for the future with the young talent we have now plus 7 picks in the first 4 rounds next year (including two 1st’s). Gives us the chance to move up for just about any player or stay put and build up even more depth.
And worst case, Jones has a bad season and we can package up some picks to move up and select the next QB. Keep in mind even if Jones has a crappy third year and we draft another QB it’s not really cost ineffective to keep Jones for year 4 and let him compete with the new guy. He’s still on a rookie scale deal.
Exciting time to be a Giants fan.
There are other teams that have great quarterbacks and play great football. Why can't the Giants?
Because for the last time, you cannot be just instantly great when you are scrapping and rebuilding your entire fucking roster dude. And now that is is mostly complete aside from some positions that we likely need an upgrade at, we all should expect playoff football.
Jesus christ. I'm not sure if you're married or what but living with you would give me a fucking ulcer. Your expectations are wildly off.
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In comment 15260911 Go Terps said:
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To me the 21 season is really only about one thing: how is the club being run between Gettleman and Judge, and how will that be reflected in the 22 draft after Jones posts (I think - for the sensitive) another bad season?
Gettleman, Judge, Jones, draft picks. That's where my head's at because I'm not expecting a good season in the field.
The rest of us are expecting an improved season on the field, it is why you are experiencing more resistance than normal.
Do you have any self awareness at all? Do you realize that you come into every single positive thread people make and remind them that DG and Jones suck, btw Mara does too. So that hope they have, they should flush it down the toilet and join you in your misery.
It gets old and people are attacking you for it.
Expect whatever you want. I'm not telling you not to.
The vast majority of posts on this board are positive...many unrealistically so. There are plenty of threads about how good this team is going to be. I'm fully aware of those that don't agree with me. You can guess how much that bothers me.
For example, this upcoming season you should root for the Packers, Bucs, Chiefs, and Bills.
Maybe in 2022 the Giants will be legit contenders and you can come on board again.
Both were in the playoffs in their 3rd season.
I don't know why anybody would have written off Josh Allen at all. He has been the model for what you want out of a developing QB in each of his first 3 seasons.
And recall he made the playoffs in his 2nd season.
If he stays in that scenario, the bigger issue will be not to overpay him. If he's decent/good and we pay him $15-22 million per year (or thereabouts), that's fine. If he's just OK and we pay him Dak money or more, that's a problem.
I'm gonna post on Jones threads, because that's the issue that matters most to where the team is going. It's the most important issue, and it's also the most interesting. I don't find the other things around this team all that interesting...for me it's about Gettleman, Judge, Jones, and those draft picks.
It also brings out some strange arguments. For example, most posters seen to agree that this is a prove it year for Jones. But many are also arguing that he has played well to this point. I don't get that...if he has played well why does he have to prove anything?
There are some serious mental gymnastics going on when discussing Jones. There's also an enormous amount of excuse making - more than I can recall for any other Giants player, which is saying something.
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to prove he's the QB. Giants will add two talents in the first round next year, and at least one of those picks is likely to be top 10. No rushing to draft a QB in '22 unless he's the right QB, another mistake takes us in the second half of the friggin decade with no end in sight.
If Jones needs another season to prove he is the QB going forward, I think it is likely we see another trade of a 1st round pick next year so that they have enough draft capital to get the QB they want in 2023...
Even if Jones fails, I'm not sure the Giants pick a QB next year. Depends on who is available.
With that said, there has to be a sense of urgency right now with all the FA contracts that went out. There is a limited window of effectiveness for those guys and if you don't have a worthy QB, you have a problem. That is QB Hell...
That's not QB Hell. QB Hell would be if Jones was middling at best and then we decided to pay him as a franchise QB.
It also brings out some strange arguments. For example, most posters seen to agree that this is a prove it year for Jones. But many are also arguing that he has played well to this point. I don't get that...if he has played well why does he have to prove anything?
More utter bullshit from you. What posters have said he has played well?
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In comment 15260728 Go Terps said:
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So does everyone else. You think if the Giants win 11 games that a whole bunch of posters aren't going to line up and say they called it, and how stupid be and I and others were?
Shit, every time a running back gets a new contract we get a thread saying "See? Running backs do have value". When Darnold flopped there was a ton of revelling from the Britts and FMICs of the world.
And that's fine. If you're right, you're right. Acting like Baghdad Bob for the Giants doesn't make anyone a better fan than the people that are critical.
There are absolutely quite a few scorekeepers at BBI. And they will certainly be looking to settle some scores if this thing gets turned around this year.
Which is fine. I have always accepted that and understand that being in the BBI mainstream is always the safest place for many BBIers.
