NFT: Best rock drummer?

Thanks for posting!

Keith Moon for me. He might not have been the best technical drummer, but he epitomizes rock and roll. Manic, wailing, blowing up his kit....and of course all the excesses, which sadly, led to his untimely death.

but Ginger Baker was the insanest.

Is #1 for me.

Moon and Peart are up there as was Carl Palmer.

A fantastic yet underrated rock drummer also high on my list is Phil Collins. Guy gets a bad rap for his MTVDisney ballad days but man when he was behind the kit in his Genesis days he was legit great.

I always enjoyed Moon and Bonham.

Mighty Max Weinberg belongs on the list too.

so I've got to put Peart at number 1. Not fair to call him just a "drummer". More of "percussionist", given all the different types he played.

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Anyone who can play the drums with a dildo is worth mentioning.

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Waaaaaay far far far after that it is like an 8 way tie for next place.

In fact I am coincidentally grooving right now on Peart from Grace Under Pressure. Even the "less good" Rush songs almost always have a beat you can focus on and groove to. Maybe not coincidence because if I'm not listening to the Dead, it's almost always going to be Rush.

Baker

but never enough love for Stewart Copeland in my opinion

In comment 15166029 Trainmaster said:

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so I've got to put Peart at number 1. Not fair to call him just a "drummer". More of "percussionist", given all the different types he played.

Yeah, that's true. I've been to a few Rush shows but never really focused on live. But then I listened to some later live shows and he absolutely transcends "drums". He's triggering midi samples, playing virtual instruments, all that multimedia stuff I am sure most was him... besides playing basically the entire percussion ensemble all by himself.

And he went from drum "solos" in my day to ... I don't even know what you call that, midi/percussion/DJ mini concerts?

Bonham.

Baker and Peart can debate who is #2. For me, it was Baker for I thought he combined technique and innovation and a new ear.

I agree Peart generated technically superior percussion sounds

Moon was a great rock character but not a great drummer ( nor around long enough with enough even performances and innovation...lot of repeats of his madman greatest hits routines)

Bonham was innovative, technical, bold and a rock character and he had years of every night power before his too early end. Never mix early end and tours where every night it was Page whose contribution level varied more than JPJ or Plant or Bonham.

For at least the 4 tours (multiple shows each time) that I saw Bonham was a whole show every song every show machine that almost forced the other three to match the power

Sorry...but he was the best I ever saw or heard. And a better drummer ( different genre) than many a jazz drummer I went to see.

In comment 15166025 No Where Man said:

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but Ginger Baker was the insanest.

Keith Moon would like a word...

such a deft drummer with great touch, great hi-hat work.

Keith Moon is a personal favorite, he had such a unique style, and I think he was a better technician than given credit for.

Stewart Copeland is another fantastic player.

Terry Bozzio Carl Palmer Bonham & Peart all amazing !!

but I am a big fan of Larry Mullen, Jr, Dave Grohl, and Taylor Hawkins.

Strangely, Grohl and Hawkins are currently in the same bad... ;)

Mitch Mitchell. As good as any.

If you ever get a chance look up him playing Panic Attack from the “drums only” cam.

Guess it’s more Metal than Rock or Math Rock/ Math Metal, but I’d throw Zach Hill in there too, probably the best drummer I’ve ever seen live.

In comment 15166040 UConn4523 said:

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His drumming really stood out on Fear Inoculum

are/were all great without a doubt.

But for the sheer musicality of his drumming, and amazing singing at the same time, I'd nominate Levon Helm. He could rock with the best of them but also almost play a tune on the drums. Quite a life well lived too.

Full disclosure - he's somewhat of a god around here since he settled in Woodstock for much of his life and held his "rambles" at his barn there for many years (which his daughter Amy now runs, albeit on pandemic pause now).
Link - ( New Window )

In comment 15166043 D HOS said:

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Waaaaaay far far far after that it is like an 8 way tie for next place. In fact I am coincidentally grooving right now on Peart from Grace Under Pressure. Even the "less good" Rush songs almost always have a beat you can focus on and groove to. Maybe not coincidence because if I'm not listening to the Dead, it's almost always going to be Rush.

The video for The Body Electric is my fav Rush video out of all of them despite how dated it looks and sounds. When the band brought that song back from the dead in their next to last tour, it just didn't have the same oompf to it. Neil needed those big '80s sounding reverbed drums and his electric kit. Red Lenses is also another deep cut from that era with a weird yet cool drum pattern

And then they was Ringo

of Carl Palmer. I agree he's in the "below Peart" conversation.

and Keith Moon get my vote

Because of the era and music in his lifetime, most consider him a Jazz drummer. I see him more as the founding father of rock drummers... brilliant and almost forgotten. Enjoy this clip of one of his magnificent solos...


Gene Krupa - ( New Window )

but I feel like Travis Barker should get some love on great drummer lists. I know he's younger than others that have been mentioned but the guy can drum.

Tommy Aldridge
Cozy Powell

He is mesmerizing to watch live.

My top 3:
Carter Beauford- Dave Matthews Band
Stewart Copeland - Police
Lars Ulrich - Metallica

From Phish. Guy is a machine.

