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These guys look for Engram to bounce back

Lowell : 6/5/2021 9:30 am
My favorite Giants podcast. They know their stuff and post a segment just about every day.
Engram - ( New Window )
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While I don’t expect a dramatically different player...  
Big Blue Blogger : 6/5/2021 11:43 am : link
... it’s reasonable to assume that a smaller percentage of Engram’s mistakes will lead to disaster. Maybe he’ll screw up less often. Maybe he’ll continue to screw up, and his role will diminish because the team has more options. Either way, it’s hard to imagine any player - no matter how unreliable - having so many of his bobbles wind up in the opponent’s hands.
If you can't catch, you don't play..  
TC : 6/5/2021 12:24 pm : link
.
These guys are fools.  
Red Dog : 6/5/2021 12:27 pm : link
.
Coach Judge has faith in Engram..  
KingBlue : 6/5/2021 12:38 pm : link
Therefore, so do I. Expect a terrific year from Engram as a key part of our much improved offense. I also look for a massive jump in production from Daniel Jones.
His "mistakes"  
River Mike : 6/5/2021 1:15 pm : link
have been maddening, and yes, I've gotten really pissed off when he has cost us games. But on the whole, I'm not down on him as much as many here are. I think we'll see a better and more valuable player this year, don't challenge me to document why, just a feeling.
Engram  
PEEJ : 6/5/2021 1:20 pm : link
seems to catch much better on the move.
RE: Engram  
Big Blue Blogger : 6/5/2021 1:54 pm : link
PEEJ said:
Quote:
seems to catch much better on the move.
He’s the Sundance Kid of tight ends.
Better when he moves. - ( New Window )
my major problem with him ....  
BCD : 6/5/2021 2:22 pm : link
is really not catching the ball it's trying to catch the ones he can't catch ....laying out and barely tipping it up in the air or reaching way back and batting the ball up for the int defensive tip drill and in football you do that bad things always happen.....if you can't get to it bat it DOWN or leave it be you learn that pop warner football.....again if Jones throws in the dirt don't try to dig it out...leave that kind of catch to somebody that know something about how to do it.. S Sheppard.
I appreciate everything these guys said ....  
Manny in CA : 6/5/2021 2:32 pm : link

Everything I've tried to advance here for two years is what they presented (plus more) - He's a receiver trapped in a tight end's body.

What he can't do - block, be a short field possession (contested area) target; why ? - because he's not naturally a big man, he doesn't have the necessary reactions to catch quick passes, he doesn't have strong hands; he's the anthesis of Jason Whitten

What he can do (with is 4.4 speed) - Out-run every NFL LB and Safety and many corners; get open with very good route running skills. Remember this 2019 play against he Bucs ? (At the 1:40 mark) .....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ia3QTncWRQ0

Last year, he was asked (with Shepard( to be the "X" because Slayton was gimpy; neither of them is. Middle of the field tight end target; he failed miserably ....

This year, all that pressure is off (with the presence of Rudolph, Galladay and the return of a healthy Slayton). I think he will shine in more of a change-of-pace "Aaron Hernandez" role when teamed-up with Rudolph

Interesting take BCD ....  
Manny in CA : 6/5/2021 2:41 pm : link

And I appreciate where you're coming from, but this is the bNFL and not Pop Warner. You're paid big bucks to catch everything not knock down balls that are Dan Jones mistakes.

RE: my major problem with him ....  
Big Blue '56 : 6/5/2021 2:50 pm : link
In comment 15280486 BCD said:
Quote:
is really not catching the ball it's trying to catch the ones he can't catch ....laying out and barely tipping it up in the air or reaching way back and batting the ball up for the int defensive tip drill and in football you do that bad things always happen.....if you can't get to it bat it DOWN or leave it be you learn that pop warner football.....again if Jones throws in the dirt don't try to dig it out...leave that kind of catch to somebody that know something about how to do it.. S Sheppard.


In theory, sure. But you can’t blame a guy for being ultra competitive..I like that in a player. I expect that in a player.
Thank you, Big Blue, well said ...  
Manny in CA : 6/5/2021 3:28 pm : link

I'm very optimistic about where this team is moving now (I think it's very much Judge's influence).

What is it that players who are successful (often coming from teams where they haven't been) always say about their present teams ?

"I appreciate how this organization recognizes each player's individual skill-set and puts us in situations where we can best contribute and succeed"
If Engram has a huge year  
Giantimistic : 6/5/2021 3:38 pm : link
and finally breaks out, do you sign him or let him walk?

