He wasn't down on Jones. He said that Jones wasn't a finished product and that until he is, the upside is uncertain. He also said that Jones has all the traits you look for. He essentially said the same thing at the end about all of the QBs in this year's draft, talking about specific limitations of all of them including Lawrence.
But that's what the Giants are doing: giving him a chance. They didn't bring in a backup that could upset the apple cart, and they're unlikely to bring in anyone to truly compete for the starting job between now and August.
Jones is being given an opportunity he hasn't earned through his play on the field; I think this points to a mediocre record in 2021. I think it's a mistaken approach.
RE: RE: he was lukewarm at best when speaking of jones
But that's what the Giants are doing: giving him a chance. They didn't bring in a backup that could upset the apple cart, and they're unlikely to bring in anyone to truly compete for the starting job between now and August.
Jones is being given an opportunity he hasn't earned through his play on the field; I think this points to a mediocre record in 2021. I think it's a mistaken approach.
Who would have you brought in based on the current marketplace ?
When you answer be sure to factor in cap hit (in a flat cap year) - the opportunity cost of what that player would have cost versus what would have been sacrificed given our free agent signings and oh yeah - the player wanting to come here to “compete” versus the other opportunities afforded to the player on a one year deal and the potential that player would will be afforded in 2020 as free agent
But that's what the Giants are doing: giving him a chance. They didn't bring in a backup that could upset the apple cart, and they're unlikely to bring in anyone to truly compete for the starting job between now and August.
Jones is being given an opportunity he hasn't earned through his play on the field; I think this points to a mediocre record in 2021. I think it's a mistaken approach.
Who would have you brought in based on the current marketplace ?
When you answer be sure to factor in cap hit (in a flat cap year) - the opportunity cost of what that player would have cost versus what would have been sacrificed given our free agent signings and oh yeah - the player wanting to come here to “compete” versus the other opportunities afforded to the player on a one year deal and the potential that player would will be afforded in 2020 as free agent
But that's what the Giants are doing: giving him a chance. They didn't bring in a backup that could upset the apple cart, and they're unlikely to bring in anyone to truly compete for the starting job between now and August.
Jones is being given an opportunity he hasn't earned through his play on the field; I think this points to a mediocre record in 2021. I think it's a mistaken approach.
Who would have you brought in based on the current marketplace ?
When you answer be sure to factor in cap hit (in a flat cap year) - the opportunity cost of what that player would have cost versus what would have been sacrificed given our free agent signings and oh yeah - the player wanting to come here to “compete” versus the other opportunities afforded to the player on a one year deal and the potential that player would will be afforded in 2020 as free agent
Please say something dumb like Jacoby Brissett.
The Giants should’ve at least brought in a backup with talent given the fact that Jones is injury prone and misses games every year.
But that's what the Giants are doing: giving him a chance. They didn't bring in a backup that could upset the apple cart, and they're unlikely to bring in anyone to truly compete for the starting job between now and August.
Jones is being given an opportunity he hasn't earned through his play on the field; I think this points to a mediocre record in 2021. I think it's a mistaken approach.
Who would have you brought in based on the current marketplace ?
When you answer be sure to factor in cap hit (in a flat cap year) - the opportunity cost of what that player would have cost versus what would have been sacrificed given our free agent signings and oh yeah - the player wanting to come here to “compete” versus the other opportunities afforded to the player on a one year deal and the potential that player would will be afforded in 2020 as free agent
Please say something dumb like Jacoby Brissett.
The Giants should’ve at least brought in a backup with talent given the fact that Jones is injury prone and misses games every year.
that adding an unproveable QB controversy to an otherwise poor or injured Ol/RB and Wr/Te talent pool under a new coaching staff during a no preseason Covid year would have been a brilliant idea.
But that's what the Giants are doing: giving him a chance. They didn't bring in a backup that could upset the apple cart, and they're unlikely to bring in anyone to truly compete for the starting job between now and August.
Jones is being given an opportunity he hasn't earned through his play on the field; I think this points to a mediocre record in 2021. I think it's a mistaken approach.
Jones has been given nothing for 2 years..two of the worst offensive lines in football, handful of games with a banged up Barkley but majority of games without...2 straight years of having his number 1 receiver a rookie/2nd year 5th rounder who’d fight for a number 3WR role on competent football teams. Giants have been setting Jones up for failure from the outset...what have the Giants ever given Jones his first two years other than an opportunity to captain one of the most inept collection of offensive players in the NFL? I can only imagine trotting 2005 Eli out with the unit Jones played with last year, instead of plax, toomer, shockey, tiki and oline with a pulse..but Eli earned the right to play along with the likes of those players based on earning that right with his stellar 2004 campaign smh.