Morgan Rose - Sevendust

more a jazz drummer. There’s some really fantastic drummers.....Chris Coleman, Todd Sucherman, Steve Smith, Carl Palmer, there’s so many to even mention. Peart, Bohnnam, Baker were probably the best all time.

is absolutely fantastic. He can nail any feel whether it be ahead or behind the beat, he can play with complexity and technique without being a distraction, and his tone and consistency are impeccable.

including John Entwistle, arguably the greatest bassist.

He’s always been a guy that bands bring in as a session drummer, but he eventually landed with Korn. Amazing drummer. Here’s his Korn audition video. Another great tune is “Goodbye” by Army of Anyone. It was a one album supergroup consisting of Richard Patrick of Filter, the DeLeo brothers of STP, and Luzier on drums. In the last few minutes of the song Luzier puts on a drum clinic.
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1. Bonham - just a beast that always get my attention whenever I listen to Zep

2. Bill Ward - seems to get forgotten in these discussions. He was so funky with his jazzy metal fusion in the early Sabbath days.

3. Ginger Baker - Cream was my first intro to classic rock growing up (I'm 44). The groove he would set behind the loud thundering bass and Clapton's riff - so dang good when they were in the pocket.

Not rock but one drummer that has blown me away recently is Larnell Lewis from Snarky Puppy,

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L_XJ_s5IsQc

drum solo
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for any category Buddy Rich and everyone else

In comment 15166094 thomasa510 said:

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In comment 15166040 UConn4523 said: Quote: . His drumming really stood out on Fear Inoculum

I’ve been listening to their entire library non stop for the past year and a half and I agree, he stands out in Fear but he’s equally impressive on Lateralus.
Carey Live - ( New Window )

But Bruford has always been my dark horse. I really think he gets too little credit.

Steve Gadd
Bingham was everyone’s first love. For good reason.

Go listen to to Geek USA by Smashing pumpkins. And tell me that guy ain’t whoop ass

To add another that no one has mentioned: John Stanier (Helmet, Battles), I love his beats and style.

Dunbar

Greiner from August Burns Red. Best in the biz right now.
The Best - ( New Window )

In comment 15166037 robbieballs2003 said:

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Anyone who can play the drums with a dildo is worth mentioning.

LMAO I love Steel Panther! Satchel got me back into playing guitar. They are so talented. So many of there songs are fantastic.

case closed.

I'm partial to Max Weinberg because I worship at the altar of Bruce.

while I don't think you can quantify best, Dave Lombardo & Carmine Appice should be in the discussion

In comment 15166260 beatrixkiddo said:

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To add another that no one has mentioned: John Stanier (Helmet, Battles), I love his beats and style.

2nd stanier. Great call. Seen battles in many iterations.

because it will always be based on personal taste (which is fine).

I am not sure I would call the 3 below "Rock" drummers ... but, holy crap if you want a demonstration of technique (and thousands of hours of practice) - click the link.



Gadd, Weckl, and Colaiuta - ( New Window )

In comment 15166289 short lease said:

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because it will always be based on personal taste (which is fine). I am not sure I would call the 3 below "Rock" drummers ... but, holy crap if you want a demonstration of technique (and thousands of hours of practice) - click the link. Gadd, Weckl, and Colaiuta - ( New Window )

Where is Jonny5? It can't be a discussion on music without his input. : )

&show_all=1#15166027]15166027[/url] Eman11 said:

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Is #1 for me. Moon and Peart are up there as was Carl Palmer. A fantastic yet underrated rock drummer also high on my list is Phil Collins. Guy gets a bad rap for his MTVDisney ballad days but man when he was behind the kit in his Genesis days he was legit great.

I'm in the Keith Moon camps and totally agree about Phil Collins. Greatest live drummer I've seen. Everyone got sick of him as a singer, but he was a fantastic drummer way before he fronted Genesis

gets my vote.

In comment 15166331 RodneyHamp said:

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gets my vote.

+1

great choice.

But Peart was an actual "musician". Big distinction. Oh and an all- world lyricist beyond compare.

And for anyone putting Ringo in the mix- just wow.

In comment 15166337 CRinCA said:

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But Peart was an actual "musician". Big distinction. Oh and an all- world lyricist beyond compare. And for anyone putting Ringo in the mix- just wow.

Did I read your post wrong? Serious ... IMO Ringo was a great drummer for the Beatles.

Ringo was a Left-handed drummer who played a right handed kit. It gave him a unique playing style. He was rock solid on so many tracks ...

"Tomorrow never knows", "Rain", the whole "Abbey Road" album. To this day I will never understand why Ringo's musical abilities gets shit on.

Apologies if I mis-interpreted your post.

In comment 15166347 short lease said:

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IIMO Ringo was a great drummer for the Beatles. Ringo was a Left-handed drummer who played a right handed kit. It gave him a unique playing style. He was rock solid on so many tracks ... "Tomorrow never knows", "Rain", the whole "Abbey Road" album. To this day I will never understand why Ringo's musical abilities gets shit on.

with you on that short lease. Ringo might not have been the right drummer for Cream or Rush, but he was the right drummer for the Beatles, and he had a unique style for the reasons you say. Another very musical drummer.

Many great names have been listed: Bonham, Peart, Ringo, Ginger, Copeland..... all legends.

