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NFT: Knicks chat: Monitoring Beal and Mccollum

nygiants16 : 2/20/2021 3:17 pm
According to Bondy Knicks are willing to give up the assets to get Beal..

Knocks also monitoring Mccollum, Portland jas a decision to make because Lewis is going to get paid this summer and he has played well with Mccollum hurt
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Ah, I forgot BBI had a bunch of people root for the Eagles in the SB..  
Sean : 2/20/2021 11:23 pm : link
makes sense that there would be a portion of them rooting for the Sixers if they were to play the Nets.
RE: If that deal does get done,  
81_Great_Dane : 2/21/2021 12:13 am : link
In comment 15157963 Jon in NYC said:
Quote:
this is the lineup moving forward:

Mitch
Julius
Bullock
Beal
Payton

with Rose, IQ, Noel, Burks coming off the bench.

Pretty damn good team. Then in the offseason you still have almost another max available to go after maybe Lowry or CP3 on a high AAV short term deal to replace Payton. Would be nice to upgrade on Bullock too, although I do think he's actually become a decently useful player.
Gonna ruminate on this for minute:

That team makes the playoffs but is not going to compete for a title. The lineup has an elite SG in Beal and an All-Star-caliber PF in Randle. Mitch is a nice C who doesn't seem to have been developing, he may never be much more than what we've seen from him. IMO Bullock and Payton are not starters on a contending team — maybe backups playing behind much, much better players.

Let's assume a couple of draft picks can be regained by trading Rivers, Burks and/or Bullock. Payton may be attractive for some teams, maybe could bring back a late first-round pick from a contender, but the Knicks would need another PG just to get through this season. Rose can't play a ton of minutes and IQ is a rookie, bound to hit the wall.

Let's assume that management has a plan, and their goal is to field a championship contender, not just "Let's get relevant and field a reasonably entertaining team that can win a first-round playoff series."

So: What's the next step? They're not relying on the draft if they make that trade. Then it's free agency, which does seem to be the way teams turn around quickly in the NBA. As much as like "trust the process," jumping up through elite free agents is not a crazy idea at all. It's New York, after all, not Milwaukee or Oklahoma City. It's cold, but it's still the Big Apple.

First question: Is this management, coach and the pieces in place enough to convince elite free agents that the Knicks are an ok organization to play for? To wash off the Dolan stink? If so,

Second question: Who are those free agents? Kawhi? Is there any reason to think Kawhi Leonard would come to New York? I think he's the only elite talent in the next FA group. Then You'd still need a PG. Jrue Holiday? Is that enough?

Let's say they are aiming for:

FA-PG
Beal
Leonard
Randle
Mitch

with IQ and Rose coming off the bench, plus some new additions.

That is a formidable team. Needs depth, and not super young, but formidable.

I think I've talked myself into it. But they better hit on their picks or they're going to be a team in decline in just a few years.
Hate Philly  
Carl in CT : 2/21/2021 12:16 am : link
Just Hate the Nets more.
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: I'm sure it's irrational on my part  
Jim in Fairfax : 2/21/2021 1:12 am : link
In comment 15157877 nygiants16 said:
Quote:



You can’t trade back to back first round picks.



Yes you can, you cant go back.to back years with ZERO first round picks


The pick from Dallas in 2023 is protected. There’s no guarantee they’ll have that pick, therefore they can’t trade their 2022 and 2023 picks.

They COULD trade either one of their picks plus the Dallas 2023 protected pick.
Washington has won 4 in a row  
larryflower37 : 2/21/2021 2:01 am : link
This comes up every week and Washington is not moving Beal.
Westbrook and Beal are figuring it out and Beal has said multiple times he wants to stay in Washington.

Washington is going to do everything to keep Beal.
Our window is two years out  
adamg : 2/21/2021 3:36 am : link
We're not reading our way into contention with the nets and Lakers. Keep RJ. Keep the 3 firsts.

adam g is on the right path  
Chris L. : 2/21/2021 7:16 am : link
also, not enough being said about the many first round draft picks thrown in. The players in this years draft are REALLY REALLY good. At some point a trade will factor into this but not now. Be patient. Collect assets. Every day we become a better destination for free agents. How about we sign a younger Bradley Beal over the next two years in free agency and KEEP the assets. To act like our future options are not greatly diminished by trading three first round picks is wrong.
RE: Our window is two years out  
adamg : 2/21/2021 7:21 am : link
In comment 15158014 adamg said:
Quote:
We're not reading our way into contention with the nets and Lakers. Keep RJ. Keep the 3 firsts.


reading=trading
RE: Our window is two years out  
Sean : 2/21/2021 8:15 am : link
In comment 15158014 adamg said:
Quote:
We're not reading our way into contention with the nets and Lakers. Keep RJ. Keep the 3 firsts.


