Weird topic,but looking to see what my peers think. They emerged during a period dominated by grunge bands and pretty much immediately following the last of the hard rock outfits like GnR, Aerosmith on its last legs. Blind Melon had a cool sound, but no band had as distinguishing a sound as The Smashing Pumpkins. Sure they had those overdrive-laden songs on Siamese Dream, but really beautifully written progressions. Mayonnaise and 1979 are two of my favorite songs ever. Then you get MellonCollie and its like a completely different band...meaning a totally reinvented sound. Dont get me wrong, I thought the double album was a mistake as there is plenty of crap on there too.
I always thought Corgan to be a weirdo, but then you listen to him talk about his music and what hes been through in his life and I have come to admire this band more and more over the years.
Anybody get feels when looking back on this group?
As for grunge. Too many bands trying to sound the same. There were things I liked, and things I didn't. I heard "Smells Like Teen Spirit" about a year before it hit big and I instantly new Nirvana was going to be huge. Who knows what might have been with them. Frankly, I find them good. Not great. They COULD have been great, given time. STP, Alice in Chains, Soundgarden, Screaming Trees, Melvins, Mudhoney, all of them had moments. Pearl Jam obviously transcended into superstardom, but like I mentioned in a previous thread, I could not stand his voice. Not even a little. That was my problem with most grunge bands. I loved the music, couldn't stand the vocals. Just an opinion, doesn't mean shit. As for calling the 90s a dead area for rock...hmmm...not buying it. As a child of the 70s who went through the dearth of "rock" in the 80s except for the stuff you had to go to college rock radio to find, the 90s were a revolution back into the mainstream for a lot of us. Yeah, it brought on the BS fake punk and pop-punk bullshit, but it was a fun time in the very late 80s and early 90s listening to The Smithereens, Cracker, Soup Dragons, Too Much Joy, Catherine Wheel, Ned's Atomic Dustbin, Matthew Sweet, James, Pavement, Soul Asylum, Primus, Weezer, Radiohead.....anything but a dead zone to me, even if you hated grunge
Dave Grohl? if that, and is that it?
I say grunge era because Dinosaur Jr, weren't traditional grunge, but had some similarities, they were probably one of the first alternative bands (besides the Pixies of course who were alternative and didn't know it).
I think the worst thing that can be said about the grunge era is it directly or indirectly birthed emo and pop-punk, but some of those bands were fun too, even if not technically great.
Quote:
I'd probably say it started going downhill in 1998 or so when the recording industry spent all of their development and publicity money on the former "Mickey Mouse Club" acts (i.e. Britney Spears, N'Sync, Backstreet Boys, Jessica Simpson).
Those artists were way more profitable (they didn't write their own songs) and easy to control. The industry's publicity machine flooded them on MTV and the radio and pushed rock bands right off the air waves.
Circa 1999-2000 also had the stink of nu-metal. That crap was horrid.
I was going to say late 90s early 00s had some pretty bad rock/metal. My favorite bands were on hiatus or had broken up and there was a flood of shit on the radio.
I think some agreed with me in that I probably didn't appreciate them as much at the time because there were sooooo rock acts just exploding at the time.
Also, sb's onterpretation of what happened to pretty much END the rock era at the end of the 90s was pretty spot on. Now a days you are getting only rock acts that emerged independently and are hardly rock at all. Rock now a days is really confined to the jam band scene.
Quote:
In comment 15218326 BamaBlue said:
Quote:
The Smashing Pumpkins were another one of those nostalgic, but not memorable bands.
You have to be kidding. The 90’s was one of the best rock decades ever. I’m not even going to name the bands because Producer already did. I felt like Rock music started going downhill around 2005 or so.
I'd probably say it started going downhill in 1998 or so when the recording industry spent all of their development and publicity money on the former "Mickey Mouse Club" acts (i.e. Britney Spears, N'Sync, Backstreet Boys, Jessica Simpson).
Those artists were way more profitable (they didn't write their own songs) and easy to control. The industry's publicity machine flooded them on MTV and the radio and pushed rock bands right off the air waves.
Good call, I remember TRL on MTV with Carson Daly around that time and it got to the point where they would play like 20 seconds of a music video and get right back to chatting with all of the pop stars in the front of their Times Square window in NYC. Part of the slow death of MTV as it morphed onto a full reality television based network.
