@DDuggan21
Was speaking to an NFL exec for a different story, but Trai Turner came up. He said Turner is still asking for $2-3M. Not sure how interested the Giants are, but that is likely out of their price range if they are.
Years ago, I was looking at one of those retirement quiz things, and it said, "Many people will need between $1M and $2M to retire." Well, that's a pretty big goddamned difference.
could be hoping for an injury to force someone's hand. However since many NFL teams feel that they can manufacture adequate guard play from lower round rookies or low-cost vets I personally think he playing a risky game
but by trading back 8 or 9 spots in the draft, wasnt there a substantial cap savings?
The Giants save about a million this year and will have about 2 million after the Rookies are signed.
I don't see the Giants making any signings other than Vet min deals before the season. They need to keep some cap in case injuries strike during the season.
My idea of eating out is grabbing a slice of pizza on my way to go kayaking. Yours may be dropping a hundred or two on a gourmet meal on your way to the opera.
The bank account necessary for retirement can vary greatly.
My idea of eating out is grabbing a slice of pizza on my way to go kayaking. Yours may be dropping a hundred or two on a gourmet meal on your way to the opera.
The bank account necessary for retirement can vary greatly.
Cap money is NOT play money.
Cap money IS play money- as in, it isn't actual dollars that a team worries about, it is the dollars on paper that must be achieved.
RE: Giants can pick up $6M of savings by dealing Engram
If the Giants can't afford that after the rookie signings, with a contingency left over for in-season signings, I'd think they need to move some money around — even if they don't want to sign Trai Turner.
Let's not forget they think Kyle Murphy is a prospect and they just signed two developmental UDFA linemen. They might not need Trai Turner or any other veteran IOL.
If the Giants can't afford that after the rookie signings, with a contingency left over for in-season signings, I'd think they need to move some money around — even if they don't want to sign Trai Turner.
Let's not forget they think Kyle Murphy is a prospect and they just signed two developmental UDFA linemen. They might not need Trai Turner or any other veteran IOL.
Historically guard seems to be a position where you can find gems as late rounders and UDFA/developmental players. The fact they didn’t make a huge push for one in FA or the draft tells me they like the potential of what they currently have on the roster.
RE: Giants can pick up $6M of savings by dealing Engram
Although, and I say this with a great deal of hesitancy, I think I would rather keep Engram in that scenario.
An old past prime version of Turner isn’t worth trading Engram, especially when we don’t have anything behind him. We all hate Engram, but he’s still a decent starter.
RE: RE: Giants can pick up $6M of savings by dealing Engram
Although, and I say this with a great deal of hesitancy, I think I would rather keep Engram in that scenario.
An old past prime version of Turner isn’t worth trading Engram, especially when we don’t have anything behind him. We all hate Engram, but he’s still a decent starter.
Agreed, if they added a TE in the draft I would feel differently. With Golladay, Toney, Slayton, Shepard, Barkley, and Rudolph I don’t see Engram getting a huge target share this season which should reduce the gaffes. His speed could make him a nice decoy to open up the other players.
We can draft a new TE in the early rounds next year to replace Engram with a more affordable prospect with upside.
compared to $13.7M over the same period for Toney. This averages $1.3M per year in savings. I assume we also saved a couple dollars moving from 42 to 50. As an added benefit, the trade downs may allow us to add another piece now or, as needed, during the season.
...while preparing to draft for the Chargers in our mock, was how thoroughly awful Trai Turner was last year, and how glad LAC fans were to be rid of him.
He’ll find a buyer. What he probably won’t find is more than about $137K in guaranteed money. You can’t make a commitment to a player who has been as bad as Turner has been in recent years. He’ll have to prove himself in camp.
RE: RE: Giants can pick up $6M of savings by dealing Engram
Although, and I say this with a great deal of hesitancy, I think I would rather keep Engram in that scenario.
An old past prime version of Turner isn’t worth trading Engram, especially when we don’t have anything behind him. We all hate Engram, but he’s still a decent starter.
