The Oline sucks as is now, so if you cut him you’d better find someone just as good and cheaper, but then you don’t have a LG either. WH, and SL put together don’ make a good guard, and should be nothing but backups. The guard is a BIG problem all the way around.
Turner, Norwell, Zeitler, Jackson to name a few. My original thoughts were to extend Zeitler which I am fine with but others are on the market. DT like Linval Joseph you could bring in on a short term deal as well if Tomlinson is asking for to much.
The market won’t support him at $12m. Either he or some as good will play for half that. It I was Zeitler I’d be offering to take a pay cut. Probably better $6m in hand than being a FA this offseason.
Mentioned this an option before. Not a bad outcome if
these guys are more economically attractive than the available Guards. Gates at Right Guard also seems like an easy fit for his skills/makeup and demeanor.
Nick Gates: An interesting option would see the Giants signing a free agent center (or drafting one) and moving Gates over to guard. The 2020 season was the first time he ever played center, and by the end he really seemed to have figured it out. He’s good enough to still be a useful player at right guard, though, and there are some interesting options (Corey Linsley, David Andrews) coming available in free agency.
With the lower league cap, many free agents will be unsigned later
...or if they've asked him to already and he declined?
KZ has to see the flood of vets getting released and floating his name out there has to be unsettling.
If he agrees to a cut, with guarantees, he foesn't have to compete for a short term contract in a flooded market...and wind up God knows where.
on this site consider the possibility that players will improve. Shane Lemieux for example, is not currently adequate in pass protection. Does that mean he will never be?? Players don’t frequently come as finished products, especially 5th rounders. Peart was a 3rd rounder. That’s considered a premium pick. He is expected to be a starter by year 2 or 3. Can’t keep going to FA to buy hole fillers. Players have to be developed. Patience is needed.
on this site consider the possibility that players will improve. Shane Lemieux for example, is not currently adequate in pass protection. Does that mean he will never be?? Players don’t frequently come as finished products, especially 5th rounders. Peart was a 3rd rounder. That’s considered a premium pick. He is expected to be a starter by year 2 or 3. Can’t keep going to FA to buy hole fillers. Players have to be developed. Patience is needed.
This, no one has patience anymore it seems. I know we have sucked for a while, but that’s not the fault of players like Lemieux, Peart, and even Jones. They need time to develop.
One FA missing that would be interesting is Nick Martin cut by the Texans.
I hope they extend him lowering the cap hit this year and also lowering the overall per year cost. It is basically a new contract same as all those other FA. All money equal I’d prefer to keep him over making a switch. Let his agent gauge interest, check in with the agents of the FA and figure out what the market is. I think he is good for 2-3 more years, but he has to be paid as mid tier not upper.
He’s already a beast in run blocking. OHara seems to think he’ll get better as well and with Sales and Flats working on the Oline, I think we’ll see more improvement. How can people write rookies off after one season? I don’t get it. Lemieux was a 5th round pick and we got good value there.
on this site consider the possibility that players will improve. Shane Lemieux for example, is not currently adequate in pass protection. Does that mean he will never be?? Players don’t frequently come as finished products, especially 5th rounders. Peart was a 3rd rounder. That’s considered a premium pick. He is expected to be a starter by year 2 or 3. Can’t keep going to FA to buy hole fillers. Players have to be developed. Patience is needed.
This, no one has patience anymore it seems. I know we have sucked for a while, but that’s not the fault of players like Lemieux, Peart, and even Jones. They need time to develop.
Sorry, missed this post after I posted my comments, but totally agree.
Zietler is now over 30, his play declined last year (maybe due to injury, maybe due to age and skill decline) either way that trend is only going to continue.
So for those who support extending Zietler, how many years are you looking to commit to him?
The Bill Belichick approach that it's better to cut a decent player a year too soon versus a year too late might be apt with Zietler.
to add at least three this draft. One in the 2-3 round area and than a later pick and UDFA.
Try to find a bargain FA who is a starter (and upgrade to Zeitler) at a bargain one year deal. I would think the Giants would be attractive spot as there will be a opening with Zeitler out.
Lets the all the interior guys compete in camp and best man win. Maybe we get lucky with one of those draft picks.
for both Hernandez and Lemiuex. Both have flashed enough to consider that but neither has been good enough to necessitate that imo, so would be a bit of a leap of faith.
