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NFT: follow up Brooks column on JD firing

Victor in CT : 5/5/2021 4:25 pm
2 keys for me:

1) Dolan had begun to question the administration of the program whose long view does not exactly jibe with the roster whose marquee players Artemi Panarin, Mika Zibanejad and Chris Kreider, will be between 28 and 30 when next season commences and are likely to be diminished by the time the promise coalesces.

2) There is a Part B to this, and that is there is no question that the meek manner in which the Rangers were manhandled by the Islanders when the playoffs were still in sight added to Dolan’s urgency here. The prioritization of skill guys over will guys was noted. So was an absence of push-back.
Jim Dolan’s Rangers vision clashed with John Davidson, Jeff Gorton blueprint - ( New Window )
Panarin and Zibanejad  
Saquon'sQuadz : 5/5/2021 4:31 pm : link
have many more years to contribute
Lil' Jimmy Dolan knows about as much about hockey as my dog does  
Greg from LI : 5/5/2021 4:33 pm : link
His "vision", my ass
A lot of "reasons" you'd expect to hear  
JoeMoney19 : 5/5/2021 4:37 pm : link
But when it comes down to it, Dolan just had a franchise shaking temper tantrum.
RE: Lil' Jimmy Dolan knows about as much about hockey as my dog does  
Victor in CT : 5/5/2021 4:38 pm : link
In comment 15255207 Greg from LI said:
Quote:
His "vision", my ass


I'm not disagreeing, but I been watching hockey long enough to know when I see a team that doesn't want to get dirty
Knicks are good, in good hands, with good vibes and PR.  
81_Great_Dane : 5/5/2021 4:40 pm : link
All without Dolan. He had to do SOMETHING to get back in the news.
just a guess but it would  
Enzo : 5/5/2021 4:41 pm : link
seem someone got in Dolan's ear about this.

RE: just a guess but it would  
djm : 5/5/2021 4:51 pm : link
In comment 15255221 Enzo said:
Quote:
seem someone got in Dolan's ear about this.


I had to check to make sure he was still alive, but would anyone doubt my theory that Glen Sather is all over this? Especially with Messier's name floating around?

Sather probably has a LOT of pull with Dolan. HE wasn't fired here. He left on his own accord and I would think the latter stages of his tenure here left a much better taste in Dolan's mouth than his beginning.
This could definitely be a power play  
larryflower37 : 5/5/2021 5:04 pm : link
By Messier.
Mark Messier on the way the #NYR are currently built: "In my opinion, if you're going to win, you got to be able to win in the street and the alley. I particularly would not have built the team that didn't have answers in this regard."

That's a statement.
RE: This could definitely be a power play  
djm : 5/5/2021 5:06 pm : link
In comment 15255253 larryflower37 said:
Quote:
By Messier.
Mark Messier on the way the #NYR are currently built: "In my opinion, if you're going to win, you got to be able to win in the street and the alley. I particularly would not have built the team that didn't have answers in this regard."

That's a statement.


Man some things are too obvious to even believe, this is LOL obvious.

So when is the PC?
Supposedly Drury is going to be president/GM though  
Greg from LI : 5/5/2021 5:14 pm : link
So where would that leave Messier? Coaching?
I think it's pretty much what we said  
arniefez : 5/5/2021 5:14 pm : link
Dolan probably went nuts over the physical beat downs in the Islander games and then the Wilson thing was the final straw.
RE: Supposedly Drury is going to be president/GM though  
larryflower37 : 5/5/2021 5:20 pm : link
In comment 15255268 Greg from LI said:
Quote:
So where would that leave Messier? Coaching?


It's doesn't mean it permanent, Drury could stay on as GM and Messier take over as team president
So JD's  
PaulN : 5/5/2021 5:34 pm : link
Teams in Columbus and St
Louis were soft, the team Gorton started building in Boston was soft? Anyone who is buying this load of shit is pretty stupid.
Who said  
PaulN : 5/5/2021 5:36 pm : link
Anything about Messier, where is this pipedrwam coming from?
This all has Sather all over it  
Bricktop : 5/5/2021 5:38 pm : link
.
Well I said all along  
pjcas18 : 5/5/2021 5:45 pm : link
you can't really be a rebuilding team with LT contracts for Panarin, Trouba, and Kreider and probably soon Zibanejad.

it's a little bit of an identity crisis - some on here said things like Panarin and Trouba were a year too early. Maybe they were right.

Overall though I like the *roster* progress the Rangers are making but I do think they probably underachieved. Partly because of COVID and it's impact on their top line center.

Partly because I don't believe in their coach.
RE: Well I said all along  
ManningLobsItBurressAlone : 5/5/2021 5:57 pm : link
In comment 15255338 pjcas18 said:
Quote:
you can't really be a rebuilding team with LT contracts for Panarin, Trouba, and Kreider and probably soon Zibanejad.

it's a little bit of an identity crisis - some on here said things like Panarin and Trouba were a year too early. Maybe they were right.