With our cap situation, I think we let him walk and aim for comp picks.
RE: Coach Judge has faith in Engram..  
TC : 6/5/2021 3:44 pm : link
In comment 15280448 KingBlue said:
Quote:
Therefore, so do I. Expect a terrific year from Engram as a key part of our much improved offense. I also look for a massive jump in production from Daniel Jones.

Every coach loves players who practice hard. And it's his job to motivate the players he has. What he going to say, you suck? No upside in that.
RE: If Engram has a huge year  
TC : 6/5/2021 3:46 pm : link
In comment 15280524 Giantimistic said:
Quote:
and finally breaks out, do you sign him or let him walk?

With our cap situation, I think we let him walk and aim for comp picks.

Walk, unless he has a bottom basement price and there's not more consistently productive talent available.
RE: RE: Color me skeptical. If he was going to improve on the drops, he would  
section125 : 6/5/2021 6:32 pm : link
In comment 15280401 jnoble said:
Quote:
In comment 15280387 Ira said:


Quote:


have done it by now.



I've joked earlier that it would almost be worth it for the first play of the first regular season game to be a pick 6 from a tipped pass off Engrams hands just to witness BBI explode in flames :-)


Victor Cruz used to drop all sort of balls. May have been worst in the NFL in drops..
cool...I know the NFL is not pop warner but the ...  
BCD : 6/5/2021 6:37 pm : link
1st things you learn comes as a youth and coaching,,,(coach pop warner for 30 yrs) had over 20 players make it to the NFL. Most not for long, Let hope people are not pulling their hair out this year when it comes to Engram....I am pulling for him....he's a Giant!!!!
reducing his role will make him more successful?  
JohnB : 6/5/2021 7:18 pm : link
Really? Does anyone see the logic in that line of thinking? Maybe if they sit him, he'll be an All-Pro and if they cut him, he's going to the HoF.

No. His role will be reduced because he can't catch the ball.
I'm only worried about his lack of hands  
SGMen : 6/5/2021 9:26 pm : link
He also lacks top-end separation I do believe despite his speed.

If he cut out his big drops, especially the ones that lead to turnovers, he is a quality player.

What fan doesn't want a 60-850-7 type season from him? He has the tools to do that but those stats can't include 6 "drops" that led to turnovers like last year. He was awful in spots.
SG. guess you didn't read what BCD said ....  
Manny in CA : 6/5/2021 11:36 pm : link

That basically he should be covering for Jones' mistakes by knocking those bad passes down; (like CBs knock down balls, to keep them from getting caught ?)

Or, should he just not try at all (grow alligator arms) and not bother hoping they don't get intercepted ?

The original point made by the video stands - that the Giants were FORCED to make him the featured target in the part of the field that he's not comfortable in - in the middle short zone.

The Giants have now solved this problem by providing Jones with three YAC targets who will excel in that environment - Shep, Rudolph and Toney.
Bounce back to what?  
sb from NYT Forum : 6/6/2021 12:53 am : link
His least disappointing season?
RE: SG. guess you didn't read what BCD said ....  
SGMen : 6/6/2021 8:00 am : link
In comment 15280740 Manny in CA said:
Quote:

That basically he should be covering for Jones' mistakes by knocking those bad passes down; (like CBs knock down balls, to keep them from getting caught ?)

Or, should he just not try at all (grow alligator arms) and not bother hoping they don't get intercepted ?

The original point made by the video stands - that the Giants were FORCED to make him the featured target in the part of the field that he's not comfortable in - in the middle short zone.

The Giants have now solved this problem by providing Jones with three YAC targets who will excel in that environment - Shep, Rudolph and Toney.
I thought some of those passes were on Engram. Jones is fairly accurate. But I'm not sitting and re-watching each of his what 6 intercepted balls off Engram's hands?
......  
Route 9 : 6/6/2021 8:26 am : link
My evaluation:

Fuck Engram. He should've been long gone and anyone else who still wants his sorry ass around here is a dumb-dumb head.
RE: my major problem with him ....  
Jimmy Googs : 6/6/2021 9:27 am : link
In comment 15280486 BCD said:
Quote:
is really not catching the ball it's trying to catch the ones he can't catch ....laying out and barely tipping it up in the air or reaching way back and batting the ball up for the int defensive tip drill and in football you do that bad things always happen.....if you can't get to it bat it DOWN or leave it be you learn that pop warner football.....again if Jones throws in the dirt don't try to dig it out...leave that kind of catch to somebody that know something about how to do it.. S Sheppard.