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: Jones shouldn't be given anything
hedged his bets on Adoree' Jackson. People are all over the place when evaluating him. The Giants need him to play at a high level given the money they threw at him.
Couldn’t agree more. I am less enthusiastic about that signing after hearing him. Seems like they paid a lot of money for someone they HOPE can get back to playing at a high level. I really hope that he works out for us.
But that's what the Giants are doing: giving him a chance. They didn't bring in a backup that could upset the apple cart, and they're unlikely to bring in anyone to truly compete for the starting job between now and August.
Jones is being given an opportunity he hasn't earned through his play on the field; I think this points to a mediocre record in 2021. I think it's a mistaken approach.
Jones has been given nothing for 2 years..two of the worst offensive lines in football, handful of games with a banged up Barkley but majority of games without...2 straight years of having his number 1 receiver a rookie/2nd year 5th rounder who’d fight for a number 3WR role on competent football teams. Giants have been setting Jones up for failure from the outset...what have the Giants ever given Jones his first two years other than an opportunity to captain one of the most inept collection of offensive players in the NFL? I can only imagine trotting 2005 Eli out with the unit Jones played with last year, instead of plax, toomer, shockey, tiki and oline with a pulse..but Eli earned the right to play along with the likes of those players based on earning that right with his stellar 2004 campaign smh.
So you agree Gettleman should have been fired for building one of the worst offensive teams in the NFL?
He's the same one that had said Josh Rosen was the best QB in his class and wasn't very impressed with Josh Allen. SO we're supposed to trust him about which non-QB to draft.
He certainly understands technique etc but he is not end-all be-all either.
To be fair, the Cardinals front office felt really good about Rosen as well, enough to make him the 10th overall pick.
Everyone misses, everyone. We're all making our best guesses here.
He's the same one that had said Josh Rosen was the best QB in his class and wasn't very impressed with Josh Allen. SO we're supposed to trust him about which non-QB to draft.
He certainly understands technique etc but he is not end-all be-all either.
If you're referring to the interview Cosell did with a Cleveland radio guy just prior to that "QB Draft" then that's not how I remember it.
While he did mention Rosen as his top choice (which he prefaced by saying, "if I had to choose...") he was not down on Allen. He said that teams will like different QBs depending upon their systems...and that Allen was more of an improvisor when a play breaks down
In any event, I certainly hope you're not suggesting that we should automatically dismiss Cosell's opinion just because he got one wrong a few years ago.
ALL pro talent evaluators get SOME picks wrong. It's the nature of that occupation. Or as George Young used to say (paraphrasing) "Drafting players is just like getting Christmas presents. You never know what you're going to get until you open the box."
All I said is he is not the end all be all.
And he wasn't impressed with Allen. HE spoke of how he liked accurate QB's and Allen was not. HE added just because he is more of a fan of accuracy others look for other things. SO he didn't say the guy stunk or avoid him etc. He makes it clear it depends on what the team is looking for.
He did have Josh Rosen number 1 though. And he was not high on Allen based on his preference. He didn't say Allen was going to stink.
I'd call calling Trubisky (29-21 record as a starter) garbage while suggesting we should believe in Jones (8-18 as a starter) trolling.
You want a sad truth? The sad truth is that if Jones were on the Eagles you'd be right there saying he sucks. And so would everyone else on this board.
but the guy doesn't use superlatives and just points out the guys weaknesses or strengths. In my experience listening to him and I know others have listened to more o him, he calls most QB's system QB's. That's what he called Jones.
hedged his bets on Adoree' Jackson. People are all over the place when evaluating him. The Giants need him to play at a high level given the money they threw at him.
Zack Rosenblatt of nj.com had a phenomenal article on Jackson,that traced his roots,his character,his athleticism,his dedication. Unfortunately,it's behind a paywall,so unless you get nj.com,you can't read it. After reading it,I'm all in on Jackson,as he seems to be the high character,extremely talented player that Judge wants on the Giants!
I'd call calling Trubisky (29-21 record as a starter) garbage while suggesting we should believe in Jones (8-18 as a starter) trolling.
