NFT: PLAYOFF BOUND KNICKS VS. SPURS 7;30PM

Why can we not just give Burks Payton’s minutes from here on out? Give me one reason why not

shirt (that no doubt smells like perfume and cigarettes) featuring Thibs in the foreground with the team backing him up - "I'm not happy unless I'm miserable."

That's awesome.

this team took awhile to get into a groove and then the ball finally started moving the 3s started dropping..

Rose needs to be the starter and Burks or Iq can be the back up point

In comment 15263714 Giantfan21 said:

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basically going to be a playoff game. Milwaukee is going to do everything to get the 2 seed and Miami is going to do everything to avoid being 6th

I don’t see it that way tbh I mean it’s not like the Bucks control their destiny in that regard they would still need the Nets to lose to either the Bulls or Cavs. Still might be a good game but I’m not getting the sense the Bucks will have playoff like urgency in their game considering they likely still don’t get the 2 seed if they win . I mean as a Knick fan I hope they play with urgency lol but I think the Heat have more on the line they basically either play the Bucks or Hawks based on whether they win or not

In comment 15263718 Leg of Theismann said:

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In comment 15263714 Giantfan21 said: Quote: basically going to be a playoff game. Milwaukee is going to do everything to get the 2 seed and Miami is going to do everything to avoid being 6th I don’t see it that way tbh I mean it’s not like the Bucks control their destiny in that regard they would still need the Nets to lose to either the Bulls or Cavs. Still might be a good game but I’m not getting the sense the Bucks will have playoff like urgency in their game considering they likely still don’t get the 2 seed if they win . I mean as a Knick fan I hope they play with urgency lol but I think the Heat have more on the line they basically either play the Bucks or Hawks based on whether they win or not

But at that point they are still figting for that 2 seed..

In comment 15263720 nygiants16 said:

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In comment 15263718 Leg of Theismann said: Quote: In comment 15263714 Giantfan21 said: Quote: basically going to be a playoff game. Milwaukee is going to do everything to get the 2 seed and Miami is going to do everything to avoid being 6th I don’t see it that way tbh I mean it’s not like the Bucks control their destiny in that regard they would still need the Nets to lose to either the Bulls or Cavs. Still might be a good game but I’m not getting the sense the Bucks will have playoff like urgency in their game considering they likely still don’t get the 2 seed if they win . I mean as a Knick fan I hope they play with urgency lol but I think the Heat have more on the line they basically either play the Bucks or Hawks based on whether they win or not But at that point they are still figting for that 2 seed..

True although they tip off 7 hours after the Nets game. If the Nets beat the Bulls earlier into the day then the Bucks only hope left would be for the Cavs to beat the Nets. Idk I’m sure they’ll give the Heat a game though

And the Celtics have lost Brown and semi-spiraling. We need to close strong and get the job done.

I do think Bucks/Heat is gonna be tight. But That would be even better though if the Bulls somehow beat the Nets earlier in the day before the Bucks play!

In comment 15263723 Leg of Theismann said:

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In comment 15263720 nygiants16 said: Quote: In comment 15263718 Leg of Theismann said: Quote: In comment 15263714 Giantfan21 said: Quote: basically going to be a playoff game. Milwaukee is going to do everything to get the 2 seed and Miami is going to do everything to avoid being 6th I don’t see it that way tbh I mean it’s not like the Bucks control their destiny in that regard they would still need the Nets to lose to either the Bulls or Cavs. Still might be a good game but I’m not getting the sense the Bucks will have playoff like urgency in their game considering they likely still don’t get the 2 seed if they win . I mean as a Knick fan I hope they play with urgency lol but I think the Heat have more on the line they basically either play the Bucks or Hawks based on whether they win or not But at that point they are still figting for that 2 seed.. True although they tip off 7 hours after the Nets game. If the Nets beat the Bulls earlier into the day then the Bucks only hope left would be for the Cavs to beat the Nets. Idk I’m sure they’ll give the Heat a game though