3 names I am shocked haven’t been mentioned are: Peter Criss, Steve Smith and Phil Collins. Especially Collins. He may have the most famous drum full of all time. He maybe known for his singing and sing writing but his drumming is so iconic and unique that you can tell it is him. He has his own style and sound.

I throw a few more names out although they aren’t just rock drummers: Omar Hakim, Manu Katche, Chester Thompson.

In comment 15166350 Del Shofner said:

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In comment 15166347 short lease said: Quote: IIMO Ringo was a great drummer for the Beatles. Ringo was a Left-handed drummer who played a right handed kit. It gave him a unique playing style. He was rock solid on so many tracks ... "Tomorrow never knows", "Rain", the whole "Abbey Road" album. To this day I will never understand why Ringo's musical abilities gets shit on. with you on that short lease. Ringo might not have been the right drummer for Cream or Rush, but he was the right drummer for the Beatles, and he had a unique style for the reasons you say. Another very musical drummer.

Exactly Del - just like I think the 1970's - 1980's Neil Peart would have been a failure with The Beatles ... in 1962 - unless he changed his style?

That is why I try to stay away from these conversations. But, I do get sucked in (lol).

How do you determine who is the greatest "Rock" drummer? ... What style are we talking about? What era?

In comment 15166358 Rjanyg said:

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Many great names have been listed: Bonham, Peart, Ringo, Ginger, Copeland..... all legends. 3 names I am shocked haven’t been mentioned are: Peter Criss, Steve Smith and Phil Collins. Especially Collins. He may have the most famous drum full of all time. He maybe known for his singing and sing writing but his drumming is so iconic and unique that you can tell it is him. He has his own style and sound. I throw a few more names out although they aren’t just rock drummers: Omar Hakim, Manu Katche, Chester Thompson.

Look up Johnathon "Sugarfoot" Moffett. He did session work with a lot of big names, especially on Michael Jackson's albums

In comment 15166358 Rjanyg said:

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Many great names have been listed: Bonham, Peart, Ringo, Ginger, Copeland..... all legends. 3 names I am shocked haven’t been mentioned are: Peter Criss, Steve Smith and Phil Collins. Especially Collins. He may have the most famous drum full of all time. He maybe known for his singing and sing writing but his drumming is so iconic and unique that you can tell it is him. He has his own style and sound. I throw a few more names out although they aren’t just rock drummers: Omar Hakim, Manu Katche, Chester Thompson.

Maybe I missed his name but, if anyone is talking about Hard Rock ... how did Ian Paice's name not get mentioned?

His hi-hat work on "My Woman from Tokyo" ... is Genius. There is also a video of him on Youtube doing a 1 handed role that sounds like 2 hands.

Love Omar Hakim.


I have to get out of here .... lol.

Bill Ward and Danny Carey are my favorites.

Is Phil Collins much different from say, Don Henley with Eagles and later solo days? I'm not trying to be a dick but I tend to think of them as comparatively "equal" although I'll admit to not being real familiar with the early Genesis days of Collins.

Honest questions not trying to be inflammatory. I barely recall the 70's and 80's as it is.

He's amazing, and not just in the metal sphere.

not just because of my own opinion as a Rush fan but many of the drummers I know (ok I know two drummers - both on my hockey team) and both say Peart is the best.

but can't argue with Bonham, Baker, Moon or any other suggestions.

I also like Steven Adler from Guns N' Roses. The signature drumming from songs like Paradise City just stood out so much when Appetite for Destruction came out it made me look at the CD liner notes to see "who is that drummer, guy is awesome?"

I'm not sure I've ever been compelled to do that.

...he is as meh as they come.

Maybe he was good when he was in his early 20s, but he's been basic since the Black Album.

In comment 15166376 CRinCA said:

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Is Phil Collins much different from say, Don Henley with Eagles and later solo days? I'm not trying to be a dick but I tend to think of them as comparatively "equal" although I'll admit to not being real familiar with the early Genesis days of Collins. Honest questions not trying to be inflammatory. I barely recall the 70's and 80's as it is.

As drummers, Collins and Henley are night and day. I recommend some old [Peter Gabriel] Genesis (Plenty of good stuff on Selling England By the Pound).

In comment 15166358 Rjanyg said:

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Many great names have been listed: Bonham, Peart, Ringo, Ginger, Copeland..... all legends. 3 names I am shocked haven’t been mentioned are: Peter Criss, Steve Smith and Phil Collins. Especially Collins. He may have the most famous drum full of all time. He maybe known for his singing and sing writing but his drumming is so iconic and unique that you can tell it is him. He has his own style and sound. I throw a few more names out although they aren’t just rock drummers: Omar Hakim, Manu Katche, Chester Thompson.

Phil’s been mentioned several times in this thread.

my biggest influences over time were Hal Blaine, Ringo, John Bonham, Ginger Baker, Bill Bruford, Tony Williams, Billy Cobham and Steve Gadd. And then, of course, I grew up right down the road from Gene Krupa. We would visit him at his house. Great guy!

