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We Got a Glimpse of What Dallas Thinks Of Us

FatMan in Charlotte : 4/30/2021 11:09 am
By going forward with a trade with Philly, it is clear that Dallas would rather have Philly with Smith than the Giants. I look that as a shift in the way we have been viewed by our rivals in the past several years.

And at the end of the day, for only getting an extra 3rd rounder, Dallas has to contend with Smith and Toney as 1st rounders while missing out on a top CB.

It's clearly too early to tell, but at face value, that trade looks like it backfired on them as well as leading to a very good deal we pivoted to with the Bears.

By the way, I heard today that carolina was trying to trade with the Bears, but Chicago pulled out of the talks because they felt confident they could get fields in a deal with a different team (which turned out to be us)

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can't say that I really care Fats.  
Victor in CT : 4/30/2021 11:10 am : link
fuck 'em both.
I'm ecstatic this morning.  
Britt in VA : 4/30/2021 11:10 am : link
The draft gods smiled on us, for once.
And I wonder if our trade back and haul  
Britt in VA : 4/30/2021 11:11 am : link
shocked both of them. I hope so. They thought they were screwing us and actually probably ended up helping us.
Dallas knew  
Br00klyn : 4/30/2021 11:12 am : link
Smith was going to land with an NFC East team so might as well move down a few spots, get something in return, and still get the guy they wanted. Lots of Giants fans are putting way too much thought into this
completely disagree  
GiantsFan84 : 4/30/2021 11:12 am : link
they knew smith was going to either philly or NYG. so he's going to be in the division regardless. they took the extra pick to help themselves and still got the player they wanted
All I think it says is Dallas wanted Parsons..  
Sean : 4/30/2021 11:14 am : link
Dallas wasn’t willing to move down to lose Parsons & Smith would be in the NFC East anyway. Might as well grab the extra 3rd.
But..  
FatMan in Charlotte : 4/30/2021 11:14 am : link
did they get the player they wanted?? They likely wanted Horn or Surtain.
I think the whole NFC East is  
Simms11 : 4/30/2021 11:14 am : link
going to have to contend with a much improved Giants team IMO. Dallas got a glimpse of what we could do in the last game of the year and now we’ve improved the roster in this off-season on top of that.
RE: completely disagree  
Capt. Don : 4/30/2021 11:15 am : link
In comment 15245019 GiantsFan84 said:
Quote:
they knew smith was going to either philly or NYG. so he's going to be in the division regardless. they took the extra pick to help themselves and still got the player they wanted


I agree with this take; I think the OP is overthinking it.

Would Dallas rather have a 3rd rd pick with Smith in the division? Or Smith in the division without a 3rd rd. pick?
RE: can't say that I really care Fats.  
jeff57 : 4/30/2021 11:15 am : link
In comment 15245007 Victor in CT said:
Quote:
fuck 'em both.


My sentiments exactly.
They knew Smith was getting drafted at 11 or 12  
Ben in Tampa : 4/30/2021 11:15 am : link
They probably liked Parsons and Slater close to equal and knew that one of them would be there at 12.

The Giants were irrelevant in that decision.

Now, are they a little pissed the Bears didn’t call them? Probably.
I noticed this as well  
aGiantGuy : 4/30/2021 11:15 am : link
I was thinking along the same lines last night. Not only does Dallas not have a corner who can guard Golladay, they don’t have a legit slot corner either. Now they’re gonna make a big push to cluster draft corners and safeties because they have to find a way to defend the new receiver talent in the nfc East ( Samuel, Devonta, Golladay, Toney).

This also puts the Eagles in a bad position because they weren’t able to get their second corner either and they lost Jalen Mills in free agency. Instead of Philly drafting some guards, to replenish the OL they have to hope a starting caliber CB falls to them. Big ramifications
Although a bit of truth  
Danny Dimes : 4/30/2021 11:15 am : link
I think they knew Giants were super bowl contenders for next 5 years with Smith vs eagles who may beat them but are not a super bowl team to brag about being best in division
The best part about last night  
Chris684 : 4/30/2021 11:15 am : link
Aside from us fleecing Chicago and getting a weapon, aside from Philly spending 2 picks on DeVonta Smith, and aside from Dallas botching things the way they did, was the fact that some of the usual suspects completely lost their shit in the 5 minutes between the Eagles pick and news of our trade back and had to do a complete about-face.

