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Giants coach Joe Judge said most other NFL players would have missed more than only two games. “Look, Daniel is the last guy that’s going to use anything as an excuse,” Judge, who rarely talks about injuries, told The Michael Kay Show on Monday. What I would say about the injury last year is it was much more serious than maybe people thought on the outside. I would say probably 90 percent of players in the league who would have had that injury, including quarterbacks, would have been on IR for the remainder of the year. That’s just the reality of it. It was much more severe than maybe he allowed people to know or the information that was put out there, and we’re going to protect our players by not disclosing everything about their injuries to be honest with you. He fought through a lot of things. He earned a lot of people’s respect.” |
You may want to just refrain from quoting or citing other posters.
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Not true. It was said that if we had drafted Herbert, we'd have made the playoffs(even though Herbert didn't even make the fucking playoffs). also, I'm pretty sure it was said that Nick Mullens was worth a couple extra wins this year too. I'm not going to scour the archives, but I know this was said: At least two guys on this thread posted in the past that a "NFL average QB" has us in the playoffs. So draw the conclusion from that what you will.
Well, the Chargers were in the AFCW, a real division. And finished 7-9, which would have been good enough - likely - to win the NFCE.
The NFCE winners only 7-9. NYG was one game back. So it's not a wild assertion to think if we had average QB play we likely win the NFCE. Because Jones was a below average QB last year just using QBR as the benchmark.
If Jones shits the bed this year, I will be with you. I don't see it though. I think this coaching staff has evaluated him and provided him perfect schematic fits. If you were to back off the tiniest bit, you could enjoy his potential success this season. Right now, you are setting yourself up to take a beating every time he has a good game.
The people that are saying prove it in 2021 are going to be able to roll with whatever happens. If he exceeds expectations and has an Allen like 3rd year, you will be thrown in a tar pit and then covered in feathers.
Figuratively.
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Here's my angle here - Garrett. Fields is a more athletic Dak. So if you give him a better version of Dak - and Garrett did excellent work with Dak - things could be very interesting...
Personally i'm not doing anything for Jason Garrett - sink or swim time for him too. I think the Giants know he's gone after this year either by choice (HC offer if the Giants play well) or by being fired.
If Jones has a good season, do you still want Garrett gone? And then have a third OC for Jones?
No but I don't think it will be up to us, he'd likely get a HC offer. Plus Kitchens sounds like he's heavily involved anyway, so I don't really view this as JG's offense to begin with.
You may want to just refrain from quoting or citing other posters.
And what's the point of pointing that out? What is the rationale? What exactly am I missing in that statement?
This shit is so stupid.
Bill L. - landing on a turning aircraft carrier or something like that I recall?
The detractors think that Jones was a key reason the team hasn't been good - which is why they beat each of these fucking threads to death with the nonsense.
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In comment 15254985 UConn4523 said:
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Here's my angle here - Garrett. Fields is a more athletic Dak. So if you give him a better version of Dak - and Garrett did excellent work with Dak - things could be very interesting...
Personally i'm not doing anything for Jason Garrett - sink or swim time for him too. I think the Giants know he's gone after this year either by choice (HC offer if the Giants play well) or by being fired.
If Jones has a good season, do you still want Garrett gone? And then have a third OC for Jones?
Ig he has a good season, the Giants are winning. Garrett would be as good as gone anyway. We should resign ourselves to this being the last year of the Judge-Garrett team.
Agree. Good offensive season and Garrett's name will be called again to be a HC which he should take. Bad season and he's fired.
This shit is so stupid.
They can't go 18-0. There are 17 games in the regular season (16 when I posted that months ago).
It's not my job to cut your food and chew it for you. If you don't understand what someone is saying, don't embellish it, throw it in their face later, and claim you hope for common ground.
If Jones has a great year in 21 you'll be the first guy killing me for it. Please.
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for Gettleman's 4 years.... means what exactly?
This shit is so stupid.
They can't go 18-0. There are 17 games in the regular season (16 when I posted that months ago).
It's not my job to cut your food and chew it for you. If you don't understand what someone is saying, don't embellish it, throw it in their face later, and claim you hope for common ground.