You want a sad truth? The sad truth is that if Jones were on the Eagles you'd be right there saying he sucks. And so would everyone else on this board.
And they'd be right.
Yea it has nothing to do with the talent level. Remember the talk about Eli when the Chargers went 14-2 under Marty Schottenheimer? The Bears were considered a contender during Trubisky’s first few seasons. Did anyone say anything about the Giants talent level the past two years? Any playoff predictions?
I'd call calling Trubisky (29-21 record as a starter) garbage while suggesting we should believe in Jones (8-18 as a starter) trolling.
You want a sad truth? The sad truth is that if Jones were on the Eagles you'd be right there saying he sucks. And so would everyone else on this board.
And they'd be right.
Was Trubisky your answer ? Still waiting on that. Considering someone did the work for you.
(I already know the answer)
For a guy that preaches organizational process and doing things the right way. - you’re hilarious.
He puts the work in and at least is not just throwing opinions without showing why he things the way he does.
QB evaluation is exceptionally difficult and then a big part of it is the the coaching staff and team they play for.
Let's hope Jones plays better with a better team around him. If he plays pretty good they will give him more time. It is not like a QB will magically appear next year. Obviously, if he is just ok and has games that cost the Giants games (turnovers) then they will have to get aggressive finding a replacement. Some franchises have looked decades to find a game altering QB.
who aren't afflicted with the BBI epidemic called - "Dumb" - for rightfully pointing out that it is indeed dumb to castigate Cosell for liking Rosen as a QB out of UCLA.
Posters do that to other posters here almost everyday. They do the "call out" routine by digging up old posts where someone has opinion about a prospect that didn't work out. As if being wrong about a prospect automatically disqualifies you from ever again taking a position on any other prospect.
I'm hoping the CDC can eventually find a vaccine for Dumb; and many BBIers can have access to it. It would certainly help BBI discourse going forward...
I'd call calling Trubisky (29-21 record as a starter) garbage while suggesting we should believe in Jones (8-18 as a starter) trolling.
You want a sad truth? The sad truth is that if Jones were on the Eagles you'd be right there saying he sucks. And so would everyone else on this board.
And they'd be right.
If Jones was on the Eagles, he wouldn't have been 8-18 and the Eagles would have won the division handly..he would have had receivers that can catch, a TE that doesn't tip balls to the defense, and an offensive line.
I think he said that QB stats can be very misleading as a measure of the player, i.e., context (players and scheme around him) matters
Devonte: a bit stiff in the hips and built straight up and down even as he is quite elusive, sees him as an outlier and did not bother to mention him in his top receivers, until Schmelk brought Smith up; interesting
Lawrence: he said he gets 'scattershot' when pressure comes up the middle; long. He stopped short of saying he wouldn't be his #1 QB, but I caught possible implication that Wilson might be his. Very high on Trask as pure passer and a guy who can play under center and do well w/play actionL praised his ability to go play action/back to the d and whips his head around and see the field well. Not high on Mac Jones. Likes Fields.
The Anderson comment was music to our ears.
Said there was only one ER who would fall w/i his top 11: Phillips has baggage.
Slater: Giants have to go with Thomas and Peart ("you can't draft a guy in the 3rd and not play him"), so if an OT is 'only'9th on your overall board, the Giants can't take him at 11.
I'm sure I'm the only one here who finds Schmelk to sound like a breathless teenager trotting out his questions, but the content was good and seems as though he's got a bit of a relationship with Cosell, so all good.
Klaatu: thank you for undressing pretensions of Producer (who must have attended Terps' 'school of hate for DJ') and BSIMatt and Bill2 nominations for posts of the year.
He does a weekly spot on Ross Tucker football podcast and it’s great. He’s very humble and unassuming. Often says how he doesn’t get into off field stuff because he’s just a film guy. Really like listening to him and learn a lot about the game. He’s been watching film for a long time. RT is terrific too.
RE: RE: he was lukewarm at best when speaking of jones
who aren't afflicted with the BBI epidemic called - "Dumb" - for rightfully pointing out that it is indeed dumb to castigate Cosell for liking Rosen as a QB out of UCLA.
Posters do that to other posters here almost everyday. They do the "call out" routine by digging up old posts where someone has opinion about a prospect that didn't work out. As if being wrong about a prospect automatically disqualifies you from ever again taking a position on any other prospect.
I'm hoping the CDC can eventually find a vaccine for Dumb; and many BBIers can have access to it. It would certainly help BBI discourse going forward...