Thrilling!
It would be Great if the Bears  
thevett : 4/30/2021 11:16 am : link
Pick turned out to be in front of the Cowturds and E-Gals
splitting hairs  
giants#1 : 4/30/2021 11:16 am : link
Dallas probably figured they would have to face Smith either way so they took the extra pick in return. I'm sure they were hoping the Giants would then panic and reach for another player.
RE: But..  
giants#1 : 4/30/2021 11:17 am : link
In comment 15245024 FatMan in Charlotte said:
Quote:
did they get the player they wanted?? They likely wanted Horn or Surtain.


That's irrelevant. I'm guessing they preferred those 2, but they were gone. I'm sure if they didn't take the Philly deal, they were still taking Parsons at 10.
No I don't see it that way  
give66 : 4/30/2021 11:17 am : link
Either us or Philly is picking Smith. Why not get a free 3rd rounder out of it. This proved correct, they gave up essentially nothing except the opportunity to trade down like we did.
Dallas made a solid deal . The main point as someone said  
gtt350 : 4/30/2021 11:17 am : link
on the draft thread " and then we totally redeemed ourselves"

I'm still smiling on that one
RE: completely disagree  
chopperhatch : 4/30/2021 11:18 am : link
In comment 15245019 GiantsFan84 said:
Quote:
they knew smith was going to either philly or NYG. so he's going to be in the division regardless. they took the extra pick to help themselves and still got the player they wanted


Not only do I completely agree with this, but I also think that the fact that Billy is in pretty much full rebuild mode and that's it would be pretty much Irrelevant for the next two years played into the decision making
This will backfire huge on both teams if Bears suck this season  
Danny Dimes : 4/30/2021 11:18 am : link
But will hurt us if they are a playoff team. Giants took the bet on Bears to suck 1 year and its a 50/50. I cant bet against field, he got Khali Mack backing him up.
RE: I noticed this as well  
giants#1 : 4/30/2021 11:19 am : link
In comment 15245030 aGiantGuy said:
Quote:
I was thinking along the same lines last night. Not only does Dallas not have a corner who can guard Golladay, they don’t have a legit slot corner either. Now they’re gonna make a big push to cluster draft corners and safeties because they have to find a way to defend the new receiver talent in the nfc East ( Samuel, Devonta, Golladay, Toney).

This also puts the Eagles in a bad position because they weren’t able to get their second corner either and they lost Jalen Mills in free agency. Instead of Philly drafting some guards, to replenish the OL they have to hope a starting caliber CB falls to them. Big ramifications


Their secondary was awful last year. They were likely picking multiple of DBs anyway.
Great trade by Giants  
The Mike : 4/30/2021 11:19 am : link
No question the right thing to do and kudos to the Giants for finally making a sensible draft day trade.

But suggesting Cowboys got hurt by a trade that brought them the best defensive player in the draft, whom they would have taken with the tenth pick anyway, and additionally getting a third round pick taken away from an arch rival, is a stretch too far.

If Parsons turns out to be a perennial pro bowler terrorizing the Giants and leading the Cowboys to a super bowl, posterity will not be kind to either the Eagles or the Giants.
Also  
chopperhatch : 4/30/2021 11:19 am : link
How pissed off would you be this morning if the Eagles made that trade?
RE: Dallas knew  
Mike in NY : 4/30/2021 11:19 am : link
In comment 15245015 Br00klyn said:
Quote:
Smith was going to land with an NFC East team so might as well move down a few spots, get something in return, and still get the guy they wanted. Lots of Giants fans are putting way too much thought into this


There is some overthinking but Philly could just have easily been trading up to get a QB of the future and not Smith and then Dallas would have had to face both. Even if Dallas was told by Philly it was for Smith that means Dallas would rather face Smith on Philly than the Giants because a 3 means nothing if you are making your schedule more difficult for at least next 5-6 years.
I posted something similar last night...  
sb from NYT Forum : 4/30/2021 11:19 am : link
...that Dallas kept Smith in the division and STILL don't have a CB.

The weird thing is that the Eagles are atrocious at LB. Why wouldn't they draft Parsons at 10?

And the Eagles drafted Reagor in the 1st last year. Is this an admission that drafting Reagor was a mistake?
RE: RE: I noticed this as well  
aGiantGuy : 4/30/2021 11:21 am : link
In comment 15245055 giants#1 said:
Quote:
In comment 15245030 aGiantGuy said:


Quote:


I was thinking along the same lines last night. Not only does Dallas not have a corner who can guard Golladay, they don’t have a legit slot corner either. Now they’re gonna make a big push to cluster draft corners and safeties because they have to find a way to defend the new receiver talent in the nfc East ( Samuel, Devonta, Golladay, Toney).

