when I heard he was trying out. I doubt he makes it but, interesting that they are trying him there.
My first thought was Plax and Hixon. What I mean was when Plax shot himself and was out for the remainder of the year, we were so inflexible that we couldn't adjust. We just thought Hixon could pick up the slack and offense will run as it had. We know how well that turned out.
So, when I see this, I think of Garrett's offense and how rigid he seems with it. I look at Benjamin as a guy they will keep in contact with throughout the season and will be a hail mary insurance policy for Golladay if he misses significant time.
when I heard he was trying out. I doubt he makes it but, interesting that they are trying him there.
My first thought was Plax and Hixon. What I mean was when Plax shot himself and was out for the remainder of the year, we were so inflexible that we couldn't adjust. We just thought Hixon could pick up the slack and offense will run as it had. We know how well that turned out.
So, when I see this, I think of Garrett's offense and how rigid he seems with it. I look at Benjamin as a guy they will keep in contact with throughout the season and will be a hail mary insurance policy for Golladay if he misses significant time.
I think he no longer has the foot speed to be an outside receiver. Not sure his hands were that great either. Even though people joked about it, he seems more suited for a quasi-TE position.
when I heard he was trying out. I doubt he makes it but, interesting that they are trying him there.
My first thought was Plax and Hixon. What I mean was when Plax shot himself and was out for the remainder of the year, we were so inflexible that we couldn't adjust. We just thought Hixon could pick up the slack and offense will run as it had. We know how well that turned out.
So, when I see this, I think of Garrett's offense and how rigid he seems with it. I look at Benjamin as a guy they will keep in contact with throughout the season and will be a hail mary insurance policy for Golladay if he misses significant time.
I think he no longer has the foot speed to be an outside receiver. Not sure his hands were that great either. Even though people joked about it, he seems more suited for a quasi-TE position.
My point is Garrett seems to need that big outside receiver that can win without getting separation. They don't grow on trees. If you are asking me if he has a chance to make the Giants as a WR or TE then it isn't even an answer. He's never played TE before. He is older now. No team is going to take their time while he learns how to play TE. Playing TE is the hardest job probably on the football field outside of QB. That doesn't make any sense to me especially with a team that wants more blocking at the position.
When you look at Garrett's offense, he wants guys to win their individual matchups. That sounds an awful lot like Perry Fewell. That drove me nuts. He would always say he schemes to get one on one matchups? WTF? An offense has 5 OL. Most matchups will be one on one. That's not coaching to me. Garrett sounds similar. I'll always revert back to his all curls play. That is such a bullshit call which I have stated numerous times why. But if those are the types of plays he wants to run then you need players to win one on one battles. The beauty of Golladay is he can always win his matchup because of his size. Benjamin has the same size. That is what seems intriguing to the Giants right now. As I said, I'd be shocked if anything materialized unless Golladay misses significant time. This is just a opportunity for him and the Giants to meet each other and keep in contact.
I think every coach attempts to create 1-on-1 matchups
In fact QB's are taught to find them. Quickly analyze where the coverage is rolling, and find the guy with the single matchup. This is of course based on how the defense should be played. When the defense breaks down and someone is wide open, its because a certain player on the D blew his assignment, fell down, etc.
RE: I think every coach attempts to create 1-on-1 matchups
In fact QB's are taught to find them. Quickly analyze where the coverage is rolling, and find the guy with the single matchup. This is of course based on how the defense should be played. When the defense breaks down and someone is wide open, its because a certain player on the D blew his assignment, fell down, etc.
I don't think what I was trying to say came across the way it was intended. As a DC, scheming up one on one matchups for your pass rushers is ridiculous. As a DC you need to be like Spags and fuck with the blocking schemes to send guys free. Spags had great success with that whether it was guys like Mitchell coming free in the A gap against Brady or sending guys off the slot who came in untouched. That's coaching.
Now, bring that to the offensive side of the ball. Yes, creating one on on matchups on offense is the goal of most but that requires motions and shifts which we do very little of. Also, great OCs run route concepts that are designed to free guys up such as rub routes. We don't run those. Most of our routes are just routes designed to have guys beat their man not have routes designed to put defenders in compromising positions.
when I heard he was trying out. I doubt he makes it but, interesting that they are trying him there.
