NFT: How good were The Smashing Pumpkins?

Boys/men of the 80s and 90s, I think this was one of the better threads on here in a long, long time.

In comment 15222112 Greg from LI said:

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going on 13

Holy shit. I was trying to guess your age based on the bands you liked in my head, and I came up with "Born in 77". Damn, wish I posted it so I wasn't lamely expressing my surprise that I was right after the fact.

In comment 15222191 Bobby Humphrey's Earpad said:

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but we are coming up to 20 years of Incubus' Morning View. Maybe they can get a small tour started in the fall. That I would attend.

Incubus is great live. I think they're one of the most underappreciated bands of the 90s. Everything from Science to A Crow Left of The Murder was top notch, and Light Grenades wasn't really bad either.

Really? I always thought Incubus was way overplayed. Then again, nearly every single one of these bands mentioned on this thread is looked at as overplayed. Maybe it was my location and the DJs had quite the fondness for Incubus but they really kept rolling out those songs from 1998-1999 into 2001-2002.

Oh yeah. Another one of those bands that's awful in the Blink/Weezer lump is Fall Out Boy. I might even have to go ahead and put Maroon 5 above all of them. Lol.

I used to work in an office in the late 00s and someone on the office floor had an XM radio subscription and they'd play music and one of FOB's songs ended with the guy fading out saying.... "Honeymooooooooon."

Puke. Who listens to that and doesn't cringe? Girls? Men? Teens? College kids?

In comment 15222274 Route 9 said:

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Really? I always thought Incubus was way overplayed. Then again, nearly every single one of these bands mentioned on this thread is looked at as overplayed. Maybe it was my location and the DJs had quite the fondness for Incubus but they really kept rolling out those songs from 1998-1999 into 2001-2002. Oh yeah. Another one of those bands that's awful in the Blink/Weezer lump is Fall Out Boy. I might even have to go ahead and put Maroon 5 above all of them. Lol.

Incubus's big hits were overplayed (especially Drive), but their catalog is incredibly deep in terms of quality. Most of their best songs weren't singles, and each release had a different sound than the next one. I really love Mike Enzinger's guitar work, and each individual member of the band, from Brandon Boyd, to whoever their drummer is, to Ben Kenney, are awesome.

The guitarwork on a Crow Left of the Murder for some really really sticks out to me.

Also, Fallout Boy was one that I never really liked, but that's a pretty wild assortment there dude lol. I consider Maroon 5 to be a straight up pop band, and think Weezer is from a really different time than the rest of the bands you mentioned. I do see the Blink and Fallout Boy connection, but even then, Blink was a bit earlier.

Shit though, at this point, Fallout Boy and Panic at the Disco, neither of whom I liked, are so so so far removed from what they actually were when they first came out. Both are pop bands with four to the floor vaguely EDM sounding kick drums all over their songs. Totally different from their myspace pop-punk/scene roots. Never was a fan of them to begin with though in the first place, so not too torn up over it. Wish they stayed more like "rock bands" just so there were more popular bands in the mainstream, for reasons I alluded to earlier in this thread.

In comment 15222283 Route 9 said:

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I used to work in an office in the late 00s and someone on the office floor had an XM radio subscription and they'd play music and one of FOB's songs ended with the guy fading out saying.... "Honeymooooooooon." Puke. Who listens to that and doesn't cringe? Girls? Men? Teens? College kids?

At this point it's just nostalgic late 20s/early 30s kids, and I guess teenagers who like pop music. That's what I'd guess at least.

I gotta say though, I usually have this viewpoint that when it comes to music, I don't give a fuck about anything other than how it sounds. I got no shame in admitting that Toxic by Britney Spears (which samples some obscure arabic song brilliantly) and Last Friday Night by Katy Perry are songs I love. Like fuck it, they sound good, so whatever, lol.

The Maroon 5 comment was a joke. Maroon 5 is an awful disease.