A couple of those deflections that were intercepted actually deflected off his facemask/helmet, AFTER they went thru his hands.

maybe Engram didn't play Pop Warner...
RE: SG. guess you didn't read what BCD said ....  
sb from NYT Forum : 6/6/2021 10:16 am : link
In comment 15280740 Manny in CA said:
Quote:

That basically he should be covering for Jones' mistakes by knocking those bad passes down; (like CBs knock down balls, to keep them from getting caught ?)

Or, should he just not try at all (grow alligator arms) and not bother hoping they don't get intercepted ?


Revisionist history. How many of these hit him dead in the hands, the numbers... or his facemask?
Evan Engram - 2020 "highlights" - ( New Window )
The end of that video with the  
Jimmy Googs : 6/6/2021 10:29 am : link
“WTF?” is just perfect...
Bounce Back?  
Beer Man : 6/6/2021 10:50 am : link
From what? Has there been a season where he has actually put it all together? Each year has been the same, he occasionally shows the awesome potential he has to be a real weapon, then he takes it all away with poor play that has greatly cost the team.
RE: RE: SG. guess you didn't read what BCD said ....  
TC : 6/6/2021 12:10 pm : link
In comment 15280855 sb from NYT Forum said:
Quote:
In comment 15280740 Manny in CA said:


Quote:



That basically he should be covering for Jones' mistakes by knocking those bad passes down; (like CBs knock down balls, to keep them from getting caught ?)

Or, should he just not try at all (grow alligator arms) and not bother hoping they don't get intercepted ?



Revisionist history. How many of these hit him dead in the hands, the numbers... or his facemask? Evan Engram - 2020 "highlights" - ( New Window )

Video would be funny, but only if you're not a Giants fan.
As much as Giants fans hate on Engram  
blueblood : 6/6/2021 12:33 pm : link
and a lot of it deservedly so.. He does get open.. he was one of the only guys getting consistently open last year
...  
broadbandz : 6/6/2021 2:14 pm : link
Engram is a non blocking TE that cant catch. Pretty much a wasted spot on the field unless he is some decoy.
Bounce back = ball  
rebel yell : 6/6/2021 3:59 pm : link
bouncing off his hands and into a defender's.
Engram and DK Metcalf ....  
Manny in CA : 6/6/2021 4:19 pm : link

Remind me a lot of each other; Metcalf 7 drops, 3 fumbles lost in 2020. Both very talented, but break your heart when they don't live up to their talent.

I don't think either should be the #1 option, but both are very good while running away from coverage (which they can do, because they're fast).

They're like many baseball home-run hitters; you don't put them at the top of the line-up because they strike out too much, but put up with that because they put the ball over the fence often enough.
RE: ...  
SGMen : 6/6/2021 10:29 pm : link
In comment 15280945 broadbandz said:
Quote:
Engram is a non blocking TE that cant catch. Pretty much a wasted spot on the field unless he is some decoy.
Engram has to be used the right way. He is definitely not an in-line TE, that much is well documented.

However, he has speed and in certain areas and matchups he can give defenses a headache.
RE: RE: ...  
TC : 6/7/2021 12:18 am : link
In comment 15281225 SGMen said:
Quote:
In comment 15280945 broadbandz said:


Quote:


Engram is a non blocking TE that cant catch. Pretty much a wasted spot on the field unless he is some decoy.

Engram has to be used the right way. He is definitely not an in-line TE, that much is well documented.

However, he has speed and in certain areas and matchups he can give defenses a headache.

The only people on the field he gives a headache are his teammates. His best position of the field is on the bench.
......  
Route 9 : 6/7/2021 4:43 am : link
Lol the classic "they don't use Engram the right way" nonsense

Yeah... True I guess. They don't use him the right way, by keeping him on the field for just one play they don't use him the right way. Doesn't matter where he is, he doesn't do his jobs no matter how many people try and sugarcoat how much he sucks ass at everything he does.

Engram = garbage. I know you all feel sorry sorry for him because ... idk he reminds you of someone you know? He's a loser.
......  
Route 9 : 6/7/2021 4:44 am : link
AND he doesn't do his job no matter where he is on the field, doesn't matter where he is lined up. Loser city.
RE: His  
Johnny5 : 6/7/2021 9:31 am : link
In comment 15280467 River Mike said:
Quote:
have been maddening, and yes, I've gotten really pissed off when he has cost us games. But on the whole, I'm not down on him as much as many here are. I think we'll see a better and more valuable player this year, don't challenge me to document why, just a feeling.