Quote:
Rock drumming is Dave Grohl, BUT Jimmy Chamberlin of Pumpkins gives him a run. I'm a fan of their music but I definitely understand the love them or hate them with this band.
Siamese Dream is a nearly perfect album.
I think Jimmy is better than Grohl tbh.
From a pure technical mastery standpoint, I totally agree. Chamberlain was the shit and if I were a Pumpkins fan he'd be a massive reason why.
I agree. I really liked them in HS through College, and from everything I've read they are all really good dudes. Shinoda is extremely talented, gifted in many forms of art. Their music isn't for everyone but I enjoy it.
Corgan’s voice is very unique. It seems like people either love it or hate it. I don’t mind it at all, but I wouldn’t say he’s one of my favorite singers by any means.
Quote:
2000’s that I am frankly not sure what to classify them as (sort of a rap/rock/metal/alternative/electronic combination), was Linkin Park. The only album I didn’t care for was the last one that sounded like a pop record. Some of their best stuff was actually music they released through LP Underground which included remixes that were better than some of the versions that ended up on the finished records as well as instrumentals.
I agree. I really liked them in HS through College, and from everything I've read they are all really good dudes. Shinoda is extremely talented, gifted in many forms of art. Their music isn't for everyone but I enjoy it.
If you haven’t heard it already lookup “announcement service public” on YouTube. I think it was an LP Underground instrumental. That one will get you amped up for lifting or running lol.
Good call. In another thread on here recently I commented that I really didn’t care for early JA, partially because Perry was so whiny. I thought he tightened it up a bit on Strays and The Great Escape Artist. The music is more aggressive and less drugged out and whiny sounding on those two albums.
Peaked early though IMO.
Kind of like Weezer. Weezer blue album is as good as it gets in the 90's. Pinkerton was criminally underrated, and since then they've basically been releasing the same album for 25 years - Beverly Hills or Islands in the Sun or if You're wondering, etc. and a bunch of filler.
Peaked early though IMO.
Kind of like Weezer. Weezer blue album is as good as it gets in the 90's. Pinkerton was criminally underrated, and since then they've basically been releasing the same album for 25 years - Beverly Hills or Islands in the Sun or if You're wondering, etc. and a bunch of filler.
Glad you said that about Weezer, everybody I know seems to think very highly of them but I really only liked the blue album. Outside of that album the music is pretty much the same every record. They are definitely not a band that takes pride in switching up their style from time to time.
Agree. Corgan is like nails on a chalkboard to me. With a different singer, I would have been a bigger fan
Peaked early though IMO.
Kind of like Weezer. Weezer blue album is as good as it gets in the 90's. Pinkerton was criminally underrated, and since then they've basically been releasing the same album for 25 years - Beverly Hills or Islands in the Sun or if You're wondering, etc. and a bunch of filler.
Part of it was Mike Shinoda doing his side projects of which there are many. Fort Minor, his solo work, producing for other artists, painting/drawing, and his philanthropy. I have to think Chester's demons played a role
But the first 2 LP albums were awesome, still really playable 15-20 years later. Definitely their best work.
System of a Down was their own thing. Not sure quite how to classify them.
Maybe they weren't all nu-metal exactly, but there was a deluge of bands around that time that were almost all terrible IMO - Limp Bizkit, Papa Roach, Linkin Park, Staind, Disturbed, Drowning Pool, Puddle of Mudd, Sevendust, Slipknot, Mudvayne, etc.
Korn had a few good songs, but not a fan overall. Deftones were pretty good though. Godsmack's first album had some great songs but wouldn't say I'm a huge fan of theirs in general.
Corgan’s voice is very unique. It seems like people either love it or hate it. I don’t mind it at all, but I wouldn’t say he’s one of my favorite singers by any means.
Like Pearl Jam, I only know the Pumpkins for the first 3 albums. Vitalogy I still found great for PJ, but their material got kind of diluted with No Code and Yield. The Pumpkins, I dont think I even tried to listen to anything after Mellon Collie.
Their look, their logo, their songs. Awful and down there with the likes of Blink-182.
Their look, their logo, their songs. Awful and down there with the likes of Blink-182.