My first thought was Plax and Hixon. What I mean was when Plax shot himself and was out for the remainder of the year, we were so inflexible that we couldn't adjust. We just thought Hixon could pick up the slack and offense will run as it had. We know how well that turned out.
So, when I see this, I think of Garrett's offense and how rigid he seems with it. I look at Benjamin as a guy they will keep in contact with throughout the season and will be a hail mary insurance policy for Golladay if he misses significant time.
I think he no longer has the foot speed to be an outside receiver. Not sure his hands were that great either. Even though people joked about it, he seems more suited for a quasi-TE position.
My point is Garrett seems to need that big outside receiver that can win without getting separation. They don't grow on trees. If you are asking me if he has a chance to make the Giants as a WR or TE then it isn't even an answer. He's never played TE before. He is older now. No team is going to take their time while he learns how to play TE. Playing TE is the hardest job probably on the football field outside of QB. That doesn't make any sense to me especially with a team that wants more blocking at the position.
When you look at Garrett's offense, he wants guys to win their individual matchups. That sounds an awful lot like Perry Fewell. That drove me nuts. He would always say he schemes to get one on one matchups? WTF? An offense has 5 OL. Most matchups will be one on one. That's not coaching to me. Garrett sounds similar. I'll always revert back to his all curls play. That is such a bullshit call which I have stated numerous times why. But if those are the types of plays he wants to run then you need players to win one on one battles. The beauty of Golladay is he can always win his matchup because of his size. Benjamin has the same size. That is what seems intriguing to the Giants right now. As I said, I'd be shocked if anything materialized unless Golladay misses significant time. This is just a opportunity for him and the Giants to meet each other and keep in contact.
Perry Fewell? How about Tom Coughlin. How frustrating was it to have first and goal at the 5, 6, 7, etc. and Tom would nearly always run on three straight plays with three tight ends in tight, telling the other team what they were doing. Then, after settling for field goals and losing by a point or two, he would say it's up to guys to beat the guy across from them. No spreading the formation and then running against a spread out defense for Tom.
RE: RE: I think every coach attempts to create 1-on-1 matchups
In fact QB's are taught to find them. Quickly analyze where the coverage is rolling, and find the guy with the single matchup. This is of course based on how the defense should be played. When the defense breaks down and someone is wide open, its because a certain player on the D blew his assignment, fell down, etc.
I don't think what I was trying to say came across the way it was intended. As a DC, scheming up one on one matchups for your pass rushers is ridiculous. As a DC you need to be like Spags and fuck with the blocking schemes to send guys free. Spags had great success with that whether it was guys like Mitchell coming free in the A gap against Brady or sending guys off the slot who came in untouched. That's coaching.
Now, bring that to the offensive side of the ball. Yes, creating one on on matchups on offense is the goal of most but that requires motions and shifts which we do very little of. Also, great OCs run route concepts that are designed to free guys up such as rub routes. We don't run those. Most of our routes are just routes designed to have guys beat their man not have routes designed to put defenders in compromising positions.
We tried a fair number of rub routes last year, though I don't know the % relative to the rest of the league. The Giants problem was they often got flagged for OPI (often incorrectly) on these plays.
As for Benjamin, he could probably run some of Engram's routes and actually hold onto the ball.
Yes, we didn't run zero rub routes but you can tell when a team emphasizes these things. You are correct that we didn't run many. You are correct that we weren't successful. And you are correct that we were flagged a lot. That to me is on coaching. You can tell the players didn't practice it much. I am totally making this up but I can see Garrett having his offense and others like Kitchens saying we need to add X, Y, and Z to the offense. They did but since it isn't a staple the chances of having success on those plays is minimized drastically. Also, I feel like when we ran them was an issue too.