Have to remember to Miami knocked the bucks out last year, could be some revenge there, Giannis looks like the type to hold a grudge

They know if the Heat finish 6th they are staring at them 1st rd. They'd probably rather help the Heat into 4th or 5th

In comment 15263723 Leg of Theismann said:

Quote:

In comment 15263720 nygiants16 said: Quote: In comment 15263718 Leg of Theismann said: Quote: In comment 15263714 Giantfan21 said: Quote: basically going to be a playoff game. Milwaukee is going to do everything to get the 2 seed and Miami is going to do everything to avoid being 6th I don’t see it that way tbh I mean it’s not like the Bucks control their destiny in that regard they would still need the Nets to lose to either the Bulls or Cavs. Still might be a good game but I’m not getting the sense the Bucks will have playoff like urgency in their game considering they likely still don’t get the 2 seed if they win . I mean as a Knick fan I hope they play with urgency lol but I think the Heat have more on the line they basically either play the Bucks or Hawks based on whether they win or not But at that point they are still figting for that 2 seed.. True although they tip off 7 hours after the Nets game. If the Nets beat the Bulls earlier into the day then the Bucks only hope left would be for the Cavs to beat the Nets. Idk I’m sure they’ll give the Heat a game though

I was thinking about it. If the nets beat the bulls then if the Bucks win they likely would play the Heat in the 1st round.

I would think they would want to avoid them and rather play the Knicks in the 1st round instead. I think there is a chance they look at the matchups and lay down.Going to be very interesting if they come out hard to win or play like Philly did tonight

In comment 15263725 Leg of Theismann said:

Quote:

And the Celtics have lost Brown and semi-spiraling. We need to close strong and get the job done. I do think Bucks/Heat is gonna be tight. But That would be even better though if the Bulls somehow beat the Nets earlier in the day before the Bucks play!

Celtixs may not play anyone on sunday

In comment 15263731 nygiants16 said:

Quote:

In comment 15263725 Leg of Theismann said: Quote: And the Celtics have lost Brown and semi-spiraling. We need to close strong and get the job done. I do think Bucks/Heat is gonna be tight. But That would be even better though if the Bulls somehow beat the Nets earlier in the day before the Bucks play! Celtixs may not play anyone on sunday

Celtics won't play anyone Sunday.
If they beat Minnesota they lock down the 7th seed and the Knicks game is meaningless also a back to back.
They could lose to Minnesota and still own the 7th seed if the hornets and Pacers lose a game.

And Burks with the treinta! Love it.

In comment 15263715 Leg of Theismann said:

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Why can we not just give Burks Payton’s minutes from here on out? Give me one reason why not

You could start Rose and bring Burks in with the second unit.
I get he is not as strong defensively as Peyton so it would be better to match with the 2nd unit

first off, thanks to my son, whose idea and treat this was. He had this idea as soon as the reduced-attendance tickets went on sale. He checked the scalping price and we could have sold the tickets for four times what he paid for them. Not that we would have. I can only imagine the scalping for the playoffs.

As for the MSG experience - I brought my vax card, which was needed, and then you had to take a health survey on your phone and provide info so that they could find you in a worst case situation. It was a good thing I was with my son because I'm not sure I would have figured out this phone survey stuff on my own, lol. But he said our granddaughter's school does something similar so he knew the ropes.

Once inside, the Garden was nice. A lot has been renovated since I was last there. A lot of new food outlets that look good - but only about 20% of them were open under these conditions. All the bars were open though, and there were some pretty drunk Knicks fans! A really nice new scoreboard - big improvement. The "crowd" was great - a surprising number of kids for a weeknight. And, although it was weird not to have all the energy of a big crowd, it wasn't bad to have like 15 feet between you and the next fans! That will end soon I guess.

It was fun watching the pre-game warmups. IQ was not good during the game, but I'll tell you that kid has a sweet shot. In warmups he effortlessly sank 3 after 3. Obi put on a dunk show and wasn't bad in limited time in the game.