If Jones has a great year in 21 you'll be the first guy killing me for it. Please.
I'll have to get in a long line, I'm sure.
The Giants are doing what most teams do, load up the offense for their franchise QB. This year is all about clarity, and removing perceived excuses from the equation. Jones needs to prove he can be durable and lead this team to wins.
I was pleased with how Jones performed against the Eagles last year, especially the 2nd game. That is what a Jones led offense should look like - he made some great throws in that game, including a long run for a touchdown. That is what we need to see this year, that’s a player you can win with.
I don’t know if Jones is the guy yet, but I don’t know if he isn’t either. It’s time to see wins though. We’ll know by Thanksgiving how it’s trending.
The Giants are doing what most teams do, load up the offense for their franchise QB. This year is all about clarity, and removing perceived excuses from the equation. Jones needs to prove he can be durable and lead this team to wins.
I was pleased with how Jones performed against the Eagles last year, especially the 2nd game. That is what a Jones led offense should look like - he made some great throws in that game, including a long run for a touchdown. That is what we need to see this year, that’s a player you can win with.
I don’t know if Jones is the guy yet, but I don’t know if he isn’t either. It’s time to see wins though. We’ll know by Thanksgiving how it’s trending.
That's in line with about 98% of the active posters here, probably.
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In comment 15255187 Britt in VA said:
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for Gettleman's 4 years.... means what exactly?
This shit is so stupid.
They can't go 18-0. There are 17 games in the regular season (16 when I posted that months ago).
It's not my job to cut your food and chew it for you. If you don't understand what someone is saying, don't embellish it, throw it in their face later, and claim you hope for common ground.
If Jones has a great year in 21 you'll be the first guy killing me for it. Please.
I'll have to get in a long line, I'm sure.
You'll probably post a victory lap thread to cut the line, I'm sure.
I'm not the one who adds words and takes quotes out of context.
I linked to my reference, for better or worse. You should try that sometime.
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I do think Jones cost the Giants a win against Tampa last year. He missed some crucial throws and was late on the 2 point conversion. I also feel his fumble that led to a touchdown in Dallas was extremely costly, it changed the whole game. He needs to be better.
The Giants are doing what most teams do, load up the offense for their franchise QB. This year is all about clarity, and removing perceived excuses from the equation. Jones needs to prove he can be durable and lead this team to wins.
I was pleased with how Jones performed against the Eagles last year, especially the 2nd game. That is what a Jones led offense should look like - he made some great throws in that game, including a long run for a touchdown. That is what we need to see this year, that’s a player you can win with.
I don’t know if Jones is the guy yet, but I don’t know if he isn’t either. It’s time to see wins though. We’ll know by Thanksgiving how it’s trending.
That's in line with about 98% of the active posters here, probably.
So then why do you all lose your patience so much with such a small minority? Just simply converse with this huge majority and have the type of threads you want.
Is the goal to have 100% of the board agree for some reason on this or quite frankly any other topic?
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about it already dreamt up when/if it happens.
I'm not the one who adds words and takes quotes out of context.
I linked to my reference, for better or worse. You should try that sometime.
You linked a thread which went against basically everything you said it contained.
If it were me, having said all that and digging up the thread and reading it, I might have said "whoops, I may have misremembered this". But that you bullheadedly doubled down and posted it (maybe hoping that nobody would actually look at it? Not sure) basically shows you to be a disingenuous dude incapable of admitting you were wrong.
So whatever. Terps actually said something very similar to what I said he did. He's not denying he said it. I'm not misremembering that. What you posted however? Pure fiction. And what's even worse, it had NOTHING to do with the discussion. I'm not even sure why you came in hot with that. To discredit me, I guess? Well who looks discredited now?
Screw em'.
You're no more interested in common ground than anyone else. The only difference between you and me is that you've been wrong more often than I've been.
And in a few months when you're wrong again, you'll probably just say you're a better fan than me, and say I'd rather be right than see the Giants win, and blah blah.
I don't give a shit about what anyone is rooting for. It's a Giants board...that we're all rooting for the Giants is a given.
Rooting for the Giants shouldn't interfere with our perceptions of reality...but it's amazing how often it does.
