As another poster brought up, Giants did not spend close to 200 million dollars this offseason in contracts to wait and see while the kids learn on the job. I think they are looking for less growing pains and instant return on investment this year from the team as a whole. This will shape how they roster construct and prepare for the season moving forward.
What does this mean as it relates to the draft? The top 3 rounds are usually considered the 'premium' rounds. These are rounds generally that you can aim for players who will be contributors year 1. This is especially true for round 1 and 2.
I think any of the players the Giants go for this year will be the types they think can be day 1 impact players.
It's why if they went EDGE@11, I agree and think it would be Paye who has a more well rounded game over Ojulari. (though I like Ojulari a lot).
Even Jayson Oweh if they go for him in round 2 (or via slight trade up) it's because they think under Chaos he can step in right away and be a positive contributor on the D side of the ball. There are a few commentators who actually feel despite the 0 sacks (he had 7 sacks in 13 games prior under Chaos) that he has a pretty well rounded game and his acclimation time to the NFL won't be too long despite lack of many years experience at the position.
Devonta Smith should he be our round 1 pick is as polished as they come and Waddle is no slouch himself.
There will be many round 2 Lineman and even into round 3 with how deep this draft is that can play day 1 or close to it.
Will the offensive line, notably Thomas, Gates, Peart, Hernandez, and Lemieux, take a big step forward?
Will Daniel Jones improve and become the long term answer at QB?
Will any of the pass rushers improve to become a dependable starter?
I expect the Giants to add more talent at WR, G, and ER in the draft. Hopefully all three positions are settled because it would greatly improve their playoff hopes.
4 players were 188 million of the 215 and only 3 of them have major dead money cap implications after this year.
I don't think Giants are close to being a finished product roster wise and I think there will be a big turnover after 2021 too.
RG is the biggest question mark.
However, I can't see them passing on either of the Alabama wide receivers if they are available. Smith is a high achiever, high character player and Waddle brings a dynamic presence the Giants have not had. Both would have an immediate impact.
I would not "throw the remote" with Slater, I just think if you pick a lineman that high he should be your left tackle. We already have that! Great RTs, G and centers are constantly found in later rounds. If we pick a guard round 2 he probably will compete to start.
What makes this draft so interesting is the fact without the usual info, someone we don't expect will drop. Probably in the 2nd round too....can't wait!
They were 6-10 last year. I repeat 6-10, and played in the worst Div in NFL history, so even if they would have snuck in, and won the Div it would be NOTHING to brag about. Dallas, and Washington are better right now, so just getting to 9-8 would be a major accomplishment.
Giants came VERY close to being the least bad team in the NFC East.
:-)
Arniefez - good answer.
Both reasoned and thoughtful.
As for me - I'm jut hopeful.
The roster isn't ready to contend for a SB, but hopefully it will have enough talent, growth, and synthesis to push for a playoff spot to begin the process.
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I think that think they can take that crown in 2021 and they’re going for it.
They were 6-10 last year. I repeat 6-10, and played in the worst Div in NFL history, so even if they would have snuck in, and won the Div it would be NOTHING to brag about. Dallas, and Washington are better right now, so just getting to 9-8 would be a major accomplishment.
I’m sorry, Washington is not better than the Giants. Can we see Washington beat the Giants just ONCE before everyone proclaiming this nonsense? Yeah, Washington won the division. By one game from the result of that one game separation being against a team that intentionally lost the game. Giants beat them twice.
This love affair with Washington is very strange.
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In comment 15222027 JohnB said:
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I think that think they can take that crown in 2021 and they’re going for it.
They were 6-10 last year. I repeat 6-10, and played in the worst Div in NFL history, so even if they would have snuck in, and won the Div it would be NOTHING to brag about. Dallas, and Washington are better right now, so just getting to 9-8 would be a major accomplishment.
I’m sorry, Washington is not better than the Giants. Can we see Washington beat the Giants just ONCE before everyone proclaiming this nonsense? Yeah, Washington won the division. By one game from the result of that one game separation being against a team that intentionally lost the game. Giants beat them twice.
This love affair with Washington is very strange.
A bit of an overreaction. How is what he posted suggesting a "love affair" with Washington?
Wash could very well be better. They won the division using a different QB it seemed almost every week. And the two Giant wins against them were by a total of 4 points so the games were pretty even.
Their roster has some talent and if they can figure out something stable, albeit not great, at QB then they may have something.
