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Giants Draft Info (asshat)

GoDeep13 : 4/2/2021 7:38 pm
I apologize for the delay. One of my sources was dealing with a delay. I have two sources I trust when it comes to giants inside info. I generally want to wait within a month of the draft to get more fleshed out details. Here’s what I’ve gathered so far.

- Giants have put most of their research into the EDGE class. There are only 2 guys that would stop them from going EDGE In the 1st round. Kyle Pitts and DeVonta Smith.

- Penn State pro day was more about Oweh than Parsons. Coach Spencer likes Parsons. Thinks he’s a good kid. But he’s be taking on a bit of a “handler” role if they were to draft Parsons. Spencer really likes Oweh. Thinks he’s has a wealth of unlocked potential.

- If one of Giants preferred offensive targets is gone. They’ll look to go EDGE. They would like to trade down to get an EDGE and have had preliminary talks with NE depending on who is available.

- If they settle to pick at 11 and both offensive guys are gone they. Select one of the EDGEs. There doesn’t seem to be a consensus yet but the belief is that Kwity Paye would be the choice because of his versatility standing and hand down. They like his personality fit and how well he takes to coaching. Love that he has a strong run defense game and believe he will grow as a pass rusher.

- if they are able to select one of the offensive weapons their is belief they will trade up from their 2nd round pick to select an EDGE in the back part of the 1st round. (I’m personally thinking this sounds like Engram + 2nd to Buffalo for #30).

- Giants like their OL pieces. Will not go OL in the 1st round unless something unforeseen happens and Penei Sewell is available. Then it’ll be hard for them not to consider. But they don’t see that as likely with the teams selecting in front of them. Belief is round 2 or 3 depending on when EDGE is selected.

- If Giants don’t go WR 1st round look for them to as a developmental piece Day 3.

If we really are approaching the draft  
English Alaister : 4/2/2021 7:41 pm : link
With such a need driven agenda then this team is screwed.
It all makes sense to me  
Mark from Jersey : 4/2/2021 7:42 pm : link
thanks for sharing.
Thanks, GD  
Big Blue '56 : 4/2/2021 7:42 pm : link
.
if you can share  
Giantsfan79 : 4/2/2021 7:44 pm : link
is Oweh and Payne the only edge players they are considering or is the list longer?
I obvi meant  
Giantsfan79 : 4/2/2021 7:45 pm : link
Paye, my bad.
Fits a lot of what I've heard so far  
JonC : 4/2/2021 7:45 pm : link
Smith, Pitts, or Edge if they're gone. I'd heard they love Waddle. Not hearing any OL love early, but could be a factor at #42.
Thank you...  
Big Blue Hokie : 4/2/2021 7:46 pm : link
Thanks for passing along but Paye would be a disappointing.
Great info  
Payasdaddy : 4/2/2021 7:46 pm : link
But if i trade engram, i want a lttle more than moving 12 spots. Would do deal if bills throw in a 3
The Waddle  
Jon in NYC : 4/2/2021 7:47 pm : link
info a huge difference. He's likely to be there, if they love him he's the guy and they probably trade up for an EDGE from the 2nd.
Pitts  
bc4life : 4/2/2021 7:48 pm : link
at 11?
TY....seems to follow the strength of draft  
George from PA : 4/2/2021 7:49 pm : link
I felt Edge was a key target...and talent is there

Would love Oweh with a trade down....

Even the trade up, including Engram makes sense
RE: Fits a lot of what I've heard so far  
SFGFNCGiantsFan : 4/2/2021 7:50 pm : link
In comment 15207549 JonC said:
Quote:
Smith, Pitts, or Edge if they're gone. I'd heard they love Waddle. Not hearing any OL love early, but could be a factor at #42.


One of them should be there no?
I'm  
AcidTest : 4/2/2021 7:52 pm : link
fine with Pitts, Smith, or Waddle at #11.

I don't want an EDGE at #11. I'd prefer to trade down and take one in the mid to late teens. I am OK trading #42 and Engram to get back into the first round to do so.
RE: If we really are approaching the draft  
Zeke's Alibi : 4/2/2021 7:55 pm : link
In comment 15207537 English Alaister said:
Quote:
With such a need driven agenda then this team is screwed.


I’m a BPA enthusiast and love hearing that it’s Pitts or Smith if available

However, if you think there’s a big drop off what’s the problem with addressing needs at appropriate spots as long as you are doing due dillegence for an appropriate trade down? That’s what’s being discussed here.
Paye is like literally the LAST guy I would want  
Judge_and_Jury : 4/2/2021 7:56 pm : link
I really hope one of the WR options drops to save us from ourselves. They are way to caught up with the physical measurables with this kid. Another Rashan Gary and even if he develops its probably going to take a couple years
RE: if you can share  
GoDeep13 : 4/2/2021 7:57 pm : link
In comment 15207544 Giantsfan79 said:
Quote:
is Oweh and Payne the only edge players they are considering or is the list longer?
they like something about all the EDGEs. They haven’t made their mind up yet. Phillips’s Pro Day was big in his evaluation. They liked the refinement of his game. The big thing about the 1st round pick is that they want them to be a quick contributor. They are trying to be competitive now. So guys who have missed a year, guys who are too raw to contribute, will be looked over. So Phillips is still very much in consideration.
Is Pitts worth  
bc4life : 4/2/2021 7:57 pm : link
the 11th pick?
I love reading all this and this is clear the organization knows what  
Zeke's Alibi : 4/2/2021 7:57 pm : link
it’s doing again. All this attention to detail and gaming scenarios has Judge written all over it. Want to be prepared as possible.
RE: Is Pitts worth  
SFGFNCGiantsFan : 4/2/2021 8:00 pm : link
In comment 15207573 bc4life said:
Quote:
the 11th pick?


Yes.
Geez, if they really settled on an edge  
Bill L : 4/2/2021 8:05 pm : link
They better trade down a lot and get more picks. Drafting one at 11 should get them fired immediately.
Do they not like  
darren in pdx : 4/2/2021 8:05 pm : link
Slater at all or are they convinced he won’t be available?
I’ve seen Paye. Mocked into the second  
Bill L : 4/2/2021 8:05 pm : link
Somewhere.
I've heard speculation that Pitts  
bc4life : 4/2/2021 8:06 pm : link
will probably go to Jets or Atlanta
not a fan of Paye  
BigBlueCane : 4/2/2021 8:07 pm : link
would rather the PSU DE but otherwise that's fine.
RE: Do they not like  
GoDeep13 : 4/2/2021 8:09 pm : link
In comment 15207591 darren in pdx said:
Quote:
Slater at all or are they convinced he won’t be available?
From what I’m guessing, they don’t think they need to spend a 1st round pick to get a good enough talent to complete the line.
RE: I've heard speculation that Pitts  
GoDeep13 : 4/2/2021 8:10 pm : link
In comment 15207597 bc4life said:
Quote:
will probably go to Jets or Atlanta
Atlanta I could see.
Excellent intel...  
bw in dc : 4/2/2021 8:11 pm : link
It's always fun to read these insights.

Really disappointing, however, to hear Paye and Oweh could be the targets at #11.

Both are absolute remote smashers because those picks would feel completely forced to fill a need.
RE: RE: Is Pitts worth  
Mark from Jersey : 4/2/2021 8:11 pm : link
In comment 15207581 SFGFNCGiantsFan said:
Quote:
In comment 15207573 bc4life said:


Quote:


the 11th pick?



Yes.
Yes
RE: I've heard speculation that Pitts  
SFGFNCGiantsFan : 4/2/2021 8:11 pm : link
In comment 15207597 bc4life said:
Quote:
will probably go to Jets or Atlanta


Jets pass on Wilson?
#42  
AcidTest : 4/2/2021 8:13 pm : link
and Engram may not be enough to allow them to trade back into the first round to get an EDGE. Oweh, Paye, Rousseau, Phillips, and Ojulari may all be gone before #25. No interest in Phillips because of his concussion history.
sounds to me like they're trying to force and EDGE pick out of need  
GiantsFan84 : 4/2/2021 8:14 pm : link
and that's not a good sign
RE: RE: I've heard speculation that Pitts  
Mark from Jersey : 4/2/2021 8:14 pm : link
In comment 15207607 GoDeep13 said:
Quote:
In comment 15207597 bc4life said:


Quote:


will probably go to Jets or Atlanta

Atlanta I could see.
Me too. Julio is not getting any younger. Only way I don't seem them taking Pitts TBH is either 1) one of the QBs fall & they start grooming Matty Ice's replacement or 2) Chase is there (somehow) and they like him over Pitts. Its highly probably he doesnt make it past Atlanta.
RE: #42  
Mark from Jersey : 4/2/2021 8:17 pm : link
In comment 15207618 AcidTest said:
Quote:
and Engram may not be enough to allow them to trade back into the first round to get an EDGE. Oweh, Paye, Rousseau, Phillips, and Ojulari may all be gone before #25. No interest in Phillips because of his concussion history.
If we stay on 42 I like Ossai from Texas the best for prospects with an average grade in the 40's.
Garafolo was on The Huddle podcast  
aimrocky : 4/2/2021 8:17 pm : link
This week and guessed Gettelman goes with a “measurables” guy in the 1st. His guess was Rousseau. I’m guessing that’s why the buzz isn’t there with Slater.
RE: sounds to me like they're trying to force and EDGE pick out of need  
bw in dc : 4/2/2021 8:17 pm : link
In comment 15207621 GiantsFan84 said:
Quote:
and that's not a good sign


Precisely.
This seems to fit  
GiantsRage2007 : 4/2/2021 8:17 pm : link
DG's MO

Not trading down but rather trading up.

Take the offensive weapon (pitts/waddle/smith) at 11 then get back into Rd1 for the edge.



Ossai  
Mark from Jersey : 4/2/2021 8:17 pm : link
to clarify, EDGE players I like him the best for players that could be picked at 42.
Great information  
KDavies : 4/2/2021 8:20 pm : link
Fine with that line of thinking
I wonder how Smith  
bc4life : 4/2/2021 8:21 pm : link
will hold up in the NFL? Very thin and I don't think he's going to get a lot bigger.
Kwity Paye getting a little bit of that Dan Jones draft treatment  
ghost718 : 4/2/2021 8:22 pm : link
That's gotta be good for his career
Great Info  
US1 Giants : 4/2/2021 8:22 pm : link
If you have the info then other teams likely also know. Really disappointed that the Giants can't keep this info private.
RE: It all makes sense to me  
Del Shofner : 4/2/2021 8:23 pm : link
In comment 15207538 Mark from Jersey said:
Quote:
thanks for sharing.


This.
RE: I wonder how Smith  
SFGFNCGiantsFan : 4/2/2021 8:23 pm : link
In comment 15207645 bc4life said:
Quote:
will hold up in the NFL? Very thin and I don't think he's going to get a lot bigger.


Same build as Marvin Harrison no?
RE: RE: I wonder how Smith  
Mark from Jersey : 4/2/2021 8:26 pm : link
In comment 15207654 SFGFNCGiantsFan said:
Quote:
In comment 15207645 bc4life said:


Quote:


will hold up in the NFL? Very thin and I don't think he's going to get a lot bigger.



Same build as Marvin Harrison no?
Great video about Waddle & Smith in the link below. They talk about Smith's size quite a bit. He is kind of an anomaly as far as his measurables go. Start at 1:50
Link - ( New Window )
Can we stop with the size issue?  
robbieballs2003 : 4/2/2021 8:29 pm : link
Show me the stats that smaller WRs get injured more than bigger WRs. You can't even breathe on WRs anymore. Concussion don't discriminate on size. I know plenty of bigger players that get hurt all the time. Most injuries today seem like non-contact injuries. Those don't discriminate based on size either. So what is the concern?
Thanks for the info.......  
Simms11 : 4/2/2021 8:30 pm : link
It’s always nice to get asshat info.
Thanks for the link  
bc4life : 4/2/2021 8:31 pm : link
Wasn't a rhetorical question. I just think about how Slayton has issues getting off press coverage. And, getting knocked around in 17 game season. At Bama it was pick your poison - in NFL, he will get more attention. Again, I don't know - helluva player, but his frame caught my attention.

Waddle is faster with more meat on his bones
robbie  
Mark from Jersey : 4/2/2021 8:31 pm : link
I agree with you. The video I link just above mentions he is being dinged because "he will struggle against press coverage due to his size" is just lazy scouting. The author watched his routes for the pass two year against press and says it not an issue and, in fact, he is actually pretty good at beating it.
RE: RE: #42  
AcidTest : 4/2/2021 8:32 pm : link
In comment 15207628 Mark from Jersey said:
Quote:
In comment 15207618 AcidTest said:


Quote:


and Engram may not be enough to allow them to trade back into the first round to get an EDGE. Oweh, Paye, Rousseau, Phillips, and Ojulari may all be gone before #25. No interest in Phillips because of his concussion history.

If we stay on 42 I like Ossai from Texas the best for prospects with an average grade in the 40's.


