There have been so many moves both in free agency and the Draft to talk about that I kind of feel like Golladay has gotten lost in the shuffle.
He is the most important addition the team has made this offseason and will change the entire offense by just his presence.
People forget that if he does nothing else, Ross can just run go routes and take the top off of defenses -- even if they don't throw to him often.
With Golloday as a deep threat, I don't see teams stacking the box otherwsie Golloday will burn them. This would ostensibly ease some pressure off the OL giving DJ more time to throw. Add in Barkley and Toney who can catch passes in the flat / dump-offs, plus Rudolph as a big safety valve underneath, and there are a lot of ways this team can beat you even with a suspect OL. And that doesn't take into account Shepard, Slayton, Ross and yes, Engram.
Everybody gets licked down a level whe you have a true #1.
Ohh and getting Barkley back!
Can't stack box now.
Front office has supplied the weapons. Coaches need to do their job now and use them to best of ability.
Key to season will be OL. I'm excited about the new OL coach. Hoping for the best.
He only Tweeted a total of THREE TIMES during the entire season last year and two of them were about Christmas.
I like it.
I'm optimistic that a new mix of players (e.g., Fulton) and perhaps a potential vet addition as camps move forward, along with, as the major piece, a year of development and improvement of the existing pieces (renewed and better coaching/teaching), will raise the level a lot form last season. They won't bring in any all-pros (maybe a former one) but enough so that along with everything else that was mentioned (which didn't include Rudolph assisting with blocking), we won't be too self-destructive.
Seriously, he'll be lucky to be active on game days after drafting Toney:
Golladay
Slayton
Toney
Shepard
ST contributor (most likely)
We needed a break... ;)
I'm very curious to see how good KG is going to perform on a bigger stage and without a superior thrower (Stafford) throwing lasers to him.
We needed a break... ;)
I'm very curious to see how good KG is going to perform on a bigger stage and without a superior thrower (Stafford) throwing lasers to him.
I guess those five minutes of optimism from you during the draft was enough for the year?
Thomas Lemieux Gates Hernandez Peart
IMO this young OL's development is more important than Saquon returning + the addition of Golladay combined
I have faith in Thomas and Gates... jury is still out on Lemeiux and Peart but Hernandez really hasn't shown any improvement from his rookie season and at this point, I know he's still really young, but I don't expect to see it from Hernandez.
We needed a break... ;)
I'm very curious to see how good KG is going to perform on a bigger stage and without a superior thrower (Stafford) throwing lasers to him.
You could argue that having a putative superior thrower squandered his best talent of winning balls.
8 in the box to stop Saquan and rolling coverage to KG? Toney, Engram and Slayton/Shep - at least one of those (probably 2) has 1on1
As emotional as we get about Engram and his drops - they still have to cover him!
2 deep safeties/man under? Saquon running behind an OL that allowed WAYNE GALLMAN to avg 4.8 ypc and you better have a spy on DJ.
Blitz w/ Zone? KG and Shep set up shop in the soft spots.
Blitz w/man? Better have a spy, hope the OL doesnt pick it up and hope Toney and Engram dont win early. If they break one tackle - gone. [Engram cant catch] Joke [/Engram cant catch]
All depends on OL, DJ and Garrett but unlike last year, we have guys that can force a DC into making choices.
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talked the KG off-season idea, courtship, health, acquisition, etc to death.
We needed a break... ;)
I'm very curious to see how good KG is going to perform on a bigger stage and without a superior thrower (Stafford) throwing lasers to him.
I guess those five minutes of optimism from you during the draft was enough for the year?
A. It was more than five minutes. I 'm not sure about all of the players, or the positions added, but I thought we finally acted like a team who knew how to optimize the draft board.
B. I actually feel great about the D. I am very fond of Graham and believe he's going to get the most out of a lot of options now.
We needed a break... ;)
I'm very curious to see how good KG is going to perform on a bigger stage and without a superior thrower (Stafford) throwing lasers to him.