Tre Cool and Corky Laing - so hard to quantify 'best' these guys were excellent with who they played with - not unlike Ringo. Corky without Leslie West wouldn't be the same but they compliment each other so well. Same with Tre and Billie Joe

In comment 15166358 Rjanyg said:

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Many great names have been listed: Bonham, Peart, Ringo, Ginger, Copeland..... all legends. 3 names I am shocked haven’t been mentioned are: Peter Criss, Steve Smith and Phil Collins. Especially Collins. He may have the most famous drum full of all time. He maybe known for his singing and sing writing but his drumming is so iconic and unique that you can tell it is him. He has his own style and sound. I throw a few more names out although they aren’t just rock drummers: Omar Hakim, Manu Katche, Chester Thompson.

Good call on Phil Collins, amazing drummer. The funny thing with Phil Collins is when you talk to people that are like he played the drums? They only remember him as a singer.

But my favorite drummer is groove-meister, John Bonham.

From any conversation about Peary because I can't stand Rush. But though I can admire his obviously immense skill, his drumming doesn't do it for me... always felt it lacked soul.

Which means that he is indeed the perfect drummer for Rush.

A few Zep songs like Achilles Last Stand or The Song Remains the Same give a glimpse into how Bonham would have approached a prog song, and they kill.

My guys are Dave Lombardo, Igor Cavalera, Dale Crover, and Jimmy Chamberlain.

John Stanier is a fantastic drummer, but Battles is just too weird for me to get into. He says he has no interest in playing metal again. His Helmet work is still incredible.

With Zappa and the Mothers and later Genesis

If he was added here I apologize.

who truly has his own style is Bill Ward. Just look at this live performance from 1970. Doing this with a fraction of the drums that some of the more modern drummers were using. Bill was likely the best rock drummer in the early 70s.

He really gets going at the 2 min mark of the video.
Bill Ward Live - ( New Window )

In comment 15166435 Greg from LI said:

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My guys are Dave Lombardo, Igor Cavalera, Dale Crover, and Jimmy Chamberlain. John Stanier is a fantastic drummer, but Battles is just too weird for me to get into. He says he has no interest in playing metal again. His Helmet work is still incredible.

I love Battles, but yeah some if it is hit or miss for me. Have you heard of Hella? Zach Hill is ridiculous on drums, single bass pedal and how he keeps that energy non stop is ridiculous. Guy has an incredible story too, pretty much lives homeless in an abandoned warehouse for some time, really a humble and insanely talented drummer.

In comment 15166467 liteamorn said:

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With Zappa and the Mothers and later Genesis If he was added here I apologize.

I didn’t see Chester mentioned either but thought about him as well. Great call and totally worthy of being up there with the best.

are legends.

Some of my favorite current drummers that are excellent are:

Ian Paice from Deep Purple has to be one of the all time underrated drummers.
Mike Portnoy - Dream Theater, Flying Colors, Avenged Sevenfold, Adrenaline Mob and whatever other band he has going right now.
Morgan Rose - Sevendust
Alex Bent - Trivium

and recently I have really gotten into the playing of Mario Duplantier from Gojira

In comment 15166080 BillT said:

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Mitch Mitchell. As good as any.

Going thru this thread was surprised he only got one mention

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Bonham's half-time shuffle groove... - ( New Window )

he would say Keith Moon (I just saw him say it recently in a documentary on Moon).

I agree with Alice.

The Who were always known as a great high energy live band. Moon was the driver of the high energy (except when he took enough horse tranquilizers to kill most people). The rest of the band had to keep up with him (this is based on interviews of Pete and Roger).

They maintained that energy after Moon died. I remember seeing the Stones in '81 and it was ok. Then I saw The Who for the first time in '82 (at Shea - David Johannsen and The Clash opened). The Who blew away the Stones. The energy was unreal (and that tour was with a relatively low energy Kenny Jones (of The Faces) on drums).

Long live rock!

In comment 15166025 No Where Man said:

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but Ginger Baker was the insanest.

He was the closest to a jazz drummer as any rock drummer ever. Which means he was pretty much the best.

In comment 15166588 djm said:

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In comment 15166025 No Where Man said: Quote: but Ginger Baker was the insanest. He was the closest to a jazz drummer as any rock drummer ever. Which means he was pretty much the best.

jazz?

I tried to get into it. I do like some jazz influence in some rock, but when it comes to jazz in general, I was better at acquiring a taste for Brussel sprouts.

In comment 15166524 Scott in Montreal said:

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are legends. Some of my favorite current drummers that are excellent are: Ian Paice from Deep Purple has to be one of the all time underrated drummers. Mike Portnoy - Dream Theater, Flying Colors, Avenged Sevenfold, Adrenaline Mob and whatever other band he has going right now. Morgan Rose - Sevendust Alex Bent - Trivium and recently I have really gotten into the playing of Mario Duplantier from Gojira

I came here to add in Gojira. Just started listening to them the past few months, Duplantier's speed and power is impressive.

In comment 15166425 santacruzom said:

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From any conversation about Peary because I can't stand Rush. But though I can admire his obviously immense skill, his drumming doesn't do it for me... always felt it lacked soul. Which means that he is indeed the perfect drummer for Rush.

LOL. I hate you for saying it, but damn that was funny.

In comment 15166572 Dr. D said:

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he would say Keith Moon (I just saw him say it recently in a documentary on Moon). I agree with Alice. . . .

Dr D,
Drummer debates are fun! This all comes down to personal opinion, so you are not wrong to choose Moon, but in my definition of ‘best drummer’, Moon isn’t the best.