Great. I guess next time when one of us criticizes Dave Gettleman and it gets thrown back in our face that we aren't a scout and DG is - you'd agree with them too that we can't go back in a prior time and criticize DG in any manner.
My post about Cosell was very mild. We can get reminded on here that SY is not perfect (I've agreed with SY and sent posts saying so only to get thrown back in my face that SY is not perfect) and not much is said about that.
But I say similar to Cosell vs we criticize DG or someone nitpicking SY and it's "How dare I?"
Any of Brissett, Mariota, or Taylor made sense as targets
But that would probably have invited calls for a change a couple weeks in.
I don't hate Jones. I just hate watching the Giants lose, and Jones does a lot of things that contribute to the Giants losing.
I'm perplexed at the animosity towards having a better backup. Jones should easily beat those guys out. That's not 'real' competition unless Jones badly struggles during multiple regular season games.
but the guy doesn't use superlatives and just points out the guys weaknesses or strengths. In my experience listening to him and I know others have listened to more o him, he calls most QB's system QB's. That's what he called Jones.
I'm as sensitive as anyone to Jones criticism but I'm completely shocked how negatively what he said about Jones was taken. He basically said RIGHT NOW entering his third season Jones is a system QB and we'll have to see if he becomes more. How many QBs in the history of the NFL were more than system QBs coming into the third season? He didn't say that's all he'll ever be either. This is such a non-story.
RE: Any of Brissett, Mariota, or Taylor made sense as targets
But that would probably have invited calls for a change a couple weeks in.
I don't hate Jones. I just hate watching the Giants lose, and Jones does a lot of things that contribute to the Giants losing.
Please listen.
Judge said, "Don't tell me what a player can't do."
That was nice hear. I have "heard" a lot good shit from coaches. I give no fucks for what they say anymore.
You know what Jones has been doing consistently since a Freshman at Duke?
Make tight window throws because his players at Duke didn't get open.
The one thing Jones has done since coming to the Giants?
Make accurate tight window throws down the field. Some QBs won't make those throws. Jones has a history of throwing them.
What is Golloday great at?
I will wait.
What is Rudolph good at?
They aren't done.
The decisions just got a lot easier for Jones. Add one of the elite skill position players routinely projected to the Giants and it is going to much better than average.
Chill out Terps.
Judge sees what Jones can do well and can exploit it.
He's the same one that had said Josh Rosen was the best QB in his class and wasn't very impressed with Josh Allen. SO we're supposed to trust him about which non-QB to draft.
The part about not trusting Cosell because of his Rosen evaluation seems harsh.
Which evaluator's judgment do you trust these days?
christian said this on another thread better than I could; I hope he doesn't mind me quoting him here:
Quote:
.
christian : 12:27 pm : link : reply
It's always about roster architecture. The Giants have a win now defense, with a bunch of 2nd contract, prime players on 2-3 year deals.
The offense is currently counting on:
- Jones bouncing back from an 11 TD, 14 start season
- Barkley bouncing back from a torn ACL
- Golladay bouncing back from a mysterious 9 week hip strain
- An UDFA, 5th round, 3rd round, and veteran bust contributing to the offensive line
If much of that turns out in the Giants favor, and they are competing for a championship over the next few years, I'll be happy to give Rabbit Foot Dave his credit.
Jones is being given an opportunity he hasn't earned through his play on the field; I think this points to a mediocre record in 2021. I think it's a mistaken approach.
Quote:
at best.. but mention that and some people lose their minds.
Personally, I can't remember one time where someone on BBI lost their mind over anyone simply being lukewarm about D. Jones.
Jones is being given an opportunity he hasn't earned through his play on the field; I think this points to a mediocre record in 2021. I think it's a mistaken approach.
Who would have you brought in based on the current marketplace ?
When you answer be sure to factor in cap hit (in a flat cap year) - the opportunity cost of what that player would have cost versus what would have been sacrificed given our free agent signings and oh yeah - the player wanting to come here to “compete” versus the other opportunities afforded to the player on a one year deal and the potential that player would will be afforded in 2020 as free agent
Please say something dumb like Jacoby Brissett.
Quote:
But that's what the Giants are doing: giving him a chance. They didn't bring in a backup that could upset the apple cart, and they're unlikely to bring in anyone to truly compete for the starting job between now and August.
Jones is being given an opportunity he hasn't earned through his play on the field; I think this points to a mediocre record in 2021. I think it's a mistaken approach.