I don't know, I'm curious to see how KG performs with one of the best rated deep ball throwers from last year too.
I wanted Samuel. That was my #1 priority. We got a Samuel with Toney. The perfect fit and the last piece we needed.
If Barkley is 100% our skill position guys are truly elite. A great mix too. Explosive across the board. We are going from the bottom of the league to the top in scoring this year.
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talked the KG off-season idea, courtship, health, acquisition, etc to death.
We needed a break... ;)
I'm very curious to see how good KG is going to perform on a bigger stage and without a superior thrower (Stafford) throwing lasers to him.
I don't know, I'm curious to see how KG performs with one of the best rated deep ball throwers from last year too.
Stafford can make every throw on a football field - at times to his detriment - and the ball gets there is a hurry. Stafford can legitimately throw receivers open. I'm not convinced Jones can do that. So that's going to be different for KG.
But, yes, Jones throwing deep to KG will be worth watching...
Everybody gets licked down a level whe you have a true #1.
First of all, I like to get licked down a level once in a while.
2nd, I've seen some critics say Golladay isn't a true #1 and I'm like, really?
Are there a lot of #2 WRs out there that have led the league in TDs, 7th in yards and 3rd in YAC?
We needed a break... ;)
I'm very curious to see how good KG is going to perform on a bigger stage and without a superior thrower (Stafford) throwing lasers to him.
yeah, clearly leaving the comfy and awesome confines of Detroit for the awful, fear inducing stage of NY/NJ will prevent Galladay from catching TD passes and producing.
Seriously, where the hell do you come with this nonsense?
Me too.
I think the OL will be better overall in 2021. It should play more like the 2nd half unit we saw last year which would be just fine, albeit not perfect.
KG is a pro and has been working with DJ on timing, routes and etc... It would be nice if DJ8, has another QB & WR session, where all guys can put in some extra work on timing, routes and etc..
Thomas Lemieux Gates Hernandez Peart
IMO this young OL's development is more important than Saquon returning + the addition of Golladay combined
I have faith in Thomas and Gates... jury is still out on Lemeiux and Peart but Hernandez really hasn't shown any improvement from his rookie season and at this point, I know he's still really young, but I don't expect to see it from Hernandez.
I said this 100 times since FA began that this line as is is a HUMPTY Dumpty line, and all the wishing, and hoping on here, and all the excuses from COVID to being young will put the line back together again. I’ve heard that this so called great coaching staff can teach them to be good rather they have talent, or not.That is a lot to wish, and hope for.
yeah, clearly leaving the comfy and awesome confines of Detroit for the awful, fear inducing stage of NY/NJ will prevent Galladay from catching TD passes and producing.
Seriously, where the hell do you come with this nonsense?
Nice try. You know damn well there is a delta in QB skill between Stafford and Jones.
Or maybe you don't, which would be strange...
Quote:
talked the KG off-season idea, courtship, health, acquisition, etc to death.
We needed a break... ;)
I'm very curious to see how good KG is going to perform on a bigger stage and without a superior thrower (Stafford) throwing lasers to him.
yeah, clearly leaving the comfy and awesome confines of Detroit for the awful, fear inducing stage of NY/NJ will prevent Galladay from catching TD passes and producing.
Seriously, where the hell do you come with this nonsense?
First, you start out with a very large dose of negativity, then you add.. ah, I don't want to be mean, so you can guess the rest.
People forget that if he does nothing else, Ross can just run go routes and take the top off of defenses -- even if they don't throw to him often.
I was talking about him before the draft, saying why if the Giants ended up not going WR in the draft it would be okay because of the additions of Golloday and Ross. If Ross can stay healthy and catch a few balls, he has blazing speed to stretch the field.
We needed a break... ;)
I'm very curious to see how good KG is going to perform on a bigger stage and without a superior thrower (Stafford) throwing lasers to him.
You miss 100% of the shots at Daniel Jones you don't take. Fire away.