In comment 15263841 robbieballs2003 said:
Perry Fewell? How about Tom Coughlin. How frustrating was it to have first and goal at the 5, 6, 7, etc. and Tom would nearly always run on three straight plays with three tight ends in tight, telling the other team what they were doing. Then, after settling for field goals and losing by a point or two, he would say it's up to guys to beat the guy across from them. No spreading the formation and then running against a spread out defense for Tom.
Tom Couglin ran the ball like that? My biggest gripe under TC/Gilbride was they threw the ball TOO much in situations where the run was the better call.
It might signal TE, or it might signal they are still uncomfortable with the outside WR spot opposite Golladay. We'll have another data point when he measures in.
They drafted Toney in the 1st round, but I'm fine if he's seen as more of a Utility Knife than a pure outside WR. (In today's NFL, an elite Utility Knife is worth a 1st round pick.) But that wouldn't change the fact they still might not be satisfied, outside.
There were a lot of tall receivers in the 2021 NFL draft
Another interesting tryout this weekend with Giants: RB Corey Clement. He was a Super Bowl hero for the Eagles a few years back. He has a chance to impress now w/NFC rival. Giants can still use depth at RB.
for another tall receiver to fight for a pass can only help increase the options if DJ is under a pass rush. Even better, if not under a rush, if gives D one more coverage scheme to have to think about.
Kelvin Benjamin + Corey Clement each played in a Super Bowl, with Clement winning one with Eagles.
They are two of five tryouts at Giants rookie camp, vying for a roster spot just as Frankie Feaster, who is coming from the opposite end of the spectrum
He’s showing some real leadership by bringing his guys, in the secondary, down to Fla to train. I think our secondary could most definitely be top 5 in the league this year. It is on paper, looking forward to seeing how the whole D comes together with all the new additions, as well.
Tom Couglin ran the ball like that? My biggest gripe under TC/Gilbride was they threw the ball TOO much in situations where the run was the better call.
He’s showing some real leadership by bringing his guys, in the secondary, down to Fla to train. I think our secondary could most definitely be top 5 in the league this year. It is on paper, looking forward to seeing how the whole D comes together with all the new additions, as well.
What I wouldn't give to be a fly on the wall in their meetings right now as they come up with ideas for this season. To see what kind of ideas PG and company are coming up with would be awesome.
He’s showing some real leadership by bringing his guys, in the secondary, down to Fla to train. I think our secondary could most definitely be top 5 in the league this year. It is on paper, looking forward to seeing how the whole D comes together with all the new additions, as well.
In comment 15263845 PatersonPlank said:
Quote: Now, bring that to the offensive side of the ball. Yes, creating one on on matchups on offense is the goal of most but that requires motions and shifts which we do very little of. Also, great OCs run route concepts that are designed to free guys up such as rub routes. We don't run those. Most of our routes are just routes designed to have guys beat their man not have routes designed to put defenders in compromising positions.
robbie, if this is an accurate assessment of Garrett's OC orientation and capabilities, and it sounds quite plausible based on what we've seen thus far, it is a very damning assessment. Like structuring an offensive scheme with one arm tied behind your back.
WR Kadarius Toney
OLB Azeez Ojulari
CB Aaron Robinson
OLB Elerson Smith
RB Gary Brightwell
CB Rodarius Williams
2021 Signed Undrafted Rookie Free Agents (3):
OC/OG Brett Heggie
OT/OG Jake Burton
DE/LB Raymond Johnson
New York Giants First-Year Players (8):
QB Clayton Thorson
RB Jordan Chunn
RB Sandro Platzgummer
WR Derrick Dillon
TE Nakia Griffin-Stewart
TE Nate Wieting
DL David Moa
LB Cale Garrett
Undrafted rookie and veteran tryout players (5):
QB Nathan Rourke (rookie)
RB Corey Clement (4-year veteran)
RB Ito Smith (3-year veteran)
FB Frank Feaster (rookie)
TE Kelvin Benjamin (former 4-year veteran WR working at TE)
He’s showing some real leadership by bringing his guys, in the secondary, down to Fla to train. I think our secondary could most definitely be top 5 in the league this year. It is on paper, looking forward to seeing how the whole D comes together with all the new additions, as well.
