since it gets thrown around here pretty casually to serve everyone's own purposes as they see fit, often in contradictory contexts.
I always assumed it meant that a team had cut bait with a QB that in which they invested assets (cash or picks), and now is spinning their wheels trying to find a new competent QB, a task in which they are hamstrung bc they no longer have the cash or picks. Just having a shitty QB, or a veteran journeyman at QB, does not equal "qb hell."
Case studies:
By this definition, the Giants ARE NOT in QB hell, as many describe. They drafted a QB they believed in, and have not abandoned that QB. They are still investing in his career.
When the Jets picked Darnold, and played Darnold, they were not in QB Hell. Now that they have abandoned Darnold, and will use a top pick on another unproven QB commodity who will be forced to play on the same offense as Darnold, and as a result will likely suck, they may be entering QB hell (if they cannot dig out of their suck in the next two years).
IMO, it is cutting bait prematurely on quarterbacks that leads to QB Hell- such as when DC jumped from Rex to Bob to Kirk to Dwayne and now to Fitz (for max one year) and then...?
The Cowboys are not in QB Hell, since they invested in their starting QB they believe in. Now if Dak bombs, and they have to cut him loose after 2 years, the QB Hell clock would start.
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Good enough to lead a strong team to the playoffs but not good enough to carry you to a SB. Good enough to likely be better than your QB for the next year or two which makes you heavily consider “timeline” rather than “potential ceiling/talent”.
Trubisky and the Bears entire QB history came to mind as well. But the Bears answered that question pretty easily this off-season...
with Dalton.
Andy Dalton signed for 1 year 10 million. How does that affect their cap negatively. He is likely a placeholder for when they draft whomever is left. That is too is NOT QB hell.
"QB hell" is when you have so much invested in a player and he becomes less and less significant to the team, but you have to keep paying him. Paying a vet like Fitzpatrick, Dalton or Mariota is NOT QB hell. When you are financially committed to the player and he isnt doing his job effectively is QB hell.
Just because a QB draft pick doesnt work out, is not QB hell given the new salary structuring of draft picks.
Andy Dalton was the Cincy QB for 9 consecutive seasons. He went 70-61-2 and made the playoffs 4 consecutive times. He signed a big ass 2nd contract.
What the Bengals went through this past decade is the definition of QB hell. Dalton was good enough to be the 15th best QB, but he never had a chance to be a Top 7 QB for an extended period of time against the best teams in the playoffs.
The Bears are just a joke when it comes to the QB position and of course they think he could be a starter. They better draft his successor ASAP.
QB primes are usually 27-32. It's why WFT made the right move by franchising him twice because they weren't sure. So instead of making a long-term commitment, they gave him a year, and then another to prove it. Said we saw enough and let the Vikes make an offer to a guy most certainly not worth it. The Vikes have done very little, with a pretty good supporting cast, in his 3 years outside of the playoff win last year. Against a Drew Brees who had a noodle arm by the time December rolls around. A team that also looked completely discombobulated by the time the playoffs came around (see Michael Thomas situation).
Cousins getting those franchise should have never happened. 25 mill or whatever against the cap, 2 years in a row when you had a bullshit squad? Why?
Dump him and let him set his own market. That wasnt QB hell for the Skins (yea I said it), that was pure indecision with a bunch of stupidity sprinkled in.
Vikes made a reasonable gamble...they had Diggs, Rudolph and Thelein with a terrific D...Cousins got them pretty close.
That is also not QB hell. Vikes made the playoffs like 3 years in a row. They put the foot on the gas hoping they had D that could win big games. It couldnt.
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In comment 15227497 Osi Osi Osi OyOyOy said:
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Good enough to lead a strong team to the playoffs but not good enough to carry you to a SB. Good enough to likely be better than your QB for the next year or two which makes you heavily consider “timeline” rather than “potential ceiling/talent”.
Trubisky and the Bears entire QB history came to mind as well. But the Bears answered that question pretty easily this off-season...
with Dalton.
Andy Dalton signed for 1 year 10 million. How does that affect their cap negatively. He is likely a placeholder for when they draft whomever is left. That is too is NOT QB hell.
"QB hell" is when you have so much invested in a player and he becomes less and less significant to the team, but you have to keep paying him. Paying a vet like Fitzpatrick, Dalton or Mariota is NOT QB hell. When you are financially committed to the player and he isnt doing his job effectively is QB hell.
Just because a QB draft pick doesnt work out, is not QB hell given the new salary structuring of draft picks.
Andy Dalton was the Cincy QB for 9 consecutive seasons. He went 70-61-2 and made the playoffs 4 consecutive times. He signed a big ass 2nd contract.
What the Bengals went through this past decade is the definition of QB hell. Dalton was good enough to be the 15th best QB, but he never had a chance to be a Top 7 QB for an extended period of time against the best teams in the playoffs.