Who would have you brought in based on the current marketplace ?
When you answer be sure to factor in cap hit (in a flat cap year) - the opportunity cost of what that player would have cost versus what would have been sacrificed given our free agent signings and oh yeah - the player wanting to come here to “compete” versus the other opportunities afforded to the player on a one year deal and the potential that player would will be afforded in 2020 as free agent
Please say something dumb like Jacoby Brissett.
2022**** as a free agent
Quote:
But that's what the Giants are doing: giving him a chance. They didn't bring in a backup that could upset the apple cart, and they're unlikely to bring in anyone to truly compete for the starting job between now and August.
Jones is being given an opportunity he hasn't earned through his play on the field; I think this points to a mediocre record in 2021. I think it's a mistaken approach.
Who would have you brought in based on the current marketplace ?
When you answer be sure to factor in cap hit (in a flat cap year) - the opportunity cost of what that player would have cost versus what would have been sacrificed given our free agent signings and oh yeah - the player wanting to come here to “compete” versus the other opportunities afforded to the player on a one year deal and the potential that player would will be afforded in 2020 as free agent
Please say something dumb like Jacoby Brissett.
The Giants should’ve at least brought in a backup with talent given the fact that Jones is injury prone and misses games every year.
Quote:
In comment 15208458 Go Terps said:
Quote:
But that's what the Giants are doing: giving him a chance. They didn't bring in a backup that could upset the apple cart, and they're unlikely to bring in anyone to truly compete for the starting job between now and August.
Jones is being given an opportunity he hasn't earned through his play on the field; I think this points to a mediocre record in 2021. I think it's a mistaken approach.
Who would have you brought in based on the current marketplace ?
When you answer be sure to factor in cap hit (in a flat cap year) - the opportunity cost of what that player would have cost versus what would have been sacrificed given our free agent signings and oh yeah - the player wanting to come here to “compete” versus the other opportunities afforded to the player on a one year deal and the potential that player would will be afforded in 2020 as free agent
Please say something dumb like Jacoby Brissett.
The Giants should’ve at least brought in a backup with talent given the fact that Jones is injury prone and misses games every year.
Who ?
The Giants should’ve at least brought in a backup with talent given the fact that Jones is injury prone and misses games every year.
Who do you suggest they should have added instead of Glennon?
I think this was the weakness of teams which have had QB controversies.
They tried it with 2 and got nowhere.
We should do it with 4
Something is bound to happen if we do
Quote:
The Giants should’ve at least brought in a backup with talent given the fact that Jones is injury prone and misses games every year.
Who do you suggest they should have added instead of Glennon?
Trubisky.
Quote:
In comment 15208494 WillVAB said:
Quote:
The Giants should’ve at least brought in a backup with talent given the fact that Jones is injury prone and misses games every year.
Who do you suggest they should have added instead of Glennon?
Trubisky.
Trubisky is garbage. :)
Give it a fucking rest already
I do agree that Trubisky isn't particularly good, of that makes you feel better.
I do agree that Trubisky isn't particularly good, of that makes you feel better.
Last conversation ever with you on Jones, until after the coming season:
Trubisky has played 5 seasons, Jones 2...He’s played twice as many games as Jones..I’m done.
Jones is being given an opportunity he hasn't earned through his play on the field; I think this points to a mediocre record in 2021. I think it's a mistaken approach.
Jones has been given nothing for 2 years..two of the worst offensive lines in football, handful of games with a banged up Barkley but majority of games without...2 straight years of having his number 1 receiver a rookie/2nd year 5th rounder who’d fight for a number 3WR role on competent football teams. Giants have been setting Jones up for failure from the outset...what have the Giants ever given Jones his first two years other than an opportunity to captain one of the most inept collection of offensive players in the NFL? I can only imagine trotting 2005 Eli out with the unit Jones played with last year, instead of plax, toomer, shockey, tiki and oline with a pulse..but Eli earned the right to play along with the likes of those players based on earning that right with his stellar 2004 campaign smh.
Quote:
In comment 15208494 WillVAB said:
Quote:
The Giants should’ve at least brought in a backup with talent given the fact that Jones is injury prone and misses games every year.
Who do you suggest they should have added instead of Glennon?
Trubisky.
I wanted Trubisky also but I expected him to make a lot more. IIRC he took less money to go to Buffalo so it doesn't matter.