Adios.
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In comment 15255311 Britt in VA said:
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about it already dreamt up when/if it happens.
I'm not the one who adds words and takes quotes out of context.
I linked to my reference, for better or worse. You should try that sometime.
You linked a thread which went against basically everything you said it contained.
If it were me, having said all that and digging up the thread and reading it, I might have said "whoops, I may have misremembered this". But that you bullheadedly doubled down and posted it (maybe hoping that nobody would actually look at it? Not sure) basically shows you to be a disingenuous dude incapable of admitting you were wrong.
So whatever. Terps actually said something very similar to what I said he did. He's not denying he said it. I'm not misremembering that. What you posted however? Pure fiction. And what's even worse, it had NOTHING to do with the discussion. I'm not even sure why you came in hot with that. To discredit me, I guess? Well who looks discredited now?
If it was you?
You have taken quotes out of context and added words to people's statements within this thread. I don't think you get to take the high road here, champ. We all do know how much you like to pretend to be holier than thou, though.
But evaluating QBs is very difficult. On the other hand, since you are keeping score, I was pretty spot on with Allen and Herbert. And said Haskins was not going to work in the NFL.
Regardless, I stand by my Fields view and challenge anyone to say he's not a better prospect at this point than Jones was. I believe Sy graded Fields higher than Jones...
I literally just posted like last week what you said about Allen on here few days before that draft. You were off of him at our pick. So I"m not sure how you can claim you were right about him, if you wouldn't have drafted him. You were right about Haskins that's for sure. I saw problems that could get fixed and why I liked him until the character concerns all came out and why I soured on him late in the process. At this point, you'll sing the praises of anyone coming out as long as it's not DJ so I'm not sure Herbert is some revelation. You would have replaced him with anyone that wasn't named Mac this year and I think you are going to see how silly that looks here soon.
Screw em'.
My guess is that the negative nannies would not be so negative if we didn't attack them so much, in my opinion. People get too personal.
If he comes out and leads the Giants to a great season and you want to throw it in my face, have at it. But where we stand right now is that Jones has given the Giants 7 good starts out of a possible 32. That's where things actually stand in the real world. It isn't negativity.
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They'd rather die on a hill than concede an inch.
Screw em'.
The ad hominem attacks they are the target of have turned them into trolls. The subtly of their work is often impressive. BW made me so fucking mad a couple of years ago that I resorted to name calling. I really try to avoid that unless provoked. He didn't deserve it.
My guess is that the negative nannies would not be so negative if we didn't attack them so much, in my opinion. People get too personal.
Quite the therapy session here. What's your hourly rate?
If he comes out and leads the Giants to a great season and you want to throw it in my face, have at it. But where we stand right now is that Jones has given the Giants 7 good starts out of a possible 32. That's where things actually stand in the real world. It isn't negativity.
Jones also had a decent rookie year with little talent. I use an eraser for 2020. Jones might be hot dog shit. My gut tells me 30 TDs and AY/A above league average in 2021. Judge spent the year with him and did not draft Fields or Mac.
I think Judge is a genius or near it based on how he speaks. That doesn't necessarily make him a great coach. I have been surrounded by brilliance in my life and some them could not manage 3 people. I think we may have stepped in dogshit landing him. I am not sure yet. Results do matter.
I just do see a reason you had to dig in so deep the kid is garbage. Other people might not see it, but I know you are one of the more intelligent posters on this board. In a similar way that Judge and DG seem to be collaborating, I think Judge and Jones may well be a good match. I believe him when he says Jones has the respect of the building, both players and coaches.
Rodgers has as much talent as I have ever seen in a QB. It is possible that he hasn't won as many Superbowls as he could have because he is also a dick. The QB has to lead the team. The fact they see the intangibles to work with in Jones is no small thing.
I think it is worth giving the kid our support for 2021. I think most of this board does too. I respect your right to your opinion though. I don't like the way people speak to you.
I did, and I have. I thought at the time that Jones maybe turned a corner, but that was wishful thinking.
I do think the Giants turned a corner bringing in Judge and apparently changing the way they operate. That's very positive, and I do think it will yield good things. Just not in 2021. The most important player on the team was acquired through the old ways, before Judge.