Agreed. Better to make aggressive moves later on, focus on development now. Hopefully that includes the playoffs.
RE: Ah, I forgot BBI had a bunch of people root for the Eagles in the SB..  
BigBlueShock : 2/21/2021 8:34 am : link
In comment 15157997 Sean said:
Quote:
makes sense that there would be a portion of them rooting for the Sixers if they were to play the Nets.

Oh please. That’s completely different. People rooting for The Eagles in the super bowl is far worse and the situations aren’t comparable.

If you want to use a comparison to the Nets playing the Sixers in the ECF it would be closer to the Eagles playing the Cowboys in the NFC Championship game. It’s easier to make a case for some people rooting for Philly in that scenario, no?
I'd root for 76ers over Nets.  
SFGFNCGiantsFan : 2/21/2021 9:00 am : link
This isn't like Eagles-Giants @ all.
Yeah  
Jon in NYC : 2/21/2021 9:10 am : link
I mean the Sixers Eagles comparison is one of the spectacularly bad takes in BBI Knicks history.
I guess I don’t get the Nets hate..  
Sean : 2/21/2021 9:13 am : link
Why? What fans do they have? What is their relevance?

I’m a Met fan, I gladly rooted for the Yankees when they played them in the World Series.
RE: I guess I don’t get the Nets hate..  
nygiants16 : 2/21/2021 9:15 am : link
In comment 15158048 Sean said:
Quote:
Why? What fans do they have? What is their relevance?

I’m a Met fan, I gladly rooted for the Yankees when they played them in the World Series.


you are one of the very few
I don't like the Nets because  
SFGFNCGiantsFan : 2/21/2021 9:19 am : link
I can't stand Irving and Harden. KD...I'm lukewarm on him, but I still think him going to Golden State was one of the softest moves in recent NBA history.

& outside of the Eagles, I don't really hate any Philly team. I'm not into hockey so that crosses off the Flyers & I'm meh about baseball so again, cross off the Phillies. And are the 76ers-Knicks even really rivals? I can't remember one big game between the two teams. This isn't like Knicks-Heat, Knicks-Bulls, & Knicks-Pacers.
SFGF..  
Sean : 2/21/2021 9:25 am : link
Didn’t you want Durant & Irving leading up to the summer of 2019? Wasn’t that the dream? Draft Zion and then sign Durant & Irving. That was literally the talk for the Knicks leading up to that summer.

I guess what annoys me is a lot of Knick fans mocking the Nets for “culture” in 2018 where they played above their heads and made the playoffs. I always stated that it mattered while most NYK fans didn’t. That season now puts them in a legit position to win a title.

Those same Knick fans are rightfully excited about the team this year, but isn’t it mostly the same as the Nets in 18?
Yes, I wanted KD  
SFGFNCGiantsFan : 2/21/2021 9:34 am : link
& Irving. And once they choose to go to Brooklyn, F them. I really just wanted KD, but Kyrie was a package deal so...

I never mocked the Nets for their 'culture'. But I think 'culture' is overrated. Talent wins in the NBA. And if you have an opportunity to get a talent like Beal, I think you gotta get him, provided you aren't selling the farm.
RE: Yes, I wanted KD  
adamg : 2/21/2021 9:46 am : link
In comment 15158060 SFGFNCGiantsFan said:
Quote:
& Irving. And once they choose to go to Brooklyn, F them. I really just wanted KD, but Kyrie was a package deal so...

I never mocked the Nets for their 'culture'. But I think 'culture' is overrated. Talent wins in the NBA. And if you have an opportunity to get a talent like Beal, I think you gotta get him, provided you aren't selling the farm.


RJ, three firsts and two swaps is the farm.
RE: RE: Yes, I wanted KD  
nygiants16 : 2/21/2021 9:51 am : link
In comment 15158064 adamg said:
Quote:
In comment 15158060 SFGFNCGiantsFan said:


Quote:


& Irving. And once they choose to go to Brooklyn, F them. I really just wanted KD, but Kyrie was a package deal so...

I never mocked the Nets for their 'culture'. But I think 'culture' is overrated. Talent wins in the NBA. And if you have an opportunity to get a talent like Beal, I think you gotta get him, provided you aren't selling the farm.