This also puts the Eagles in a bad position because they weren’t able to get their second corner either and they lost Jalen Mills in free agency. Instead of Philly drafting some guards, to replenish the OL they have to hope a starting caliber CB falls to them. Big ramifications



Their secondary was awful last year. They were likely picking multiple of DBs anyway.

I’m pretty sure Dallas was penciling in the idea of having Surtain or Horn, putting Trevon Diggs to CB2. Very few foresaw Carolina taking Horn. IMO that was the biggest domino of the night
RE: And I wonder if our trade back and haul  
Jim in Forest Hills : 4/30/2021 11:21 am : link
In comment 15245012 Britt in VA said:
Quote:
shocked both of them. I hope so. They thought they were screwing us and actually probably ended up helping us.


My gut tells me this isn't true, but my heart hopes its true!
I think Dallas pivoted the same way we pivoted  
Gatorade Dunk : 4/30/2021 11:22 am : link
They clearly had an expectation that one of the two CBs would be there for them, and they bailed when the draft unfolded differently. They still got a really good defensive player, and it's obvious by now that red flags aren't a negative in their personnel evaluations.

But you're right that they obviously didn't have much concern about the Eagles adding Smith. I'm not sure whether that's a reflection on the Eagles or on Smith, but it wasn't something they had much interest in guarding against, especially because I presume the Bears' offer would also have been available to them at 10, so they could have jumped out of that pick without helping a rival.
Dallas got screwed by the Broncos and Panthers first  
islander1 : 4/30/2021 11:23 am : link
so they just passed it on down by allowing the Eagles to take 'allegedly' our guy. I don't blame Dallas, honestly, they got a third round pick for nothing.

It would've worked, too, if not for the Bears. Gettleman and Abrams deserve a massive amount of credit for taking a questionable situation for us and turning it into a free first round draft pick next year.

What Dallas did was the same thing the Giants did. Basically told the other team "Yeah, we'll trade, but only if our guy is gone". That assumes we'd draft Smith of course.

C'mon  
Pete in MD : 4/30/2021 11:25 am : link
Dallas absolutely wanted/needed one of the top 2 corners but they always overplay their hand in the draft. It usually works out for them but this time it didn't. Parsons is no slouch but he wasn't their top choice. The Giants did't get their top choice either but got a first rounder out of the deal.
RE: I think Dallas pivoted the same way we pivoted  
FStubbs : 4/30/2021 11:25 am : link
In comment 15245076 Gatorade Dunk said:
Quote:
They clearly had an expectation that one of the two CBs would be there for them, and they bailed when the draft unfolded differently. They still got a really good defensive player, and it's obvious by now that red flags aren't a negative in their personnel evaluations.

But you're right that they obviously didn't have much concern about the Eagles adding Smith. I'm not sure whether that's a reflection on the Eagles or on Smith, but it wasn't something they had much interest in guarding against, especially because I presume the Bears' offer would also have been available to them at 10, so they could have jumped out of that pick without helping a rival.


Either the Bears didn't make them the same offer, or the guy Dallas really wanted was Parsons all along, and the Eagles offering them a free third round pick to get him anyway was worth it to them.
Fuck  
ryanmkeane : 4/30/2021 11:26 am : link
Dallas and fuck Philly. Time to take this division over.
RE: Also  
Gatorade Dunk : 4/30/2021 11:26 am : link
In comment 15245059 chopperhatch said:
Quote:
How pissed off would you be this morning if the Eagles made that trade?

The trade we made would have potentially given them a FOURTH 1st round pick for next year. That would be tough to stomach.
The Eagles have to live with the fact they passed on Jefferson  
GiantBlue : 4/30/2021 11:26 am : link
They drafter Reagor and Jefferson may be the HOF WR out of last year's draft!

Now they draft Smith.....and Let's hope Toney becomes the HOF WR out of this draft!
I keep seeing people crying about  
jvm52106 : 4/30/2021 11:27 am : link
not getting Smith. Listen, he is a great player (college level) and will need to prove it at the NFL level. He can say anything he wants right now but Jalen Hurts is no guarantee to become the man.

Plus, I don't care what others did it is what we did. We did a great job, got a weapon many people like, added pick now and picks next year!
RE: RE: I think Dallas pivoted the same way we pivoted  
Gatorade Dunk : 4/30/2021 11:27 am : link
In comment 15245085 FStubbs said:
Quote:
In comment 15245076 Gatorade Dunk said:


Quote:


They clearly had an expectation that one of the two CBs would be there for them, and they bailed when the draft unfolded differently. They still got a really good defensive player, and it's obvious by now that red flags aren't a negative in their personnel evaluations.