Zeitler on the other hand is a solid pro and seems like a good guy. they have some leverage here and I think he announced his wife is pregnant yesterday. In a stacked market for guards it would seem to be sensible for both sides even if it's just a punt to FA next year or the year after with a little extra guaranteed money.
RE: I think extending Zeitler would be smart unless they want spots open
for both Hernandez and Lemiuex. Both have flashed enough to consider that but neither has been good enough to necessitate that imo, so would be a bit of a leap of faith.
What has Hernandez flashed the last 2 years that would give you the confidence? His play has gone down hill big time. Sorry people are willing to post here how Zeitler has started to decline and is getting older yet seem to be remiss about the fact that Hernandez has declined substantially even though he is still young. To me this looks like a potential bust.
Convert the majority of his 2021 salary to signing bonus
on this site consider the possibility that players will improve. Shane Lemieux for example, is not currently adequate in pass protection. Does that mean he will never be?? Players don’t frequently come as finished products, especially 5th rounders. Peart was a 3rd rounder. That’s considered a premium pick. He is expected to be a starter by year 2 or 3. Can’t keep going to FA to buy hole fillers. Players have to be developed. Patience is needed.
This, no one has patience anymore it seems. I know we have sucked for a while, but that’s not the fault of players like Lemieux, Peart, and even Jones. They need time to develop.
Because there are way to many Olinemen thatwould need to improve for them to be halfway decent. The Oline sucks, and the team is on a yearly losing record streak, and that is why there is no patience.
Because there are way to many Olinemen thatwould need to improve for them to be halfway decent. The Oline sucks, and the team is on a yearly losing record streak, and that is why there is no patience.
Indeed.
I think we have reached the inflection point where Judge needs to solve this OL problem because it is abundantly clear Mr. Hog Mollie can't. I have to imagine Judge recognizes that 3/5 of the constituent parts of the OL are simply not consistently good.
And unless he gets it fixed, he's really not going to know what he has in Jones or have a team that can consistently compete, despite how horrific the division is. Which could impact his job security...
Because there are way to many Olinemen thatwould need to improve for them to be halfway decent. The Oline sucks, and the team is on a yearly losing record streak, and that is why there is no patience.
Indeed.
I think we have reached the inflection point where Judge needs to solve this OL problem because it is abundantly clear Mr. Hog Mollie can't. I have to imagine Judge recognizes that 3/5 of the constituent parts of the OL are simply not consistently good.
And unless he gets it fixed, he's really not going to know what he has in Jones or have a team that can consistently compete, despite how horrific the division is. Which could impact his job security...
I can’t imagine that Barkley, or even DJ for that matter likes lining up behind this Humpty Dumpty line. Forget about paying Williams 20 million, and spend the money on the Oline WH were it is needed most.
for both Hernandez and Lemiuex. Both have flashed enough to consider that but neither has been good enough to necessitate that imo, so would be a bit of a leap of faith.
What has Hernandez flashed the last 2 years that would give you the confidence? His play has gone down hill big time. Sorry people are willing to post here how Zeitler has started to decline and is getting older yet seem to be remiss about the fact that Hernandez has declined substantially even though he is still young. To me this looks like a potential bust.
Hernandez is $9m - $10m cheaper. With Zeitler being cut you can get at least 1 or 2 decent enough players for what he is being paid. HUGE difference.
still not sure Hernandez's problems weren't COVID related.
If so, that's really scary.
It would mean that the Giants were infected with Covid in 2019 when Hernandez also sucked.
LOL. I'm not sure his play was necessarily impacted, because he was the same overall player before and after. But, it may have had something to do with how much he played.
I think the Giants dropped the ball with the handling of the OL
last season. To me, this terrible division did them in. They were a bad team, but almost tricked into believing they were good (this is from the front office/coaching perspective) and made some decisions accordingly. I can't exactly blame them because when the division is there, regardless of circumstance, you should try to grab it.
But, for all the talk of rotating, they barely did. When Thomas was healthy and Fleming was healthy, Peart played a series or 2 max. When Hernandez came back, the same went for him. What we really needed was a proper evaluation of young OL and being a shitty team we should have had the luxury of doing so. Instead, we never saw Peart with extended RT play. We never saw very much of Hernandez at RG and none of Lemieux at RG. We never saw an OL of Thomas, Lemieux/Hernandez, Gates, Lemieux/Hernandez, Peart. For that matter, we never saw the same with any variation of the 3 guards plugged in for more than 1 series.