RJ, three firsts and two swaps is the farm.


no its not
RE: Yes, I wanted KD  
Sean : 2/21/2021 10:04 am : link
In comment 15158060 SFGFNCGiantsFan said:
Quote:
& Irving. And once they choose to go to Brooklyn, F them. I really just wanted KD, but Kyrie was a package deal so...

I never mocked the Nets for their 'culture'. But I think 'culture' is overrated. Talent wins in the NBA. And if you have an opportunity to get a talent like Beal, I think you gotta get him, provided you aren't selling the farm.


And the Knicks are in a better position to get talent since they are much better coached and hovering around .500.
Why do we have to be the nets?  
adamg : 2/21/2021 10:10 am : link
Why cant we be golden state?
Ny16  
adamg : 2/21/2021 10:13 am : link
If WAS says I want IQ, RJ, Obi, 3 firsts and the DET 2 for Beal. Do you say yes?
RE: Ny16  
nygiants16 : 2/21/2021 10:22 am : link
In comment 15158080 adamg said:
Quote:
If WAS says I want IQ, RJ, Obi, 3 firsts and the DET 2 for Beal. Do you say yes?


hell no that is giving up the farm
RE: Ny16  
BigBlueShock : 2/21/2021 10:25 am : link
In comment 15158080 adamg said:
Quote:
If WAS says I want IQ, RJ, Obi, 3 firsts and the DET 2 for Beal. Do you say yes?

I’m not sure there is a player in the league that I’d give all of that up for. You’re one injury away from absolute disaster
RE: Ny16  
SFGFNCGiantsFan : 2/21/2021 10:28 am : link
In comment 15158080 adamg said:
Quote:
If WAS says I want IQ, RJ, Obi, 3 firsts and the DET 2 for Beal. Do you say yes?


That is not the farm. That is the Louisiana Purchase. Hell no.
Lol. Just trying to see where the line is for the people willing to  
adamg : 2/21/2021 10:30 am : link
Sell on RJ. He's untouchable to me.
IQ, RJ, JR, MR  
adamg : 2/21/2021 10:36 am : link
That's the core to build around. I wouldn't touch any of those.
Knicks fans  
TyreeHelmet : 2/21/2021 10:50 am : link
Some Knicks fans are truly incredible. One poster said they had zero interest in CJ.... do you know how good that guy is?

And people doubting Beal are nuts. You aren’t going to get a player that talented without giving up a lot. I swear some Knicks fans wouldn’t treads a couple 1sts for prime Lebron. I would be all over Beal- incredible. You need stars in this league to win. Figure out the rest later. He can play D too....

With that said I wouldn’t believe anything from that clown Michael Kay. And the Wiz have won 4 in a row.

But 3 1sts and RJ for Beal is a complete no brainer. It’s going to cost more...
RE: Lol. Just trying to see where the line is for the people willing to  
nygiants16 : 2/21/2021 10:53 am : link
In comment 15158093 adamg said:
Quote:
Sell on RJ. He's untouchable to me.


its sinple for me:

Rj OR Obi

Frank and Knox in the deal, + whatever cap filler

21 dallas and knicks, 22 swap, 23 dallas, 24 swap
I still think Dipo  
nygiants16 : 2/21/2021 10:59 am : link
or Fournier are the 2 guards that end up in New York by the dealine, it is clear Knicks want to upgrade over Bullock..

Rockets seem close to going full youth
RE: Lol. Just trying to see where the line is for the people willing to  
TyreeHelmet : 2/21/2021 10:59 am : link
In comment 15158093 adamg said:
Quote:
Sell on RJ. He's untouchable to me.


You wouldn’t trade RJ for anyone in the league?
RE: RE: Lol. Just trying to see where the line is for the people willing to  
adamg : 2/21/2021 11:02 am : link
In comment 15158118 TyreeHelmet said:
Quote:
In comment 15158093 adamg said:


Quote:


Sell on RJ. He's untouchable to me.



You wouldn’t trade RJ for anyone in the league?


It depends, I guess. I think he has more value to the knicks than he does as a trade piece.
TyreeHelmet  
GMEN46 : 2/21/2021 11:02 am : link
I’m the guy who said I have no interest in McCullum. Turning 30 in September. 3 years $100 million starting next year.

I don’t see him ageing well, he is a very good player, but unathletic. I’m not trading the future for him. I’m all for Beal and lavine just not mccullum. He doesn’t fit with the timeline of the team.
I’m the guy who has no interest in the Nets  
Carl in CT : 2/21/2021 11:31 am : link
Sorry all?.
RE: TyreeHelmet  
larryflower37 : 2/21/2021 11:43 am : link
In comment 15158120 GMEN46 said:
Quote:
I’m the guy who said I have no interest in McCullum. Turning 30 in September. 3 years $100 million starting next year.