I'm fine with Ossai at #42. He's got a relentless motor, and is an explosive pass rusher with some nice moves.
robbie - maybe you're right  
bc4life : 4/2/2021 8:32 pm : link
on a side note, despite all the talk about not being able to touch wrs - I saw an awful lot of holding last year w/o flags
I think if its true re: NE trade  
90.Cal : 4/2/2021 8:34 pm : link
Its dependent on one of the top 5 QB's falling to 11. Which is possible. But if the top 5 QBs all go top 10... then at least one of Smith, Sewell, Pitts, Chase, Waddle or Slater will be there at 11 and I'll be fine with any of those guys.
RE: Paye is like literally the LAST guy I would want  
section125 : 4/2/2021 8:34 pm : link
In comment 15207571 Judge_and_Jury said:
Quote:
I really hope one of the WR options drops to save us from ourselves. They are way to caught up with the physical measurables with this kid. Another Rashan Gary and even if he develops its probably going to take a couple years


I have said on a few threads, a friend who is a big U Mich alum(captain of the team) said Paye and Gary are NOT alike. Paye is much better and would do really well with hard coaching (he specifically said a Belichick type coach). I was totally against Paye, but he knows his football, and looking at Paye he may be perfect opposite LW.
My  
AcidTest : 4/2/2021 8:35 pm : link
concern is that the Giants will force an EDGE pick at #11 if their offensive targets are gone and they can't trade down. Go BPA even if its an OL.
RE: My  
SFGFNCGiantsFan : 4/2/2021 8:37 pm : link
In comment 15207687 AcidTest said:
Quote:
concern is that the Giants will force an EDGE pick at #11 if their offensive targets are gone and they can't trade down. Go BPA even if its an OL.


I think either Smith, Waddle, or Pitts will be there @ 11. Pitts...most likely of the 3 gone.
Disappointed by the interest in Paye  
PwndPapi : 4/2/2021 8:38 pm : link
Where is the production? I'd rather go with Oweh.
So if I understand this correctly,  
81_Great_Dane : 4/2/2021 8:38 pm : link
the worst case scenario for the Giants is:

1) Pitts and Smith are gone. (I guess they don't think Chase will be there in any event. That's not impossible though.)
2) No trading partner to move down.
3) Must draft a player they don't think is worth #11.

That could totally happen if they think that the Edge prospects like Rousseau, Paye and Ojulari are worth more like 15-20, they're going to be stuck.

I thought the knock on Paye for the Giants was that he was a 4-3 end, who only played from a 3-point stance. I guess not.

Personally, I don't much care who they draft or what position. Just win, baby.
RE: robbie - maybe you're right  
robbieballs2003 : 4/2/2021 8:41 pm : link
In comment 15207683 bc4life said:
Quote:
on a side note, despite all the talk about not being able to touch wrs - I saw an awful lot of holding last year w/o flags


I can see the concern with RBs, TEs, OL, DL, and LB. Basically anyone that is going to take a repeated beating play in and play out. If you are at a strength, weight, size disadvantage where you put yourself in vulnerable positions then I can totally buy that. I mean look at Eli in his career. He took big hit after big hit but never exposed himself to lower body injuries. Every player is unique.

But when it comes to WRs I don't see the problem. People bring up Marvin Harrison. Marvin Harrison also fell to the ground whenever a defender was within 5 yards of him. He knew how to protect himself. Smith is so elusive that he doesn't take hits. Maybe he can takes hits and maybe he can't. But I am not downgrading him or having concerns when he hasn't had those issues.
This was the other concerning piece for me...  
bw in dc : 4/2/2021 8:43 pm : link
Quote:
Giants like their OL pieces. Will not go OL in the 1st round unless something unforeseen happens and Penei Sewell is available.


If there is one thing we have learned over this last decade, under both Reese and now Gettleman, there should be no reason to feel good about the OL until there is real evidence that it is actually good.
Both great players  
bc4life : 4/2/2021 8:44 pm : link
I do not think Pitts will be there at 11. Either, Smith or Waddle should be.
RE: This was the other concerning piece for me...  
Judge_and_Jury : 4/2/2021 8:46 pm : link
In comment 15207698 bw in dc said:
Quote:


Quote:


Giants like their OL pieces. Will not go OL in the 1st round unless something unforeseen happens and Penei Sewell is available.



If there is one thing we have learned over this last decade, under both Reese and now Gettleman, there should be no reason to feel good about the OL until there is real evidence that it is actually good.


Yes that is a very disparaging quote. Giants think they can just 'coach' up what they have. Give me a break if true.

Hope someone drops so we don't end up going Paye.
bw  
bc4life : 4/2/2021 8:48 pm : link
Giants OL drafting has been horrendous for a while. You're really digging yourself out of a hole when you blow 2 1st round picks on offensive tackles.

Think Thomas will be fine and Lemiueux grows into the job. I think Peart is going to be a realy good test re:their eye for OL talent
Draft BPA  
Rick in Dallas : 4/2/2021 8:49 pm : link
Do not force a "need" pick at 11. If you like Oweh and Pity please trade down.
IMHO, this is a very average EDGE class with a lot of "boom or bust" prospects.
I do like Phillips but his medical history scares the crap out of me.
I do think one of Smith or Waddle will be available at number 11.
They must still like Will Hernandez as a starter at OG.Lemieux is awful in pass protection...look out Jones!!!
This OL is not settled as far as I am concerned.
RE: RE: Paye is like literally the LAST guy I would want  
Judge_and_Jury : 4/2/2021 8:49 pm : link
In comment 15207686 section125 said:
Quote:
In comment 15207571 Judge_and_Jury said:


Quote:


I really hope one of the WR options drops to save us from ourselves. They are way to caught up with the physical measurables with this kid. Another Rashan Gary and even if he develops its probably going to take a couple years



I have said on a few threads, a friend who is a big U Mich alum(captain of the team) said Paye and Gary are NOT alike. Paye is much better and would do really well with hard coaching (he specifically said a Belichick type coach). I was totally against Paye, but he knows his football, and looking at Paye he may be perfect opposite LW.


You can't always coach someone into being great. Especially a pass rusher. They have to have natural God given ability to do it. I don't think Paye will bust in terms of being a legit NFL player but he won't be close to BPA when we pick.
I meant Paye in my last post  
Rick in Dallas : 4/2/2021 8:52 pm : link
sorry guys....
They're pretty clearly trying to  
JonC : 4/2/2021 8:54 pm : link
fill holes, if this plays out.
If we go edge  
Payasdaddy : 4/2/2021 8:56 pm : link
Trade down with bears if we get a 2( if qb there)
ER
WR
Oline
TE
CB thru 4 rds
RE: RE: Do they not like  
Angel Eyes : 4/2/2021 8:58 pm : link
In comment 15207604 GoDeep13 said:
Quote:
In comment 15207591 darren in pdx said:


Quote:


Slater at all or are they convinced he won’t be available?

From what I’m guessing, they don’t think they need to spend a 1st round pick to get a good enough talent to complete the line.

That’s pretty arrogant of them, considering what happene with Hernandez.
I am all for BPA....but after the top guys...talent level  
George from PA : 4/2/2021 8:58 pm : link
Flattens out...so if value is equivalent


Then "need" is a tiebreaker
could be a lot of smoke still  
Platos : 4/2/2021 8:59 pm : link
not to discredit your sources GoDeep13. I just would like to think the team isn't putting out so much detailed info out like that.

Paye isn't that bad of a prospect.

a trade down to get him would be ideal.
The thing I like the most there is the trade down with New England.  
Chris684 : 4/2/2021 9:01 pm : link
I’d give them 11 for their 1st (15) and their 3rd (96).

Then we have 15, 42, 76 and 96.

3 picks on Friday night. Would love that.
RE: The thing I like the most there is the trade down with New England.  
Judge_and_Jury : 4/2/2021 9:04 pm : link
In comment 15207730 Chris684 said:
Quote:
I’d give them 11 for their 1st (15) and their 3rd (96).

Then we have 15, 42, 76 and 96.

3 picks on Friday night. Would love that.


If the QB drops they'll give us quite a bit more especially if there is competition for the pick.
RE: I think if its true re: NE trade  
The Mike : 4/2/2021 9:05 pm : link
In comment 15207685 90.Cal said:
Quote:
Its dependent on one of the top 5 QB's falling to 11. Which is possible. But if the top 5 QBs all go top 10... then at least one of Smith, Sewell, Pitts, Chase, Waddle or Slater will be there at 11 and I'll be fine with any of those guys.


This.

The Giants first pick must be one of these six players. Even if only four quarterbacks are selected, Parsons or Surtain will likely be a top ten pick.

Edge is a reach at eleven. Would be classic Giants to bypass Josh Allen in 2019, then win a meaningless game against Washington so as to lose Chase Young in 2020 and then reach for an edge defender in 2021 who will only be marginally better than someone they can get in the second round.

Hopefully this post is just pre-draft subterfuge.
RE: If we really are approaching the draft  
widmerseyebrow : 4/2/2021 9:06 pm : link
In comment 15207537 English Alaister said:
Quote:
With such a need driven agenda then this team is screwed.


Bingo. Hopefully one of the value guys is there and they don't force a subpar edge.
RE: The thing I like the most there is the trade down with New England.  
The Mike : 4/2/2021 9:10 pm : link
In comment 15207730 Chris684 said:
Quote:
I’d give them 11 for their 1st (15) and their 3rd (96).

Then we have 15, 42, 76 and 96.

3 picks on Friday night. Would love that.


This would be ideal. But it is virtually certain that five quarterbacks are going in the top ten.
It's not completely need based  
Go Terps : 4/2/2021 9:12 pm : link
If Smith or Pitts would keep them from drafting an edge guy, I'd guess it would be because they had them graded higher.

Above everything I like hearing about the trade down possibility. More smoke that Gettleman's approach of falling in full bloom love may be in the past.

Trading down and staying out of the top of the FA market is, over the course of years, good policy.
Anyone bemoaning missing on Josh Allen  
George from PA : 4/2/2021 9:25 pm : link
The talent of several Edge defenders in this draft exceeds Josh Allen's talent.

"Reach" is a term...that has a false meaning.

Bottomline.... draft great players
RE: RE: This was the other concerning piece for me...  
bw in dc : 4/2/2021 9:25 pm : link
In comment 15207703 Judge_and_Jury said:
Quote:
In comment 15207698 bw in dc said:


Quote:




Quote:


Giants like their OL pieces. Will not go OL in the 1st round unless something unforeseen happens and Penei Sewell is available.



If there is one thing we have learned over this last decade, under both Reese and now Gettleman, there should be no reason to feel good about the OL until there is real evidence that it is actually good.



Yes that is a very disparaging quote. Giants think they can just 'coach' up what they have. Give me a break if true.

Hope someone drops so we don't end up going Paye.


I hear you.

At this point, you have to hitch yourself to Judge's wagon and hope he can actually fix EVERYTHING.
RE: The thing I like the most there is the trade down with New England.  
Osi Osi Osi OyOyOy : 4/2/2021 9:29 pm : link
In comment 15207730 Chris684 said:
Quote:
I’d give them 11 for their 1st (15) and their 3rd (96).

Then we have 15, 42, 76 and 96.

3 picks on Friday night. Would love that.


The trade down with New England has felt like a very possible scenario for a while now, interesting to see that being backed up as real by one of our “insiders”.

If the team is really focused on an Edge rusher, hopefully the QB the Pats wants falls to the Giants pick and a trade down happens. Paye/Ojulari/Phillips/Rousseau/etc. would all feel better as picks if they were drafted at 15 via a trade down.
RE: It's not completely need based  
Jay on the Island : 4/2/2021 9:31 pm : link
In comment 15207750 Go Terps said:
Quote:
If Smith or Pitts would keep them from drafting an edge guy, I'd guess it would be because they had them graded higher.

Above everything I like hearing about the trade down possibility. More smoke that Gettleman's approach of falling in full bloom love may be in the past.

Trading down and staying out of the top of the FA market is, over the course of years, good policy.

Agreed, If by some miracle both Smith and Pitts are on the board at 11 nobody can say that they are a need pick. Yes they would both fill a need but they deserve to go earlier than 11. If Pitts, Sewell, Smith, Chase, and Waddle are off the board at 11 then I hope the Giants trade down and then select a pass rusher. NE is an ideal spot especially if they receive a 2nd round pick for moving down.

It sucks that Jaelan Phillips has the concussion concerns because he is such a great prospect IMO. I hope that the Giants get lucky and he falls to 42 while the Giants come away with Smith or Pitts at 11.
I don’t view this as “forcing a need”  
Sean : 4/2/2021 9:33 pm : link
It’s clear they view Pitts/Smith as BPA and they’d take either. If they are both off the board than value would meet need - I’d guess all the EDGE’s would grade out pretty even to the other prospects, so they’d go with the EDGE. Makes sense to me.

