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Phil Simms: 1979 NFL Draft

Angel Eyes : 4/13/2021 9:41 am
So Phil Simms was famously booed (with Pete Rozelle sporting a shit-eating grin) when he was drafted by the Giants in 1979, something that was shown via archive footage from the 1986 America’s Game.

For someone who was alive then, why did everyone boo Simms? Who did they want instead?
I am sure....no one knew who he was....Morehead St....wtf.  
George from PA : 4/13/2021 9:47 am : link
I do not remember exactly....but I am sure ....it was not received well.
Here's the NYT article from when it happened  
JB_in_DC : 4/13/2021 9:51 am : link








Quote:
Giant fans. hoping to get Jack Thompson in yesterday's college draft of the National Football League, are now hoping they didn't get another Rocky Thompson instead.

The Giants, picking four places after the Cincinnati Bengals chose Jack Thompson of Washington State, generally rated the top quarterback prospect this year, selected Phil Simms, a quarterback from little Morehead State University (enrollment 7,200) in Kentucky.

The choice was a clear indication that the new head coach, Ray Perkins, and the new general manager, George Young, are not overjoyed with the quarterbacks they have inherited. The Giants’ passing game was rated “no better than a junior high school team's” in one scouting report.

To get Simms, however, they passed up players such as Charles Alexander, the Louisiana State University fullback, and Kellen Winslow, the Missouri tight end, who might have helped fill some of their other offensive needs. Those were the names that were being called out by the gallery before the Giants turn came. Simms’ name was greeted with boos.

Simms was such a surprise choice that Tom Power, the promotions director who took the selection over the phone from the team's bunker in Giants Stadium, started writing “Moorehead” instead of “Morehead” under the space for the player's name on the card to be presented to Commissioner Pete Rozelle at the Waldorf‐Astoria.

The Giants have a history of strange first‐round choices. The most infamous, of course, was Rocky Thompson of West Texas State in 1971.

Simms, a 6‐foot‐2¼‐inch, 216‐pound right‐handed thrower who was only a second‐team selection on the all‐Ohio Valley Conference squad last season, was not well‐known by the public. But most scouting reports rated him the second or third best quarterback prospect.

“Thompson‐Simms, Simms‐Thompson,” said Jerry Shay, the Giants’ chief scout, who was responsible for the firstround selection in 1976 of the then‐unheralded Troy Archer. “We had them rated about even.”

“I think Phil Simms, at some paint in time, has a chance to be a great quarterback,” said Perkins.

The coach said that the Giants had Giants Pick Simms, A Quarterback, No. 1 made up their minds to take a quarterback on the first round and that “we had good reason to believe he [Simms] would not be there in the second round.”

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John McVay, Perkins's predecessor and now director of player personnel for the San Francisco 49ers, told one Giant official, “You guys made one hell of a pick.” The 49ers, who picked first on the second round, were believed prepared to take Simms, whom they had rated ahead of Thompson. Shay said there was “no way” that Simms would have lasted even that far.

On the second round, the Giants passed up such running‐back prospects as Tony Nathan of Alabama and Steve Atkins of Maryland to try again to improve their passing game. They chose Ernest Gray, a 6‐3, 195‐pound wide receiver from Memphis State with 4.5second speed for the 40‐yard dash and a National Collegiate record as a junior of 29.5 yards a reception. Shay rated Gray as “another first‐round choice.”

“I'm not trying to brag on myself,” said Gray, “but I have a good pair of hands and deceptive speed because of my long stride.”

Possible Starters

Gray could well be a starter this year. And so could Simms, who reminds both Perkins and Shay of Terry Bradshaw. “He even looks like Bradshaw,” said Shay. “He's blond, big, rawboned. He looks like his clone.”

Simms was visited by Perkins on April 17. The quarterback threw some passes for the coach, and then they had dinner together.

“I know that from what he saw he must have liked me to pick me No. 1,” said Simms by telephone from a Holiday Inn near the Morehead State campus. “I threw the ball well that day, I think, because of the relaxed mood he put me in.”