However, while I know it won't stop, I do find it more than a little irritating this "narrative" that posters like you and I are more interested in being right than the Giants winning. I'm actually more interested in why the guys who are in charge of building this team have been so wrong so often.
Where were you between 2007 and 2012 bw? Why did you not ever post during those years? You posted a decade before. You posted a decade since. Why did you disappear during that stretch?
He's capable of answering for himself, but...
I am not the institutional memory of this place (I can't even remember where i parked my car at work most days) but I do recall that bw was very clear in explicitly posting that he was taking a break from BBI, particularly at the time he had his first(?) child. I don't think you can ascribe it to not being here because we were successful at that time and he had nothing to say. (I'm pretty sure that he almost always has something to say (even if he really doesn't)).
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It also brings out some strange arguments. For example, most posters seen to agree that this is a prove it year for Jones. But many are also arguing that he has played well to this point. I don't get that...if he has played well why does he have to prove anything?
More utter bullshit from you. What posters have said he has played well?
Well, me for one. I have seen bits and pieces of really good play from him (IMO, I guess), where I thought he was either turning a corner or at least had potential to be a quality or even elite QB. The moniker "Danny Dimes" might be stupid but it didn't come from nothin'.
You list Judge and Gettelman as topics of interest, well, didn't they just sign and draft a bunch of players? In such a team based sport isn't that something that should be interesting? Even if we had Mahomes, shouldn't we want to draft and sign players to help him?
You list Judge and Gettelman as topics of interest, well, didn't they just sign and draft a bunch of players? In such a team based sport isn't that something that should be interesting? Even if we had Mahomes, shouldn't we want to draft and sign players to help him?
If we had Mahomes I'd be all about talking about other issues.
We don't though. We have what I think is a huge minus at QB...as long as that minus is there I don't think much else is going to make a difference.
I think they've improved in drafting and FA since Judge got here, but I don't think that's going to result in more wins. Why?
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"mental gymnastics" is how I interpret any and every thread on this board derailing into the same song and dance about something completely out of any fans control.
You list Judge and Gettelman as topics of interest, well, didn't they just sign and draft a bunch of players? In such a team based sport isn't that something that should be interesting? Even if we had Mahomes, shouldn't we want to draft and sign players to help him?
If we had Mahomes I'd be all about talking about other issues.
We don't though. We have what I think is a huge minus at QB...as long as that minus is there I don't think much else is going to make a difference.
I think they've improved in drafting and FA since Judge got here, but I don't think that's going to result in more wins. Why?
Wait, you don't think Daniel Jones is going to be a good QB?
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In comment 15260911 Go Terps said:
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To me the 21 season is really only about one thing: how is the club being run between Gettleman and Judge, and how will that be reflected in the 22 draft after Jones posts (I think - for the sensitive) another bad season?
Gettleman, Judge, Jones, draft picks. That's where my head's at because I'm not expecting a good season in the field.
The rest of us are expecting an improved season on the field, it is why you are experiencing more resistance than normal.
Do you have any self awareness at all? Do you realize that you come into every single positive thread people make and remind them that DG and Jones suck, btw Mara does too. So that hope they have, they should flush it down the toilet and join you in your misery.
It gets old and people are attacking you for it.
Expect whatever you want. I'm not telling you not to.
The vast majority of posts on this board are positive...many unrealistically so. There are plenty of threads about how good this team is going to be. I'm fully aware of those that don't agree with me. You can guess how much that bothers me.
That’s how most fan sites are. Majority are fan boys, then you have some negative posters, and some middle ground ones. The negative ones get all the attention from the fan boys.
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...than the constant declarations that anyone who is remotely critical is "shitting on the team".
Who has been "remotely critical?'
Remotely is the only way you can be critical.
Covid, you know...
Tip ya waitresses!
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...than the constant declarations that anyone who is remotely critical is "shitting on the team".
Who has been "remotely critical?'
"Shitting on the team" is ambiguous and not what I had in mimd when discussing these posters.
"Vomiting up the same narrative in the absence of any logic that combats prevailing opinions based on the entire status of the other personnel on the roster" is one I take exception to.
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It also brings out some strange arguments. For example, most posters seen to agree that this is a prove it year for Jones. But many are also arguing that he has played well to this point. I don't get that...if he has played well why does he have to prove anything?
More utter bullshit from you. What posters have said he has played well?
Agreed. But Terps has his Sambas on,his Umbros hiked up and he has a bunch of kids he is going to coach into not sucking.
Surely as a Giants fan and a 20 year contributor to BBI, that thought would have crossed your mind?
Jesus, you kept track of that. Man, it must be a eureka moment for you to finally be able to pull that detail out of your back pocket.