The NE drop down spot also makes sense.
...  
ryanmkeane : 4/2/2021 9:36 pm : link
We have the 11th pick. This isn’t the same as having a top 6 or 7. Anyone who thinks Paye would not be a good pick without anyone ever stepping on the NFL field is mistaken.
RE: RE: I've heard speculation that Pitts  
BH28 : 4/2/2021 9:36 pm : link
In comment 15207612 SFGFNCGiantsFan said:
Quote:
In comment 15207597 bc4life said:


Quote:


will probably go to Jets or Atlanta



Jets pass on Wilson?


I know everyone and their mother has Jets taking Wilson but I have a hard time seeing it unless they trade Darnold before the draft.

Darnold still has trade value, that value plummets if they draft Wilson and Darnold is still on the team. They take a $9 million hit cutting him, roughly half that if they can trade him.
Most fans predisposition on Pitts  
bLiTz 2k : 4/2/2021 9:39 pm : link
Comes from his listen position...a lot of biases on here, but ask any football person and he's right there in the conversation for one of the 3 best prospects in the entire draft.
Why is everyone against Paye  
Saos1n : 4/2/2021 9:45 pm : link
Other than his name doesn’t sound like one that becomes an NFL star?

For a man his size, he’s got a sudden quickness and speed to round the corner. Strength to man the middle, as well as bull rush the OTs. A hell of a motor. Remind me of a quicker, faster Tuck

If it comes to that, sign me up!!!
Paye  
UGADawgs7 : 4/2/2021 9:50 pm : link
Is going to suck
Please be misdirection or not accurate  
GiantSteps : 4/2/2021 9:51 pm : link
I have a hard time believing ANY of the edge guys will be BPA at 11.
RE: Paye  
ryanmkeane : 4/2/2021 9:55 pm : link
In comment 15207813 UGADawgs7 said:
Quote:
Is going to suck

Lol. Ok
Screw potentiial.  
Carl in CT : 4/2/2021 9:55 pm : link
Draft football players please at #11. We are not drafting at #25.
If we are going Edge (not Parsons included)  
Carl in CT : 4/2/2021 10:01 pm : link
We better be trading down twice and sitting with 3 second rounders and a first. Or we are plain dumb.
better to reach a little in the second and get  
Tom in Kzoo : 4/2/2021 10:01 pm : link
Jordan Smith UAB as an ER. Sleeper. Greg Cosell likes him alot.
I smell....  
5BowlsSoon : 4/2/2021 10:03 pm : link
MISDIRECTION HERE!

Not buying it.....but that’s just me.
RE: RE: RE: I've heard speculation that Pitts  
robbieballs2003 : 4/2/2021 10:10 pm : link
In comment 15207793 BH28 said:
Quote:
In comment 15207612 SFGFNCGiantsFan said:


Quote:


In comment 15207597 bc4life said:


Quote:


will probably go to Jets or Atlanta



Jets pass on Wilson?



I know everyone and their mother has Jets taking Wilson but I have a hard time seeing it unless they trade Darnold before the draft.

Darnold still has trade value, that value plummets if they draft Wilson and Darnold is still on the team. They take a $9 million hit cutting him, roughly half that if they can trade him.


You don't pass on what you believe is a franchise QB because of Darnold. And, no, his value doesn't plummet. It is already low. This isn't Rosen where he had 4 years of control left. This is Darnold who has one year left and a decision needs to be made this year on his 5th year option which would be insane to pick up. Right now Darnold's value is at best a third. None of this matters if Wilson is your guy.
NE 1st and 3rd is no way enough!  
Carl in CT : 4/2/2021 10:21 pm : link
It would have to be 1 & 2. Even draft charts it’s not enough and if they are moving up for a QB then that’s where I would start 1 & 2.
Question for the OP:  
Angel Eyes : 4/2/2021 10:23 pm : link
Would anyone want Engram for a second rounder? I have my doubts due to being unsure of how much the Giants would want a tight end who can’t block or catch.
While  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 4/2/2021 10:23 pm : link
I somewhat understand the desire for a trade down here, on most "pundit" boards right now, Kwity Paye is in the the #12, #13, #14 #15 range. I'd love to trade down (always). But Paye is projected to go in that range.
I'm hoping people have learned  
mittenedman : 4/2/2021 10:26 pm : link
not to boo draft picks before they play. Paye wouldn't be my first choice, but if the Giants decide he's the right guy for the program they're building, so be it. They could really use a strongside edge who can play the 9/7/5 - big achilles heel.
For what it’s worth  
ryanmkeane : 4/2/2021 10:27 pm : link
NFL.com has Owusu-Koramoah as the 7th best prospect
RE: I'm hoping people have learned  
Angel Eyes : 4/2/2021 10:27 pm : link
In comment 15207852 mittenedman said:
Quote:
not to boo draft picks before they play. Paye wouldn't be my first choice, but if the Giants decide he's the right guy for the program they're building, so be it. They could really use a strongside edge who can play the 9/7/5 - big achilles heel.

I could get behind a trio of drafts where we could hit three spots. Say Paye, TE Friermuth in Round 2, and OG Banks in Round 3?
RE: I've heard speculation that Pitts  
uconngiant : 4/2/2021 10:31 pm : link
In comment 15207597 bc4life said:
Quote:
will probably go to Jets or Atlanta



Jet's are taking Wilson and I see a quarterback going to Atlanta as well.
RE: Disappointed by the interest in Paye  
chopperhatch : 4/2/2021 10:31 pm : link
In comment 15207693 PwndPapi said:
Quote:
Where is the production? I'd rather go with Oweh.


Im with this. Given how Oweh's pro day went went and the Chaos connection, I would be more into taking him than Paye.

But these coaches see coachable traits and know ehat they are wat hing far better than we do. But Oweh has always been intriguing. With a trade down he is ideal, but could see us seeing him as the BPA at 11.

Thenwewould hear the usual suspects say he was overdrafted for 2 years until he hit double digit sacks.
RE: For what it’s worth  
chopperhatch : 4/2/2021 10:32 pm : link
In comment 15207853 ryanmkeane said:
Quote:
NFL.com has Owusu-Koramoah as the 7th best prospect



Doesnt fit our team at all. He would play the same position as peppers.
For those saying where is the production  
robbieballs2003 : 4/2/2021 10:37 pm : link
Remember our run defense got gashed on the edges a ton when Fackrell wasn't there. Don't undervalued that part of it. If I am not mistaken, NE used to love OLB that were the size of defensive ends in a 4-3. Paye fits that mold and is probably one reason why Sy supposedly likes him.
RE: RE: Paye is like literally the LAST guy I would want  
Rave7 : 4/2/2021 10:38 pm : link
In comment 15207686 section125 said:
Quote:
In comment 15207571 Judge_and_Jury said:


Quote:


I really hope one of the WR options drops to save us from ourselves. They are way to caught up with the physical measurables with this kid. Another Rashan Gary and even if he develops its probably going to take a couple years



I have said on a few threads, a friend who is a big U Mich alum(captain of the team) said Paye and Gary are NOT alike. Paye is much better and would do really well with hard coaching (he specifically said a Belichick type coach). I was totally against Paye, but he knows his football, and looking at Paye he may be perfect opposite LW.


Even Sy tweeted Paye is one of the 5 best non-QBs in the class. I think he's very high on Paye. Also, I heard Paye was used in the wrong scheme in Michigan and that's why he's production was low.
Paye had  
ryanmkeane : 4/2/2021 10:42 pm : link
12.5 TFL and 6.5 sacks as a junior. This past season he had 4 TFL and 2 sacks in 4 games because of the big ten short season. This isn’t exactly a guy who didn’t produce.

Rashan Gary had similar production at Michigan and really started to come on late in his second season and into the playoffs with the Packers. I think he’s due for a big year coming up.
I feel I'm in the 95th percentile...  
bw in dc : 4/2/2021 10:45 pm : link
here on following PSU - on the field and with their recruiting.

He and Parsons were the class of 2018. Parsons was a 5 star recruit ranked in the top ten of most boards. And Oweh was a 4 star recruit ranked around 90-100.

Here is the ESPN write up on Oweh's weaknesses:

WEAKNESSES: Still raw and needs to continue to watch pad level and develop technique. Shows flashes but needs to improve get-off.

Honestly, I don't think much has changed. He's still a dynamic athlete but he is still very raw and isn't very productive. So it's a real stretch to even imagine taking such a project at #11...
Thanks for the info GoDeep.  
Dave in Hoboken : 4/2/2021 10:46 pm : link
Nothing but happiness from this guy if either Pitts or Smith are still there at 11 for us.
RE: For those saying where is the production  
ryanmkeane : 4/2/2021 10:49 pm : link
In comment 15207861 robbieballs2003 said:
Quote:
Remember our run defense got gashed on the edges a ton when Fackrell wasn't there. Don't undervalued that part of it. If I am not mistaken, NE used to love OLB that were the size of defensive ends in a 4-3. Paye fits that mold and is probably one reason why Sy supposedly likes him.

Correct. Trey Flowers.
For those concerned with Paye  
robbieballs2003 : 4/2/2021 10:53 pm : link
Watch this video on him setting the edge. I can 100% question our ability to set an edge right now with our current defenders. Right now that is the biggest weakness of our defense imo.
Link - ( New Window )
RE: RE: RE: RE: I've heard speculation that Pitts  
BH28 : 4/2/2021 11:02 pm : link
In comment 15207843 robbieballs2003 said:
Quote:
In comment 15207793 BH28 said:


Quote:


In comment 15207612 SFGFNCGiantsFan said:


Quote:


In comment 15207597 bc4life said:


Quote:


will probably go to Jets or Atlanta



Jets pass on Wilson?



I know everyone and their mother has Jets taking Wilson but I have a hard time seeing it unless they trade Darnold before the draft.

Darnold still has trade value, that value plummets if they draft Wilson and Darnold is still on the team. They take a $9 million hit cutting him, roughly half that if they can trade him.



You don't pass on what you believe is a franchise QB because of Darnold. And, no, his value doesn't plummet. It is already low. This isn't Rosen where he had 4 years of control left. This is Darnold who has one year left and a decision needs to be made this year on his 5th year option which would be insane to pick up. Right now Darnold's value is at best a third. None of this matters if Wilson is your guy.


I didn't say he had high value to begin with, but you're not getting a third for him after you draft Wilson hence his value plummets. There is no benefit to keeping him on the roster at this point if you're set on Wilson. Get what you can and move on.
I completely disagree with your assessment.  
robbieballs2003 : 4/2/2021 11:05 pm : link
The BEST case scenario is a third but who is giving that up besides maybe Denver?

And why can't Darnold stay on the roster? Optics? Who cares? If the Jets are only getting like a 5th round pick as an offer now then you hold onto him for a year, let him leave via FA, and collect a comp pick. Wilson may take time to develop.
Thanks GoDeep13!  
Mdgiantsfan : 4/2/2021 11:08 pm : link
I greatly appreciate the info!

RE: Question for the OP:  
GoDeep13 : 4/2/2021 11:26 pm : link
In comment 15207849 Angel Eyes said:
Quote:
Would anyone want Engram for a second rounder? I have my doubts due to being unsure of how much the Giants would want a tight end who can’t block or catch.
no way. At most Engram may garner a late 3rd
RE: RE: Question for the OP:  
GFAN52 : 4/2/2021 11:28 pm : link
In comment 15207888 GoDeep13 said:
Quote:
In comment 15207849 Angel Eyes said:


Quote:


Would anyone want Engram for a second rounder? I have my doubts due to being unsure of how much the Giants would want a tight end who can’t block or catch.

no way. At most Engram may garner a late 3rd


At best.
RE: RE: Question for the OP:  
chopperhatch : 4/2/2021 11:31 pm : link
In comment 15207888 GoDeep13 said:
Quote:
In comment 15207849 Angel Eyes said:


Quote:


Would anyone want Engram for a second rounder? I have my doubts due to being unsure of how much the Giants would want a tight end who can’t block or catch.

no way. At most Engram may garner a late 3rd


But trading Engram AND a pick to more back into the end of the 1st wouldbe worth the listen. Imagine getting an EDGE at 11 and a guy like Terrace Marshall at 30. Draft Tommy Tremble in the 4th andlets go to work.
RE: For those concerned with Paye  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 4/2/2021 11:37 pm : link
In comment 15207869 robbieballs2003 said:
Quote:
Watch this video on him setting the edge. I can 100% question our ability to set an edge right now with our current defenders. Right now that is the biggest weakness of our defense imo. Link - ( New Window )


That's good stuff. I like the guy narrating that too.
I just don’t see the Giants using a premium pick on a 6’2 or 6’3 edge  
bigblue12 : 4/2/2021 11:58 pm : link
Their history has been long athletes. In my opinion, Phillips, Oweh or even Rousseau are more likely than Paye or Oljulari.
I don't mind the plan  
mphbullet36 : 4/3/2021 12:21 am : link
But even in a trade down I hope the Paye rumors are smoke...I would rather have any of the other projected "edge" guys then him.

Ojulari
Phillips
would even take a chance on a raw guy like Rousseau

Don't get me wrong Paye looks like a energy guy that plays hard but I don't see much production or elite pass rushing skills.