As for the game - we had a good vantage point and it's always better to see the whole floor all the time. From that vantage point, I can say:

- Elfrid Payton looks even worse in person than on TV. When you see the whole floor, you see how he confounds his teammates expectations on every possession. HIs teammates never know what he's going to do. His being decent on D and on drives does not justify his shortcomings. Luckily This didn't play him much in either half.

- RJ is still going through growing pains but I think he's going to be an All Star type player in 2 or 3 years. Can't believe he's 20 - he's a grown man out there, not fazed by the NBA game at all. Started slow but was clutch in the 4th.

- Burks is a solid vet who saved the day in Rose's absence.

- Noel had an off game. He and Randle looked like they were nursing minor injuries the whole game, although JR was still good as usual. Taj is a real team player, they're better on O with Taj than Noel because Taj sets high screens better than anyone else I've seen, and unlike Noel he has decent hands and can score a little here and there.

Fun night. The first real public event I've been to since this all started. The subways from and back to Brooklyn were fine too.

That's so great to hear you had an amazing time with your son. Thanks so much for sharing.

Thanks for sharing and sounds like an awesome experience.
LFGK!!!

So they will probably rest everyone for the final 2 games.

Need to hope Miami loses to the Bucks.

shorter rotation, more minutes for the starters, less of a leash on Toppin and Quick

im really hoping that is the plan once he is back and healthy. I cant believe that Thibs has done such a good job yet he keeps doing this really stupid thing. I mean i get that Burks and IQ were hurt which did limit the options, but once everyone is back you cant start Payton. If you want to bring rose off the bench, fine, but just start anyone. Literally anyone, start Taj and Noel together for all i care. We are fighting for the 4 seed yet have what has to be the worst starting PG in the whole league.

In comment 15263842 Italianju said:

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im really hoping that is the plan once he is back and healthy. I cant believe that Thibs has done such a good job yet he keeps doing this really stupid thing. I mean i get that Burks and IQ were hurt which did limit the options, but once everyone is back you cant start Payton. If you want to bring rose off the bench, fine, but just start anyone. Literally anyone, start Taj and Noel together for all i care. We are fighting for the 4 seed yet have what has to be the worst starting PG in the whole league.

i was reading some stats Randle with Payton is a -85 and with Payton off he is +226..

Payton is the only negative player besides Noel who is -13..

Craxy to think where this team would be without Payton..

-80 during their win streak

In comment 15263797 nygiants16 said:

Quote:

shorter rotation, more minutes for the starters, less of a leash on Toppin and Quick

Yep. Meanwhile Payton is left out there to get torched by Murray for 7 minutes in the 3rd quarter. Truly mind boggling.

was the first time Thibs when asked about Payton didnt wax poetic about his versatility, kind of side stepped the question

It's like an out-of-body experience. At the start of the season, I never thought for a second they'd be in this position.

if they win out?

In comment 15263892 Metnut said:

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if they win out?

yes

In the playoffs, Reggie/Rose/Quick need to get the majority of the mins. You can slide Burks to guard when necessary (e.g. Reggie gets in foul trouble). If you need guard minutes from someone else, I still don't want Elf out there. Throw Frank out there instead.

But Peyton is getting playoff minutes and most likely starting.
Thibs is hard headed with things sometimes.
In the playoffs like with the Denver game we can't get down early and expect to fight back.
Really good teams put you away.

This could be the downfall of this team in the playoffs.

In comment 15263797 nygiants16 said:

Quote:

shorter rotation, more minutes for the starters, less of a leash on Toppin and Quick

During our first ever title run in ‘69/‘70, Holzman went with 8 players most of the time

For better or worse. Not hard to see that coming.

ugly win my ass. That was a thing of beauty.