Thomas started slow, but really showed progress in the 2nd half. He was drafted to play LT for 10 years. And Peart was drafted as a possible long term solution at RT. When they realized he was further along than they expected, he should have been the RT, because Fleming was absolute garbage. And, if they felt there was a shot he might be their LT based on his 1 game there, then he should have played there while Thomas was at RT, because Thomas isn't going anywhere.
Instead, we now have questions, still, at 3 OL positions in LG, RG, and RT. Does it make sense to cut Zeitler or extend him? Are they planning on Hernandez for their future? Are they planning on Lemieux for their future? Is Peart penciled in at RT? They no answers to any of these questions and the slight possibility of taking an OL in the 1st round, depending on how things shakes out will have residual effects on the roster, as we have a number of holes...STILL.
I think we dropped the ball with that proposed rotation that never really shook out,.
2-- - And it's an easy decision when you can easily replace said overpaid player with someone that is both better and cheaper. Rd 1- Slater.
True. Or, we could pay a premium for a younger, better player like Thuney and we should be set for 3-5 years. Or make a move for a C like Nick Martin or Corey Linsley and move Gates to G.
Whatever the case, it's time to end this OL nightmare. I honestly believe I could throw darts at a bunch of available OLs on a cork-board and do better than Hog Mollie.
I'm not alone on this, but it really is amazing that DG is still on the job.
2-- - And it's an easy decision when you can easily replace said overpaid player with someone that is both better and cheaper. Rd 1- Slater.
True. Or, we could pay a premium for a younger, better player like Thuney and we should be set for 3-5 years. Or make a move for a C like Nick Martin or Corey Linsley and move Gates to G.
Whatever the case, it's time to end this OL nightmare. I honestly believe I could throw darts at a bunch of available OLs on a cork-board and do better than Hog Mollie.
I'm not alone on this, but it really is amazing that DG is still on the job.
DG should be long gone. He did better with his FA signings this past year, but his drafting sucks, and that is a big reason the team keeps on having a losing record. Barkley at two, and DJ at six were bad picks, and set the team back even further, and the jury is still out on t
Thomas if he made the right pick there. Right position, but was it the right player. Until the Oline is fixed the team will have a losing record. Don’t get fooled when the took the garbage out in the garbage division last year, and went 4-2, because the division can’t be as bad this year, but the Giants can especially with the tough schedule.
2-- - And it's an easy decision when you can easily replace said overpaid player with someone that is both better and cheaper. Rd 1- Slater.
True. Or, we could pay a premium for a younger, better player like Thuney and we should be set for 3-5 years. Or make a move for a C like Nick Martin or Corey Linsley and move Gates to G.
Whatever the case, it's time to end this OL nightmare. I honestly believe I could throw darts at a bunch of available OLs on a cork-board and do better than Hog Mollie.
I'm not alone on this, but it really is amazing that DG is still on the job.
The correct spelling is phonetic: "Hawg Mawlie"
RE: RE: RE: I think extending Zeitler would be smart unless they want spots open
Hernandez is $9m - $10m cheaper. With Zeitler being cut you can get at least 1 or 2 decent enough players for what he is being paid. HUGE difference.
I have no problem if you want to cut Zeitler to save money if you have a bona fide replacement in mind. But don't peddle Hernanadez as that option. So just because he is cheaper he should play even though he stinks? I don't get this.
RE: RE: RE: RE: I think extending Zeitler would be smart unless they want spots open
Hernandez is $9m - $10m cheaper. With Zeitler being cut you can get at least 1 or 2 decent enough players for what he is being paid. HUGE difference.
I have no problem if you want to cut Zeitler to save money if you have a bona fide replacement in mind. But don't peddle Hernanadez as that option. So just because he is cheaper he should play even though he stinks? I don't get this.
I agree, which is why I think they dropped the ball by not playing at least one of him or Lemieux at RG, with the other at LG. They still dont really know what they have with this OL. And Zeitler
Picked his game up in the 2nd half a bit. I still think he's a bit expensive for they have, but there is not a clear replacement
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: I think extending Zeitler would be smart unless they want spots open
Hernandez is $9m - $10m cheaper. With Zeitler being cut you can get at least 1 or 2 decent enough players for what he is being paid. HUGE difference.