Like Phillips has big time pass rushing potential he just needs to be cleared medically and I would 100% take the risk on that then someone that just doesn't get to the QB even when he's healthy.
also  
mphbullet36 : 4/3/2021 12:22 am : link
would be interested in Oweh or Collins over Paye as well.
RE: For those concerned with Paye  
bw in dc : 4/3/2021 12:27 am : link
In comment 15207869 robbieballs2003 said:
Quote:
Watch this video on him setting the edge. I can 100% question our ability to set an edge right now with our current defenders. Right now that is the biggest weakness of our defense imo. Link - ( New Window )


FWIW...

Will Fries, #71, the RT for PSU, is, and I'll be kind, an ordinary OL. And Rasheed Walker, #53, the LT, is very young and maybe average right now. The entire PSU OL was horrible this past year.

OSU has much better talent at the bookends in that game in 2019. And they pretty much held Paye in check.
RE: I completely disagree with your assessment.  
Producer : 4/3/2021 12:35 am : link
In comment 15207875 robbieballs2003 said:
Quote:
The BEST case scenario is a third but who is giving that up besides maybe Denver?

And why can't Darnold stay on the roster? Optics? Who cares? If the Jets are only getting like a 5th round pick as an offer now then you hold onto him for a year, let him leave via FA, and collect a comp pick. Wilson may take time to develop.


100% right. Why can't Darnold and Wilson be on the same team? Feelings? Optics? Competition is good. These are warriors. Competition should bring out the best in them. If it doesn't they shouldn't be in this league.
RE: RE: For those concerned with Paye  
robbieballs2003 : 4/3/2021 1:26 am : link
In comment 15207918 bw in dc said:
Quote:
In comment 15207869 robbieballs2003 said:


Quote:


Watch this video on him setting the edge. I can 100% question our ability to set an edge right now with our current defenders. Right now that is the biggest weakness of our defense imo. Link - ( New Window )



FWIW...

Will Fries, #71, the RT for PSU, is, and I'll be kind, an ordinary OL. And Rasheed Walker, #53, the LT, is very young and maybe average right now. The entire PSU OL was horrible this past year.

OSU has much better talent at the bookends in that game in 2019. And they pretty much held Paye in check.


I agree. I have been trying to find games on YouTube and nothing. I remember there used to be a website nfldraftbreakdown.com that used to have all game breakdowns. It was great. I guess if is a copyright thing now so there is limited video out there.
Another underwhelming pick  
giantstock : 4/3/2021 4:42 am : link
I've predicted Kwity Paye that the Giants will take. Just on how they have drafted in the past 3 years. While "not bad" another underwhelming pick.

Paye just isn't that elite. Just as Thomas isn't that elite. Just as Jones isn't that elite and just as taking a rb 2nd overall isn't an elite selection.

We're building our team to some terrific mediocrity.
RE: Why is everyone against Paye  
giantstock : 4/3/2021 5:02 am : link
In comment 15207809 Saos1n said:
Quote:
Other than his name doesn’t sound like one that becomes an NFL star?

For a man his size, he’s got a sudden quickness and speed to round the corner. Strength to man the middle, as well as bull rush the OTs. A hell of a motor. Remind me of a quicker, faster Tuck

If it comes to that, sign me up!!!


If his size and athleticism is as good as you say then why didn't he have better production going against other college players?
RE: I don't mind the plan  
Judge_and_Jury : 4/3/2021 5:54 am : link
In comment 15207914 mphbullet36 said:
Quote:
But even in a trade down I hope the Paye rumors are smoke...I would rather have any of the other projected "edge" guys then him.

Ojulari
Phillips
would even take a chance on a raw guy like Rousseau

Don't get me wrong Paye looks like a energy guy that plays hard but I don't see much production or elite pass rushing skills.

Like Phillips has big time pass rushing potential he just needs to be cleared medically and I would 100% take the risk on that then someone that just doesn't get to the QB even when he's healthy.


Yes at least Phillips has natural rush talent.
Paye hasn’t played standing up  
jeff57 : 4/3/2021 6:35 am : link
Phillips is a better bet even with the concussions. And it’s a mistake to get locked into a position. Although I do like the idea of trading down to 15.
RE: Paye hasn’t played standing up  
section125 : 4/3/2021 6:42 am : link
In comment 15207973 jeff57 said:
Quote:
Phillips is a better bet even with the concussions. And it’s a mistake to get locked into a position. Although I do like the idea of trading down to 15.


Phillips has better potential to be sidelined with concussions...We whine about Shepard's chances of being lost to IR and yet people want to draft a guy with a history of concussions. That is too high a risk for a 1st rounder. At #42 it would be different. Not doubting his talent, but this is a guy that stopped playing football on his own because of injury concerns.

I would rather the steady solid performer in round 1 that will be on the field more likely with a very good chance of getting better at the rush and he is not chopped liver, either.
It All Comes Down To Who  
pa_giant_fan : 4/3/2021 6:46 am : link
Judge and Graham think is the right player for their system. To think we know better than them is just crazy.

When you factor in the reported pursuit of Leonard Floyd...  
Klaatu : 4/3/2021 7:55 am : link
With the uncertainty surrounding Carter and Ximines, it's easy to see why the Giants would be looking for a top-tier ER/OLB in this draft. I hope they can trade down and still get their man.

I don't think missing out on one of the highest-ranked WR's in the 1st Round would be a mortal blow. It seems to me that they should be able to find a good WR prospect later on. Same for an IOL if they choose to go that route.
Move back and  
Lines of Scrimmage : 4/3/2021 8:02 am : link
grab the BPA at LB/Corner. Next three picks OL (I think they need and want a starter), WR, DT. I like Parsons who from what I have read is very diverse in his skill set.

Good point about defending the edge in the running game. Pats usually have this as a very important position; Willie McGinest who comes to mind. I think one of the additions in FA may help with this role.
RE: Why is everyone against Paye  
TommyWiseau : 4/3/2021 8:04 am : link
In comment 15207809 Saos1n said:
Quote:
Other than his name doesn’t sound like one that becomes an NFL star?

For a man his size, he’s got a sudden quickness and speed to round the corner. Strength to man the middle, as well as bull rush the OTs. A hell of a motor. Remind me of a quicker, faster Tuck

If it comes to that, sign me up!!!


You think people don't like him because his name does not sound like an NFL star's name? What?

People don't like him because his college production is garbage.
Very good link robbieballs  
mittenedman : 4/3/2021 8:13 am : link
That looks like an instructional video on how to play DE.
As  
AcidTest : 4/3/2021 8:14 am : link
I said, I'd prefer to pass on EDGE at #11, but Paye would be the best choice of those available. His production at Michigan has been very good.

Phillips has had too many concussions. Rousseau opted out and basically has one year of production. Oweh is to raw. #11 is too early for Ojulari IMO.

But I think it's moot because one of their receiving targets (Pitts, Waddle, or Smith) is likely to be available.

Link - ( New Window )
EDGE  
mittenedman : 4/3/2021 8:20 am : link
Paye vs. Rousseau vs. Phillips

That's why management gets the big bucks. Pick the right one.
If things were to go right  
Giantimistic : 4/3/2021 8:32 am : link
for the team and our free agents performed without getting injured, Jones takes the jump that it seems like the staff think he will take, the oline is solid as it sounds like the coaching staff thinks and the defense gets even better than last year then we will be competing in the playoffs.

I understand those are ifs, but there are a possibility. If that is all true, the one major thing this team is missing is an edge that can get to the passer on their own. Imagine if our secondary as good as it could be and we can get to the QB with 3 or 4 players.

So that being said, the chances of finding a rookie impact edge past round 2 is very slim. If you want impact this year, most of the time it is coming from round 1 or 2. It makes sense that the Giants expect to go after an edge talent in 1 or 2 and that if they go offense with pick one that they would be aggressive trying to get their edge with the next pick. If we do not get an edge with pick 1 or 2, the chance of a rookie impact edge will be more luck than anything.

As far as the actual players, I have no idea, but since I am all in with Judge I will be excited with who they go with. I believe in the vision Judge has for the team and trust the player they go with.

With all respect to the OP ...  
Spider56 : 4/3/2021 8:48 am : link
As tight lipped as the Giants have been since JJ arrived with the ‘Belickian’ approach, how does this level of detail filter out? Is this like pillow talk or what? I can buy into the logic of some of the points, but not specific names.
Thanks GoDeep13  
Matt in SGS : 4/3/2021 9:03 am : link
great info as usual. Love looking for your posts this time of year.
RE: With all respect to the OP ...  
Ten Ton Hammer : 4/3/2021 9:05 am : link
In comment 15208046 Spider56 said:
Quote:
As tight lipped as the Giants have been since JJ arrived with the ‘Belickian’ approach, how does this level of detail filter out? Is this like pillow talk or what? I can buy into the logic of some of the points, but not specific names.


If something doesn't seem credible to you, trust your instincts. It's healthy to treat asshattery with a grain of salt.
Appreciate the info  
AcesUp : 4/3/2021 9:13 am : link
As stated by others, I don’t really see a scenario where they have to stand pat and take Edge at 11. At least 4-5 QBs should go before that pick, leading to one of Sewell, Pitts or the Bama WRs falling. If all those QBs don’t go before that pick then the Giants have the carrot to encourage a trade down with another team. I don’t see a big difference in the Edge the Giants can get at 11 vs the top of the 2nd round (or in a trade up like suggested). There’s a very good chance that Rousseau is sitting there at their 2nd pick if there’s any truth to recent draft chatter.
Not sure if 5 QBs will go before us but if they do  
Chris684 : 4/3/2021 9:38 am : link
5 QBs + Chase, Sewell, Surtain means one of Pitts, Smith or Waddle is there for us.

I have a feeling only 4 of the QBs go in front of us but drafts are weird. Who saw Clelin Ferrell going 4 to the Raiders 2 years ago?
RE: While  
DavidinBMNY : 4/3/2021 9:47 am : link
In comment 15207850 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
I somewhat understand the desire for a trade down here, on most "pundit" boards right now, Kwity Paye is in the the #12, #13, #14 #15 range. I'd love to trade down (always). But Paye is projected to go in that range.
Paye is going to be a solid pro. He has a very high floor. I'd be pleased with the pick. I don't think he's an explosive player but very solid. More of a Dupree level pass russ production, but better vs. the run.

It's really hard to get an Edge in FA. The last high edge picked was JPP. I'm not counting 3rd rd players.

They are over due for one. The thing is, how important in this defense is that.
Edge is the way to go  
WillVAB : 4/3/2021 10:06 am : link
Preferably after a trade down. Edge and OL early then look for value at the offensive skill positions later in the draft.
RE: With all respect to the OP ...  
Mike in NJ : 4/3/2021 10:16 am : link
In comment 15208046 Spider56 said:
Quote:
As tight lipped as the Giants have been since JJ arrived with the ‘Belickian’ approach, how does this level of detail filter out? Is this like pillow talk or what? I can buy into the logic of some of the points, but not specific names.


Has it been tight lipped? I think GoDeep (or one of the other asshats on this board) had the Andrew Thomas pick last year, I made money betting on him based on the tip from this board. I also think it was GoDeep that called the McKinney pick before Day 2 of the draft last year.

It was also pretty well known prior to the trade deadline last year that the team liked Kenny Golladay and would make a run at him during free agency if they weren't able to trade for him.
It's been quieter  
JonC : 4/3/2021 10:28 am : link
but stuff always gets out, especially as the draft draws near.
If Sewell fell  
jeff57 : 4/3/2021 10:36 am : link
“Giants: This was another hard “yes” on drafting Sewell.”
Link - ( New Window )
RE: With all respect to the OP ...  
Peppers : 4/3/2021 10:40 am : link
In comment 15208046 Spider56 said:
Quote:
As tight lipped as the Giants have been since JJ arrived with the ‘Belickian’ approach, how does this level of detail filter out?


It doesn't.
So leaks then  
BigBlueCane : 4/3/2021 10:53 am : link
I believe the evidence about them wanting to trade down is legit but getting that deal done is another thing.

Personally I'm not a fan of Paye, I do think Oweh or the Texas DE might be better...
RE: RE: RE: For those concerned with Paye  
bw in dc : 4/3/2021 11:04 am : link
In comment 15207932 robbieballs2003 said:
Quote:
In comment 15207918 bw in dc said:


Quote:


In comment 15207869 robbieballs2003 said:


Quote:


Watch this video on him setting the edge. I can 100% question our ability to set an edge right now with our current defenders. Right now that is the biggest weakness of our defense imo. Link - ( New Window )



FWIW...

Will Fries, #71, the RT for PSU, is, and I'll be kind, an ordinary OL. And Rasheed Walker, #53, the LT, is very young and maybe average right now. The entire PSU OL was horrible this past year.

OSU has much better talent at the bookends in that game in 2019. And they pretty much held Paye in check.



I agree. I have been trying to find games on YouTube and nothing. I remember there used to be a website nfldraftbreakdown.com that used to have all game breakdowns. It was great. I guess if is a copyright thing now so there is limited video out there.


