I have to preface this by saying I don’t like the Niners. Outside of the division, they would be my least liked franchise by a lot. Obviously the NYG-SF rivalry has had a lot of history. I also think Shanahan & Lynch have been anointed by the NFL media prematurely. I understand they reached the Super Bowl in 2019, but they’ve had plenty of misses in the draft. The Garoppolo contract looks questionable at best as well.
If you believe the rumors, Mac Jones may be the pick for them at #3. If that’s the case, the Niners would have traded up from #12 to #3 and mortgaged their 2022 & 2023 first rounders to do so.
I admit, if they like Mac that much, I have no issue with it. I also felt the entire argument that the Giants could have gotten Daniel Jones at 17 to be overblown. The Giants wanted to guarantee they got Jones at 6, and the Niners would be doing the same here at #3. If a team loves a QB, it’s best not to play games.
I’m curious what people think of this.
I'm starting to think that Shanahan loves the idea of molding a superior talent like Fields or Lance
Agree, i just can't see them passing on Lance or Fields,but what do i know.
I think the 9ers are going to get Zack Wilson because the Jets are going to wise-up and take Fields, who has the body type to hold up in a more dual-threat system deployed by Mike LaFleur. And Fields has just played more big games on the biggest stage compared to Wilson. So I think he'll be able to hit the ground running...Wilson will take take time.
You think the Jets are passing on Wilson? If this was a smokescreen wouldn't it be for Fields and not Jones?
Having receivers like Smith and Waddle who are constantly open make reading the field a less daunting task. You probably don't need to get to your 4th read very often :)
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who benefitted by the genius play-calling of Steve Sarkisian and six players on that offense who are going to get drafted in three weeks. But I can't believe he's even being considered for the first round, let alone a top five target. So the 9ers are either (1) seeing something in his ability that most outside of Alabama don't see or (2) they are using Jones as the smoke screen for Fields or Lance, two more physically gifted prospects by far.
I think the 9ers are going to get Zack Wilson because the Jets are going to wise-up and take Fields, who has the body type to hold up in a more dual-threat system deployed by Mike LaFleur. And Fields has just played more big games on the biggest stage compared to Wilson. So I think he'll be able to hit the ground running...Wilson will take take time.
You think the Jets are passing on Wilson? If this was a smokescreen wouldn't it be for Fields and not Jones?
Yes, my best guess is the Jets are going with the blue blood talent in Fields for the reasons stated.
On the 9ers, I think they are still trying to rank out Fields, Lance, and Wilson. Fields and Lance are having their second pro days this week and that's going to help them set their board between the three. And will have to have a plan if Fields goes to the Jets and they are left with a choice between Lance and Wilson. That could be a toss-up, too, btw...
A couple of months back I posted that I saw him fitting in Pittsburgh or New England. Still feel that. He had two exceptional wide receivers who reeled in some of his erratic passes.
Jones?
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In comment 15217330 bw in dc said:
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who benefitted by the genius play-calling of Steve Sarkisian and six players on that offense who are going to get drafted in three weeks. But I can't believe he's even being considered for the first round, let alone a top five target. So the 9ers are either (1) seeing something in his ability that most outside of Alabama don't see or (2) they are using Jones as the smoke screen for Fields or Lance, two more physically gifted prospects by far.
I think the 9ers are going to get Zack Wilson because the Jets are going to wise-up and take Fields, who has the body type to hold up in a more dual-threat system deployed by Mike LaFleur. And Fields has just played more big games on the biggest stage compared to Wilson. So I think he'll be able to hit the ground running...Wilson will take take time.
You think the Jets are passing on Wilson? If this was a smokescreen wouldn't it be for Fields and not Jones?
Yes, my best guess is the Jets are going with the blue blood talent in Fields for the reasons stated.
On the 9ers, I think they are still trying to rank out Fields, Lance, and Wilson. Fields and Lance are having their second pro days this week and that's going to help them set their board between the three. And will have to have a plan if Fields goes to the Jets and they are left with a choice between Lance and Wilson. That could be a toss-up, too, btw...
Maybe but what's the smoke screen? They aren't fighting for any of them, they have their pick after the Jets.
Played terrible in three games this past season. Next you see, well, he was missing X guy, this happened because X here, and so on.
Bad vibes when I see so many fixated on the guy. Ryan Day came out and defended him, too, it's just unusual. You don't see Trey Lance's college coach come out and do that.
