The rumor is floating around that the Warriors intend on making a big run at Leonard. The Knicks can absorb Wiggins entire salary (about 31 per for the next 2). Wiggins + the Wolves pick (top 3 protected this season) unprotected in 2022) + the Wolves 2nd rounder this year. Would be a very strong move for the Knicks and one I think GS would very much consider if they do in fact hope to sign Leonard.
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but whatever nonsense source you quoted earlier said "According to Evan Massey of ESPN and Yahoo" (like you can work for both at the same time, lol).
There's a whole echo chamber of NBA "writers" who throw out nonsense rumors which then get retweeted and picked up by aggregators and spun as "news".
Back in the real world, the Warriors won't be dumping Wiggins along with picks to clear room for a max player because they'd still be over the cap.
If they want to get involved with any free agents this summer for more than the MLE, it would have to be via sign-and-trade. And event that might be difficult to pull off under the cap apron.
Unless we package a ton of picks for Beal or Lavine. (Or my dream scenario D. Mitchell).
We need to act quick because Thibs is not walking into next season with a bench of all 2nd and 1st year players.
Wiseman
Minny pick
2021 GS pick
Wiggins which cost more to give up
Another future first
That said i concur there is no way this happens, dont see how GSW can sign leonard even if they gut everything on the roster except the original trio.
Picks are great if we can move them for players or package to move up in the draft.
The Knicks are not adding 3 or 4 rookies to this roster.
Agreed. I have little doubt that the KNicks are trading quantity for quality this coming off-season and for numerous reasons. First off the Knicks need star power and they have a bunch of young players and picks already. And Thibs isn't a fan of a big rotation.
I'd do this deal. Kind of think Wiggins could be a good defensive player if he's in the right spot.
That Minny pick is going to be amazing, but that Wiggins contract is a killer for the next couple of years.
I think doing that deal would be a no brainer, but the one thing that gives me pause is it's going to make a weird timeline for the team where Randle will be the elder statesman of the group and the young players would be RJ, Minny pick, Quickley, etc.
IF you go that route, you're basically praying that the pick is a star player because in the next couple of years you have to sign Randle to the max, look at giving Mitch and maybe Noel deals.
That Wiggins contract would def be tradeable next year.
Thibs is gonna murder Brock Aller in cold blood.
I would be okay with this if the Knicks had no future on the horizon, but this season shows they're not that far off.
I would be okay with this if the Knicks had no future on the horizon, but this season shows they're not that far off.
Wiggins makes the Knicks a better team on the court as well. He's overpaid but let's not pretend he's trash. He'd be at worst their third-best player come opening night.
47% from the field, 38% from 3, 5 rebounds.
14.6 PER, .065 WS/48
"Wiggins’ defensive metrics are all in a better place than in recent years. His ESPN Defensive Real Plus-Minus is 1.36, good enough for No. 9 among players listed as small forwards and by far the best mark of Wiggins’ career."
That's the team I fear getting Lonzo. They need a point too.
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and Bulls expected to be the "top" teams in on Ball and NO unlikely to match anything over 20 per Berman
That's the team I fear getting Lonzo. They need a point too.
According to multiple reports they made an "aggressive" bid for him via trade so it's safe to assume they will be hot for him.
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is that the Knicks should be actively trying to improve this roster, not sitting in a holding pattern with a bad contract soaking up all their money.
I would be okay with this if the Knicks had no future on the horizon, but this season shows they're not that far off.
Wiggins makes the Knicks a better team on the court as well. He's overpaid but let's not pretend he's trash. He'd be at worst their third-best player come opening night.
47% from the field, 38% from 3, 5 rebounds.
14.6 PER, .065 WS/48
I admittedly haven't seen enough of him to have an opinion of how good he's been, but is the addition he'd make so much so that it's worth taking on that contract? Because the money you give him is money you can't spend elsewhere of course. It's not as if they're one player away.
Wiggins is only 26 years old and would give you 3 legit scoring threats.
With Randle being the oldest starter at 27.
Sign me up!
(Based on only players under contract)
Wiggins, Mitch, Randle, Barrett, IQ, Toppin, Knox, Frank + the 2 firsts the Knicks already have... Wiggins would represent roughly half of the Knicks cap space, they could still sign a Lonzo Ball if they wanted to, they could still sign a Lowry short term etc. They aren't signing 60 million in "good NBA FA's" in one off-season. Wiggins has 2 years left, it's not some huge long term commitment... he's also only 3 years older than Obi Toppin.
Thibs on Wiggins
"“Huge difference. He’s grown. I think this environment is perfect for him. I think the job that Steve (Kerr) and his staff has done, they’ve challenged him to grow," Thibodeau told Strauss. "His defense is vastly improved. His all-around play, too, and it will get better and better. Playing with guys like Steph and Draymond (Green) and when Klay (Thompson)’s back, that’s going to be a big bonus for him. Andrew is a great guy. He’s very talented and gifted and that’s the thing you can’t lose sight of, what the Warriors have done. The obvious is Steph, Klay and Draymond, but adding these young pieces that are so talented. They’re going to be good for a long time.”"