I don't know,when all is said & done,a proven commodity like Rudolph may wind up being our #1 TE this season. So,I think we have something behind Engram!!
They went out and signed two vets to play guard. One is a JAG, and the other is a decent right tackle playing out of position. Dumping Turner was pure addition by subtraction. It doesn’t appear that the Chargers even tried to negotiate a salary reduction, though they did try to trade him.
...while preparing to draft for the Chargers in our mock, was how thoroughly awful Trai Turner was last year, and how glad LAC fans were to be rid of him.
He’ll find a buyer. What he probably won’t find is more than about $137K in guaranteed money. You can’t make a commitment to a player who has been as bad as Turner has been in recent years. He’ll have to prove himself in camp.
Good post, and taking into account his recent performance why even sign Turner? It seems like he is just a name at this point. Camp competition can’t hurt but only at a minimum level deal or we’re just burning cap dollars in my opinion.
why do so many believe the Giants are interested at any price? Yes, he is a veteran. He is also coming off a terrible season. His name and past accomplishments won't help the Giants much.
...while preparing to draft for the Chargers in our mock, was how thoroughly awful Trai Turner was last year, and how glad LAC fans were to be rid of him.
He’ll find a buyer. What he probably won’t find is more than about $137K in guaranteed money. You can’t make a commitment to a player who has been as bad as Turner has been in recent years. He’ll have to prove himself in camp.
He's an interesting case study.
5 straight Pro Bowls from 2015-2019 and then he fell off a cliff in 2020. So what happened to him? He wasn't a 1 year wonder. What it the scheme and how the Chargers used him vs Carolina? His ankle injury? $2M - $3M is a steal for a potential Pro Bowl Guard if (and it all hinges on the if) they feel he can get back to his former performance level.
...while preparing to draft for the Chargers in our mock, was how thoroughly awful Trai Turner was last year, and how glad LAC fans were to be rid of him.
He’ll find a buyer. What he probably won’t find is more than about $137K in guaranteed money. You can’t make a commitment to a player who has been as bad as Turner has been in recent years. He’ll have to prove himself in camp.
We do learn about our teams in our BB! Mock Draft. I've followed the Dolphins more because of it for that precise reason. The word on Turner is that he's forked/toasted. Better to role with a post June 1st signing of a healthy vet who will take the veteran minimum---and they will be there for the taking. It's a buyer's market this off-season.
...while preparing to draft for the Chargers in our mock, was how thoroughly awful Trai Turner was last year, and how glad LAC fans were to be rid of him.
He’ll find a buyer. What he probably won’t find is more than about $137K in guaranteed money. You can’t make a commitment to a player who has been as bad as Turner has been in recent years. He’ll have to prove himself in camp.
We do learn about our teams in our BB! Mock Draft. I've followed the Dolphins more because of it for that precise reason. The word on Turner is that he's forked/toasted. Better to role with a post June 1st signing of a healthy vet who will take the veteran minimum---and they will be there for the taking. It's a buyer's market this off-season.
Interesting. Thanks for the insight. It's just rare for a player to drop off that drastically - Pro Bowl to practically at the bottom.
...while preparing to draft for the Chargers in our mock, was how thoroughly awful Trai Turner was last year, and how glad LAC fans were to be rid of him.
He’ll find a buyer. What he probably won’t find is more than about $137K in guaranteed money. You can’t make a commitment to a player who has been as bad as Turner has been in recent years. He’ll have to prove himself in camp.
We do learn about our teams in our BB! Mock Draft. I've followed the Dolphins more because of it for that precise reason. The word on Turner is that he's forked/toasted. Better to role with a post June 1st signing of a healthy vet who will take the veteran minimum---and they will be there for the taking. It's a buyer's market this off-season.
Interesting. Thanks for the insight. It's just rare for a player to drop off that drastically - Pro Bowl to practically at the bottom.
If I am not mistaken it is like a 3 year drop off where last year was almost rock bottom. But this isn't just a LAC thing. This goes back farther than that.
