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My shot at a mock draft

chopperhatch : 4/15/2021 6:35 pm
I put a little bit of reasoning at the end of each description but don't kill me on it. My mock is based on 3 QBs taken before our pick. Lance drops, so I offer an alternate pick based on that happening. Prior to our pick, I have Lawrence, Wilson and Fields going 1, 2 and 3.

Ja'Marr Chase going 4 to ATL because his measurables ensure that who ever comes to replace Ryan will have Ridley and the best WR in the draft as his target.

T Penei goes to Bengals because he is a no brainer there. Stop it.

At 6 the Phins go get one of Tua's buddies in Devonta Smith. Him and Parker will have fun.

7 Lions take Rashawn Slater. Bit of a surprise, but its usually better to build your line before the QB comes and gets his shit pushed in.

Carolina takes Waddle. Gives Darnold a safety blanket and replaces what Samuel(s) brought to the team. Relying on later in the draft to address the line over a difference maker.

At 9 Denver takes Surtain or Horn. They have a pretty good D and taking either 1 or 1A CB makes sense here. They have to rebuild the whole O at this point andhaving a great D in place makes the rebuild a simpler process.

At 10, everybody's nightmare....Pitts to the Boys. They have shot on D with very few exceptions and their only hope is to try and accentuate their high octane offense. This pick drops EVERYBODY in coverage and allows room for Zeke.

Round 1: Kwity Paye (DE) Michigan: Everybody poo-poos the pick because of lack of pass rush numbers, which is a legitimate argument, but he is extremely coachable, his athleticism and strength is no joke....plus, he doesnt have to learn to play the run. Despite some pass rush deficiencies, he will be playing next to two big men with pass rush abilities as well and his quickness negates many teams' x factor mobile QB.

****ALT whoever is left after Surtain/Horn

[i]ALT trade down with Chicago or NE[i]....either way we get at least an additional 3rd to move down a bit. I am not going to quibble over where this pick is, but we get a 3rd if we trade down and we take Jayson Oweh...we are going defense in

Round 2: K'Addarius Toney with the run on OL and DL that werent worthy of 1st round grades, the last two WRs to go before our 2nd are Bateman and Marshall. Toney brings that wiggle/slot receiver who can do it all from handoffs to deep routes to being a middle terror. Brings another toy that can loosen things up for Barkley getting the balls in the flats.

Round 3: Ben Cleveland: another slip because of the dearth of O Linemen in this draft. He slips because of the athleticism of other Guards and some orher big names. But no doubt he is a kick ass blocker who likes to kick ass, use your corpse to get himself up and probably smells horrible. Sounds like a real treat to play against. Put him on the line with his old teammate and let him suck opponents' wills to live.

Additional Round 3: Nico Collims is graded as a 3, but his size/speed combo might get him taken earlier. Seems physical and a nice mirror to Golladay and Slayton

Rpund 4: Tommy Tremble probably my favorite sleeper in the draft. I watched enough of ND this past year to see he is a PLAYER. He was usually the 4th or 5th receiving option on the field because he had two other TEs, a WR and a RB ahead of him as far as threats. But this guy blocked his ass off and is legit as athltic as thaey come. Hes not small coming out at 6'3" 245ish and reminds me a lot of LJ Smith. Think this guy plus Rudolph makes our red zone offense scary.

Round 6: Khalil Herbert...dense little scat back to back up Barkley and provide some burst. Round 6....back up RB

The rest? Fuck it....you tell me.
Love the Giants picks....but  
George from PA : 4/15/2021 6:54 pm : link
Pitts is not falling to Dallas....
.  
Bill2 : 4/15/2021 6:54 pm : link
I could see it shaking out that way.

I'm not thrilled with Owen. When a guy is potential over production in high school and college it doesn't feel like a good first rounder.

Feels like a variation of Apple Flowers Engram.
I'm in on Tommy Tremble, too.  
Red Dog : 4/15/2021 6:58 pm : link
Love to see them trade EE for whatever they can get - a fourth, or maybe another third.

Then draft Tremble, who is supposed to be the BEST BLOCKING TE in this draft, and who has demonstrated that he can catch enough to be somewhat of a threat there, too.

OK, he's not going to be a home run hitter as a receiver, but he can be a move the chains guy and they need more of those guys, too. Pair him and Rudolph and you've really got some good TEs who can protect DJ and catch the ball from him. What a concept.
RE: I'm in on Tommy Tremble, too.  
chopperhatch : 4/15/2021 7:00 pm : link
In comment 15222312 Red Dog said:
Quote:
Love to see them trade EE for whatever they can get - a fourth, or maybe another third.