Katy Perry LOL

In comment 15222300 Route 9 said:

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Katy Perry LOL

Lol fuck it, I can appreciate a good pop song, I have no shame. Like I said earlier in this thread, one of my three favorite bands ever is the Dillinger Escape Plan and it basically sounds like unlistenable noise to almost all of Earth's population, so I got no shame. A good song's a good song, you know?

They have that one song that's alright, Sunday Morning, had an exgf that liked that one a lot and it grew on me. But yeah, their shit is bland as hell.

I was a bicentennial baby, just barely made it into 1976 before the calendar flipped.

I can unironically say that Duran Duran had some great songs. Most modern pop, I can't listen to for two seconds, but I'll sing along with Rio or Hungry Like the Wolf anytime.

... I gained a SHIT TON of respect for Adam Levine when he did a live version of Purple Rain on the Howard Stern birthday bash with Train. Yeah I'm sure Train helped a bunch with that.. lol

In comment 15222392 Johnny5 said:

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... I gained a SHIT TON of respect for Adam Levine when he did a live version of Purple Rain on the Howard Stern birthday bash with Train. Yeah I'm sure Train helped a bunch with that.. lol

He's definitely a good singer, no denying it.

But yeah, I've just gotten past the point of "hating" bands, unless the individuals themselves are true pieces of shit (like lostprophets, or, IMO, xxxtenacion, sixnine, etc)

In comment 15222285 Bear vs Shark said:

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In comment 15222274 Route 9 said: Quote: Really? I always thought Incubus was way overplayed. Then again, nearly every single one of these bands mentioned on this thread is looked at as overplayed. Maybe it was my location and the DJs had quite the fondness for Incubus but they really kept rolling out those songs from 1998-1999 into 2001-2002. Incubus's big hits were overplayed (especially Drive), but their catalog is incredibly deep in terms of quality. Most of their best songs weren't singles, and each release had a different sound than the next one.

Going to agree with this - the big hits were overplayed but there's enough quality in that catalog that you can actually avoid them - I listen to Make Yourself and Privilege rather than Drive. On Morning View, I still love the other hits, but it's just a really good album top to bottom.

They evolved their sound every album and it helped them not get stale. Even in concert they changed the arrangements - the live version of Redefine from the Look Alive DVD is a favorite. It's a credit to them how they've become top musicians.

It’s funny - I’m not a snob about most things. I like good coffee and food but would be fine with drinking gas station coffee or going to a White Castle.

Music and literature is a no slum zone for me. Need good lyrics and sound or I just can’t do it. So something like Michael Jackson or the Eagles just kill me.

But when I find a band or musician I like well I get pretty into it

In comment 15222420 thomasa510 said:

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It’s funny - I’m not a snob about most things. I like good coffee and food but would be fine with drinking gas station coffee or going to a White Castle. Music and literature is a no slum zone for me. Need good lyrics and sound or I just can’t do it. So something like Michael Jackson or the Eagles just kill me. But when I find a band or musician I like well I get pretty into it

But if it sounds good to your ears, isn't inherently good music?

Lyrics I can take or leave. I like a lot of instrumental bands, and like half of the music I listen to is instrumental, so I never gave too much of a shit about lyrics. Don't get me wrong, they can make a song better or actively make it worse if they're terrible, but they're also easy to ignore.

My ex was obsessed with Maroon 5/Adam Levine. Just way too much of that guy for me in a short amount of time. Their music does suck though. Just headache annoying.

Everyone hated it when it was released. They didn't release anything until 2001 and when they toured they wouldn't play anything off of Pinkerton. It has since gained a lot of respect.

As far as bands from the 1990s, Lifetime needs to be mentioned. Hello Bastards and Jersey's Best Dancers were great albums.
Seemed like a lot of punk/emo bands that made it to the radio in the early 2000s were influenced by them or at least it sounded like it.

When they first came out? That's an honest question. I think it was Eminem's early albums they were given average reviews and then Pitchfork Media or whoever came back and give MMLP a 10 out of 10. Or maybe it was Nas? I forget.

I don't know, but it just seems as if once the public approves of music then those album review guys act as if they called it a classic the entire time.