I know Simms and Shanahan are real close friends and Simms works for NBC Sports so he has cred (or perceived cred), but is there more to the Mac Jones rumor then that right now?
Charlie Weiss said it and that’s where this all began. They are going fields or Lance. Mac isn’t even in the thought process
Maybe but what's the smoke screen? They aren't fighting for any of them, they have their pick after the Jets.
Maybe they would be willing to trade back a spot or two (Atlanta/Lions/Panthers/Broncos) if they thought they could still get their guy and claw back some draft capital...?
It never hurts to create mystery, right?
To your point on a trade back I did give that some thought over the weekend. Would be interesting to see if they can recoup come of the cost and still get their guy. Might be hard though with this crop of QB's in a season that was such a cluster fuck. Just a lot of inexperience, especially Lance and Jones.
Apparently Jones allowed the tide and Sarkisian to install the most difficult offensive packages to date, inside of a couple months. He is accurate and projects to start quickly.
He doesn’t fit the new math with mobility and throwing off platform, but the niners window is now.
All I know is if it is Jones I think SF way overpaid. I think he will be pretty good but giving up 2 1st round picks AND using your 1st round pick is a shit ton for any player let alone a QB. They better be right no matter who it is.
But I'm sure that is why they went to his pro day, just to confirm what they saw on film. I don't see them taking Lance, he has accuracy issues. Maybe Fields, his accuracy downfield is excellent, but less so on intermediate routes. I still think Jones will be the pick.
To your point on a trade back I did give that some thought over the weekend. Would be interesting to see if they can recoup come of the cost and still get their guy. Might be hard though with this crop of QB's in a season that was such a cluster fuck. Just a lot of inexperience, especially Lance and Jones.
If you recall, Shanahan/Lynch couldn't get to Fields's first workout two weeks ago because they had committed to Jones's. But now that Fields is having a second this week - and speculation is the 9ers pushed for it - we may start to hear more pro-Field propaganda after they attend it.
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Don't fail because their arm isn't strong enough. It is the cognitive qualities that differentiate QBs. How they see the field and how they react to what they see. I am not saying that Mac Jones is or should be the guy, but based on what I read, he may have the cognitive qualities that lead to success.
Exhibit A: Ryan Leaf
Indeed. And back in the day one of the prominent posters on BBI, whom I will not name except to say that he has commented on this thread, was sure that the Colts were making a mistake by drafting Peyton Manning; this poster suggested that while Manning was the more "NFL ready", Leaf had a much higher upside and would be the better long term choice.
I have no idea whom SF is coveting or should covet in that spot so much. But I am quite sure they are confident both in whom they want and, rightly or wrongly, that he is the right guy for their team.
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In comment 15217246 Peter from NH (formerly CT) said:
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Don't fail because their arm isn't strong enough. It is the cognitive qualities that differentiate QBs. How they see the field and how they react to what they see. I am not saying that Mac Jones is or should be the guy, but based on what I read, he may have the cognitive qualities that lead to success.
Exhibit A: Ryan Leaf
Indeed. And back in the day one of the prominent posters on BBI, whom I will not name except to say that he has commented on this thread, was sure that the Colts were making a mistake by drafting Peyton Manning; this poster suggested that while Manning was the more "NFL ready", Leaf had a much higher upside and would be the better long term choice.
I have no idea whom SF is coveting or should covet in that spot so much. But I am quite sure they are confident both in whom they want and, rightly or wrongly, that he is the right guy for their team.
PLEASE say it was bw..Thanks
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so I don’t really see a problem with it.
Jones?
Yes. He doesn’t have Burrow’s mobility but he moves extremely well in the pocket and he has a stronger arm.
You can say Jones does not have the physical skills of Lance or Fields and that he had a exceptional offensive roster but he did a very important thing.......executed a offense that did require him to be a very good distributor. Perhaps the niners are looking for that.
you'd think 20 years (more) of this draft nonsense would be enough evidence by now.
and there was no reason for SF to keep their interest under wraps since everyone knows who is going 1-2.
i haven't watched enough of fields to know if he's the goods. i think jones did a nice job of getting the ball to the right people in college. shanahan has a very QB friendly offense. i can see him going there and doing a good job and SF knows they are LOADED outside of the QB position so they are taking their shot
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everyone who knows anything is lying about their plans and anyone who says they know anything is full of shit.
you'd think 20 years (more) of this draft nonsense would be enough evidence by now.
Yeah but that doesn't really mean everything is misdirection. Everyone assumes reports are bullshit, that's pretty accepted these days but many turn out to be true.
