Wilson targets Panarin and Buch, there should have been a bullseye on Backstrom. Should have gone after him relentlessly. Making him pay for Wilson's bullshit is better than having 4th liners line brawl.
Wilson targets Panarin and Buch, there should have been a bullseye on Backstrom. Should have gone after him relentlessly. Making him pay for Wilson's bullshit is better than having 4th liners line brawl.
And then Dowd boards Lafrieniere. On and on it goes on both sides. And now you have a bunch of guys who play the right way injured and suspended.
Smith did the right thing with Wilson. He doesn’t have to win the fight, he only has to let him know he can’t play that way. Going after Oshie and Backstrom is garbage.
didn't "target" Panarin, that's some slight revisionism, Panarin pulled Wilson off the pile and Wilson responded.
For all you know Wilson didn't even know who it was who was pulling him off the pile until after he reacted.
Correct. He targeted Buchnevich while he was lying prone on the ice, created the pile up, and then defended himself by pulling Panarin's hair to drive his head into the ice. Then also punched him while he was on the ice.
didn't "target" Panarin, that's some slight revisionism, Panarin pulled Wilson off the pile and Wilson responded.
For all you know Wilson didn't even know who it was who was pulling him off the pile until after he reacted.
Correct. He targeted Buchnevich while he was lying prone on the ice, created the pile up, and then defended himself by pulling Panarin's hair to drive his head into the ice. Then also punched him while he was on the ice.
Why would you feel the need to reply that way to a response about Wilson "targeting" Panarin?
do you just like to be argumentative about things, your post had zero to do with my post and what I was responding to.
Elliott Friedman discusses the shakeup at MSG. His opinions: this has the stench of Sather's cigars to it, and the Rangers are going back to their old and, ultimately, unsuccessful ways of chasing the shiny. Link - ( New Window )
nbcsports washington (after Marchand bailed on a fight with Lars Eller - a retaliation fight for when Marchand jumped Eller) on fighting unwritten rules and etiquette and some really good quotes from Wilson and Devante Smith-Pelly (I can't see the authors name anywhere,but link is below.
And for the record, for those people saying things like fighting = money for the league, in the last poll I saw 98% of the players say they want to keep fighting in the game.
Quote:
...In today’s NHL, the most common reason for fighting is to stand up for a teammate. Hockey is a contact sport so it is impossible to react after every hit, but if it is believed a player has crossed the line between physical and dirty, then he will have to answer for it.
“Probably all my fights are with a hit that I don't agree with at the time,” Devante Smith-Pelly said.
A very recent example came on Jan. 8 when Smith-Pelly dropped the gloves with Philadelphia Flyers defenseman Radko Gudas. Gudas delivered a shoulder check right to the chest of Nic Dowd that knocked Dowd to the ice.
Smith-Pelly’s reaction to the hit was immediate. If you see a teammate take a dirty play, then you are expected to respond.
“If you're right there and you're the first guy and you feel like that's what you should do, then you've got to do it,” Smith-Pelly said.
From the other end, if you deliver a big hit, you are not going to be caught off guard when the other team comes after you. It is expected and often respected even if it doesn’t happen right away.
“Sometimes you're almost doing the guy a favor,” Wilson said. “He asks [to fight] and you'd expect the same in return.”...
Quote:
...“Before the game, you can look at a lineup and I know who on the other team would probably be willing to fight, who if something happened they would be ready,” Wilson said. “And then there's probably 11 other forwards that wouldn't. So when something happens, you go into Ottawa, you look at their lineup, it's a guy like [Mark Borowiecki], he's probably the guy that would fight if something happened. There's that understanding. I'm not going to go grab someone else on their team like the young [Brady Tkachuk] kid. There's just that understanding.”
But even if you know someone would be willing to fight, it doesn’t always mean that you should.
Wilson, for example, is typically on Washington’s top line and plays a major role on the team. Because of his growing role, Wilson cannot simply drop the gloves against anyone just because they ask.
“I try and really make sure the guys nowadays that I'm fighting have a role on the other team, that they're out there playing minutes,” Wilson said. “There's still guys like that around the league that are big parts of their teams that are willing to fight. If you get a five-minute major, you could be in the box for 10 minutes because you have to wait for a whistle. It can be a huge chunk of time so you've got to be really smart about it.”...
Quote:
“It's just kind of the way it is now with the instigator,” Wilson said. “I can't go out and hold him accountable, he has to agree to it.”
