beal. He also fits on every team in the league and there are going to be a ton of teams in on him. I think RJ and 5 1sts is a starting point and I highly doubt that gets it done.
Haliburton was the best all round player on the floor tonight. What an embarrassment by the organization passing on him. We all had the pick, it was an easy pick. If the Knicks had me as a gm they would have Haliburton and donovan mitchell o the roster right now. I will admit After Sexton went knox was my preferred choice over bridges and I am wrong on that one, but in a league dominated by shooting I don’t get how you pass on Haliburton.
One other note I was all over trading down for Booker on the KP draft. Now KP ended up being the goods but I was pounding the table about finding a way to get Booker. My track record speaks for itself.
As for the frank comments. I still think frank can end up being a shooter and have reasons for it, he is an excellent free throw shooter and has really good form on his shot. You can’t serious look at toppins form and think he has the chance to be a great shooter. There also is a big difference between the college 3 and the nba 3. At the end of the day his upside to me is a 12 pt 7 rebound players. Haliburton has the chance to be an all star. He isn’t a top 10 nba type player but def can make some all star teams. Tell me what you all see in Toppin that excites you? Being serious what have you seen so far that you think you like his future more than Haliburton.
He was superb. All over the place. Biggest defensive play of the game coming out of nowhere to block Burks 3 when we were down only 2.
Because the ball is in Rj and Randles hands, Payton is useless with the starting unit, offensively kbicks play 4 on 5
Team has tired legs. Barrett was a step slower than yesterday. If he could finish with his right hand (harder than it sounds), he would be deadly.
Randle playing really well. It'll be interesting to see the offers we get for him, it would have to be worth it for how miraculously he's playing. Legit 1/2 option right now playing two ways. Who would've thought!?
Kings backcourt is legit. Haliburton and Fox can get out on the break! I wanted Tyrese as I thought he was exactly what we needed, but getting Quickley makes it more palletable. His 3-9 was blip on the development radar.
Obi didn't play enough to get into the flow of the game. Tough to play agains the good two way player in Barnes.
Burks and Payton, hopefully we can get something for them at the deadline. Payton played great d for three quarters which took its toll on the offensive side of the game. Burks needs to get in shape. 3-14, looked sleepy tonight.
Kings are a front court player from being pretty good. Nothing to be ashamed of in this game.. west coast, back to back not matter where you are.
Yea, I disagree. I thought he was fine. Still very timid in the lane, but hes gotten better so...
Randle is infuriating. He is such a good producer, he makes his free throws, but he KILLS flow. I would rather trade him in a package for Beal than Toppin or RJ. As good as hes been, he absolutely murders the flow of moving thee ball around. How is that going to work with a guy like Beal? Would rather speed and hops in Toppin.
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Yea, I disagree. I thought he was fine. Still very timid in the lane, but hes gotten better so...
Randle is infuriating. He is such a good producer, he makes his free throws, but he KILLS flow. I would rather trade him in a package for Beal than Toppin or RJ. As good as hes been, he absolutely murders the flow of moving thee ball around. How is that going to work with a guy like Beal? Would rather speed and hops in Toppin.
How is it Randles fault? he was carrying the team, He is constantly trying to find the ooen man, the offense runs through him..
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In comment 15131467 nygiants16 said:
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Yea, I disagree. I thought he was fine. Still very timid in the lane, but hes gotten better so...
Randle is infuriating. He is such a good producer, he makes his free throws, but he KILLS flow. I would rather trade him in a package for Beal than Toppin or RJ. As good as hes been, he absolutely murders the flow of moving thee ball around. How is that going to work with a guy like Beal? Would rather speed and hops in Toppin.
How is it Randles fault? he was carrying the team, He is constantly trying to find the ooen man, the offense runs through him..
I replied to this, but for some reason the post didnt post.
Im not typing the whole thing again, but simple answer is I prefer Topins athleticism and defensive potential to JR and his great off production but poor decision making. If we can somehow trade Randle and 1 or 2 picks for Max deal Beal, I would prefer that over Toppin. Toppin is so explosive and I think can be taught D. JR does not want to play help side or above the rim D. We dont need a point 4. We need a guy who will run the floor and go up against rim gangsters.
Its Zach Randolph vs Amare Stoudemire in their primes. But with a great shooting guard added to the mix. Who do you think fits better?
Haliburton was the best all round player on the floor tonight. What an embarrassment by the organization passing on him. We all had the pick, it was an easy pick. If the Knicks had me as a gm they would have Haliburton and donovan mitchell o the roster right now. I will admit After Sexton went knox was my preferred choice over bridges and I am wrong on that one, but in a league dominated by shooting I don’t get how you pass on Haliburton.