Quote:
In comment 15208559 Jay on the Island said:
Quote:
In comment 15208494 WillVAB said:
Quote:
The Giants should’ve at least brought in a backup with talent given the fact that Jones is injury prone and misses games every year.
Who do you suggest they should have added instead of Glennon?
Trubisky.
Trubisky is garbage. :)
Trubisky gives you a chance to win some games when Jones inevitably misses 4+ games for something. Glennon is pure shit.
Quote:
In comment 15208564 WillVAB said:
Quote:
In comment 15208559 Jay on the Island said:
Quote:
In comment 15208494 WillVAB said:
Quote:
The Giants should’ve at least brought in a backup with talent given the fact that Jones is injury prone and misses games every year.
Who do you suggest they should have added instead of Glennon?
Trubisky.
Trubisky is garbage. :)
Trubisky gives you a chance to win some games when Jones inevitably misses 4+ games for something. Glennon is pure shit.
What I don’t understand, is why Trubisky would sign with Buffalo? If you’re trying to revitalize a career, is Buffalo the place to do that?
Quote:
In comment 15208566 Big Blue '56 said:
Quote:
In comment 15208564 WillVAB said:
Quote:
In comment 15208559 Jay on the Island said:
Quote:
In comment 15208494 WillVAB said:
Quote:
The Giants should’ve at least brought in a backup with talent given the fact that Jones is injury prone and misses games every year.
Who do you suggest they should have added instead of Glennon?
Trubisky.
Trubisky is garbage. :)
Trubisky gives you a chance to win some games when Jones inevitably misses 4+ games for something. Glennon is pure shit.
What I don’t understand, is why Trubisky would sign with Buffalo? If you’re trying to revitalize a career, is Buffalo the place to do that?
No idea. Maybe that was the only offer? The first offer? Maybe he wants a year to learn with no pressure?
Couldn’t agree more. I am less enthusiastic about that signing after hearing him. Seems like they paid a lot of money for someone they HOPE can get back to playing at a high level. I really hope that he works out for us.
Quote:
But that's what the Giants are doing: giving him a chance. They didn't bring in a backup that could upset the apple cart, and they're unlikely to bring in anyone to truly compete for the starting job between now and August.
Jones is being given an opportunity he hasn't earned through his play on the field; I think this points to a mediocre record in 2021. I think it's a mistaken approach.
Jones has been given nothing for 2 years..two of the worst offensive lines in football, handful of games with a banged up Barkley but majority of games without...2 straight years of having his number 1 receiver a rookie/2nd year 5th rounder who’d fight for a number 3WR role on competent football teams. Giants have been setting Jones up for failure from the outset...what have the Giants ever given Jones his first two years other than an opportunity to captain one of the most inept collection of offensive players in the NFL? I can only imagine trotting 2005 Eli out with the unit Jones played with last year, instead of plax, toomer, shockey, tiki and oline with a pulse..but Eli earned the right to play along with the likes of those players based on earning that right with his stellar 2004 campaign smh.
So you agree Gettleman should have been fired for building one of the worst offensive teams in the NFL?
It is what it is.
If Daniel has a decent year.
They both likely stay.
Probably gonna happen.
You know it.
It is why some of you are pantsing yourselves in numerous threads
He certainly understands technique etc but he is not end-all be-all either.
To be fair, the Cardinals front office felt really good about Rosen as well, enough to make him the 10th overall pick.
Everyone misses, everyone. We're all making our best guesses here.
It is what it is.
If Daniel has a decent year.
They both likely stay.
Probably gonna happen.
You know it.
It is why some of you are pantsing yourselves in numerous threads
Damn right. We all know it’ll happen, and I hope it does
Full blown troll status at this point.
what a fucking moron.
Quote:
He's the same one that had said Josh Rosen was the best QB in his class and wasn't very impressed with Josh Allen. SO we're supposed to trust him about which non-QB to draft.
He certainly understands technique etc but he is not end-all be-all either.
If you're referring to the interview Cosell did with a Cleveland radio guy just prior to that "QB Draft" then that's not how I remember it.
While he did mention Rosen as his top choice (which he prefaced by saying, "if I had to choose...") he was not down on Allen. He said that teams will like different QBs depending upon their systems...and that Allen was more of an improvisor when a play breaks down
In any event, I certainly hope you're not suggesting that we should automatically dismiss Cosell's opinion just because he got one wrong a few years ago.