Moon provided energy to The Who’s live shows, there is no disputing that. He played a ton of notes; banged on drums like nuts. He filled space with busy fills every chance he could. To my ears that didn’t always add value. He sometimes played in his own world, leaving the time-keeping job to Entwistle.

Are busy fills more important than delivering a sense of groove?

To me, a more important factor of the ‘best drummer’ is delivering a sense of groove. That, along with keeping time have the most weight. Playing fills is a lesser factor. If you think of Stewart Copeland for example; he played a variety of styles, but his energy really drove the Police’s music. He didn’t need to play monster fills to provide that energy.

What factors do you think make the ‘best drummer’?

In comment 15166572 Dr. D said:

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he would say Keith Moon (I just saw him say it recently in a documentary on Moon). I agree with Alice. The Who were always known as a great high energy live band. Moon was the driver of the high energy (except when he took enough horse tranquilizers to kill most people). The rest of the band had to keep up with him (this is based on interviews of Pete and Roger). They maintained that energy after Moon died. I remember seeing the Stones in '81 and it was ok. Then I saw The Who for the first time in '82 (at Shea - David Johannsen and The Clash opened). The Who blew away the Stones. The energy was unreal (and that tour was with a relatively low energy Kenny Jones (of The Faces) on drums). Long live rock!

The Who would have ended in 1989 had Pete not hired Zak Starkey (Ringo's son). Pete has stated that he will never play another Who show unless Zak is on drums. He calls Zak the karmic Keith Moon.

In comment 15166771 rnargi said:

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The Who would have ended in 1989 had Pete not hired Zak Starkey (Ringo's son). Pete has stated that he will never play another Who show unless Zak is on drums. He calls Zak the karmic Keith Moon.

Yeah, Roger was ok with Kenny Jones, but Pete wasn't. There was a drummer in between Jones and Zak. I forgot his name so i just looked up the '89 tour (I saw 3 of those shows). Simon Phillips actually played drums on that tour. He wasn't bad, but Zak is the best and most Moon like.

You're probably aware that Keith was close friends with Ringo and sort of Zak's Godfather. The story goes that Ringo didn't want Zak going into the music business. Keith basically said f*ck that and bought Zak his first drum kit.. and the rest is history.

I've seen The Who with Zak quite a few times and it's always great. Kind of crazy to think he's been drummer for The Who so much longer than Keith was. Of course Keith's years were the golden years.

In comment 15166153 Devour the Day said:

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My top 3: Carter Beauford- Dave Matthews Band Stewart Copeland - Police Lars Ulrich - Metallica

Beauford absolutely belongs in the conversation, IMO. Peart and Copeland too, for sure, along with Moon, Collins, and Grohl.

In comment 15166766 Gregorio said:

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In comment 15166572 Dr. D said: Quote: he would say Keith Moon (I just saw him say it recently in a documentary on Moon). I agree with Alice. . . . Dr D, Drummer debates are fun! This all comes down to personal opinion, so you are not wrong to choose Moon, but in my definition of ‘best drummer’, Moon isn’t the best. What factors do you think make the ‘best drummer’?

Are you questioning Super Duper Alice Cooper?!

All the young girls love Alice! (45 years ago, anyway).

Ha! Gregorio, looks like you know far more about drumming than I. But I will say that imo, Moon knew how to use empty space (don't know if that's a legit term), but as an example he used it well through the climax of Won't Get Fooled Again. And climax is a good word for it.

I do agree that (from what I've read) the Ox had to sometimes keep timing together on stage. But The Who wouldn't have been The Who (who I love) if Moon wasn't their drummer the first 15 yrs.

And was never a big fan of the Police, so can't say jack about Copeland.

In comment 15166272 Beef Wellington said:

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case closed.

Good call on Gordon, such a fantastic player. Loved his work on Derek & the Dominos and the later Traffic records. Such a tragic story - an undiagnosed paranoid schizophrenic who is in prison for killing his mother. He sought treatment a number of times, but was told his issues were drug-related.

In comment 15166376 CRinCA said:

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Is Phil Collins much different from say, Don Henley with Eagles and later solo days? I'm not trying to be a dick but I tend to think of them as comparatively "equal" although I'll admit to not being real familiar with the early Genesis days of Collins. Honest questions not trying to be inflammatory. I barely recall the 70's and 80's as it is.

No way, Phil Collins was a far better drummer than Henley, it's not even close. He can't play anymore, but his Genesis work and his first solo record were tour de force drum sessions.

In comment 15166474 EricJ said:

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who truly has his own style is Bill Ward. Just look at this live performance from 1970. Doing this with a fraction of the drums that some of the more modern drummers were using. Bill was likely the best rock drummer in the early 70s. He really gets going at the 2 min mark of the video. Bill Ward Live - ( New Window )

Honestly, I think everyone in Black Sabbath is underrated and I only like roughly half their songs. Geezer Butler in particular -- other bassists know he rules, but he rarely appears on any "great bassist" list.

In comment 15166534 Brown_Hornet said:

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... Bonham's half-time shuffle groove... - ( New Window )

Jesus, listen to all those ghost notes! How the hell.

Michael Shrieve, lifelong Santana drummer. He set the world on fire as a 19 yr old at Woodstock, and hasn't slowed down a bit.