Simms's team had even a worse season than the Giants did last year — 2‐61. Because, like the Giants, Morehead State tried a ball‐control offense, the quarterback's statistics were not superior. Simms completed 92 of 173 passes, a good 53.2 percentage, but for only 1,229 yards, six touchdowns and 11 Interceptions. For his four‐year career, he completed 409 of 836 passes, 48.9 percent, for a school‐record 5,545 yards and 32 touchdowns, with 45 interceptions.

The Giants, whose third‐round pick went to Miami as compensation for the signing of Larry Csonka in 1976, went to a major college in the fourth round, choosing Phil Tabor, a defensive lineman who led Oklahoma in quarterback sacks last season with 10. With Jack Gregory, the 35‐year‐old defensive captain, apparently being primed for retirement, the Giants felt they had to strengthen their front four.

Giants Selections

Phil Simms, quarterback, Morehead State; Ernest Gray, wide receiver, Memphis State; Phil Tabor, defensive back, Oklahoma; Cleveland Jackson, tight end, Nevada‐Las Vegas; Bob Torrey, running back, Penn State; Eddie Hicks, running back, East Carolima.



Link - ( New Window )
Kellen Winslow  
HMunster : 4/13/2021 9:53 am : link
was still available.


RE: I am sure....no one knew who he was....Morehead St....wtf.  
Jints in Carolina : 4/13/2021 9:54 am : link
In comment 15218497 George from PA said:
Quote:
I do not remember exactly....but I am sure ....it was not received well.


exactly...no one knew who the hell he was.
Yup.  
Big Blue '56 : 4/13/2021 9:56 am : link
Hated the pick. I was actually watching some college football back then and I too had never heard of him..
Simms was picked before the internet, camera phones and cable tv.  
Spider56 : 4/13/2021 10:14 am : link
Even the most ardent college fan could usually only watch games from the major conferences and ND, and only 2 or 3 per week. I doubt anyone outside of the pro scouting organizations ever heard of Simms before his name was called. To a Giant fan, his selection was considered same old, same old.
Bill Walsh was going to draft Simms  
arniefez : 4/13/2021 10:19 am : link
He'd be in the HOF if that happened and Joe Montana probably wouldn't have lasted long in the NFL if he went to the Giants instead.
I was stunned at the pick  
bluepepper : 4/13/2021 10:21 am : link
Had literally never heard of the guy. I assume that was the reason for the reaction at the draft.

However, my tune changed pretty quickly after reading the next days papers. The beat writers were very positive about the pick and said he was a sleeper who was highly regarded by a lot of teams. Also Ray Perkins had worked him out extensively. All this was reassuring. It wasn't the same old Giants after all - they knew what they were doing. Didn't mean he was going to be any good but he definitely had a lot of potential.
Ottis Anderson went right after Simms.  
Mad Mike : 4/13/2021 10:22 am : link
Not a bad sequence of picks. Cards also got Roy Green in that draft, that's a lot of offense for a day's work.
My Dad and I had never heard of Phil Simms  
chick310 : 4/13/2021 10:26 am : link
when we read in the newspapers the next day that he was QB drafted by the Giants.

Walsh even told Simms that he was going to be a 49er  
Greg from LI : 4/13/2021 10:27 am : link
SF had traded their first round pick for OJ Simpson, though, so their first pick was the first pick of the second round. Simms told Walsh that he didn't think he'd still be available by then, to which Walsh said that they had checked around and didn't think anyone was picking Simms in the first round.
no one had heard of Simms, and the Giants passed on  
Del Shofner : 4/13/2021 10:29 am : link
Ottis Anderson (who went next) and HOF'er Kellen Winslow.

That's why people booed.