In comment 15222496 St. Jimmy said:

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Everyone hated it when it was released. They didn't release anything until 2001 and when they toured they wouldn't play anything off of Pinkerton. It has since gained a lot of respect. As far as bands from the 1990s, Lifetime needs to be mentioned. Hello Bastards and Jersey's Best Dancers were great albums. Seemed like a lot of punk/emo bands that made it to the radio in the early 2000s were influenced by them or at least it sounded like it.

Lifetime, New Brunswick NJ legends. As a Rutgers students who grew up next door, Lifetime, Thursday, Screaming Females, and Gaslight Anthem will always have special places in my heart.

We really did have one of the best music scenes out of all US college towns

In comment 15221782 Pete in MD said:

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hate it when Rancid got into the ska/reggae stuff for a few albums. It was sort of getting back to their Operation Ivy roots but more polished. They're now back to straight punk rock again and it's pretty unoriginal IMO.

I hated Life Won't Wait when it came out. About 10 years ago, I gave it another try and really loved it. Tim Armstrong was in the zone through Indestructible. Of the three albums since, the only one I listen to regularly is Honor Is All We Know.

In comment 15222509 Route 9 said:

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When they first came out? That's an honest question. I think it was Eminem's early albums they were given average reviews and then Pitchfork Media or whoever came back and give MMLP a 10 out of 10. Or maybe it was Nas? I forget. I don't know, but it just seems as if once the public approves of music then those album review guys act as if they called it a classic the entire time.

Pitchfork Loved This Is It by The Strokes when it came out. I think they referenced its original Smell the Glove like cover. The second cover is great and that was before I read it was an picture of tequila under an electronic microscope. That was a very good album, but they fell off quickly.

In comment 15222513 Bear vs Shark said:

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In comment 15222496 St. Jimmy said: Quote: Everyone hated it when it was released. They didn't release anything until 2001 and when they toured they wouldn't play anything off of Pinkerton. It has since gained a lot of respect. As far as bands from the 1990s, Lifetime needs to be mentioned. Hello Bastards and Jersey's Best Dancers were great albums. Seemed like a lot of punk/emo bands that made it to the radio in the early 2000s were influenced by them or at least it sounded like it. Lifetime, New Brunswick NJ legends. As a Rutgers students who grew up next door, Lifetime, Thursday, Screaming Females, and Gaslight Anthem will always have special places in my heart. We really did have one of the best music scenes out of all US college towns

The Bouncing Souls started out there too. They were the band my senior year of high school. Carried the banner for me. That wore off some time after they signed with Epitaph. Still can get into Maniacal Laughter and The Good, The Bad, and the Argyle every now and then.

In comment 15222513 Bear vs Shark said:

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In comment 15222496 St. Jimmy said: Quote: Everyone hated it when it was released. They didn't release anything until 2001 and when they toured they wouldn't play anything off of Pinkerton. It has since gained a lot of respect. As far as bands from the 1990s, Lifetime needs to be mentioned. Hello Bastards and Jersey's Best Dancers were great albums. Seemed like a lot of punk/emo bands that made it to the radio in the early 2000s were influenced by them or at least it sounded like it. Lifetime, New Brunswick NJ legends. As a Rutgers students who grew up next door, Lifetime, Thursday, Screaming Females, and Gaslight Anthem will always have special places in my heart. We really did have one of the best music scenes out of all US college towns

I was at Lifetime's last show at the Trocadero in Philly.

.

Right up there with the rest of them. Man, basement shows and court tavern, really miss those days.

One of the new post punk revival bands I mentioned earlier, Shame, got great reviews from the start.

In comment 15222576 Pete in MD said:

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In comment 15222513 Bear vs Shark said: Quote: In comment 15222496 St. Jimmy said: Quote: Everyone hated it when it was released. They didn't release anything until 2001 and when they toured they wouldn't play anything off of Pinkerton. It has since gained a lot of respect. As far as bands from the 1990s, Lifetime needs to be mentioned. Hello Bastards and Jersey's Best Dancers were great albums. Seemed like a lot of punk/emo bands that made it to the radio in the early 2000s were influenced by them or at least it sounded like it. Lifetime, New Brunswick NJ legends. As a Rutgers students who grew up next door, Lifetime, Thursday, Screaming Females, and Gaslight Anthem will always have special places in my heart. We really did have one of the best music scenes out of all US college towns I was at Lifetime's last show at the Trocadero in Philly.