But saying no to a fight is not without its risks. Refusing a fight when a player wants to stand up for a teammate or spark his team has its consequences.
Wilson said there have been players who told him after he refused a fight that they would continue targeting his teammates with big hits until he agreed. He then has to determine how much he will allow before he ultimately acquiesces.
“There's a line,” Wilson said. “If he's playing physical and the game's going well then [no], if he's hurting your guys then you've got to probably stand up for them. There's guys that take that approach.”
Even with the instigator penalty, you also still risk getting hit if you refuse a fight.
As much as the Caps hated how Marchand “jumped” Eller, they did acknowledge that Eller ultimately chose to drop the gloves rather than take the penalty. The problem wasn’t the fight, it was how Marchand started it.
“I chose to drop the gloves too because there sometimes comes a point where you just have to defend yourself,” Eller said. “I chose to do that in that moment.”
“For me, unless I really, really am mad, I don't think I would ever just pop a guy if he says no,” Smith-Pelly said. “At the same time, if someone's trying to fight me and I say no and he pops me, I can't really be mad....
Quote:
...“It takes a certain breed,” Wilson said, “A certain guy to go out there on any given night and drop the gloves and fight so I think there's a respect level that, after that's done, you respect the guy.”..
didn't "target" Panarin, that's some slight revisionism, Panarin pulled Wilson off the pile and Wilson responded.
For all you know Wilson didn't even know who it was who was pulling him off the pile until after he reacted.
Correct. He targeted Buchnevich while he was lying prone on the ice, created the pile up, and then defended himself by pulling Panarin's hair to drive his head into the ice. Then also punched him while he was on the ice.
Why would you feel the need to reply that way to a response about Wilson "targeting" Panarin?
do you just like to be argumentative about things, your post had zero to do with my post and what I was responding to.
I haven't tracked your entire conversation (your reply didn't quote whatever post you were responding to directly so I may not have assumed the correct one), and we don't have to agree on this but I find any defense of Wilson to be argumentative and distorting of blame. Whatever Panarin did is way down the relevance scale because if he wasn't on the ice the same incident still erupts while the opposite is not true, and that shouldn't be lost. Without Wilson on the ice nothing happens except the next faceoff. Nothing about what he did to start the altercation was a hockey play. Assigning blame to Panarin is like blaming someone for trying to fight off a home invader and getting injured in the process. And as we are all well aware Wilson is a serial offender.
If you watch the clip my guess is he didn't even know it was Panarin until Panarin's helmet came off. If he even knew at all before it was over - it was a scrum until that point.
your analogy is completely off-base because I'm not blaming Panarin and I'm not defending what Wilson did, I am simply taking issue with the phrase about Wilson targeting Panarin.
Wilson is completely in the wrong and deserved a suspension but that incident is not what I'd call targeting Panarin.
@markscheig
·
6m
Rangers handed a $250,000 fine for their comments about Player Safety.
Lol, expected.
And then Dowd boards Lafrieniere. On and on it goes on both sides. And now you have a bunch of guys who play the right way injured and suspended.
Smith did the right thing with Wilson. He doesn’t have to win the fight, he only has to let him know he can’t play that way. Going after Oshie and Backstrom is garbage.
For all you know Wilson didn't even know who it was who was pulling him off the pile until after he reacted.
@markscheig
·
6m
Rangers handed a $250,000 fine for their comments about Player Safety.
But he should get a Crate full of pennies and have it delivered to NHL offices!
For all you know Wilson didn't even know who it was who was pulling him off the pile until after he reacted.
Correct. He targeted Buchnevich while he was lying prone on the ice, created the pile up, and then defended himself by pulling Panarin's hair to drive his head into the ice. Then also punched him while he was on the ice.
Quote:
didn't "target" Panarin, that's some slight revisionism, Panarin pulled Wilson off the pile and Wilson responded.
For all you know Wilson didn't even know who it was who was pulling him off the pile until after he reacted.
Correct. He targeted Buchnevich while he was lying prone on the ice, created the pile up, and then defended himself by pulling Panarin's hair to drive his head into the ice. Then also punched him while he was on the ice.
Why would you feel the need to reply that way to a response about Wilson "targeting" Panarin?
do you just like to be argumentative about things, your post had zero to do with my post and what I was responding to.