Then draft Tremble, who is supposed to be the BEST BLOCKING TE in this draft, and who has demonstrated that he can catch enough to be somewhat of a threat there, too.

OK, he's not going to be a home run hitter as a receiver, but he can be a move the chains guy and they need more of those guys, too. Pair him and Rudolph and you've really got some good TEs who can protect DJ and catch the ball from him. What a concept.


I just went on the assumption that we couldnt trade Engram. But having Tremble on the roster along with Rudolph sets us up for the future and can be insurance if Engram decides to take a shit.
RE: Love the Giants picks....but  
chopperhatch : 4/15/2021 7:00 pm : link
In comment 15222305 George from PA said:
Quote:
Pitts is not falling to Dallas....


Eitherway, he is not available when we pick.
RE: .  
chopperhatch : 4/15/2021 7:02 pm : link
In comment 15222308 Bill2 said:
Quote:
I could see it shaking out that way.

I'm not thrilled with Owen. When a guy is potential over production in high school and college it doesn't feel like a good first rounder.

Feels like a variation of Apple Flowers Engram.


Hear you,but he has incredible measurables and all of the pass rushers are flawed in some way. Oweh shares commonality with his college coach.
I am a big fan of Tremble  
Jay on the Island : 4/15/2021 7:14 pm : link
He's already a good blocker and he has untapped potential as a TE. He was underutilized as a receiver and I think he is one of those college TE's that put up much better numbers in the NFL.

As for Toney I doubt the Giants take him because I read he has some attitude concerns. That doesn't sound like a player Judge would want with an early draft pick.
RE: I am a big fan of Tremble  
chopperhatch : 4/15/2021 7:23 pm : link
In comment 15222339 Jay on the Island said:
Quote:
He's already a good blocker and he has untapped potential as a TE. He was underutilized as a receiver and I think he is one of those college TE's that put up much better numbers in the NFL.

As for Toney I doubt the Giants take him because I read he has some attitude concerns. That doesn't sound like a player Judge would want with an early draft pick.


I was trying to fill a need and take one of my favorite players at the position. I didnt hear about character concerns with him either. How many saints can we have?
Forgot the  
chopperhatch : 4/15/2021 7:24 pm : link
"LOL" Jay.
I’d take a pass on  
ryanmkeane : 4/15/2021 7:31 pm : link
Toney
Other than that  
ryanmkeane : 4/15/2021 7:31 pm : link
I really like the other picks. Nicely done
Pitts to Dallas doesn't make sense to me...  
Capt. Don : 4/15/2021 7:55 pm : link
I think he is the best non QB in the draft but there is only one football.

Cooper, Lamb and Gallup (most underrated WR in the league) and Zeke needs his carries. As good as Pitts is, I don't see a huge net gain in their offense.
RE: Pitts to Dallas doesn't make sense to me...  
chopperhatch : 4/15/2021 7:58 pm : link
In comment 15222408 Capt. Don said:
Quote:
I think he is the best non QB in the draft but there is only one football.

Cooper, Lamb and Gallup (most underrated WR in the league) and Zeke needs his carries. As good as Pitts is, I don't see a huge net gain in their offense.


Based on rumors that JJ likes him....A LOT and also that I was trying to get everybody that we wanted as fans off the board. This was a worst case scenario draft. I didnt want to argue Smith v. Waddle v. Pitts. I think if Smith and Pitts are gone we go Paye or one of the corners.
And Pitts to Dallas makes all the sense in the world!  
chopperhatch : 4/15/2021 8:00 pm : link
No defensive difference makers other than corner, you want to thrive on an unstoppable offense....draft Pitts and Prescott can close his eyes and throw it.
RE: I’d take a pass on  
chopperhatch : 4/15/2021 8:01 pm : link
In comment 15222376 ryanmkeane said:
Quote:
Toney


KT has got a lot of Percy Harvin in him....and that is not just the Florida connection.
RE: RE: Pitts to Dallas doesn't make sense to me...  
Capt. Don : 4/15/2021 8:08 pm : link
In comment 15222409 chopperhatch said:
Quote:
In comment 15222408 Capt. Don said:


Quote:


I think he is the best non QB in the draft but there is only one football.

Cooper, Lamb and Gallup (most underrated WR in the league) and Zeke needs his carries. As good as Pitts is, I don't see a huge net gain in their offense.



Based on rumors that JJ likes him....A LOT and also that I was trying to get everybody that we wanted as fans off the board. This was a worst case scenario draft. I didnt want to argue Smith v. Waddle v. Pitts. I think if Smith and Pitts are gone we go Paye or one of the corners.