I loved the blue album. My name is Jonas is an all time classic.
and the poppy songs like Buddy Holly, Say it Ain't So and the Sweater Song were party classics.
but they became so derivative they became unlistenable.
however, a case could be made that Pinkerton was better than the blue album. El Scorcho, Pink Triangle, The Good Life, just a "smart" album.
and if you got the deluxe edition like me you had "You gave your love to me softly" on it and you recognized that from the movie Angus.
but again, no growth after those two for 25 years, lol
But for whatever reason I could not get into them. Maybe it's Corgan or something, I don't know.
The music may have went downhill but something was going up when Britney came on the scene.
Just a bunch of chanting stuff like "woahhh" and yelling gibberish lyrics. I think it was 2005 or 2006 maybe, and one of my friends had their most recent CD and it was horrid.
Yeah and they're probably looked at as this big Godfather hipster band now among teenagers today. Gross. I also remember when they named a CD after Hurley from Lost. So stupid.
Quote:
In comment 15218326 BamaBlue said:
Quote:
The Smashing Pumpkins were another one of those nostalgic, but not memorable bands.
You have to be kidding. The 90’s was one of the best rock decades ever. I’m not even going to name the bands because Producer already did. I felt like Rock music started going downhill around 2005 or so.
I'd probably say it started going downhill in 1998 or so when the recording industry spent all of their development and publicity money on the former "Mickey Mouse Club" acts (i.e. Britney Spears, N'Sync, Backstreet Boys, Jessica Simpson).
Those artists were way more profitable (they didn't write their own songs) and easy to control. The industry's publicity machine flooded them on MTV and the radio and pushed rock bands right off the air waves.
Their look, their logo, their songs. Awful and down there with the likes of Blink-182.
There are legions of people my age (32) who started playing guitar because of Blink. They were a gateway drug for a lot of musicians.
Also, Blink-182 wrote really well crafted pop songs.
My next point is more of a general observation, but this type of attitude - "if something is popular, it must suck" - is why rock music no longer has the cultural relevance it once had. Sure, it was always there to an extent, but it got to the point where people in rock bands never even *aspired* to actually hit it truly big. Well, when that happens, you get less rockstars, and the genre fades from pop culture consciousness. You need the attention whores like Blink-182 in the mainstream, they have their place (besides, I think Good Charlotte is a better example of what you were going for anyway).
Couple that attitude with rock radio/media not really showcasing any young, new, up and coming bands since the early 00s, and you end up with what we have today. Seriously, when was the last time there was a group of young bands that had mainstream buzz? Probably the early 00s with The Hives/Strokes/Vines/White Stripes.
Quote:
Weezer was/still is fucking terrible.
Their look, their logo, their songs. Awful and down there with the likes of Blink-182.
I loved the blue album. My name is Jonas is an all time classic.
and the poppy songs like Buddy Holly, Say it Ain't So and the Sweater Song were party classics.
but they became so derivative they became unlistenable.
however, a case could be made that Pinkerton was better than the blue album. El Scorcho, Pink Triangle, The Good Life, just a "smart" album.
and if you got the deluxe edition like me you had "You gave your love to me softly" on it and you recognized that from the movie Angus.
but again, no growth after those two for 25 years, lol
legitimately looked like wherever they were was where they wanted to be and entertaining gave them joy not just a paycheck.
I saw them at a few warped tours, which were fun shows to go to anyway, and festival shows, and they always get some of the best crowd reaction. even if it was due to their immature or sophomoric humor.
you can all critique them musically and how serious they were or not - that is not my point (though Adam's Song was kind of poignant).
the only more fun I saw in a concert was Mighty Mighty Bosstones with the Pietasters at the 9:30 club in DC - that place was perfect for a show like that, small, cozy, but not tiny and allowed for the crazies who wanted a mosh pit and the other people who were just typical concert goers.
anyway - good thread Chopper - brings back some memories.
Really enjoyed Billy on with Joe Rogan. I recommend it. Cool dude.
Great band.
Figured I might as well post it, it's worth the watch IMO and there's some good reasons that the host points out.
Link - ( New Window )
What sucked back then still sucks today.
Went to a concert in 2002 or with friends and Green Day blew them off the stage when the two bands went on tour together. After that whole mess the bands stopped switching between who opened and who closed the show.
Green Day is mainstream and shouldn't have wasted their time sharing the same stage with Blink. Green Day called them out for their sloppy performances and justifiably so. Armstrong's displeasure was noted on an MTV segment as well back then.
