for display only
Big Blue Interactive The Corner Forum  
Back to the Corner

Archived Thread

Could JC Horn be BPA at 11?

KingBlue : 4/19/2021 8:39 am
I think he very well could be. Would that even matter? In your opinion, would the Giants pass on BPA to fill a need? Is depth at WR a bigger need than depth at CB? Is a bigger need like Edge or OL enough of a reason to pass on a potential star like Horn?

Personally, I think Horn would be a great pick.
Yes, and he would be a good pick.  
robbieballs2003 : 4/19/2021 8:40 am : link
.
Funny you mentioned Jaycee Horn  
M.S. : 4/19/2021 8:46 am : link

Was just thinking how he could be there at 11 and be the best player available. I'm begging for offense but this guy is very tempting!
According to Sy, these are his top players so far:  
robbieballs2003 : 4/19/2021 8:48 am : link
91 - Sewell, Penei
90 - Pitts, Kyle
85 - Surtain II, Patrick
85 - Horn, Jaycee
85 - Paye, Kwity
85 - Slater, Rashawn
85 - Vera-Tucker, Alijah

I feel confident saying there are no RBs in this range. That leaves QBs and WR. Assuming we aren't in the running for a QB, that just leaves WRs. Lets assume that Chase, Waddle, and Smith are there. That is 10 players with a grade of a 85 or higher. We can also assume that Lawrence will be there so that brings the number to 11 with only 1 QB going before us.

It is definitely possible and he hasn't gotten a lot of attention on this board. If Surtain is a possibility then I think Horn is too. However, I think the Giants will focus elsewhere like WR or Edge. I wouldn't say drafting Horn is likely but definitely a possibility.
He certainly seems to be moving up.....  
George from PA : 4/19/2021 8:48 am : link
The #2 and #3 corners swaps spots due to injury
Drafting for Depth ???  
averagejoe : 4/19/2021 8:50 am : link
With pick 11 ??? Did we just win the Superbowl or does our roster still need a massive upgrades at WR, OL, and ER ? Where would Horn play ? A reserve CB and special teamer ? Horn should not even be considered here.
Best RAS score at CB in like 30+ years  
Judge_and_Jury : 4/19/2021 8:50 am : link
https://mobile.twitter.com/mathbomb/status/1374785946042953732?lang=en

And the tape matches the testing. At this point I actually would be surprised if teams looking for a CB like the Cowboys don't have him as CB1 too.

If we didn't have 30M tied up in 2 top CBs AND a promising slot CB in Holmes (0 passing TDs given up), he'd be on my short list for 11.

Some NFL exec actually predicted TWO CBs in the top 10. Undoubtedly one of them is Horn.
RE: Drafting for Depth ???  
KingBlue : 4/19/2021 8:53 am : link
In comment 15225422 averagejoe said:
Quote:
With pick 11 ??? Did we just win the Superbowl or does our roster still need a massive upgrades at WR, OL, and ER ? Where would Horn play ? A reserve CB and special teamer ? Horn should not even be considered here.


Is having 3 top CB's on your defense a bad thing? Could Graham make use of top tier CB talent on his defense?
RE: RE: Drafting for Depth ???  
averagejoe : 4/19/2021 8:58 am : link
In comment 15225425 KingBlue said:
Quote:
In comment 15225422 averagejoe said:


Quote:


With pick 11 ??? Did we just win the Superbowl or does our roster still need a massive upgrades at WR, OL, and ER ? Where would Horn play ? A reserve CB and special teamer ? Horn should not even be considered here.



Is having 3 top CB's on your defense a bad thing? Could Graham make use of top tier CB talent on his defense?