The Bears are just a joke when it comes to the QB position and of course they think he could be a starter. They better draft his successor ASAP.
I dont disagree with anything of what you said.....except for associating the Bear's decision to sign Dalton to a 1 year, poop QB vontract with his time with the Brngals. Those Bengals teams had more flaws to them than Dalton throwimg to Green, or Eifert...they had a damned good team that lost games because of head cases like Burfict, injuries and shotty coaching by a coach who sat on the throne waaaaay longer than he should have. That team needs to get sold.
But the Bears signing Dalton for a year and the Bengals experience with him.....NOT QB hell.
QB hell is something diff....where you pay a QB for no production.
I think the term is often overused though. Is QB hell what the Jets did? I don't think so, I think they whiffed, and after 3 years to get a full eval moved on. Wilson is a baller, but imagine being in this situation without QBs like Wilson and Lawrence at top? Some of it's just dumb luck. Of course Wilson could suck, there are no gurantees.
I am mot sure about the particulars, but on the surface, ypu are correct. I have also heard that the Eagles are on track for a ton of cap space going into '22. I have no details, but would love it os someone could breakdown the Wentz guaranteed money and its effect over the next two years. I kinda find it hard to believe that he is off their books THIS NEXT year.
Ugh, fuck those fuckers.
I guess if he won that Super Bowl it would be a diff story - ( New Window )
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Carson Wentz is the poster child for QB Hell b/c he was overpaid for his performance.
1. If your team's QB is paid $30-$40M per year and is top 10 passer, then you are not in QB Hell. You are getting what you paid for in these QBs. Aaron Rodgers, Russell Wilson, Patrick Mahomes and DeShaun Watson are in this category. If he recovers, then so is Dak.
2. If your team's QB is on rookie salary deal and is below top 15 passer, then you are not in QB Hell. The team might be bad but can still add talent at key positions and move on from the QB at little to now cost. Sam Darnold and Mitch Trubisky are the perfect example of this concept.
3. If your team's QB is paid +25M per year and is below top 10 passer, then you might be in QB hell b/c it limits your ability to win games and add talent to your team. Good examples are Jimmy G, Kirk Cousins and Derek Carr. These guys may be good enough to get their teams to the playoffs but they are not super stars.
4. If your team's QB is paid less than $25M per year but can't stay healthy for all 16 games and the team has to resort to a platoon of mediocre back-up QBs cycling into the lineup every week. The Panthers and WFT seem to have this process down pat as they tend to invest in recycled QBs at higher rate then other teams.
5. Your underpaid, over-drafted QB sucks and everyone knows it. This is the Denver Broncos since Payton retired.
Russell Wilson is a very good QB overall but a really overrated QB after New Year's Day. He's not January/February championship pedigree.
He's a form of QB hell himself, and it's only starting to come out now even though some of us could see the writing on the wall 5-6 years ago.
Huge cap hit, while his postseason play isn't remarkable whatsoever (never was really, just good enough in those SB years).
Seahawks can't build a meaningful roster anymore now that all those college players while Carroll was in USC are all in retirement homes. Can't draft, can't build wisely with FAs.
Wilson could theoretically play for $1 million a year and make them better, but it still won't be as scary as the old days.
applause.gif
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Carson Wentz is the poster child for QB Hell b/c he was overpaid for his performance.
1. If your team's QB is paid $30-$40M per year and is top 10 passer, then you are not in QB Hell. You are getting what you paid for in these QBs. Aaron Rodgers, Russell Wilson, Patrick Mahomes and DeShaun Watson are in this category. If he recovers, then so is Dak.
2. If your team's QB is on rookie salary deal and is below top 15 passer, then you are not in QB Hell. The team might be bad but can still add talent at key positions and move on from the QB at little to now cost. Sam Darnold and Mitch Trubisky are the perfect example of this concept.
3. If your team's QB is paid +25M per year and is below top 10 passer, then you might be in QB hell b/c it limits your ability to win games and add talent to your team. Good examples are Jimmy G, Kirk Cousins and Derek Carr. These guys may be good enough to get their teams to the playoffs but they are not super stars.
4. If your team's QB is paid less than $25M per year but can't stay healthy for all 16 games and the team has to resort to a platoon of mediocre back-up QBs cycling into the lineup every week. The Panthers and WFT seem to have this process down pat as they tend to invest in recycled QBs at higher rate then other teams.
5. Your underpaid, over-drafted QB sucks and everyone knows it. This is the Denver Broncos since Payton retired.
Russell Wilson is a very good QB overall but a really overrated QB after New Year's Day. He's not January/February championship pedigree.
He's a form of QB hell himself, and it's only starting to come out now even though some of us could see the writing on the wall 5-6 years ago.
