Love the trade down, and Toney looks like a human highlight reel. He'll add a lot to the offense.
However, given past experiences with Plax and DeAndre Baker, I'm not so thrilled about this tidbit from Duggan today:
(Toney) was suspended for the 2018 season opener after he was among a group of Florida players involved in a confrontation with Gainesville locals where he painted an air-soft gun to look like an AR-15 assault rifle. A few months later, he was pulled over and an authentic AR-15 rifle was found loaded in his back seat. He said the gun was for protection from the locals and he wasn’t charged for violating the state’s open-carry law because the gun was in the back seat.
Chris Petit went on to say:
We spent time with him in person to get to know the person there and that continues. Then our security staff goes through every check that we do on every player. Listen, if there was a concern with him, he wouldn’t have been on our board.
One would hope, but DeAndre Baker was on your board not long ago.
I don't care whether your pro or anti gun, I think it's fair to say NFL Players and guns are NEVER a GOOD mix. Just like they tell the rookies at the symposium, nothing good ever happens at 3am. It's also true that nothing good ever happens with NFL players and guns. There are zero positive outcomes.
Maybe the Giants should have Plax to talk to the kid and explain in gory detail that NY's gun laws are VERY different to Florida's.
Good point. And I think it was pretty arrogant for them to say: If there was a concern with him, he wouldn’t have been on our board.
With the Baker fiasco SO fresh in everyone's memory. I'm not saying they could have foreseen the Baker incident, but they could maybe show a little more humility after it.
I would have preferred something more like:
We do our best to vet everything, and sometimes things still happen. In Toney's case, we're aware of the gun incidents, and we're taking steps to ensure he thoroughly understands NY gun laws, and what we expect of him in this regard as NY Giant.
That would have been more assuring.
Regardless, how they say it doesn't really matter but only if it sinks in.
I do have laugh how we Giants fans will look the other way when it's one of our guys. We've had a lot of shady characters play for this team.
I say this is a new slate - no point in living in the past. I trust they did their homework and we will have no issues with Toney going forward.
It was August 2018, so 2.5 years ago. Also, the gun was loaded. And in another city he might have been charged. The cops discussed whether to charge him. The law here is very vague. This is what the Tampa Bay Times reported:
"Police said Toney's weapon was in the backseat, not concealed. But officers questioned whether the weapon was "on or about" him, which would have violated the state's open-carry law. They decided it was not, because it was in the backseat rather than, say, between his legs." If it was in the front seat my guess is he'd have been charged.
Also, this idea that it was 2 or 3 years ago is odd, considering Parsons' incident was also in 2018, and since then he has had a child, which changes most people's outlook on life. Yet the majority of BBI was strongly against Parsons. Sadly, we'll be dealing with Parsons and Smith (the new DeShaun Jackson) for 10 years
That said, I like the pick and think Toney's quickness and ability to separate in an instant is exactly what Jones and the offense needs.
Yep, I've been here 14 years and guns, college and high school football should be somewhere in the state constitution. A large percentage of Floridians are gun owners. So the kid has an AR-15...big deal. Once he is a responsible gun owner he can have all the guns he wants.
Seriously, I wonder about the mental state.
SOunds like the Giants spent alot of time looking into Toney and alot of time with him personally getting to know him and were satisfied.
Gun culture is deeply embedded down here
Seriously, I wonder about the mental state.
Due respect, but I think many of us don't fully realize the state of affairs in the areas some of these kids come from
Not trying to make any kind of larger political/social commentary here. I grew up in a town where we rode our bikes around the neighborhood after school and the worst that happened was a kid got a bruise in a backyard pickup game
But i'm also aware for kids from some parts of this country, feeling compelled to carry a gun at 18 for protection is a fact of life.
I actually think the fact he was doing so legally and didn't get arrested for anything related to it is a good sign
From article:
"Toney told police he needed the weapon for protection from locals in Gainesville because "they be coming after us." The stop came after tension (and at least one fight) between some Gators and Gainesville residents, including Devante "Tay Bang" Zachery."
Link - ( New Window )
Regardless, how they say it doesn't really matter but only if it sinks in.
I do have laugh how we Giants fans will look the other way when it's one of our guys. We've had a lot of shady characters play for this team.
EVERY Team has "a lot of shady characters". Unfortunately it's part of the deal for everyone. I'm paraphrasing here, but I remember Francesa asked Reese about Bradshaw's issues(remember he had to serve time after his rookie season for a college era incident), Reese said something to the effect that you investigate, meet the kid, and have to determine if the incident was just a stupid transgression, or if the kid really is a bad guy who will always be in trouble. If the former you take him, the latter you pass.
Dollars to doughnuts a solid majority of players are gun owners.