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I think that think they can take that crown in 2021 and they’re going for it.
They were 6-10 last year. I repeat 6-10, and played in the worst Div in NFL history, so even if they would have snuck in, and won the Div it would be NOTHING to brag about. Dallas, and Washington are better right now, so just getting to 9-8 would be a major accomplishment.
I don’t think the Giants share your opinion. It’s been a long losing stretch and bringing it to an end with the NFC East crown is highly desired regardless of the final record.
I’m thinking that’s Mara’s thinking after watching Washington squeeze in last year when it could have been us.
In true JerseyJoe fashion, you're going to create a thread a day saying the same things aren't you??
Each of these threads seems to be another way to work Ojulari and Oweh into the discussion.
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In comment 15222047 Old Blue said:
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In comment 15222027 JohnB said:
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I think that think they can take that crown in 2021 and they’re going for it.
They were 6-10 last year. I repeat 6-10, and played in the worst Div in NFL history, so even if they would have snuck in, and won the Div it would be NOTHING to brag about. Dallas, and Washington are better right now, so just getting to 9-8 would be a major accomplishment.
I’m sorry, Washington is not better than the Giants. Can we see Washington beat the Giants just ONCE before everyone proclaiming this nonsense? Yeah, Washington won the division. By one game from the result of that one game separation being against a team that intentionally lost the game. Giants beat them twice.
This love affair with Washington is very strange.
A bit of an overreaction. How is what he posted suggesting a "love affair" with Washington?
Wash could very well be better. They won the division using a different QB it seemed almost every week. And the two Giant wins against them were by a total of 4 points so the games were pretty even.
Their roster has some talent and if they can figure out something stable, albeit not great, at QB then they may have something.
The Giants beat Seattle last year, so we’re they a better team than Seattle?? The Giants were a very bad team in a even worse Division, so until the Giants can at least get to 9-8 they are still a very bad team.
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In comment 15222027 JohnB said:
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I think that think they can take that crown in 2021 and they’re going for it.
They were 6-10 last year. I repeat 6-10, and played in the worst Div in NFL history, so even if they would have snuck in, and won the Div it would be NOTHING to brag about. Dallas, and Washington are better right now, so just getting to 9-8 would be a major accomplishment.
I don’t think the Giants share your opinion. It’s been a long losing stretch and bringing it to an end with the NFC East crown is highly desired regardless of the final record.
I’m thinking that’s Mara’s thinking after watching Washington squeeze in last year when it could have been us.
That's pretty much how they shouldn't look at 2020, imv. Too narrow, not enough self-assessment that leads to changes and growth at various levels of the organization. Fans can afford to look at it this way, professional leaders should not, imv.
Giants were a bad football team in a historically bad division in 2020. Their perspective should be about building a better program from bottom up, rather than squeaking out a division crown and 6-7 wins.
However, I can't see them passing on either of the Alabama wide receivers if they are available. Smith is a high achiever, high character player and Waddle brings a dynamic presence the Giants have not had. Both would have an immediate impact.
I would not "throw the remote" with Slater, I just think if you pick a lineman that high he should be your left tackle. We already have that! Great RTs, G and centers are constantly found in later rounds. If we pick a guard round 2 he probably will compete to start.
What makes this draft so interesting is the fact without the usual info, someone we don't expect will drop. Probably in the 2nd round too....can't wait!
Some good points ed. You could argue that Slater though could have a Zack Martin like impact for a Garrett offense.And it happens to be a position of high need
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In comment 15222047 Old Blue said:
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In comment 15222027 JohnB said:
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I think that think they can take that crown in 2021 and they’re going for it.
They were 6-10 last year. I repeat 6-10, and played in the worst Div in NFL history, so even if they would have snuck in, and won the Div it would be NOTHING to brag about. Dallas, and Washington are better right now, so just getting to 9-8 would be a major accomplishment.
I’m sorry, Washington is not better than the Giants. Can we see Washington beat the Giants just ONCE before everyone proclaiming this nonsense? Yeah, Washington won the division. By one game from the result of that one game separation being against a team that intentionally lost the game. Giants beat them twice.
This love affair with Washington is very strange.
A bit of an overreaction. How is what he posted suggesting a "love affair" with Washington?
Wash could very well be better. They won the division using a different QB it seemed almost every week. And the two Giant wins against them were by a total of 4 points so the games were pretty even.