You list Judge and Gettelman as topics of interest, well, didn't they just sign and draft a bunch of players? In such a team based sport isn't that something that should be interesting? Even if we had Mahomes, shouldn't we want to draft and sign players to help him?
Mahomes certainly can't win a Super Bowl by himself; Super Bowl 55 was evidence of that. Without a good offensive line to keep him clean (including Mike Remmers, someone we cut after 2019 as their left tackle) the Buccaneers gave him trouble for the entire game; they actually set the record for most pressures by a single team.
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Can you? You say the same thing every single day
Okay, guilty. But for those of us who post here regularly, who doesn't basically say the same thing over and over on these topics?
?????
What a weird thing to come back with. I dont. There are plenty of others who discuss things and walk back their theories when confronted with better logic. I can mention names but choose not to. BB '56 is one that I see who does it regularly and yet doesnt mind me saying he does. There has been a ton of DJ fans that have given him a pass for '20 but are less likely to do that going forward.
This "woe is me" front you arr trying to shroud yourself in is pretty beat.
Calmly telling people that they're not "telling anyone what to think or expect..."
...after telling everyone what to think and what to expect.
Believing that coming into a room full of what they call fanboys (they have no respect for fanboys), who are talking about how good things look and telling them that their opinions are wrong and that the QB is and always will be, bad.
Then claiming to just be discussing the team or making the conversation less boring.
Which ultimately means...making the conversation about themselves.
And finally, claiming "both sides" and playing the victim.
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and just "yay, the Giants won the Superbowl, can you believe it?". Either Superbowl?
Surely as a Giants fan and a 20 year contributor to BBI, that thought would have crossed your mind?
Jesus, you kept track of that. Man, it must be a eureka moment for you to finally be able to pull that detail out of your back pocket.
Thays a silly take. Bw is one of the most frequent posters on the board and yet he was a ghost when we won the whole fucking thing. How do you not notice that kind of silence?
Show me Im wrong. Prove it.
The Giants have improved the roster dramatically
and he has enough talent around him now to succeed.
I'm betting he will.
This is true only if the OL improves significantly. Without a competent OL, we are going nowhere, and it will not be on DJ.
What doesn't help is thinking Terps is being "remotely critical." He's inventing scenarios that have not happened yet to make his arguments about Jones and the Giants, that run counter to basically every other point that he makes or player he wants to bring in instead.
But yeah, just because we want to hold bullshit posts accountable means we think he's "shitting on the team." Posters can shit on the team all they want. It's when they are hypocritical and lazy with their arguments, that gets me to respond. Saying things like "I don't think Daniel Jones is good" is perfectly fine with me. But when you say things like "He's 7-18 as a starter" (or whatever it is) - then you are just proving that you have no idea what you are talking about.
Football isn't a one man sport. It's not even a 5 man sport. If you aren't willing to wait for the draft picks to develop, for the coaching staff to get their feet wet for 10 minutes with this franchise, for the roster to improve around the QB to legitimately see what he can bring to the table, for free agency signings to come into
play, then I just don't know what to tell you. If you think Jones sucks after 24 starts on a mostly bad offense, then great, certainly within reason to have that opinion.
Everyone was up in their fucking arms about the Beckham trade and the Williams trade. The same people lost their collective shit when they picked Jones, hell some even did it with Dexter Lawrence and Andrew Thomas. Some think that Barkley doesn't help the team win games.
This is all to say that you really can't fix what some people perceive to be reality. We can sit and argue all day on a message board about the Gettleman Giants and how they've been taking 10 years to be good. But the reality is that they started over with a new quarterback, a new coach, and new players over the last 2 years, and for whatever reason, some fans are just ready to call it a day.
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In comment 15260875 Britt in VA said:
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and just "yay, the Giants won the Superbowl, can you believe it?". Either Superbowl?
Surely as a Giants fan and a 20 year contributor to BBI, that thought would have crossed your mind?
Jesus, you kept track of that. Man, it must be a eureka moment for you to finally be able to pull that detail out of your back pocket.
Thays a silly take. Bw is one of the most frequent posters on the board and yet he was a ghost when we won the whole fucking thing. How do you not notice that kind of silence?
Show me Im wrong. Prove it.
I don't know man. Maybe it's me because I'm incapable of remembering who didn't post on a football message board 13 years ago.
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In comment 15260875 Britt in VA said:
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and just "yay, the Giants won the Superbowl, can you believe it?". Either Superbowl?
Surely as a Giants fan and a 20 year contributor to BBI, that thought would have crossed your mind?
Jesus, you kept track of that. Man, it must be a eureka moment for you to finally be able to pull that detail out of your back pocket.
Thays a silly take. Bw is one of the most frequent posters on the board and yet he was a ghost when we won the whole fucking thing. How do you not notice that kind of silence?