I wanted Samuel. That was my #1 priority. We got a Samuel with Toney. The perfect fit and the last piece we needed.
If Barkley is 100% our skill position guys are truly elite. A great mix too. Explosive across the board. We are going from the bottom of the league to the top in scoring this year.
Sort of an interesting hypothetical - which combo would you rather?
KG/Toney
Samuel/Bateman
I think I'd lean towards the former because there's more upside even with the lower cash invested in the 2nd group (though I suppose if there was a compelling extra player added to group 2, like Thuney, the balance shifts). I do think Samuel was really coming into his own last year though and he's more than 2 years younger than Golladay.
(also i'm not trying to nitpick, i'm really happy with what we've got)
I thought that they were a *lot* of fun to watch last year.
It's not more draft picks acquired it's "draft capital"
There is a "delta between the two" not a difference between the two players.
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yeah, clearly leaving the comfy and awesome confines of Detroit for the awful, fear inducing stage of NY/NJ will prevent Galladay from catching TD passes and producing.
Seriously, where the hell do you come with this nonsense?
Nice try. You know damn well there is a delta in QB skill between Stafford and Jones.
Or maybe you don't, which would be strange...
Think the Lions would have taken Jones for Stafford...? ;)
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This team is going to be FUN to watch. I’m excited. Would be great if they opened up camp to public, but that might be asking too much.
I thought that they were a *lot* of fun to watch last year.
I'd call it ugly fun, it was good to see positive traction of any kind on gamedays. But, the lack of finishers dulled the shine and cost them a better record/division crown.
Penei Sewell?
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yeah, clearly leaving the comfy and awesome confines of Detroit for the awful, fear inducing stage of NY/NJ will prevent Galladay from catching TD passes and producing.
Seriously, where the hell do you come with this nonsense?
Nice try. You know damn well there is a delta in QB skill between Stafford and Jones.
Or maybe you don't, which would be strange...
Have you looked at Stafford's stats for his first 2 years, lately?
D. Jones first two years are better than Stafford's (avg. QBR nearly 60 vs mid 40s). And Stafford didn't have the long list of shit going against him going into his 2nd yr (he had some shit going against him, but nothing like D. Jones had last year).
Oh, let me guess, you can't compare them. Different era, right? Give me a break.
But guess what? Stafford took a large leap forward in his THIRD season. Hmmm.
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yeah, clearly leaving the comfy and awesome confines of Detroit for the awful, fear inducing stage of NY/NJ will prevent Galladay from catching TD passes and producing.
Seriously, where the hell do you come with this nonsense?
Nice try. You know damn well there is a delta in QB skill between Stafford and Jones.
Or maybe you don't, which would be strange...
I'm not going to argue a Jones to Stafford comparison right now because that would be too early in Jones' career to be fair. However I will say it must have been really hard to throw Calvin Johnson, Golden Tate (in his prime), and Kenny Golladay open. You can put Stafford on pedestal if you want to but Dante Culpepper looked really good with Randy Moss.
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In comment 15254714 UberAlias said:
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This team is going to be FUN to watch. I’m excited. Would be great if they opened up camp to public, but that might be asking too much.
I thought that they were a *lot* of fun to watch last year.
I'd call it ugly fun, it was good to see positive traction of any kind on gamedays. But, the lack of finishers dulled the shine and cost them a better record/division crown.
Part of it was also (for me anyway) diversion and part was relief that we had any football at all to watch last year.
D. Jones first two years are better than Stafford's (avg. QBR nearly 60 vs mid 40s). And Stafford didn't have the long list of shit going against him going into his 2nd yr (he had some shit going against him, but nothing like D. Jones had last year).
Oh, let me guess, you can't compare them. Different era, right? Give me a break.
But guess what? Stafford took a large leap forward in his THIRD season. Hmmm.
Uh, Stafford got hurt his second year. He only played three games.
So his third year was really his second year. Care to dive into those numbers and compare to Jones's second year?
Jones has 26 starts through 2 years. Stafford had 13.
Nice try.