I've said before that I think (emphasis on think before people freak out) that Judge knows his job is secure and is waiting this out. Jones isn't his guy, and he (Judge) just got a lot of ammo to get his guy in 2022.
In the macro sense I'm optimistic.
Bill L. - landing on a turning aircraft carrier or something like that I recall?
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The detractors think that Jones was a key reason the team hasn't been good - which is why they beat each of these fucking threads to death with the nonsense.
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others reasons as well, like the GM who put a poor roster together, particularly on Offense and plopped a rookie QB into the middle of it.
Bill L. - landing on a turning aircraft carrier or something like that I recall?
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The detractors think that Jones was a key reason the team hasn't been good - which is why they beat each of these fucking threads to death with the nonsense.
the reference was something I heard about the battle of midway. A Japanese aircraft carrier could not help because apparently it takes a decade to turn around. Not sure really how long. Point being DG inherited a ship going in the wrong direction and it takes a lot longer than you might think to turn it around.
DG didn't even attempt to turn it around in 18. If anything he went full speed ahead in the direction they were going.
Lt. Richard Best led the second wave. Known for diving at very high speeds and very steep angles, he put a 1000 pound bomb from such a short distance that it went straight to the fuel and munitions storage section before exploding.
That acknowledged, it would take a fully functional Nimitz fifty miles to stop if you shut off the power right now.
Not sure which example is the metaphor you were diving or driving for.
Lt. Richard Best led the second wave. Known for diving at very high speeds and very steep angles, he put a 1000 pound bomb from such a short distance that it went straight to the fuel and munitions storage section before exploding.
That acknowledged, it would take a fully functional Nimitz fifty miles to stop if you shut off the power right now.
Not sure which example is the metaphor you were diving or driving for.
After that shot, if he didn't go by the nickname Dick, he should have 😂
They, of course, universally put him down as an inferior Admiral who did not fight like a gentleman in long distance parallel lines but rather sought to destroy by crossing the T of their ships lines and destroying them in detail from all sides and at close quarters. ( its hard to get your ships lined up one after the other in neat formation...takes a high bred Admiral not like a small common man)
The fact that none of those ever fielded a Naval challenge to England ever again seems lost.
Like some posting styles, Nelson mastered firing at 3x the speed of the opponent.
Or perhaps you could mix your metaphors and disable their rudders while firing 3x faster?
He went up another time at Midway and sunk another carrier. The only man to take down two carriers with over 50 planes apiecen in one day.
He also wrecked his lungs at Midway and never flew combat ever again.
"He likes to create chaos"
But Midway was well done.
One more movie that shows that Woody Harrelson had chops he wasn't showing on the set of Cheers.
He went up another time at Midway and sunk another carrier. The only man to take down two carriers with over 50 planes apiecen in one day.
He also wrecked his lungs at Midway and never flew combat ever again.
I think every one with the name Richard went by Dick back then lol. Winters comes to mind as well. Also, my father was born in '42 and goes by Dick. I however do not
I knew what you meant Bill and I agree.
Turnarounds do take time. They take even longer when root problems are ignored or underestimated from the outset, or a well designed rebuilding plan is not devised only leading to further desperate moves to try and make up for earlier mistakes or lost time. You know the
Oh, and the Akagi was never at Coral Sea. But she and Nagumo sure got their asses kicked in at Midway because he ignored certain warning signs and didn’t have the same level of intelligence that his opponents had...
She was being retrofit/training during the Battle of Coral Sea.
;)
The Ser
The Bonhomme Richard was done...defeated...not up to the test of the day.
Jones decided to not give up. Jones decided that with the trust of his team that he had all he needed.
So Yamamoto decided his 4 other largest carriers from the Kido Butai would be able to do the job at Midway. While the Japanese had a superior number of carriers to the US when the war started, this already showed the weaknesses they had in replacing and refitting their battle units from losses.
Midway’s losses basically crippled them for good.
;)
Well, maybe Jones will just happen to catch his opponents flat-footed in 2021. Maybe he will surprise them and throw a few bombs down their throats when they least expect it.
And turn the tide on his career...