I don’t see him ageing well, he is a very good player, but unathletic. I’m not trading the future for him. I’m all for Beal and lavine just not mccullum. He doesn’t fit with the timeline of the team.


McCullum is a comp to Quickley, I think Quickley will ultimately land like McCullum off ball.
Both are undersized at 6'3 and have similar games.
IMO McCullum will age well because he shoots the lights out. Career .400 shooter from 3 and it hasn't gone down with volume.
Do I want to give up what it will take to get him now in his career and where the Knicks are no.

Also BTW Dame deserves the MVP and get very little respect.
RE: RE: Ah, I forgot BBI had a bunch of people root for the Eagles in the SB..  
djm : 2/21/2021 12:33 pm : link
In comment 15158037 BigBlueShock said:
Quote:
In comment 15157997 Sean said:


Quote:


makes sense that there would be a portion of them rooting for the Sixers if they were to play the Nets.


Oh please. That’s completely different. People rooting for The Eagles in the super bowl is far worse and the situations aren’t comparable.

If you want to use a comparison to the Nets playing the Sixers in the ECF it would be closer to the Eagles playing the Cowboys in the NFC Championship game. It’s easier to make a case for some people rooting for Philly in that scenario, no?


Wha? How on earth do the nets compare at all to Dallas?

Philly nets in ECF?? Go nets. Some of you are nuts.

The nets? Who fucking cares if they win? There are 24 nets fans. Who cares?
RE: RE: RE: Ah, I forgot BBI had a bunch of people root for the Eagles in the SB..  
BigBlueShock : 2/21/2021 1:02 pm : link
In comment 15158165 djm said:
Quote:
In comment 15158037 BigBlueShock said:


Quote:


In comment 15157997 Sean said:


Quote:


makes sense that there would be a portion of them rooting for the Sixers if they were to play the Nets.


Oh please. That’s completely different. People rooting for The Eagles in the super bowl is far worse and the situations aren’t comparable.

If you want to use a comparison to the Nets playing the Sixers in the ECF it would be closer to the Eagles playing the Cowboys in the NFC Championship game. It’s easier to make a case for some people rooting for Philly in that scenario, no?



Wha? How on earth do the nets compare at all to Dallas?

Philly nets in ECF?? Go nets. Some of you are nuts.

The nets? Who fucking cares if they win? There are 24 nets fans. Who cares?

A division rival that happens to play in the same city and is getting hyped beyond belief? It may not be a perfect comp but it’s certainly a hell of a lot more accurate than comparing it to Giants fans rooting for the fucking Eagles in the Super Bowl.

You can love the Nets all you want. I don’t give a shit. But I guaranfuckingtee you that if they win the championship and have all the pieces to win again after that, your tune is going to change. The hype is already nauseating. Can you imagine after they start winning? I’m hoping that gets nipped in the bud before it becomes a problem. Fuck the Nets. I have no interest in seeing them win a championship.
As in any trade, what it takes to get the player is very important.  
Ira : 2/21/2021 1:08 pm : link
If we have to give up the farm to get Beal, it's not a good idea. We'd probably lose him when he becomes a free agent next year. McCollum should require less in return because of his age. Point guard, IMO, is his best position.
RE: As in any trade, what it takes to get the player is very important.  
nygiants16 : 2/21/2021 1:21 pm : link
In comment 15158177 Ira said:
Quote:
If we have to give up the farm to get Beal, it's not a good idea. We'd probably lose him when he becomes a free agent next year. McCollum should require less in return because of his age. Point guard, IMO, is his best position.


why would you probably lose him? This isnt the old Knicks regime, Wes and Rose have legit connections, if they are trading for someone they know they can keep them..
RE: To me the biggest key to any Beal trade  
Gatorade Dunk : 2/21/2021 1:37 pm : link
In comment 15157967 djm said:
Quote:
Is what do the Knicks have up their sleeve after adding Beal? Regarding cost to get Beal the best thing about this start under Thibs is we have finally seen player development here. Knicks finally dealing from a position of strength. Key is what’s lined up after any Beal trade if it were to happen.

Ps I’d rather trade toppin than Barrett but maybe Barrett has built up enough of a rep to make a deal more palatable, meaning less players going to wash.