Guess what? I was around in 1999 and remember them before they came out. Blink isn't even a pimple on the ass of the music industry.
What sucked back then still sucks today.
Went to a concert in 2002 or with friends and Green Day blew them off the stage when the two bands went on tour together. After that whole mess the bands stopped switching between who opened and who closed the show.
Green Day is mainstream and shouldn't have wasted their time sharing the same stage with Blink. Green Day called them out for their sloppy performances and justifiably so. Armstrong's displeasure was noted on an MTV segment as well back then.
Guess what? I was around in 1999 and remember them before they came out. Blink isn't even a pimple on the ass of the music industry.
I'm not arguing about what band is better. I don't care about what sounds good to you, and you don't care about what sounds good to me (one of my favorite bands, The Dillinger Escape Plan, sounds like pure noise to 99.999% of the human population).
My point was more about why rock music isn't in the public consciousness anymore. You need those cheesy pop stars to retain the relevance.
As an example a lot of the other music I listen to is house and techno (NOT edm). EDM is derided in the music circles for the electronic music I'm into, but the people doing that are short sighted, because they don't realize that artists like Swedish House Mafia got people into electronic music back in the early 10s, who found other music, and are now the DJs and producers we listen to.
Having said that, Blink's best albums are a lot better than Green Day's to me. Green Day was way more straight power chordy, Blink had a lot more going on guitarwise, dual vocalists, and a much better drummer. Still not great live, but they are better on an album (mostly talking about Take Off Your Pants and Jacket here).
But for fucks sake, can we not sit here and argue about who's "better" Blink 182 vs Green Day? It's 2021, this is such an outdated, dumb conversation to have. Both of these bands are old and pretty much share the same fanbase at this point (the vast vast majority of which is people over the age of 30).
Yeah. I had friends just like you in high school. I was more of a Hall and Oates kind of guy.
Take off your Pants was the one with the song referencing sex with dogs? Right?
Yes 2021 where the idea of going to a concert sounds outlandish. Just think of those days of a time when you can actually enjoy your life without having the mommy/Karen mentality putting a choke hold on a good time.
Did you go to Pinelands?
It also is laughable considering how big they were and the fact they're still touring and putting out albums that people listen to.
It's so weird that people can't divorce their personal opinions on music from an artist's stature when it comes to a dead genre. Like, I never ever really liked Pearl Jam save for a couple songs, most of which were B-sides -- but that doesn't mean they "aren't a pimple on the ass of the music industry".
Grow the fuck up dude, you sound like you just got out of a time machine from 2002.
Quote:
so yeah, we were both def at PNC. Literally the same show, pretty funny.
Did you go to Pinelands?
Also, that isn't what a Karen is.
And Smashing Pumpkins was not a grunge band. Neither was STP. Only bands from Seattle are grunge, imo. Nirvana, Soundgarden, The Melvins, Mudhoney, The Screaming Trees, Alice in Chains, etc etc..
And Smashing Pumpkins was not a grunge band. Neither was STP. Only bands from Seattle are grunge, imo. Nirvana, Soundgarden, The Melvins, Mudhoney, The Screaming Trees, Alice in Chains, etc etc..
But yeah, if we're talkin grunge, can't forget about Tad and Green River also!
I haven't been on here as much like I used to. This team is not that interesting.
Quote:
great 90s bands.
And Smashing Pumpkins was not a grunge band. Neither was STP. Only bands from Seattle are grunge, imo. Nirvana, Soundgarden, The Melvins, Mudhoney, The Screaming Trees, Alice in Chains, etc etc..
Love Pavement, was going to bring them up earlier in this thread. Little later in the decade, but I liked the Dismemberment Plan also, who always kinda reminded me of Pavement. That scene of indie rock was cool, Built to Spill was another classic. I don't know if they would it in that genre, but Braid was another I liked, although they kind of splintered into that whole initial first-wave-midwest-emo thing.
But yeah, if we're talkin grunge, can't forget about Tad and Green River also!
Not really too much later int he decade. I was into them in 92 with Slanted and enchanted and saw them a few times. And the EP Westing. To me that was their best period ending with Crooked Rain.
Quote:
Is that you Sonic?
Yeah I never said I wasn't Sonic Youth. I've actually said it before in other posts.
Ha that's funny. I had no idea but I was thinking it based on what you were posting in the last couple of music threads. Sup dood?