In comment 15263747 Del Shofner said:

Quote:

first off, thanks to my son, whose idea and treat this was. He had this idea as soon as the reduced-attendance tickets went on sale. He checked the scalping price and we could have sold the tickets for four times what he paid for them. Not that we would have. I can only imagine the scalping for the playoffs. As for the MSG experience - I brought my vax card, which was needed, and then you had to take a health survey on your phone and provide info so that they could find you in a worst case situation. It was a good thing I was with my son because I'm not sure I would have figured out this phone survey stuff on my own, lol. But he said our granddaughter's school does something similar so he knew the ropes. Once inside, the Garden was nice. A lot has been renovated since I was last there. A lot of new food outlets that look good - but only about 20% of them were open under these conditions. All the bars were open though, and there were some pretty drunk Knicks fans! A really nice new scoreboard - big improvement. The "crowd" was great - a surprising number of kids for a weeknight. And, although it was weird not to have all the energy of a big crowd, it wasn't bad to have like 15 feet between you and the next fans! That will end soon I guess. It was fun watching the pre-game warmups. IQ was not good during the game, but I'll tell you that kid has a sweet shot. In warmups he effortlessly sank 3 after 3. Obi put on a dunk show and wasn't bad in limited time in the game. As for the game - we had a good vantage point and it's always better to see the whole floor all the time. From that vantage point, I can say: - Elfrid Payton looks even worse in person than on TV. When you see the whole floor, you see how he confounds his teammates expectations on every possession. HIs teammates never know what he's going to do. His being decent on D and on drives does not justify his shortcomings. Luckily This didn't play him much in either half. - RJ is still going through growing pains but I think he's going to be an All Star type player in 2 or 3 years. Can't believe he's 20 - he's a grown man out there, not fazed by the NBA game at all. Started slow but was clutch in the 4th. - Burks is a solid vet who saved the day in Rose's absence. - Noel had an off game. He and Randle looked like they were nursing minor injuries the whole game, although JR was still good as usual. Taj is a real team player, they're better on O with Taj than Noel because Taj sets high screens better than anyone else I've seen, and unlike Noel he has decent hands and can score a little here and there. Fun night. The first real public event I've been to since this all started. The subways from and back to Brooklyn were fine too.

Good insight, Del. Thanks

The Knicks haven't had that kind of grit to not let that game slip away in years. Fun times.

Starting
PG - Burks
SG - Bullock
SF - Barrett
PF - Randle
C - Noel unless Mitch is back which is unlikely

Bench
PG - Rose
SG - Quickley
SF - Frank
PF - OBi
C - Gibson

In comment 15263747 Del Shofner said:

Quote:

first off, thanks to my son, whose idea and treat this was. He had this idea as soon as the reduced-attendance tickets went on sale. He checked the scalping price and we could have sold the tickets for four times what he paid for them. Not that we would have. I can only imagine the scalping for the playoffs. As for the MSG experience - I brought my vax card, which was needed, and then you had to take a health survey on your phone and provide info so that they could find you in a worst case situation. It was a good thing I was with my son because I'm not sure I would have figured out this phone survey stuff on my own, lol. But he said our granddaughter's school does something similar so he knew the ropes. Once inside, the Garden was nice. A lot has been renovated since I was last there. A lot of new food outlets that look good - but only about 20% of them were open under these conditions. All the bars were open though, and there were some pretty drunk Knicks fans! A really nice new scoreboard - big improvement. The "crowd" was great - a surprising number of kids for a weeknight. And, although it was weird not to have all the energy of a big crowd, it wasn't bad to have like 15 feet between you and the next fans! That will end soon I guess. It was fun watching the pre-game warmups. IQ was not good during the game, but I'll tell you that kid has a sweet shot. In warmups he effortlessly sank 3 after 3. Obi put on a dunk show and wasn't bad in limited time in the game. As for the game - we had a good vantage point and it's always better to see the whole floor all the time. From that vantage point, I can say: - Elfrid Payton looks even worse in person than on TV. When you see the whole floor, you see how he confounds his teammates expectations on every possession. HIs teammates never know what he's going to do. His being decent on D and on drives does not justify his shortcomings. Luckily This didn't play him much in either half. - RJ is still going through growing pains but I think he's going to be an All Star type player in 2 or 3 years. Can't believe he's 20 - he's a grown man out there, not fazed by the NBA game at all. Started slow but was clutch in the 4th. - Burks is a solid vet who saved the day in Rose's absence. - Noel had an off game. He and Randle looked like they were nursing minor injuries the whole game, although JR was still good as usual. Taj is a real team player, they're better on O with Taj than Noel because Taj sets high screens better than anyone else I've seen, and unlike Noel he has decent hands and can score a little here and there. Fun night. The first real public event I've been to since this all started. The subways from and back to Brooklyn were fine too.