Didn't we draft Holmes last year to be the third CB ? So let's use a premium pick for a 4th CB ?
RE: RE: RE: Drafting for Depth ???  
robbieballs2003 : 4/19/2021 9:00 am : link
In comment 15225430 averagejoe said:
Quote:
In comment 15225425 KingBlue said:


Quote:


In comment 15225422 averagejoe said:


Quote:


With pick 11 ??? Did we just win the Superbowl or does our roster still need a massive upgrades at WR, OL, and ER ? Where would Horn play ? A reserve CB and special teamer ? Horn should not even be considered here.



Is having 3 top CB's on your defense a bad thing? Could Graham make use of top tier CB talent on his defense?



Didn't we draft Holmes last year to be the third CB ? So let's use a premium pick for a 4th CB ?


Not sure why I am arguing as your mind is made up already but, one, Horn wouldn't be our 4th corner and, two, right now we are one injury away from having Yiadom start in our base defense let along all our sub packages.
Sy has 12 CBs  
Capt. Don : 4/19/2021 9:01 am : link
with a 2nd or 3rd round pick grade, six of which are graded at the 2nd half of the 3rd round.

12 seems like a lot for those two rounds, so to me the 4th round could be a sweet spot for cornerback value.
RE: Sy has 12 CBs  
Capt. Don : 4/19/2021 9:05 am : link
In comment 15225435 Capt. Don said:
Quote:
with a 2nd or 3rd round pick grade, six of which are graded at the 2nd half of the 3rd round.

12 seems like a lot for those two rounds, so to me the 4th round could be a sweet spot for cornerback value.


My mistake, five corners graded for the end of the 3rd round, not six.
Surtain and Horn  
JonC : 4/19/2021 9:05 am : link
could both be BPA at #11, but it appears clear NYG is looking WR or Edge.
RE: Drafting for Depth ???  
UConn4523 : 4/19/2021 9:05 am : link
In comment 15225422 averagejoe said:
Quote:
With pick 11 ??? Did we just win the Superbowl or does our roster still need a massive upgrades at WR, OL, and ER ? Where would Horn play ? A reserve CB and special teamer ? Horn should not even be considered here.


COVID still exists, injuries still happen. We are a Bradberry injury or positive test away from a strength turning into a weakness. I can also guarantee 1-2 of our current CB's won't be on the team next year with typical roster turnover.

I'm not advocating that we take Surtain or Horn but I certainly understand why we would. In Graham's scheme the secondary is the most vital unit of the defense.
CB is an almost constant need nowadays  
JonC : 4/19/2021 9:09 am : link
given how teams tend to build defenses, and NYG is one injury away from being where they were before signing Adoree. A CB would be a bit of a luxury, but get out of the mindset of picking strictly for need in the first round.
RE: CB is an almost constant need nowadays  
KingBlue : 4/19/2021 9:15 am : link
In comment 15225443 JonC said:
Quote:
given how teams tend to build defenses, and NYG is one injury away from being where they were before signing Adoree. A CB would be a bit of a luxury, but get out of the mindset of picking strictly for need in the first round.


Jon, I agree CB is always a need... but the question was... Could Horn be BPA at 11? Which you already answered above.. He or Surtain may be BPA at 11. So, if the Giants were to select Horn... it would not be strictly for need.
RE: CB is an almost constant need nowadays  
Judge_and_Jury : 4/19/2021 9:17 am : link
In comment 15225443 JonC said:
Quote:
given how teams tend to build defenses, and NYG is one injury away from being where they were before signing Adoree. A CB would be a bit of a luxury, but get out of the mindset of picking strictly for need in the first round.