I have no problem if you want to cut Zeitler to save money if you have a bona fide replacement in mind. But don't peddle Hernanadez as that option. So just because he is cheaper he should play even though he stinks? I don't get this.
I agree, which is why I think they dropped the ball by not playing at least one of him or Lemieux at RG, with the other at LG. They still dont really know what they have with this OL. And Zeitler
Picked his game up in the 2nd half a bit. I still think he's a bit expensive for they have, but there is not a clear replacement
I’ve seen enough of Hernandez that you don’t need to try him at RG, or even Lemieux, who is nothing more than a back up. Zeitler is better than both, but to expensive for a bad team, so to add it all up the Oline sucks, which adds up to another losing record.
That is just unfair to Lemieux. He was a 5th rounder forced into starting without any training camp and my eyes tell me he is a legit NFL player. Can we at least have some patience and give our young some time to develop? Like even a single preseason.
As christian has said, the Giants should wait to cut him
Notice, nobody is signing any of the mentioned optioned. The market for these guys this year is going to be decidedly lower. The Giants will have a smorgasbord of options and can use that to drive Zeitler down if they really want to keep him. But I am pretty confident he is not staying at his current salary, if the Giants did that, it would be a huge mistake.
Regarding patience for Lemieux and others...
This isn't about patience. Nobody is saying cut these younger guys. They are going to be in the mix, and given the opportunity to compete. But you cannot count on them improving. You HOPE they will, but you cannot base your business decisions on hope.
Somebody posted a comment the other day on a different thread suggesting that our young "talent" suddenly and magically improved under Judge.
Here is our young talent... Other than Gates and possible Peppers, what young talent should marked improvement? No argument that some of these players were already decent, the question is, which ones showed improvement last year? Notice that there are many who are already gone.
blaming the COVID stuff. Mark Schlereff has this to say about Hernandez:
Quote:
Former three-time Super Bowl Champion and current-day FS1 analyst, Mark Schlereth, believes you don’t have to go very far to find a culprit that has added to Thomas’ struggles this season. In fact, all you have to do is look at the guy who lines up next to Thomas on every play.
Starting left guard Will Hernandez quickly became a fan favorite for his bullish play style and tough-guy persona upon joining the Giants as a second-round pick out of UTEP in 2018.
Schlereth believes Hernandez’s faulty play has much to do with his football smarts, or rather, lack thereof. Schlereth was highly critical of Hernandez in a recent interview with North Jersey Media Group, noting the guard “doesn’t totally understand the game.”
Now, I'm no Schlereth fan but I'd take his observation on G play seriously. Those are pretty strong words to be just talking out of your ass too.
You asked which young talent showed improvements under Judge. I went through the roster and it’s astonishing how few players were playing significant minutes after playing a lot in 2019. Massive roster turnover. This is a team at the beginning of a rebuild.
I’ll add 1 1/2 names to yours: I thought Gallman showed a lot of progress. And I think it’s possible that Julian Love made enough improvements to have the a chance at an NFL career.
That is just unfair to Lemieux. He was a 5th rounder forced into starting without any training camp and my eyes tell me he is a legit NFL player. Can we at least have some patience and give our young some time to develop? Like even a single preseason.
No patience for a backup, and that is what he is, and the only reason Lemieux is mentioned as a starter is because the rest of the line as is just isn’t very good. There are a lot of other eyes that see the same thing.
Restructure & keep right where he is. Cutting/trading ur best OL would be a dumbass move.
Restructure essentially means we are committing to him for more years. With a paycut comes more guranteed money generally, extended over a few years. So, the annual salary goes down as does the cap hit, but the actual money does not.
Thanks for the link.
Nick Gates: An interesting option would see the Giants signing a free agent center (or drafting one) and moving Gates over to guard. The 2020 season was the first time he ever played center, and by the end he really seemed to have figured it out. He’s good enough to still be a useful player at right guard, though, and there are some interesting options (Corey Linsley, David Andrews) coming available in free agency.
KZ has to see the flood of vets getting released and floating his name out there has to be unsettling.
If he agrees to a cut, with guarantees, he foesn't have to compete for a short term contract in a flooded market...and wind up God knows where.
How much of of paycut is really the question.
If KZ wants to remain with the team, I would see an extension lowering his 2021 cap number as highly likely.
But what if KZ does NOT want to stay with the team. This would force the Giants to cut him as his current 2021 cap hit is prohibitive.