ALL pro talent evaluators get SOME picks wrong. It's the nature of that occupation. Or as George Young used to say (paraphrasing) "Drafting players is just like getting Christmas presents. You never know what you're going to get until you open the box."
All I said is he is not the end all be all.
And he wasn't impressed with Allen. HE spoke of how he liked accurate QB's and Allen was not. HE added just because he is more of a fan of accuracy others look for other things. SO he didn't say the guy stunk or avoid him etc. He makes it clear it depends on what the team is looking for.
He did have Josh Rosen number 1 though. And he was not high on Allen based on his preference. He didn't say Allen was going to stink.
That's all I'm saying. - he is not The Gospel.
Quote:
then Jones is radioactive waste.
Full blown troll status at this point.
what a fucking moron.
I'd call calling Trubisky (29-21 record as a starter) garbage while suggesting we should believe in Jones (8-18 as a starter) trolling.
You want a sad truth? The sad truth is that if Jones were on the Eagles you'd be right there saying he sucks. And so would everyone else on this board.
And they'd be right.
Zack Rosenblatt of nj.com had a phenomenal article on Jackson,that traced his roots,his character,his athleticism,his dedication. Unfortunately,it's behind a paywall,so unless you get nj.com,you can't read it. After reading it,I'm all in on Jackson,as he seems to be the high character,extremely talented player that Judge wants on the Giants!
Quote:
In comment 15208576 Go Terps said:
Quote:
then Jones is radioactive waste.
Full blown troll status at this point.
what a fucking moron.
I'd call calling Trubisky (29-21 record as a starter) garbage while suggesting we should believe in Jones (8-18 as a starter) trolling.
You want a sad truth? The sad truth is that if Jones were on the Eagles you'd be right there saying he sucks. And so would everyone else on this board.
And they'd be right.
Yea it has nothing to do with the talent level. Remember the talk about Eli when the Chargers went 14-2 under Marty Schottenheimer? The Bears were considered a contender during Trubisky’s first few seasons. Did anyone say anything about the Giants talent level the past two years? Any playoff predictions?
Why wasn’t this pursued? His new Raiders contract was $3.5mm so it’s very affordable.
Quote:
In comment 15208576 Go Terps said:
Quote:
then Jones is radioactive waste.
Full blown troll status at this point.
what a fucking moron.
I'd call calling Trubisky (29-21 record as a starter) garbage while suggesting we should believe in Jones (8-18 as a starter) trolling.
You want a sad truth? The sad truth is that if Jones were on the Eagles you'd be right there saying he sucks. And so would everyone else on this board.
And they'd be right.
Was Trubisky your answer ? Still waiting on that. Considering someone did the work for you.
(I already know the answer)
For a guy that preaches organizational process and doing things the right way. - you’re hilarious.
Btw I can’t fuckkng stand Gettleman
This
QB evaluation is exceptionally difficult and then a big part of it is the the coaching staff and team they play for.
Let's hope Jones plays better with a better team around him. If he plays pretty good they will give him more time. It is not like a QB will magically appear next year. Obviously, if he is just ok and has games that cost the Giants games (turnovers) then they will have to get aggressive finding a replacement. Some franchises have looked decades to find a game altering QB.
Posters do that to other posters here almost everyday. They do the "call out" routine by digging up old posts where someone has opinion about a prospect that didn't work out. As if being wrong about a prospect automatically disqualifies you from ever again taking a position on any other prospect.
I'm hoping the CDC can eventually find a vaccine for Dumb; and many BBIers can have access to it. It would certainly help BBI discourse going forward...
Quote:
In comment 15208576 Go Terps said:
Quote:
then Jones is radioactive waste.
Full blown troll status at this point.
what a fucking moron.
I'd call calling Trubisky (29-21 record as a starter) garbage while suggesting we should believe in Jones (8-18 as a starter) trolling.
You want a sad truth? The sad truth is that if Jones were on the Eagles you'd be right there saying he sucks. And so would everyone else on this board.
And they'd be right.
If Jones was on the Eagles, he wouldn't have been 8-18 and the Eagles would have won the division handly..he would have had receivers that can catch, a TE that doesn't tip balls to the defense, and an offensive line.
what caught my ears, which are often wrong:
I think he said that QB stats can be very misleading as a measure of the player, i.e., context (players and scheme around him) matters
Devonte: a bit stiff in the hips and built straight up and down even as he is quite elusive, sees him as an outlier and did not bother to mention him in his top receivers, until Schmelk brought Smith up; interesting
Lawrence: he said he gets 'scattershot' when pressure comes up the middle; long. He stopped short of saying he wouldn't be his #1 QB, but I caught possible implication that Wilson might be his. Very high on Trask as pure passer and a guy who can play under center and do well w/play actionL praised his ability to go play action/back to the d and whips his head around and see the field well. Not high on Mac Jones. Likes Fields.