Good for him but he should go a step further and advise his mates to tell the union to pound salt and show up for the OTAs.. They need to be coached up together as a unit and with the rest of the defense in NJ, not Florida.
Wiith only 22 players in rookie camp, there wasn't a lot of on-field excitement for the Giants on Day 1 (with the exception of Kadarius Toney's problematic shoe).
Said Joe Judge: "This is really an orientation weekend. This isn’t a competition weekend."
#Giants #Judge - this is just an orientation for the players, every rookie is far behind.....got to get them caught up and they have long way to go....just get them moving around and focus on fundamentals, our systems, how we practice so they know what to do when they get to camp
#Giants #Judge - first impression of the rookie was what we saw on tape before the draft.....now, we just acclimate them to the building and how we do things.....and got to get them in football shape
#Giants #Judge - biggest thing is this is their first day on our field...orientation week...get a look at them physically and see how they do drills, pace, tempo of team activities
Had to stop tweeting midway thru practice so to summarize the cleat saga: Toney went blue cleats/no socks, red cleats/no socks, red cleats/white socks before settling on white cleats/white socks. Was in and out of practice before shutting it down late with an apparent calf cramp.
Had to stop tweeting midway thru practice so to summarize the cleat saga: Toney went blue cleats/no socks, red cleats/no socks, red cleats/white socks before settling on white cleats/white socks. Was in and out of practice before shutting it down late with an apparent calf cramp.
My first thought was Plax and Hixon. What I mean was when Plax shot himself and was out for the remainder of the year, we were so inflexible that we couldn't adjust. We just thought Hixon could pick up the slack and offense will run as it had. We know how well that turned out.
So, when I see this, I think of Garrett's offense and how rigid he seems with it. I look at Benjamin as a guy they will keep in contact with throughout the season and will be a hail mary insurance policy for Golladay if he misses significant time.
Quote:
when I heard he was trying out. I doubt he makes it but, interesting that they are trying him there.
My first thought was Plax and Hixon. What I mean was when Plax shot himself and was out for the remainder of the year, we were so inflexible that we couldn't adjust. We just thought Hixon could pick up the slack and offense will run as it had. We know how well that turned out.
So, when I see this, I think of Garrett's offense and how rigid he seems with it. I look at Benjamin as a guy they will keep in contact with throughout the season and will be a hail mary insurance policy for Golladay if he misses significant time.
I think he no longer has the foot speed to be an outside receiver. Not sure his hands were that great either. Even though people joked about it, he seems more suited for a quasi-TE position.
Quote:
In comment 15263811 jvm52106 said:
Quote:
when I heard he was trying out. I doubt he makes it but, interesting that they are trying him there.
My first thought was Plax and Hixon. What I mean was when Plax shot himself and was out for the remainder of the year, we were so inflexible that we couldn't adjust. We just thought Hixon could pick up the slack and offense will run as it had. We know how well that turned out.
So, when I see this, I think of Garrett's offense and how rigid he seems with it. I look at Benjamin as a guy they will keep in contact with throughout the season and will be a hail mary insurance policy for Golladay if he misses significant time.
I think he no longer has the foot speed to be an outside receiver. Not sure his hands were that great either. Even though people joked about it, he seems more suited for a quasi-TE position.
My point is Garrett seems to need that big outside receiver that can win without getting separation. They don't grow on trees. If you are asking me if he has a chance to make the Giants as a WR or TE then it isn't even an answer. He's never played TE before. He is older now. No team is going to take their time while he learns how to play TE. Playing TE is the hardest job probably on the football field outside of QB. That doesn't make any sense to me especially with a team that wants more blocking at the position.
When you look at Garrett's offense, he wants guys to win their individual matchups. That sounds an awful lot like Perry Fewell. That drove me nuts. He would always say he schemes to get one on one matchups? WTF? An offense has 5 OL. Most matchups will be one on one. That's not coaching to me. Garrett sounds similar. I'll always revert back to his all curls play. That is such a bullshit call which I have stated numerous times why. But if those are the types of plays he wants to run then you need players to win one on one battles. The beauty of Golladay is he can always win his matchup because of his size. Benjamin has the same size. That is what seems intriguing to the Giants right now. As I said, I'd be shocked if anything materialized unless Golladay misses significant time. This is just a opportunity for him and the Giants to meet each other and keep in contact.