Agreed and we could easily select another one in this deep CB draft, just probably not round 1 or 2.
It was more about averagejoe's post  
JonC : 4/19/2021 9:18 am : link
Surtain or Horn could absolutely be BPA.
Would the Giants pass on BPA to fill a need?  
Jimmy Googs : 4/19/2021 9:23 am : link
Yes, they are basically experts at this by now...
Yes, they absolutely could  
JonC : 4/19/2021 9:28 am : link
they've done it the past two drafts.
I'm categorically and unequivocally opposed to drafting a CB in Rd. 1.  
Klaatu : 4/19/2021 9:31 am : link
Because...reasons.
Let's see  
mavric : 4/19/2021 9:34 am : link
In just the last few years the Giants have picked a CB twice in the first round, both times getting the "best" CB coming out of college: Eli Apple and Deandre Baker

I have zero faith that the Giants' front office can make a good decision on a CB with their first round picks. They suck at it
could he be?  
ryanmkeane : 4/19/2021 9:34 am : link
sure...we won't know for a few years on Horn and Surtain, even Farley. I think Horn is a good corner for 8+ years in the NFL. Problem is, we have 2 good corners and some depth there.

I'd be shocked if they drafted a corner.
Not likely  
jeff57 : 4/19/2021 9:36 am : link
.
RE: Let's see  
UConn4523 : 4/19/2021 9:37 am : link
In comment 15225482 mavric said:
Quote:
In just the last few years the Giants have picked a CB twice in the first round, both times getting the "best" CB coming out of college: Eli Apple and Deandre Baker

I have zero faith that the Giants' front office can make a good decision on a CB with their first round picks. They suck at it


If you think Judge has an influence on who we draft (I know I do), what do the historicals matter? Eli Apple was selected by Reese anyway, couldn't be more irrelevent.
But would he be MVP available  
ColHowPepper : 4/19/2021 9:42 am : link
assuming others in that same row?
Would think the A Jackson deal in free agency  
Jimmy Googs : 4/19/2021 9:50 am : link
almost assured the Giants will do something else at #11, even if JC Horn or another cornerback was BPA. They jumped on Jackson and offered a contract that ensured he would be a NYG, taking CB off the board in round one.

Don't think even Judge's influence, if he was pushing a CB, would hold up as to thinking here.

CB is also one of the toughest positions  
ryanmkeane : 4/19/2021 9:57 am : link
right out of college, I think the Jackson signing was also about getting someone who can hold it down for at leadt two seasons, and getting someone like Holmes more experience in the slot. Bradberry and a rookie on the outside would be tough considering they are in a window now where they think they can be playoff contenders
RE: RE: Drafting for Depth ???  
chopperhatch : 4/19/2021 9:58 am : link
In comment 15225425 KingBlue said:
Quote:
In comment 15225422 averagejoe said:


Quote:


With pick 11 ??? Did we just win the Superbowl or does our roster still need a massive upgrades at WR, OL, and ER ? Where would Horn play ? A reserve CB and special teamer ? Horn should not even be considered here.



Is having 3 top CB's on your defense a bad thing? Could Graham make use of top tier CB talent on his defense?


Also Bradberry's contract is up after 2022 when hell be 30, I doubt extending him would be cheaper than a rookie contract, Jackson is a good 2, but he has had injuries and he is only signed for 3 years. If Horn turns out to be an elite corner, we would be drafting one of the elite players at one of the most expensive andimportant positions in the NFL.
RE: Drafting for Depth ???  
SirYesSir : 4/19/2021 10:01 am : link
In comment 15225422 averagejoe said:
Quote:
With pick 11 ??? Did we just win the Superbowl or does our roster still need a massive upgrades at WR, OL, and ER ? Where would Horn play ? A reserve CB and special teamer ? Horn should not even be considered here.




Sigh - the draft is NOT free agency. You don't make choices with the goal of filling out your 2021 roster. You draft players that will be studs for years, so he's absolutely in the discussion
RE: RE: RE: Drafting for Depth ???  
KingBlue : 4/19/2021 10:06 am : link
In comment 15225529 chopperhatch said:
Quote:
In comment 15225425 KingBlue said:


Quote:


In comment 15225422 averagejoe said:


Quote:


With pick 11 ??? Did we just win the Superbowl or does our roster still need a massive upgrades at WR, OL, and ER ? Where would Horn play ? A reserve CB and special teamer ? Horn should not even be considered here.