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In comment 15217249 Chris in Philly said:
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everyone who knows anything is lying about their plans and anyone who says they know anything is full of shit.
you'd think 20 years (more) of this draft nonsense would be enough evidence by now.
Yeah but that doesn't really mean everything is misdirection. Everyone assumes reports are bullshit, that's pretty accepted these days but many turn out to be true.
I think a lot of that is the sheer volume of predictions now. Every analyst puts out a mock, some doing several iterations. The liklihood of a player not being mocked to a team or rumored to a team is very low.
Just look at the Jags and Lawrence. Some analysts will say things like "Lawrence may not be the pick", when everyone knows he's the pick. It's a win-win for them though. If he's the pick, they never mention the comment again. If he isn't the pick, they use it to say they knew all along.
If the Niners pick Jones, it will be a ballsy move. They also better hope he's everything they think because they guy is going to have a ton of expectations on him from Day 1.
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In comment 15217249 Chris in Philly said:
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everyone who knows anything is lying about their plans and anyone who says they know anything is full of shit.
you'd think 20 years (more) of this draft nonsense would be enough evidence by now.
Yeah but that doesn't really mean everything is misdirection. Everyone assumes reports are bullshit, that's pretty accepted these days but many turn out to be true.
they have no reason for misdirection. the first 2 picks are set. nobody is trading up to 1 or 2. and in the weird event someone does get up to 1 or 2 it's not to take jones
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In comment 15217353 giantBCP said:
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so I don’t really see a problem with it.
Jones?
Yes. He doesn’t have Burrow’s mobility but he moves extremely well in the pocket and he has a stronger arm.
I don't see it that way, but okay.
IMV, Jones does not move "extremely well" - he moves okay - and I would say, at best, his arm is equal to Burrow's. But I would actually rate Burrow a grade slightly higher (neither have plus arms).
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In comment 15217353 giantBCP said:
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so I don’t really see a problem with it.
Jones?
Yes. He doesn’t have Burrow’s mobility but he moves extremely well in the pocket and he has a stronger arm.
If you think Mac Jones is as good a prospect as Mac Jones you must be smoking crack.
Burrow has a whole off-script, secondary reaction part of his game that is phenomenal. And Mac Jones doesn't have any of that.
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In comment 15217369 bw in dc said:
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In comment 15217353 giantBCP said:
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so I don’t really see a problem with it.
Jones?
Yes. He doesn’t have Burrow’s mobility but he moves extremely well in the pocket and he has a stronger arm.
If you think Mac Jones is as good a prospect as Mac Jones you must be smoking crack.
Burrow has a whole off-script, secondary reaction part of his game that is phenomenal. And Mac Jones doesn't have any of that.
* as Burrow
I heard on NFL Network this morning they may take Pitts...lol. If they traded 3 1st round picks for Pitts that would be one heck of a smoke screen. It doesnt matter to me who gets taken before our pick, I dont have a guy I am locked on. My hope is that there is a QB that teams want with our pick and DG takes a nice haul to trade down. Maybe a 3 team battle for the pick.
Unfortunately in that scenario I think Dallas is more likely to trade down and still get a CB.
A good amount are worried about Jones being the pick for the same reason a Kirk Cousins was sought after, and Shanahan's propensity to prefer the classic drop back who will do what he's told.
Having said all of that, IMO, drafting Jones is riskier than drafting Fields/Lance/Wilson. Somewhere this last year Shanahan has admitted to having a different take on mobile QBs.
If you draft Jones and fail, then that's a huge mark on your reputation. If you draft another of those top QBs and fail, at least one could say it was worth the risk.
Shanahan is also looking at these QBs through the lens of sitting a year, and having a much better team than most of these top 5 picks tend to go to.
He has to think, if any of these QBs can (eventually) process the game as good as Jimmy Garoppolo, then it's a homerun pick with those physical traits.
You also have to consider Shanahan looking beyond QB IQ, and thinking of how the Ravens use Lamar to some extent. Not necessarily the running game, but how to use the running ability combined with how he likes the jet sweeps with Deebo Samuel and Brandon Aiyuk.
I think the 9ers are going to get Zack Wilson because the Jets are going to wise-up and take Fields, who has the body type to hold up in a more dual-threat system deployed by Mike LaFleur. And Fields has just played more big games on the biggest stage compared to Wilson. So I think he'll be able to hit the ground running...Wilson will take take time.