“What is apparent is he and Andrew had a great relationship and Andrew said that as well,” Kerr said. “I know Andrew told me he really enjoyed playing for him and appreciated his commitment.”
Lonzo, Wiggins, RJ, Randle, Mitch would be the Knicks best starting 5 in a very, very long time. Randle would be the old man of that group, 27 for the entire 2022 season.
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is that the Knicks should be actively trying to improve this roster, not sitting in a holding pattern with a bad contract soaking up all their money.
I would be okay with this if the Knicks had no future on the horizon, but this season shows they're not that far off.
Wiggins makes the Knicks a better team on the court as well. He's overpaid but let's not pretend he's trash. He'd be at worst their third-best player come opening night.
47% from the field, 38% from 3, 5 rebounds.
14.6 PER, .065 WS/48
14.6 PER is pretty much league average....and his 3 pt shooting this year appears to be an outlier. Yes he makes them a better team but at some point you have to make smart decisions with regards to allocating cap dollars.
$30 million for a player of this caliber when you have other glaring needs is not smart.
This states the case perfectly. Absolutely do it if it can be done - the fact that Wiggins and Thibs are simpatico is a bonus.
and why the Warriors are including a lottery pick to dump Wiggins?
In your fantasy land scenario, the pick makes Wiggins' contract easier to swallow - but 2/65 for a non all-star that doesn't address our biggest needs (and plays the same position as RJ) just isn't a smart use of cap resources.
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have 60 million (or so to spend) and would be getting either a strong pick this year (top 3 protected) or the Wolves 2022 pick (who knows?). They still would have more than enough money to sign a "premium" (Lonzo, Trent etc) FA to pair with the Wiggins addition. The Knicks are pretty clearly a legit playoff team with Wiggins/Lonzo, the current core AND their own 2 firsts (not to mention potentially a very high Wolves pick). Those picks would also allow you to potentially trade for another good player.
and why the Warriors are including a lottery pick to dump Wiggins?
In your fantasy land scenario, the pick makes Wiggins' contract easier to swallow - but 2/65 for a non all-star that doesn't address our biggest needs (and plays the same position as RJ) just isn't a smart use of cap resources.
I'm not advocating doing the deal without the pick #1. #2 They are inarguably better on the court with Wiggins + say Lonzo Ball. 2 for 65 WITH the pick is the only math that matters, but Wiggins makes the Knicks a better team on the court. If you feel otherwise I don't know what else there is to say. He's a superior player to other players on the roster who are playing the minutes he would be playing.
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have 60 million (or so to spend) and would be getting either a strong pick this year (top 3 protected) or the Wolves 2022 pick (who knows?). They still would have more than enough money to sign a "premium" (Lonzo, Trent etc) FA to pair with the Wiggins addition. The Knicks are pretty clearly a legit playoff team with Wiggins/Lonzo, the current core AND their own 2 firsts (not to mention potentially a very high Wolves pick). Those picks would also allow you to potentially trade for another good player.
and why the Warriors are including a lottery pick to dump Wiggins?
In your fantasy land scenario, the pick makes Wiggins' contract easier to swallow - but 2/65 for a non all-star that doesn't address our biggest needs (and plays the same position as RJ) just isn't a smart use of cap resources.
So you would rather start Bullock over Wiggons?
Sorry, but if we can afford it, I take wiggins/Barrett as our 2/3 over Bullock any day. Wiggins is shooting almost 49%FG, can finish at the rim and is over 38 from 3. He wouldbe a great add for 2 years.
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In comment 15220778 DanMetroMan said:
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have 60 million (or so to spend) and would be getting either a strong pick this year (top 3 protected) or the Wolves 2022 pick (who knows?). They still would have more than enough money to sign a "premium" (Lonzo, Trent etc) FA to pair with the Wiggins addition. The Knicks are pretty clearly a legit playoff team with Wiggins/Lonzo, the current core AND their own 2 firsts (not to mention potentially a very high Wolves pick). Those picks would also allow you to potentially trade for another good player.
and why the Warriors are including a lottery pick to dump Wiggins?
In your fantasy land scenario, the pick makes Wiggins' contract easier to swallow - but 2/65 for a non all-star that doesn't address our biggest needs (and plays the same position as RJ) just isn't a smart use of cap resources.
I'm not advocating doing the deal without the pick #1. #2 They are inarguably better on the court with Wiggins + say Lonzo Ball. 2 for 65 WITH the pick is the only math that matters, but Wiggins makes the Knicks a better team on the court. If you feel otherwise I don't know what else there is to say. He's a superior player to other players on the roster who are playing the minutes he would be playing.
again, why the Warriors are including a lottery pick to dump Wiggins' contract?