Have you let your dry cleaner know to expect some extra pants after the Knicks potentially acquire a full priced veteran acquisition, or do you keep your fetish to yourself?
RE: Ah, I forgot BBI had a bunch of people root for the Eagles in the SB..  
Gatorade Dunk : 2/21/2021 1:39 pm : link
In comment 15157997 Sean said:
Quote:
makes sense that there would be a portion of them rooting for the Sixers if they were to play the Nets.

Sean holding onto (and attempting to defend) one of the dumber BBI takes in recent history should make for some fun.
RE: I guess I don’t get the Nets hate..  
Gatorade Dunk : 2/21/2021 1:44 pm : link
In comment 15158048 Sean said:
Quote:
Why? What fans do they have? What is their relevance?

I’m a Met fan, I gladly rooted for the Yankees when they played them in the World Series.

Cool, so you'll root for any local winner.

Not exactly something I'd hang my hat on, but whatever.
I guess I didn’t realize Nets hatred..  
Sean : 2/21/2021 2:03 pm : link
Was as strong as I thought. All of their 15 fans really trigger a lot of Knick fans apparently. To each their own.
RE: I guess I didn’t realize Nets hatred..  
Gatorade Dunk : 2/21/2021 2:25 pm : link
In comment 15158207 Sean said:
Quote:
Was as strong as I thought. All of their 15 fans really trigger a lot of Knick fans apparently. To each their own.

No, you just didn't realize that the Sixers are just as irrelevant as the Nets, but not as local. And the Nets are the current superteam du jour, with Durant, Harden, Irving - right in the backyard of the Knicks.

No one who isn't already a Nets fan should try to justify rooting for them, although it sounds like you want an excuse to do exactly that.
It is nice  
nygiants16 : 2/21/2021 3:35 pm : link
to be talking to trades to improve the team halfway through the year rather than talking about dumping players for picks
RE: I guess I didn’t realize Nets hatred..  
SFGFNCGiantsFan : 2/21/2021 4:02 pm : link
In comment 15158207 Sean said:
Quote:
Was as strong as I thought. All of their 15 fans really trigger a lot of Knick fans apparently. To each their own.


Again, is there a 76ers Knicks rivalry? I don't think so. I can't recall one meaningful game vs. Philly in my life. I'm not even kidding. This isn't like Giants-Eagles, not even in the same universe. And the Nets hatred is entirely justifiable considering they have two of the more universally disliked players in the league in Kyrie & Harden.
&, for the record,  
SFGFNCGiantsFan : 2/21/2021 4:02 pm : link
I really don't even care about the Nets. But if it's 76ers Nets in the playoffs...I will be rooting for the Sixers.
from NYP article on Knicks coping without Mitch -  
Del Shofner : 2/21/2021 4:04 pm : link
According to sources, Thibodeau has spent three days of practice trying to mix and match. One thing he has looked into is playing more small-ball, moving Julius Randle to center and using rookie Obi Toppin at power forward.

Thibodeau is also debating whether to return Kevin Knox to the rotation at power forward, using him with Randle at center. Knox was taken out of the rotation on Jan. 31 against the Clippers — 10 games ago. Knox, the Knicks’ 2018 lottery pick, has made three garbage-time cameos in that span, playing a total of nine minutes.

The Knicks were a disaster offensively in the second half Wednesday at Orlando, missing 15 straight shots and amassing just 33 points following halftime in the 107-89 loss. Knox’s 3-point shooting could come in handy, as he was hitting them at a career-best 37.9 percent clip.

Meanwhile, the Knicks’ 2020 lottery pick, Toppin, is struggling from deep (29.7 percent) and looked tentative while playing just 11 minutes against the Magic.

Sources said the Knicks want to stand pat for now at center. In fact, the Knicks let young Westchester Knicks center Justin Patton, the No. 16 pick of the 2017 draft, sign a two-way deal with the Rockets on Friday. Patton, 23, played under Thibodeau in Minnesota.
RE: &, for the record,  
Sean : 2/21/2021 4:07 pm : link
In comment 15158253 SFGFNCGiantsFan said:
Quote:
I really don't even care about the Nets. But if it's 76ers Nets in the playoffs...I will be rooting for the Sixers.


I didn’t think my post would start a debate, ha. I certainly respect that view. I happen to like Doc Rivers and have no issues with the Sixers aside from them being in Philly.

I’m a Knick fan who doesn’t have hatred for this current Net squad. Just being honest. I did hate the Kidd/Martin era Nets.
I mean, if you want to root for the Nets, that's your business  
Greg from LI : 2/21/2021 11:37 pm : link
But no way in hell am I going to do that, ever.
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