Worked out just fine, and we even got Ottis later.
Pretty much the story with Walsh  
arniefez : 4/13/2021 10:29 am : link
Quote:
In Glen Dickey's 49ers, it is apparent that Bill really sought Morehead State QB Phil Simms. However, the team traded it's 1979 first round pick in '78 (which ended up being first overall) as part of the package sent to the Bills for O.J. Simpson. This idea would be backed up in Phil Simms' autobiography, Sunday Morning Quarterback. In the book, he mentions how Walsh worked him out and came away impressed with his quick feet. Walsh remembered, "I left feeling Phil was our man, but it would soon become evident that other teams were looking at Phil and he would most likely be drafted before us." Simms ended up being selected seventh overall by the Giants.

Did Bill Walsh Really Target Joe Montana in 1979? - ( New Window )
Rocky Thompson  
Bob from Massachusetts : 4/13/2021 10:32 am : link
That name's just about enough to ruin my whole day.The trauma lives on....
I can remember an anecdote from the Simms/McConkey book  
Greg from LI : 4/13/2021 10:33 am : link
He said that he worked out for Walsh first, who kept telling him to throw nice and easy, not too hard, get in a good rhythm, throw a pretty ball. When he worked out for Perkins, he asked Perkins how he wanted Simms to throw. Perkins told him to throw hard and knock the receivers down.
A steal  
Sec 103 : 4/13/2021 10:40 am : link
a complete steal!!!! Simms and Gray!!!
Kellen Winslow would have been nice, who was gonna throw to him?
..  
Named Later : 4/13/2021 10:49 am : link
As I recall that draft, there were 3 QB's of note -- Jack Thompson was first, the NY press had already nicknamed him The Throwin' Samoan,
A kid from Clemson Steve Fuller,
And Jeff Rutledge from Alabama.
Not a single mention of little Morehead State.

There was no Internet, No WFAN.....you had to get your Draft Updates from CBS News Radio 88 on the quarter hour. I went out to my car at lunchtime, the radio took great joy in replaying the Giants' pick and the crowd reaction. That was tough to take.

The next day in the Newark Star Ledger, Dave Klein had a glowing article, probably fed the info for the Giants Front Office.

I pledged to give the New Kid a chance. We had just watched Craig Morton, Jerry Goldstein and Joe Pisarchick make a mockery of the QB position.

It took a few years and a few injuries, but it paid off in '84 when a Giants QB finally crossed into the exalted 4000 yards passing territory.

God Bless you Phil Simms.....one less Earnest Gray dropped TD Pass and you'd be a lock for the HOF.
He was an unknown from an unknown small school. It was like "who the  
Blue21 : 4/13/2021 10:55 am : link
hell is this guy?" There was no social media then so no one knew much about the draft or prospects like we do today. Today we'd know every team that talked to him prior to the draft etc etc.
Most Giant fans knew nothing about him.  
Giant John : 4/13/2021 10:56 am : link
I don’t think it was directed at Phil so much but more at why are Giants drafting some unknown guy? Well we all know how it turned out.
...  
SFGFNCGiantsFan : 4/13/2021 10:59 am : link
Different era. Was ESPN even around in 79? And if was...who had cable? Morehead State wasn't on national TV.
RE: ...  
Daniel in MI : 4/13/2021 11:33 am : link
In comment 15218667 SFGFNCGiantsFan said:
Quote:
Different era. Was ESPN even around in 79? And if was...who had cable? Morehead State wasn't on national TV.


I don’t think so, and if if it was a fledgling, early on they didn’t have NFL stuff, it was a lot of equestrian events, worlds strongest man, lumberjack competitions...like the fictional ESPN 8- The Ocho.

Looking at Simms’ numbers, holy backlash! His ints were higher than TDs, he played in a ball control O. If he was picked at 1 today fans would riot and Twitter servers would go down from all the flames. I like that they saw him as a Terry Bradshaw clone.
Simms' NFL career stats are something like  
Adam G in Big D : 4/13/2021 11:34 am : link
2 TDs to every 1.5 INTs.