The offense needs to evolve to maximize one of Jone's proven strengths. I've watched a ton of the lions, my old roommate is a fan...Saying Stafford is the clear better deep passer is wrong imo.
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D. Jones first two years are better than Stafford's (avg. QBR nearly 60 vs mid 40s). And Stafford didn't have the long list of shit going against him going into his 2nd yr (he had some shit going against him, but nothing like D. Jones had last year).
Oh, let me guess, you can't compare them. Different era, right? Give me a break.
But guess what? Stafford took a large leap forward in his THIRD season. Hmmm.
Uh, Stafford got hurt his second year. He only played three games.
So his third year was really his second year. Care to dive into those numbers and compare to Jones's second year?
Jones has 26 starts through 2 years. Stafford had 13.
Nice try.
I would say that this is where we get into tortured comparisons of circumstances. Jones was also injured and then played hurt; should he get dinged for being the tougher player? And, since you raise that issue, then it becomes fair(er) to raise the COVID year issue. And on and on...
He missed most of his 2nd year due to shoulder injury and finished season 1-2, with a QBR of 50 (D. Jones had QBR of 61.5 last yr).
What the hell was wrong with them? (they could've had about 7 QBs by now!)
/s
The offense needs to evolve to maximize one of Jone's proven strengths. I've watched a ton of the lions, my old roommate is a fan...Saying Stafford is the clear better deep passer is wrong imo.
I said Stafford was the better all-around thrower. I said Jones was a good deep ball thrower. It's not even close how much quicker Stafford's release is compared to Jones. Stafford is an elite thrower.
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D. Jones first two years are better than Stafford's (avg. QBR nearly 60 vs mid 40s). And Stafford didn't have the long list of shit going against him going into his 2nd yr (he had some shit going against him, but nothing like D. Jones had last year).
Oh, let me guess, you can't compare them. Different era, right? Give me a break.
But guess what? Stafford took a large leap forward in his THIRD season. Hmmm.
Uh, Stafford got hurt his second year. He only played three games.
So his third year was really his second year.
Excuses, excuses..
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The offense needs to evolve to maximize one of Jone's proven strengths. I've watched a ton of the lions, my old roommate is a fan...Saying Stafford is the clear better deep passer is wrong imo.
I said Stafford was the better all-around thrower. I said Jones was a good deep ball thrower. It's not even close how much quicker Stafford's release is compared to Jones. Stafford is an elite thrower.
He missed most of his 2nd year due to shoulder injury and finished season 1-2, with a QBR of 50 (D. Jones had QBR of 61.5 last yr).
What the hell was wrong with them? (they could've had about 7 QBs by now!)
/s
Here are Stafford's real second year stats:
5K+ passing yards, 64% completion, 41TDs/16INTs (2.56 ratio), 7.6 YPA, 7.7 AYA, QBR 60+, 4 GWDs.
Can we agree those are pretty damn good?
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Here's his rookie stats: 13 TD, 20 INTs, 37.1 QBR
He missed most of his 2nd year due to shoulder injury and finished season 1-2, with a QBR of 50 (D. Jones had QBR of 61.5 last yr).
What the hell was wrong with them? (they could've had about 7 QBs by now!)
/s
Here are Stafford's real second year stats:
5K+ passing yards, 64% completion, 41TDs/16INTs (2.56 ratio), 7.6 YPA, 7.7 AYA, QBR 60+, 4 GWDs.
Can we agree those are pretty damn good?
What I was really trying to respond originally to was the Golloday thing about not being happy with Jones. Unnecessary and even though Stafford will very likely always be the better thrower, Jones could end up the better QB. Intangibles matter more at that position than any other. Jeff George had a better arm and release than Stafford...
Stafford then had another full offseason, training camp, and preseason leading into that third campaign.
The benefit of being around the team, even while injured and the importance of the offseason, training camp, and preseason are often marginalized.
Point is whether he played three regular season games or not, it’s not correct to just skip year 2 and act like year 3 was his second season.