Link - ( New Window )
link - ( New Window )
And for the record, for those people saying things like fighting = money for the league, in the last poll I saw 98% of the players say they want to keep fighting in the game.
“Probably all my fights are with a hit that I don't agree with at the time,” Devante Smith-Pelly said.
A very recent example came on Jan. 8 when Smith-Pelly dropped the gloves with Philadelphia Flyers defenseman Radko Gudas. Gudas delivered a shoulder check right to the chest of Nic Dowd that knocked Dowd to the ice.
Smith-Pelly’s reaction to the hit was immediate. If you see a teammate take a dirty play, then you are expected to respond.
“If you're right there and you're the first guy and you feel like that's what you should do, then you've got to do it,” Smith-Pelly said.
From the other end, if you deliver a big hit, you are not going to be caught off guard when the other team comes after you. It is expected and often respected even if it doesn’t happen right away.
“Sometimes you're almost doing the guy a favor,” Wilson said. “He asks [to fight] and you'd expect the same in return.”...
But even if you know someone would be willing to fight, it doesn’t always mean that you should.
Wilson, for example, is typically on Washington’s top line and plays a major role on the team. Because of his growing role, Wilson cannot simply drop the gloves against anyone just because they ask.
“I try and really make sure the guys nowadays that I'm fighting have a role on the other team, that they're out there playing minutes,” Wilson said. “There's still guys like that around the league that are big parts of their teams that are willing to fight. If you get a five-minute major, you could be in the box for 10 minutes because you have to wait for a whistle. It can be a huge chunk of time so you've got to be really smart about it.”...
“It's just kind of the way it is now with the instigator,” Wilson said. “I can't go out and hold him accountable, he has to agree to it.”
But saying no to a fight is not without its risks. Refusing a fight when a player wants to stand up for a teammate or spark his team has its consequences.
Wilson said there have been players who told him after he refused a fight that they would continue targeting his teammates with big hits until he agreed. He then has to determine how much he will allow before he ultimately acquiesces.
“There's a line,” Wilson said. “If he's playing physical and the game's going well then [no], if he's hurting your guys then you've got to probably stand up for them. There's guys that take that approach.”
Even with the instigator penalty, you also still risk getting hit if you refuse a fight.
As much as the Caps hated how Marchand “jumped” Eller, they did acknowledge that Eller ultimately chose to drop the gloves rather than take the penalty. The problem wasn’t the fight, it was how Marchand started it.
“I chose to drop the gloves too because there sometimes comes a point where you just have to defend yourself,” Eller said. “I chose to do that in that moment.”
“For me, unless I really, really am mad, I don't think I would ever just pop a guy if he says no,” Smith-Pelly said. “At the same time, if someone's trying to fight me and I say no and he pops me, I can't really be mad....
link - ( New Window )
Quote:
In comment 15256454 pjcas18 said:
Quote:
didn't "target" Panarin, that's some slight revisionism, Panarin pulled Wilson off the pile and Wilson responded.
For all you know Wilson didn't even know who it was who was pulling him off the pile until after he reacted.
Correct. He targeted Buchnevich while he was lying prone on the ice, created the pile up, and then defended himself by pulling Panarin's hair to drive his head into the ice. Then also punched him while he was on the ice.
Why would you feel the need to reply that way to a response about Wilson "targeting" Panarin?
do you just like to be argumentative about things, your post had zero to do with my post and what I was responding to.
I haven't tracked your entire conversation (your reply didn't quote whatever post you were responding to directly so I may not have assumed the correct one), and we don't have to agree on this but I find any defense of Wilson to be argumentative and distorting of blame. Whatever Panarin did is way down the relevance scale because if he wasn't on the ice the same incident still erupts while the opposite is not true, and that shouldn't be lost. Without Wilson on the ice nothing happens except the next faceoff. Nothing about what he did to start the altercation was a hockey play. Assigning blame to Panarin is like blaming someone for trying to fight off a home invader and getting injured in the process. And as we are all well aware Wilson is a serial offender.
If you watch the clip my guess is he didn't even know it was Panarin until Panarin's helmet came off. If he even knew at all before it was over - it was a scrum until that point.
your analogy is completely off-base because I'm not blaming Panarin and I'm not defending what Wilson did, I am simply taking issue with the phrase about Wilson targeting Panarin.
Wilson is completely in the wrong and deserved a suspension but that incident is not what I'd call targeting Panarin.