I'll add 2 more, Glenn Kotche of Wilco, and Phil Selway of Radiohead. Kotche is simply fantastic, especially live. And listen to Selway's work on Reckoner off of the In Rainbows record, the closest thing to Art Blakely I've heard in popular music.

In comment 15166766 Gregorio said:

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To me, a more important factor of the ‘best drummer’ is delivering a sense of groove. That, along with keeping time have the most weight. Playing fills is a lesser factor. If you think of Stewart Copeland for example; he played a variety of styles, but his energy really drove the Police’s music. He didn’t need to play monster fills to provide that energy.

That's a great way to put it. Copeland basically propels the band almost single-handedly with just his hi hat.

I used to really love that guy, but in general these days, I prefer a more laid back feel to being ahead of the beat all the time.

Selway is awesome. He has a great knack for rendering Radiohead's riffs and melodies into a great feel, and can be powerful, delicate, propulsive, laid back, and everywhere in between.

In comment 15166358 Rjanyg said:

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Many great names have been listed: Bonham, Peart, Ringo, Ginger, Copeland..... all legends. 3 names I am shocked haven’t been mentioned are: Peter Criss, Steve Smith and Phil Collins. Especially Collins. He may have the most famous drum full of all time. He maybe known for his singing and sing writing but his drumming is so iconic and unique that you can tell it is him. He has his own style and sound. I throw a few more names out although they aren’t just rock drummers: Omar Hakim, Manu Katche, Chester Thompson.

I have a family story that my cousin (mom's first cousin) introduced Peter Criss to the drums. It's plausible because they grew up in the same neighborhood in Brooklyn and would be roughly the same age (but my cousin died in a car accident before I was born.) Also, my cousin and other family members played in polka bands. He learned to play at very young age bc they needed a drummer. He played drums at weddings and such in his early teens.

are Bruford, Peart, and Paul Ramsey.

In comment 15166347 short lease said:

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In comment 15166337 CRinCA said: Quote: But Peart was an actual "musician". Big distinction. Oh and an all- world lyricist beyond compare. And for anyone putting Ringo in the mix- just wow. Did I read your post wrong? Serious ... IMO Ringo was a great drummer for the Beatles. Ringo was a Left-handed drummer who played a right handed kit. It gave him a unique playing style. He was rock solid on so many tracks ... "Tomorrow never knows", "Rain", the whole "Abbey Road" album. To this day I will never understand why Ringo's musical abilities gets shit on. Apologies if I mis-interpreted your post.

Ring tremendously underrated because of the company he kept. But a very fine drummer. A friend of mine who plays professionally on tours all over the world can go on and on about the technical aspects of Ringo’s playing that make him one of the most underrated drummers of all time. He points to Ringo’s inventive drumming on Come Together as an example.

on Amazon if I'm not mistaken about their transition from touring in Germany to becoming the biggest band in the world. In it, either John or Paul (or both) are quoted as saying the entire band simply took a huge step forward once Ringo took the drum throne.

I've felt that too, when our old band replaced our subpar drummer with one who wasn't spectacular, but who was simply rock solid and played with conviction. Everything else, even the vocals, just sounded much better as a result.

It's called Eight Days a Week, on Hulu. Roughly 5 minutes in Paul says:

"I still remember that moment the first time Ringo played with us. Bang, he kicks in. And it was an Oh My God moment. I remember looking, and we're all looking at each other like, 'Yeah, this is it.'"

In comment 15166425 santacruzom said:

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From any conversation about Peary because I can't stand Rush. But though I can admire his obviously immense skill, his drumming doesn't do it for me... always felt it lacked soul. Which means that he is indeed the perfect drummer for Rush.

I was never quite sure how to express my respect for and dislike of, Neil Peart.
Until now.

This is awesome.

In comment 15167041 Brown_Hornet said:

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In comment 15166425 santacruzom said: Quote: From any conversation about Peary because I can't stand Rush. But though I can admire his obviously immense skill, his drumming doesn't do it for me... always felt it lacked soul. Which means that he is indeed the perfect drummer for Rush. I was never quite sure how to express my respect for and dislike of, Neil Peart. Until now. This is awesome.

This is the thing about Bonham, who had great skills, perhaps not on the level of Peart but still great, but who had a groove and feel and an inventiveness within the normal structure of rock music. He played "deep in the pocket" otherwise known as a "fat groove". It is hard to play that way and sound together. Bonham's feel is a big part of Zeppelin's sound. Add to that the heaviness of his playing and the sound he achieves, and you can see why without Bonham there is no Led Zeppelin. Later in his career Peart explored laying back more and studied groove. It wasn't something that came naturally to him.

As it regards Ringo, I'm not a great fan and I think the Beatles would have benefitted from a better drummer. His playing is fine but I think there are many who are just as good and would have been a good fit for the Beatles.

I am actually surprised nobody has mentioned Charlie Watts. Watts is seriously underrated. He helps the Stones swing. And I think he is superior to Ringo.

In comment 15167088 Producer said:

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As it regards Ringo, I'm not a great fan and I think the Beatles would have benefitted from a better drummer. His playing is fine but I think there are many who are just as good and would have been a good fit for the Beatles.