I stumbled on something the other day on Paye that was interesting. I'll see if I can dig it up.
I’m very happy to hear  
Jay on the Island : 4/3/2021 11:18 am : link
That Smith and Pitts are at the top of the Giants wish list. I also like that they’ve explored trade down options if they’re both off the board in order to land a pass rusher. I’m not a fan of Paye however. I would much rather see them target Ojulari, Rousseau, or Phillips over Paye.
RE: I’m very happy to hear  
BlueVinnie : 4/3/2021 11:48 am : link
In comment 15208200 Jay on the Island said:
Quote:
That Smith and Pitts are at the top of the Giants wish list.

I'm not real thrilled with Smith being there. Seems like a nice pick in the lower part of round 1 (at best). Will have several productive years but will never achieve the greatness he displayed last season at Alabama. I think he's a number 2 receiver in the NFL, not a guy you pick at 1.11.
Appreciate the post by  
ryanmkeane : 4/3/2021 11:49 am : link
GoDeep - but this same guy posts this level of detail before the draft every year and has been very wrong in recent years.

He said Gettleman was going to step down/retire. Flat out stated it was going to happen.
Dis-information....is information  
George from PA : 4/3/2021 11:54 am : link
I wouldn't put it past Judge/DG to leak wrong information....to keep people guessing.

It's not that information flows freely...

Ross was always trying to show people his intelligence and leaked
RE: Appreciate the post by  
GoDeep13 : 4/3/2021 12:36 pm : link
In comment 15208225 ryanmkeane said:
Quote:
GoDeep - but this same guy posts this level of detail before the draft every year and has been very wrong in recent years.

He said Gettleman was going to step down/retire. Flat out stated it was going to happen.
Not to toot my own horn in past years but I was the one that posted about the Giants interest in Leonard Floyd in the 2016 draft on the Main Giants message board that was on Giants.com (still probably the one time I will I may have KINDA screwed us). I was also the first to post about how Gettleman fell in love with Daniel Jones (a post I was told to delete by my source). These sources also told me it was down to an OT between Wirfs and Thomas last year. My mocks do suck though because I only ever have an idea about what the Giants want to do and can’t really gauge other teams.

Am I 100%? No. Things do end up changing. I was wrong about Gettleman being out after this season. But it’s obvious with the direction we took in FA that he was given an ultimatum heading into this season.
GoDeep13  
YANKEE28 : 4/3/2021 12:43 pm : link
Thanks for your posts.

Do you have any knowledge of who from the Giants attended yesterdays Pro Days (Oregon and Tulsa to see Collins)?
Paye would be great for this defense, it's just not a sexy pick.  
Zeke's Alibi : 4/3/2021 12:52 pm : link
Can't say this enough, but many times production is based on scheme ESPECIALLY at the college level.

Guy sets the edge and has a lot of upside as a pass rusher tbh. Even if he doesn't hit that, he's an instant starter, and great fit for what we do defensively.

I like hearing a lot it's Pitts, Smith and then Paye. I know a lot of people won't like hearing this, but he reminds me a lot of Olivier Vernon. Vernon wouldn't nearly be as hated here if he wasn't paid ridiculous money and started getting injuries out of nowhere.
GD13  
Rave7 : 4/3/2021 12:54 pm : link
I always appreciate your asshat posts. Thanks. Keep up the good work!
RE: GoDeep13  
GoDeep13 : 4/3/2021 1:04 pm : link
In comment 15208269 YANKEE28 said:
Quote:
Thanks for your posts.

Do you have any knowledge of who from the Giants attended yesterdays Pro Days (Oregon and Tulsa to see Collins)?
I don’t know who attended either but I know they are evaluating the possibility of using Zaven Collins a lot like the Patriots used Dont’a Hightower. Having him play MLB on run downs and being a EDGE rusher on 3rd. They think he measures comparably to Hightower but offers more in pass coverage. But they still have some background work to do on Collins.
So is Zaven Collins a possibility at 11  
jeff57 : 4/3/2021 1:12 pm : link
Or with a trade down? Can’t see him making it out of the top 20.
RE: RE: Appreciate the post by  
Zeke's Alibi : 4/3/2021 1:16 pm : link
In comment 15208259 GoDeep13 said:
Quote:
In comment 15208225 ryanmkeane said:


Quote:


GoDeep - but this same guy posts this level of detail before the draft every year and has been very wrong in recent years.

He said Gettleman was going to step down/retire. Flat out stated it was going to happen.

Not to toot my own horn in past years but I was the one that posted about the Giants interest in Leonard Floyd in the 2016 draft on the Main Giants message board that was on Giants.com (still probably the one time I will I may have KINDA screwed us). I was also the first to post about how Gettleman fell in love with Daniel Jones (a post I was told to delete by my source). These sources also told me it was down to an OT between Wirfs and Thomas last year. My mocks do suck though because I only ever have an idea about what the Giants want to do and can’t really gauge other teams.

Am I 100%? No. Things do end up changing. I was wrong about Gettleman being out after this season. But it’s obvious with the direction we took in FA that he was given an ultimatum heading into this season.


Yeah dude, don't sweat it. People don't understand that things are fluid. Been on this board a long time and your information is clearly the most accurate and generally tracks with the overall orginization's thinking imo.

If what you are saying is true this year, it gives me really high fucking hopes for the future.
RE: So is Zaven Collins a possibility at 11  
GoDeep13 : 4/3/2021 1:18 pm : link
In comment 15208294 jeff57 said:
Quote:
Or with a trade down? Can’t see him making it out of the top 20.
Not sure where he’ll shake out. Apparently they haven’t finished their evaluation off him yet. But I like him as the most complete LB in the draft. I’d be ecstatic with Collins. Even at 11.
GoDeep13.....and one of my favorite things they've changed  
Zeke's Alibi : 4/3/2021 1:20 pm : link
is it seems like they've thrown WAY more resources at gaming the draft out. Way to many times under the old regime we would be get standing around with our fucking pants down when a curveball was thrown, and often didn't feel like they had an understanding at what was going to be available down the line with later picks from a tier perspective. I'd imagine Slater has a similar grade as Paye and Surtain, but it really seems like they feel like there will be better options available in rd2 and 3, then there will be at corner and edge.
RE: RE: So is Zaven Collins a possibility at 11  
Spider56 : 4/3/2021 1:25 pm : link
In comment 15208304 GoDeep13 said:
Quote:
Or with a trade down? Can’t see him making it out of the top 20.
Not sure where he’ll shake out. Apparently they haven’t finished their evaluation off him yet. But I like him as the most complete LB in the draft. I’d be ecstatic with Collins. Even at 11.


This would be sweet music to my ears ...a complete player.
Draft comments  
Colin@gbn : 4/3/2021 1:33 pm : link
Very interesting info GoDeep. It does seem to confirm what the Giants have been doing in the field these days in that just about all,if not all, the top prospects at the pro days their senior people have been attending are defensive front seven players. To me maybe the most interesting note you make is that while Paye is the guy mentioned there is still no real consensus. And that may be reinforced by the fact they appear to be willing to deal down. If they had a conviction on Paye then I doubt they would be thinking of moving down as there is a real chance he could be gone even by 15.

Fact is you have a bunch of edges - Paye, Phillips, Rousseau, Ojulari, Collins etc - who are all pretty close. I know your source downplayed it a little - and if there is going to be any misinfo from the Giants this might be it - but I keep looking at Parsons when I do mocks. Just about everyone I talk to around the league will say quite unequivocably that he is THE best defensive player in this draft. And more than one has said second isn't even close. And i find it hard to believe that Judge didn't go to Happy Valley to see and meet for a up-close-and-personal perspective Parsons to find out for himself.

Time will tell.
RE: Draft comments  
GoDeep13 : 4/3/2021 1:55 pm : link
In comment 15208320 Colin@gbn said:
Quote:
Very interesting info GoDeep. It does seem to confirm what the Giants have been doing in the field these days in that just about all,if not all, the top prospects at the pro days their senior people have been attending are defensive front seven players. To me maybe the most interesting note you make is that while Paye is the guy mentioned there is still no real consensus. And that may be reinforced by the fact they appear to be willing to deal down. If they had a conviction on Paye then I doubt they would be thinking of moving down as there is a real chance he could be gone even by 15.

Fact is you have a bunch of edges - Paye, Phillips, Rousseau, Ojulari, Collins etc - who are all pretty close. I know your source downplayed it a little - and if there is going to be any misinfo from the Giants this might be it - but I keep looking at Parsons when I do mocks. Just about everyone I talk to around the league will say quite unequivocably that he is THE best defensive player in this draft. And more than one has said second isn't even close. And i find it hard to believe that Judge didn't go to Happy Valley to see and meet for a up-close-and-personal perspective Parsons to find out for himself.

Time will tell.
yep. Went back last night to watch other evalutions and videos on Paye again and I noticed something that I’m taking as a sign at Paye’s pro day. Fast forward to the Bench press and look what you see.
Kwity Paye Pro Day - ( New Window )
RE: RE: For those concerned with Paye  
BigRoss71 : 4/3/2021 2:02 pm : link
In comment 15207918 bw in dc said:
Quote:
In comment 15207869 robbieballs2003 said:


Quote:

FWIW...

Will Fries, #71, the RT for PSU, is, and I'll be kind, an ordinary OL. And Rasheed Walker, #53, the LT, is very young and maybe average right now. The entire PSU OL was horrible this past year.


Sad as it might be, Fries will probably get picked on day 3. Goes to show you how little good depth there is with OL in the current NFL.

Normally the guys I've seen play in HS I am biased towards, however after watching film on him, he leans too much as opposed to keeping his feet moving when trying to re-establish leverage. Hand placement isn't bad, but lacks "pop". For his size (not as wide as he looks in pads, almost looks "lean"), one would think his feet would be quicker.
RE: EDGE  
Milton : 4/3/2021 2:13 pm : link
In comment 15208020 mittenedman said:
Quote:
Paye vs. Rousseau vs. Phillips

That's why management gets the big bucks. Pick the right one.
+1
p.s.--I prefer Rousseau, but what the hell do I know compared to people who watch film all day and have access to zoom interviews, medical records, and college coaches.
RE: RE: Draft comments  
Colin@gbn : 4/3/2021 2:14 pm : link
In comment 15208347 GoDeep13 said:
Quote:
In comment 15208320 Colin@gbn said:


Quote:


Very interesting info GoDeep. It does seem to confirm what the Giants have been doing in the field these days in that just about all,if not all, the top prospects at the pro days their senior people have been attending are defensive front seven players. To me maybe the most interesting note you make is that while Paye is the guy mentioned there is still no real consensus. And that may be reinforced by the fact they appear to be willing to deal down. If they had a conviction on Paye then I doubt they would be thinking of moving down as there is a real chance he could be gone even by 15.

Fact is you have a bunch of edges - Paye, Phillips, Rousseau, Ojulari, Collins etc - who are all pretty close. I know your source downplayed it a little - and if there is going to be any misinfo from the Giants this might be it - but I keep looking at Parsons when I do mocks. Just about everyone I talk to around the league will say quite unequivocably that he is THE best defensive player in this draft. And more than one has said second isn't even close. And i find it hard to believe that Judge didn't go to Happy Valley to see and meet for a up-close-and-personal perspective Parsons to find out for himself.

Time will tell.

yep. Went back last night to watch other evalutions and videos on Paye again and I noticed something that I’m taking as a sign at Paye’s pro day. Fast forward to the Bench press and look what you see. Kwity Paye Pro Day - ( New Window )


GD masks. Its looks like it might be Kyle O'Brien to me. Whoever it is he's getting a very god look. Actually shows up in the vertical too getting a real close-up look.
RE: When you factor in the reported pursuit of Leonard Floyd...  
ColHowPepper : 4/3/2021 2:21 pm : link
In comment 15208002 Klaatu said:
Quote:
With the uncertainty surrounding Carter and Ximines, it's easy to see why the Giants would be looking for a top-tier ER/OLB in this draft. I hope they can trade down and still get their man.
I agree getting an effective ER is a needed piece for the d. However, I am twofold confused: 1/I thought consensus is that this is a weak draft year for ER (i.e., don't push NEED to the center of the table); and 2/I think Klaatu is being kind to Carter and Ximines: they are mediocre players at their positions. If Graham and JJ are trying to push them as the ER solution, it's another 'Pio play.
RE: If things were to go right  
giantstock : 4/3/2021 2:29 pm : link
In comment 15208029 Giantimistic said:
Quote:
for the team and our free agents performed without getting injured, Jones takes the jump that it seems like the staff think he will take, the oline is solid as it sounds like the coaching staff thinks and the defense gets even better than last year then we will be competing in the playoffs.

I understand those are ifs, but there are a possibility. If that is all true, the one major thing this team is missing is an edge that can get to the passer on their own. Imagine if our secondary as good as it could be and we can get to the QB with 3 or 4 players.