So maybe rather than Hernandez actually losing his job, maybe it was an issue of planning for the future. Coaches knew what they had in Hernandez and wanted to see what they have in Lemieux.
Lost time due to Covid and subsequent recovery from same just added to the matter.
We needed a break... ;)
I'm very curious to see how good KG is going to perform on a bigger stage and without a superior thrower (Stafford) throwing lasers to him.
Here we go again.............
Quote:
talked the KG off-season idea, courtship, health, acquisition, etc to death.
We needed a break... ;)
I'm very curious to see how good KG is going to perform on a bigger stage and without a superior thrower (Stafford) throwing lasers to him.
Here we go again.............
Agreed, the love for Stafford is funny to me. He showed some flashes early in his career that he may be a good QB with a bunch of comeback victories, etc. But at the end of the day he’s a QB that puts up decent stats but hasn’t won anything. And he’s had some nice weapons in Calvin Johnson, Burleson, Marvin Jones, Golladay. We’ll see how he does in LA this year.
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Here's his rookie stats: 13 TD, 20 INTs, 37.1 QBR
He missed most of his 2nd year due to shoulder injury and finished season 1-2, with a QBR of 50 (D. Jones had QBR of 61.5 last yr).
What the hell was wrong with them? (they could've had about 7 QBs by now!)
/s
Here are Stafford's real second year stats:
5K+ passing yards, 64% completion, 41TDs/16INTs (2.56 ratio), 7.6 YPA, 7.7 AYA, QBR 60+, 4 GWDs.
Can we agree those are pretty damn good?
If you're going to play that game, we haven't seen D. Jones "real second year stats" yet (some of us can't wait to see what he can do with the awesome new weapons. Must suck to not look forward to that).
Remember, Kevin Gilbride said the upcoming season should be considered D. Jones 2nd. I don't know if JJ has exactly said that, but he obviously expects him to take a big leap forward (or else they would've done something to replace him).
Are some excuses better than others? In D. Jones case, you have a long list of shit that was completely out of his control. In Stafford's case, you had an injury to his throwing shoulder.
That may have been out of Stafford's control too, but if anything, a season ending injury to a QBs throwing shoulder, after a poor rookie season, should be better justification for cutting bait, right? I know, not for you.
It doesn't matter what anyone says. Jones sucks and doesn't deserve his "real second season".
The real point about Stafford's leap forward is that it actually happened in his THIRD year. This is D. Jones THIRD year. If he takes the leap that others, including Stafford have taken, most of us will be very happy.
If you're going to play that game, we haven't seen D. Jones "real second year stats" yet (some of us can't wait to see what he can do with the awesome new weapons. Must suck to not look forward to that).
Remember, Kevin Gilbride said the upcoming season should be considered D. Jones 2nd. I don't know if JJ has exactly said that, but he obviously expects him to take a big leap forward (or else they would've done something to replace him).
Are some excuses better than others? In D. Jones case, you have a long list of shit that was completely out of his control. In Stafford's case, you had an injury to his throwing shoulder.
That may have been out of Stafford's control too, but if anything, a season ending injury to a QBs throwing shoulder, after a poor rookie season, should be better justification for cutting bait, right? I know, not for you.
It doesn't matter what anyone says. Jones sucks and doesn't deserve his "real second season".
The real point about Stafford's leap forward is that it actually happened in his THIRD year. This is D. Jones THIRD year. If he takes the leap that others, including Stafford have taken, most of us will be very happy.
With all due respect, Stafford, again, only had 13 starts before he really crushed it. Maybe it was technically his third year by virtue of his contract, but by starts he was much further along than Jones.
The point I was making is that Stafford, purely based on throwing ability, is in a different universe than Jones and can make - and create - more throws than Jones. So I think it's going to be interesting to see how KG adapts to that.
But if you want to keep letting your imagination run away thinking Jones is on the same level as Stafford than dream away...