Me too. I had heard about them about a week before on a college radio show. I was their to see the Bouncing Souls. I was at the same venue to see the Lifetime when they opened for the Bouncing Souls when they got together for their reunion. Amazing how things change.

In comment 15222622 Greg from LI said:

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.

Yes, I remember when White Blood Cells came out they were loved by the critics. I don't remember what was thought of their earlier albums. I never heard of them before White Blood Cells.
Man, could Meg White play the drums.

In comment 15222634 St. Jimmy said:

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In comment 15222622 Greg from LI said: Quote: . Yes, I remember when White Blood Cells came out they were loved by the critics. I don't remember what was thought of their earlier albums. I never heard of them before White Blood Cells. Man, could Meg White play the drums.

Lmao at the last line. I remember when the White Stripes came out and there was major confusion (at least to my 13 year old self and my friends) if Meg and Jack were married, or siblings.

Since this thread is gonna die, and I've mentioned a lot of bands but never posted one, figured I might as well close it out with ONE song at least.

This is my favorite band of all time, The Fall of Troy. This is their most popular song, though definitely not my favorite. Having said that, it's still amazing because almost all their songs are (save for one album).

It's also fairly popular as it got a huge boost due to eventually being in a Guitar Hero video game. This particular song, FPREMIX, is off their 2005 album which Doppelganger, recorded when they were all 18/19. This record, along with Nevermind, is my favorite album of all time.

When I first heard this band and was 16, I wanted to quit playing music. They were so much better than me and doing everything I wanted to with a band, were a three piece that somehow was playing their instruments and singing at the same time, only slightly older than me, and just so much better. The album changed what I thought was even possible on guitar and changed the way I looked at the instrument, and was actually life changing (not even being hyperbolic).

Check it out, and if you like it, you should check out the whole album. My favorite song off this album is Mouths like Sidewinder Misiles (gotta get the Doppelganger version though, the earlier one is from when they were 17).
FCPREMIX - ( New Window )

And I love seeing others on BBI listening to Lifetime, Bouncing Souls, Gaslight. Throw Vision in there for a Central Jersey punk-o-Rama.

In comment 15222631 St. Jimmy said:

Quote:

In comment 15222576 Pete in MD said: Quote: In comment 15222513 Bear vs Shark said: Quote: In comment 15222496 St. Jimmy said: Quote: Everyone hated it when it was released. They didn't release anything until 2001 and when they toured they wouldn't play anything off of Pinkerton. It has since gained a lot of respect. As far as bands from the 1990s, Lifetime needs to be mentioned. Hello Bastards and Jersey's Best Dancers were great albums. Seemed like a lot of punk/emo bands that made it to the radio in the early 2000s were influenced by them or at least it sounded like it. Lifetime, New Brunswick NJ legends. As a Rutgers students who grew up next door, Lifetime, Thursday, Screaming Females, and Gaslight Anthem will always have special places in my heart. We really did have one of the best music scenes out of all US college towns I was at Lifetime's last show at the Trocadero in Philly. Me too. I had heard about them about a week before on a college radio show. I was their to see the Bouncing Souls. I was at the same venue to see the Lifetime when they opened for the Bouncing Souls when they got together for their reunion. Amazing how things change.

Was Less Than Jake also part of that show? My memory could be off. I am also a big Bouncing Souls fan.

to E-Town Concrete? They were badass.