This won't change your mind, but it should. From Webster's (and other dictionaries):
"Assault rifle: any of various intermediate-range, magazine-fed military rifles (such as the AK-47) that can be set for automatic or semiautomatic fire
also : a rifle that resembles a military assault rifle but is designed to allow only semiautomatic fire."
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and I can't imagine a security situation that would require a college student in Gainesville, Florida to require an AR-15 (or any firearm) for protection. I have a deep respect for the right to own a gun, but a profound fear of people using that right to do very stupid things.
This really requires the peeling back of another layer... what was Toney doing and where was he going that he felt so threatened?
As a gun owner yourself and a self-proclaimed gun nut - if it's legal to own and carry the gun in Florida, why is it anyone's business what he's doing with it? Maybe target shooting? Protection? Hunting?
This is thread should probably be deleted.
The report said he had an AR for self protection. I questioned why a college student would need to have a loaded AR-15 in the backseat of his car for protection. I think there's a lot more to the story about his behavior. The gun is what most people gravitate to, but the reason he felt threatened and what he was doing is more telling...
Except that that is unbelievably rare. Lots of these guys handle guns all the time. Highlighting rarities is silly.
How many of these guys smoke weed regularly? 50%? Higher? And how many get popped for failing drug tests. Not many at all.
.223 actually
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One gun is not a fetish.. nor is 6 guns an "arsenal"
ar·se·nal
/ˈärs(ə)n(ə)l/
noun
a collection of weapons and military equipment stored by a country, person, or group.
He lawfully owned an AR. He didn’t do anything wrong.
IMO, there's some intersect between "he didn't legally do anything wrong" and "19-year-old college football players don't really have any reason to be carrying a loaded AR-15 in their car."
I'm excited to have Toney on the Giants, but I'd consider myself to be in full denial if I didn't acknowledge that his firearm history is a bit of a concern. I just hope he's more mature by now.
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and I can't imagine a security situation that would require a college student in Gainesville, Florida to require an AR-15 (or any firearm) for protection. I have a deep respect for the right to own a gun, but a profound fear of people using that right to do very stupid things.
This really requires the peeling back of another layer... what was Toney doing and where was he going that he felt so threatened?
As a gun owner yourself and a self-proclaimed gun nut - if it's legal to own and carry the gun in Florida, why is it anyone's business what he's doing with it? Maybe target shooting? Protection? Hunting?
This is thread should probably be deleted.
It absolutely matters what he was doing with it.
That's a crazy defense.
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Assault. An AR15 is a .22 caliber.
.223 actually
Assault is a verb. If anything, its a defensive weapon. Most gun deaths in US are by hand guns.. The Plax thing was ridiculous. Any sane person knows you carry in a holster,esp a weapon like a glock. not in your waistband... STUPID not to know the laws in NY
Teams need to have a serious talk with players coming into blue states from red states and make sure they follow all laws.. cost us a repeat superbowl and a man his career, almost his life
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In comment 15245584 Paulie Walnuts said:
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One gun is not a fetish.. nor is 6 guns an "arsenal"
ar·se·nal
/ˈärs(ə)n(ə)l/
noun
a collection of weapons and military equipment stored by a country, person, or group.
not even close man.. like 1000 rds is a huge amount of ammo
Huh? What are you talking about? What's that got to do with rounds of ammunition?
Would you prefer the definition from Merriam-Webster?
Definition of arsenal
1a: an establishment for the manufacture or storage of arms and military equipment
The city is home to a federal arsenal.
b: a collection of weapons
went with a friend who stated that to be legal in NJ, he had to conceal the weapon in his trunk, not in the cabin of the car, and that it had to have a trigger lock.
Since most of his time will most likely be in NJ, not sure why we are worried about NY gun laws?
went with a friend who stated that to be legal in NJ, he had to conceal the weapon in his trunk, not in the cabin of the car, and that it had to have a trigger lock.
Since most of his time will most likely be in NJ, not sure why we are worried about NY gun laws?
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In comment 15245603 PwndPapi said:
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In comment 15245584 Paulie Walnuts said:
Quote:
One gun is not a fetish.. nor is 6 guns an "arsenal"
ar·se·nal
/ˈärs(ə)n(ə)l/
noun
a collection of weapons and military equipment stored by a country, person, or group.
not even close man.. like 1000 rds is a huge amount of ammo
Huh? What are you talking about? What's that got to do with rounds of ammunition?
Would you prefer the definition from Merriam-Webster?
Definition of arsenal
1a: an establishment for the manufacture or storage of arms and military equipment
The city is home to a federal arsenal.
b: a collection of weapons
OK, To me 5-6 rifles is hardly an arsenal,not even a collection, but whatever. live your life..
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In comment 15245503 BamaBlue said:
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and I can't imagine a security situation that would require a college student in Gainesville, Florida to require an AR-15 (or any firearm) for protection. I have a deep respect for the right to own a gun, but a profound fear of people using that right to do very stupid things.