But you're right that they obviously didn't have much concern about the Eagles adding Smith. I'm not sure whether that's a reflection on the Eagles or on Smith, but it wasn't something they had much interest in guarding against, especially because I presume the Bears' offer would also have been available to them at 10, so they could have jumped out of that pick without helping a rival.



Either the Bears didn't make them the same offer, or the guy Dallas really wanted was Parsons all along, and the Eagles offering them a free third round pick to get him anyway was worth it to them.

I think that's exactly right. Or at least Parsons was far and away the next guy on their board after the corners went.
Chicago..  
FatMan in Charlotte : 4/30/2021 11:28 am : link
had been negotiating with Carolina and the Giants. They probably felt confident that they had a couple of options available to them, but I'm glad they didn't make a deal with Dallas.

My guess is that if chicago were already negotiating with NY and had a deal outlined, they probably didn't want to screw them over to do business with Dallas at a similar price
RE: Dallas got screwed by the Broncos and Panthers first  
aGiantGuy : 4/30/2021 11:29 am : link
In comment 15245077 islander1 said:
Quote:
so they just passed it on down by allowing the Eagles to take 'allegedly' our guy. I don't blame Dallas, honestly, they got a third round pick for nothing.

It would've worked, too, if not for the Bears. Gettleman and Abrams deserve a massive amount of credit for taking a questionable situation for us and turning it into a free first round draft pick next year.

What Dallas did was the same thing the Giants did. Basically told the other team "Yeah, we'll trade, but only if our guy is gone". That assumes we'd draft Smith of course.

Yeah, but they did it with a division rival. I think it’s an unwritten rule as much as Dallas will downplay it. The fact remains that they have no defensive answer for Smith on their team so it makes sense to make the weakest team in the division grab him.
RE: Dallas got screwed by the Broncos and Panthers first  
Gatorade Dunk : 4/30/2021 11:30 am : link
In comment 15245077 islander1 said:
Quote:
so they just passed it on down by allowing the Eagles to take 'allegedly' our guy. I don't blame Dallas, honestly, they got a third round pick for nothing.

It would've worked, too, if not for the Bears. Gettleman and Abrams deserve a massive amount of credit for taking a questionable situation for us and turning it into a free first round draft pick next year.

What Dallas did was the same thing the Giants did. Basically told the other team "Yeah, we'll trade, but only if our guy is gone". That assumes we'd draft Smith of course.

I think it's very likely that Smith was our guy - I don't see how there's any getting around that. NYG did a great job of pivoting after missing out on their primary target, but I don't see how anyone can deny that Smith would have been the pick if he was there, just like Dallas would have taken either of the top corners if they were there.
RE: Chicago..  
Gatorade Dunk : 4/30/2021 11:31 am : link
In comment 15245095 FatMan in Charlotte said:
Quote:
had been negotiating with Carolina and the Giants. They probably felt confident that they had a couple of options available to them, but I'm glad they didn't make a deal with Dallas.

My guess is that if chicago were already negotiating with NY and had a deal outlined, they probably didn't want to screw them over to do business with Dallas at a similar price

I always assume there is no shame in backstabbing when it comes to things like draft trades, but I think you're probably right.
The OP is a unique take and for me is salve on the  
Dinger : 4/30/2021 11:33 am : link
Eagles jumping ahead to 'get our guy'. I have NO idea if Smith was who we had our heart set on, but it appears, as we took a WR, that he most likely was. We had no control really and I'm glad we did not trade up to get anyone, but having any team, let alone the Eagles, jump us, burns my bacon. The take FMiC provides helps ease that and knowing we picked up a pick this year and two next makes it a lot better. I mean, what transpired sucked, but I'd rather have give up Smith to get the extra pick this year, plus the potential Toney has, PLUS the 1st rounder next year. THAT, plus some of the takes on Philly an Dallas help.
I got a lot of crap for this, but I think the Dallas trade was awful  
Essex : 4/30/2021 11:33 am : link
under any analysis.

Dallas got Micha Parsons and a third rounder
For swapping their first rounder this year.

There is no way the Bears were not talking to the Cowboys as well. They had to have been able to get our deal. They could have gotten 20, a first rounder next year, a fifth rounder this year, and fourth round next year.