Agreed, the love for Stafford is funny to me. He showed some flashes early in his career that he may be a good QB with a bunch of comeback victories, etc. But at the end of the day he’s a QB that puts up decent stats but hasn’t won anything. And he’s had some nice weapons in Calvin Johnson, Burleson, Marvin Jones, Golladay. We’ll see how he does in LA this year.
In Stafford's defense, he has played in Detroit. I wouldn't call that the most stable place in the NFL.
I do agree, however, to an extent, he has come up a bit short and a change of scenery was needed...
What excuses are you referring to here?
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Agreed, the love for Stafford is funny to me. He showed some flashes early in his career that he may be a good QB with a bunch of comeback victories, etc. But at the end of the day he’s a QB that puts up decent stats but hasn’t won anything. And he’s had some nice weapons in Calvin Johnson, Burleson, Marvin Jones, Golladay. We’ll see how he does in LA this year.
In Stafford's defense, he has played in Detroit. I wouldn't call that the most stable place in the NFL.
I do agree, however, to an extent, he has come up a bit short and a change of scenery was needed...
Rodgers is interesting to me. Not in defense of Jones but just in terms of the giants overall.
His age is so far out of tune with the rest of the lineup, that you'd have to be very deep into your investigation and confidence of his shelf-life (which includes more than the physicalness but also other extracurricular draws on his life). You would definitely be mortgaging the future to get him (especially when you think of not only draft picks but who you have to jettison in salary). You would almost need a SB guarantee in the next year or two; would the rest of the team be able to carry that? And then, after that, you're pretty much done for a decade.
True, but even you must admit Detroit got absolutely screwed a few years ago in the playoff loss in Dallas. That was a tragic display by those refs...
What does that mean? Are we talking about pure Arm strength? Does that make you an "Elite Thrower" ?
I think an elite thrower would also include timing, touch, and placement too. In that regard I never fully understood the Stafford love. He has played with some GREAT receivers who can mask a lot of QB errors.
So my argument just might be a semantic one.
Back to the topic of this thread - I am super excited to see Golladay with Daniel Jones and it is great he will give us barometer as fans to judge Daniel Jones.
I will use the Culpepper example again - but great weapons make some predestination QB look great. I think DJ is better than Culpepper and I expect his numbers to increase with his new weapons.
Golladay will not only improve DJ for their connection, but he should improve DJ with others as well. He will pull double teams, leaving space for others. This should also give the benefit to DJ to read the field better which is something he needs to improve on this year.
DJ is a pre-snap read QB which Golladay will be there to make the contested catch while Toney may give Daniel the added boost he needs post read when Safeties need to make quicker decisions when in coverage than sit back like last year when player failed to get separation quickly.
There is a "delta between the two" not a difference between the two players.
I'm puzzled... are they in Mississippi? At an airport? In a sorority house?
I also love a world where Jones record is what it is and excuses are a losers lament while Matthew stafford's record is a function of the dysfunction in Detroit, not his own weaknesses.
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There is a "delta between the two" not a difference between the two players.
I'm puzzled... are they in Mississippi? At an airport? In a sorority house?
NICE
In any case, Golladay and Barkley on the field together change the Giants fundamentally. No more stacking the box. And no more dropping everyone into coverage. Now you have to play the Giants even up. That is going to completely change the game for the Giants over what has happened during the last two years.
The Rams just gave two number one picks and Jared Goff for Matthew Stafford. At best, Daniel Jones would get a second round pick... There is no comparison between these two quarterbacks.
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as the #6 pick in his draft than Stafford has been as the #1 pick in his draft
The Rams just gave two number one picks and Jared Goff for Matthew Stafford. At best, Daniel Jones would get a second round pick... There is no comparison between these two quarterbacks.
How much would Detroit have gotten for Stafford after his 2nd season (and rookie season that was much worse than that of D. Jones)? Possibly less than the Giants would've gotten for D. Jones after his 2nd.
The Lions wisely gave Stafford a THIRD season to prove himself. And he did. Can we please just fucking do the same for Jones?