Their roster has some talent and if they can figure out something stable, albeit not great, at QB then they may have something.
Still blaming Philly for losing the Stinkin div. How about blaming the 6-10 record.
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In comment 15222047 Old Blue said:
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In comment 15222027 JohnB said:
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I think that think they can take that crown in 2021 and they’re going for it.
They were 6-10 last year. I repeat 6-10, and played in the worst Div in NFL history, so even if they would have snuck in, and won the Div it would be NOTHING to brag about. Dallas, and Washington are better right now, so just getting to 9-8 would be a major accomplishment.
I’m sorry, Washington is not better than the Giants. Can we see Washington beat the Giants just ONCE before everyone proclaiming this nonsense? Yeah, Washington won the division. By one game from the result of that one game separation being against a team that intentionally lost the game. Giants beat them twice.
This love affair with Washington is very strange.
A bit of an overreaction. How is what he posted suggesting a "love affair" with Washington?
Wash could very well be better. They won the division using a different QB it seemed almost every week. And the two Giant wins against them were by a total of 4 points so the games were pretty even.
Their roster has some talent and if they can figure out something stable, albeit not great, at QB then they may have something.
It’s not all about what he said. It was a general thought based on what I keep seeing on this site. It’s been said numerous times by several posters that Washington is better than the Giants. It’s stated as fact. I know you’re a typically negative poster when it comes to this team and that’s fine, it’s well deserved. But let me ask you something. and I hope you are honest with your answer. If the roles were reversed and Washington beat the Giants twice last season but the Giants ended up winning the division by one game that was essentially handed to them because the opponent had zero interest in winning the game in week 17, would all these same posters be so quick to say the Giants are better than Washington? We both know the answer to that.
Not sure you read my post correctly as my comment about overreaction was to the other poster.
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In comment 15222067 BigBlueShock said:
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In comment 15222047 Old Blue said:
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In comment 15222027 JohnB said:
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I think that think they can take that crown in 2021 and they’re going for it.
They were 6-10 last year. I repeat 6-10, and played in the worst Div in NFL history, so even if they would have snuck in, and won the Div it would be NOTHING to brag about. Dallas, and Washington are better right now, so just getting to 9-8 would be a major accomplishment.
I’m sorry, Washington is not better than the Giants. Can we see Washington beat the Giants just ONCE before everyone proclaiming this nonsense? Yeah, Washington won the division. By one game from the result of that one game separation being against a team that intentionally lost the game. Giants beat them twice.
This love affair with Washington is very strange.
A bit of an overreaction. How is what he posted suggesting a "love affair" with Washington?
Wash could very well be better. They won the division using a different QB it seemed almost every week. And the two Giant wins against them were by a total of 4 points so the games were pretty even.
Their roster has some talent and if they can figure out something stable, albeit not great, at QB then they may have something.
Still blaming Philly for losing the Stinkin div. How about blaming the 6-10 record.
They beat Washington twice. I don’t give a fuck about the division. YOU are the one that said Washington is better. What the hell is this based on? I’m sorry, I’m not saying that Washington is better until I see it on the field. They had two chances last year. Two, not one, two. Same team won both games and it wasn’t Washington. When I see Washington beat the Giants on the field, at that point I can reevaluate. People get way too caught up in their DL because we are all obsessed with pass rush. And that team is getting overly glamorized because of it.
Not sure you read my post correctly as my comment about overreaction was to the other poster.
They could be the better team. Maybe, that guy stated it as if it’s a fact. That’s where it’s bullshit. Never mind the fact they haven’t beaten the Giants in years.
It’s not all about what he said. It was a general thought based on what I keep seeing on this site. It’s been said numerous times by several posters that Washington is better than the Giants. It’s stated as fact. I know you’re a typically negative poster when it comes to this team and that’s fine, it’s well deserved. But let me ask you something. and I hope you are honest with your answer. If the roles were reversed and Washington beat the Giants twice last season but the Giants ended up winning the division by one game that was essentially handed to them because the opponent had zero interest in winning the game in week 17, would all these same posters be so quick to say the Giants are better than Washington? We both know the answer to that.
I am on the site pretty frequently and I certainly do not see posters shouting from the mountain top that Washington is better than the Giants. If it has been mentioned several times then so be it, but it is certainly not often enough to be worthy of this. By the way, I don't think its unfair to say that Wash isn't better.