I don't think what I was trying to say came across the way it was intended. As a DC, scheming up one on one matchups for your pass rushers is ridiculous. As a DC you need to be like Spags and fuck with the blocking schemes to send guys free. Spags had great success with that whether it was guys like Mitchell coming free in the A gap against Brady or sending guys off the slot who came in untouched. That's coaching.
Now, bring that to the offensive side of the ball. Yes, creating one on on matchups on offense is the goal of most but that requires motions and shifts which we do very little of. Also, great OCs run route concepts that are designed to free guys up such as rub routes. We don't run those. Most of our routes are just routes designed to have guys beat their man not have routes designed to put defenders in compromising positions.
Quote:
In comment 15263821 robbieballs2003 said:
Quote:
In comment 15263811 jvm52106 said:
Quote:
when I heard he was trying out. I doubt he makes it but, interesting that they are trying him there.
My first thought was Plax and Hixon. What I mean was when Plax shot himself and was out for the remainder of the year, we were so inflexible that we couldn't adjust. We just thought Hixon could pick up the slack and offense will run as it had. We know how well that turned out.
So, when I see this, I think of Garrett's offense and how rigid he seems with it. I look at Benjamin as a guy they will keep in contact with throughout the season and will be a hail mary insurance policy for Golladay if he misses significant time.
I think he no longer has the foot speed to be an outside receiver. Not sure his hands were that great either. Even though people joked about it, he seems more suited for a quasi-TE position.
My point is Garrett seems to need that big outside receiver that can win without getting separation. They don't grow on trees. If you are asking me if he has a chance to make the Giants as a WR or TE then it isn't even an answer. He's never played TE before. He is older now. No team is going to take their time while he learns how to play TE. Playing TE is the hardest job probably on the football field outside of QB. That doesn't make any sense to me especially with a team that wants more blocking at the position.
When you look at Garrett's offense, he wants guys to win their individual matchups. That sounds an awful lot like Perry Fewell. That drove me nuts. He would always say he schemes to get one on one matchups? WTF? An offense has 5 OL. Most matchups will be one on one. That's not coaching to me. Garrett sounds similar. I'll always revert back to his all curls play. That is such a bullshit call which I have stated numerous times why. But if those are the types of plays he wants to run then you need players to win one on one battles. The beauty of Golladay is he can always win his matchup because of his size. Benjamin has the same size. That is what seems intriguing to the Giants right now. As I said, I'd be shocked if anything materialized unless Golladay misses significant time. This is just a opportunity for him and the Giants to meet each other and keep in contact.
Perry Fewell? How about Tom Coughlin. How frustrating was it to have first and goal at the 5, 6, 7, etc. and Tom would nearly always run on three straight plays with three tight ends in tight, telling the other team what they were doing. Then, after settling for field goals and losing by a point or two, he would say it's up to guys to beat the guy across from them. No spreading the formation and then running against a spread out defense for Tom.
Quote:
In fact QB's are taught to find them. Quickly analyze where the coverage is rolling, and find the guy with the single matchup. This is of course based on how the defense should be played. When the defense breaks down and someone is wide open, its because a certain player on the D blew his assignment, fell down, etc.
I don't think what I was trying to say came across the way it was intended. As a DC, scheming up one on one matchups for your pass rushers is ridiculous. As a DC you need to be like Spags and fuck with the blocking schemes to send guys free. Spags had great success with that whether it was guys like Mitchell coming free in the A gap against Brady or sending guys off the slot who came in untouched. That's coaching.
Now, bring that to the offensive side of the ball. Yes, creating one on on matchups on offense is the goal of most but that requires motions and shifts which we do very little of. Also, great OCs run route concepts that are designed to free guys up such as rub routes. We don't run those. Most of our routes are just routes designed to have guys beat their man not have routes designed to put defenders in compromising positions.