Is having 3 top CB's on your defense a bad thing? Could Graham make use of top tier CB talent on his defense?



Also Bradberry's contract is up after 2022 when hell be 30, I doubt extending him would be cheaper than a rookie contract, Jackson is a good 2, but he has had injuries and he is only signed for 3 years. If Horn turns out to be an elite corner, we would be drafting one of the elite players at one of the most expensive andimportant positions in the NFL.


Good post... how can drafting elite talent at one of the premier positions in today's NFL not be a consideration?
There was a thread few weeks back  
Tuckrule : 4/19/2021 10:20 am : link
Everyone said Surtain and I kept saying it. Horn is a much better scheme fit and it isn’t close. I would have taken Farley over Surtain if it weren’t for the back issues. Horn to me is the clear cut CB1 in this draft.
Horn, Surtain and Parsons  
The Mike : 4/19/2021 10:21 am : link
Are the three best players in this draft on defense. I think they are more properly graded on the level of Sewell and Chase. Assuming Horn is the only player amongst this group left when the Giants draft, the Giants must select him.

Horn is best thought of as a hybrid of Jalen Ramsey and Derwin James and will be a force in the league for a decade. Don't confuse him for Eli Apple and DeAndre Baker who were two of the most egregious reaches in Giants history.

And how can any true Giants fan be skeptical of a dback whose name starts with Jay and ends in CeeHorn!
No offense to Sy, but his list is not the Giants list  
George from PA : 4/19/2021 10:25 am : link
We tend to rely on public lists of BPA....

Also Sy does not interview, meet with, nor knows the coaches, etc.


Who knows what the Giants draft board looks like
Yes  
UberAlias : 4/19/2021 10:25 am : link
Unfortunately NYG doesn’t believe in BPA.
Good chance Horn  
UberAlias : 4/19/2021 10:27 am : link
Or Parsons will be BPA. But I don’t see either being the pick
Right now, other players will help our team more  
CT Charlie : 4/19/2021 10:39 am : link
than an excellent rookie CB. Unless we know we can trade one of our CBs for a proven player at a position of need.
My dream..  
FatMan in Charlotte : 4/19/2021 10:40 am : link
would be to select Horn and have him pull out a cellphone after making a game-clinching INT against the Saints.
RE: Horn, Surtain and Parsons  
chopperhatch : 4/19/2021 10:53 am : link
In comment 15225587 The Mike said:
Quote:
Are the three best players in this draft on defense. I think they are more properly graded on the level of Sewell and Chase. Assuming Horn is the only player amongst this group left when the Giants draft, the Giants must select him.

Horn is best thought of as a hybrid of Jalen Ramsey and Derwin James and will be a force in the league for a decade. Don't confuse him for Eli Apple and DeAndre Baker who were two of the most egregious reaches in Giants history.

And how can any true Giants fan be skeptical of a dback whose name starts with Jay and ends in CeeHorn!


Hiiiiiiiiyo!
RE: Would the Giants pass on BPA to fill a need?  
joeinpa : 4/19/2021 1:50 pm : link
In comment 15225461 Jimmy Googs said:
Quote:
Yes, they are basically experts at this by now...


That s funny, but also kind of true
Dallas will take JC Horn  
Angus : 4/19/2021 3:31 pm : link
Not something we have to worry about.
People still not knowing  
section125 : 4/19/2021 10:47 pm : link
what the draft is for and confusing regimes with previous selections...

It would seem that Adoree Jackson eliminated the NEED for a CB in the draft, but not need for elite players even if a CB.

They signed Golladay, does that mean they do not take Pitts, Smith or Waddle if available. (Yes Pitts is a "TE", but is an elite receiver none the less and they would not pass on him)

I have a feeling Surtain and Horn will be in the 1B tier after Lawrence, Pitts, Chase and Sewell.
Back to the Corner