It's so hard to tell though, because even though many of Ringo's parts can be played by a decent drummer, I'm not sure they would have been conceived by many of them.

A guy like Watts, whose feel I love... I'm not sure there are many Stones songs featuring a drum part I can easily identify as a Watts part if someone else played it perfectly. But Ringo provided a ton of easily recognizable parts. Would those parts have been created or surpassed by another drummer? We'll never know.

I just have to defer to the quote from McCartney I provided earlier. To hear him talk about how the entire band responded the moment Ringo took over for Pete Best -- how recalling the memory actually made him choke up a bit -- tells volumes.

No other instrument can do that to the whole band like a drummer, IMO. It's too bad the awesome power of drums is wielded by drummers, the most likely people on earth to misappropriate that power!

In comment 15167114 santacruzom said:

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In comment 15167088 Producer said: Quote: As it regards Ringo, I'm not a great fan and I think the Beatles would have benefitted from a better drummer. His playing is fine but I think there are many who are just as good and would have been a good fit for the Beatles. It's so hard to tell though, because even though many of Ringo's parts can be played by a decent drummer, I'm not sure they would have been conceived by many of them. A guy like Watts, whose feel I love... I'm not sure there are many Stones songs featuring a drum part I can easily identify as a Watts part if someone else played it perfectly. But Ringo provided a ton of easily recognizable parts. Would those parts have been created or surpassed by another drummer? We'll never know.

Watts makes you dance to the Stones. Watts is the sexy of the Stones music, which is huge. If it was Ringo playing on those songs, honestly I don't think it would be nearly as good. Good drumming on Stones songs.. there are plenty. Maybe you are not much of a fan. Start with Honky Tonk Women, Can't You Hear me Knocking, Gimme Shelter (epic menacing groove), Paint it Black, Sympathy for the Devil... dark, swinging, sexy.. is Watts.

let's not forget that there are heavy rumors that in fact it was McCartney who played some of the drums on the White Album and Abbey Road, the albums with the very best drumming on Beatles albums.

In comment 15167150 Producer said:

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In comment 15167114 santacruzom said: Quote: In comment 15167088 Producer said: Quote: As it regards Ringo, I'm not a great fan and I think the Beatles would have benefitted from a better drummer. His playing is fine but I think there are many who are just as good and would have been a good fit for the Beatles. It's so hard to tell though, because even though many of Ringo's parts can be played by a decent drummer, I'm not sure they would have been conceived by many of them. A guy like Watts, whose feel I love... I'm not sure there are many Stones songs featuring a drum part I can easily identify as a Watts part if someone else played it perfectly. But Ringo provided a ton of easily recognizable parts. Would those parts have been created or surpassed by another drummer? We'll never know. Watts makes you dance to the Stones. Watts is the sexy of the Stones music, which is huge. If it was Ringo playing on those songs, honestly I don't think it would be nearly as good. Good drumming on Stones songs.. there are plenty. Maybe you are not much of a fan. Start with Honky Tonk Women, Can't You Hear me Knocking, Gimme Shelter (epic menacing groove), Paint it Black, Sympathy for the Devil... dark, swinging, sexy.. is Watts.

No no, I didn't mean to imply I didn't think there is no good drumming in the entire Stones catalog. But his parts are more straight-ahead and fundamental than what you'll hear in a lot of later-day Beatles tunes, which are more compositional.

Also, Ringo delivered the danceable R&B stuff very well in their early years.

In comment 15167120 santacruzom said:

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I just have to defer to the quote from McCartney I provided earlier. To hear him talk about how the entire band responded the moment Ringo took over for Pete Best -- how recalling the memory actually made him choke up a bit -- tells volumes. No other instrument can do that to the whole band like a drummer, IMO. It's too bad the awesome power of drums is wielded by drummers, the most likely people on earth to misappropriate that power!

But was McCartney’s comment more about how good Ringo was, or just how bad Pete Best was. Their label told them they would not allow Best to play on any record. They could tour with him, but they had to find another studio drummer.

In comment 15167229 Section331 said:

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In comment 15167120 santacruzom said: Quote: I just have to defer to the quote from McCartney I provided earlier. To hear him talk about how the entire band responded the moment Ringo took over for Pete Best -- how recalling the memory actually made him choke up a bit -- tells volumes. No other instrument can do that to the whole band like a drummer, IMO. It's too bad the awesome power of drums is wielded by drummers, the most likely people on earth to misappropriate that power! But was McCartney’s comment more about how good Ringo was, or just how bad Pete Best was. Their label told them they would not allow Best to play on any record. They could tour with him, but they had to find another studio drummer.

yes. A bit of both I suspect. I'm sure Ringo elevated their sound. He was a pro drummer. He is a great drummer there is no doubt. I'm sure he was a good participant bringing the music to tape. But he's not in Bonham's class. Bonham almost defines Zeppelin's sound. And I like the swing of Watts better.