The likely outcome IMO is a restructured contract lowering the 2021 cap hit by at least $5 Million.
This, no one has patience anymore it seems. I know we have sucked for a while, but that’s not the fault of players like Lemieux, Peart, and even Jones. They need time to develop.
Will he improve enough to be good at pass blocker
I hope they extend him lowering the cap hit this year and also lowering the overall per year cost. It is basically a new contract same as all those other FA. All money equal I’d prefer to keep him over making a switch. Let his agent gauge interest, check in with the agents of the FA and figure out what the market is. I think he is good for 2-3 more years, but he has to be paid as mid tier not upper.
Quote:
on this site consider the possibility that players will improve. Shane Lemieux for example, is not currently adequate in pass protection. Does that mean he will never be?? Players don’t frequently come as finished products, especially 5th rounders. Peart was a 3rd rounder. That’s considered a premium pick. He is expected to be a starter by year 2 or 3. Can’t keep going to FA to buy hole fillers. Players have to be developed. Patience is needed.
This, no one has patience anymore it seems. I know we have sucked for a while, but that’s not the fault of players like Lemieux, Peart, and even Jones. They need time to develop.
Sorry, missed this post after I posted my comments, but totally agree.
So for those who support extending Zietler, how many years are you looking to commit to him?
The Bill Belichick approach that it's better to cut a decent player a year too soon versus a year too late might be apt with Zietler.
Try to find a bargain FA who is a starter (and upgrade to Zeitler) at a bargain one year deal. I would think the Giants would be attractive spot as there will be a opening with Zeitler out.
Lets the all the interior guys compete in camp and best man win. Maybe we get lucky with one of those draft picks.
Zeitler on the other hand is a solid pro and seems like a good guy. they have some leverage here and I think he announced his wife is pregnant yesterday. In a stacked market for guards it would seem to be sensible for both sides even if it's just a punt to FA next year or the year after with a little extra guaranteed money.
What has Hernandez flashed the last 2 years that would give you the confidence? His play has gone down hill big time. Sorry people are willing to post here how Zeitler has started to decline and is getting older yet seem to be remiss about the fact that Hernandez has declined substantially even though he is still young. To me this looks like a potential bust.
His cap hit would drop $7 million per year. A guard of Zeitler's ability at $7 million is a no-brainer, and Zeitler would have $14 million guaranteed.
Quote:
on this site consider the possibility that players will improve. Shane Lemieux for example, is not currently adequate in pass protection. Does that mean he will never be?? Players don’t frequently come as finished products, especially 5th rounders. Peart was a 3rd rounder. That’s considered a premium pick. He is expected to be a starter by year 2 or 3. Can’t keep going to FA to buy hole fillers. Players have to be developed. Patience is needed.
This, no one has patience anymore it seems. I know we have sucked for a while, but that’s not the fault of players like Lemieux, Peart, and even Jones. They need time to develop.
Because there are way to many Olinemen thatwould need to improve for them to be halfway decent. The Oline sucks, and the team is on a yearly losing record streak, and that is why there is no patience.
Because there are way to many Olinemen thatwould need to improve for them to be halfway decent. The Oline sucks, and the team is on a yearly losing record streak, and that is why there is no patience.
Indeed.
I think we have reached the inflection point where Judge needs to solve this OL problem because it is abundantly clear Mr. Hog Mollie can't. I have to imagine Judge recognizes that 3/5 of the constituent parts of the OL are simply not consistently good.
And unless he gets it fixed, he's really not going to know what he has in Jones or have a team that can consistently compete, despite how horrific the division is. Which could impact his job security...
Quote:
Because there are way to many Olinemen thatwould need to improve for them to be halfway decent. The Oline sucks, and the team is on a yearly losing record streak, and that is why there is no patience.
Indeed.
I think we have reached the inflection point where Judge needs to solve this OL problem because it is abundantly clear Mr. Hog Mollie can't. I have to imagine Judge recognizes that 3/5 of the constituent parts of the OL are simply not consistently good.
And unless he gets it fixed, he's really not going to know what he has in Jones or have a team that can consistently compete, despite how horrific the division is. Which could impact his job security...
I can’t imagine that Barkley, or even DJ for that matter likes lining up behind this Humpty Dumpty line. Forget about paying Williams 20 million, and spend the money on the Oline WH were it is needed most.