I also love a world where Jones record is what it is and excuses are a losers lament while Matthew stafford's record is a function of the dysfunction in Detroit, not his own weaknesses.
How about in 2013 when all the Lions had to do was beat the Giants who's best offensive weapon at the time was Jerrell Jernigan and lost.
I know every conversation comes back to Jones, but as long as the OL performs on the improved level they were showing late in the season, we will really find out of DJ is the guy or not. Most of the excuses seem to be gone
I also love a world where Jones record is what it is and excuses are a losers lament while Matthew stafford's record is a function of the dysfunction in Detroit, not his own weaknesses.
Absolutely correct. It amazes me that Eli took a ton of shit on this very board about his record even w two freaking SB MVPs. And DJ takes a ton of shit for his record. He’s only been at it for two years. Stafford? 12 years.
But Stafford, 20 games below 500 and not one PO win.
Sometimes you just got to shake your head.
How much would Detroit have gotten for Stafford after his 2nd season (and rookie season that was much worse than that of D. Jones)? Possibly less than the Giants would've gotten for D. Jones after his 2nd.
The Lions wisely gave Stafford a THIRD season to prove himself. And he did. Can we please just fucking do the same for Jones?
Just to round this out, the economics were different, too, with Stafford. His first contract was for 6yrs/$72M.
I still hold arm talent to be a very important trait of a QB. WFT for example has the chance to be a very good defense with a defensive minded HC. They will scheme and play to make Jones stick those long throws that need to be thrown with velocity on a line. Jones will need to make them.
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In comment 15254883 LeonBright45 said:
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as the #6 pick in his draft than Stafford has been as the #1 pick in his draft
The Rams just gave two number one picks and Jared Goff for Matthew Stafford. At best, Daniel Jones would get a second round pick... There is no comparison between these two quarterbacks.
How much would Detroit have gotten for Stafford after his 2nd season (and rookie season that was much worse than that of D. Jones)? Possibly less than the Giants would've gotten for D. Jones after his 2nd.
The Lions wisely gave Stafford a THIRD season to prove himself. And he did. Can we please just fucking do the same for Jones?
If Jones has the same third year as Stafford there will be dancing in the streets... But there was near universal clarity that Stafford was a good quarterback despite his slow start and he would have still had greater trade value than Jones at the same point in his career...
The sheer whiff of any excuse making for Jones sends you and the usual suspects into a frenzy, and yet, whenever another player is discussed, you find narratives and ways to make excuses, the same stuff you always tell posters NOT to do about the Giants
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as the #6 pick in his draft than Stafford has been as the #1 pick in his draft
The Rams just gave two number one picks and Jared Goff for Matthew Stafford. At best, Daniel Jones would get a second round pick... There is no comparison between these two quarterbacks.
Comparing what Stafford would get in his prime to Jones in his second year. Brilliant.
The sheer whiff of any excuse making for Jones sends you and the usual suspects into a frenzy, and yet, whenever another player is discussed, you find narratives and ways to make excuses, the same stuff you always tell posters NOT to do about the Giants
Narratives. These buzzwords are just beautiful.
Let's address the two incidents you raised for Stafford...
On the third year issue, there is no excuse. It's accurately describing the circumstance. Stafford got hurt his second year and only played three games (shoulder). At that point, he had 13 starts. Right? So while he was technically into his third season by contract, his second year was basically a wash out. Can we agree on that? Whereas Jones had 26 starts by the end of his second year...
If what happened to the Lions and Stafford, in Dallas for that 2015 playoff game, happened to the Giants in a playoff game this site would be set on fire. And rightfully so. That was a horrendous call. Even my Fat Friend in Charlotte, I believe, would agree with this take...
I think that is an apt description of Stafford. And I never said he was a great QB. I said he had elite arm talent.
Ironically, this type of post seems to your entire contribution as well...
Many-a-time, I remember him making his way down the field knocking linebackers and defensive backs on their collective
asses in front of the running back.