Here's the catch and I'll use OL as an example: If you draft Slater for guard, and assuming everyone is right about RT being okay, you've just assured Giants of a running game. And if you have a running game - it means Jones will have time to pass. And now that they have a number 1 WR - their offense should be good.

And as for defense- you get your two best DL back, you added a little pass rush by getting two other OLB's back from injury and a FA pickup, and another FA pickup as ILB as a probable improvement to what they had. Along with you got a number 2 corner. And you have McKinney back for a full year. As a result your defense as of this moment should be at least as good (conservatively) as last year. And now you trade up for an Edge - haven’t you possibly made your team stronger overall because now your offense instead of being filled with as many "maybes" is a bit more assured of being good while still maintaining a good defense?

Slater is good enough to ensure your offense will be to a certain pretty good standard while now we have to hope two guard spots are okay. And you should prefer to try to win with balance rather be "very strong" say at defense and be just "decent" with offense, right? Try to achieve being good at both.
RE: RE: When you factor in the reported pursuit of Leonard Floyd...  
Klaatu : 4/3/2021 2:37 pm : link
In comment 15208361 ColHowPepper said:
Quote:
In comment 15208002 Klaatu said:


Quote:


With the uncertainty surrounding Carter and Ximines, it's easy to see why the Giants would be looking for a top-tier ER/OLB in this draft. I hope they can trade down and still get their man.

I agree getting an effective ER is a needed piece for the d. However, I am twofold confused: 1/I thought consensus is that this is a weak draft year for ER (i.e., don't push NEED to the center of the table); and 2/I think Klaatu is being kind to Carter and Ximines: they are mediocre players at their positions. If Graham and JJ are trying to push them as the ER solution, it's another 'Pio play.


Colin, I was referring to their injuries (I guess I should have been more specific). But, yeah, their play has been nothing to write home about. Both seem eminently upgradeable.
Sorry, CHP. I confused you with Colin..  
Klaatu : 4/3/2021 2:39 pm : link
.....
I wish I could say I resemble Colin  
ColHowPepper : 4/3/2021 2:46 pm : link
in any way, shape or form! Thank you!
RE: RE: If things were to go right  
GoDeep13 : 4/3/2021 2:48 pm : link
In comment 15208367 giantstock said:
Quote:
In comment 15208029 Giantimistic said:


Quote:


for the team and our free agents performed without getting injured, Jones takes the jump that it seems like the staff think he will take, the oline is solid as it sounds like the coaching staff thinks and the defense gets even better than last year then we will be competing in the playoffs.

I understand those are ifs, but there are a possibility. If that is all true, the one major thing this team is missing is an edge that can get to the passer on their own. Imagine if our secondary as good as it could be and we can get to the QB with 3 or 4 players.






Here's the catch and I'll use OL as an example: If you draft Slater for guard, and assuming everyone is right about RT being okay, you've just assured Giants of a running game. And if you have a running game - it means Jones will have time to pass. And now that they have a number 1 WR - their offense should be good.

And as for defense- you get your two best DL back, you added a little pass rush by getting two other OLB's back from injury and a FA pickup, and another FA pickup as ILB as a probable improvement to what they had. Along with you got a number 2 corner. And you have McKinney back for a full year. As a result your defense as of this moment should be at least as good (conservatively) as last year. And now you trade up for an Edge - haven’t you possibly made your team stronger overall because now your offense instead of being filled with as many "maybes" is a bit more assured of being good while still maintaining a good defense?

Slater is good enough to ensure your offense will be to a certain pretty good standard while now we have to hope two guard spots are okay. And you should prefer to try to win with balance rather be "very strong" say at defense and be just "decent" with offense, right? Try to achieve being good at both.
Well. As an exercise, which do you think works better?

1. Paye
2. Landon Dickerson/Wyatt Davis

Or

1. Slater
2. Carlos Basham?

I think you get the better EDGE prospect in the 1st scenario while still getting a very good IOL. Slater is a great prospect but if you believe you’ve got your tackles of the future (all indications are that is how the Giants feel about Thomas and Peart) then you drafted a Good Guard at 11 but he’s not Zach Martin, Nelson, or Brandon Scherff. As far as being a guard, is he really much better than Davis, Dickerson, or Cleveland?

Now, if the Giants weren’t sure about Thomas or Peart then I can see them wanting and OL that offers tackle insurance, but Slater wouldn’t match their profile for tackles. They drafted the two longest armed OTs in last year’s draft. Kept Solder who is a long OT, and had Cam Fleming as OT who is also very long. They’ve shown they value length at the OT position.
RE: Sorry, CHP. I confused you with Colin..  
Colin@gbn : 4/3/2021 2:56 pm : link
In comment 15208381 Klaatu said:
Quote:
.....


That's okay Klaat! Happens all the time.

Don't want to distract from Godeep's thread because its really interesting info. And its not hard to make the case why the Giants would be looking for edge rusher in this year's draft.
Talk to just about anyone around the NFL and they will tell you that the two things you pretty much need to be able to do to win a championship are you have to be able to throw the ball and you want to be able to rush the passer.

The Giants obviously feel they have enough pieces in place to at least find out whether in fact they can throw the ball effectively. Its been a while though since the Giants have been able to mount a consistent pass rush and they don't really have many people in place with the potential to get them there other than maybe Williams.

And I believe its part of trying to build a championship level team rather than just filling holes. In fact my guess is that even if the Giants did hit on an ER this year, my guess is that they would still be looking for more over the next 2-3 drafts. Remember that the team whose M.O. was 'you can never have enough pass rushers' hasn't used a first or second round pick on a DE/ER in over a decade. (JPP was the last in 2010.)
Go Deep--and we all appreciate these seasonal hats, for sure--  
ColHowPepper : 4/3/2021 2:58 pm : link
A problem I can easily foresee in your scenario above if the team goes ER/d at #11, it's a given that at 42 they go OL or WR. As the board on Day 2 plays out, it will be foreseeable to see a team jump the Giants or pick ahead at their need. Obviously this factor is ever-present in the draft, but at #11, there is less foreseeability what the Giants will do, especially if QBs go off the board in a bunch ahead of them.
But the real Colin makes a lot of sense, too  
ColHowPepper : 4/3/2021 3:01 pm : link
Colin, how do you rate this draft in terms of ER? A few good ones/blue chippers/red chippers at the top??? but not much good caliber after? Sorry if this has been covered.
RE: But the real Colin makes a lot of sense, too  
Colin@gbn : 4/3/2021 3:13 pm : link
In comment 15208402 ColHowPepper said:
Quote:
Colin, how do you rate this draft in terms of ER? A few good ones/blue chippers/red chippers at the top??? but not much good caliber after? Sorry if this has been covered.


Its an interesting class in that yeah you don't really have any sure thing DEs with top 5-10 potential. What you do appear to have is as many as a half dozen guys with at least some top 20 potential. So they aren't far off. And it is maybe why they might consider a trade down. And as I mentioned earlier, to me the tough call would be if Parsons is there and the Giants hadn't taken him off their board for character issues. Then you might very well run into the BPA thing.
GoDeep13  
YANKEE28 : 4/3/2021 3:15 pm : link
The other day you did a 1st round mock that confused me.

Your mock does not include Jayson Oweh going all 32 picks in Round One. That seems to contradict your other info.

Can you clarify?

RE: Garafolo was on The Huddle podcast  
Nomad Crow on the Madison : 4/3/2021 3:34 pm : link
In comment 15207629 aimrocky said:
Quote:
This week and guessed Gettelman goes with a “measurables” guy in the 1st. His guess was Rousseau. I’m guessing that’s why the buzz isn’t there with Slater.


Rousseau would be worse than Paye! He is a third round talent.
RE: RE: RE: If things were to go right  
giantstock : 4/3/2021 3:43 pm : link
In comment 15208390 GoDeep13 said:
Quote:
In comment 15208367 giantstock said:


Quote:


In comment 15208029 Giantimistic said:


Quote:


for the team and our free agents performed without getting injured, Jones takes the jump that it seems like the staff think he will take, the oline is solid as it sounds like the coaching staff thinks and the defense gets even better than last year then we will be competing in the playoffs.

I understand those are ifs, but there are a possibility. If that is all true, the one major thing this team is missing is an edge that can get to the passer on their own. Imagine if our secondary as good as it could be and we can get to the QB with 3 or 4 players.






Here's the catch and I'll use OL as an example: If you draft Slater for guard, and assuming everyone is right about RT being okay, you've just assured Giants of a running game. And if you have a running game - it means Jones will have time to pass. And now that they have a number 1 WR - their offense should be good.

And as for defense- you get your two best DL back, you added a little pass rush by getting two other OLB's back from injury and a FA pickup, and another FA pickup as ILB as a probable improvement to what they had. Along with you got a number 2 corner. And you have McKinney back for a full year. As a result your defense as of this moment should be at least as good (conservatively) as last year. And now you trade up for an Edge - haven’t you possibly made your team stronger overall because now your offense instead of being filled with as many "maybes" is a bit more assured of being good while still maintaining a good defense?

Slater is good enough to ensure your offense will be to a certain pretty good standard while now we have to hope two guard spots are okay. And you should prefer to try to win with balance rather be "very strong" say at defense and be just "decent" with offense, right? Try to achieve being good at both.

Well. As an exercise, which do you think works better?

1. Paye
2. Landon Dickerson/Wyatt Davis

Or

1. Slater
2. Carlos Basham?

I think you get the better EDGE prospect in the 1st scenario while still getting a very good IOL. Slater is a great prospect but if you believe you’ve got your tackles of the future (all indications are that is how the Giants feel about Thomas and Peart) then you drafted a Good Guard at 11 but he’s not Zach Martin, Nelson, or Brandon Scherff. As far as being a guard, is he really much better than Davis, Dickerson, or Cleveland?

Now, if the Giants weren’t sure about Thomas or Peart then I can see them wanting and OL that offers tackle insurance, but Slater wouldn’t match their profile for tackles. They drafted the two longest armed OTs in last year’s draft. Kept Solder who is a long OT, and had Cam Fleming as OT who is also very long. They’ve shown they value length at the OT position.


Slater is supposedly much better than any guards you mention is what I’ve read – is that Slater is going to be extremely good. I guess that is the catch. What you are hearing or what you think is that Slater isn't much better than the 2nd rounders vs taking an Edge at 11 vs getting one early 2nd round? OFC they are the experts and the best way to evaluate is wait a season or two etc.

I hope the Giants are right if they go through the course you mention. But I don’t feel the last 3 drafts with Barkley, Jones and Thomas the have been though. With Jones jury still out and maybe he can be really good. So maybe they nailed it and getting the QB right is everything. However jury still out.

But as for Thomas he was regarded as being 3rd best tackle after season-end, correct? They took the higher floor guy. Last year I thought he was 3rd best before the draft so needless to say I wasn’t enamored with the pick. Didn't "hate it." Just thought they could've done better.

And Barkley they took the high-floor guy destined to be Gold Jacket but as some have questioned for a rebuilding team and a position susceptible to get banged up early, he definitely has not been worth the 2nd overall pick.

As a result, I'm questioning their value/decisions on top-tier players. Therefore, I’m also questioning their view on Slater too. Am I wrong to question them on this based on the points I've just made?


This draft is gonna  
BigBlueCane : 4/3/2021 3:52 pm : link
tell a lot about who's got control in personnel control and preference.

Judge has a very different kind of player in mind from DG.
Colin, thank you  
ColHowPepper : 4/3/2021 4:04 pm : link
Giants once again are in the unenviable position of significant, roster changing need at more positions than they have high picks: OL, ER, WR, in some order.

giantstock (not that you asked me), I have zero issues with your skepticism, but a bit too early to pass final judgment on Thomas? Wirfs (at RT) and Wills certainly appeared to be better on balance last season, Becton at times too, health issues there. In retrospect, Barkley has turned out to be a very flawed pick; even before the fact, there were questions as to the wisdom of picking him at 2 overall. I hope JJ is inside Gettelman's heat and at the controls.
RE: Colin, thank you  
Colin@gbn : 4/3/2021 4:59 pm : link
In comment 15208436 ColHowPepper said:
Quote:
Giants once again are in the unenviable position of significant, roster changing need at more positions than they have high picks: OL, ER, WR, in some order.


Actually I tend to disagree a little bit. This draft has the potential to play nicely into the hands of the Giants. Whichever direction they go they are going to get a really good prospect in the first. Then the strengths on the second day and into the 3rd are WR, CB and OL, the positions they are probably looking at. Time will tell!
RE: For those concerned with Paye  
Nomad Crow on the Madison : 4/3/2021 5:07 pm : link
In comment 15207869 robbieballs2003 said:
Quote:
Watch this video on him setting the edge. I can 100% question our ability to set an edge right now with our current defenders. Right now that is the biggest weakness of our defense imo. Link - ( New Window )


That video was helpful. The kid has talent. And he is apparently a terrific young man, which is important. If only he can learn to rush the passer. I mean, if you are going to be an edge rusher... you better be able to rush.
Great post  
Brandon Walsh : 4/3/2021 5:26 pm : link
And thread all around.
RE: For those concerned with Paye  
Ten Ton Hammer : 4/3/2021 6:11 pm : link
In comment 15207869 robbieballs2003 said:
Quote:
Watch this video on him setting the edge. I can 100% question our ability to set an edge right now with our current defenders. Right now that is the biggest weakness of our defense imo. Link - ( New Window )


I would question why you think that. Right now the ends are Williams and likely Shelton. Paye isn't playing LB. We know Williams doesn't have a problem setting. On many plays Lawrence pushes outside. Shelton is a solid player.