I can't see the differential being made up by the fact that the Cowboys would rather have the Eagles have Smith than the Giants. Not that they did not make that evaluation, but if they did that is a bad deal. Worry about making your team better. because in this NFL fortunes can change and the Eagles could swipe their three first rounders next year for a complete overhaul at QB, making DeVonta Smith a much more difficult person to deal with. After all, they are going to have to deal with Smith in the division for a decade and both teams (Eagles and Giants) will probably have ups and downs in that decade.
The amazing thing about Dallas  
WillieYoung : 4/30/2021 11:35 am : link
is that it appears they are moving on from Leightan Vander Esch. Who saw that coming after he had 141 tackles and two interceptions as a rookie. I'll be surprised if they pick up his 5th year option now.
RE: I got a lot of crap for this, but I think the Dallas trade was awful  
aGiantGuy : 4/30/2021 11:36 am : link
In comment 15245115 Essex said:
Quote:
under any analysis.

Dallas got Micha Parsons and a third rounder
For swapping their first rounder this year.

There is no way the Bears were not talking to the Cowboys as well. They had to have been able to get our deal. They could have gotten 20, a first rounder next year, a fifth rounder this year, and fourth round next year.

I can't see the differential being made up by the fact that the Cowboys would rather have the Eagles have Smith than the Giants. Not that they did not make that evaluation, but if they did that is a bad deal. Worry about making your team better. because in this NFL fortunes can change and the Eagles could swipe their three first rounders next year for a complete overhaul at QB, making DeVonta Smith a much more difficult person to deal with. After all, they are going to have to deal with Smith in the division for a decade and both teams (Eagles and Giants) will probably have ups and downs in that decade.

Not to mention that they could’ve gotten Newsome or Farley at 20 who have the same ceiling as Parsons with better positional value.
Agreed 100% FMiC  
mittenedman : 4/30/2021 11:39 am : link
The Giants smacked both of them around last year and are clearly on the upswing. DAL correctly identified Smith as a missing piece for us. With Golladay here, an All Pro slot/flanker would've been Cruz to Nicks.

Unfortunately for PHI, they are much more than a slot/flanker away from being good. So they "stuck it to us" when in reality, we got Toney and 2 #1's next year in what is being billed as a loaded class.

It looks to me like both DAL & PHI panicked at the prospect of the Giants getting Smith, and made a bad situation for them, worse.
They got a third round pick for dropping two spots.  
shockeyisthebest8056 : 4/30/2021 11:40 am : link
Plus, they got the guy they would’ve drafted if they were somehow forced to stay at ten. It was a smart move and had nothing to do with their level of fear or respect for either of their division rivals.
RE: RE: Dallas got screwed by the Broncos and Panthers first  
islander1 : 4/30/2021 11:41 am : link
In comment 15245097 aGiantGuy said:
Quote:
In comment 15245077 islander1 said:


Quote:


so they just passed it on down by allowing the Eagles to take 'allegedly' our guy. I don't blame Dallas, honestly, they got a third round pick for nothing.

It would've worked, too, if not for the Bears. Gettleman and Abrams deserve a massive amount of credit for taking a questionable situation for us and turning it into a free first round draft pick next year.

What Dallas did was the same thing the Giants did. Basically told the other team "Yeah, we'll trade, but only if our guy is gone". That assumes we'd draft Smith of course.



Yeah, but they did it with a division rival. I think it’s an unwritten rule as much as Dallas will downplay it. The fact remains that they have no defensive answer for Smith on their team so it makes sense to make the weakest team in the division grab him.


There was also an unwritten rule that you don't tank a game on purpose, but that didn't stop those scumbags in Philly from doing that either, so...

If you listened to that last press conference with Jerruh  
Zeke's Alibi : 4/30/2021 11:42 am : link
his son looked like he wanted to put a muzzle on him. They def weren’t trading up and were def looking to add picks.
RE: They got a third round pick for dropping two spots.  
Essex : 4/30/2021 11:43 am : link
In comment 15245137 shockeyisthebest8056 said:
Quote:
Plus, they got the guy they would’ve drafted if they were somehow forced to stay at ten. It was a smart move and had nothing to do with their level of fear or respect for either of their division rivals.


so what, that doesn't mean anything. They got the guy they would have drafted and picked up a third, but they could have had a pick ten picks later and got a quality player (who has more value positionally than Parsons even if Parsons was not there which while not likely is not unthinable). Then, they could have had THREE MORE picks, including a 2022 first and a fourth and fifth. It just boggles my mind that people say, "oh well, they got the guy they wanted" and they also got the third. That makes no sense if there is pot of gold sitting next you that you ignore.
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