Huge cap hit, while his postseason play isn't remarkable whatsoever (never was really, just good enough in those SB years).
Seahawks can't build a meaningful roster anymore now that all those college players while Carroll was in USC are all in retirement homes. Can't draft, can't build wisely with FAs.
Wilson could theoretically play for $1 million a year and make them better, but it still won't be as scary as the old days.
Disagree on Wilson. The Seahawks are better than they should be because of him. The problem is their complete inability to draft OL and frequent high picks on guys who had no business being drafted high (Germain Ifedi, James Carpenter, Maliek McDowell, Rashaad Penny, Jordyn Brooks, L.J. Collier, etc. - they haven't hit on a first rounder since 2010)
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In comment 15227497 Osi Osi Osi OyOyOy said:
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Good enough to lead a strong team to the playoffs but not good enough to carry you to a SB. Good enough to likely be better than your QB for the next year or two which makes you heavily consider “timeline” rather than “potential ceiling/talent”.
Trubisky and the Bears entire QB history came to mind as well. But the Bears answered that question pretty easily this off-season...
with Dalton.
Andy Dalton signed for 1 year 10 million. How does that affect their cap negatively. He is likely a placeholder for when they draft whomever is left. That is too is NOT QB hell.
"QB hell" is when you have so much invested in a player and he becomes less and less significant to the team, but you have to keep paying him. Paying a vet like Fitzpatrick, Dalton or Mariota is NOT QB hell. When you are financially committed to the player and he isnt doing his job effectively is QB hell.
Just because a QB draft pick doesnt work out, is not QB hell given the new salary structuring of draft picks.
Andy Dalton was the Cincy QB for 9 consecutive seasons. He went 70-61-2 and made the playoffs 4 consecutive times. He signed a big ass 2nd contract.
What the Bengals went through this past decade is the definition of QB hell. Dalton was good enough to be the 15th best QB, but he never had a chance to be a Top 7 QB for an extended period of time against the best teams in the playoffs.
The Bears are just a joke when it comes to the QB position and of course they think he could be a starter. They better draft his successor ASAP.
Soooooo....going to the playoffs with a QB is NOT QB hell. When you are in, you have a chance to win it all. That was a fine team and a fine QB....just didnt come up big. Were the Cpwboys with Romo QB hell?
The Browns have been in hell multiple times. The Bills when they signed Bledsoe and did the Rob Johnson/Doug Flutie thing. The Jets were with Testaverde, Lucas and Pennington all on the same team (I think).
The Bengals with Dalton werent and the Bears with Dalyon arent either.
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In comment 15227070 kdog77 said:
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Carson Wentz is the poster child for QB Hell b/c he was overpaid for his performance.
1. If your team's QB is paid $30-$40M per year and is top 10 passer, then you are not in QB Hell. You are getting what you paid for in these QBs. Aaron Rodgers, Russell Wilson, Patrick Mahomes and DeShaun Watson are in this category. If he recovers, then so is Dak.
2. If your team's QB is on rookie salary deal and is below top 15 passer, then you are not in QB Hell. The team might be bad but can still add talent at key positions and move on from the QB at little to now cost. Sam Darnold and Mitch Trubisky are the perfect example of this concept.
3. If your team's QB is paid +25M per year and is below top 10 passer, then you might be in QB hell b/c it limits your ability to win games and add talent to your team. Good examples are Jimmy G, Kirk Cousins and Derek Carr. These guys may be good enough to get their teams to the playoffs but they are not super stars.
4. If your team's QB is paid less than $25M per year but can't stay healthy for all 16 games and the team has to resort to a platoon of mediocre back-up QBs cycling into the lineup every week. The Panthers and WFT seem to have this process down pat as they tend to invest in recycled QBs at higher rate then other teams.
5. Your underpaid, over-drafted QB sucks and everyone knows it. This is the Denver Broncos since Payton retired.
Russell Wilson is a very good QB overall but a really overrated QB after New Year's Day. He's not January/February championship pedigree.
He's a form of QB hell himself, and it's only starting to come out now even though some of us could see the writing on the wall 5-6 years ago.
Huge cap hit, while his postseason play isn't remarkable whatsoever (never was really, just good enough in those SB years).
Seahawks can't build a meaningful roster anymore now that all those college players while Carroll was in USC are all in retirement homes. Can't draft, can't build wisely with FAs.
Wilson could theoretically play for $1 million a year and make them better, but it still won't be as scary as the old days.
One the worst posts I have seen on BBI. Wilson QB hell? FFS sake. Absurd.
LMFAO.
Didn't read it carefully did ya?
If Eli Manning went 1-4 in his last 5 playoff games, there would be some unfavorable talks about him as well regardless of how the team was constructed. And he certainly would be costing big money too.
Don't take my word for it?
Just ask Richard Sherman about Wilson.