In comment 15167244 Producer said:

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In comment 15167229 Section331 said: Quote: In comment 15167120 santacruzom said: Quote: I just have to defer to the quote from McCartney I provided earlier. To hear him talk about how the entire band responded the moment Ringo took over for Pete Best -- how recalling the memory actually made him choke up a bit -- tells volumes. No other instrument can do that to the whole band like a drummer, IMO. It's too bad the awesome power of drums is wielded by drummers, the most likely people on earth to misappropriate that power! But was McCartney’s comment more about how good Ringo was, or just how bad Pete Best was. Their label told them they would not allow Best to play on any record. They could tour with him, but they had to find another studio drummer. yes. A bit of both I suspect. I'm sure Ringo elevated their sound. He was a pro drummer. He is a great drummer there is no doubt. I'm sure he was a good participant bringing the music to tape. But he's not in Bonham's class. Bonham almost defines Zeppelin's sound. And I like the swing of Watts better.

I don't even mention Bonham in conversations like these because I just kind of consider him a consensus.

That Fool In The Rain isolated drum clip someone posted earlier is fantastic. I always appreciated his part but never heard all those subtleties until now.

IMO in order of influence on the music
John Henry Bonham
Vinnie Colaiuta
Stewart Copeland
Neil Peart
Danny Carey
Dave Grohl

Granted there are many great all Around drummers-But these guys completely dominated, revolutionized the sound and were most influential. But thems be the studs.

...Bonzo was amazing and mega kudos to Carl Palmer, Ginger Baker, Neil Peart, Bill Bruford, Steve Gadd, Mitch Mitchell - a solid case for all these and many others could be made but honestly - NOBODY raised the bar higher than Moon, he challenged himself and everyone else playing back then, his drumming turned ordinary songs into extraordinary ones ' "I can see for miles" an excellent example. Moon's creativity, IMO, was unmatched, his approach to the kit singularly unique and befuddling to those trying to learn his songs - Moon never played the same song exactly the same way, he was a true artist, an abstract drummer - really a jazz drummer in a pretty straightforward rock band. More than any other, I really believe Moon made the Who much better than any other drummer did for their band.

not taking anything away from him, but I saw a mini documentary fairly recently about the opening drum sound on When The Levee Breaks, which might be my favorite Zep song (a good cover of an old blues song).

It was Page, not Bonham, who came up with the idea and set up the drum kit in the middle of a foyer/stairway of an old house, among other things, that gave the drums a unique sound on that song.

I'm far from the biggest Zep fan, but wonder how much Page had to do with the drum sounds on other songs. Of course Bonham was the one with the sticks.

In comment 15167155 Producer said:

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let's not forget that there are heavy rumors that in fact it was McCartney who played some of the drums on the White Album and Abbey Road, the albums with the very best drumming on Beatles albums.

Just - stop. Anyone who has seen McCartney's drumming knows that it's vanilla. His excellence instrumentally was as a vocalist and he was a great bassist, very creative and pushed the envelope.

McCartney is a legend, but it isn't because of his drumming.

Ringo was the perfect drummer for the Beatles, he evolved through the British invasion to the point where his style became definitive, minimalist in a new and creative way - his drumming on "Ticket to Ride" is a fantastic example of how he made a simple pop song so much better, his fills on "A Day in the Life" another wonderful example. The Beatles simply wouldn't have been better with any other drummer.

I'm a big Who fan, but I never knew Keith's middle name was Fekking.

Learn something new everyday ;)

Incidentally, I found out recently that I got married on the anniversary (24th) of Moon's death. So I've got that going for me.

In comment 15167435 Dr. D said:

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not taking anything away from him, but I saw a mini documentary fairly recently about the opening drum sound on When The Levee Breaks, which might be my favorite Zep song (a good cover of an old blues song). It was Page, not Bonham, who came up with the idea and set up the drum kit in the middle of a foyer/stairway of an old house, among other things, that gave the drums a unique sound on that song. I'm far from the biggest Zep fan, but wonder how much Page had to do with the drum sounds on other songs. Of course Bonham was the one with the sticks.

As I understand it, the drum part on "When the Levee Breaks" wound up as it did because Bonhams new drum kit was delivered while the band was already recording in that house - with nowhere to really put it, they set it up in the vestibule.

The rest is history.

In comment 15167451 x meadowlander said:

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In comment 15167435 Dr. D said: As I understand it, the drum part on "When the Levee Breaks" wound up as it did because Bonhams new drum kit was delivered while the band was already recording in that house - with nowhere to really put it, they set it up in the vestibule. The rest is history.

That's not how they explained it in the doc. They gave the credit to Page, as if it was intentional, but who knows.

antone watch Santana at Woodstock, that's him

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In comment 15167465 gtt350 said:

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antone watch Santana at Woodstock, that's him

I mentioned him and his star turn at Woodstock. He still kicks ass 50 years later.

yep still going strong

aka: Hellhammer

unbelievable metal drummer. Best I have ever seen.

In comment 15167465 gtt350 said:

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antone watch Santana at Woodstock, that's him

You're talking about this guy right?
Awesome Santana drum solo - ( New Window )

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[From Far Out Magazine]
Among the sixties clan, Peart has also picked out Cream’s iconic percussionist Ginger Baker as an unstoppable influence on his career. “His playing was revolutionary,” Peart told Rolling Stone in 2009, “extrovert, primal, and inventive. He set the bar for what rock drumming could be. I certainly emulated Ginger’s approaches to rhythm — his hard, flat, percussive sound was very innovative. Everyone who came after built on that foundation. Every rock drummer since has been influenced in some way by Ginger — even if they don’t know it.”

My pick is Mr. Baker.