Show me Im wrong. Prove it.
Sometimes people post on the forums to vent, and when things are going well, they're enjoying the ride so they aren't posting as much.
I hope Weather Man comes back to post one day but fearful of all the shit who would get if he did.
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In comment 15260875 Britt in VA said:
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and just "yay, the Giants won the Superbowl, can you believe it?". Either Superbowl?
Surely as a Giants fan and a 20 year contributor to BBI, that thought would have crossed your mind?
Jesus, you kept track of that. Man, it must be a eureka moment for you to finally be able to pull that detail out of your back pocket.
Thays a silly take. Bw is one of the most frequent posters on the board and yet he was a ghost when we won the whole fucking thing. How do you not notice that kind of silence?
Show me Im wrong. Prove it.
I could be wrong, but I think that you took a fairly extended absence form here.
I hope Weather Man comes back to post one day but fearful of all the shit who would get if he did.
Why would Weatherman get shit?
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and sometimes real life gets int he way of fake life.
I hope Weather Man comes back to post one day but fearful of all the shit who would get if he did.
Why would Weatherman get shit?
For being absent for a period of time.
Oddly, Terps was one of the guys I looked forward to reading before my hiatus.
I'm sure that we'll get back there soon.
Calmly telling people that they're not "telling anyone what to think or expect..."
...after telling everyone what to think and what to expect.
Believing that coming into a room full of what they call fanboys (they have no respect for fanboys), who are talking about how good things look and telling them that their opinions are wrong and that the QB is and always will be, bad.
Then claiming to just be discussing the team or making the conversation less boring.
Which ultimately means...making the conversation about themselves.
And finally, claiming "both sides" and playing the victim.
The self-awareness issue is actually yours. Those posters don't do what you are suggesting. In fact, they typically become the conversation because so many here want to argue specifically with them and it becomes the drama.
Oddly, Terps was one of the guys I looked forward to reading before my hiatus.
I'm sure that we'll get back there soon.
Anybody give you shit for it?
Seems that there was one tick-turd that claimed I was a dupe.
Don't remember who that was.
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In comment 15260989 Greg from LI said:
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...than the constant declarations that anyone who is remotely critical is "shitting on the team".
Who has been "remotely critical?'
"Shitting on the team" is ambiguous and not what I had in mimd when discussing these posters.
"Vomiting up the same narrative in the absence of any logic that combats prevailing opinions based on the entire status of the other personnel on the roster" is one I take exception to.
If you take exception then why engage and refer to them directly as "dip shits" no less like you did earlier.
You're looking to only pick a fight and rip into them.
A few of these guys go overboard with the Jones narrative in my view but its the opposition that actually hijacks and ruins threads, not them.
It is what all NFL franchises need. I think the HC is more important in football than other sports. A NFL QB might be the most important single position in all of team sports. Maybe Hockey goalie? Maybe.
If you get those 2 things right you have shot every year.
It is what all NFL franchises need. I think the HC is more important in football than other sports. A NFL QB might be the most important single position in all of team sports. Maybe Hockey goalie? Maybe.
If you get those 2 things right you have shot every year.
Jones developing his game in 2021 would be like a double-bonus as the Giants would have their guy at QB and all those extra picks to continue to upgrade the roster on both sides of the ball.
It is unreasonable, IMO, to say what Jones is/isn't/or ever will be at this juncture. It is incomplete.
Do you know how many great players in NFL history wouldn't exist if they were written off after two seasons?
The way I see it, both positions have validity and historical examples to back them up. Yes, there are QBs who eventually emerged from poor starts, conquered their deficiencies, and became great. There are also QBs who showed glaring flaws early and never transcended them.
We don't know which Jones will be. However, I'm glad that if season 3 provides evidence that he's the latter, the Giants seem to now be in position to move on to a potentially more promising prospect in 2022.
Every game thread I see, if a Giant scores on a big play, there are about 25 posts saying something like "CRUUUUUUUUZ!!!!" or "LET'S GOOOOOOO!!!!!!" or "YEEAAAAHHHHH!!!" I've never thought to add such a comment myself, and I hope that doesn't mean that in the historical BBI register I've revealed myself to be someone who doesn't like these big plays.
But I’ll drop it.
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season by these standards. Baker Mayfield, too.
Both were in the playoffs in their 3rd season.
I don't know why anybody would have written off Josh Allen at all. He has been the model for what you want out of a developing QB in each of his first 3 seasons.
Yeah, that's a mystery to me too. Allen wasn't drafted as a sure-fire pro-ready QB who could be effective immediately. He had known warts/concerns as a prospect and improved upon them measurably in season 2 and especially season 3.