Of the concerns with the defense, the bigger red flag to me is who's playing lineback in this 3-4 alignment.
RE: This draft is gonna  
fireitup77 : 4/3/2021 6:12 pm : link
In comment 15208431 BigBlueCane said:
Quote:
tell a lot about who's got control in personnel control and preference.

Judge has a very different kind of player in mind from DG.


Please explain.
RE: RE: For those concerned with Paye  
Angel Eyes : 4/3/2021 6:20 pm : link
In comment 15208490 Ten Ton Hammer said:
Quote:
In comment 15207869 robbieballs2003 said:


Quote:


Watch this video on him setting the edge. I can 100% question our ability to set an edge right now with our current defenders. Right now that is the biggest weakness of our defense imo. Link - ( New Window )



I would question why you think that. Right now the ends are Williams and likely Shelton. Paye isn't playing LB. We know Williams doesn't have a problem setting. On many plays Lawrence pushes outside. Shelton is a solid player.

Of the concerns with the defense, the bigger red flag to me is who's playing lineback in this 3-4 alignment.

The two ILBs are probably going to be Martinez and either Crowder or Ragland.
RE: RE: For those concerned with Paye  
jeff57 : 4/3/2021 6:25 pm : link
In comment 15208490 Ten Ton Hammer said:
Quote:
In comment 15207869 robbieballs2003 said:


Quote:


Watch this video on him setting the edge. I can 100% question our ability to set an edge right now with our current defenders. Right now that is the biggest weakness of our defense imo. Link - ( New Window )



I would question why you think that. Right now the ends are Williams and likely Shelton. Paye isn't playing LB. We know Williams doesn't have a problem setting. On many plays Lawrence pushes outside. Shelton is a solid player.

Of the concerns with the defense, the bigger red flag to me is who's playing lineback in this 3-4 alignment.

Shelton will be the NT.
fire  
BigBlueCane : 4/3/2021 6:32 pm : link
I think Judge prefers guys from schools that his staff has a connection with and he prefers guys from schools that play at a higher level of competition.

RE: RE: For those concerned with Paye  
Angel Eyes : 4/3/2021 6:38 pm : link
In comment 15208490 Ten Ton Hammer said:
Quote:
In comment 15207869 robbieballs2003 said:


Quote:


Watch this video on him setting the edge. I can 100% question our ability to set an edge right now with our current defenders. Right now that is the biggest weakness of our defense imo. Link - ( New Window )



I would question why you think that. Right now the ends are Williams and likely Shelton. Paye isn't playing LB. We know Williams doesn't have a problem setting. On many plays Lawrence pushes outside. Shelton is a solid player.

Of the concerns with the defense, the bigger red flag to me is who's playing lineback in this 3-4 alignment.

Well, OLB is going to be a bit of a puzzle. Carter and Ximines are both coming off injury (particularly Carter, who has failed to impress in three seasons), there’s questions as to Odenigbo is more of a 4-3 end or 3-4 rushbacker, and Brown, Coughlin, Lalos, and Anderson are unproven, particularly Lalos who only played in six games. For all we know (and not my favorite course of action since I’m a fan of the old-school way of getting pressure with four and dropping the rest into coverage), the Giants will roll with a 3-3-5 alignment with Lawrence and Williams at end and Shelton at nose tackle, Martinez at MIKE with a combo of Brown, Coughlin, Crowder, and Ragland rotating at the OLB spots depending on what’s needed (Judge and Graham are a fan of this method), and a defensive backfield of Bradberry, Peppers, McKinney, Ryan or Holmes at the slot/nickelback, and Jackson.
RE: Colin, thank you  
giantstock : 4/3/2021 6:46 pm : link
In comment 15208436 ColHowPepper said:
Quote:

giantstock (not that you asked me), I have zero issues with your skepticism, but a bit too early to pass final judgment on Thomas? Wirfs (at RT) and Wills certainly appeared to be better on balance last season, Becton at times too, health issues there. In retrospect, Barkley has turned out to be a very flawed pick; even before the fact, there were questions as to the wisdom of picking him at 2 overall. I hope JJ is inside Gettelman's heat and at the controls.


Thanks ColHow.

I just want to add I have a bias in that I despise Dave G. HOWEVER HOWEVER if the Giants to start to win I’ll change completely. Especially if it is more than 1 year etc. I’ll completely flip. I just want them to win.

So with that said- every one of the 3 picks DG has made previously of SB, DJ, and AT can become terrific overall. I am in no way writing them off – just saying I’m skeptical – though I am not skeptical of ATHomas being “good.”

All I was saying about AThomas is that in my view pre-draft I thought he was 3rd best but recognized through reading that he had highest floor. So that doesn’t mean I think he stinks or is average. Just a potential “missed opportunity” for someone I thought to be better. Anyway. if I thought he was 3rd best pre-draft and he was 3rd best after season 1, then naturally I’m still projecting he will be 3rd best. That is still okay however. But just “okay” instead of “wow – we nailed that.”

So far there hasn’t there has not been any “wows” from the DG 1st rd draft,- though only one clear bust. I just think if you get the high quality Guard, then that raises the chances that Barkley and Jones can become “wow.”

I just think Dave G is content on wanting to play 17-14 / 20-17 football. I think he has an opportunity for more while in round 2 (or trade up in round 1) to get his Edge.

Barkley running with less penetration imo makes him exponentially better. Same with Jones in a clean pocket and a running game. Then he could “manage the shit” out of the game. These are two enormous pieces that we rely on to play huge.

Why risk having to put it on Judge to have to radically coach up his young OL that weren’t that good last year- or draft a lesser guard in rd 2 (or later)? But ofc if Slater is not that highly valued then okay – pass on him. Or if Paye is projected to be a star early on year 1 or year 2– okay.
RE: RE: RE: For those concerned with Paye  
Ten Ton Hammer : 4/3/2021 6:59 pm : link
In comment 15208498 jeff57 said:
Quote:
In comment 15208490 Ten Ton Hammer said:


Quote:


In comment 15207869 robbieballs2003 said:


Quote:


Watch this video on him setting the edge. I can 100% question our ability to set an edge right now with our current defenders. Right now that is the biggest weakness of our defense imo. Link - ( New Window )



I would question why you think that. Right now the ends are Williams and likely Shelton. Paye isn't playing LB. We know Williams doesn't have a problem setting. On many plays Lawrence pushes outside. Shelton is a solid player.

Of the concerns with the defense, the bigger red flag to me is who's playing lineback in this 3-4 alignment.


Shelton will be the NT.



I could believe this. And that's even more a reason why they would have no need to draft Paye. You're not displacing Williams or Lawrence.
RE: RE: RE: RE: For those concerned with Paye  
jeff57 : 4/3/2021 7:11 pm : link
In comment 15208526 Ten Ton Hammer said:
Quote:
In comment 15208498 jeff57 said:


Quote:


In comment 15208490 Ten Ton Hammer said:


Quote:


In comment 15207869 robbieballs2003 said:


Quote:


Watch this video on him setting the edge. I can 100% question our ability to set an edge right now with our current defenders. Right now that is the biggest weakness of our defense imo. Link - ( New Window )



I would question why you think that. Right now the ends are Williams and likely Shelton. Paye isn't playing LB. We know Williams doesn't have a problem setting. On many plays Lawrence pushes outside. Shelton is a solid player.

Of the concerns with the defense, the bigger red flag to me is who's playing lineback in this 3-4 alignment.


Shelton will be the NT.




I could believe this. And that's even more a reason why they would have no need to draft Paye. You're not displacing Williams or Lawrence.


Paye has played 4-3 end. Has not played standing up. Doesn’t make a lot of sense.
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: For those concerned with Paye  
Angel Eyes : 4/3/2021 7:16 pm : link
In comment 15208540 jeff57 said:
Quote:
In comment 15208526 Ten Ton Hammer said:


Quote:


In comment 15208498 jeff57 said:


Quote:


In comment 15208490 Ten Ton Hammer said:


Quote:


In comment 15207869 robbieballs2003 said:


Quote:


Watch this video on him setting the edge. I can 100% question our ability to set an edge right now with our current defenders. Right now that is the biggest weakness of our defense imo. Link - ( New Window )



I would question why you think that. Right now the ends are Williams and likely Shelton. Paye isn't playing LB. We know Williams doesn't have a problem setting. On many plays Lawrence pushes outside. Shelton is a solid player.

Of the concerns with the defense, the bigger red flag to me is who's playing lineback in this 3-4 alignment.


Shelton will be the NT.




I could believe this. And that's even more a reason why they would have no need to draft Paye. You're not displacing Williams or Lawrence.



Paye has played 4-3 end. Has not played standing up. Doesn’t make a lot of sense.

A lot of teams ran with a four-lineman approach in the 80s, when the 3-4 was big, on passing downs; this includes the Giants where Curtis McGriff would sit and George Martin was the nickel rusher. With Judge and Graham, shouldn’t there be something for every occasion since Graham likes to mix and match players based on what they’re facing from the offense?
You don’t take a situational pass rusher at 11  
jeff57 : 4/3/2021 7:21 pm : link
.
RE: You don’t take a situational pass rusher at 11  
Angel Eyes : 4/3/2021 7:27 pm : link
In comment 15208552 jeff57 said:
Quote:
.

JPP was situational most of his rookie year since Osi Umenyiora started at RDE most of 2010 and I’m not sure what the Giants intended for Michael Strahan when they drafted him in the second round of ‘93 while they were still using the 3-4.

Anyways, why can’t the Giants use a 4-3 or a 4-2-5?
Crossing my fingers  
Thegratefulhead : 4/3/2021 7:45 pm : link
Jon is right about Waddle. He would have Smiths production at receiver plus the amazing return game. If we get Waddle the skill position weapons will be insane. Waddle is Ruggs fast but a football player. We well be able to put pressure on ever quadrant if the field even in the red zone.
Quality Edge Rushers  
WillVAB : 4/3/2021 8:21 pm : link
Are hard to find. They rarely hit FA now and when they do they cost a ton.

The Giants have ZERO quality ER’s. They have to roll the dice in the draft because that’s the only place they’re going to find them.
RE: RE: You don’t take a situational pass rusher at 11  
Ten Ton Hammer : 4/3/2021 8:39 pm : link
In comment 15208561 Angel Eyes said:
Quote:
In comment 15208552 jeff57 said:


Quote:


.


JPP was situational most of his rookie year since Osi Umenyiora started at RDE most of 2010 and I’m not sure what the Giants intended for Michael Strahan when they drafted him in the secondhttps://twitter.com/CorkGaines/status/1378472030744502273?s=19 round of ‘93 while they were still using the 3-4.

Anyways, why can’t the Giants use a 4-3 or a 4-2-5?


They use all kinds of sets now. The sticking point is you're using the 11th overall pick on a substitution player when you have an owner talking about needing to win more games and plenty of needs at other roster spots.
RE: RE: RE: You don’t take a situational pass rusher at 11  
Angel Eyes : 4/3/2021 8:41 pm : link
In comment 15208620 Ten Ton Hammer said:
Quote:
In comment 15208561 Angel Eyes said:


Quote:


In comment 15208552 jeff57 said:


Quote:


.


JPP was situational most of his rookie year since Osi Umenyiora started at RDE most of 2010 and I’m not sure what the Giants intended for Michael Strahan when they drafted him in the secondhttps://twitter.com/CorkGaines/status/1378472030744502273?s=19 round of ‘93 while they were still using the 3-4.

Anyways, why can’t the Giants use a 4-3 or a 4-2-5?



They use all kinds of sets now. The sticking point is you're using the 11th overall pick on a substitution player when you have an owner talking about needing to win more games and plenty of needs at other roster spots.

Well, I’d prefer getting an edge in the second or third rounds, but if the Giants are going for edge in the first, so be it.
RE: GoDeep13  
GoDeep13 : 4/3/2021 9:12 pm : link
In comment 15208409 YANKEE28 said:
Quote:
The other day you did a 1st round mock that confused me.

Your mock does not include Jayson Oweh going all 32 picks in Round One. That seems to contradict your other info.

Can you clarify?
I did the Mock before speaking with my sources. Also, once you get to 20-32 in a mock it’s pretty much all based on your own personal board. I don’t value Oweh that highly. I get wanting to get on the tools, but he seemed quite bleh in his game.
RE: RE: GoDeep13  
Angel Eyes : 4/3/2021 9:19 pm : link
In comment 15208637 GoDeep13 said:
Quote:
In comment 15208409 YANKEE28 said:


Quote:


The other day you did a 1st round mock that confused me.