We tried a fair number of rub routes last year, though I don't know the % relative to the rest of the league. The Giants problem was they often got flagged for OPI (often incorrectly) on these plays.
As for Benjamin, he could probably run some of Engram's routes and actually hold onto the ball.
Perry Fewell? How about Tom Coughlin. How frustrating was it to have first and goal at the 5, 6, 7, etc. and Tom would nearly always run on three straight plays with three tight ends in tight, telling the other team what they were doing. Then, after settling for field goals and losing by a point or two, he would say it's up to guys to beat the guy across from them. No spreading the formation and then running against a spread out defense for Tom.
Tom Couglin ran the ball like that? My biggest gripe under TC/Gilbride was they threw the ball TOO much in situations where the run was the better call.
They drafted Toney in the 1st round, but I'm fine if he's seen as more of a Utility Knife than a pure outside WR. (In today's NFL, an elite Utility Knife is worth a 1st round pick.) But that wouldn't change the fact they still might not be satisfied, outside.
I don't know if they tried, but if a goal was simply a tall WR, I think that Sage Surratt was available to sign after the draft.
Interesting if correct.
Link - ( New Window )
They are two of five tryouts at Giants rookie camp, vying for a roster spot just as Frankie Feaster, who is coming from the opposite end of the spectrum
The shotgun draw should be mentioned here.
What I wouldn't give to be a fly on the wall in their meetings right now as they come up with ideas for this season. To see what kind of ideas PG and company are coming up with would be awesome.
Awesome.
Quote: Now, bring that to the offensive side of the ball. Yes, creating one on on matchups on offense is the goal of most but that requires motions and shifts which we do very little of. Also, great OCs run route concepts that are designed to free guys up such as rub routes. We don't run those. Most of our routes are just routes designed to have guys beat their man not have routes designed to put defenders in compromising positions.
Eric from BBI : Admin : 3:55 pm : link : reply
and weights for our two new LBs were adjusted.
Link not working for me - would be interested to see, if you could re-post. Thx.
Quote:
are attendees....
Link not working for me - would be interested to see, if you could re-post. Thx.
I posted as jpeg. If you can't see it, I don't know know why.
WR Kadarius Toney
OLB Azeez Ojulari
CB Aaron Robinson
OLB Elerson Smith
RB Gary Brightwell
CB Rodarius Williams
2021 Signed Undrafted Rookie Free Agents (3):
OC/OG Brett Heggie
OT/OG Jake Burton
DE/LB Raymond Johnson
New York Giants First-Year Players (8):
QB Clayton Thorson
RB Jordan Chunn
RB Sandro Platzgummer
WR Derrick Dillon
TE Nakia Griffin-Stewart
TE Nate Wieting
DL David Moa
LB Cale Garrett
Undrafted rookie and veteran tryout players (5):
QB Nathan Rourke (rookie)
RB Corey Clement (4-year veteran)
RB Ito Smith (3-year veteran)
FB Frank Feaster (rookie)
TE Kelvin Benjamin (former 4-year veteran WR working at TE)
Judge - ( New Window )
Good for him but he should go a step further and advise his mates to tell the union to pound salt and show up for the OTAs.. They need to be coached up together as a unit and with the rest of the defense in NJ, not Florida.
Said Joe Judge: "This is really an orientation weekend. This isn’t a competition weekend."
#Giants #Judge - first impression of the rookie was what we saw on tape before the draft.....now, we just acclimate them to the building and how we do things.....and got to get them in football shape
#Giants #Judge - biggest thing is this is their first day on our field...orientation week...get a look at them physically and see how they do drills, pace, tempo of team activities
Quote:
Had to stop tweeting midway thru practice so to summarize the cleat saga: Toney went blue cleats/no socks, red cleats/no socks, red cleats/white socks before settling on white cleats/white socks. Was in and out of practice before shutting it down late with an apparent calf cramp.
classic giants rookie wr camp lol
I'd imagine one of them gets signed to the #NYGiants 90-man roster by the end of the weekend. We'll see.