2-- - And it's an easy decision when you can easily replace said overpaid player with someone that is both better and cheaper. Rd 1- Slater.
Inclined to agree.
Quote:
for both Hernandez and Lemiuex. Both have flashed enough to consider that but neither has been good enough to necessitate that imo, so would be a bit of a leap of faith.
What has Hernandez flashed the last 2 years that would give you the confidence? His play has gone down hill big time. Sorry people are willing to post here how Zeitler has started to decline and is getting older yet seem to be remiss about the fact that Hernandez has declined substantially even though he is still young. To me this looks like a potential bust.
Hernandez is $9m - $10m cheaper. With Zeitler being cut you can get at least 1 or 2 decent enough players for what he is being paid. HUGE difference.
If so, that's really scary.
It would mean that the Giants were infected with Covid in 2019 when Hernandez also sucked.
Quote:
still not sure Hernandez's problems weren't COVID related.
If so, that's really scary.
It would mean that the Giants were infected with Covid in 2019 when Hernandez also sucked.
But, for all the talk of rotating, they barely did. When Thomas was healthy and Fleming was healthy, Peart played a series or 2 max. When Hernandez came back, the same went for him. What we really needed was a proper evaluation of young OL and being a shitty team we should have had the luxury of doing so. Instead, we never saw Peart with extended RT play. We never saw very much of Hernandez at RG and none of Lemieux at RG. We never saw an OL of Thomas, Lemieux/Hernandez, Gates, Lemieux/Hernandez, Peart. For that matter, we never saw the same with any variation of the 3 guards plugged in for more than 1 series.
Thomas started slow, but really showed progress in the 2nd half. He was drafted to play LT for 10 years. And Peart was drafted as a possible long term solution at RT. When they realized he was further along than they expected, he should have been the RT, because Fleming was absolute garbage. And, if they felt there was a shot he might be their LT based on his 1 game there, then he should have played there while Thomas was at RT, because Thomas isn't going anywhere.
Instead, we now have questions, still, at 3 OL positions in LG, RG, and RT. Does it make sense to cut Zeitler or extend him? Are they planning on Hernandez for their future? Are they planning on Lemieux for their future? Is Peart penciled in at RT? They no answers to any of these questions and the slight possibility of taking an OL in the 1st round, depending on how things shakes out will have residual effects on the roster, as we have a number of holes...STILL.
I think we dropped the ball with that proposed rotation that never really shook out,.
2-- - And it's an easy decision when you can easily replace said overpaid player with someone that is both better and cheaper. Rd 1- Slater.
True. Or, we could pay a premium for a younger, better player like Thuney and we should be set for 3-5 years. Or make a move for a C like Nick Martin or Corey Linsley and move Gates to G.
Whatever the case, it's time to end this OL nightmare. I honestly believe I could throw darts at a bunch of available OLs on a cork-board and do better than Hog Mollie.
I'm not alone on this, but it really is amazing that DG is still on the job.
Quote:
2-- - And it's an easy decision when you can easily replace said overpaid player with someone that is both better and cheaper. Rd 1- Slater.
True. Or, we could pay a premium for a younger, better player like Thuney and we should be set for 3-5 years. Or make a move for a C like Nick Martin or Corey Linsley and move Gates to G.
Whatever the case, it's time to end this OL nightmare. I honestly believe I could throw darts at a bunch of available OLs on a cork-board and do better than Hog Mollie.
I'm not alone on this, but it really is amazing that DG is still on the job.
DG should be long gone. He did better with his FA signings this past year, but his drafting sucks, and that is a big reason the team keeps on having a losing record. Barkley at two, and DJ at six were bad picks, and set the team back even further, and the jury is still out on t
Thomas if he made the right pick there. Right position, but was it the right player. Until the Oline is fixed the team will have a losing record. Don’t get fooled when the took the garbage out in the garbage division last year, and went 4-2, because the division can’t be as bad this year, but the Giants can especially with the tough schedule.
Quote:
2-- - And it's an easy decision when you can easily replace said overpaid player with someone that is both better and cheaper. Rd 1- Slater.
True. Or, we could pay a premium for a younger, better player like Thuney and we should be set for 3-5 years. Or make a move for a C like Nick Martin or Corey Linsley and move Gates to G.