Your mock does not include Jayson Oweh going all 32 picks in Round One. That seems to contradict your other info.

Can you clarify?


I did the Mock before speaking with my sources. Also, once you get to 20-32 in a mock it’s pretty much all based on your own personal board. I don’t value Oweh that highly. I get wanting to get on the tools, but he seemed quite bleh in his game.

His stats are even more suspect than Paye; in seven games in 2020 he didn’t record a sack.
RE: fire  
Zeke's Alibi : 4/3/2021 9:31 pm : link
In comment 15208500 BigBlueCane said:
Quote:
I think Judge prefers guys from schools that his staff has a connection with and he prefers guys from schools that play at a higher level of competition.


Any specific reason you believe this? There's only one year of draft history to go there and he has a ton of connections at big time college football programs. Drafting a guy from UGA and Alabama isn't that unusual. Did he have any connections to UConn, UCLA, or Oregon?
Looks like the Sewell contingency plan  
stoneman : 4/4/2021 7:39 am : link
will have to be accounted for now - with his less than stellar pro-day. Doesn't change the tape, but it only takes a team or two to start having cold feet and drop out of the top 10. Good news for the Giants either way.
Zeke  
BigBlueCane : 4/4/2021 9:09 am : link
in the past, everyone made the jokes about BC, Cuse, the U, etc.. for reasons.
I'm not Ok with Oweh at 11  
ATL_Giants : 4/4/2021 10:22 am : link
Late 1st round maybe. Great Blue North has him as their #2 DE... must be something their I don't recognize.
RE: I'm not Ok with Oweh at 11  
Klaatu : 4/4/2021 12:29 pm : link
In comment 15208947 ATL_Giants said:
Quote:
Late 1st round maybe. Great Blue North has him as their #2 DE... must be something their I don't recognize.


Well, Oweh is the highest-graded Edge at NFL.com, in fact he's graded higher than any DE, too, so there is that.
RE: RE: I'm not Ok with Oweh at 11  
jeff57 : 4/4/2021 12:43 pm : link
In comment 15209024 Klaatu said:
Quote:
In comment 15208947 ATL_Giants said:


Quote:


Late 1st round maybe. Great Blue North has him as their #2 DE... must be something their I don't recognize.



Well, Oweh is the highest-graded Edge at NFL.com, in fact he's graded higher than any DE, too, so there is that.


A pass rusher who had no sacks at 11? 🤔
RE: RE: RE: I'm not Ok with Oweh at 11  
Klaatu : 4/4/2021 12:58 pm : link
In comment 15209035 jeff57 said:
Quote:
In comment 15209024 Klaatu said:


Quote:


In comment 15208947 ATL_Giants said: Late 1st round maybe. Great Blue North has him as their #2 DE... must be something their I don't recognize.



Well, Oweh is the highest-graded Edge at NFL.com, in fact he's graded higher than any DE, too, so there is that.



A pass rusher who had no sacks at 11? 🤔


Well, as Chad Reuter wrote:
Quote:
Oweh flashed his talent as a redshirt freshman in 2019, accumulating five sacks and two forced fumbles in 13 games (one start) for the Nittany Lions. He did not record a sack in seven starts as a redshirt sophomore, but Big Ten coaches still voted him first-team all-conference after he recorded 38 tackles (6.5 for loss).


I'll admit that I'd prefer Oweh after a slight trade down, say with NE. His comp at NFL.com is Bud Dupree, who went #22 overall. Oweh is not a finished product by any means, but this was Lance Zierlein's assessment:

Quote:
Prototypical NFL build and some of the most exciting traits and explosiveness of any edge defender in this draft. Those features can't be taught but they can be coached up, so any concerns about his lack of polish at this stage should be tempered. He has dominant potential as a run defender with burst and range to upend back-side and play-side runs, turning them into short gains or losses. While he figures to stack up stats with sheer athleticism, he does lack eye discipline and feel for blocking schemes, which tends to derail his momentum at times. He's slow getting off the snap, which dulls the early advantage he should be able to generate with his wicked get-off as a rusher. At this point, the hand usage and overall rush plan are lacking, but he has the feet for inside counters, the power to pull rush and the bend to dip and run the rush arc with fury. It's not all there yet, but with more coaching and experience, Oweh has the ability to rate as a Pro Bowl rush linebacker with the ability to stick a hand in the ground if you need it.
Giants very likely to trade UP in the first 2 rounds  
Prude : 4/4/2021 1:04 pm : link
They have 83 players signed right now, before the draft, UDFAs, camp cuts etc. They have a fully fleshed out roster with no huge holes but desperately in need of game-breaking talent. They are in win-now mode, with Gettleman desperately needing a playoff berth.

All signs point towards them trading up early, likely from the 2nd round back into the 1st for the 5th year option. If Oweh is still on the board at 30 I think they are going to go hard after him.

Also a good chance they move up from 11 in front of the cowboys. In a year with a bunch of qbs going early there is going to be super-premium talent between 6-9. Wouldn't be surprised if they think there's a guy there that maked this team instantly better.

RE: Giants very likely to trade UP in the first 2 rounds  
UGADawgs7 : 4/4/2021 1:26 pm : link
In comment 15209045 Prude said:
Quote:
They have 83 players signed right now, before the draft, UDFAs, camp cuts etc. They have a fully fleshed out roster with no huge holes but desperately in need of game-breaking talent. They are in win-now mode, with Gettleman desperately needing a playoff berth.

All signs point towards them trading up early, likely from the 2nd round back into the 1st for the 5th year option. If Oweh is still on the board at 30 I think they are going to go hard after him.

Is this just a guess or do you have any info?
Also a good chance they move up from 11 in front of the cowboys. In a year with a bunch of qbs going early there is going to be super-premium talent between 6-9. Wouldn't be surprised if they think there's a guy there that maked this team instantly better.
Trade up with what ?  
blueblood : 4/4/2021 1:56 pm : link
they have 6 picks.
Are they not interested in Waddle?  
BestFeature : 4/4/2021 2:06 pm : link
I see people bringing him up but the OP doesn't mention him.
RE: Trade up with what ?  
Prude : 4/4/2021 3:14 pm : link
In comment 15209083 blueblood said:
Quote:
they have 6 picks.


Dude we used a 7th, relax.
RE: RE: Giants very likely to trade UP in the first 2 rounds  
Prude : 4/4/2021 3:17 pm : link

In comment 15209067 UGADawgs7 said:


Is this just a guess or do you have any info?
Quote:
In comment 15209045 Prude said:


Quote:


They have 83 players signed right now, before the draft, UDFAs, camp cuts etc. They have a fully fleshed out roster with no huge holes but desperately in need of game-breaking talent. They are in win-now mode, with Gettleman desperately needing a playoff berth.

All signs point towards them trading up early, likely from the 2nd round back into the 1st for the 5th year option. If Oweh is still on the board at 30 I think they are going to go hard after him.

Also a good chance they move up from 11 in front of the cowboys. In a year with a bunch of qbs going early there is going to be super-premium talent between 6-9. Wouldn't be surprised if they think there's a guy there that maked this team instantly better.




Just a guess based on circumstance and history
RE: Zeke  
Zeke's Alibi : 4/4/2021 3:19 pm : link
In comment 15208892 BigBlueCane said:
Quote:
in the past, everyone made the jokes about BC, Cuse, the U, etc.. for reasons.


True, I guess all coaches tend to draft players from programs they are somewhat familiar with.
Prude  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 4/4/2021 3:20 pm : link
We have 6 picks but we traded away our 5th and 7th. We have an extra 6th from the Cardinals.
RE: RE: Trade up with what ?  
blueblood : 4/4/2021 3:44 pm : link
In comment 15209127 Prude said:
Quote:
In comment 15209083 blueblood said:


Quote:


they have 6 picks.



Dude we used a 7th, relax.



I dont get the relax comment.. but be that as it may. The Giants dont have many picks that they can package to move up. They are more likely to trade down than move up.
The more I think about the OP, the more I think it’s logical and a  
Spider56 : 4/4/2021 3:59 pm : link
solid approach. (Though I still don’t get how this stuff leaks out). I can see Waddle or a Smith as #1 with a front seven guy next. The question is who. Look what Devin White did for the Bucs defense last year ... Can Collins be that guy?

Personally, I still hope they trade down and get another day 2 pick ... Maybe Collins (at 15), then a WR, G and TE on day 2 followed by another WR, G and RB (either of the Louisiana guys) on day 3.

Maybe they’ll shock us all, trade down with NE then unload Engram to get another pick on day 1.
RE: RE: RE: Trade up with what ?  
Prude : 4/4/2021 6:09 pm : link
In comment 15209141 blueblood said:
Quote:
In comment 15209127 Prude said:


Quote:


In comment 15209083 blueblood said:


Quote:


they have 6 picks.



Dude we used a 7th, relax.




I dont get the relax comment.. but be that as it may. The Giants dont have many picks that they can package to move up. They are more likely to trade down than move up.


Theyve got picks next year, theyve got engram. It's for sure a little eaier with some comp picks but you start with 7 and we have 6. You can move around if you want to.
Pick 11  
Lines of Scrimmage : 4/4/2021 7:08 pm : link
I like to see someone that can change the game. I mentioned before but kids have been playing WR going back 15 years. It is a fun position and they see the opportunity both for scholarships and the NFL.

Let's go impact D (Parsons). Fill the OL with the 2nd or 3rd and get ready to roll.

Whatever they do we just want to add a very good football player. We need them imo
RE: Appreciate the info  
Nomad Crow on the Madison : 4/4/2021 8:05 pm : link
In comment 15208068 AcesUp said:
Quote:
As stated by others, I don’t really see a scenario where they have to stand pat and take Edge at 11. At least 4-5 QBs should go before that pick, leading to one of Sewell, Pitts or the Bama WRs falling. If all those QBs don’t go before that pick then the Giants have the carrot to encourage a trade down with another team. I don’t see a big difference in the Edge the Giants can get at 11 vs the top of the 2nd round (or in a trade up like suggested). There’s a very good chance that Rousseau is sitting there at their 2nd pick if there’s any truth to recent draft chatter.


Have you watched Rousseau's film? He's not good.
RE: RE: For those concerned with Paye  
Nomad Crow on the Madison : 4/4/2021 8:14 pm : link
In comment 15208490 Ten Ton Hammer said:
Quote:
In comment 15207869 robbieballs2003 said:


Quote:


Watch this video on him setting the edge. I can 100% question our ability to set an edge right now with our current defenders. Right now that is the biggest weakness of our defense imo. Link - ( New Window )



I would question why you think that. Right now the ends are Williams and likely Shelton. Paye isn't playing LB. We know Williams doesn't have a problem setting. On many plays Lawrence pushes outside. Shelton is a solid player.

Of the concerns with the defense, the bigger red flag to me is who's playing lineback in this 3-4 alignment.


Shelton is not an edge defender. He is a nose tackle. He can play the 3-technique, but he is not an ER ever.
We tried potential many times  
Carl in CT : 4/4/2021 8:15 pm : link
Get players who can play with heart.
RE: RE: RE: For those concerned with Paye  
Ten Ton Hammer : 4/5/2021 10:14 am : link
In comment 15209259 Nomad Crow on the Madison said:




Shelton is not an edge defender. He is a nose tackle. He can play the 3-technique, but he is not an ER ever.

So our down edges are Lawrence and Williams. I'm good with that. Paye isn't a linebacker. So why are we looking at linemen edges at 11? Really shouldn't be.
RE: Not sure if 5 QBs will go before us but if they do  
Red Right Hand : 4/5/2021 12:34 pm : link
In comment 15208086 Chris684 said:
Quote:
5 QBs + Chase, Sewell, Surtain means one of Pitts, Smith or Waddle is there for us.

I have a feeling only 4 of the QBs go in front of us but drafts are weird. Who saw Clelin Ferrell going 4 to the Raiders 2 years ago?
and if it's Surtain who is there?
RE: Are they not interested in Waddle?  
GoDeep13 : 4/5/2021 1:23 pm : link
In comment 15209094 BestFeature said:
Quote:
I see people bringing him up but the OP doesn't mention him.
Only time Waddle was mentioned was me asking who they would take if both were on the board and the answer was “Smith is the one they really want.” I don’t know if that would mean over Pitts as well but it’s Smith over Waddle.
RE: RE: Are they not interested in Waddle?  
Mike in NY : 4/5/2021 1:59 pm : link
In comment 15209940 GoDeep13 said:
Quote:
In comment 15209094 BestFeature said:


Quote:


I see people bringing him up but the OP doesn't mention him.

Only time Waddle was mentioned was me asking who they would take if both were on the board and the answer was “Smith is the one they really want.” I don’t know if that would mean over Pitts as well but it’s Smith over Waddle.


I can definitely see Smith over Waddle if a team is not 100% sure on the medicals. I would not be shocked if Waddle falls further than expected on Draft Day unless he can work out prior.
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