One other note I was all over trading down for Booker on the KP draft. Now KP ended up being the goods but I was pounding the table about finding a way to get Booker. My track record speaks for itself.
As for the frank comments. I still think frank can end up being a shooter and have reasons for it, he is an excellent free throw shooter and has really good form on his shot. You can’t serious look at toppins form and think he has the chance to be a great shooter. There also is a big difference between the college 3 and the nba 3. At the end of the day his upside to me is a 12 pt 7 rebound players. Haliburton has the chance to be an all star. He isn’t a top 10 nba type player but def can make some all star teams. Tell me what you all see in Toppin that excites you? Being serious what have you seen so far that you think you like his future more than Haliburton.
The thing about your pounding your chest incessantly about Mitchell that nobody has called you out on for some reason is that you also loved DSJ in that draft. They were 1a and 1b on your wishlist for the Knicks. They were often mentioned together in your posts during that draft period. You were absolutely in love with DSJ and his athleticism. You never seem to mention that. I wonder why?
Team has tired legs. Barrett was a step slower than yesterday. If he could finish with his right hand (harder than it sounds), he would be deadly.
Randle playing really well. It'll be interesting to see the offers we get for him, it would have to be worth it for how miraculously he's playing. Legit 1/2 option right now playing two ways. Who would've thought!?
Kings backcourt is legit. Haliburton and Fox can get out on the break! I wanted Tyrese as I thought he was exactly what we needed, but getting Quickley makes it more palletable. His 3-9 was blip on the development radar.
Obi didn't play enough to get into the flow of the game. Tough to play agains the good two way player in Barnes.
Burks and Payton, hopefully we can get something for them at the deadline. Payton played great d for three quarters which took its toll on the offensive side of the game. Burks needs to get in shape. 3-14, looked sleepy tonight.
Kings are a front court player from being pretty good. Nothing to be ashamed of in this game.. west coast, back to back not matter where you are.
Good post. Overall this team is playing well and exceeding expectations, but we all know the roster is still stocked with several guys who won’t be here long term. This year is about rebuilding a culture and playing competitive under a good new coach, instead of tanking for a high pick for the 10th year in a row or whatever.
2nd night of a back to back after a west coast flight, they faded down the stretch. It happens
Obi has been back 3 games after 3 weeks off, and you guys are ready to take him out back and shoot him. Good grief
Needs to happen. Quickley with the first unit makes everyone better. Not sure what Elfrid Payton has done to earn so much rope. It’s like Willie playing Miguel Cairo everyday in 2005
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Do we see any big changes then? Elf on the shelf, or better yet off the team?
Needs to happen. Quickley with the first unit makes everyone better. Not sure what Elfrid Payton has done to earn so much rope. It’s like Willie playing Miguel Cairo everyday in 2005
Or Tom starting Markus Kuhn in 2015 for most of the season
Rivers i not a true point guard but hr can playmake, he can shoot the 3 and he can get into the paint, you cant jist leave him on offense..
I would do a 3 guard rotation quickley rivers and burks..Quick can play off the ball or on the ball, all 3 can shoot..
Bullock would be my back up 3 behind Rj..
Toppin back up randle and Noel back.up Mitch..
Knox and Payton out of the rotation for now..
I think that 9 gives this team the best chance to win, you cant go and double Randle freely with no care with those guys in the back court and you always have at least 2 shooters on the court
David Fizdale on the Knicks, via ‘The Jump:’
“They are exactly Tom Thibodeau. They are competing their tails off. You know I love those kids. So for them to know what it feels like to win in this league is great for them. And (Thibs) is doing a helluva job.”
David Fizdale on the Knicks, via ‘The Jump:’
“They are exactly Tom Thibodeau. They are competing their tails off. You know I love those kids. So for them to know what it feels like to win in this league is great for them. And (Thibs) is doing a helluva job.”
I domt think Fiz is a bad guy, he is just an assistant in every sense of the word, as HC you got to be a hard ass and your going to piss players off..Assistants are the players friends and Fiz couldnt change his mentality, i think what happened in Memphis eith Gasol scarred him..
He was so afraid to make a player mad that he was constantly changing the lineups, giving 12 guys a night minutes, it just didnt work..
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Seems like a good guy but was a terrible head coach.
David Fizdale on the Knicks, via ‘The Jump:’
“They are exactly Tom Thibodeau. They are competing their tails off. You know I love those kids. So for them to know what it feels like to win in this league is great for them. And (Thibs) is doing a helluva job.”