As to if the roles were reversed. it would be the same sentiment. The Giants might be better or Washington might be. Is there really a truly right and truly wrong answer either way between two teams trying to figure out right now how to win more games than they lose?
As to being a negative poster, that's your opinion. I try to call them as I see them which right now is sizing up a 6-10 team that has some good reason for hope if Barkley gets back on the field and Jones develops.
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In comment 15222071 chick310 said:
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In comment 15222067 BigBlueShock said:
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In comment 15222047 Old Blue said:
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In comment 15222027 JohnB said:
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I think that think they can take that crown in 2021 and they’re going for it.
They were 6-10 last year. I repeat 6-10, and played in the worst Div in NFL history, so even if they would have snuck in, and won the Div it would be NOTHING to brag about. Dallas, and Washington are better right now, so just getting to 9-8 would be a major accomplishment.
I’m sorry, Washington is not better than the Giants. Can we see Washington beat the Giants just ONCE before everyone proclaiming this nonsense? Yeah, Washington won the division. By one game from the result of that one game separation being against a team that intentionally lost the game. Giants beat them twice.
This love affair with Washington is very strange.
A bit of an overreaction. How is what he posted suggesting a "love affair" with Washington?
Wash could very well be better. They won the division using a different QB it seemed almost every week. And the two Giant wins against them were by a total of 4 points so the games were pretty even.
Their roster has some talent and if they can figure out something stable, albeit not great, at QB then they may have something.
Still blaming Philly for losing the Stinkin div. How about blaming the 6-10 record.
They beat Washington twice. I don’t give a fuck about the division. YOU are the one that said Washington is better. What the hell is this based on? I’m sorry, I’m not saying that Washington is better until I see it on the field. They had two chances last year. Two, not one, two. Same team won both games and it wasn’t Washington. When I see Washington beat the Giants on the field, at that point I can reevaluate. People get way too caught up in their DL because we are all obsessed with pass rush. And that team is getting overly glamorized because of it.
Big deal that they beat Washington twice. They beat Seattle too, and they wasn’t better than Seattle, and they played Tampa close, but they aren’t in the same league as Tampa. They took out the garbage, and won 4 games in the garbage division. Big deal. I still would go with Washington as the better team, and Dak being back makes Dallas better too.Either way all the teams are bad at this point until that get to a winning record.
Lost to the Rams by 6, Bears by 4 and Bucs by 2.(And beat a good Seattle team)
I keep hearing that it wasn't the same team (Bucs) that won the Super Bowl. To that I say - "that's hog-wash"
If you look at the games in which they got their butts kicked (SF, Ravens, Bengals) - there you can see the holes which can/are being corrected this year (with /FA, and hopefully the draft)...
True "X" receiver (Galladay), book-end compliment to Bradberry (Jackson), legit edge (Paye) and more help on the O-line (Wyatt Davis).
Of course, in the first round, all bets are off, if they can get their grubby little hands on Alabama's Smith.
Lost to the Rams by 6, Bears by 4 and Bucs by 2.(And beat a good Seattle team)
I keep hearing that it wasn't the same team (Bucs) that won the Super Bowl. To that I say - "that's hog-wash"
If you look at the games in which they got their butts kicked (SF, Ravens, Bengals) - there you can see the holes which can/are being corrected this year (with /FA, and hopefully the draft)...
True "X" receiver (Galladay), book-end compliment to Bradberry (Jackson), legit edge (Paye) and more help on the O-line (Wyatt Davis).
Of course, in the first round, all bets are off, if they can get their grubby little hands on Alabama's Smith.
Bottom line they were 6-10, and a losing record for the fourth year in a row. They could have won more of the close games last year, and they could have lost more of the close games. Could have gone 9-7, or could have gone 4-12. Right now on paper it looks like they have improved, but games aren’t won on paper.
4 players were 188 million of the 215 and only 3 of them have major dead money cap implications after this year.
I don't think Giants are close to being a finished product roster wise and I think there will be a big turnover after 2021 too.
Good post! The giants free agent spending was mostly short term
Giants came VERY close to being the least bad team in the NFC East.
:-)
hahaha...very nice
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I think that think they can take that crown in 2021 and they’re going for it.
They were 6-10 last year. I repeat 6-10, and played in the worst Div in NFL history, so even if they would have snuck in, and won the Div it would be NOTHING to brag about. Dallas, and Washington are better right now, so just getting to 9-8 would be a major accomplishment.