At 6' 4-5", 235-40, with a head of steam, he delivered a healthy blow. I hope Galllady is 1/2 as good !
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is "well, technically, it was his SECOND season...and well, they did get screwed by the refs during the course of his career..."
The sheer whiff of any excuse making for Jones sends you and the usual suspects into a frenzy, and yet, whenever another player is discussed, you find narratives and ways to make excuses, the same stuff you always tell posters NOT to do about the Giants
Narratives. These buzzwords are just beautiful.
Let's address the two incidents you raised for Stafford...
On the third year issue, there is no excuse. It's accurately describing the circumstance. Stafford got hurt his second year and only played three games (shoulder). At that point, he had 13 starts. Right? So while he was technically into his third season by contract, his second year was basically a wash out. Can we agree on that? Whereas Jones had 26 starts by the end of his second year...
You can try to spin it any way you like, but it's still making an excuse.
But yet, you (and others) are completely dismissive when people (rightfully) that DJ has had (close to) zero weapons, had two OC's in two years and had to deal with no offseason due to COVID.
Yeah, sure - no agenda there!
I mean hell - when Stafford became available there were “bring him in!” Posts. Which is fine, that opinion is absolutely valid. Just very very ridiculous to me when people say “his OL and defense sucked!” About Stafford, but posters want Jones to do it all his first two years without much help.
Really exited for Golladay. He’s a Top 10/15 WR who is legitimately elite as a down field threat. Jones’ YPA has been very poor so far and it’s due to a lot of things, but one being that the Giants’ WR position has been significantly below average in his time here.
Jones’ deep ball passing numbers were strong this past year although on limited volume. I’m hoping he can maintain that deep ball efficiency on more downfield attempts this year through Golladay. That would open up so much space for the offense to work with in the short/intermediate range, in terms of both running and passing.
You can try to spin it any way you like, but it's still making an excuse.
But yet, you (and others) are completely dismissive when people (rightfully) that DJ has had (close to) zero weapons, had two OC's in two years and had to deal with no offseason due to COVID.
Yeah, sure - no agenda there!
So speedywheels, you agree then that the GM did an awful job of putting a poor offensive roster in place for his young QB?
Hopefully he will be shuffling with the ball in the end zone each and every week...
Kadarius Toney has a 13.3 College per catch average. Seems to me, if I've got time, I'm going for Galladay. If I'm running to my life, I'm looking for Toney.
Hopefully, both can start winning this coming season.
Right now...taking into account salary....I prefer Jones.
Quote:
D. Jones first two years are better than Stafford's (avg. QBR nearly 60 vs mid 40s). And Stafford didn't have the long list of shit going against him going into his 2nd yr (he had some shit going against him, but nothing like D. Jones had last year).
Oh, let me guess, you can't compare them. Different era, right? Give me a break.
But guess what? Stafford took a large leap forward in his THIRD season. Hmmm.
Uh, Stafford got hurt his second year. He only played three games.
So his third year was really his second year. Care to dive into those numbers and compare to Jones's second year?
Jones has 26 starts through 2 years. Stafford had 13.
Nice try.
I do not get the Stafford love, never did, never will. There is nothing wrong with Jones arm, it is more than plenty strong to play in the NFL. Joe Montana could not break a pane of glass and while Brady used to have a great arm, it is not much right now.
Jones has to stop fumbling and he will be just fine. He has to stop with stupid INTS. Jones' arm is not what is holding him back. He is a hell of a lot more accurate than Eli, throws a much better spiral and can actually complete a screen pass.
They've definitely improved, but just not sure where they are right now, especially the right side
They've definitely improved, but just not sure where they are right now, especially the right side
Agreed. Running and pass pro. All the toys are great, but if we can't protect, won't matter. I get concerned any offseason when I'm excited about the offense, feels like the wheels always come off someway somehow.
As to Eric's original post...funny you should mention it. Was literally in the car yesterday when it just randomly hit me that, "Woah, Kenny Golladay is a GIANT". Fun stuff.