An injury limited him to just nine games in 2020. Turner's Pro Football Focus grade of 34.8. He was credited with drawing two penalties and one sack in 536 offensive snaps.
Do with it what you will. PPF rating was bad but we ignore PFF here. 2 penalties and one sack? We have certainly seen worse in a single game.
why do so many believe the Giants are interested at any price? Yes, he is a veteran. He is also coming off a terrible season. His name and past accomplishments won't help the Giants much.
He just happens to be a name people know. Posters have a bit of a sheep mentality on here. And they go rinse/repeat often.
RE: RE: Giants can pick up $6M of savings by dealing Engram
Although, and I say this with a great deal of hesitancy, I think I would rather keep Engram in that scenario.
An old past prime version of Turner isn’t worth trading Engram, especially when we don’t have anything behind him. We all hate Engram, but he’s still a decent starter.
I'm not saying this because I have any particular attachment to signing Turner - and I agree that his play has been in decline - but he's not old. He's 27 years old, two months older than James Bradberry (unless you think he's also old).
do not factor in age, system fit, wear and tear, injuries, or if the player just had a bad year. They see the name and the accolades and assume it's a net positive. Don't know what Turner's got left, but they've been in touch. Lemieux and Hernandez are probably top of the depth chart when camp opens.
I don't know, when all is said & done, a proven commodity like Rudolph may wind up being our #1 TE this season. So,I think we have something behind Engram!!
No, we have something in front of Engram. We still don't really have anything behind him.
Assuming he still has something left in the tank. It would go a long way towards solidifying the middle of the OL.
lol, Trai Turner is not the item that's going to get us to the promised land...forget that right now. This team's floor/ceiling is not affected by the signing of Turner, at all.
RE: RE: RE: RE: Giants can pick up $6M of savings by dealing Engram
I don't know, when all is said & done, a proven commodity like Rudolph may wind up being our #1 TE this season. So,I think we have something behind Engram!!
No, we have something in front of Engram. We still don't really have anything behind him.
What, no love for Rysen John?
Turner didn't look good, I wouldn't be in a rush to sign him now
He can play guard as well as center.He is versatile and would probably play at vet minimum.
I was thinking the same thing. There are other OL options besides Trai Turner. The Giants tried to sign Looney last offseason to compete for the starting center job but he chose to return to Dallas where he was atop the depth chart.
Austin Reiter, Michael Schofield, Nick Easton, and Dennis Kelly are still available.
I'd be happy if he signs here but the team that cut him added 5 new OL
2 in FA who are making significantly more than the 2-3m Turner wants and a 3rd who is making $1.6m. And they drafted Slater in the first round (and Brenden Jaimes in round 5). The fact that a team in desperate need of OL went elsewhere should tell us something the same way we got rid of Alec Ogletree despite being desperate for LB. I'd similarly guess that despite age/reputation Turner has just gone downhill quickly.
in Fulton. It seemed they wanted one more young guy to fit into the mix. Didn’t work out in the draft, maybe June 1 cuts? I suspect they are not done yet.
To back up the 5 young starters, and a second year man they seem to be high on in Murphy.
I won’t be surprised if these are the nine OL they start the season with. Maybe they’ll add a player or few to the pipeline on the practice squad if they can beat out Slade, Wiggins etc.
And next year they draft a guard to challenge Murphy to replace Hernandez whose contract is up. And 1-3 of the practice squad guys can replace the vet backups who are all on one year deals. That’s how you develop your pipeline.
...if they want him ...
This isn't that. Cap money is play money.
The Giants save about a million this year and will have about 2 million after the Rookies are signed.
I don't see the Giants making any signings other than Vet min deals before the season. They need to keep some cap in case injuries strike during the season.
My idea of eating out is grabbing a slice of pizza on my way to go kayaking. Yours may be dropping a hundred or two on a gourmet meal on your way to the opera.
The bank account necessary for retirement can vary greatly.
Cap money is NOT play money.
Although, and I say this with a great deal of hesitancy, I think I would rather keep Engram in that scenario.