Del, awesome. Great you had a good time. And saw a win to boot!

And play more than Noel but I know they won't upset the apple cart at this point. He's light years better at setting screens legally, much better hands and finisher inside, can get more physical with good bigs and is a much more consistent offensive rebounder.

.

Payton also is playing as badly as he has all year long. If he was this bad all year he wouldn't be playing as much as he has. If he doesn't improve he likely sees the bench.

People have been bitching about this guy from day one this season. The HC is awesome. The HC plays Payton for a reason. Don't understand why some of you can't reconcile this. If the HC was an idiot I could see, but he's the savior.

Oh yeah he really set the tone at the beginning of the 3rd quarter last night...for some of the shittiest 7 minutes of defense we've played all year.

Mitch is to returning?

If we could have him for some playoff minutes that could be great, and if nothing else an opportunity to showcase him for a potential trade.

In comment 15264123 Jon in NYC said:

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Mitch is to returning? If we could have him for some playoff minutes that could be great, and if nothing else an opportunity to showcase him for a potential trade.

Foot injuries and bigs are never a quick heal. Pretty sure we're not seeing Mitch till next year.

In comment 15264123 Jon in NYC said:

Quote:

Mitch is to returning? If we could have him for some playoff minutes that could be great, and if nothing else an opportunity to showcase him for a potential trade.

I doubt they push him, foot injuries with a big man is nothing to play with

In comment 15264095 djm said:

Quote:

Payton also is playing as badly as he has all year long. If he was this bad all year he wouldn't be playing as much as he has. If he doesn't improve he likely sees the bench. People have been bitching about this guy from day one this season. The HC is awesome. The HC plays Payton for a reason. Don't understand why some of you can't reconcile this. If the HC was an idiot I could see, but he's the savior.

I fully realize that Thibs has forgotten more about basketball than all of cour collective "knowledge" combined. That said, he is not infallible. It's not impossible for a guy who's a good coach to have the occasional blind spot.

which i think he will be, Thibs will have a much quicker hook, with Rose, Burks and Quick you got plenty of depth to do that..

Also thr Knicks will have 5 to 6 days of rest after sunday

is that we have the depth to bench Payton. Rose should be gettnig the majority of the minutes (duh). But Burks and Quick can cover the rest. Or Frank in a pinch.

shitting on one player over and over, but Payton was really really bad last game. And each of these games recently, it feels like having him out there puts us in a hole to begin with.

He plays hard. He plays decent defense, you can feel how much he wants to do well. But he's just not as good as about 3 guys we have on the bench. That's just facts at this point.

But he is basically the same player he has been for the last 7 years.
He has made no improvement.
He is solid depth on a losing team
He plays hard every game, takes it to the Rim and has had some success at times distributing the ball.
Also solid defense.
But he doesn't elevate a playoff team.
He has never been a strong finisher,
Peyton is a mediocre player on an okay team.
This New York Knicks team needs a lot more than that at this point in this season .
Thibs needs to start to trust the other ball players on this team.
Peyton is a professional and goes out every day and busts his butt and I think that's what thibs loves about him.
It's just not enough

I'd rather Quick get the playoff reps.

he has no idea when to pass and when to try and score, completely kills all momentum the offesne ever gets

if they know who has it going on the court and feeds that guy constantly...How many times has Payton looked off the guy eho had made a few shots in a row to drive to score himself only to miss or get blocked?