The Anderson comment was music to our ears.
Said there was only one ER who would fall w/i his top 11: Phillips has baggage.
Slater: Giants have to go with Thomas and Peart ("you can't draft a guy in the 3rd and not play him"), so if an OT is 'only'9th on your overall board, the Giants can't take him at 11.
I'm sure I'm the only one here who finds Schmelk to sound like a breathless teenager trotting out his questions, but the content was good and seems as though he's got a bit of a relationship with Cosell, so all good.
Klaatu: thank you for undressing pretensions of Producer (who must have attended Terps' 'school of hate for DJ') and BSIMatt and Bill2 nominations for posts of the year.
Quote:
.
Why would he be otherwise? It's not like Jones lit it up last year. Still, I took his evaluation more like "the jury is still out," which is fair.
This is how I heard it as well. Seemed reasonable. I wanted a little more Jones discussion (maybe he's done it elsewhere).
Posters do that to other posters here almost everyday. They do the "call out" routine by digging up old posts where someone has opinion about a prospect that didn't work out. As if being wrong about a prospect automatically disqualifies you from ever again taking a position on any other prospect.
I'm hoping the CDC can eventually find a vaccine for Dumb; and many BBIers can have access to it. It would certainly help BBI discourse going forward...
Great. I guess next time when one of us criticizes Dave Gettleman and it gets thrown back in our face that we aren't a scout and DG is - you'd agree with them too that we can't go back in a prior time and criticize DG in any manner.
My post about Cosell was very mild. We can get reminded on here that SY is not perfect (I've agreed with SY and sent posts saying so only to get thrown back in my face that SY is not perfect) and not much is said about that.
But I say similar to Cosell vs we criticize DG or someone nitpicking SY and it's "How dare I?"
I don't hate Jones. I just hate watching the Giants lose, and Jones does a lot of things that contribute to the Giants losing.
I don't hate Jones. I just hate watching the Giants lose, and Jones does a lot of things that contribute to the Giants losing.
I'm perplexed at the animosity towards having a better backup. Jones should easily beat those guys out. That's not 'real' competition unless Jones badly struggles during multiple regular season games.
I'm as sensitive as anyone to Jones criticism but I'm completely shocked how negatively what he said about Jones was taken. He basically said RIGHT NOW entering his third season Jones is a system QB and we'll have to see if he becomes more. How many QBs in the history of the NFL were more than system QBs coming into the third season? He didn't say that's all he'll ever be either. This is such a non-story.
I don't hate Jones. I just hate watching the Giants lose, and Jones does a lot of things that contribute to the Giants losing.
Judge said, "Don't tell me what a player can't do."
That was nice hear. I have "heard" a lot good shit from coaches. I give no fucks for what they say anymore.
You know what Jones has been doing consistently since a Freshman at Duke?
Make tight window throws because his players at Duke didn't get open.
The one thing Jones has done since coming to the Giants?
Make accurate tight window throws down the field. Some QBs won't make those throws. Jones has a history of throwing them.
What is Golloday great at?
I will wait.
What is Rudolph good at?
They aren't done.
The decisions just got a lot easier for Jones. Add one of the elite skill position players routinely projected to the Giants and it is going to much better than average.
Chill out Terps.
Judge sees what Jones can do well and can exploit it.
The have delivered perfect schematic fits.
The part about not trusting Cosell because of his Rosen evaluation seems harsh.
Which evaluator's judgment do you trust these days?
christian : 12:27 pm : link : reply
It's always about roster architecture. The Giants have a win now defense, with a bunch of 2nd contract, prime players on 2-3 year deals.
The offense is currently counting on:
- Jones bouncing back from an 11 TD, 14 start season
- Barkley bouncing back from a torn ACL
- Golladay bouncing back from a mysterious 9 week hip strain
- An UDFA, 5th round, 3rd round, and veteran bust contributing to the offensive line
If much of that turns out in the Giants favor, and they are competing for a championship over the next few years, I'll be happy to give Rabbit Foot Dave his credit.