I definitely think Dallas takes him if he is there, I just don't think the net gain is as big as you're making it out to be. Nothing bc of him, I love his game and He makes them better for sure but their offense is already top 1-3 in terms of weapons.

They have 3 really good WR and a RB who does best with 20+ carries. There is only 1 football.
I'll put it this way...  
Capt. Don : 4/15/2021 8:20 pm : link
Before Dak got hurt they were averaging 33 ppg but gave up 36 ppg and were 2-3.

How much more are they going to score with Pitts?

Or would their team have a greater net improvement if they took the best defensive playet.
RE: I’d take a pass on  
chopperhatch : 4/15/2021 8:35 pm : link
In comment 15222376 ryanmkeane said:
Quote:
Toney


I would also point out that Toney is as close to Waddle as you can get with the next pick. Guy has a nose for the end zone.
i think your top-10 is wrong  
Producer : 4/15/2021 8:46 pm : link
Atl will either trade out of #4 or pick Lance. Lance is going 3 or 4.

Fields will also go top-10.

Mac Jones will drop out of the top-10.

Cincy takes Chase. to pair with Burrow.

Miami takes Pitts.

The Lions take Waddle.

The Panthers take Sewell.

If Fields drops Denver takes Fields.


The Giants will have their pick of Smith, Parsons, Slater, Paye, Horn, Jaelan Phillips
In your scenario, I drop big time because all the value is gone  
Bill L : 4/15/2021 9:07 pm : link
And pick one of any number of edges close to twenty and use the extra picks for other things.
RE: In your scenario, I drop big time because all the value is gone  
chopperhatch : 4/15/2021 9:20 pm : link
In comment 15222499 Bill L said:
Quote:
And pick one of any number of edges close to twenty and use the extra picks for other things.


I would love to drop to Chicago, but the fact is unless there is a QB both they and NE like at 11, we arent moving anywhere unless Pitt gets weird.
I stopped reading...  
bw in dc : 4/15/2021 9:37 pm : link
at Paye... ;)

I like Toney but I envision him in round one.

I liked Cleveland until Sy eviscerated him yesterday.

Good effort in the later rounds.

Trash as  
tyrik13 : 4/15/2021 9:40 pm : link
Hell
RE: I stopped reading...  
chopperhatch : 4/15/2021 9:43 pm : link
In comment 15222538 bw in dc said:
Quote:
at Paye... ;)

I like Toney but I envision him in round one.

I liked Cleveland until Sy eviscerated him yesterday.

Good effort in the later rounds.


Paye is phenomenal with short area quickness and can really stop mobile QBs if he gets no pass rush.

Hes also who I think gets drafted in 1 not who I would want. I also put a contingency if offered a trade down. Not sure how many more footnotes I could lay down.

I would also be surprised if Toney goes Rd. 1. Back-up (and preferred option) is Bateman at 42.
Ehh...  
Jimmy Googs : 4/15/2021 9:59 pm : link
I mentioned a ćouple of times Giants are possibly interested in Cleveland on here already. I do like Tremble, but the rest not so much.

Don’t hurry with your 2.0

:- )

RE: Ehh...  
chopperhatch : 4/15/2021 10:05 pm : link
In comment 15222571 Jimmy Googs said:
Quote:
I mentioned a ćouple of times Giants are possibly interested in Cleveland on here already. I do like Tremble, but the rest not so much.

Don’t hurry with your 2.0

:- )


Ehhh, don't hurry your way to the door because I didnt even read your opinion and disregard anything you say meatball.

Why havent you left and brought LGBTHJ13 or whatever your other handle was back? Literally nobody wants you here!
It must have been, ahem, a coincidence then.  
Jimmy Googs : 4/15/2021 10:13 pm : link
You seem a better fit under the NFT page, if at all.

Bad mojo.
RE: It must have been, ahem, a coincidence then.  
chopperhatch : 4/15/2021 10:16 pm : link
In comment 15222589 Jimmy Googs said:
Quote:
You seem a better fit under the NFT page, if at all.

Bad mojo.



Yea....blah, blah, blah....you should realize by now nobody takes anything you say seriously. You latch on to bw and Terps arguments, but never bring anything.