I can name a bunch of players superior to players on our roster that we can acquire via unrealistic trades. Maybe we can start some other threads to discuss? Should be fun!
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In comment 15220778 DanMetroMan said:
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have 60 million (or so to spend) and would be getting either a strong pick this year (top 3 protected) or the Wolves 2022 pick (who knows?). They still would have more than enough money to sign a "premium" (Lonzo, Trent etc) FA to pair with the Wiggins addition. The Knicks are pretty clearly a legit playoff team with Wiggins/Lonzo, the current core AND their own 2 firsts (not to mention potentially a very high Wolves pick). Those picks would also allow you to potentially trade for another good player.
and why the Warriors are including a lottery pick to dump Wiggins?
In your fantasy land scenario, the pick makes Wiggins' contract easier to swallow - but 2/65 for a non all-star that doesn't address our biggest needs (and plays the same position as RJ) just isn't a smart use of cap resources.
So you would rather start Bullock over Wiggons?
Sorry, but if we can afford it, I take wiggins/Barrett as our 2/3 over Bullock any day. Wiggins is shooting almost 49%FG, can finish at the rim and is over 38 from 3. He wouldbe a great add for 2 years.
well we can "afford" it...but do we want to? Wiggins is better than Bullock, but is he good enough to justify his cap hit the next 2 seasons? If he was consistently an above average 3 pt shooter, the contract doesn't hurt as much, but for the vast majority of his career he's been below average. I'd rather just go with Burks at 1/3 the cost.
again, why the Warriors are including a lottery pick to dump Wiggins' contract?
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really clear why you have such an attitude about this, nor do I generally start trade idea threads but keep ranting if it makes you feel better.
again, why the Warriors are including a lottery pick to dump Wiggins' contract?
To free up room to chase better players. Curry/Klay/Green (though he'd likely be moved too) aren't getting any younger. You've repeatedly noted how overpaid Wiggins is, how he's not worth anywhere near his money aka to move such an albatross they would have to include an asset.
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In comment 15220847 DanMetroMan said:
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really clear why you have such an attitude about this, nor do I generally start trade idea threads but keep ranting if it makes you feel better.
again, why the Warriors are including a lottery pick to dump Wiggins' contract?
To free up room to chase better players. Curry/Klay/Green (though he'd likely be moved too) aren't getting any younger. You've repeatedly noted how overpaid Wiggins is, how he's not worth anywhere near his money aka to move such an albatross they would have to include an asset.
Congrats on finally realizing just unloading Wiggins doesn't help them with the cap. So now they have to unload both Wiggins AND Green without taking any money back so that they can chase an impact player. How is that happening? he kicker is that even if they do that, they STILL wouldn't have max cap room (based on a $115 million cap).
The claim is he won't leave Cali. That even Riley was licking his chops but is now convinced that Leonard wants to stay close to "home"
Minnesota has the worst record in the NBA. The bottom 3 teams in the league each have a 40.1% chance of having a Top 3 pick.
4th worst record is 36.6% (3.5 games ahead of Minny)
5th worst record 31.5% (6 games ahead of Minny).
For all intents and purposes, if the Knicks were to get Minnesota's 2021 Draft pick, there's only a 60% chance that they would actually get the draft pick.
Minnesota has the worst record in the NBA. The bottom 3 teams in the league each have a 40.1% chance of having a Top 3 pick.
4th worst record is 36.6% (3.5 games ahead of Minny)
5th worst record 31.5% (6 games ahead of Minny).
For all intents and purposes, if the Knicks were to get Minnesota's 2021 Draft pick, there's only a 60% chance that they would actually get the draft pick.
Completely unprotected in 2022.
The Knicks have made some bad signings, but that has to be among the 2 or 3 worst. Phil’s weed must’ve been laced with something in order to think that was a good idea.
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Next year $6m! Then finally done. It seems like it’s been 20 years.
The Knicks have made some bad signings, but that has to be among the 2 or 3 worst. Phil’s weed must’ve been laced with something in order to think that was a good idea.
People on here could not believe it was possibly true that the Knicks would give anywhere near that deal (4 for 72). It seemed so inflated that it had to be wrong. Nope.
would Rose, Wade, Melo, KP, Noah been any different?
Where the Knicks are picking you are not getting a rookie impact PG.
So you need to go hard for Lonzo.
Still leaves you 40 million to fill the roster.
Derozen would be a good signing and fit right in with this team.
I would resign Noel and let Robinson play out the option next year.
Let Mitch become unrestricted in
2022.
RJ
Randle
Mitch/Noel
Derozen
Lonzo
Is a top 4 roster in the east and we still have a ton of picks over the next few years.
And as others have noted- Wiggins can help this team. Of course he's overpaid but its only for 2 years.
I would try to squeeze more out of Golden State or take a run at Leonard themselves- but I would do this trade in a heartbeat. Incredible trade for the Knicks and if the Warriors can Leonard out of it- can't blame them either.