Although, and I say this with a great deal of hesitancy, I think I would rather keep Engram in that scenario.
If they put Engram at guard you wouldn’t have to worry about holding penalties. He can’t hold onto anything.
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and go sign Turner.
Although, and I say this with a great deal of hesitancy, I think I would rather keep Engram in that scenario.
If they put Engram at guard you wouldn’t have to worry about holding penalties. He can’t hold onto anything.
Thanks for the sprayed drink
My idea of eating out is grabbing a slice of pizza on my way to go kayaking. Yours may be dropping a hundred or two on a gourmet meal on your way to the opera.
The bank account necessary for retirement can vary greatly.
Cap money is NOT play money.
Cap money IS play money- as in, it isn't actual dollars that a team worries about, it is the dollars on paper that must be achieved.
Although, and I say this with a great deal of hesitancy, I think I would rather keep Engram in that scenario.
Who are you, and what have you done with Jimmy Googs?
Let's not forget they think Kyle Murphy is a prospect and they just signed two developmental UDFA linemen. They might not need Trai Turner or any other veteran IOL.
Let's not forget they think Kyle Murphy is a prospect and they just signed two developmental UDFA linemen. They might not need Trai Turner or any other veteran IOL.
Historically guard seems to be a position where you can find gems as late rounders and UDFA/developmental players. The fact they didn’t make a huge push for one in FA or the draft tells me they like the potential of what they currently have on the roster.
Although, and I say this with a great deal of hesitancy, I think I would rather keep Engram in that scenario.
An old past prime version of Turner isn’t worth trading Engram, especially when we don’t have anything behind him. We all hate Engram, but he’s still a decent starter.
Quote:
and go sign Turner.
Although, and I say this with a great deal of hesitancy, I think I would rather keep Engram in that scenario.
An old past prime version of Turner isn’t worth trading Engram, especially when we don’t have anything behind him. We all hate Engram, but he’s still a decent starter.
Agreed, if they added a TE in the draft I would feel differently. With Golladay, Toney, Slayton, Shepard, Barkley, and Rudolph I don’t see Engram getting a huge target share this season which should reduce the gaffes. His speed could make him a nice decoy to open up the other players.
We can draft a new TE in the early rounds next year to replace Engram with a more affordable prospect with upside.
He’ll find a buyer. What he probably won’t find is more than about $137K in guaranteed money. You can’t make a commitment to a player who has been as bad as Turner has been in recent years. He’ll have to prove himself in camp.
Quote:
and go sign Turner.
Although, and I say this with a great deal of hesitancy, I think I would rather keep Engram in that scenario.
An old past prime version of Turner isn’t worth trading Engram, especially when we don’t have anything behind him. We all hate Engram, but he’s still a decent starter.
I don't know,when all is said & done,a proven commodity like Rudolph may wind up being our #1 TE this season. So,I think we have something behind Engram!!
He’ll find a buyer. What he probably won’t find is more than about $137K in guaranteed money. You can’t make a commitment to a player who has been as bad as Turner has been in recent years. He’ll have to prove himself in camp.
Good post, and taking into account his recent performance why even sign Turner? It seems like he is just a name at this point. Camp competition can’t hurt but only at a minimum level deal or we’re just burning cap dollars in my opinion.
He’ll find a buyer. What he probably won’t find is more than about $137K in guaranteed money. You can’t make a commitment to a player who has been as bad as Turner has been in recent years. He’ll have to prove himself in camp.
He's an interesting case study.
5 straight Pro Bowls from 2015-2019 and then he fell off a cliff in 2020. So what happened to him? He wasn't a 1 year wonder. What it the scheme and how the Chargers used him vs Carolina? His ankle injury? $2M - $3M is a steal for a potential Pro Bowl Guard if (and it all hinges on the if) they feel he can get back to his former performance level.
He’ll find a buyer. What he probably won’t find is more than about $137K in guaranteed money. You can’t make a commitment to a player who has been as bad as Turner has been in recent years. He’ll have to prove himself in camp.