In comment 15222998 Pete in MD said:

Quote:

In comment 15222631 St. Jimmy said: Quote: In comment 15222576 Pete in MD said: Quote: In comment 15222513 Bear vs Shark said: Quote: In comment 15222496 St. Jimmy said: Quote: Everyone hated it when it was released. They didn't release anything until 2001 and when they toured they wouldn't play anything off of Pinkerton. It has since gained a lot of respect. As far as bands from the 1990s, Lifetime needs to be mentioned. Hello Bastards and Jersey's Best Dancers were great albums. Seemed like a lot of punk/emo bands that made it to the radio in the early 2000s were influenced by them or at least it sounded like it. Lifetime, New Brunswick NJ legends. As a Rutgers students who grew up next door, Lifetime, Thursday, Screaming Females, and Gaslight Anthem will always have special places in my heart. We really did have one of the best music scenes out of all US college towns I was at Lifetime's last show at the Trocadero in Philly. Me too. I had heard about them about a week before on a college radio show. I was their to see the Bouncing Souls. I was at the same venue to see the Lifetime when they opened for the Bouncing Souls when they got together for their reunion. Amazing how things change. Was Less Than Jake also part of that show? My memory could be off. I am also a big Bouncing Souls fan.

Not sure if you’re aware, but Beach Rats are members of Lifetime (Ari), Bouncing Souls (Pete and Bryan) and Bad Religion (Brian Baker). The drummer is an old friend of Souls, Dubs.
Link - ( New Window )

In comment 15222998 Pete in MD said:

Quote:

In comment 15222631 St. Jimmy said: Quote: In comment 15222576 Pete in MD said: Quote: In comment 15222513 Bear vs Shark said: Quote: In comment 15222496 St. Jimmy said: Quote: Everyone hated it when it was released. They didn't release anything until 2001 and when they toured they wouldn't play anything off of Pinkerton. It has since gained a lot of respect. As far as bands from the 1990s, Lifetime needs to be mentioned. Hello Bastards and Jersey's Best Dancers were great albums. Seemed like a lot of punk/emo bands that made it to the radio in the early 2000s were influenced by them or at least it sounded like it. Lifetime, New Brunswick NJ legends. As a Rutgers students who grew up next door, Lifetime, Thursday, Screaming Females, and Gaslight Anthem will always have special places in my heart. We really did have one of the best music scenes out of all US college towns I was at Lifetime's last show at the Trocadero in Philly. Me too. I had heard about them about a week before on a college radio show. I was their to see the Bouncing Souls. I was at the same venue to see the Lifetime when they opened for the Bouncing Souls when they got together for their reunion. Amazing how things change. Was Less Than Jake also part of that show? My memory could be off. I am also a big Bouncing Souls fan.

Not that I remember. Looking around, it says Lifetime and Bouncing Souls. Maybe there was a local band opening but not listed. Tim Barry was at the reunion show in 2009.

My one best friend growing up is one of 12 brothers and sisters growing up. He had an older brother who let us listen to all of his CDs when he was done with them. I remember that's when I was introduced to Less than Jake. That family was into ska music and other types big time.

One of the only ska bands from that era that still really really holds up.

If you like heavy shit and Ska (and are from NJ), I'm sure some of you probably ended up seeing Folly back in the day. Great crossover stuff.

But yeah, I always thought RX Bandits was the best ska band, if you can even call them that after their first couple albums. It was like "progressive ska". The mathrock/prog ska combo really worked out well for them. Great drummer and guitarists also.

And Less than Jake.

Streetlight Manifesto was my NJ ska band of choice.

Automatic video. They show many quick shots of the crowd and there's a skinny kid with a shaved head that looks remarkably like 18-year old Pete. It absolutely could be another skinny kid with a shaved head but I did see them a lot in the late 90's when the video was made. I should probably try to find it on YouTube.

And Tim Barry. Avail was another great band.

In comment 15223277 10thAve said:

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And Less than Jake. Streetlight Manifesto was my NJ ska band of choice.

Catch 22 and Streetlight are right up there with RXB for me. I went to East Brunswick High School which was Catch 22/Jamie Eagan's hometown, so we had a hugeeee statue/mural dedicated to them in our HS, which was pretty cool.