Overall though I like the *roster* progress the Rangers are making but I do think they probably underachieved. Partly because of COVID and it's impact on their top line center.

Partly because I don't believe in their coach.


I think underachieving with this group is an interesting word. Sure, Dolan probably demanded the playoffs from this team, but did anyone realistically expect the Rangers to place in the top 4 of a division that also houses Boston, NYI, Pittsburgh, and the Caps? With the youngest team in hockey (until the Devils sell off), we battled until the last handful of games.

The start of the season obviously was sour, but what could we have expected with a D group that barely ever played with each other, with all the youth, and COVID effects rendering Zbinejad a shell of his last season self. Losing Panarin for multiple weeks for a still unknown Russian entanglement (where would we be if he had played in those 10-12 games?). I understand that we made our hay down the stretch beating the likes of NJD and Buffalo, but this was all valuable and meaningful games to kids that still haven't even experienced what a regular/full NHL season is like. We want to look at the poor starts of Kakko, Laf, Chytil as NHL players, but look at all their draft class counterparts, these guys aren't outliers to the group, the exceptions are the guys that are killing it. They need time, and I think everyone would agree that they've looked like better players these last few weeks.

I think this is a sad day for the Rangers. There is no one now between Dolan, and the organizational executives at the team level. I am not at a complete loss of faith because Drury is sticking around, and has been involved in this process for a while, but at what could happen if we hand Messier a Presidency (a guy with barely any coaching experience let alone team building). What players and picks will be dealt at the expense of toughness and grit. We seemingly had a long term plan, we had a ton of buyout cap coming off the books, and next year really felt like the time for this team to contend for the cup. Now I'm not sure what players/picks will be dangled all at rectifying this Wilson and toughness situation.
RE: Who said  
larryflower37 : 5/5/2021 6:04 pm : link
In comment 15255318 PaulN said:
Quote:
Anything about Messier, where is this pipedrwam coming from?

"I've made it very clear that I've been standing by ready to help out in any way for many years," Messier said, according to Walker. "I don't really know what else to say."
This is great  
TJ : 5/5/2021 6:11 pm : link
Time spent screwing up the Rangers is time he can't use to screw up the Knicks.
Dolan was not wrong  
Vanzetti : 5/5/2021 8:44 pm : link
Of course, being Dolan, he did it in a stupid way with the memo to the league about that big meanie Wilson.

Horton was utterly mediocre

And JD assembled a roster with no toughness. Then traded away the one tough guy in Lemieux. He gave Tony D 9 million and then got rid of him after a few games. Kept the awful Quinn as coach. JD was basically a disaster.
There was going to be a change  
Dankbeerman : 5/6/2021 8:06 am : link
this offseason regardless but why could the moves not been made next week?

And how is the Coach left standing? Quinn may have been the right guy to work with the you g players but he cant just flip now into a playoff winning type of Coach. Especially when the AHL Coach was able to step in for him with no dip in play.
RE: There was going to be a change  
Victor in CT : 5/6/2021 8:13 am : link
In comment 15256004 Dankbeerman said:
Quote:
this offseason regardless but why could the moves not been made next week?

And how is the Coach left standing? Quinn may have been the right guy to work with the you g players but he cant just flip now into a playoff winning type of Coach. Especially when the AHL Coach was able to step in for him with no dip in play.


for 3 games its easier to just let him finish
Once your given  
Burt64 : 5/6/2021 8:23 am : link
the title of President you don't give it up to be a GM.

Drury will remain President and maybe handoff the GM title in time. He'll be both thru the draft and Free Agency i'm guessing.

That leaves Messier as either a VP of Hockey Ops, GM/Asst GM to Coach. Take your pick really.
.....  
BrettNYG10 : 5/6/2021 8:39 am : link
Was there some large philosophical difference between Drury and Gorton/JD?

You'd think he would go outside the organization.

The Rangers haven't had a real General Manager search in over 20 years.
RE: .....  
Mad Mike : 5/6/2021 11:41 am : link
In comment 15256032 BrettNYG10 said:
Quote:
Was there some large philosophical difference between Drury and Gorton/JD?

Not according to Drury.
Quote:
Drury where he goes w/ the rebuild:

"I don’t think it’s anything too drastic. I really believe in what we’ve accomplished since the letter. What we’ve been able to do in not only adding some good young assets and making some key trades and signing a marquee free agent (Panarin)"


link - ( New Window )
Thanks, Mike.  
BrettNYG10 : 5/6/2021 11:44 am : link
Kind of weird then.

I actually don't blame Dolan for being upset at JD/Gorton apparently putting out whispers that they disagreed with the statement. No reason not to wait a few days, though.
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