Just go the fuck away loser.
We’ll always have Cleveland  
Jimmy Googs : 4/15/2021 10:20 pm : link
but like I said...NFT
RE: We’ll always have Cleveland  
chopperhatch : 4/15/2021 10:35 pm : link
In comment 15222596 Jimmy Googs said:
Quote:
but like I said...NFT


Eat glass. Literally nobody cares. Ive never seen anybody given less attention who continuously posts like his opinion matters. Everyone ignores you. Im going to give it a shot going forward.
Your best shot is on NFT  
Jimmy Googs : 4/15/2021 10:40 pm : link
find your mojo...
RE: I'll put it this way...  
Zeke's Alibi : 4/15/2021 11:04 pm : link
In comment 15222438 Capt. Don said:
Quote:
Before Dak got hurt they were averaging 33 ppg but gave up 36 ppg and were 2-3.

How much more are they going to score with Pitts?

Or would their team have a greater net improvement if they took the best defensive playet.



This is why it's total bullshit. Who cares what JJ supposedly thinks? The media reports the same thing every year and they haven't drafted that guy in years. His son is running the football operations now. He's not going to let that happen. You need some defense and their defensive line can get after the passer a bit, it's just their backend is so atrocious it doesn't matter. It's going to be defense and I really think Horn may be a dark horse there. Guy is a baller and even before the injury shit I liked him more than Caleb. He's way too boom bust to take in top 10.
RE: RE: I'll put it this way...  
chopperhatch : 4/15/2021 11:19 pm : link
In comment 15222628 Zeke's Alibi said:
Quote:
In comment 15222438 Capt. Don said:


Quote:


Before Dak got hurt they were averaging 33 ppg but gave up 36 ppg and were 2-3.

How much more are they going to score with Pitts?

Or would their team have a greater net improvement if they took the best defensive playet.




This is why it's total bullshit. Who cares what JJ supposedly thinks? The media reports the same thing every year and they haven't drafted that guy in years. His son is running the football operations now. He's not going to let that happen. You need some defense and their defensive line can get after the passer a bit, it's just their backend is so atrocious it doesn't matter. It's going to be defense and I really think Horn may be a dark horse there. Guy is a baller and even before the injury shit I liked him more than Caleb. He's way too boom bust to take in top 10.


It's total bullshit? Ok. I guess Pitts at TE wjere they have an opening just couldnt be the pick because they need defense. Something tells me that due to their cap, and what they have going for them that they just MIGHT prefer an offense that is unstoppable on paper over adding one player that might take theor defense from straight shit to below average at best.

How is it "bullshit" that the Cowboys would opt for the most dynamic receiving TE since Antonio Gates to go along with an already awsome receiving corps in favor of ONE defensive piece? Oh and Pitts would be the BPA too. So how is that "bullshit?"
I fear the OP is right Giants choosing Kwity Paye  
giantstock : 4/16/2021 2:00 am : link
And he comes up with the cliche "he is coachable."

What a great thing to read that at number 11 it must be addressed that a player is coachable. I'm so excited because a number 11 pick is coachable. LOL.

Paye is going to be a good football player but it would be typical of the Giants to take him. -- Another underwhelming choice considering their draft position with their 1st pick.
Paye  
UGADawgs7 : 4/16/2021 7:17 am : link
The only way Giants can take him is if all 3 WR and the OL they’d want are gone. Pitts isn’t falling to Dallas and hope they trade up for him. The defense is a mess, hope they still go offense and screw themselves up down the line.
RE: RE: RE: I'll put it this way...  
Capt. Don : 4/16/2021 7:46 am : link
In comment 15222636 chopperhatch said:
Quote:
In comment 15222628 Zeke's Alibi said:


Quote:


In comment 15222438 Capt. Don said:


Quote:


Before Dak got hurt they were averaging 33 ppg but gave up 36 ppg and were 2-3.

How much more are they going to score with Pitts?

Or would their team have a greater net improvement if they took the best defensive playet.


How is it "bullshit" that the Cowboys would opt for the most dynamic receiving TE since Antonio Gates to go along with an already awsome receiving corps in favor of ONE defensive piece? Oh and Pitts would be the BPA too. So how is that "bullshit?"


I wouldn't say it is "total bullshit" but I dont think it makes sense.

You asked why and I answered that in my previous post. Because their offense was scoring as much as the '99 Rams before Dak went out. How much better is Pitts going to make them? Their net gain is not proportional to Pitts talent.

