Edge: Pass Rusher or Container?

I'll go with Bill.

the Belichick approach works well. I am fine with whatever Patrick Graham recommends. He made Bettcher look like a fucking clown with how great a job he did with our D last year. Yes, we added Bradberry and Martinez, but look how much better LW looked under Graham. In addition to a secondary maligned by injuries and idiocy (eg. Baker and whatever Beal is trying to accomplish).

then get after the passer 4-3 DE. Osi Umenyora was a rush first forget about the contain 4-3 DE.

I prefer Strahan.

You contain first and rush second. That goes for every single pass rusher. With QBs today you can no longer rush the passer like osi was doing. Wouldn’t work in today’s NFL. Can’t just go around the arc and beat the tackle. With motion, jet sweeps, misdirection and mobile QBs the game has changed.

You need to build your secondary which it seems like we are doing. It makes me believe we are “containing” while playing elite level secondary play. That’s why I believe the target is Patrick Surtain at 11.

Peppers
McKinney
Ryan
Bradberry
Holmes
Surtain?

In comment 15167227 section125 said:

Quote:

then get after the passer 4-3 DE. Osi Umenyora was a rush first forget about the contain 4-3 DE. I prefer Strahan.

Strahan was always a contain and “set the edge” first kind of guy. But it also has to do with playing the strong side. Teams don’t attack the weak side (Osi’s side) like they do the strong side. In that sense, Strahan was a more complete player. Both players had their favorite “victims” at tackle.

But now we are talking about a 3-4 front and the edge players have different roles, and different responsibilities from play to play. Osi would be the rush LB and might not be an every down LB. Strahan might be in on every play, only on the bench for a breather.

By design and assignment.

In comment 15167220 eric2425ny said:

Quote:

the Belichick approach works well. I am fine with whatever Patrick Graham recommends. He made Bettcher look like a fucking clown with how great a job he did with our D last year. Yes, we added Bradberry and Martinez, but look how much better LW looked under Graham. In addition to a secondary maligned by injuries and idiocy (eg. Baker and whatever Beal is trying to accomplish).

Look what the defense looked like against Browns without Bradberry. Bradberry, LW, and Martinez are cornerstones of this defense. Not giving Betcher a pass though because our secondary looked confused week in week out.

In comment 15167339 Tuckrule said:

Quote:

You contain first and rush second. That goes for every single pass rusher. With QBs today you can no longer rush the passer like osi was doing. Wouldn’t work in today’s NFL. Can’t just go around the arc and beat the tackle. With motion, jet sweeps, misdirection and mobile QBs the game has changed. You need to build your secondary which it seems like we are doing. It makes me believe we are “containing” while playing elite level secondary play. That’s why I believe the target is Patrick Surtain at 11. Peppers McKinney Ryan Bradberry Holmes Surtain?

Good post about how today's game - assuming most QB are mobile - and how the outside rush should operate. And how it makes more sense to upgrade and build the secondary.

As far as I'm concerned, the way to build a defense is to...

-- Secondary that can cover AND tackle
-- Upgrade overall team speed, specifically the LBs
-- athletes at Edge who can run
-- cheap, huge DTs who can consistently fill the A and B
-- SCHEME

For us, we are very fortunate to have Graham and a secondary this is on the upswing.

First 2 picks DE,
G
LB
LB
CB
Best Avail..

...that's their job.

Also, I hate the word "contain," I have always preferred "force."
"Contain" suggests a more passive approach to doing the same job as a "force" player.

In comment 15167339 Tuckrule said:

Quote:

You contain first and rush second. That goes for every single pass rusher. With QBs today you can no longer rush the passer like osi was doing. Wouldn’t work in today’s NFL. Can’t just go around the arc and beat the tackle. With motion, jet sweeps, misdirection and mobile QBs the game has changed. You need to build your secondary which it seems like we are doing. It makes me believe we are “containing” while playing elite level secondary play. That’s why I believe the target is Patrick Surtain at 11. Peppers McKinney Ryan Bradberry Holmes Surtain?

On point ...

amongst many on the Giant roster, I don't know how folks on the board believe the Giants will be targeting any specific player/position in Rd 1 (like Surtain above). Is that more personal preference or do you have some relevant clues.

Last draft there were plenty of clues because OT play was abysmal, there was nobody being developed and they were losing their right tackle. DG was also making a lot of comments about the OL and they only grabbed a middling swing tackle in free agency, so OT was obvious in an unusually deep OT draft.

Have comments leaked out from team that you all have heard about CB or any other position. The only thing I recall is the constant chirping about "playmakers".

Btw - Giant secondary improved but has a long way to go to get to elite. I think they were middle of the pack at best in most categories in 2020 other than giving up big plays (which was nice to see), but played a lot of soft zones as we know because the coaches weren't comfortable. And that was with a decent pass rush.