I have been watching a lot of his games on YouTube and he also was a victim of a lot of dropped passes.
1979 was ESPN's first year of operation  
Greg from LI : 4/13/2021 11:37 am : link
And yes, they broadcast anything they could get for cheap. Well into the '80s, I can remember them still broadcasting a lot of stuff like jet ski jumping, lumberjack games, Aussie rules football, etc.
the instant response was Phil who?  
gtt350 : 4/13/2021 11:40 am : link
. it was shock more than disappointment
A big part of it was Rozelle announced the pick twice.  
truebluelarry : 4/13/2021 11:46 am : link
While researching for one of my BBI articles I came across good information about the event, and it ended up taking on a life of it's own via NFL Film replays over and over, and was the catalyst for the draft becoming the mega event it is today.

I don't remember the name of the hotel they held the draft in that year, but it had a modest sized gallery, holding maybe a couple-hundred fans. It wasn't a big thing, it was only die-hard draftniks there and the reaction was more like, "Phil who?".

When it came time for Rozelle to announce Simms as the Giants pick there were a few audible groans from the fans but not a huge deal. The local NY TV members thought it would be great to have the pick recorded so it could be aired that evening. Allegedly it took some prodding and cajoling to get him to do so, but he finally relented. Watch the film again, it is totally staged. As Rozelle steps up to the mic, you'll see him crack a half smile. The Giants fans who were there were juiced and took the opportunity to let themselves be heard. Rozelle even gooses their reaction reaction by emphasizing the call "the Giants select...[dramatic pause]...QUARTERBACK...[fans begin howling]...Phil Simms from Moorehead State..." and he walks away from the podium snickering. It was borderline WWF choreography in real life!

It turned out to be a boon of free publicity though. Aside from being braodcast all over the local news that night, the pick wa splastered on the back pages of all the sports sections, which was normally reserved for baseball in April. Before 1979 most fans weren't even aware there was an NFL draft in April. The 1980 draft was moved to a bigger hotel with a larger gallery and the NFL hype machine took it from there. I think it was a year later ESPN began airing the draft live. No one had ever considered fans would be interested in watching a 10-hour business meeting, but that second take of the Simms pick in 1979 inadvertently created a whole new phenomena: Draft Mania!
From "Phil who?" to...  
GA5 : 4/13/2021 11:52 am : link
"I'm goin' to Disneyland." Not bad, not bad at all!
Another thing to consider is the mind set of those Giant fans  
truebluelarry : 4/13/2021 12:19 pm : link
who were there that day.

This was only a few months after the infamous 1978 season, the Pisarcik fumble, fans burning tickets outside the stadium and flaying a chartered plane saying "15 Years Of Lousy Football, We've Had Enough".
They were on their fourth coach in seven years, this was the first pick of the new Young/Perkins regime.

You can't blame them for having been a little salty! :)
I was young but remember all the booing and bad commentary  
Dinger : 4/13/2021 12:32 pm : link
about the pick. What I remember of the Ernest Gray era, was that he had bad hands. Or that Simms, Brunner or whomever couldn't get him the passes. The Giants identity was Defense 1st running game second. I always got worried that if they needed to complete a pass to win a game we were screwed. That is, until that pass to Bobby Johnson on 4th and 17.
My dad  
hocuspocus : 4/13/2021 1:23 pm : link
desperately wanted the Giants to draft Joe Montana (they were from the same hometown). When they drafted Simms, he yelled:

"Who the hell is Phil Simms? And where the [bleep] is Morehead State?!?"
The ghost of Rocky Thompson  
JerseyCityJoe : 4/13/2021 1:52 pm : link
was still haunting the franchise. It was who? Nobody heard of the guy and it felt like it was the Giants just being clueless as usual.
why did we boo at the time??  
Dave : 4/13/2021 1:53 pm : link
a team in perpetual distress, drafting high, and picking an unknown QB from an unknown college, got booed. No mystery imo
RE: My dad  
truebluelarry : 4/13/2021 2:01 pm : link
In comment 15218937 hocuspocus said:
Quote:
desperately wanted the Giants to draft Joe Montana (they were from the same hometown). When they drafted Simms, he yelled:

"Who the hell is Phil Simms? And where the [bleep] is Morehead State?!?"