I domt think Fiz is a bad guy, he is just an assistant in every sense of the word, as HC you got to be a hard ass and your going to piss players off..Assistants are the players friends and Fiz couldnt change his mentality, i think what happened in Memphis eith Gasol scarred him..
He was so afraid to make a player mad that he was constantly changing the lineups, giving 12 guys a night minutes, it just didnt work..
There has to be some balance. You also can’t give 6 guys 30+ minutes on back to back nights and have them fresh down the stretch.
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In comment 15131552 TyreeHelmet said:
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Seems like a good guy but was a terrible head coach.
David Fizdale on the Knicks, via ‘The Jump:’
“They are exactly Tom Thibodeau. They are competing their tails off. You know I love those kids. So for them to know what it feels like to win in this league is great for them. And (Thibs) is doing a helluva job.”
I domt think Fiz is a bad guy, he is just an assistant in every sense of the word, as HC you got to be a hard ass and your going to piss players off..Assistants are the players friends and Fiz couldnt change his mentality, i think what happened in Memphis eith Gasol scarred him..
He was so afraid to make a player mad that he was constantly changing the lineups, giving 12 guys a night minutes, it just didnt work..
There has to be some balance. You also can’t give 6 guys 30+ minutes on back to back nights and have them fresh down the stretch.
No but most starters play 30+ minutes in the NBA, most teams go 9 or 10 deep eith their 10th guy only playing 10 to 15 minutes..
Randle and Rj playing 37 minutes a night is not out of the ordinary and yes there will be nights they are tired
I will say for this draft I didn’t love anyone and I def. argued against trading up for ball, said I would just stay at 8 and take Haliburton. Ball looks good Haliburton looks good also so I don’t think I am wrong on that one. The frustrating thing was again Haliburton was such an easy pick there from a talent perspective and from a need perspective. I’m not going to act like some genius I think majority of people on this board thought Haliburton should have been the pick there and also the ‘experts’ did as well.
I really wanted Sexton, but he went right before knicks so nothing knicks can do about that. And I favored knox over bridges, which bridges looks like the better player now, I still see upside in knox, he needs a few more years and probably won’t be on the Knicks by the time he is reliable. I would have been fine with Porter jr risk but I also understood knicks were not in a position to take that risk given the current roster situation. I missed on SGA.
I did really want Booker in the KP draft and I did not want KP, I was happy to not get okafor. At the end of the day KP is a stud, but always hurt. I can’t say the Knicks are idiots for not trading down for Booker, but again if you watched him in college it was easy to see that he would be a star one day the way the league plays now a days and no reason for him dropping as far as he did.
These continue to be the most hilarious posts on BBI.
Again, still early.
Haliburton is not a point guard tho, The guy from Utah most likely ran the drsft, his name escapes me right now..
Again, still early.
Whether we like it or not, he IS raw. He played one season of varsity basketball in high school. He’s still learning the game
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is Obi Toppin doesn't win any one-on-one matchups. No matter the advantage. It seems like he loses all momentum, and can't back down anyone. He's a power forward. He's about to be 23 soon. He shouldn't be this raw. IMO.
Again, still early.
Whether we like it or not, he IS raw. He played one season of varsity basketball in high school. He’s still learning the game
I understand that he is. But from the impression that I got leading up to selectig him was that he was the most ready to make that jump Day 1. He's young. I'm patient. I'm sure an actual competent PG who could best utilize him would do wonders for the kid.
Hahaha whatever you say. Keep up the jokes.
When he gets the ball he is not used to smaller guys being so strong and bigger guys being quick.
In college he got a little guy he took him into the paint and score, if he got a big on him he blew right by him..
In the NBA that is not always the case..
I think he will be fine, for the Knicks the biggest issue is point guard play
I'd trade for Hield, gladly.
This was his seventh NBA game. Cmon.
In fact, I'd probably want future picks in exchange for taking on his contract. Maybe like DSJ, Knox for Hield, 2023 1st.
Saves the Kings 20 mil in cap moving forward, gets the Knicks a legit floor spacer that fits well with the rest of the roster.
The defense is a huge concern though
Obi needs to settle down, and just react instead of going 100mph with the ball. Our guard play doesn’t help either.
Separate I will pass on Hield, no defense, he looks like put on 40 lbs in the offseason which means he is lazy and he also has an attitude problem. He doesn’t do anything that is very exciting besides hitting 3-4 3’s a game. He is not worth the money.