We do learn about our teams in our BB! Mock Draft. I've followed the Dolphins more because of it for that precise reason. The word on Turner is that he's forked/toasted. Better to role with a post June 1st signing of a healthy vet who will take the veteran minimum---and they will be there for the taking. It's a buyer's market this off-season.
Quote:
...while preparing to draft for the Chargers in our mock, was how thoroughly awful Trai Turner was last year, and how glad LAC fans were to be rid of him.
He’ll find a buyer. What he probably won’t find is more than about $137K in guaranteed money. You can’t make a commitment to a player who has been as bad as Turner has been in recent years. He’ll have to prove himself in camp.
We do learn about our teams in our BB! Mock Draft. I've followed the Dolphins more because of it for that precise reason. The word on Turner is that he's forked/toasted. Better to role with a post June 1st signing of a healthy vet who will take the veteran minimum---and they will be there for the taking. It's a buyer's market this off-season.
Interesting. Thanks for the insight. It's just rare for a player to drop off that drastically - Pro Bowl to practically at the bottom.
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In comment 15259750 Big Blue Blogger said:
Quote:
...while preparing to draft for the Chargers in our mock, was how thoroughly awful Trai Turner was last year, and how glad LAC fans were to be rid of him.
He’ll find a buyer. What he probably won’t find is more than about $137K in guaranteed money. You can’t make a commitment to a player who has been as bad as Turner has been in recent years. He’ll have to prove himself in camp.
We do learn about our teams in our BB! Mock Draft. I've followed the Dolphins more because of it for that precise reason. The word on Turner is that he's forked/toasted. Better to role with a post June 1st signing of a healthy vet who will take the veteran minimum---and they will be there for the taking. It's a buyer's market this off-season.
Interesting. Thanks for the insight. It's just rare for a player to drop off that drastically - Pro Bowl to practically at the bottom.
Sorry - meant to say drop off in just 1 year
Do with it what you will. PPF rating was bad but we ignore PFF here. 2 penalties and one sack? We have certainly seen worse in a single game.
Joe dON LOONEY
He just happens to be a name people know. Posters have a bit of a sheep mentality on here. And they go rinse/repeat often.
Quote:
and go sign Turner.
Although, and I say this with a great deal of hesitancy, I think I would rather keep Engram in that scenario.
An old past prime version of Turner isn’t worth trading Engram, especially when we don’t have anything behind him. We all hate Engram, but he’s still a decent starter.
I'm not saying this because I have any particular attachment to signing Turner - and I agree that his play has been in decline - but he's not old. He's 27 years old, two months older than James Bradberry (unless you think he's also old).
For all the bashing that Zeitler took, he is 4 years older and signed with Baltimore for 16M guaranteed
If the guy is done, he is done - doesn't make a difference at how much the cost is
Given that there is talent there, albeit inconsistent, a good OL coach should be able to get plenty out of these two.
I don't know, when all is said & done, a proven commodity like Rudolph may wind up being our #1 TE this season. So,I think we have something behind Engram!!
lol, Trai Turner is not the item that's going to get us to the promised land...forget that right now. This team's floor/ceiling is not affected by the signing of Turner, at all.
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I don't know, when all is said & done, a proven commodity like Rudolph may wind up being our #1 TE this season. So,I think we have something behind Engram!!
No, we have something in front of Engram. We still don't really have anything behind him.
What, no love for Rysen John?
I was thinking the same thing. There are other OL options besides Trai Turner. The Giants tried to sign Looney last offseason to compete for the starting center job but he chose to return to Dallas where he was atop the depth chart.
Austin Reiter, Michael Schofield, Nick Easton, and Dennis Kelly are still available.
I won’t be surprised if these are the nine OL they start the season with. Maybe they’ll add a player or few to the pipeline on the practice squad if they can beat out Slade, Wiggins etc.
And next year they draft a guard to challenge Murphy to replace Hernandez whose contract is up. And 1-3 of the practice squad guys can replace the vet backups who are all on one year deals. That’s how you develop your pipeline.