The ironic part is that Bill Walsh wanted Simms in the first round, but the Giants took him first. The 49ers ended up getting Montana with the final pick of the third round.


1979 NFL Draft - ( New Window )
Great stuff truebluelarry!  
trueblueinpw : 4/13/2021 2:10 pm : link
Didn’t know that about the double announcement. And while I knew that Walsh and the Niners coveted Simms, I don’t think I ever knew that he was ranked in the top three of QBs in that draft. I remember watching Simms as a little kid but the legend of from where he came was like he was a nobody and the pick was totally off the grid. The truth seems to be that Simms was a highly graded draft prospect by at least the Giants and the 49ers.

I’ve seen a number of people equate the Jones pick to Simms. “No one knew who Simms was either”, or, “Giants fans booed Simms too” and look how that all worked out. The problem with those comparisons though is that while fans didn’t know who Simms was, he was generally regarded as being the second or third best QB in the draft. So, not to turn this into another Jones thread, but the comparisons to Simms, either in terms of the scouting and draft slot, or in terms of the Giants fan reaction, doesn’t really hold up under scrutiny.

Anyway, good post and good comments!
RE: Bill Walsh was going to draft Simms  
NINEster : 4/13/2021 2:11 pm : link
In comment 15218566 arniefez said:
Quote:
He'd be in the HOF if that happened and Joe Montana probably wouldn't have lasted long in the NFL if he went to the Giants instead.


Don't be so sure about that.

They would have kept the stadium doors closed for Joe Clifford. ;)
He would have been selling insurance or  
arniefez : 4/13/2021 2:56 pm : link
trading stocks by 1982 if he had to play behind the OL Simms did his first 5 years in the NFL.
Phil who?  
Simms11 : 4/13/2021 7:03 pm : link
and where the hell is Moorehead State? It was madness in ‘79! I’m glad the Giants made all the naysayers eat crow! It goes to show you that the Team does extensive research and knows the prospects better then the average fan.
The general consensus:  
Joe Beckwith : 4/13/2021 11:41 pm : link
A)Phil Who the hell is that?!
B)Morehead? Where’s Morehead?


I guess you can say  
marbles : 4/14/2021 8:36 am : link
Simms would have been considered a rabbit ears antenna thrower in 1979.
RE: He would have been selling insurance or  
NINEster : 4/14/2021 3:34 pm : link
In comment 15219073 arniefez said:
Quote:
trading stocks by 1982 if he had to play behind the OL Simms did his first 5 years in the NFL.


Anyone who can come back from back surgery 56 days later to play (1986), and return after Burt, Marshall, etc. is entitled the benefit of the doubt at merely surviving in the league behind an allegedly terrible OL.

Buddy Ryan Eagles in '89 and Oilers in '93 smashed him up hard and couldn't KO him or beat him.

I know, Ronnie Lott was the only tough player in the Bay.

LOL.
RE: I was young but remember all the booing and bad commentary  
BlueVinnie : 4/14/2021 4:38 pm : link
In comment 15218817 Dinger said:
Quote:
about the pick. What I remember of the Ernest Gray era, was that he had bad hands. Or that Simms, Brunner or whomever couldn't get him the passes. The Giants identity was Defense 1st running game second. I always got worried that if they needed to complete a pass to win a game we were screwed. That is, until that pass to Bobby Johnson on 4th and 17.

Oh man! I still remember that play and thinking afterward, "this could actually be the year".
That was George Young's first pick...  
BillKo : 4/14/2021 4:38 pm : link
..and a ballsy one at that, esp considering Simms' stats and success in college (hadn't seen that before!).

GY said you have to give the fans hope, and a QB does that.....one of the reasons - besides pure talent - that the pick was made.

The Simms deep out pass and seam pass are still among the best I've seen..........
Jack Thompson doesn't look like had a fantastic career?  
Bill L : 4/14/2021 4:44 pm : link
?
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