Whatever the case, it's time to end this OL nightmare. I honestly believe I could throw darts at a bunch of available OLs on a cork-board and do better than Hog Mollie.
I'm not alone on this, but it really is amazing that DG is still on the job.
The correct spelling is phonetic: "Hawg Mawlie"
Quote:
In comment 15168750 Eric on Li said:
Quote:
Hernandez is $9m - $10m cheaper. With Zeitler being cut you can get at least 1 or 2 decent enough players for what he is being paid. HUGE difference.
I have no problem if you want to cut Zeitler to save money if you have a bona fide replacement in mind. But don't peddle Hernanadez as that option. So just because he is cheaper he should play even though he stinks? I don't get this.
Quote:
In comment 15168794 Bruner4329 said:
Quote:
In comment 15168750 Eric on Li said:
Quote:
Hernandez is $9m - $10m cheaper. With Zeitler being cut you can get at least 1 or 2 decent enough players for what he is being paid. HUGE difference.
I have no problem if you want to cut Zeitler to save money if you have a bona fide replacement in mind. But don't peddle Hernanadez as that option. So just because he is cheaper he should play even though he stinks? I don't get this.
Picked his game up in the 2nd half a bit. I still think he's a bit expensive for they have, but there is not a clear replacement
Quote:
In comment 15168901 giantstock said:
Quote:
In comment 15168794 Bruner4329 said:
Quote:
In comment 15168750 Eric on Li said:
Quote:
Hernandez is $9m - $10m cheaper. With Zeitler being cut you can get at least 1 or 2 decent enough players for what he is being paid. HUGE difference.
I have no problem if you want to cut Zeitler to save money if you have a bona fide replacement in mind. But don't peddle Hernanadez as that option. So just because he is cheaper he should play even though he stinks? I don't get this.
I agree, which is why I think they dropped the ball by not playing at least one of him or Lemieux at RG, with the other at LG. They still dont really know what they have with this OL. And Zeitler
Picked his game up in the 2nd half a bit. I still think he's a bit expensive for they have, but there is not a clear replacement
I’ve seen enough of Hernandez that you don’t need to try him at RG, or even Lemieux, who is nothing more than a back up. Zeitler is better than both, but to expensive for a bad team, so to add it all up the Oline sucks, which adds up to another losing record.
Notice, nobody is signing any of the mentioned optioned. The market for these guys this year is going to be decidedly lower. The Giants will have a smorgasbord of options and can use that to drive Zeitler down if they really want to keep him. But I am pretty confident he is not staying at his current salary, if the Giants did that, it would be a huge mistake.
Regarding patience for Lemieux and others...
This isn't about patience. Nobody is saying cut these younger guys. They are going to be in the mix, and given the opportunity to compete. But you cannot count on them improving. You HOPE they will, but you cannot base your business decisions on hope.
Somebody posted a comment the other day on a different thread suggesting that our young "talent" suddenly and magically improved under Judge.
Here is our young talent... Other than Gates and possible Peppers, what young talent should marked improvement? No argument that some of these players were already decent, the question is, which ones showed improvement last year? Notice that there are many who are already gone.
Jones?
Barkley?
Carter?
Ximines?
Hernandez?
Baker?
Love?
Connelly?
D.Slayton?
Ballentine?
Asafo-Adjei?
C.Slayton?
Hill?
Lauletta?
McIntosh?
Peppers?
Engram?
Tomlinson?
Webb?
Gallman?
Moss?
Bisnowaty?
So when posters constantly post about players "improving", they are talking about hope and not the reality for most in the NFL.
Starting left guard Will Hernandez quickly became a fan favorite for his bullish play style and tough-guy persona upon joining the Giants as a second-round pick out of UTEP in 2018.
Schlereth believes Hernandez’s faulty play has much to do with his football smarts, or rather, lack thereof. Schlereth was highly critical of Hernandez in a recent interview with North Jersey Media Group, noting the guard “doesn’t totally understand the game.”
Now, I'm no Schlereth fan but I'd take his observation on G play seriously. Those are pretty strong words to be just talking out of your ass too.
I’ll add 1 1/2 names to yours: I thought Gallman showed a lot of progress. And I think it’s possible that Julian Love made enough improvements to have the a chance at an NFL career.
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No patience for a backup, and that is what he is, and the only reason Lemieux is mentioned as a starter is because the rest of the line as is just isn’t very good. There are a lot of other eyes that see the same thing.