Their defensive backfield was AWFUL. A Surtain or Horn could improve it drastically.
Cowboys selecting of Pitts  
Rick in Dallas : 4/16/2021 8:12 am : link
I believe Pitts is the best non QB in the draft. He probably doesn't get close to the Cowboys at 10 in the real draft.
But in this scenario I do think Stephen and Will McClay would draft Pitts as BPA. This draft is super deep in the second round with very talented CB's.
As far as the one ball argument, TE Schultz caught over 60 passes last year. Who would you rather have catching those 60 passes? Pitts or Schultz.This is a PASSING league.
RE: Cowboys selecting of Pitts  
Spider56 : 4/16/2021 9:19 am : link
In comment 15222742 Rick in Dallas said:
Quote:
I believe Pitts is the best non QB in the draft. He probably doesn't get close to the Cowboys at 10 in the real draft.
But in this scenario I do think Stephen and Will McClay would draft Pitts as BPA. This draft is super deep in the second round with very talented CB's.
As far as the one ball argument, TE Schultz caught over 60 passes last year. Who would you rather have catching those 60 passes? Pitts or Schultz.This is a PASSING league.


Pitts won’t fall to Dallas, but if Jerrah truly loves this guy, he’ll make an offer the Falcons can’t refuse and trade up.
If Giants passed on Parsons for Paye  
joeinpa : 4/16/2021 9:21 am : link
I would not be so presumptuous as to question the pick, but I would be fan enough to be disappointed.
RE: If Giants passed on Parsons for Paye  
giantstock : 4/16/2021 9:43 am : link
In comment 15222816 joeinpa said:
Quote:
I would not be so presumptuous as to question the pick, but I would be fan enough to be disappointed.


Joe-- I did say Paye will be a good player. Just saying imo it's an underwhelming pick. SO like you say - I'll be disappointed. Not a remote thrower.
RE: RE: RE: RE: I'll put it this way...  
chopperhatch : 4/16/2021 10:20 am : link
In comment 15222721 Capt. Don said:
Quote:
In comment 15222636 chopperhatch said:


Quote:


In comment 15222628 Zeke's Alibi said:


Quote:


In comment 15222438 Capt. Don said:


Quote:


Before Dak got hurt they were averaging 33 ppg but gave up 36 ppg and were 2-3.

How much more are they going to score with Pitts?

Or would their team have a greater net improvement if they took the best defensive playet.


How is it "bullshit" that the Cowboys would opt for the most dynamic receiving TE since Antonio Gates to go along with an already awsome receiving corps in favor of ONE defensive piece? Oh and Pitts would be the BPA too. So how is that "bullshit?"



I wouldn't say it is "total bullshit" but I dont think it makes sense.

You asked why and I answered that in my previous post. Because their offense was scoring as much as the '99 Rams before Dak went out. How much better is Pitts going to make them? Their net gain is not proportional to Pitts talent.

Their defensive backfield was AWFUL. A Surtain or Horn could improve it drastically.


Just an FYI Capt Don, I was responding to Zeke's Alibi.

And while I agree with your premise, I would prefer to be a slam dunk offense while trying to piece together a defense over a less than mediocre defense with an above average offense. Plus I think Gallup is gone after this year. So Pitts, Lamb and Cooper is a nice segue.

Fyi, my nightmare is Dallas grabbing Pitts.
RE: Paye  
chopperhatch : 4/16/2021 10:25 am : link
In comment 15222705 UGADawgs7 said:
Quote:
The only way Giants can take him is if all 3 WR and the OL they’d want are gone. Pitts isn’t falling to Dallas and hope they trade up for him. The defense is a mess, hope they still go offense and screw themselves up down the line.


Thats apparently not true, because according to those in-the-know, Paye is very much liked at 11. He doesnt have to learn to play the run, he was taught that. He is great at dissecting the zone read and read option. He is quick enough to stop his rush and cover a back in the flats because he apparently ran a sub 7 3 cone (I still refuse to believe it was 6.5. He is built like a super hero and the coachability comes in where he can learn hand fighting and pass rush moves.

He seems l8ke a smart player, has great measurables and is very good against the run.
Don't Get It  
Bruner4329 : 4/16/2021 11:37 am : link
Paye is a reach at 11. We can get him at 15-17. So everyone gets on DG for his drafting and yet people want him to take a player at 11 that is a reach at that spot. Geez. If you really want this guy it has to be after trading down otherwise you are wasting Draft capital.
"gets his shit pushed in."  
TheGhostofBlueGuy : 4/16/2021 1:30 pm : link
Fuck is this? Training Day?

Come out. Come out. Where ever you are.
RE: RE: If Giants passed on Parsons for Paye  
joeinpa : 4/16/2021 3:28 pm : link
In comment 15222860 giantstock said:
Quote:
In comment 15222816 joeinpa said:


Quote:


I would not be so presumptuous as to question the pick, but I would be fan enough to be disappointed.



Joe-- I did say Paye will be a good player. Just saying imo it's an underwhelming pick. SO like you say - I'll be disappointed. Not a remote thrower.


Yep, I m with you
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