This really requires the peeling back of another layer... what was Toney doing and where was he going that he felt so threatened?
As a gun owner yourself and a self-proclaimed gun nut - if it's legal to own and carry the gun in Florida, why is it anyone's business what he's doing with it? Maybe target shooting? Protection? Hunting?
This is thread should probably be deleted.
It absolutely matters what he was doing with it.
That's a crazy defense.
It's not a defense, it's a question. People are questioning this guy's character and making comparisons to DeAndre Baker and Plaxico Burress. He was pulled over for a seat belt violation, and the police found a registered gun being carried in a legal manner. How many thousands of times do things like this likely occur in open carry states like Florida?
It might make you uncomfortable, but his explanation for carrying the gun was self-protection. That's probably the explanation that more than 50% of gun owners would provide in that scenario. What would make you question his character more than a housewife with a handgun in her purse?
I also don't know any housewives who carry handguns in their pocketbooks.
So forgive me if I'd prefer the Giants rookies (AND veterans) to NOT be "gun guys."
Not sure your meaning of “gun guy”; but I t sounds ominous.
I don’t own a gun, don’t like them. But Almost everyone I know has more than 1; none of them come across as particularly, dangerous.
Perhaps you should rethink your position.
[/quote]
This is a good post, makes you think.
Personally, I was a bit concerned about the fake AR then the real AR, even if it's legal, maybe just Baker and Plax are on my mind. Being a Rapper? You have to be kidding. Lot's of people love the genre, he's creative, I think that's a good thing.
He should have said it was his fucking Constitutional right to have it, and nobody else's business.
Side note: always practice proper gun safety techniques.
He should have said it was his fucking Constitutional right to have it, and nobody else's business.
Side note: always practice proper gun safety techniques.
Agree with you that!!! #2A
I also don't know any housewives who carry handguns in their pocketbooks.
He didn’t get stopped with an illegal gun. It was legally registered.
Maybe you should visit Texas, Georgia or Florida.
I think you’re missing my point, however Brown Hornet hit the nail on the head.
He should have said it was his fucking Constitutional right to have it, and nobody else's business.
Side note: always practice proper gun safety techniques.
"A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed."
Funny how we ignore that first sentence there. I guess some things written in the Constitution are worth dedicating your life to while others are just there...for no reason I guess?
P.s do you know any other amendments or just the one's about shooting stuff?
And it will
Than the Giants will stand around in confusion looking like townspeople from Rock Ridge.
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gets stopped with an illegal gun also claims to have for protection. Even criminals.
I also don't know any housewives who carry handguns in their pocketbooks.
He didn’t get stopped with an illegal gun. It was legally registered.
Maybe you should visit Texas, Georgia or Florida.
I think you’re missing my point, however Brown Hornet hit the nail on the head.
Look. All I'm saying is when we fans asked for offensive weapons this offseason, AR-15s isn't quite what we had in mind.
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is to say that it was for protection against the locals.
He should have said it was his fucking Constitutional right to have it, and nobody else's business.
Side note: always practice proper gun safety techniques.
"A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed."
Funny how we ignore that first sentence there. I guess some things written in the Constitution are worth dedicating your life to while others are just there...for no reason I guess?
P.s do you know any other amendments or just the one's about shooting stuff?
We don't ignore the first sentence. We just understand what a "well-regulated Militia" meant when it was written (hint: it's not the National Guard). We also understand that wherever "the right of the people" appears in the Constitution, the phrase refers to an individual right, not a collective right.
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is to say that it was for protection against the locals.
He should have said it was his fucking Constitutional right to have it, and nobody else's business.
Side note: always practice proper gun safety techniques.
"A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed."
Funny how we ignore that first sentence there. I guess some things written in the Constitution are worth dedicating your life to while others are just there...for no reason I guess?
P.s do you know any other amendments or just the one's about shooting stuff?
Certain people will always take certain passages of dusty old documents literally and ignore other parts entirely. Let's just be happy they can read at all.
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In comment 15245943 fivehead said:
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is to say that it was for protection against the locals.
He should have said it was his fucking Constitutional right to have it, and nobody else's business.
Side note: always practice proper gun safety techniques.
"A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed."
Funny how we ignore that first sentence there. I guess some things written in the Constitution are worth dedicating your life to while others are just there...for no reason I guess?
P.s do you know any other amendments or just the one's about shooting stuff?
We don't ignore the first sentence. We just understand what a "well-regulated Militia" meant when it was written (hint: it's not the National Guard). We also understand that wherever "the right of the people" appears in the Constitution, the phrase refers to an individual right, not a collective right.
Hint: "well-regulated" was not intended to be a throwaway portion.