That's not a nuanced argument. They lost their best player in the first quarter of week 2, played 3 rookies on OL, a guy playing a new position at C for the first time, and a QB that was still developing, and a brand nee head coach and system everyone was learning for the first time.
With that team they went 5-3 in the second half.
They lost Tomlinson, but added Golladay, Jackson, Odenigbo, and guys that are good gambles like Ryan Anderson.
And they should get back the best RB in the NFL, and a really good player at 11, at minimum.
This division will come down to the Giants and Cowboys, and both may make the playoffs.
The biggest factor with the Giants is Judge. He has a spark about him, and he's building the right culture.
There's every reason to be optimistic. This team is going to battle. And they may end up being a surprise contender if things fall right.
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In comment 15222027 JohnB said:
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I think that think they can take that crown in 2021 and they’re going for it.
They were 6-10 last year. I repeat 6-10, and played in the worst Div in NFL history, so even if they would have snuck in, and won the Div it would be NOTHING to brag about. Dallas, and Washington are better right now, so just getting to 9-8 would be a major accomplishment.
That's not a nuanced argument. They lost their best player in the first quarter of week 2, played 3 rookies on OL, a guy playing a new position at C for the first time, and a QB that was still developing, and a brand nee head coach and system everyone was learning for the first time.
With that team they went 5-3 in the second half.
They lost Tomlinson, but added Golladay, Jackson, Odenigbo, and guys that are good gambles like Ryan Anderson.
And they should get back the best RB in the NFL, and a really good player at 11, at minimum.
This division will come down to the Giants and Cowboys, and both may make the playoffs.
The biggest factor with the Giants is Judge. He has a spark about him, and he's building the right culture.
There's every reason to be optimistic. This team is going to battle. And they may end up being a surprise contender if things fall right.
Nice post. Now upgrade the OG spot , WR and Edge in the top 3-4 rounds and let's go to war!
Also, saying Washington is the better team is also bullshit because they got beat twice last year and IIRC, twice the previous year. Despite the great defensive line, the Giants maligned offensive line handled them quite thoroughly and that says a lot.
Nobody wins the division in the offseason, but it can go a long way to setting the stage. The Giants offense sucked last year. It sucked because Barkley got hurt in the 2nd game, the offensive line was very bad to start the year and still bad at year end, and Jones had nobody to throw to...
We do not know enough about Jones after two years. He is still a turnover machine but showed vast improvement after single handedly losing the Tampa game. We do not know about the offensive line, but we do know DG/JJ got Jones some help as far as receivers. The question, without doubt will be how the offensive line improves. Losing Zeitler was overrated. I never saw him do anything special, even if he was the least bad OG and that is not saying much and certainly not worth $12 mill.
There is no doubt that they feel they can compete for the still weak NFC Least. The important signings were the ones that went multiple years - Williams, Golladay, Jackson and Rudolph. The others are fill the hole signings with a look see. I expect nothing at this point because I do not know how things will improve. But yes the FA period was to give the team the chance to compete and show some improvement.
The irony of 2004 was that the team started 5-2 and nearly stumbled into playoff contention. As bad as Looked at times, if the Giants' defensive line hadn't been crushed by injuries, Eli might never have seen the field.
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In comment 15222027 JohnB said:
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I think that think they can take that crown in 2021 and they’re going for it.
They were 6-10 last year. I repeat 6-10, and played in the worst Div in NFL history, so even if they would have snuck in, and won the Div it would be NOTHING to brag about. Dallas, and Washington are better right now, so just getting to 9-8 would be a major accomplishment.
That's not a nuanced argument. They lost their best player in the first quarter of week 2, played 3 rookies on OL, a guy playing a new position at C for the first time, and a QB that was still developing, and a brand nee head coach and system everyone was learning for the first time.
With that team they went 5-3 in the second half.
They lost Tomlinson, but added Golladay, Jackson, Odenigbo, and guys that are good gambles like Ryan Anderson.
And they should get back the best RB in the NFL, and a really good player at 11, at minimum.
This division will come down to the Giants and Cowboys, and both may make the playoffs.
The biggest factor with the Giants is Judge. He has a spark about him, and he's building the right culture.
There's every reason to be optimistic. This team is going to battle. And they may end up being a surprise contender if things fall right.
A lot of cogent points allstar.