I agree Mike. I was furious with him last year. But he's also made plenty of good plays. Let's just hope with the added skill players his role diminishes to the point where he is less of a focus by the defense and Garrett is not running him on 10 yard curl routes. I have a feeling he makes some big plays for us this year with a less of the misses and bad bounces... lol
The Drop in Philadelphia Game  
LTIsTheGreatest : 6/7/2021 9:41 am : link
was the straw that broke the camel's back for most fans. 95% of the fan base wanted him gone after that.
RE: Not buying  
santacruzom : 6/7/2021 12:04 pm : link
In comment 15280409 mittenedman said:
Quote:
I don't think his problem is mental at all - he's just got poor hands.


I'm not so sure of that myself. He doesn't seem to botch "routine" passes that often. Instead, it seems like he is caught by surprise by too many passes thrown his way, as if he's got slow reflexes or can't tune out the presence of nearby defenders.

Maybe he's the sort of guy you don't want to throw short and quick passes to.
though that Eagles drop  
santacruzom : 6/7/2021 12:05 pm : link
tells a different story.

Shit, he probably does just suck.
RE: The Drop in Philadelphia Game  
Route 9 : 6/7/2021 3:51 pm : link
In comment 15281445 LTIsTheGreatest said:
Quote:
was the straw that broke the camel's back for most fans. 95% of the fan base wanted him gone after that.


I wanted him gone prior to the 2019 season. He was impressing BBI with the second half of his 2018 campaign but since I'm a notch above most on here, I applied common sense and wasn't fooled. 2018 should've been his last season. Then what happened? He had one good game with Jones (first start) vs Tampa and got hurt again that year.

" we need to see what he can do in one season of being healthy!"

Then, I actually got into a discussion with someone on here prior to the 2020 season and I had to read how much of a keeper he was because he was cheap.

Doesn't matter. People on here would still slurp him up if he did that Eagle drop again. Idk? People are just stupid.

He'll makes backbreaking dropes all year long and does Big Mouth Judge do a thing about it? Nope. He'd run right back onto the field with zero consequences. Is this the end of him? Nope. Coming back for another year.

What a culture built here at New York Giants World.
Yeah, quality post. You're probably more like a notch and half above  
Jimmy Googs : 6/7/2021 4:18 pm : link
most on here...
For all those hearts still aching over Engram's drops ...  
Manny in CA : 6/8/2021 1:12 am : link

What if Victor Cruz hadn't dropped those 3 Passes ?

https://bleacherreport.com/articles/1324962-what-ifvictor-cruz-hadnt-dropped-those-three-passes

Or how about Amani Toomer's drops ?

https://www.nydailynews.com/sports/football/giants/amani-toomer-drops-giant-factor-article-1.277117

Then, (January 1987, 1st half, play-off game) going the other way, future HOF Jerry Rice catches a long pass from Joe Montana, while pulling way toward the End Zone, he fumbles for no apparent reason. Beginning of the end for the 49ers, as they lose 49-4.
Correction  
Manny in CA : 6/8/2021 1:23 am : link
Giants 49, SF 3.
RE: Yeah, quality post. You're probably more like a notch and half above  
Route 9 : 6/8/2021 4:01 am : link
In comment 15281743 Jimmy Googs said:
Quote:
most on here...


Sometimes when you read the same bullcrap over and over again about a subpar player, you have to find new ways to convey some original ideas.

Funny thing is... you know I'm right. Not my fault you are a lightweight and you can't handle the sauce. Irritating the food pipeline. Evan engram sucks. Period. Period again.
RE: RE: Yeah, quality post. You're probably more like a notch and half above  
Jimmy Googs : 6/8/2021 7:56 am : link
In comment 15282049 Route 9 said:
Quote:
In comment 15281743 Jimmy Googs said:


Quote:


most on here...



Sometimes when you read the same bullcrap over and over again about a subpar player, you have to find new ways to convey some original ideas.

Funny thing is... you know I'm right. Not my fault you are a lightweight and you can't handle the sauce. Irritating the food pipeline. Evan engram sucks. Period. Period again.


Wasn't suggesting you missed it on Engram, moreso that you think you're a notch above the rest here.

Nevertheless, will keep an eye out for your future posts and will take measure of your notches...
......  
Route 9 : 6/8/2021 7:59 am : link
I'm "notch sure" where I am on the BBI pecking order. I've been pretty busy myself. I didn't get to swim yet once this summer, that's not yet technically summer.
Did you really want that to count or  
Jimmy Googs : 6/8/2021 8:04 am : link
are you just trying to warm up?
RE: Did you really want that to count or  
Route 9 : 6/8/2021 8:07 am : link
In comment 15282145 Jimmy Googs said:
Quote:
are you just trying to warm up?


The only thing when I'm warming up is the leftover pizza in the oven.
......  
Route 9 : 6/8/2021 8:07 am : link
Oops. Get rid of that "when"
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