I'm pretty sure Jamie teaches band at North Brunswick High School. My childhood friend who plays in a ska/hardcore (Folly-ish but not as hardcore) band called The Best of the Worst teaches with Jamie, and has always talked about how crazy it is since he spent his youth looking up to that band, haha.

tour with Less than Jake, Reel Big Fish, Social Distortion, Blink 182, Pennywise, Mighty Mighty Bosstones, Bad Religion, Bouncing Souls, the descendants, Buck-o-nine, and more

maybe 1997 or 1998 in a blistering hot late July day at RFK

great show

In comment 15223360 pjcas18 said:

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tour with Less than Jake, Reel Big Fish, Social Distortion, Blink 182, Pennywise, Mighty Mighty Bosstones, Bad Religion, Bouncing Souls, the descendants, Buck-o-nine, and more maybe 1997 or 1998 in a blistering hot late July day at RFK great show

I went to Blink-182 and NFG in 2001 at the Tweeter Center in Camden. What a toilet that arena, or outdoor amphitheater, was (even then, cannot imagine what it's like now) and someone got hit in the head with a banana. Blink-182 had the words "FUCK" in flames.

What an awful experience. Cannot expect much from Camden.

In comment 15223360 pjcas18 said:

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tour with Less than Jake, Reel Big Fish, Social Distortion, Blink 182, Pennywise, Mighty Mighty Bosstones, Bad Religion, Bouncing Souls, the descendants, Buck-o-nine, and more maybe 1997 or 1998 in a blistering hot late July day at RFK great show

Pretty sure that was 1997, I was at the one in Asbury Park. Also had Sick of it All on that lineup. And Limp Bizkit.

In comment 15223370 10thAve said:

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In comment 15223360 pjcas18 said: Quote: tour with Less than Jake, Reel Big Fish, Social Distortion, Blink 182, Pennywise, Mighty Mighty Bosstones, Bad Religion, Bouncing Souls, the descendants, Buck-o-nine, and more maybe 1997 or 1998 in a blistering hot late July day at RFK great show Pretty sure that was 1997, I was at the one in Asbury Park. Also had Sick of it All on that lineup. And Limp Bizkit.

Yep! definitely same show (different location).

I think Pennywise closed or at least was one of the final bands if I remember right, I was such a big fan of them, wonder whatever happened to them.

to the Randall's Island stop of the same tour. I always laugh because Limp Bizkit and Kid Rock went on early to very few people and a year or two later they became hugely popular (not that am a fan of either of them.) I thought the little person in the band who died was Kid Rock at the time.

In comment 15223373 pjcas18 said:

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In comment 15223370 10thAve said: Quote: In comment 15223360 pjcas18 said: Quote: tour with Less than Jake, Reel Big Fish, Social Distortion, Blink 182, Pennywise, Mighty Mighty Bosstones, Bad Religion, Bouncing Souls, the descendants, Buck-o-nine, and more maybe 1997 or 1998 in a blistering hot late July day at RFK great show Pretty sure that was 1997, I was at the one in Asbury Park. Also had Sick of it All on that lineup. And Limp Bizkit. Yep! definitely same show (different location). I think Pennywise closed or at least was one of the final bands if I remember right, I was such a big fan of them, wonder whatever happened to them.

Bosstones closed, Pennywise was second from the end. I distinctly remember the dilemma when the Bosstones played, as the Descendents were playing at the same time on a smaller stage. I think I ended up watching half of each.

Regarding Pennywise, I know their lead singer left the band for awhile but I think he’s back now. He also wrote a book about being a punk rock parent, it was pretty good light reading.
Link - ( New Window )

in a documentary about raising kids as an aging punk musician called "The Other F Word." Fat Mike from NOFX is in it too.

Jim once at a show. He was just hanging out by himself after their set. We had a short chat about raising kids and the documentary. He seemed like a nice guy.

Ska punk bands like Less Than Jake. In the late 80's and early 90's I used to annually attend the Berkeley Ska Fest and see incredible performances by Ska bands like Let's Go Bowling, The Beat, The Specials, The Toasters, etc... big bands with like 10 people on stage, half of whom were playing horns. When ska punk came along it felt like a Mike Tyson punch to the nuts.