As for Beal I am all in and would overpay, given that he is locked in for thisbyear and next and is entering his prime. Toppin, Knox, DSJ, Bullock and 4 first rounders for Beal. Given that we have the Dallas picks we lose net 2 first round picks for Beal plus a few guys that have potential to be good but we won’t know until down the road.
PG - Quickley/Frank/Payton
SG - Beal/Burks/Frank
SF - Barrett/Burks
PF - Randle/ buyout player
C - Mitch/noel/Gibson
Cap space for a max in the offseason but unfortunately no max guy left to sign. 2022 could have some really good free agents but most are likely to resign where they are, Mitch will be do $15 mil a year deal soon
I just think it's hilarious how openly and actively think you are some brilliant basketball mind.
"My track record speaks for itself." This is legitimately one of the funniest things I've read on here.
I just think it's hilarious how openly and actively think you are some brilliant basketball mind.
"My track record speaks for itself." This is legitimately one of the funniest things I've read on here.
you were also one of the posters actively tlaking about hoe you wanted haliburton
That said, he does seem to have above-average athleticism, the ability to create a bit, and to shoot a bit. I think his ceiling is an above-average starter.
He's also played only like 7 games and already shown flashes of being able to do some nice things, so maybe we should all (myself included) fall back a little bit.
As for Beal I am all in and would overpay, given that he is locked in for thisbyear and next and is entering his prime. Toppin, Knox, DSJ, Bullock and 4 first rounders for Beal. Given that we have the Dallas picks we lose net 2 first round picks for Beal plus a few guys that have potential to be good but we won’t know until down the road.
So we're giving up more assets for Beal than we did Melo? Aside from not nearly having the impact of Melo, Beal isn't worth 4 first round picks plus Toppin and Knox.
Also, I can't speak for Jon.. but you've said before how you do your gloating about wanting and being right on Mitchell on purpose just to see if we take the bait? After so many times, you come across as a douche. Like you were called out earlier, you also were high on Dennis Smith Jr. The "I know what I'm talking about" and "my track record speaks for itself" is the part where you lose any shred of being taken seriously. You were right about one prospect in an overall crapshoot draft. To act like you're some authority figure on scouting talent makes you look like a joke. As Jon and I like to say.. take a lap.
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As for Beal I am all in and would overpay, given that he is locked in for thisbyear and next and is entering his prime. Toppin, Knox, DSJ, Bullock and 4 first rounders for Beal. Given that we have the Dallas picks we lose net 2 first round picks for Beal plus a few guys that have potential to be good but we won’t know until down the road.
So we're giving up more assets for Beal than we did Melo? Aside from not nearly having the impact of Melo, Beal isn't worth 4 first round picks plus Toppin and Knox.
Also, I can't speak for Jon.. but you've said before how you do your gloating about wanting and being right on Mitchell on purpose just to see if we take the bait? After so many times, you come across as a douche. Like you were called out earlier, you also were high on Dennis Smith Jr. The "I know what I'm talking about" and "my track record speaks for itself" is the part where you lose any shred of being taken seriously. You were right about one prospect in an overall crapshoot draft. To act like you're some authority figure on scouting talent makes you look like a joke. As Jon and I like to say.. take a lap.
That trade for Beal would be an absolute steal for the Knicks, Beal is playing like a top 10 player in the league this year..
Beal, Rj, Randle, Mitch with room for more is not to shabby and eith the amount of picks the Knicks have they would still have 1st rounders to add players
Separate I will pass on Hield, no defense, he looks like put on 40 lbs in the offseason which means he is lazy and he also has an attitude problem. He doesn’t do anything that is very exciting besides hitting 3-4 3’s a game. He is not worth the money.
As for Beal I am all in and would overpay, given that he is locked in for thisbyear and next and is entering his prime. Toppin, Knox, DSJ, Bullock and 4 first rounders for Beal. Given that we have the Dallas picks we lose net 2 first round picks for Beal plus a few guys that have potential to be good but we won’t know until down the road.
PG - Quickley/Frank/Payton
SG - Beal/Burks/Frank
SF - Barrett/Burks
PF - Randle/ buyout player
C - Mitch/noel/Gibson
Cap space for a max in the offseason but unfortunately no max guy left to sign. 2022 could have some really good free agents but most are likely to resign where they are, Mitch will be do $15 mil a year deal soon
Washington laughs at that trade offer. I don’t think fans and people on here how much it’s going to take to trade for Beal. He also fits on every team in the league and there are going to be a ton of teams in on him. I think RJ and 5 1sts is a starting point and I highly doubt that gets it done.